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Jul 1, 2014 03:37 AM

High End Thai restaurant in Tokyo

I have tried to search around for a high end Thai restaurant as an option for my trip but I can't find anything. Does such a thing even exist?

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  1. Mango Tree's flagship restaurant on the 35th floor of the Marunouchi Building is on the upscale end of Thai in Tokyo - they have a Y10,800 prix-fixe dinner menu for example.

    The food's not precisely what you'd get in Bangkok, but there are some real Thai flavors in there.

    8 Replies
      1. re: Roysen

        It's high-end, but it's quite pedestrian. Follows the very important maxim that the better the view the worse the food. Add demerits if the restaurant is rotating (which it isn't, so it isn't that horrid).

        1. re: Uncle Yabai

          Ah, that's too bad, I've enjoyed all the other branches of Mango Tree that I've been to, especially their buffets.

          1. re: Robb S

            Really? Maybe I should change my mind. The choice was between these two and my mind was made when I read a food blogger in Tokyo really diss Mango Tree and highly recomend Jim Thompson.

            1. re: Roysen

              I've been to the lunch buffet at Jim Thompson and found it okay but underwhelming (after I had heard good reports about it). But I really enjoyed the dinner buffet at a different Mango Tree (not Marunouchi). If I had to pick one or the other I'd probably pick Marunouchi Mango Tree.

              And when you're eating Thai food it's nice to try a lot of different dishes and flavors, so a well-provisioned buffet table is very appealing, especially if you're dining alone or with just one other person.

              1. re: Robb S

                That is great advice. Which Mango Tree are you recomending?

                1. re: Roysen

                  I haven't been there yet, but I'd probably pick Marunouchi - it seems to have the biggest selection of dishes. I imagine it's at least as good as the smaller, cheaper Ikebukuro branch, which I thought was pretty satisfying for a buffet....

      2. Replying here instead of the Indian thread...

        If you really want to do Thai, I would recommend doing a lower-end Thai place as you'll get better food. A Thai friend went to Baiyok in Ueno, and she thought it was fine.
        (If you click on the third tab on that page with the camera, you can see pics. If you click on the third tab under the camera tab, you can see the exterior of the restaurant so you'll know what it looks like).

        But if you really want high end and are not too picky about how Thai the food is, Jim Thompson's Table Thailand in Ginza would suit your needs better. I'm not saying the food isn't good as food, just that it might not be as Thai (not based on my experience, but on my friend's). (eta: it's not really high end, but it's nicer than Baiyok).

        9 Replies
        1. re: prasantrin

          You would consider Jim Thompson's Table in Ginza better than Mango Tree Maronouchi?

          1. re: Roysen

            I haven't been to either, though I have had Mango Tree's ekiben (not ekiben, exactly). Mango Tree's ekiben was fine, though not particularly Thai.

            Fact is, unless you go to Tochigi or Ibaraki (don't know about now, but back in the 90s there were many Thai workers at factories in those areas, so there were some excellent Thai restaurants and stores--all low-end, of course), you probably won't find really good Thai food in the area.

            Jim Thompson is owned by the Thai company, though, so it may be fine. It's probably more refined than Mango Tree.

            That being said, I'm half Thai. I'm not a good person to be asking where to get the best crappy Thai food because I won't like most of the suggestions.

            1. re: prasantrin

              I've had very good Thai food in various spots in Kabukicho, but places there tend to come and go, so I don't have any current recommendations. I've also heard good things about Kinshicho.

              Back to Mango Tree, I think they're also owned by a Thai company, no? Or at least they seem to have some connection with Coca (there's a combination Coca-Mango Tree in Yurakucho Bic Camera), which is run by a Bangkok-based company. The "Thai sukiyaki" they specialize in here is called "Cantonese sukiyaki" back in Thailand.

              1. re: Robb S

                Mango Tree is Thai, but more like Thai for farangs. Same with Jim Thompson, for that matter (and Cabbages and Condoms which has / had a branch in Kyoto). Flavours are more muted, maybe safe is a better word. Posher, more sanitary settings than most Thai restaurants in Thailand to appeal to the need for cleanliness among certain groups of farangs, and the food is more sanitary, too.

                1. re: prasantrin

                  Well sure, they want to stay in business, don't they.

