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Heritiers P.de Marcilly

Thru highly convoluted ways, a bottle of 1981 Heritiers P.de Marcilly Criots-Batard-Montrachet came into my stash. I have an unusual question for this most honorable Board: what does the "P" stand for ?

 
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  1. Probably the first name of M. de Marcilly

    Now, do I get an invitation to be there when you open that bottle?

    1 Reply
    1. re: ChefJune

      Yes, once you provide correct answer.

    2. Coat of arms and motto on the label are not even close to the ones on record:
      http://www.houseofnames.com/de+marcil...

       
      1 Reply
      1. re: CharlesDarwin

        P. de Marcilly Frères are still using the same logo on their labels.

        There are around 20 places called Marcilly all over France so surely more than one de Marcilly family.

      2. That's a great question! Back in the early 1980s, i used to import and sell wines from this producer -- and I am embarrassed to admit that I don't remember! I want to say Phillippe, but I honestly don't know if that's a dim memory or merely grasping at straws . . .

        3 Replies
        1. re: zin1953

          Philippe or Pierre or whatever his name was probably the guy who started the family business in 1849.

          1. re: Robert Lauriston

            And wasn't that the original question?

            1. re: zin1953

              Right, I'm just thinking that if he died ~150 years ago nobody in the wine trade might have known it for generations.

        2. Pierre-Antoine, the abbot of Marcilly?

          Pere? As in "father," "priest" or "abbot."

          Sometimes P. in front of a name just means older or respected.

          1. Interesting facts:
            1) Last mention of P.de Marcilly in the Guide Hachette des Vins seems to go back to the year 2000, the Guide indicating they are part of the group Boisset, phone # 03.80.62.61.61
            2) A quick search produces record showing in fact phone above corresponds to Jean-Claude Boisset
            3) The Boisset site http://www.boisset.fr/ makes no mention whatsoever of P.de Marcilly

             
            3 Replies
            1. re: CharlesDarwin

              Maybe they're no longer part of that group. There are 2011s for sale in the UK.

              1. re: Robert Lauriston

                Which should indicate they are still in business.
                However, I've been unable to find their phone #.

                1. re: CharlesDarwin

                  If the winery was sold to a conglomerate, it may no longer exist as an independent business.

              1. re: Robert Lauriston

                Good job on that.

                ----

                OP, Robert Parker has written about the winery -- easy to find. The winery both grows grapes and buys grapes.

                Not sure this bottle is worth lots of thought, but I understand being curious about its provenance.

                1. re: maria lorraine

                  I subscribe to eRobertParker.com and did search there the keyword "Marcilly" using all options of Site Search, but nothing came up. Same with burghound.com.

                   
                  1. re: CharlesDarwin

                    Found in Google Books online using P. de. Marcilly as a search term.

                2. WTSO had this offering from Marcilly:

                  Domaine P. de Marcilly Hautes Cotes-de-Beaune Pinot Noir 2010


                  Introduction
                  -This is a very special Tastevinage selection with each bottle having its own limited edition number.
                  -This is a beautiful 100% Pinot Noir by de Marcilly and was a winner in the Tastevinage competition. This is a blind tasting and the select wines are made by Burgundy’s top palates and represents the best of the best.
                  -DeMarcilly is a famous name dating back to ancient times and the family has been in the wine business since 1849. This is an extreme value Pinot from a great name and the prestigious Hautes-Cotes de Beaune that is very compelling

                  9 Replies
                  1. re: penthouse pup

                    Yes, well . . . there is no "Tastevinage competition," and thus no "winner" -- as in a Gold Medal, or a 1st Place . . .

                    /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

                    From La Confrérie des Chevaliers du Tastevin's website (see http://www.tastevin-bourgogne.com/en/...):

                    >>> Tastevinage consists of an examination, which enables the stamp of the Confrérie des Chevaliers du Tastevin to be granted to those Burgundies that correspond precisely to their appellation and their vintage. Thus wine lovers will be able to tell those bottles, which, by their honesty, their character and their undoubted quality have deserved this distinction.

                    >>> The questions, which the jury must answer, are precise: "is this wine worthy of the appellation and the vintage on its label ? Is it genuinely representative? In a word, is it a wine I would be pleased to have in my cellar and proud to serve to a friend? " twenty or so wines per table, presented anonymously, that is without the name of the grower or merchant, are put through this hard test for about two hours.

                    >>> The double objective of Tastevinage is thus attained. - to reward the producer for the quality of the wine he has crafted and to give an additional guarantee to the consumer. <<<

                    /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

                    The wine itself may be very good, and $14.99 is a good price for an AOC Bourgogne Hautes Côtes-de-Beaune, but to say it was $35 is ludicrous! Small print says it was $35 *INCLUDING* shipping. I'm guessing the retail was a lot closer to $25 or so, but one should keep in mind that the $14.99 price tag does NOT include shipping, so it's a bit of an apples-to-oranges sort of comparison.

                    1. re: zin1953

                      Actually, the $14.99 does include shipping (it's their standard arrangement--shipping is always included.) My guess is the low price is linked to not-so-great content inside the bottle...

                      1. re: penthouse pup

                        Thanks for the tip!
                        I just ordered a half case.
                        (Given the price, not much that can go wrong here).
                        Will report back.

                        1. re: CharlesDarwin

                          Got it today.
                          Sorry can't open yet, need to wait until bottle shock is over.
                          But something definitely doesn't look good.
                          Please compare coat of arms in both bottles.

                           
                          1. re: CharlesDarwin

                            What's to compare? The first is the P. de Marcilly label. But when you bottle a wine with the Tastevinage, you use *their* coat of arms . . .

                            1. re: zin1953

                              So it is family's coat of arms versus marketing's?
                              And marketing wins?
                              Merde...

                              1. re: CharlesDarwin

                                With respect, wrong answer . . .

                                When someone earns the Tastevinage label, that estate/domain/négociant does NOT use their own label, but rather that of the La Confrérie des Chevaliers du Tastevin. That is true for P. de Marcilly, just as it would be for Maison Louis Jadot, Maison Dominique Laurent, Domaine Maurice Écard, Bouchard Pere et Fils, or anyone else.

                                In that regard, it is no different than the Hospice de Beaune auction. The lot is *always* bottled using the Hospice de Beaune label, even though it clearly states (in the small print) Momessin, or Jadot, or Faiveley, or . . . or . . . or . . .

                          2. re: CharlesDarwin

                            On the 3 points Darwin wine tasting scale (1 = don't like it, 2 = like it, 3 = like it a lot) this one scores a 3. Even more, Ms.Darwin (a really keen taste) said this is the perfect red wine for fish. Said and done: it went perfectly well with a bacalao a la vizcaína.

                            1. re: CharlesDarwin

                              I recall enjoying their wines when I sold them 30+ years ago, but haven't had any since them. Good to know. Thanks.