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Montreal to join rest of world and allow street food soon?

Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 09:14 AM

I never thought I'd see the day, but could it be that Montreal city council has come to its senses and is about to ditch that old Drapeau-era law banning the sale of street food?


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    Evilbanana11 RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 10:25 AM


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      ios94 RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 10:50 AM

      Great, so we'll have a bunch of hot dog carts lining the city. I'm probably in the minority on here who doesn't want these carts, I'm sure there will be some original ideas and some noteworthy grub but I think this will represent a small percentage of the carts.

      5 Replies
      1. re: ios94
        SnackHappy RE: ios94 Jun 13, 2012 08:27 PM

        I'd be really surprised if hot-dog carts, or any carts for that matter, were part of the plan. People lobbying for this legislation want to allow food trucks.

        1. re: SnackHappy
          ios94 RE: SnackHappy Jun 23, 2012 08:15 AM

          So I guess it's going to be a bunch of hot dog "trucks". lol
          Regulating what type of food can be sold in these trucks is draconian, you allow food trucks or you don't. Who is to say that you can sell the food trend du jour but not steamies, stupid IMO.

          1. re: ios94
            SnackHappy RE: ios94 Jun 23, 2012 09:44 AM

            AFAIC, they should be allowed to sell whatever they want wherever they want as long as they pass food safety inspections. They idea of making this some sort of chi-chi foodie thing irritates the hell out of me. Entrepreneurs are always against regulations and in favour of open markets until it starts to threaten their own business.

            1. re: SnackHappy
              Glaff RE: SnackHappy Jun 23, 2012 09:46 PM

              And what's the point of having a crappy hot-dog on the street when you can have one at every fast-food place for take-out in 2 minutes?

              1. re: Glaff
                SnackHappy RE: Glaff Jun 24, 2012 08:20 AM

                The point is to allow competition, to allow people who don't have the means to open a proper restaurant to start micro-businesses. The point is to bring in a bit of diversity to the Montreal food scene. The point is to not hand the whole thing over to a restaurant industry that didn't even want street food to begin with.

      2. porker RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 11:30 AM

        Will they allow me to set up shop with a whole hog like the article's picture?
        I think not.
        I guess hot dogs and maybe pretzels might be a good start....

        1. e
          EaterBob RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 12:22 PM

          It's actually Camillien Houde who banned them in 1947, not Drapeau (who became mayor for the first time in 1954). And they were banned because at the time they were not sanitary, they didn't pay business taxes, they caused traffic jams, and the fry carts would dump their used oil on the street once they were done.

          1. l
            LoveGossipGirl RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 01:05 PM

            sweet! i just saw this posted online and came here to share it ;)

            who knows what they'll start with, but i hope we get some interesting food.

            1. g
              Ghostquatre RE: Haggisboy Jun 13, 2012 03:25 PM

              I hope it's not all going to be overpriced hipster trash

              4 Replies
              1. re: Ghostquatre
                catroast RE: Ghostquatre Jun 13, 2012 03:43 PM

                in montreal? noooo

                I just hope that the hoops to jump through aren't so small that only an elite few could participate. I really hope that new and recent immigrants will have an opportunity to join the biz. my pessimistic side believes that street food will be very limited to a few areas. Toronto tried that and it was a costly disaster.

                1. re: catroast
                  porker RE: catroast Jun 14, 2012 01:00 PM

                  I agree and am pessiimistic myself - its likely that whatever makes street food great will be regulated right out.

                  1. re: porker
                    catroast RE: porker Jun 14, 2012 01:35 PM

                    Also, the city has only promised to review its policy. I am curious as to the restaurant association's anti-food truck demographic. I can't imagine any successful restauranteur being overly concerned. I would think that the most successful would be the most interested in participating given the popularity and success of food trucks in other cities as well as the new advertising space food trucks would open. Is it mostly chain conglomerates that are opposed? It would be surprising if national or international chains were opposed considering they do well in other cities with food trucks. It must be the Quebec chains.

