84691 Wed Jun 18 17:44:37 -0700 2003 15 3 California 0 469175 Hello, I read the board and nippers.com and have a chowhound itinerary already below, but where should I go for Santa Barbara wineries (on www.wineriesofsantabarbara.com there are about 43 wineries) and what should I try? Will be driving down from SF Bay Area from Hwy 101: 7/3 Thurs nite, leaving SF Peninsula area: dinner: Shadowbrook, 1750 Wharf Rd, Capitola-by-the-sea. It'll be our first time, looks great on their website. Cable car ride up-sounds very cool ------ Hotel: Embassy Ste Hotel, Lopoc 1117 North H St, Lompoc, CA ------ Fri 7/4: Breakfast-Pierre LaFond Restaurant, 516 State St (West of Cota) for blueberry cornmeal pancakes ---- Fri 7/4 lunch: La Super Rica, 622 N. Milpas St (cross-Alphonse St) tamale de veduras, pechuga suizo, gueso de cazuela, veggie tamale ------ Dessert: Via Maestra 42, 3343 State St, Santa Barbara 805-569-6522 (Italian Sarbetti and gelato) gelato a must ----- Fri 7/4 Dinner: Grappolo's, 3678 Sagundo St Ste C, Santa Ynez 805-688-6899 or Brophy Brothers, 119 Harbor Way, SB 805-966-4418 mussels & clams steamed in wine, fresh fish of day, fresh oyster shooters, creamy clam chowder, panoramic ocean views ----- Sat 7/5: Breakfast: East Beach Grill, 1188 E. Cabrillo Blvd, SB 805-965-8805 great banana wheat germ pancake half order 2 for $5 ---- Sat 7/5 Lunch: Palace Grill, 8 East Cota St, SB 805-966-3133. New Orleans creole cajun-food. LA gumbo, bread pudding souffle ---- Sat 7/5 Dinner: Taco Temple, 2680 N. Main St. Morro Bay and Gas Station across from Taco Temple-wonderful homemade tamales Anything I'm missing?? Link: http://www.wineriesofsantabarbara.com/winerypage.htm Wed Jun 18 17:44:37 -0700 2003 0 Arlene 1 469176 It'll help to narrow down wineries if you can give some indication of wines you particularly like or dislike. Short of that, here are my recommendations... I like and recommend: - The two tasting rooms in Los Olivos, both must stops (can never get the names straight; one is a small shop near the flagpole, the other is a large barn on the edge of town; both pour a wide selection of wines from wineries not open to the public) - Babcock (nice pinot noir and chardonnay, and I generally dislike CA chard) - Sunstone (really liked their viognier from a few years ago, beautiful building) I did not like and recommend avoiding: - Fess Parker (tourist trap with poor wines) - Firestone (mediocre wines) - Zaca Mesa (long drive, underwhelming wines) Hmmm... I know I've been to a few more wineries in that area, but none of the names on your site or the one I linked below are ringing any bells. I wonder if some have been renamed or closed... I've heard raves lately about Melville's pinot noirs, though I've yet to try any of their wines. Finally, don't forget about all the wineries in the Paso Robles area. There are quite a few that are just off 101. Info is at http://www.pasowine.com (which, by the way, is the best regional wine guide of its kind; every region should make a list of wineries by grape!). Last time I drove to L.A. I made stops at... - Garretson (good selection of rhone style wines) - Turley (good zinfandel, expensive to taste though) - Wild Horse (very diverse range of wines: some good, some not; if you go don't miss the blaufrankisch) Link: http://www.sbcountywines.com/home.html Wed Jun 18 19:23:16 -0700 2003 469175 0 nja 2 469181 Thanks for all the suggestions. More questions: We changed the hotel location, now we're staying at Sandman Inn, 3714 State St, SB from Thu-Sat. Where should we have dinner on Thurs night? If driving from SF Bay Area, what's a stop half-way? Is Cambria half-way? Wines we like-Reds..not much of a drinker very social, just want to try some and maybe buy a bottle or two. Is Palazzio good or is it like Buca di Beppo in the Bay Area-huge amount of food, not that great? Found out Sandman Inn will have free continental breakfast so won't be having breakfast in the restaurants. What's good at Grappolo? Where can I get the Pinoit from Hitching Post at a more reasonable price? Thanks for the help, Arlene Thu Jun 19 11:54:04 -0700 2003 469176 0 Arlene 3 469183 So you were originally planning on staying in Lompoc the whole time, but now got a hotel in SB proper? Very wise decision. :) For a stop half