HOME > Chowhound > Cookware >

Discussion

DISHWASHER

  • 58
  • Share

Most of my appliances are Kitchen Aid and Whirlpool Gold. We moved into our home 8 years ago and all the appliances were new, still we have had many issues with them through the year, so needless to say I have no brand loyalty to Kitchen Aid/Whirlpool

It is time to replace the dishwasher. I am considering going Higher end and looking at Bosch. Anyone have any experience with them, is it really worth the extra money to drop $1,000 to $2,000 on a dishwasher versus the $500 - $750 range? Am I better off saving the $ and spend it on other chowhound worthy items?

Thanks in advance for the advice.

  1. Click to Upload a photo (10 MB limit)
Delete
Posting Guidelines | FAQs | Feedback
Cancel
  1. When I had my KitchenAid dishwasher serviced (thankfully still under warranty), I was telling the repair buy how disappointed I was that it need to be serviced so soon, after all, I got the most expensive model they sold. He told me it didn't matter how much you spend on them, they're all the same. Then he told me he wasn't supposed to make recommendations, but he said I should never get a Bosch... said they used to be the best, but now they're junk. I've never owned a Bosch, but that's what he told me.

    2 Replies
    1. re: ButterYum

      Sounds like he has a personal thing against Bosch, ours has been trouble free for 5 years. I would say though that its main advantage is that it's very quiet - that was an issue for us because of its location - but it doesn't necessarily get the dishes any cleaner than the $300 Frigidaire we had in the last place.

      1. re: Samalicious

        Lol.

    2. My mom decided that a dishwasher would be a great christmas gift for my wife and I a couple of years ago. We went with a Bosch and it's been sensational so far. The most immediately notable thing was how quiet the thing is. You can only tell it's running by the little 'active' light. You can't hear a thing, even standing right in front of it. Anyway, we've been super-happy with ours.

      1. We have a Bosch that retailed in the $1200 range. Happy with it. I'm sure my engineer SO could explain why he chose that ~exact~ model.

        Me? I can't tell much difference in cleanliness of dishes from our old KA. The stainless Bosch certainly looks great and is super-duper quiet.

        1. We have a Bosch as well as a Fisher Paykel dishdrawer(sp?) and have been pleased w/ both. The FP does a better job of drying at the conclusion of the wash process & we use it primarily for glassware. Both units are quiet and have been largely trouble-free over the 4 - 5 years of ownership.

          1. We looked at Bosch but went withaKitchenAid as the Bosch was not as deep and lacked the larger capacity we wanted.

            We recently replaced our old induction top with a Bosch and after 6 months am fully satisfied. Seems more powerful than the older DIVA (Fagor internals) unit!

            1. I chose a Bosch 800 plus (the cheapest in the line) because I wanted the 3rd rack for cutlery. It turns out I really like it, but others actually hate having to line up the forks & spoons in the slots. And the basket slots are too narrow for our flatware.

              As for its quietness - I wasn't impressed. I read reviews of "its silent" & "I didn't even know its running". Baloney. Not only can I tell when its running, I can tell when its running in another room. Its not loud at all, but in a silent house - its not silent. And the loudest part of any dishwasher - the draining - isn't talked about by any manufacturer. You don't see "My 0.001 sone dishwasher is perfect - except every 20 minutes when I hear Gargomel gargling & gurgling at the sink drain." And the solenoid for the intake water.

              As for cycles - I pretty much stick to Auto. I hand wash glassware & I have copper pots & aluminum bakeware, so I don't have need for a glassware or Pots&Pans cycles. On rare occasions, pesto has been redeposited & dried oatmeal hasn't come off, but it could be my stingy detergent usage too.

              Euro dishwashers don't have heated dry. My Bosch has condensation drying. So when the cycle is up, dishes are dripping wet. Many hours later, they are almost completely dry. Typically I speed the process by cracking the door & lodging a shmata there

              My dishwasher does generate a funk - even right after a cycle. I just lay down 3 spritz of Lysol or whatever on the bottom stainless & that takes care of it.

