Top Chef Texas - Ep. #6 - 12/07/11 (Spoilers)

[LindaWhit]

The Queen of Mean and the King of Pain are going to featured on tonight's episode! At least, that's what the preview showed. Who are they? Well, you'll just have to watch/read to see, won't you? :-)

The episode starts off back at the TC House, everyone missing Chuy. Only 5 guys left vs. 8 women.

The next day, they show up at Le Cordon Bleu in Dallas, where Padma and Chef Dean Fearing are there to greet them. Paul went to school there, so everything is very familiar to him.

The Quickfire tests their skills as a saucier, the most prestigious position on the line in a kitchen, according to Chef Fearing. They draw knives that each have one of the five mother sauces: Veloute, Tomate, Espagnole, Hollandaise, and Bechamel. Their challenge is to make a dish that uses the sauce they drew, but one that is personalized. They have 1-1/2 hours to cook. Some of the dishes looked amazing!

The dishes that were in the bottom? Dakota, Nyesha, and Beverly.
The dishes in the top group? Grayson, Chris C., and Paul.

And the winner is? Grayson wins! She gets immunity in the Elimination Challenge.

The EC is all about steak - they'll work as one team creating a 4-course dinner for 200 guests at the Cattle Baron's Ball. Steaks need to be medium-rare when they hit the table, and steak must be included in at least two of the dishes. The Ball will be held at Southfork Ranch - the home of the the TV show, "Dallas". The winner will get a 2011 Toyota Venza - they get to drive them on the way to Whole Foods. But first, they have 30 minutes to plan their menu.

First course - Soup - Dakota, Beverly, Sarah
Second course - Appetizer - Edward, Chris J., and Paul
Third course - Entrée - Nyesha, Ty-Lor, Whitney & Chris C.
Fourth course - Dessert - Lindsay, Heather, and Grayson

Edward takes on the role of "Secretary" to keep everyone on track - but he's ticked off that Heather's taking * his* cake recipe and doing the same thing that she did at the Quinceañera.

They make a mess in Whole Foods, breaking bottles. They're back at the kitchen and have 3 hours to prep.

The first course soup will be a Tomato-Watermelon Gazpacho. The second course app will be seared NY Strip Steak Carpaccio. The third course entrée will be steak with greens and a potato gratin. Then, the cake for dessert.

Heather notes that Beverly is in charge of one thing - shrimp. Three hours should be plenty of time to prep, but as a team, they're looking for her to do more. Whitney said she won't get her potato gratin in to cook tonight, and Edward is concerned. Meanwhile, Ty-Lor is digging out marrow with an oyster knife, and he cuts himself. The medic tells him he'll need stitches, but he said just to wrap the hand as he's not going to stop cooking. Time is up, and they all head back to the house except Ty-Lor, who heads to the hospital. Ty-Lor is in charge of the steak the next day - this could be a problem. He doesn't show back up until the next morning - the emergency room was very busy.

They all head off to the Southfork Ranch. It's going to a scorcher outside. Heather is doing a lot of organization, getting plates ready to be used for plating each course's dish. Whitney's had to remove the top layer of her potato gratin, as they were discolored. But Heather's also snarking about Beverly taking two full days to prepare the shrimp for poaching.

Tom Colicchio does his walk-through, and notes who's doing what for each course. The steaks that Ty-Lor is responsible for will be marked on the grill, and then finished in the oven. Somehow, Beverly gets all of the shrimp done as well. Ty-Lor's dealing with a buttload of charcoal Weber grills outside in the heat.

Hugh Acheson joins the judges, along with two women who head up the charity side of the Cattle Baron's Ball and the American Cancer Society. Hugh asks who was taking a leadership role in the kitchen, and Tom replies that yesterday Ed got the ball rolling, but Lindsay and Heather took the lead on the day of service.

The first course is a Tomato-Watermelon Gazpacho, with Poached Shrimp and Avocado Mousse. Tom thinks they played it a bit safe, but other diners seem to like it.

The second course is a NY Strip Carpaccio with Heirloom Tomato and Asparagus Salad, a Candied Pistachio Vinaigrette, and Mushroom "bacon". Tom wasn't happy with it, but Dean Fearing liked the degree of doneness on the steak.

Meanwhile, when the 2nd course was being plated, Lindsay was nervous that the steaks needed to be started. Timing to serve this course is key - Edward flashed the steaks a bit too early, WAY too soon since the diners were still on the 2nd course. The course was served - a Grilled Rib Eye with Creamy Potato Gratin, Braised Greens and a Compound Butter. BIG problem - Dean Fearing did NOT get a medium rare steak. The potato gratin was undercooked, but they liked the compound butter and the sauce, both of which Nyesha made.

The last course of dessert is a "Right Side Up" Texas Peach Cake, Peach Salad, with a Candied Pecan Streusel. The judges mostly seem to like the dessert, the diners are split.

Service is over, and Ty-Lor feels he's done. Whitney wasn't happy with her potato gratin, and it seems both feel that they'll be at Judges Table.

