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Aug 21, 2012 07:13 AM

Thoughts on Carbone......(New restaurant that from the owners of Torrisi and Parm)?

I just read this short article on Grubstreet re: Carbone, the new restaurant that from the owners of Torrisi and Parm:

The article talks about how the restaurant will have a 'certain ambience and a distinctive style of participatory service. “We’re paying tribute to what we call ‘moves,’ ” says Carbone.'

After reading people's responses to the changes at Eleven Madison Park, I thought it would be interesting to get people's take on this new restaurant.

Any thoughts?

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  1. Except for the Il Mulino style free offerings, presended in what is described as an "attack," most of what they are calling "moves" are common practice in Italy.

    Presenting a piece of meat, or a whole fish before cooking?
    Discussing the menu with patrons before the order is taken?
    Offering a few complimentary antipasti?

    Calling these "moves" is what strikes me as gimmicky..

    1 Reply
    1. re: erica

      Yeah, I think it was the emphasis on 'the moves' and the decor that got me thinking about paying homage vs. creating what some people termed a theme park in the EMP discussion. From the article, 'nostalgic trappings like captains in bow ties and dinner jackets, tablecloths (perhaps checkered), and, yes, lots and lots of red sauce.'

    2. This is just copying the way a million restaurants have operated. It's only news that it's being done by young guys with resumes. It's nothing like what EMP says it's going to do.

      BTW, someone should tell Grub Street that traditional Venitian liver dish is calve's liver, not foie gras. Foie Gras Veniziana would be a new invention, if that's actually what they're serving.

      8 Replies
      1. re: Sneakeater

        I don't think (but I could be wrong - it's happened before) the OP is comparing Carbone to EMP, I thought they were interested in the reaction of people because of so many posters being in an uproar over what they felt was EMP co-oping the "NYC experience ". After reading the linked article it sounds like Carbone is trying to recreate the red sauce experience so what's people opinion of that.

        1. re: Spiritchaser

          Doesn't that seem like something you would absolutely have predicted the Torrissi guys would do?

          1. re: Sneakeater

            Instead of magic tricks they could reenact scenes from The Godfather.

            But seriously, I love Torrisi so I'm all for this *new* concept.

          2. re: Spiritchaser

            I see what you're saying, actually, so here's what I think (I know everybody cares):

            It's one thing for two guys who grew up in a culture to replicate it or riff on it.

            It's another thing for some guy to come to New York from Switzerland by way of San Francisco, and pick out random New York dishes (appetizing platter! egg cream!) and insert them or takeoffs on them into his menu and claim to be celebrating New York culture. It even SOUNDS like nothing more than tourism.

            1. re: Sneakeater

              Well, whenever I write my mind on this board it gets removed so I guess I can't respond to this.

              1. re: Spiritchaser

                Maybe you can write the opposite of what you think and then at the end write "crisscross".

              2. re: Sneakeater

                I understand where you're coming from (meaning I think I get your thought-process), but I would be curious what you think then about someone like Andy Ricker who runs Pok Pok - are you thinking that's 'OK' because he only does all Thai at his restaurant? Is EMP different in your view because its cherry-picking NY experiences/dishes for homage?

                Thanks for the interesting conversation!

                1. re: Beloved1

                  Yeah, that's pretty much what I think I think. EMP is basically a French restaurant, with food by a chef trained in that tradition. It's not like Chef Humm is dedicating himself to learning about New York vernacular food, as someone like Andy Ricker did with a foreign (to him) cuisine. He's just picking a few items, throwing them on the menu, and saying, "THIS IS NEW YORK!!!!!" It isn't, really.

                  (Thanks for starting the interesting discussion.)

          3. honestly don't think there's a reason to recreate the red sauce experience, especially considering you can already find it at any number of places out of NYC, places like the queen in downtown brooklyn, marco polo, sam's and red rose in cobble hill/carroll gardens, don pepe's in ozone park, and any number of restaurants in bay ridge and sheepshead bay.

            i can even think of a bunch in the city, including sam's place on 38th street, rossin's, elio's, and of course il mulino.

            you pay tribute to places that don't exist anymore, not places that do exist.

            1 Reply
            1. re: jon

              The thing is, though, that as good as my childhood memories of red-sauce Italian are, I always find the food at the remaining Old Skool red-sauce places to be pretty disappointing. About the only one that I thought really lived up to my hopes was Colandrea's New Corner. So if someone would do a version with food as good as I want it to be, I'd be pretty happy.

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