              For me the 3rd rack was worth a few hundred extra. I suppose because the machine was made in Germany counts for some $$. I wouldn't pay for quietness. Heated dry - it would be nice but I can live without. Its a lovely glorified water splashing device, but it doesn't clean materially different from my 20 year old Whirlpool. The lower rack is lower though. Extra space; more back pain.

              5 Replies
              1. re: Vitriolic

                I can't speak for your machine any more than you can speak for mine, but I'm telling you that my machine is absolutely dead silent. I can't remember the model number, but I imagine it is different from yours..

                1. re: TheCarrieWatson

                  I have the Bosch SHE7ER55UC, rated at 42db. Who knows where Bosch measured that noise & how far away.

                  All dishwashers make noise. Invariably, they all have their noise levels tested & listed. When I was looking last year, the lowest was 38 or 39db. "Soft whisper" is 30db.

                  In summary, all dishwashers are louder than "soft whisper" - which isn't "dead silent".

                  1. re: Vitriolic

                    If I'm standing right in front of my dishwasher, and I hit the 'start' button, and I literally can't hear a thing, then I'm sorry - that's quiet. I'm an audio engineer and I have pretty good ears. I'm sorry you don't like your dishwasher but please don't speak for mine.

                    1. re: TheCarrieWatson

                      My old Bosch truly was *that* quiet, so I agree, you can run some and not even know it's on. Then you get splashed when you open it!
                      I'd call my new Bosch quiet, but not silent like my older one ;-(

                    2. re: Vitriolic

                      Re: Bosch dishwashers.

                      The more you pay, the quieter it is. Go to their site and you will see db levels for all models. The more expensive ones have more insulation, thus, quieter. Bosch is the best quality dishwasher made today.

                2. Unfortunately, I think you could mention any brand of dishwasher and there will be people who hate them.

                  I moved into a house six months ago where the previous owner bought a Bosch as part of a kitchen remodel. It was the worst dishwasher I'd ever used in my life. It didn't clean anything properly, it didn't dry, and it took forever. it had terrible space management in that I could barely put in half the dishes of other similar-size dishwashers from other brands. Plus the dishwasher tines were adjustable but kept falling over against any weight so they were useless.

                  I replaced it with a GE Profile dishwasher which was about a hundred times better.

                  1. SAMSUNG

                    1. We have a Bosch, and are very happy with it. It cleans well and is extremely quiet, important in our open concept home. Like others have said, it is not silent, but we find it unobtrusive.

                      Take some of YOUR dishes with you, especially your bowls and glasses, to make sure the dishwasher will hold them, as well as any platters you like to wash. We immediately ruled out many dishwashers as they were incapable of holding our bowls (which are Corelle and not at all fancy or unusual) without nesting and touching. That was a deal breaker. We also saw a few where we couldn't fit platters and glasses at the same time. Multiple salesmen commented how clever that was (I read it somewhere).

                      1 Reply
                      1. re: CanadaGirl

                        CanadaGirl 5 minutes ago
                        We have a Bosch, and are very happy with it. It cleans well and is extremely quiet, important in our open concept home. Like others have said, it is not silent, but we find it unobtrusive.
                        ******
                        Ditto. We just got our second Bosch with a kitchen renovation. The reason our 6 year old Bosch was replaced is because it was black and we switched to stainless for the new kitchen.
                        The Bosch models are virtually the same, save for a red "on" indicator light on the new one. Interestingly, we opted for the indicator light because our black Bosch was silent as the dead. DH would open it and get sprayed on occasion! However, the stainless Bosch is audible during some cycles, but nothing bothersome.
                        We paid around $720 or so for our new Bosch and I love it. It's interior looks smaller than our first Bosch, but it fits so many dishes and utensils that we have to run it not quite full because we run out of clean stuff to use!

                      2. Thanks for all the feedback. My biggest gripes are right now I find my wine glasses never get clean, I find residual crux caked in and dried to into the glass, it is just gross. I also had to replace the tub because it cracked! Thankfully it was covered under warranty, but it was still a fight to have it covered. I also replaced the mother board. I must of just got a lemon.