In the Stew Room, Heather asks what went wrong with the steaks. Ty-Lor said he was responsible for the steak, but had only had 1 hour of sleep. In addition, Heather also called out Beverly about the fact that she only worked on just the shrimp.

Padma comes in and asks to see Nyesha, Heather, and Chris Jones. They're in the Top Group! Chris's steak carpaccio was perfectly done. Heather's dessert (the cake) was well done - light as a feather and very moist. Nyesha's butter saved the entrée. And the winner is Heather with her cake - she gets the 2011 Toyota Venza!

They head back into the Stew Room, and Heather said they want to see Ty-Lor, Whitney and Beverly. You also saw that Edward was visibly ticked that Heather won using his recipe.

Ty-Lor knows the steaks were overcooked when they went out. The Judges's plates were all over the map on the doneness of the steaks they received - everything from rare to medium-well done. Whitney's potato gratin was raw for many of the diners. Edward's salad that was under the Steak Carpaccio was just underwhelming. Edward said that no one wanted to step on anyone else's toes, but Hugh said that someone had to rise up and say that they've got a vision for that plate and it's going to be awesome....and no one did.

Back at JT, *none* of the Bottom Three were well liked. Hard to say who's going home based on what we heard from the judges, but I'm thinking it might be Whitney. Tom's overview highlights all of the faults of each dish, and then said that it wasn't hard to choose who was going home this time. Sure enough, it's Whitney.

Next week preview shows it's a double elimination, and the cheftestants have to judge the three dishes on the bottom!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now it's on to LCK! Whitney heads back to the TC house, and finds Tom's letter to meet him in the TC ktichen. This is when she finds out about her chance to stay in the competition. So it's Whitney vs Chuy...and their challenge is to create the Classic American Burger. Andrew, Keith and Richie are there to cheer them both on. Tom has them draw knives - Chuy gets ostrich, and Whitney gets elk. Both proteins are lean, so they'll have to make sure to keep it moist. Interesting questions and comments coming from the Peanut Gallery of A, K and R, almost as if they were judging! Sure enough, they get to try the burgers after Tom does, and he *does* ask their opinion. I know which burger *looked* better to me.

[Ruth Lafler]

BTW, I was watching some of the re-runs last night, and it struck me that Heather called Tom Colicchio "Tom" when he checked in with them during set up. It seemed overly familiar, somehow. Don't most -- if not all -- of the cheftestants call him "chef" when they speak to him?

[monavano]

I've noticed that they call Tom "chef" most of the time, but maybe Colicchio is laid back and said, "hi, I'm Tom". It's not as bad as when Kelsey Nixon appeared on the Rachael Ray show (with the other finalists) to do a segment for TNFNS and walked out and called her "Rach" (which she hates).

[Ruth Lafler]

Colicchio is a laid back guy, and I'm sure he doesn't care if they call him Tom, especially outside the parameters of the show. But on the show, he's a judge, and treating him like a colleague by calling him by his first name is clearly not something that most of them feel comfortable doing. It's very consistent with what we've seen of Heather, though, that she does, both her arrogance and her tone-deafness to social interactions.

[cowboyardee]

http://www.tvguide.com/News/Top-Chef-...
For anyone interested, here is an interview with the eliminated chef, Whitney. Some nice insight into what makes talented chefs cook really awful food in a competition. She seems to have a decent head on her shoulders.

[Joanie]

She sounds nice, smart and fairly personable there whereas on the show, she seemed like one of the most insipid personalities in the house.

[chicgail]

editing. editing. editing.

[mariacarmen]

i hope one of them goes home tonight so we can finally let this sub-thread die an unnatural death!

[soupkitten]

really? i thought whitney came off as fairly talented, nice, and "cool." all the "i love you"'s she was receiving (and giving) during her exit from the stew room seemed quite genuine.

[cowboyardee]

She seemed like a very warm, nice person on Last Chance Kitchen, particularly.

[chowser]

I thought both she and Chuy came off really well on LCK. It made me like them both a lot more.

[LindaWhit]

Did you not like Chuy during the regular show, chowser? I did. Although his endless stories (most of which I suspect we *didn't* hear the way the cheftestants did) would drive me bonkers after awhile, I think. :-)

[chowser]

I did. I just thought he came off as more humble in this episode so I like him even more. I loved how he took charge in the quincenera episode and think he was the force that got them to act as a team and produce good food. I also think the LCK shows that there is more respect and camaraderie among the chefs than shown. as we all know. I loved seeing the other chefs cheering and giving pointers and giving warnings ("get the pan on, get the pan on!").

[LindaWhit]

Good point on LCK showing respect amongst the cheftestants - at least those of who have had the misfortune of being to to PYKAG. I'm not sure the same could be said of all who are currently in the TC kitchen.

[John E.]

Had Chuy lasted at least through the half-way point I think he would have made a run at fan favorite. Right now, I don't see any of them in that way.