                  I've spent quite a bit of time in Thailand, and also eaten at various branches of Mango Tree and Jim Thompson, and one thing I like about Mango Tree is certain aromas of spices that are reminiscent of Bangkok, that one doesn't encounter in many other mainstream chain Thai places in Tokyo. Although of course the hot spices are toned down quite a bit, and you don't get some of the more interestingly pungent dishes that I used to enjoy in Kabukicho.

                  I think the "Thaisuki" at Coca might be very close to what they serve in Bangkok though. Although Thai people think it's Chinese.

                  1. re: Robb S

                    Thai suki is considered Chinese because it's based on Chinese hot pot. You can often differentiate Chinese-Thai dishes from Thai dishes because people will generally use chopsticks to eat the former (mostly true, but a little tongue in cheek). Like all noodle dishes are Chinese (to Thai people).

                    I think we just have different frames of reference re: Thai flavours. I will admit that when in Thailand, we often dine at the posher places and not so much at hawker stands, etc. It's just the way my Thai family eats. Plus my father grew up on atypical Thai cooking, so the flavour profiles we're used to is different even from what the general Thai population is used to.

                    1. re: prasantrin

                      Thanks for that explanation. Are really all noodle dishes thought of as Chinese? Even dishes similar to Pad Thai?

                      >I think we just have different frames of reference re: Thai flavours.

                      I'll admit that I might not bring a Thai person to the buffet at Mango Tree, but as a general introduction to Thai cuisine for someone from northern Europe I don't think it's such a bad choice - especially since it's a buffet. Don't judge them just on their ekiben.

                      And you seem skeptical that there could be good Thai restaurants in Tokyo, but I've had some quite nice Thai meals here, surrounded by Thai customers, some of them (the dishes) reminiscent of more upscale Bangkok spots, not just street stalls. One thing I've learned is to order from the "chef's specials" corner of the menu when possible. And to look for nam phrik dishes on the menu, for a fully balanced meal....

                      1. re: Robb S

                        Thai people are very proud to have created pad thai, but noodle dishes are considered to have Chinese origins, just because noodles are considered Chinese. Weird, but that's the way it is. A lot of other Thai dishes have Chinese origins, too, like Thai-style sweet and sour pork (though not all are eaten with chopsticks :-) ). There are so many ethnic Chinese Thai that there is a lot of Chinese influence in the food. It goes back a long way, though, so people often don't realize it's there. (BTW, the next time you're in BKK, try to find a place with Peking Duck. It will be a posher place, but the peking duck in BKK is still very traditional as opposed to the "newer" style where there is imo too much fat and meat attached to the skin. It's fantastic, and I always get a peking duck meal in when in BKK)

                        I've tried a couple of Thai restaurants that were relatively well reviewed. They were fine, but not great. There was one that was really very basic in atmosphere, but the food was on the better side of OK, and I would have recommended it but I think it's closed now. I couldn't find it in my research. I always use pad grapow gai as a baseline. It's a relatively simple dish, yet it's hard to find a really good version of it. If a restaurant screws it up, it's a bad sign, but if they do a really good version, then I'm more willing to try everything else on the menu.

                        The best Thai restaurant I've tried in Japan was in Utsunomiya--closer to the outskirts of town rather than the central area. The Thai owner/cook was married to a Japanese man. Seriously good food, as good as places in Thailand, but that was 15-ish years ago. Who knows if it's still there.

                        The second best Thai restaurant was somewhere in Ibaraki-ken. A lot of Thai factory workers in those parts, so even 15-20 years ago, you could get very good Thai food in Ibaraki (some really good Thai provisions stores in the area, too).

                        Gotta say, the Mango Tree ekiben container was really neat, though. It was one of those kinds that will heat the food. That alone was worth the purchase.

                        1. re: prasantrin

                          Are dishes like chicken or shrimp Satay sticks, Tom Kha Gai, Som Tam salad, different types of curries with duck or chicken and coconut milk in addition to ingredients like lime leaves, lemongrass, thai basil, chilli, bamboo shots, curry paste, nuts, coriander, galangal etc. This is what I normally like to eat at a Thai restaurant here. There are quite a few. That is also what I would be looking for in Tokyo too. I am just checking if this is authentic thai cuisine and if its also available in Tokyo or if thai restaurants in Tokyo typically serves something else?