way, go someplace in San Luis Obispo. I had always liked Big Sky Cafe, but it's been many years since my last visit. If you go, be sure to save room for beignets for dessert. I'm sure there are other suggestions for SLO on this board. Buca di Beppo is a national chain, by the way. Started somewhere in Minneapolis 10 years ago. Link: http://www.bigskycafe.com/index2.html Thu Jun 19 12:34:38 -0700 2003 469181 0 nja 4 469197 If Cambria is your stop - far more scenic that Paso Robles or King City - the two best places for dinner are Robins and the Black Cat Bistro. Can be crowded at both locales - so call ahead for reservations. The Bistro has a tiny dining room. If you are looking for breakfast in SLO - Blue Sky is the best! Fri Jun 20 10:15:40 -0700 2003 469183 0 Oceanlover 3 469184 You're right about Palazzio ... big, mediocre food. And the last time I was there they didn't take reservations so we ended up standing outside on the street. If you like Indian food, Cafe Taj at 905 State St., is very good and reasonably priced too. And I would definitely pick Brophy Brothers over the Paradise in spite the whatever wait you might have. Walking the breakwater and enjoying the harbor is delightful. And be sure to ask for outside seating (take something warm to wear) because the view is wonderful. We've eaten at The Sow's Ear in Cambria and find the food reliably good (stear clear of the chicken fried steak tho). Good luck. Thu Jun 19 12:35:18 -0700 2003 469181 0 Jane 4 469188 Jane's description of Palazzio is spot on but should have been in the past tense. It closed a couple of months ago, and is slated to reopen at some point in the future as part of the Dario Furlati/Gene Montesano Italian restaurant mini-empire. Thu Jun 19 17:25:19 -0700 2003 469184 0 David Russell 4 469210 While Cafe Taj is decent, Spice Avenue on State St. is significantly better. It opened about a month ago, and is currently the best Indian in SB. It's not stellar, but if you've got a craving, it'll satisfy it. Fri Jun 20 19:17:59 -0700 2003 469184 0 Ted 4 469296 I had lunch at the Paradise cafe today and wasn't really impressed. We were hungry after driving down from San Luis Obispo to visit Lotusland (which was great...) All I remembered was the Palace in SB but the woman I was with had been there and wanted to try the Paradise cafe instead. We decided to split a large spinach salad with rock shrimp and a calamari sandwich. The spinach salad was large but It didn't really even taste like there was a dressing on it kind of plain with big chunks of tomato and avocado… the Calamari sandwich had what seemed like two day old bread. The best part was the glass of cold Heineken, and the woman that accompanied me.. :) It was quite a while ago, but I think I’ve eaten at the Brophy place (near the docks with a balcony??) I really liked the place and seemed to remember liking the food pretty well too, but it was about three years ago. We had another beer/coffee with desert at some corner Italian place on State a few blocks down toward the ocean and then on our way back had another beer at the Cold Springs tavern (off hwy 154). I hadn’t been there in years at it is a really great place (very casual almost a bit of a dive with all sorts of people). She loved it and asked me to bring her back to have a meal there too. Sun Jun 29 03:28:22 -0700 2003 469184 0 Roger 3 469185 Your half way point is probably somewhere around King City, I seem to recall a fairly recent post about some good Mexican food there. Paso Robles isn't too much further and has a number of good choices, the new Paris just off the town square is very good. Do a search of past threads and you'll find some more suggestions. If you opt for Cambria keep in mind it will add at least an hour to your travel time. Thu Jun 19 13:03:50 -0700 2003 469181 0 PolarBear 2 469202 Though your recommendation may be to pass on Firestone winery, I would suggest considering a stop at Firestone Brewery -- either in Buellton or in Paso Robles. Great local atmosphere, wonderful beers, and a good "break" from wine tasting. I like the double barrel unfiltered ale -- only available at the brewery. I bring home 'growlers' of that beer as often as I make the trip. Link to the taprooms below. Link: http://www.firestonewalker.com/sections/drink_firestone/buellton_taproom.html Fri Jun 20 13:04:37 -0700 2003 469176 0 jen maiser 1 469178 A couple of thoughts on your itinerary Arlene. After dinner in Capitola you're going to have a rather long (3.5 hrs?) drive down to Lompoc on a very heavy travel weekend. We used to frequent the Palace when they first opened but after a couple of years the quality of the food and service seemed to go downhill. It's been quite a few years since we've been back so maybe some of the Hounds out there can share their more recent experiences. Always enjoy the Cioppino at Brophy Bros. but they don't take reservations so there'll probably be quite a wait. They do provide a little pager so you can walk around the yacht harbor. We often just wait for seats at the bar to open up. My winery visits in the area are pretty limited but have been making an effort the past year or so of becoming more familiar. I would second the no vote for Fess Parker, pretty grounds and all but there are much better wines around. We visited LinCourt a few years ago and weren't particularly impressed but I recently heard some high praise for one of their recent efforts with Pinot I believe. Also heard that they market their higher end stuff under the Foley label. Cambria and Byron make a decent Pinot. A couple of weeks ago I was impressed with a couple from Andrew Murray, a syrah and a syrah blend IIRC. Qupe and Jaffurs make some decent syrah as well. I have some others on my must visit soon list, Beckmans, Fiddlehead, and Whitcraft. These are on the higher end price wise I believe but seem to continually receive high marks. Maybe Melanie Wong and some of the other more knowledgeable Winehounds will share their expertise. Wed Jun 18 20:55:57 -0700 2003 469175 0 PolarBear 1 469180 If you opt for S.B. rather than Santa Ynez on Friday night and are looking for a casual, populated-largely-by-locals place, I'd opt for Paradise Cafe over Brophy's. The fish will be just as fresh (grilled on an oak grill), and the burgers--should you suddenly find yourself seized by carnivorous cravings--are the best around. The exceptionally well put together and reasonably priced wine list closes the deal for me. Palace Grill? I've lived in Santa Barbara for 18 years now and just don't see the appeal. Wineries are a bit of a tough nut in that most of the very best don't accept visitors. Therefore, you won't be visiting Au Bon Climat, Qupé, Brewer-Clifton, Bonaccorsi, or Kunin, for example, though some or all of these can probably be tasted in Los Olivos. Of the two retail-stores-cum-tasting-rooms there, by the way, you'll have the far better experience at Bob Senn's Los Olivos Wine & Spirits Emporium just outside (south?) of town. As for wineries that do welcome guests, Melville is absolutely worthy of the buzz others have mentioned. Stolpman is poised to surge to the top tier of Rhône variety producers now that Ojai alum Sashi Moorman has taken the reins there. Back in Santa Barbara proper, Craig Jaffurs is turning out stunning wines at his eponymous winery on Montecito Street. Wed Jun 18 23:39:10 -0700 2003 469175 0 David Russell 1 469194 Here's a report on a recent one day winery trip I took to the S.B. area... I recently took a trip that started with two activities at Hospice du Rhone, continuing with the Ojai Music Festival over the weekend, and ending by wandering around the Santa Ynez Valley. On Monday, after a night at the Ballard Inn (recommended!), I started at Lafond Winery on Santa Rosa Road, which is the upscale bottling of Santa Barbara Wines. Nothing remarkable here save for a late harvest "2000 zinfandel essence" with 27% residual sugar which smelled and tasted exactly like ripe cherries. Next was Melville who graciously accepted an appointment for me on short notice. The 2002 Clone 76 - Inox was a delicious example of a no-oak chardonnay and I bought a few bottles. They also poured their regular 2001 estate Pinot Noir and Syrah bottlings, which I find a bit thin and tannic. Finally, even though they weren't pouring it, I picked up a bottle of the 2001 Carrie's Pinot Noir (alc. 15.1%) for "research." Back around to Sanford (they weren't open yet the first time around). The 1999 Estate Chardonnay is a perfect example of a big, oaked California