                        Thanks again for the advice.

                        2 Replies
                        1. re: angelo04

                          Jet Dry works wonders in our slosher. Even the plastic storage containers come out dry and the glass is clear. The top rack fits wine glasses upright or leaning against a plastic thingy that holds the stems in place, if you flip it down.
                          I can say that I'm glad we didn't go for the third rack because of the top head room and what we've noticed we can fit without banging the top when the rack gets slid back in.
                          I don't know *if* the third upper utensil rack affects the head room per se tho, it's just my supposition and I'd look at that when you check out dishwashers. Take a wine glass.
                          Our Bosch is the SHX43R55UC

                          1. re: monavano

                            +1 Jetdry

                        2. I am not so sure the brand is as important as extra water heating and the particle sensor. I have a Whilpool with the Accusense particle sensor, and everything comes out very clean and clear. The water is so hot,I don't use the dry function at all, the dishes come out dry due to evaporation.

                          1. Although there are Bosch DWs retailing in excess of $1,000, their basic models start around $500, on sale. in other words, on pricing, they are more or less directly competitive with Whirlpool/ KA.

                            When I was shopping for a DW 2+ years ago, I did not want to spend more than $700. After a lot of research, I'd narrowed my choices to Bosch or KA, and ultimately bought a KA. I am basically satisfied with it. We've had no service issues. It's reasonably quiet although noisier now than when we bought it, but whisper-quiet was not one of my main criteria. My main complaint is that the rack configuration is not as efficient as my old KA but that was even more true of the Bosch. One of the few features that I did care about was a top rack that could be easily raised or lowered, and the KA was better than the Bosch for that, which ultimately was why I chose the KA.

                            1. One thing I've notice when it comes to noise reduction is that it's better when the sink drains are closed. As others have pointed out, you hear the water draining. But, with the plugs in the sink(s), it is significantly quieter.

                              1. I move a lot, so In the last 10 years I have used 4 different dishwashers. Every one of them has cleaned dishes perfectly fine. My first dishwasher was a Kenmore that I rolled over to the sink faucet and manually hooked up and again that was perfectly fine for cleanability. I have never prerinsed my dishes on any dishwasher, either. They go in DIRTY.

                                So, you want to focus on other features.
                                1) You need a display on the front. Consumer Reports rates Bosch Ascenta as the best dishwasher. But friends of mine own this and you absolutely cannot tell if the cycle is complete. I try to look in the cracks to see if I can see the red lights but I can't. Invariably, I keep opening the door on the dry cycle letting all the hot steam out.

                                Many higher end Kenmores have 3 lights on the front (Washing, Drying, Clean). This is the bare minimum of what you need.

                                2)The soap cup. I seem to be the only person on the planet who has this problem, but I like a soap cup that slides (Bosch). If the door pops out (Kenmore) then you have to be careful to not block it or the soap gets stuck.

                                3)Loading. This would be difficult to gauge until you have it in your house and are using it every day. Bosch's are noticeably smaller on the inside. I had a Jenn Air that was evil for loading. I can't talk about it anymore since it brings up bad memories.

                                3)Quietness. Oy Vey! All I have ever wanted is a quiet dishwasher. Consumer Reports said a Kenmore Eite was "very good" for quiet. It wasn't. Now I have a $1500 Bosch that rates "excellent" for quiet. Yes, it is quiet, but it's certainly not silent by a long shot.

                                4)Dishwasher times have gotten really long. Kenmores clock in at 2 1/2 hours. Don't know how Bosch does it, but a full cycle is well under 2 hours. Bosch appears to be the only maker with a time under two hours. This is true for the Ascenta as well as the higher end models.

                                So, actually, the best dishwasher I have owned is my new $1500 Bosch (SHX98M0[9]UC). The loading space is small, but it's well laid out. It's not silent, but it is quiet enough. And it has a large digital display on the front that indicates time to completion.

                                Next, my old Kenmore Elite which I think cost around $1000. Lights on front were more important to me then the pop out soap cup that caused me endless frustration.

