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Great NY Noodletown – A True New York Chinatown Institution

Lau Oct 7, 2012 02:11 PM

**For full post and pics**: http://www.lauhound.com/2012/10/great...

Great NY Noodletown probably the most well known restaurant in Chinatown and generally is a pretty famous restaurant. It’s been around for a long time and was here far before I arrived in New York. The restaurant specializes in shao la (Cantonese BBQ), congee and various simple dishes. I’ve been meaning to write about this restaurant for a long time as I feel like my blog wouldn’t be very comprehensive if I didn’t report about this place.

The restaurant looks like most other Cantonese BBQ restaurants in NY; its run down, kind of dirty, has no décor to speak of and has BBQ meats hanging in the window. However, you will notice when you walk in that it’s noticeably more crowded than other restaurants. You often have to wait for a table on the weekends and there is usually a line of Chinese people getting BBQ meats or food to go. Another thing you will notice if you go late enough is that it’s a late night spot that lots of drunk people come to after partying.

Here’s what we got:

- Pork and Thousand Year Egg Congee (Pi Dan Zhu Rou Zhou): Congee is one thing that Manhattan’s Chinatown does very well. I actually find the congee here to be fairly similar to what you get in Hong Kong. Congee is rice porridge that you make by cooking rice with a lot of water until it turns into porridge. I was actually wondering how they came up with the name congee since it’s nothing like that Chinese word for congee (zhou in Mandarin or juk in Cantonese) and according to this Wikipedia article it’s actually derived from a Tamil word (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congee). Anyhow, the congee here is very good, it has good thick consistency and nice flavor although congee by itself is fairly plain, but I’ve heard some people may add some chicken stock or lard for flavor. I prefer to get it with pork and pi dan which is a black preserved egg, which has a creamy flavor if you’ve never had it before. Also, I prefer a decent amount of white pepper and a little chili oil in my congee for flavor as well (it’s always sitting on the table). Overall, it’s simple dish, but it’s done very well here. 8.5/10

- Beef Congee (Niu Rou Zhou): This is the same thing as the other congee except it has nicely silky tender beef in it. 8.5/10

- Fried Crueller (You Tiao): You tiao is a long fried donut that is a standard accompaniment with congee. You take it and dip it in the congee and it’s delicious. The you tiao here are decent, but they are pre-fried, so they’re not nearly as good as a freshly fried one. 7.25/10

The first picture has roast pork, soy sauce chicken and roast duck (from left to right) and the 2nd picture is roast pork. Here are reviews of each:

- Soy Sauce Chicken (Jiang You Ji / See Yau Gai): This is roast chicken covered in a dark soy sauce. This is one of my favorite shao la (Cantonese BBQ) dishes. The chicken is very tender and the skin is very flavorful and pairs really nicely with the soy sauce. The version here is quite good although it can be a little inconsistent. One thing to note is that Chinese people like their meat tender and I’ve found some Americans can find the texture of the skin to be too slippery and dislike it. Overall, they do a pretty decent job on this dish. 8/10

- Roast Duck (Kao Ya): This is roast duck that they pour a semi-sweet soy sauce marinade on it. It’s got good flavoring, but it can be inconsistent as sometimes I find it can be too dry sometimes as I like my duck to be really tender and juicy. 7/10 when it’s off, 7.75/10 when it’s on

- Roast Pork (Cha Shao / Cha Siu): Cha siu literally means “fork roast” in Chinese; the reason they call it that is because you skewer a long piece of pork and then roast it in a special cylinder shaped oven. The marinades can vary, but generally it contains honey, soy sauce, five spice powder, hoisin sauce and some people use this stuff called hong fu ru, which is a fermented bean curd. The flavors can be quite different ranging from very sweet to barely sweet at all. Also, the reason it’s red on the outside is because they use food coloring. Cha siu is literally one of my all time favorite foods when I was a kid I used to refuse to eat the other food and just wanted cha siu with rice. When done right it’s tender, juicy and has a great sweet flavor. Anyhow, the cha siu at Noodletown is extremely inconsistent. When it’s on its actually quite good, I’d say you might even consider it maybe an average type place in Hong Kong, but when it’s off its dry and not good at all. It’s totally luck of the draw as to whether it’s going to be off or on unfortunately. Also, just so you can see here’s a link to the best cha siu I’ve ever had in Hong Kong (https://www.lauhound.com/2010/10/fu-s...). 6.75/10 when it’s off, 8.25/10 when it’s on
Ribs (Pai Gu): These are prepared in the same marinade they use for the cha siu, so it’s a bit sweet and salty at the same time. They are pretty good, not as tender as the cha siu, but reasonably tasty nonetheless. 7.5/10