wine. If you like this style, this is an excellent one, fairly priced. I also got to compare two single-vineyard 2000 pinots, the La Rinconada and the Sanford and Benedict. Although the La Rinconada got some great press, right now it is closed and tannic and not much fun. The 2000 Sanford and Benedict pinot noir was much better with great pinot character and softer tannins. I am sorry I didn't buy a case while I was there as this is not a real easy wine to find. In Los Olivos, I wandered into the Longoria Tasting room but for some reason didn't taste. Bad vibes? After I got back a few friends mentioned that Longoria has a good reputation; perhaps I should have plunked down my $7.50 ... and then again, perhaps not. Andrew Murray Vineyards also has a tasting room in Los Olivos. Don't miss this one. Mr. Murray is very talented at making friendly, well-priced wines. They had five wines to taste ( 2001 Viognier "Tous le Jours", Enchante, Esperance, 2000 Syrah "Les Coteaus" and Syrah Melville Vineyard) and each one was a winner. It was hard to choose where to spend the $$, but I picked up a few bottles of the Andrew Murray 2000 Melville Vineyard Syrah, which will be fun to compare to the Ojai version in a year or two. Down the street, I bought the last two bottles of Fiddlehead Estate 2000 Lollapalooza Fiddlestix Pinot Noir. I had a bottle of this with dinner on Saturday at Deco in Ventura (a good place) where I found the wine to be big and highly extracted, but balanced and delicious with sweet tannins on the very very long finish. Over in Santa Ynez, behind the Santa Ynez Inn, there is a new wine store tasting room dedicated to Au Bon Climat, Byron, IO, Qupe and Westerly. The 2000 Westerly "W" Red Meritage (55% Cabernet Franc, 45% Merlot) was the surprise here, sort of a right-bank Bordeaux on the left-coast. It had good fruit, unctuousness, stuffing and a long pleasing finish. Westerly also has a Viognier which was over the top with lots of extraction and 15.3% alcohol. This was an impressive effort, but I can’t imagine it would be refreshing with food! Finally, on the way back to San Francisco, I drove up to Santa Maria through Foxen Canyon. The Foxen Winery tasting room is a classic: a small tin-roofed shed by the side of the narrow road. Foxen was pouring a really wide selection of wines including a good collection from their library. I bought a few bottles, but the standouts were two recent Foxen wine-club offerings, the 2001 Dry Farmed Tinaquiac Vineyard Syrah, and the 2001 Bien Nacido Block 8 Clone 115 Pinot Noir. They also told me that the Syrah from the Williamson Dore vineyard (named after the co-owners of Foxen) -- which I liked so much at HdR -- will be a regular bottling starting next year. Link: http://www.ballardinn.com/ Thu Jun 19 19:10:18 -0700 2003 469175 0 Paul H 1 469195 It is very likely that Grappolo will be closed for the Fourth of July - you'd better call first. As far as buying Hitching Post wines at a better price, you can check around at a few local wine stores, but I don't think you'll find them much cheaper. Some local (Santa Ynez Valley) wine stores with good selections include: Los Olivos Grocery, on Hwy 154, across from Brander Winery, which I recommend for a visit, Los Olivos Cafe & Wine Merchant, right in Los Olivos, and the El Rancho Market, on Hwy 246, between Solvang and Santa Ynez. In Santa Barbara, try the Wine Cask, or East Beach Wines, to name a few. Oh, and when wine touring in the Santa Ynez Valley, Bob Senn's Los Olivos Wine Emporium really is a must stop, as others have said. I would make it my first stop, and Bob will give you great advice. Fri Jun 20 08:57:29 -0700 2003 469175 0 JT 1 469212 I've just perused the responses to your request - agree that Palazzio is more like Buca di Beppo - lots of food, ok but nothing great. Also agree with the reply that Brophy Bros. is the place for seafood - Paradise Grill is good, but not like Brophys. One of my favorite casual places is Sojourner Cafe - always pleased with the quality/variety...semi healthy with a lot of vegetarian items, but also serves fish and chicken, and really good desserts! Another favorite is Aja - Calif/Asian fusion... the chef worked for the original Roys in Honolulu. Sat Jun 21 11:28:16 -0700 2003 469175 0 Bob