          1. re: DirtyDen

            "And, for what it's worth, here's the Thai rankings..."

            I'd say the Thai rankings at Tabelog are not worth a lot. I've been to three places in their top ten - two of them are really awful and overpriced (but well known), and one is just a neighborhood curry joint with Thai pretensions.

            1. re: Robb S

              I think you forgot the actual ranking.

              1. re: Roysen

                Ha, do you want me to name names?

                Actually as of now I've been to a fourth place in their top ten (Jasmine Thai in Yotsuya for lunch today), and it was okay, although relatively expensive for what you get. The dinner menu looked promising enough though.

            2. re: DirtyDen

              Having developed a craving for Thai food after participating in this thread, I visited number 4 on the Tabelog list of best Thai restaurants in Tokyo, Mae Yao in Shinanomachi yesterday.

              While I had a better-than-average curry there, the shop lacks some of the characteristics that go into a good Thai restaurant, the most important of which is having more than five menu choices. The menu there offers just three curries (green, red and Mae Yao), beef-noodle soup and stir-fried pork. On the plus side, prices are reasonable (Y780 for curry).

              Mae Yao is quite famous, being a branch of the famous Indian and Thai curry shop in Waseda, which is the only way I can account for their high ranking, but even then it's hard to imagine anyone who's been to actual Thai restaurants thinking that this is the fourth-best Thai restaurant in Tokyo.

              I know several people on this board have said that they found Tabelog ratings to be reliable, but I wonder if a lot of that might just be confirmation bias.

              1. re: Robb S

                Or, someone who wishes to explain confirmation bias could visit a place that receives a food score of 3.6 and is clearly a simple Japanese "Thai" curry house, where the top rated place in the category receives 4.1, and decide based on that data point that tabelog ranking are probably not worth while. ;)

                1. re: Gargle

                  If anything, tabelog's scores for Thai restaurant confirm the opinions on this board regarding the relative paucity of good Thai restaurants in Tokyo. Only one scores above 4 and the second best scores a 3.7.

                2. re: Robb S

                  Hi Robbie,

                  Would you mind sharing your personal ranking of the Thai restaurants you have visited?

                  I have set aside one spot for a Thai restaurant for lunch on my Tokyo schedule. At the moment it is Mango Tree Maronouchi occupying that spot. It is a close call with Jim Thompsons's Table Thailand. I am however very flexible and follow your adventures in this thread with eager eyes, ears and tastebuds.

                  1. re: Roysen

                    Thanks for the vote of confidence. Unfortunately a lot of places I really liked have gone out of business, and I haven't yet found replacements, so I'm not quite as enthusiastic about recommending places as I might be.

                    However, I've enjoyed meals at Sawasdee in Shibuya. Rice Terrace in Nishi-Azabu has been pretty reliable, and a bit more upscale than average. The main Keawjai in Shinjuku seems to have carried on the menu of their beloved Meguro branch (frequented by Thai embassy staff), but I haven't been enough to be sure that it's the same quality.

                    Perhaps other people can add their favorites to the thread.

                    If I were to have a single meal though and I wasn't dining with a group of four people, I might go for a buffet. For a fully balanced meal I like to have a spicy salad, soup, steamed and fried dishes, a curry and a spicy dip, plus a bit of dessert, so it's nice to either go with a group or else go to a buffet that has everything.

                    1. re: Robb S

                      Like I wrote in an earlier post in this thread, what I usually order at a thai restaurant would be a Chicken Satay, a Tom Ka Gai soup,and a Som Tam salad as starters and a curry as main course. I really prefer my thai curries in coconut milk with duck. Would that be something they serve at the thai restaurants in Tokyo? Would it also be possible to choose level of how spicy I want it?

                      1. re: Roysen

                        I've never been asked to specify how spicy I want something - I think it's up to the chef and how he prepares that particular dish.

                        Those dishes all sound pretty standard, other than the satay, which you might see sometimes in Thai places but more often in Indonesian shops. And come to think of it duck isn't that common in Tokyo Thai places.

                        1. re: Robb S

                          Thanks, Robbie. Very valuable. Are prawns or chicken the most common main ingredient in a thai curry in Tokyo or are other main ingredients usual as well?

                          1. re: Roysen

                            This might seem to be a novel idea but as you have what appears to be an unlimited budget, why don't you catch a flight to Bangkok after your trip in Tokyo?