- Salt and Pepper Soft Shell Crab (Jiao Yen Ruan Ke Xie): This dish has become perhaps their most famous dish; I believe it was written up in the New York Times actually. It’s a soft shell crab battered and fried in a typical Cantonese style salt and pepper batter. It’s nicely crispy on the outside and the salt and pepper batter goes really well with the soft shell crab. It’s well deserving of its reputation and definitely a really tasty dish assuming you like soft shell crab. 8.5/10

- Salt and Pepper Squid (Jiao Yen You Yu): Same thing as the soft shell crab except with squid. This is a favorite Cantonese dish of mine so I almost always get it when I come here. South China Garden (RIP) had the best version, but now that they are closed I find Noodletown to have the best version in New York right now. The batter here is good, the only thing is that I find their squid isn’t quite as tender as I like, but overall still quite good. 8.25/10

- Chinese Broccoli with Oyster Sauce (Jie Lan): This is a standard dish, which tastes exactly as it sounds and they do it well here. 8/10

- Flowering Chives with Beef (Jiu Cai Hua Niu Rou): This is another signature dish. Its flowering chives which I believe are called garlic chives in English stir fried with beef, carrots and ginger. It has decent “wok hay”, which means wok air basically and it’s the flavor you get from cooking food in a wok at a very hot temperature which effectively smokes the food. The beef is very silky and smooth and the garlic chives have a nice crunch to them and good flavor. I think this is one of the best dishes here. 8.25/10

- Shrimp Wonton Noodle Soup (Xia Ren Yun Tun Mian): While wonton noodle soup sounds like it should be an easy dish to make it’s actually very difficult and I would say that it’s somewhat akin to Japanese ramen in that sense. In Hong Kong people take it pretty seriously and you have lots of restaurants that specialize in it and people are very particular about it. I think the hardest part to get right is broth and I’ve never really found anywhere in the US that can get it right unfortunately. That said within in New York, Noodletown probably is one of the better versions in NY. The noodles are pretty decent, but be aware that the noodles in wonton noodle soup are very springy and some people find them almost too springy. The wontons are decent, they’re reasonably well made although I think it’d be better if they used better quality shrimp. The broth is decent although it doesn’t have the complexity a really good version has and I also find it has a little too much alkaline flavor. It has an alkaline flavor because you need to use alkaline salts in order to make the noodles. Fyi, the best version is Shifu Chio in Flushing which you can see here (http://www.lauhound.com/2010/09/shifu...) and I’d also say Noodle Village does a decent version as well (http://www.lauhound.com/2011/01/noodl...). 7.5/10

- Eggplant in Garlic Sauce (Yu Xiang Qie Zi): I ordered this randomly once, it’s your typical eggplant in garlic sauce, but they definitely made it on the sweet side. The sauce wasn’t gloppy, but I thought it was too sweet. 6.75/10

Overall, it is an enjoyable restaurant and definitely one of the better restaurants in Chinatown although their BBQ meats are inconsistent.

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  1. p
    Pan RE: Lau Oct 7, 2012 05:15 PM

    Great review.

    I differ with you on only one thing, I think: I find their Soy Sauce Chicken too salty, and until recently, I preferred the rendition at Wing Shoon. By comparison, I find their Roast Duck great, even though I completely agree that it's sometimes too dry. I'll post about some of my other favorite dishes there that you didn't mention, when I have more time.

    7 Replies
    1. re: Pan
      Lau RE: Pan Oct 7, 2012 05:55 PM

      ah i could see that re: the soy sauce chicken although i guess it's a personal thing as i prefer the chicken to be somewhat heavily flavored if it's soy sauce chicken

      only been to wing shoon once a while ago, so i don't have much of an opinion on it

      look forward to hearing about your favorite dishes

      1. re: Lau
        Pan RE: Lau Oct 10, 2012 09:47 PM

        So my favorite dishes at Noodletown, in addition to the Roast Duck, include:

        Any dish with flowering chives
        Any dish with pea shoots
        The sauteed pea shoots in garlic, themselves, which aren't in a gloppy sauce or anything like that
        Beef Stew, given as a side dish - very soothing, with a lot of fresh ginger
        Of the lo mein dishes, my favorite is ginger/scallion.

