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Should I get Henkels Miyabi 600s or Miyabi 600d (fusion) knife?

s
shinydonut Jun 19, 2013 01:35 AM

I went to Sur La Table recently to try out some knives. Although I originally thought I was going to get something like a Wusthof Classic 8" knife, I found I liked the Miyabi 600d 8" chef knife because it was lightweight and its handle was very comfortable.

I couldn't really find a link to the either Miyabi knives at Sur La Table. But here are the links at Bed Bath and Beyond:

600s
http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/produ...

600d (Fusion Line)
http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/produ...

Questions:

1) What's the difference between Miyabi 600s and 600d?
I found a link http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/sho... that discusses this but I still have some lingering questions.

2) Are the handles the same shape or are they just similar?

3) I read the Miyabi 600s has a hardness of 56 while the 600d has a hardness of 60 and its made of VG-10 demascus? Is this increased hardness worth paying for? Can I cut hard things like carrots with either of them?

Although I know a cleaver would be the ideal tool for breaking down a chicken, could I use the miyabi chef knife to break down a chicken. Will it chip if I try to do so (not by cutting through bone, but like cutting through cartilage for instance)?

4) Since the 600s has softer steel, I read that it should be maintained with honing on a rod while the 600d has to be either professionally sharpened or sharpened occasionally on a whetstone? Which system would be easier to maintain?

5) Do either/both resist stains, corrosion, or rust well? Are they reactive to acidic foods like lemons?

Thanks for your help.

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  1. Chemicalkinetics RE: shinydonut Jun 19, 2013 04:26 AM

    <Should I get Henkels Miyabi 600s or Miyabi 600d (fusion) knife?>

    Between the two, I would get Miyabi fusion, but that's me. Another one which worth looking at is the Miyabi Artisan:

    http://www.surlatable.com/product/PRO...

    <1) What's the difference between Miyabi 600s and 600d?>

    The knife blade steel is the major difference.

    <2) Are the handles the same shape or are they just similar?>

    I believe to be the same.

    <3) I read the Miyabi 600s has a hardness of 56 while the 600d has a hardness of 60 and its made of VG-10 demascus? Is this increased hardness worth paying for?>

    Yes, for me anyway.

    <Can I cut hard things like carrots with either of them? >

    Yes.

    <4) Since the 600s has softer steel, I read that it should be maintained with honing on a rod while the 600d has to be either professionally sharpened or sharpened occasionally on a whetstone? Which system would be easier to maintain? >

    It depends on your skill and priority. For many people, the 600s is easier to maintain due to the lower skill requirement -- like a honing steel. For others, 600d is easier to maintain due to its ability to hold its edge -- less frequent knife sharpening. I belong to the latter.

    <5) Do either/both resist stains, corrosion, or rust well? Are they reactive to acidic foods like lemons?>

    They are both stainless steel and they should be both resist stains and rust, but 600s should be slightly more stain resistance.

    2 Replies
    1. re: Chemicalkinetics
      s
      shinydonut RE: Chemicalkinetics Jun 19, 2013 03:06 PM

      Thanks for your very detailed response! I really appreciate it. There's not a lot of info about these knives on the internet.

      I was hoping that you could answer one more question.

      Since you have the 600d, have you experienced any chipping with it and under what circumstance?

      1. re: shinydonut
        Chemicalkinetics RE: shinydonut Jun 19, 2013 05:10 PM

        Actually, I should be clear. I don't have 600d. I have a couple of knives which are made of the same steel as 600d (VG-10).

        Have I experienced chipping in these knives? Yes. I have seen a tiny but visible chip on my Shun Classic VG-10 bread knife. I ground/sharpened it, and have not had any chip since then. This may be due to the reputation which Shun's factory edge being chippy. As for my Tojiro VG-10 chef's knife, I have not experienced any chipping.

        <Although I know a cleaver would be the ideal tool for breaking down a chicken,>

        As for your early question about breaking down a chicken, a cleaver is not necessary the best tools for deboning a chicken unless you want to cut through the bones.

        It may be best for you to use your older/beater knife for that. It also depends on your definition of breaking down. Some people barely have their knives touch the bones on the chicken. Others only use the knives for cutting through cartilage. Others use the knives to break the actual bones.