                    1. re: catroast
                      captain_vegetable RE: catroast Jun 14, 2012 04:12 PM

                      I would actually think that the most vocal entities against food trucks would be major commercial landlords. Nothing would drive down rent faster than having someone compete with your tenant rent-free in virtually the same place.

                      Also, given the mobile nature of food trucks, you wouldn't necessarily know at any point what your location is will be worth in terms of rent in the short-term future. For example, let's say your tenant leaves because there is a food truck outside that drives them out of business. You realise that you need to lower your rent for the next tenant and do so. However, three months into the new lease, the food trucks moves on to a better location and, suddenly, your tenant is underpaying for your location and, until end of the lease, there is nothing you can do.

                      I could see this uncertainty creating a major issue for landlords . . . or maybe this is just my lawyer brain working overtime.

              2. bomobob RE: Haggisboy Jun 16, 2012 01:59 PM

                I'm not holding my breath. The downtown merchants assn has had city hall in their pockets for years. The last thing they want is for people to have choices. I fear we will continue to be the only major city on Earth without street food.
                I hope I'm wrong.

                1. c
                  chickenbruiser RE: Haggisboy Jun 17, 2012 11:55 AM

                  I really don't get this obsessive fascination with the food truck trend. If it's really that great why do 90% of food carts and trucks in NY suck and pretty much serve the same crap. I really don't think it'll improve and make for better food choices in the city... just more of the same. And we live in Montreal... not NY or Vancouver... our outdoor eating season is pretty damn short.
                  Maybe the city can delegate an area where several food trucks can congregate and maybe supply picnic tables so people can sit and eat.... Oh, right.... that's a food court and every dumbass mall has one.

                  3 Replies
                  1. re: chickenbruiser
                    eatwell RE: chickenbruiser Jun 17, 2012 12:26 PM

                    Food carts are especially wonderful when you are a tourist on a tight schedule, budget and travelling with young children. So nice to just walk up to a cart easily, take your items to a park, relax, let the kids run around, enjoy the scenery, etc. Wonderful and the season is not that short, please. Might I add, it's also nice for "locals" to feel like they are on a nice, casual holiday.

                    1. re: eatwell
                      GordGanjini RE: eatwell Jun 19, 2012 09:19 AM

                      Most of those parks you want to eat in have restaurants located around them.

                      1. re: eatwell
                        causeimhungry RE: eatwell Jun 19, 2012 10:22 AM

                        I agree with eatwell. I'd rather pick something up from a food truck and walk over to a park to enjoy it.

                    2. g
                      GordGanjini RE: Haggisboy Jun 19, 2012 09:17 AM

                      This sucks. The trucks will show up for festivals/long weekends/special events taking business from the restos that are open all year serving their hoods forcing some of these places to close.

                      Montreal is such a great city for small restaurants this will kill more then a few of them.

                      6 Replies
                      1. re: GordGanjini
                        catroast RE: GordGanjini Jun 19, 2012 09:29 AM

                        there are small restaurants in every city with food trucks

                        the only restaurants that feel the pinch are the terrible ones

                        quite frankly i couldn't care less if a few awful lebanese restaurants shut down.

                        1. re: GordGanjini
                          porker RE: GordGanjini Jun 19, 2012 10:21 AM

                          I don't think more than a few small restaurants will close because of food trucks; its a different clientele. Some that do close (as hinted by catroast) perhaps are the ones who are teetering on closing anyway.

                          If a food truck sells ice cream, is Dairy Queen gonna shut down?

                          I did run a small restaurant at one time. Hot dog carts and a coupla trucks did arrive in my neighborhood, but they did not affect my business.

                          I'm hoping that its not just a food truck thing, but rather a street-food movement. I'm thinking theres lots of talent and ethnic foodstuffs out there, but the cost of running a small restaurant is prohibitive, not allowing these guys to showcase their potential wares. Running a food stall or stand or cart or food truck might be economically viable for the small guy.
                          Theres a woman on Church Street in Burlington Vermont just selling Chinese Dumplings, another cart selling popcorn, etc etc etc
                          Seemingly in harmony with the restaurants next door and without the high overhead.