        1. re: Pan
          Lau RE: Pan Oct 11, 2012 05:49 AM

          yah pea shoots are great although cooking them with some garlic and oil is very standard, thats how they are usually served

          havent tried beef stew, ill give it a whirl, but im kind of particular about it b/c i find most places in the US can't get it right, i think its harder to make than it sounds for some reason

          1. re: Lau
            swannee RE: Lau Oct 11, 2012 08:04 AM

            the stewed beef tendon is also great as a side dish, especially with the colder weather.

            1. re: swannee
              Lau RE: swannee Oct 11, 2012 08:08 AM

              thats actually what i thought u meant by beef stew, it usually has tendon in it as well

              1. re: swannee
                Pan RE: swannee Oct 11, 2012 11:44 AM

                What they call "beef muscle." Yeah, I like that, too.

                The stew is made from the diaphragm cut.

              2. re: Lau
                Pan RE: Lau Oct 11, 2012 11:47 AM

                I know garlic/oil is a very standard way to cook green vegetables, but to make pea shoots well, you have to start with fresh ones (Noodletown usually does, though once, they used older ones that were mediocre), and some places overuse corn starch to unnecessarily thicken the sauce. No real sauce is needed - just the minced garlic and a certain amount of oil.

        2. b
          batterypark RE: Lau Oct 7, 2012 06:07 PM

          I agree about the quality of the food. Very good to great almost all of the time. At worst, the food is the same as elsewhere. However, as a caution to those who have not eaten here, the place is not very large, putting nearly every seat in a bad place (the front door, the kitchen, the waiter's station), and the waiters can be very unfriendly. I cannot get my wife to eat here because of these factors, but I can and do enjoy getting the food to take away.

          1 Reply
          1. re: batterypark
            Pan RE: batterypark Oct 8, 2012 09:31 PM

            I actually find the waiters fine. They're not usually effusive, but they're busy. They know me, as a long-time regular, and I always say "Hi" to them.

          2. m
            mitchleeny RE: Lau Oct 7, 2012 06:36 PM

            By some strange coincidence, we had lunch at GNYN today - one of our favorite places for roasted meats and soups. We were there early enough to grab some roasted baby pig, a fine rendition with nice, crispy skin.

            I've been lucky with the duck lately, too. The last 2 or 3 times the duck was perfect - just fatty enough and nice and juicy.

            I disagree about the wait staff, but that may be because we eat here a lot...they're always nice and friendly to my wife and me, and whomever else we happen to be with.

            9 Replies
            1. re: mitchleeny
              AubWah RE: mitchleeny Oct 7, 2012 07:44 PM

              I also find the wait staff charming and sharp witted

              1. re: mitchleeny
                Lau RE: mitchleeny Oct 7, 2012 08:00 PM

                the service is sort of gruff, but it's efficient and i've never had an attitude problem with them. although i'm not the best person to ask about service b/c i don't care as long as they get my order correct and the food comes out in a timely manner

                although i agree with batterypark that the seating totally sucks in that place

                1. re: Lau
                  swannee RE: Lau Oct 8, 2012 05:58 AM

                  I, too, have a good relationship with the waitstaff, but I can see that can be pretty short. I think their casseroles are excellent as is their XO sauce. And I fully concur on the beef with flowering chives. My experience with the duck has been mostly excellent. Does anyone else remember how good their goose used to be?? Whydid they stop making it???
                  I always wondered why the soup has such an alkaline taste: thanks to Lau, now I know.

                  1. re: swannee
                    Lau RE: swannee Oct 8, 2012 07:06 AM

                    yah the alkaline taste can vary from shop to shop, you always have a little bit of it, but it can be somewhat off putting if it's too strong as it can taste almost chemically

                    i haven't really tried their casseroles so ill give them a go

                    i didnt even know they served goose; goose is extremely difficult to find in the US. I'm not even sure i've even found a chinese restaurant that serves it in the US except for goose feet. It's something I always get in HK when I'm there.