                                5 Replies
                                1. re: blackpippi

                                  Traditionally, Kenmores were made by Whirlpool/ KA, although more recently some Kenmores are made by LG. The features that you describe on your Kenmore are similar to my newish (2 yr old) KA. The pop out detergent holder is far less cumbersome if you use tablet detergent, than if you fill with powder.

                                  The cycle on my KA runs about 90 minutes, but that is because I opt out of the "heat" portion -- i.e., the same as your Bosch, which does not have a heat option. All DW cycles are longer because of re-engineering to save energy.

                                  1. re: blackpippi

                                    One other feature to think about is delay start. I love that feature so I can set the dishwasher to run in the middle of the night or after we leave for the day

                                    I have a mid-range Bosch that is probably 6 or 7 years old. It is fairly quiet and does a good job cleaning. It doesn't create world peace or anything but I have no major complaints and would buy one again.

                                    1. re: tcamp

                                      My 8 yr old Bosch had a massive leak one day just after starting, fortunately I was in the kitchen and was able to quickly stop the water and mop my wood floors. I'll never use the delay start again. It was replace by a Meile which I love.

                                      1. re: firecooked

                                        Don't know about 8-year old Boschs, but when I was shopping for DWs 2+ years ago, one of the features about Bosch that I really liked was an automatic shut-off valve that prevented the DW from flooding the floor if the drain from the DW backed up.

                                        We too have wood floors, and the plumbing in our 100 year old house does sometimes backs up for reasons wholly unrelated to the DW, so this was a feature that I found quite appealing. I ultimately bought a KA, however, after I weighed the trade-off in features that I liked in each.

                                    2. re: blackpippi

                                      The display on the front is not necessarily required. I have new Bosch and while there is no display on the front, there is a light that shines on the floor until the cycle is finished.

                                    3. We purchased a G 1472 SCVi and have used the Miele dishwashing tabs in it.

                                      Once I figured out how to stack our dishes in it I love it. I love the silverware tray, the adjustable racks and how quiet it is.

                                      We do use the stemware holders on the sides and the glasses always come out clean with no spots.

                                      The times I've used Cascade for small loads where I didn't want to waste a tab I've had spots and stuck on things on it. The Miele tabs are worth it IMO.

                                      We looked at a variety of washers but ended up with the Miele and I've got no regrets.

                                      1 Reply
                                      1. re: eperdu

                                        Ditto... I now have Meile's in 2 homes and no regrets.

                                      2. Just a quick note about the control panel. Mine is on the front of the door which is a problem because I inevitably brush up against it while chopping vegetables and disrupt the wash cycle, even when I "lock" the panel. I'll definitely make sure I buy a model with a hidden panel next time.

                                        16 Replies
                                        1. re: ButterYum

                                          +1 on the hidden panel. I don't know that I'd brush up against mine like you do but it looks much nicer hidden. :)

                                          1. re: eperdu

                                            agreed. I chose the visible panel so I would know when the wash cycle was done because I like to open the door and allow the dishes to air dry, but I accidentally interrupt that darn cycle at least once a day so I end up having to start the cycle over again. It drives me absolutely bonkers. I wish there were some sort of clear acrylic shield available.

                                          2. re: ButterYum

                                            I believe I've mentioned in this thread, but may I add that some models with hidden controls have indicator lights that are on during the cycle. My Bosch has a red light that shines on the floor.
                                            The funny thing is (in an ironic, funny way) that our new Bosch isn't silent like our older Bosch. Basically the same model. Go figure, but the red light is cool.

                                            1. re: monavano

                                              The problem I had when buying my new dishwasher was actually finding stores that sold it. My manual says the red light is optional (which is weird because with the large display on the front it would be pointless), but there must be hundreds of different dishwashers all with special accessories. When I went to Lowes I just told them the model number and bought the dishwasher sight unseen which is a harrowing way to spend $1500.
                                              My point is that both Sears and Lowes had about 15 dishwashers on display and that was it. If I hadn't done massive amounts of online research I wouldn't have even known that my dishwasher exists let alone what the options were.
                                              I'm sure my friends who have the cheaper Bosch would have paid for a red light if they knew that was an option.