                            My experience of Thai food here is that it is nowhere near as good as it is Thailand.

                            As Robb S says satay is an Indonesian dish rather than a Thai one.

                            1. re: terrych

                              It is a good idea. Thanks. Keep in mind however that there is only one thai restaurant on my plan for two whole months in Japan. It would probably be a little stressful to go to Bangkok just for one meal and it would probably also make it impossible to catch the planned Japanese restaurant in Tokyo on the same day. This trip is really all about experiencing the best Japan has to offer. The reason why there are single thai, indian etc restaurants on the plan is because it will probably make me appriciate the Japanese restaurants more and avoid tiring of the same type of food for such a long time if I mix it up with some alternative cuisine in between.

                              A good plan for someone of good health might have been to go on a gastronomic adventure to Thailand, China and India after my trip to Japan. I am however instead thinking more and more about a second trip to Tokyo in January to try to gather up the restaurants I can not reserve for the first upcoming trip. I would prefer to make that a priority than going to Thailand, Chaina and India.

                              A trip further into the future than January is not possible at the moment of health reasons.

                              1. re: Roysen

                                If you are trying to experience the best of what Japan has to offer, I would not recommend thai restaurants. Then again, I wouldn't recommend thai restaurants anywhere other than Thailand, Laos and some select enclaves in Los Angeles.

                                I haven't been to japan for longer than 14 days but in that I time I never tired of eating Japanese food. My thinking the end was that I could easily eat for another 14 days without needing another type of cuisine. But who knows what I would have actually felt by the end of it.

                                1. re: tigerjohn

                                  I am afraid you need to read my previous post again where I explained why I have included one thai restaurant in a schedule for experiencing the best Japan has to offer.

                                  1. re: Roysen

                                    Even with your stated reason, I'd stick to French and Italian for contrast. Korean could be a good choice as well.

                                    1. re: tigerjohn

                                      I understand. It is very likely that we have different preferances. After all our tasteorgans and everything else involved in a diining experience give us subjekctive experiences. It would be almost strange if we would agree on everything related to dining. So I certainly understand your point of view even though my point of view differs slightly. My view on Italian for instance seems different than yours. It seems to me as if Tokyo has not all that much high quality italian restaurants compared to what we have here in northern Europe (alhtough with my limited knowledge I might be very wrong) and I would rather think the Chinese, Indian and Thai options (since being in Asia afer all) seems more appealing even though not on the same level as in Hong Kong, Shanghai, Bangkok or New Dehli.

                                      1. re: Roysen

                                        Just because Thailand and Japan are both in Asia doesn't mean Japan is any more likely to have good Thai restaurants than any other country in the world. They're not even considered to be in the same "part" of Asia (Japan is East Asia, Thailand is SE Asia, India, for that matter, is South Asia). East Asian food (Chinese, Korean, Japanese) are the most different to SE and South Asian (you'll see more similarities between SE and South Asian food).

                                        Regarding Thai dishes, the dishes you mentioned aren't even from the same areas of Thailand. Som tam is Northern Thai (Isaan, actually, so it's actually Laotian more so than Thai), Satay is very much Thai, but has its roots in Southern Thailand (satay came to Thailand via Malaysia), and different curries are associated with different areas. Of course if you were to go to Thailand, you can get almost any of the dishes anywhere.

                                        I guess my point is that to expect to go to Japan and get good Thai food, better than what you can get wherever you live, is an erroneous assumption. You really are better off sticking to Japanese food, and if you really must, Chinese. Like others have said, Korean is a better option than other Asian foods. (Note that China, Korea, and Japan are all East Asian countries.)

                                        If you were to return to Japan, you could very easily plan a trip to Japan with a stopover for a few days in Bangkok on your return home. You can get excellent Thai food in Bangkok as well as excellent Indian food (there are many ethnic Indians in Thailand and quite a bit of Thai culture comes from India). And in my opinion, you can get better Chinese food in Thailand than in Japan, too.

                                        If you only have a short time, use that meal for an impromptu meal somewhere instead of something planned. Something like walking around Namba in Osaka and stopping in for okonomiyaki, and having takoyaki from one of the stands, etc. etc. All the foods that Japanese people eat every day, and you'll be mixing with Japanese people as they are every day. Good food and potentially making friends with locals. Those are often the best experiences when travelling.