                    This isn't cantonese style goose, but here's two restaurants serving some great teochew (chiu chow / chao zhou) style goose in HK:

                    1. re: swannee
                      scoopG RE: swannee Oct 8, 2012 07:45 AM

                      On why it is hard to find goose...

                      1. re: scoopG
                        batterypark RE: scoopG Oct 8, 2012 07:50 PM

                        Perhaps this would be better in a new thread on goose, but here it goes ...

                        New York Mart (open for around one year now, on Mott Street, 1-1/2 blocks north of Canal) started selling whole roast goose a few weeks ago. It is around $5 more for a whole goose than for a whole duck, but you get much more to eat so it is still a great deal, and it is absolutely delicious. You can eat there, but it is not a restaurant, mostly elderly Chinese folk eating $4 meals from the steam table.

                        1. re: batterypark
                          Lau RE: batterypark Oct 8, 2012 07:58 PM

                          ive seen the shao la (cantonese bbq) station there, ive been meaning to try it b/c its usually busy but i had no idea they had goose! wow thats very surprisingly. Ill try it this weekend

                          1. re: Lau
                            batterypark RE: Lau Oct 8, 2012 08:03 PM

                            I think the goose was $24 (or $18 for half a goose, so why not get the full goose). They will chop it up the Chinese way, which is what I go last time, but you can also have them give to you either whole or in two halves, which will allow you to carve it yourself and serve in a western fashion if that's your thing. Spread the word, so they keep selling this. Now that I've eaten their goose I will always want it to be there.

                            1. re: batterypark
                              Lau RE: batterypark Oct 9, 2012 06:07 AM

                              im curious to see how it stacks up since ive never really had goose outside of asia and really mainly in hong kong

                2. k
                  knucklesandwich RE: Lau Oct 8, 2012 07:26 AM

                  Good post, Lau. GNYN, warts and all.

                  I've never been passionate about wonton soup myself, and their version tastes positively toxic to me. You mentioned alkaline salts. What's up with that?

                  1 Reply
                  1. re: knucklesandwich
                    Lau RE: knucklesandwich Oct 8, 2012 07:32 AM

                    alkaline salts are used in the noodle making process in order to give noodles their springy texture; in fact it's used for cantonese style wonton noodle soup noodles, ramen noodles and various other lesser known noodles in Asia. Although the noodles used in wonton noodle soup are probably the most springy type of noodles i've ever had, so i believe they may use more alkaline salt than other noodles hence the propensity to have that flavor be more noticeable (although at any great wonton noodle soup place you will only faintly taste it or not taste it at all)

                    i just google'd it, so you can read more about it:

                  2. Motosport RE: Lau Oct 9, 2012 09:50 AM

                    Noodletown is my late evening/early AM go to spot. Fabulous food and a true NYC experience. After a Yankee game last week we took my Joisey nephew and his gal there @ 1 AM. They were in awe of the food, the waiters and the entertaining early morning clientele.
                    "Can't get this in Freehold!!" They agreed.

                    3 Replies
                    1. re: Motosport
                      Lau RE: Motosport Oct 9, 2012 09:54 AM

                      freehold NJ? id imagine not haha

                      1. re: Lau
                        Motosport RE: Lau Oct 9, 2012 11:41 AM

                        Hey!! They have Olive Garden!! All you can eat garlic knots.

                        1. re: Motosport
                          Lau RE: Motosport Oct 9, 2012 12:12 PM

                          haha i have a soft spot in my heart for garlic knots, i used to love those things when i was young

                    2. b
                      bearmi RE: Lau Oct 9, 2012 04:58 PM

                      I was there a couple of times (many years ago) and it wasn't bad but it wasn't memorable either (I actually don't even remember what I ate exactly but I do remember ordering the beef congee.). I definitely trust your recommendation so maybe I should give them another try. Did you have to share a table with strangers?

                      19 Replies
                      1. re: bearmi
                        Lau RE: bearmi Oct 9, 2012 07:09 PM

                        hey bearmi - if you're by yourself or with just 2 people and it's busy then you're going to have to share a table, if you're with more people then u'll probably get your own table.