    2. j
      jaykayen RE: shinydonut Jun 20, 2013 12:30 AM

      I feel like a 56 Rockwell 8" knife should not cost 100, or I feel like there are better options for that price point.

      1. j
        JavaBean RE: shinydonut Jun 20, 2013 12:31 PM

        Hi. My wife has been using the 600d for about 1.5 year, now and haven’t had any issues. I got it at the introduction price (~$100). It’s a great knife, but I no longer consider it to be a steal at its’ current price (~$170). For the $, I’d consider the Artisan SG-2 (if you like powdered steel blades), or other VG-10 class knives.

        1) What's the difference between Miyabi 600s and 600d?


        The blade steel. The 600s is made out “German” steel (probably X50CroMoV15 or something like it) @ 56 hrc. The 600d is made from VG-10 @ 60 hrc.

        2) Are the handles the same shape or are they just similar?

        I believe the handles and everything but the blade is the same.

        3) Is this increased hardness worth paying for?

        Yes, but there are alot variables (maker, type of steel, intended use, user level, etc.) in play. In general, I believe knives in 58-60 hrc range are ideally suited for general purpose tasks, and users with decent handling and maintenance skills. < 58 hrc for knives such as cleavers, that normally see hard contact and / or user misuse / abuse. >60 for knives that see little to no hard contact and / or advance users.

        If the 600s is akin a typical German knife, its’ softer and (more than likely) thicker blade will need a ~16-20 degree (per side) edge. It should be tough enough to withstand misuse, hard items (poulty & fish bones, lobster shells, etc. At the same time, its’ thicker blade is going to be more ponderous, more prone to wedging on general prep items (boneless meats, veggies, etc.) and obtuse edge will crush delicate items (herbs, tomatoes).

        The 600d blade is much thinner, and can take & hold ~9-11 degree edge (per side). Although it can’t handle light cleaver-esque tasks like a German chef's knife can, it does everything else and does it better.

        Can I cut hard things like carrots with either of them?

        Yes. If you have an opportunity to try before you buy, grab a bag of carrots, and do some side-by-side cuts with various knives. You should feel the difference immediately.

        I think the hardest items my wife has done are avocado pits, acorn squash, rutabaga, and a chocolate brick. Got a couple small chips from the rutabaga, and a chocolate brick. The knife probably got stuck and she may have tried to pry it loose or smash it against the cutting board.

        Although I know a cleaver would be the ideal tool for breaking down a chicken, could I use the miyabi chef knife to break down a chicken. Will it chip if I try to do so (not by cutting through bone, but like cutting through cartilage for instance)?

        I’ve deboned (separating the meat from the bone and /or only cutting through the joints) chickens with knives that are more fragile, so neither should have a problem. If you’re breaking down chickens (half, quartering) == cutting through the rib bones and spine, the 600s should be fine, the 600d is going to chip.

        4) Since the 600s has softer steel, I read that it should be maintained with honing on a rod while the 600d has to be either professionally sharpened or sharpened occasionally on a whetstone? Which system would be easier to maintain?

        IME, softer knives generally are easier / faster to sharpen, but need to be sharpened more frequently. Conversely, harder knives require more skill and time to sharpen, but hold their edge much longer. For example, I used to hone / steel my German knives before and often during each use, and sharpen them every couple of weeks. My Japanese knives get stropped (weekly) and sharpened (monthly).

        5) Do either/both resist stains, corrosion, or rust well? Are they reactive to acidic foods like lemons?

        Both are stainless, but the 600s is likely more so.

        3 Replies
        1. re: JavaBean
          Chemicalkinetics RE: JavaBean Jun 20, 2013 05:33 PM

          Wow, our answers are like 90% the same.

          1. re: Chemicalkinetics
            j
            JavaBean RE: Chemicalkinetics Jun 20, 2013 10:45 PM

            This is getting out of hand. How the heck can our responses be nearly the same...all the time.

          2. re: JavaBean
            s
            shinydonut RE: JavaBean Jun 28, 2013 09:39 PM

            Thanks for your input!

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