                                        Like James Michener said, "If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the religion and avoid the people, you might better stay at home." You've embraced the food, but what about everything else?

                                        1. re: prasantrin

                                          >I guess my point is that to expect to go to Japan and get good Thai food, better than what you can get wherever you live, is an erroneous assumption.

                                          While I entirely agree with your excellent post, I think you may be underestimating how bad Thai food can be in northern Europe.

                                          At least in Japan you don't see signs advertising "Thai sushi."

                                          1. re: Robb S

                                            Exactly. I think thai restaurants in Tokyo has at least got to be better than at home in Scandinavia.

                                            I am certain Thai, Indian and Chinese would be better in a lot of cities in Asia than Tokyo. You do however have to consider where I come from and what my expectations will be. I am sure Tokyo will be thai restaurant heaven to me.

                                            Having said that. The idea of going to Bangkok, Hong Kong. Shanghai or New Dehli a few extra days after Tokyo is a very good one. I agree completely. I just whish my health situation was different.

                                            In regards to the thai dishes I normally order in a scandinavian thai restaurant, I applogize if I seemed disrespectful by mixing together dishes and cultural aspects that don't belong together. Lacking knowledge of these things I just mentioned what I like to order at a thai restaurant at home. I also hoped to be able to order the same dishes but of higher quality at in Tokyo. Please forgive me if that seems ignorant since those dishes are from very different regions of Thailand.
                                            What I was looking for was some familiarity too among all the unfamiliar Japanese food I will eat. I think that will provide a welcome break in between.

                                            If there is any thai restaurants of high "Tokyo thai standard" (which is likely to be heavenly compared to Scandinavian Thai) where they serve chicken satay, tom ka gai, som tam and duck curry in coconut milk I would be very grateful if someone gave me a hint. I looked at the meny on the Mango Tree Maronouchi webpage. It was very small and they did not offer chicken satay, nor som tam with prawn which is what I am used to nor curry with duck in coconut milk. Maybe it is possible to ask them for the possibility on reservation. I am not so hopeful though so my search continues. I have not been able to find the menu of Jim Thompson's Table Thailand.

                                            1. re: Roysen

                                              Here's the menu for Jim Thompson's Table:

                                              It looks like they have at least a few of your requests - som tam and tom khaa gai. You might have to settle for chicken instead of duck though, and find a substitute for satay. Note that these are from their dinnertime menu, but there seems to be some special deal where you can order dinner items at lunchtime if you order a special menu, which is limited to six people per day or something.

                                              1. re: Robb S

                                                Thank you, Robbie! That was really great of you. Any chance I could invite you out for a meal when in Tokyo? Your choice of restaurant on my list. On me of course. You seem like a very nice guy and I am looking to expand my gastronimic contact network in Tokyo.

                                                1. re: Roysen

                                                  Thanks, that's very kind of you. I will get in touch if it turns out that I'm in town and available.

                                                  1. re: Robb S

                                                    Looking forward to that. I'll be in Japan from October 13th to December 7th.

                                              2. re: Roysen

                                                Sorry, I wasn't clear regarding the different origins of different dishes. What I wanted to say is that a restaurant that has som thai, for example, may not have satay because they are from very different areas (north vs south). Or if the restaurant does have both, one dish may be much better than the other (where I live, most Thai restaurants are actually owned by Laotians, so they make quite good som tam and other Isaan dishes, but their dishes from other areas are not as good).

                                                And it may be that Thai restaurants in Nordic countries are quite horrible, but if they were that horrible, you would not have fallen in love with the food. So if you do try a Thai restaurant in Japan, hope that it will be better than you're used to, but don't expect it. I would actually give you that advice for all your meals, as many of them may not live up to your expectations.

                                              3. re: Robb S

                                                Perhaps! My aunt lived part time in Sweden for a couple of decades, but I don't recall her complaining much about Thai food there, and she would have had to go out to get her fix. That being said, we didn't talk a lot about that sort of stuff, so maybe it just didn't come up.

                                                1. re: prasantrin

                                                  Thanks! That piece of information is actually very useful. Maybe I am actually underestimating the thai restaurnts here after all and that you are tight that the thai restaurants in Tokyo might not be any better.

