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Thoughts on Carbone......(New restaurant that from the owners of Torrisi and Parm)?

Beloved1 Aug 21, 2012 07:13 AM

I just read this short article on Grubstreet re: Carbone, the new restaurant that from the owners of Torrisi and Parm:


The article talks about how the restaurant will have a 'certain ambience and a distinctive style of participatory service. “We’re paying tribute to what we call ‘moves,’ ” says Carbone.'

After reading people's responses to the changes at Eleven Madison Park, I thought it would be interesting to get people's take on this new restaurant.

Any thoughts?

  1. jon Aug 21, 2012 03:50 PM

    honestly don't think there's a reason to recreate the red sauce experience, especially considering you can already find it at any number of places out of NYC, places like the queen in downtown brooklyn, marco polo, sam's and red rose in cobble hill/carroll gardens, don pepe's in ozone park, and any number of restaurants in bay ridge and sheepshead bay.

    i can even think of a bunch in the city, including sam's place on 38th street, rossin's, elio's, and of course il mulino.

    you pay tribute to places that don't exist anymore, not places that do exist.

    1 Reply
    1. re: jon
      Sneakeater Aug 21, 2012 03:57 PM

      The thing is, though, that as good as my childhood memories of red-sauce Italian are, I always find the food at the remaining Old Skool red-sauce places to be pretty disappointing. About the only one that I thought really lived up to my hopes was Colandrea's New Corner. So if someone would do a version with food as good as I want it to be, I'd be pretty happy.

    2. s
      Sneakeater Aug 21, 2012 10:25 AM

      This is just copying the way a million restaurants have operated. It's only news that it's being done by young guys with resumes. It's nothing like what EMP says it's going to do.

      BTW, someone should tell Grub Street that traditional Venitian liver dish is calve's liver, not foie gras. Foie Gras Veniziana would be a new invention, if that's actually what they're serving.

      8 Replies
      1. re: Sneakeater
        Spiritchaser Aug 21, 2012 10:53 AM

        I don't think (but I could be wrong - it's happened before) the OP is comparing Carbone to EMP, I thought they were interested in the reaction of people because of so many posters being in an uproar over what they felt was EMP co-oping the "NYC experience ". After reading the linked article it sounds like Carbone is trying to recreate the red sauce experience so what's people opinion of that.

        1. re: Spiritchaser
          Sneakeater Aug 21, 2012 11:07 AM

          Doesn't that seem like something you would absolutely have predicted the Torrissi guys would do?

          1. re: Sneakeater
            Lacrosse_Gastronomic Aug 21, 2012 11:22 AM

            Instead of magic tricks they could reenact scenes from The Godfather.

            But seriously, I love Torrisi so I'm all for this *new* concept.

          2. re: Spiritchaser
            Sneakeater Aug 21, 2012 01:28 PM

            I see what you're saying, actually, so here's what I think (I know everybody cares):

            It's one thing for two guys who grew up in a culture to replicate it or riff on it.

            It's another thing for some guy to come to New York from Switzerland by way of San Francisco, and pick out random New York dishes (appetizing platter! egg cream!) and insert them or takeoffs on them into his menu and claim to be celebrating New York culture. It even SOUNDS like nothing more than tourism.

            1. re: Sneakeater
              Spiritchaser Aug 21, 2012 03:18 PM

              Well, whenever I write my mind on this board it gets removed so I guess I can't respond to this.

              1. re: Spiritchaser
                Sneakeater Aug 21, 2012 03:27 PM

                Maybe you can write the opposite of what you think and then at the end write "crisscross".

              2. re: Sneakeater
                Beloved1 Aug 22, 2012 05:51 AM

                I understand where you're coming from (meaning I think I get your thought-process), but I would be curious what you think then about someone like Andy Ricker who runs Pok Pok - are you thinking that's 'OK' because he only does all Thai at his restaurant? Is EMP different in your view because its cherry-picking NY experiences/dishes for homage?

                Thanks for the interesting conversation!

                1. re: Beloved1
                  Sneakeater Aug 22, 2012 08:18 AM

                  Yeah, that's pretty much what I think I think. EMP is basically a French restaurant, with food by a chef trained in that tradition. It's not like Chef Humm is dedicating himself to learning about New York vernacular food, as someone like Andy Ricker did with a foreign (to him) cuisine. He's just picking a few items, throwing them on the menu, and saying, "THIS IS NEW YORK!!!!!" It isn't, really.

                  (Thanks for starting the interesting discussion.)

          3. erica Aug 21, 2012 09:38 AM

            Except for the Il Mulino style free offerings, presended in what is described as an "attack," most of what they are calling "moves" are common practice in Italy.

            Presenting a piece of meat, or a whole fish before cooking?
            Discussing the menu with patrons before the order is taken?
            Offering a few complimentary antipasti?

            Calling these "moves" is what strikes me as gimmicky..

            1 Reply
            1. re: erica
              Beloved1 Aug 22, 2012 08:32 AM

              Yeah, I think it was the emphasis on 'the moves' and the decor that got me thinking about paying homage vs. creating what some people termed a theme park in the EMP discussion. From the article, 'nostalgic trappings like captains in bow ties and dinner jackets, tablecloths (perhaps checkered), and, yes, lots and lots of red sauce.'

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