                          1. re: porker
                            SnackHappy RE: porker Jun 19, 2012 10:37 AM

                            From the looks of it, and from reading the letter Normand Laprise wrote in La Presse, it's lining up to be an elitist, over-regulated fiasco. If Laprise got his way, only established and "reputable" restaurants would be allowed to run food trucks and only in parks. Sounds dreadful. Others like Marie-Claude Lortie seem to share a similarly elitist attitude.

                            I, for one, would like to see some falafel, kebab and pretzel carts along with the fancy taco, pulled-pork and ostrich sandwich trucks, but I really doubt it's going to happen.

                            1. re: porker
                              GordGanjini RE: porker Jun 19, 2012 11:00 AM

                              Dairy Queen is a small restaurant? Montreal is compared to Burlington? Your analogies are not very good.

                              A small soft serve place might well shut down if there is a truck outside that does not have to pay property tax or provide washrooms (thus the lower overhead) and can simply show up on the best days of the year for say a steet fair in Verdun or a festival in a park in Pointe-St-Charles while the permanent places in those areas need those days to survive the fall/winter/spring.

                              1. re: GordGanjini
                                catroast RE: GordGanjini Jun 19, 2012 12:03 PM

                                And what if a familiar franchise moves next door to the hypothetical ice cream shop and has the weight of brand recognition and corporate marketing behind it? Fairness has its limits. Perhaps the mom and pop ice cream shop would be encouraged to stop selling Nestle products....

                                1. re: GordGanjini
                                  porker RE: GordGanjini Jun 19, 2012 01:23 PM

                                  Who says the permanent places can't "compete" as well: open a small food stall offering different, street-oriented stuff adjacent to their place?
                                  The St. Laurent street festival had lotsa street food places (although mostly stand after stand of bifana or soy noodle....but there was some interesting stuff if you looked hard enough) all put out by the stores/restos/bars themselves.

                                  I think most of our arguments and points of view are a waste of bandwidth anyway as I feel SnackHappy's got it right: "elitist, over-regulated fiasco" which will miss the point of street food entirely.
                                  Me, I'd like to see Mexican cochinita tortas or hand stretched tortillas or simple charcoal skewers etc etc etc. "but I really doubt it's going to happen."

                            2. kpzoo RE: Haggisboy Jun 20, 2012 02:31 PM

                              Interesting CBC Radio discussion with three local food bloggers about the potential for street food in Montreal.


                              1. c
                                catroast RE: Haggisboy Jun 20, 2012 03:52 PM

                                some trucks are in the school yard on de l'epee above laurier right now

                                1. m
                                  mattlane RE: Haggisboy Jun 21, 2012 05:19 PM

                                  In many cities, food trucks serve a lot of rubbish in many cases (think La Belle on Wheels), but some definitely rise above. CHeck out the Vendies (US awards for the best of the best).

                                  Bud of mine just sent me a shot of my Manahattan fave, my main man O'Neil of the Jamaican Dutchy. The goat, jerk, etc. would shame our local Carribean joints. All out of a cube truck.

                                  PS - at the height cheek, their permit parks them right smack in front of the Le Bernardin. Wonder if Eric Ripert indulges?


                                  2 Replies
                                  1. re: mattlane
                                    porker RE: mattlane Jun 22, 2012 03:58 AM

                                    Or is poor Eric's business being crushed by the goat guy?

                                    1. re: porker
                                      mattlane RE: porker Jun 22, 2012 08:33 AM

                                      I'd like to think their respective clientele's can figure it out...