                                                  One thing I would like to know though is if duck is a normal ingredient in the menu of a thai restaurant. Over here there is always a duck section on the menu of any thai restaurant.

                                                  One regular item I really like is a whole duck baked in the owen served with the breast up thinly sliced with crispy skin. In between each slice a slice of ginger and a sweet sauce based on honey and chilli. The first time I had that dish was actually in Stockholm in Sweden. Addiotnal the duck section always have several curries green, red and other types with coconut milk and different vegetables and fruits in it. It seems that is not normal in the Tokyo thai restaurants and that is a real shame.

                                                  1. re: Roysen

                                                    I've had duck curries in Thailand (mostly red curry with duck), but duck isn't that popular in Japan. A broad generalization, but I find Japanese prefer subtle flavours and duck definitely does not have a subtle flavour. The only duck I've ever had in Japan was peking duck,and that was just the pancake course. Plus duck is very expensive in Japan and most Thai restaurants there are not.

                                                    I'm not familiar with that whole duck dish to which you refer. It sounds like a posher version of the roast duck you can find around bangkok (at restaurants that specialize in roast duck--mostly Chinese or Chinese influenced). I don't remember seeing roasting houses like that in Japan, even in Chinatowns in Kobe or Yokohama. But that doesn't mean they don't exist, just that I've never seen them

                                                    1. re: Roysen

                                                      Duck is not featured regularly in traditional thai cuisine outside of specific appearances, primarily red and orange curries, and chinese preparations (which is probably the one you had above). However, there are many "modern thai" restaurants that are using duck with other traditional thai flavors in new ways. I had a fantastic "Tom Kha Quail" (instead of chicken) at one such place on my last visit. Should you go to Bangkok, there are many places taking this approach, perhaps unsurprisingly.

                                                      1. re: tigerjohn

                                                        Tom Kha Quail - very interesting

                                                        The idea of taking out everything relating to Chinese, Thai and Indian restaurants from the Tokyo list and cut a week of the Tokyo travel plan seems more and more appealing to me. If I should use that week and add another week using that time for a few days (lets say 5 days each) in Bangkok, Hong Kong and Shanghai this might be real interesting.

                                                2. re: prasantrin

                                                  Very good post. I plan to spend plenty of time between lunch and dinner for walking around near Namba in Osaka and stop in for snacks like okonomiyaki and takoyaki. I want to do the same between lunch and dinner in Kyoto - trawling around and snacking local specialities. Similarily I plan to spend after-dinner hours in Tokyo to trawl Izakayas and have a few sakes and some snacks in addition to sampling the excellent cocktail bar scene in Tokyo during late hours. It is after all just lunch and dinner that are pre-planned. For your information since I plan to get to know the cocktail bar scene with mixing in a cognac and cigar once in a while I plan to stay up late. That also means sleeping late, skipping breakfast and get up in time for lunch. That means I will also not have the additional stomach fill breakfast normally would be. Instead I plan to snack between lunch and dinner as well as after dinner as already described. Having said that I plan to have a regular hangout in each city. Between lunch and dinner in Tokyo I will spend a lot of time snacking in the Izakaya Kanemasu. In Osaka after dinner I will spend a lot of time snacking in the wine bar Mille Carresses and in Kyoto after dinner I will spend a lot of time snacking in the seafood bar Yamashita. If anyone wants to meet to discuss food or anything really I will most likely be found at these places at these hours.

                                                3. re: Roysen

                                                  I don't have a different view of Italian restaurants in Japan vs. Northern Europe. Those in Japan are not as good as in Northern Europe from a quality and consistency standpoint. However, the quality of thai food in Japan for me is not worth your time, however bad thai food in Northern Europe is (and yes, it's really bad). Focus on Korean and Chinese given the relatively (for Japan) larger numbers of immigrants from those countries. When it comes to cuisines outside of North Asia, I feel that Japan is strongest in French and to a lesser extent Italian.

                                                  1. re: tigerjohn

                                                    Ok, I understand and accept your point of view. I am not going to argue with you. My point though is that I really like thai food and even really bad scandinavian thai food. I actually prefer that over any korean food.

                                                    I will look into the excellent idea of a couple of days in Bangkok though. Thanks for that suggestion.

                                                    1. re: Roysen

                                                      Get back in touch if you need Bangkok recs.