                                              1. re: blackpippi

                                                Researching online was key for me. It got a little overwhelming at times, because any and all appliances have failed for someone out there, so you have to sift through the information carefully.
                                                We bought our built-in microwave sight unseen and yes, that was a scary $1000 purchase.
                                                I found AJ Madison to be a good resource but also found that putting my hands on appliance was most helpful. It can just be a pain in the butt to track down the exact model you want!

                                              2. re: monavano

                                                Does your Bosch with hidden controls have any visible indicator that says whether the dishes are clean -- i.e., that the cycle has been completed? One of the things that I like about our KA, which does not have hidden controls, is the little blue light that appears & stays on until the DW is opened, reading "clean." It's a handy way to make sure that someone else doesn't load additional dirty items into the DW after the cycle has run but before it is unloaded.

                                                As to the hidden vs. visible control issue, I've rarely had issues with inadvertently shutting off the DW while it is in cycle by leaning up against it, despite the visible controls. It may just be a function of where our DW is placed -- right below an area of the counter where the dishdrainer sits, with a window above it. In other words, we have no cabinets above the DW and do not use that counterspace for food prep. I can see how one might lean up against the DW while reaching up to get something from an overhanging cabinet.

                                                1. re: masha

                                                  The red light goes off when the cycle is done, indicating it's OK to open. There is also a Clean indicator light on the hidden panel.

                                                  1. re: monavano

                                                    The problem is in a multi-person household, where 1 person may run the DW without the other knowing. So, if there is no indicator that remains on after the cycle is done, signaling that the contents are clean (i.e., the DW has been run), person no. 2 may not know that & place dirty dishes into the DW with the clean. The fact that the red light isn't on does not clue person no 2 that the DW contains clean dishes. But, if there is a "clean" indicator on the hidden panel, perhaps that suffices.

                                                    1. re: masha

                                                      We just don't load dirty into clean all that often. I don't know how many other indicators one would need.
                                                      Perhaps we just don't rinse very well when we put them in, but we generally catch it before it happens. It's pretty easy to see.
                                                      Whatever works best for one's household is what you should get.
                                                      I don't get how much more a clean indicator on the outside helps that much more than one on the inside. Just open the door and see!
                                                      Oh, the red light is off. OK. Ah, the clean indicator light is one.
                                                      The dishes are clean.
                                                      ???

                                                      1. re: monavano

                                                        As you say, whatever works for you. A clean indicator on the inside is probably fine.

                                                        My DH insists on, not just rinsing, but actually wiping every dish before he places them in the DW, so it's not always easy just to glance inside and see that they are "dirty." So, some sort of electronic indicator really helps when he has cleaned up.

                                                        1. re: masha

                                                          Agh, the prerinsers. I have been at my friends' house and have demanded they put very dirty dishes in their dishwasher. Every time they say "will my dishwasher clean that?." Then the dishwasher proves my point and they shake their heads in wonder as if it's magic then next time I see them they are back to prerinsing their dishes.
                                                          Frankly, it's bizarre.

                                                          1. re: blackpippi

                                                            You have to pick your battles. I've given up on this one.

                                                            1. re: masha

                                                              So true! The only bowls/plates that I wouldn't know whether they're clean or not are the ones my dogs get to lick!

                                                          2. re: masha

                                                            I have found (based on recommendations from the dish washer installer guys) that you get better results if you load the dishes dirty. There has been some trial and error, but I guessing I have cut my rinsing water in half and getting cleaner dishes.

                                                            1. re: firecooked

                                                              Yes, I know but this is an argument that my husband just will not accept. Inevitably there are occasions when a dish will emerge dirty because the debris was particularly sticky when I load them without rinsing. My feeling is that I'll wash that occasional dirty dish after I've run the DW, rather than rinse everything in advance but he doesn't buy it. As I said before, you pick your battles and it's not worth pressing this one. Aside from this pecadillo in the kitchen, he's great -- a very good cook, who has split the kitchen duties from day 1 of our 30+ years together.