                                  2. m
                                    mangoannie RE: Haggisboy Jul 12, 2012 06:12 PM

                                    Toronto is expanding street food to include healthy foods such as salads, cut up fruit etc--expecting to appeal to other groups who are not keen on hot dogs sausages. but still some think not wideenough, corn on the cob sounds good

                                    Pre-packaged cut fruits and vegetables using only vinaigrette dips
                                    Whole fruits and vegetables, including corn on the cob
                                    Pre-packaged fruit salad
                                    Bagels with individual serving containers of butter, margarine, peanut butter or jam
                                    Pre-packaged nuts and seeds
                                    Pre-packaged salads containing only vegetables and/or fruits with all dressings to be pre-packaged and not requiring refrigeration
                                    Pre-packaged Tabbouleh salad and pita bread Soups
                                    Pre-cooked veggie burgers Coffees and teas

                                    1 Reply
                                    1. re: mangoannie
                                      PhilTG84 RE: mangoannie Jul 12, 2012 06:41 PM

                                      Honestly, I don't understand the objection to street food. It is what it is. I think it could be a positive contribution to food culture in Montreal, but I think most people are skewed by what they see on programmes like Eat St. and don't realize that it's not the reality ( as mattlane said). I've lived (aside from MTL) in Boston and San Francisco, both of whom have street food and let me tell you, you do it once but never again. The concept would be amazing for tourists in the Old Port or people in a rush, but for a casual diner, it sucks. You're often in line for a while for what turns out to be so-so food and then have to find a place to sit and eat. Once the novelty wears off, you kind of avoid it.

                                      That being said just let the trucks in. Those that have so-so fare or who violate health laws will disappear and will be replaced. It's business. Just let it go.

                                    2. j
                                      JerkPork RE: Haggisboy Mar 29, 2013 08:15 PM

                                      Food trucks by 2015?


                                      The Gazette article states, "Most important to the restaurateurs’ association, vendors will have to prepare food in a building where they will pay rent and taxes, putting them on more even footing."

                                      Plus the cart plus brick & mortar expenses? hmmm


                                      4 Replies
                                      1. re: JerkPork
                                        Glaff RE: JerkPork Mar 29, 2013 09:45 PM

                                        Isn't it how it works already for most food trucks anyway? Can you really prepare that quantity of food in your little truck? They can just share a professional kitchen or rent space in another restaurant (like Saint Donuts do). I'm pretty sure they save time and can sell more that way.

                                        Anyway, good news. I'm sure we'll see a lot more this summer since boroughs are encouraged to test it already.

                                        1. re: JerkPork
                                          porker RE: JerkPork Apr 3, 2013 04:32 AM

                                          It certainly looks like good news, but the bureaucracy seems ridiculous;
                                          "A regulatory framework covering all of the city’s 19 boroughs is expected by summer 2015"
                                          "the commission has established a “no junk food” rule, promising Montreal’s vendors will mirror the gastronomic and esthetic sensibilities of the city"

                                          So the pencil-pushers will decide on whats "junk".

                                          1. re: JerkPork
                                            ylsf RE: JerkPork Apr 7, 2013 08:11 AM

                                            I hope they do learn from Toronto's mistakes (ie a la carte program) and figure things out soon. Let the market decide what to support vs a "no junk food" ban. Is a deep fried fish taco "junk" food? Looking forward to seeing the food trucks prosper in Montreal and hope that they offer better value than Toronto.

                                            1. re: ylsf
                                              JerkPork RE: ylsf Apr 9, 2013 12:13 PM

                                              "It appears that street eats will be available on the avenues of downtown Montreal this summer. The mayor’s office has scheduled a 2 p.m. press conference Tuesday afternoon on the subject of a pilot project regarding “street kitchens,” or “cuisine de rue” en français, for the Ville Marie borough."


                                          2. c
                                            catroast RE: Haggisboy Apr 9, 2013 01:56 PM

                                            if you don't make the food on the truck then you aren't a food truck, you are a food delivery guy.

                                            12 Replies
                                            1. re: catroast
                                              Maximilien RE: catroast Apr 9, 2013 03:51 PM

                                              As far as I understand, food must be prepared (sauces, stews, veggies chopping) at a brick'n'mortar cuisine.

                                              All finishing and cooking will be done in the "truck".

                                              You know if you look closely at a regular restaurant, most of the preparation is done in advance during the day, and only the finihsing (cooking, grilling, ... ) is done at service.

                                              There is no difference.

                                              1. re: Maximilien
                                                catroast RE: Maximilien Apr 9, 2013 04:23 PM

                                                Ok but the food trucks of the world that Applebaum hopes to emulate prep and cook on the trucks. That's the whole point. It's street food. It's supposed to the cheap and affordable every man's food.