                        i think you know chinese food pretty well so:
                        - congee is their most consistent dish; worth trying (mind you i love congee)
                        - BBQ can be good or bad totally luck of the draw; can't guarantee how it wil be
                        - wonton noodle soup is just alright especially if you know what its supposed to taste like
                        - salt & pepper dishes usually quite good
                        - flowering chive w beef is good

                        1. re: bearmi
                          swannee RE: bearmi Oct 10, 2012 04:27 AM

                          personally I think their best congee is sliced fish with lettuce....or the preserved egg and pork "powder".

                          1. re: swannee
                            Lau RE: swannee Oct 10, 2012 05:57 AM

                            i like sliced fish congee, but i hate lettuce in it...however for sliced fish congee i like it better at XO Kitchen, they use better quality fish and I also like that they give you freshly fried you tiao

                            1. re: Lau
                              swannee RE: Lau Oct 10, 2012 09:50 AM

                              How funny. I LOVE the lettuce in fish congee! But I agree the fish could be better. sweet and Tart had good fish congee (and dried fish wit peanuts, yum!) but. Like NYNT's congee better.

                              1. re: swannee
                                Lau RE: swannee Oct 10, 2012 10:48 AM

                                sweet & tart...wow that's a name i haven't heard in a long time, i remember going there when i first moved to NY in college

                                not to tempt you with places you may never eat, but here's a place that has some really good fish congee back in CA in orange county. Now that I'm looking at my rating it really should be like 8.75 or 9 b/c its really good, in fact i may change the rating with a disclaimer (in fact both of my ratings are probably too low in this post...i guess thats the problem with trying to quantify something that is qualitative)


                                1. re: Lau
                                  swannee RE: Lau Oct 10, 2012 01:46 PM

                                  Both dishes look great. I also can't eat congee without lots of white pepper fish congee of course needs ginger for balance. Do you anyplace in NY that has congee with dried fish (firewood fish in Chinese) and peanuts? It is a great combo.

                                  1. re: swannee
                                    Lau RE: swannee Oct 10, 2012 02:21 PM

                                    hmmm i dont know, never really looked for it...its possible

                                    1. re: Lau
                                      bob192 RE: Lau Oct 13, 2012 08:29 AM

                                      Had the Singapore Chow Fun for take-out the past two nights (it's a pretty healthy portion!) with leftover steak, and it was the best ever, even cold. Well-spiced curried chow fun (broad) noodles, shrimp, pork, green pepper, onion, sprouts, a nice, satisfying dish.

                                      1. re: bob192
                                        Pan RE: bob192 Oct 13, 2012 11:15 PM

                                        I seldom get that, but it actually is good. Isn't it Singapore Mai Fun, though?

                                        1. re: Pan
                                          tex.s.toast RE: Pan Oct 14, 2012 07:03 AM

                                          most places ive seen offer the thinner mai fun, noodletown definitely does this with the wide chow fun noodle.

                                          1. re: tex.s.toast
                                            Pan RE: tex.s.toast Oct 14, 2012 12:48 PM

                                            I stand (rather, sit) corrected. I haven't had it in a long time, so I forgot.

                                          2. re: Pan
                                            AubWah RE: Pan Oct 14, 2012 08:00 AM

                                            The Singapore Chow Fun at Noodletown is the stuff of legend

                                            1. re: Pan
                                              foodwhisperer RE: Pan Oct 17, 2012 02:34 PM

                                              Usually they call it Singapore Chow Mei Fun and it is the thin noodles and has the curry in it. I love reading this board, especially about the foods of Asia. I never would have thought Singapore Mei fun is not a dish from Singapore. It reminds me of when I was in Cassino, Italy and figured I'd get the popular dish served in Italian restaurants here "clams casino" and they laughed because they were in the mountains and do not get many clams there and never heard of the American/Italian dish called clams casino.

                                              1. re: foodwhisperer
                                                kathryn RE: foodwhisperer Oct 17, 2012 02:45 PM


                                            2. re: bob192
                                              stuartlafonda RE: bob192 Oct 15, 2012 09:55 AM

                                              One of my favorite Chinatown dishes. It may not be authentic as the Chowhound link in the attached article notes, but a delicious dish. I think I will get it today.



                                              1. re: stuartlafonda
                                                Pan RE: stuartlafonda Oct 15, 2012 03:25 PM

                                                I think it actually is authentic - to Hong Kong, not Singapore.