                                                              1. re: masha

                                                                A great cook? I'd concede the pre-rinsing too!

                                              3. If noise is a problem, simply put the machine on delay start and turn it on before going to bed.

                                                1. I've had a couple of Bosch dishwashers. The first one was fantastic. The second, well, not so much. It doesn't dry the dishes well at all. Not as well as the cheaper GE model we have in our basement. And, yes, I have had the heat to dry the dishes turned up. I would not buy another.

                                                  1. Hey Richard - Thanks for the Link - Still haven't replaced it.....yet. But this thread and article has been helpful. WIll post back when I make my final decision.

                                                    1 Reply
                                                    1. re: angelo04

                                                      cool! :-) goodluck

                                                    2. We've had 6 Miele's over the years and various homes. We now have 2. The latest is a G5705 SCI. I consider it the worst Miele product we owned (about 20). I'd go farther but I'm not sufficiently familiar with other makes.

                                                      Compared to our older Miele's, it's noisier, not as well built, very difficult to fill as there are so many tines to support plates, thin and bendy, spaced close together so you need to hold the plate just the right way to get them in straight and built solely for capacity numbers with no capability to handle large or dished plates without wasting a ton of space. Its a product designed by a marketing person who has either never used a dishwasher or owns only Corelle dishes.

                                                      The flatware drawer has its pros and cons. When we have one we complain there's insufficient height and can't accommodate tall plates and glasses. When we order a basket, we complain about the rough handling our flatware gets.

                                                      So, don't put too much weight in Miele's name. I would have agreed in the past but its obvious to us things have changed. We also recently purchased one of their induction cooktops. Another design disaster. Very delicate glass surface relative to other glass tops we've owned, terrible control set and placed so the stove cannot be used as a work or serving surface when not used as a cook top. But a great addition if cooking prepared meals in a pot of boiling water.

                                                      The Bosch's we've had or used vary all over the place, some very good and some not so.

                                                      Look carefully and try to get a demo run before you buy.

                                                      1. I don't have a Bosch, just a top-of-the-line
                                                        GE, and I had to have it serviced after 15 months. The repair man told me to use only the detergent that comes in little plastic pellets and, most important, to use Dishwasher Magic every three months. I have a stainless steel lining that had become all cruddy and the filter was full of stuff. The Dishwasher magic cleaned everything out and left the lining clean and shining like new. I realize this sounds like a TV commercial, but I really couldn't believe what a difference the Dishwasher Magic made. Water now comes into the dishwasher with better force and everything comes out clean, which it didn't before. Try this stuff. It seems to have the ability to turn a lousy dishwasher into a better one.

                                                        1. I'm late to the party, but have had experience with Miele and Bosch so thought I'd chime in. In '04 I bought a Miele and my only complaint was incomplete drying. It cleaned very well, super quiet of course, but I did have to open the door to get dishes fully dry.

                                                          In '08 we rented a home with a new low-end Bosch. Loved it! Best dishwasher I'd ever used, including KA. My only gripe? I missed Miele's upper cutlery rack.

                                                          In '10 we bought a home with an 11-yr-old barely-functioning POS GE builders grade model. Bent, rusted tines, yuck. I went looking for a Bosch and what did I find? They've copied Miele's cutlery rack! I snapped it up online and have been loving it ever since. Cleans well, it's so quiet I have to look at the floor light to know if it's done running, and my cutlery doesn't touch. I'm in love.

                                                          1. Which dishwasher did you end up buying?

                                                            2 Replies
                                                            1. re: shorty123

                                                              My apologies for not updating. I went with LG back in August. We really like it. Its quiet but most importantly my wine glasses come about clean again!. Specific model I will get back to you on, but it was in the $800 range and after sales I got it for roughly $650. Purchased it at Lowe's.

                                                              1. re: angelo04

                                                                Yes -- I would be interested in finding out what model you got. I normally wash dishes by hand, but sometimes use the dishwasher when I want to sanitize things.