                                                1. re: catroast
                                                  Peaches to Poutine RE: catroast Apr 9, 2013 04:38 PM

                                                  Yeah, catroast has a point. With the exception of a few, most street food in Portland is prepared on site in said trucks/carts/etc., so why not do the same here in Quebec? Would it violate the curent health code? (The latter is a legitmate question.)

                                                  1. re: Peaches to Poutine
                                                    SnackHappy RE: Peaches to Poutine Apr 9, 2013 04:48 PM

                                                    I think it's to keep the small guy out of the picture, and basically hand over street food to the restaurant industry. This could have been a great opportunity for people who couldn't normally afford to start a business for lack of capital, but the city and the restaurant lobby have pretty much killed that idea.

                                                    1. re: SnackHappy
                                                      Peaches to Poutine RE: SnackHappy Apr 9, 2013 05:05 PM

                                                      And that's sad. I'll be honest, I was hoping this would be a sea change for casual dining because I could more likely afford to run a food truck than a bricks & mortar bakery right now. It was, for me, a bright spot in alternative eating and thinking.

                                                      But I guess nowhere in Canada is really ready to commit to this right now. Not without sucking all the fun out of it.

                                                      1. re: Peaches to Poutine
                                                        porker RE: Peaches to Poutine Apr 9, 2013 05:09 PM

                                                        At least you previously had hope...
                                                        I was jaded from the start, already convinced they're gonna miss the whole point, suck out all the fun, and generally fuck it up.
                                                        Look at the treatment and sham the charcuteries had to go through few years back.
                                                        Pencil-pushing, administrative, civil-servant boneheads know better than everyone else......
                                                        Just my opinion.

                                                    2. re: Peaches to Poutine
                                                      scipie RE: Peaches to Poutine Apr 9, 2013 04:53 PM

                                                      Many US cities have strict restrictions on food trucks. In Chicago food trucks can't park within 200 feet of any brick and mortar restaurant and until 6-months ago no cooking was permitted on board.

                                                      1. re: scipie
                                                        Peaches to Poutine RE: scipie Apr 9, 2013 05:06 PM

                                                        I think in Atlanta, they adjusted the laws because it was all like that the last time I went home--can't be hear restaurants, can't cook onboard--but current news is that it's relaxed and a lot of cool trucks are popping up!

                                                  2. re: Maximilien
                                                    westaust RE: Maximilien Apr 9, 2013 05:09 PM

                                                    Considering that most of the food trucks that existed last year at festivals were already mobile operations from various type of restaurants, I don't see that as much of a problem.

                                                    In the end, what I want, is more variety of food downtown and this will surely bring that!

                                                    1. re: westaust
                                                      SnackHappy RE: westaust Apr 9, 2013 05:18 PM

                                                      I don't want to get into a tirade about the food truck offer in Montreal, but if what we get is more of what we have now, I don't see the point. Why pay the same price as a restaurant meal to eat luxury fast food out of styrofoam plates with plastic cutlery? All it is right now is an interesting novelty. It should be an alternative to fast food joints, but at their current price range it's anything but. I don't see the currently proposed model lasting more than a few years. Once the novelty wears off, that'll be it.

                                                      1. re: SnackHappy
                                                        catroast RE: SnackHappy Apr 9, 2013 06:19 PM

                                                        anyone else see that wonky video of applebaum drinking from grumman's sip sack? he looked utterly ridiculous.

                                                        so how long before sergakis has a truck at all 10 PVM locations?

                                                        1. re: SnackHappy
                                                          porker RE: SnackHappy Apr 10, 2013 04:59 AM

                                                          Actually, I'm hoping the food trucks will constantly push the envelope regulation wise. Not the hygenics, of course, but whats allowed to be made and served on board.
                                                          Hopefully after awhile, an equilibrium will be reached where the beaurocrats/restaurant lobby/resto owners will all be at ease and allow the trucks more freedom than what is now proposed.
                                                          I'm also hoping for 4-legged turkeys, but hey, a guy can dream...

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