                                                1. re: Pan
                                                  AubWah RE: Pan Oct 15, 2012 03:47 PM

                                                  yes i believe the dish was invented by hong kong chefs

                                                  1. re: AubWah
                                                    swannee RE: AubWah Oct 16, 2012 02:14 PM

                                                    definitely HK. I wonder why it is nearly always with mi fen (mei fun) when it is so much better with he fen (ho fun). I always ask for it with he fen, but it isn't always easy.

                                                    1. re: swannee
                                                      Lau RE: swannee Oct 16, 2012 04:37 PM

                                                      singapore mei fun doesn't exist in singapore

                                                      the closest thing is probably singapore style hokkien mee, but that dish a) doesn't have any curry b) is much wetter than this and c) tastes nothing like this, so im not quite sure how this dish developed

                              2. Silverjay RE: Lau Jun 11, 2013 07:36 AM

                                Went recently for first time in a year and had a real good meal.

                                The soft shell crabs were great. Two large specimens fried to order. Clean and crunchy outside and juicy on the inside.

                                There was a special on the wall in Chinese that said some kind of green vegetable with beef. I asked the waiter and he told me the name in Chinese but couldn't catch it. "You should order it," he said. "Very good." ..Turned out to be a spinach type deal with long stems and slightly bitter leaves cooked with garlic and a little bit of ginger. Beef was very tender and good. I don't know if I'd order this one again though.

                                Since we had done beef there, we ordered the flowering chives with shrimp. The shrimp were plump and fresh and the chives were done perfectly with light fluff from being expertly flipped in the wok. They tasted like Spring. Great dish.

                                Ordered a small plate of the cha siu and the roast duck they both came out nice on this night. Not dry, though both were a bit on the salty side.

                                I like the guys that work there too.

                                10 Replies
                                1. re: Silverjay
                                  Lau RE: Silverjay Jun 11, 2013 07:58 AM

                                  ahh good, glad you had a good meal

                                  the BBQ meats there are super inconsistent like when they are good they're actually pretty decent, but when they're off they're pretty mediocre and can end up anywhere in between. Btw when you get cha siu next time ask them for half fatty and half not. I personally like the fatty pieces more

                                  1. re: Lau
                                    Silverjay RE: Lau Jun 11, 2013 08:05 AM

                                    On that roast meats part of the menu there is also something called young pig or baby pig or something like that.... What's the deal with that?

                                    1. re: Silverjay
                                      Sneakeater RE: Silverjay Jun 11, 2013 08:30 AM

                                      It's the best thing they have. Tenderer than the normal roast pig.

                                      They're very often out of it. If they have it when you're there, GRAB IT.

                                      1. re: Silverjay
                                        Lau RE: Silverjay Jun 11, 2013 09:47 AM

                                        its suckling pig, it has a very crispy dark skin with a layer of pork below, here's a pic of a good version from HK (although this is the whole thing):

                                        there are two roast porks besides the cha siu: 1) the baby pig you just mentioned and 2) i forgot what it's called in english, but its calle siu yuk in cantonese, this is what it looks like:

                                        i have not found a very good version of siu yuk in NY yet, its really awesome when you make it right

                                        1. re: Lau
                                          Silverjay RE: Lau Jun 11, 2013 11:10 AM

                                          Ah yeah, I had siu yuk at Hsing Wong a few years ago. It was pretty good. In general I prefer cha siu.

                                          1. re: Lau
                                            howdini RE: Lau Jun 13, 2013 01:35 PM

                                            Siu yuk is usually hanging in the window, yes? lt's what called "roast pig"? l often get roast pig on rice, with wildly varying quality, but it's usually pretty tasty, and always a great bargain.

                                            l haven't tried it at Wah Fung #1 yet, but l'd like to.

                                            1. re: howdini
                                              Lau RE: howdini Jun 13, 2013 02:20 PM

                                              yes, its the very big one with golden skin

                                              1. re: howdini
                                                fourunder RE: howdini Jun 13, 2013 02:33 PM

                                                I don't recall Wah Fung having Roast Pig as an option.

                                                1. re: fourunder
                                                  howdini RE: fourunder Jun 13, 2013 05:11 PM

                                                  l'm pretty sure l saw it the last time l was in there, a couple of weeks ago.

                                                  1. re: howdini
                                                    fourunder RE: howdini Jun 13, 2013 05:26 PM

                                                    I must have missed it....and i stand corrected. I'll have to try their version next time I go.

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