[LindaWhit]

John, I agree with you re: Chuy getting Fan Favorite if he had lasted longer. Right now, it seems Chris Crary is winning some online favorite contest that Bravo has going. Gah.

[JuniorBalloon]

Can we assume at this point that we can post spoilers about LCK for this episode? I have more to say, but don't want to spill the spoils.

jb

[chowser]

I was wondering that, too, and was very careful w/ how I coached my words so I wouldn't give it away.

[LindaWhit]

Lord, I would *hope* that people would have seen LCK at this point. My request to not post spoilers re: LCK is mostly asking that everyone give it a few days to allow anyone who hasn't yet seen the online ep to have a chance to view it.

So personally? I say have at it. :-)

[chowser]

I'm so glad who won won!;-) I actually just saw it but I don't really mind about spoilers. I don't care if I know who won before I see it. Actually, I would have been fine with either Chuy or Whitney winning.

[LindaWhit]

I know, but there are others who do mind spoilers...which is why they don't read this thread until they've seen the show. :-)

I *really* liked Chuy though, as I've said. Whitney, while she seems like a nice person, never wowed me.

[JuniorBalloon]

So if Whitney is doing an exit article does that mean she won't win the LCK this evening?

Are we getting spoiled by a spoiler?

jb

[LindaWhit]

Actually, isn't that an exit interview for TC, not LCK? That's the way I read it. Nothing was even mentioned about LCK in the TV Guide interview.

[JuniorBalloon]

It doesn't really say either way and I assumed it was all one. Maybe other eliminated chefs have made this same kind of interview. Just seemed odd if you were still in the running that you'd be allowed to do such an interview.

jb

[LindaWhit]

IIRC, previous seasons have the kicked off cheftestants doing interviews. I do believe, however, that a Bravo show rep is there on the phone with them allowing them to answer questions or not, depending on if the answer would reveal anything about who wins or loses.

I think there were interviews done by someone on CHOW during TC7, and I remember the audio sometimes having someone who wasn't the cheftestant saying something in the background and then the cheftestant saying they couldn't answer the question. Or something like that.

[gaffk]

Yes, I hate, hate, hate spoilers and would never read your recap before viewing the episode ;)

[LindaWhit]

LOL! Uh-huh. Suuuuurrrrre! :-)

I know if I weren't writing these recaps, I wouldn't be reading them until I could watch the episode. That's just me. A bit a-r like that. But it works for me. :-)

And this is post #500 on this thread! I'm a little stunned we made it this far, as I know the Mods removed some earlier posts because it had gotten off-track. But I guess when you have a volatile subject such as the Beverly-Heather dynamic, it's going to prompt a lot of discussion. :-)

[gaffk]

Your recaps and the ensuing threads are so much better than the actual episode. Now watching the Bev-Heather team . . . .hope they crash & burn!

[LindaWhit]

Aww! I'm glad you (and I hope most others!) like the recaps, gaffk!

[jcattles]

Go for it!

[John E.]

This thread is already pushing 500 posts, how about a new Last Chance Kitchen thread that we can use for the rest of the season (depending on how long it gets)?

[KailuaGirl]

That would make great sense. Those of us who watch LCK immediately after TC can comment freely, and debate about the challenges, winners and losers but won't have to worry about ruining it for others.

[Joanie]

Don't know, she seemed nice but very blah to me. Don't have to worry about it anymore now.

[bobbert]

Just watched again. What I find really interesting is the Heather/Beverly dynamic. Maybe we can delve deeper into this. Anyone?

As much as I really have enjoyed this thread, I think at least for now, we can declare that particular horse dead. But fear not, they're teammates this week. I'm almost giddy with anticipation :-)

[LindaWhit]

I had declared it dead a few days ago. And yet it continues to grow. Like one of those really flat "magic pop-up sponges" you buy in the gimmick stores that becomes a fat animal of some sort when you put it in water. Or like a Peep when put in a microwave. :-)

[chicgail]

Or hands reaching out from the grave to grab the heroine in the last scene of the horror movie - just when we thought she was safe.

[gaffk]

Yes, I am amzaed nobody has seen fit to comment on the Heather/Beverly dynamic. Maybe later this week, after they've been teamed up?

[LurkerDan]

I prepared a lengthy psychological profile of each of them, but didn't think people here would be interested.

[gaffk]

Probably not . . . posters on this board seem largely unconcerned with the personalities of the cheftestants.

[JuniorBalloon]

Who?

jb

[cowboyardee]

No offense sir, but you are expressing your distaste for dead horses while lounging inside a glue factory,

The 'is Charlie's Angels sexist' tangent last year went on longer than this whole thread. It's what we do here.

Go on and argue with me. We can get into an exhaustive debate over whether Seabiscuit is really truly dead or whether his hoof twitching constitutes sufficient reason to bust out the defibrillator. I dig irony.

[huiray]

Don't forget the fennel with steamed mussels hoo-ha!

[chowser]

At least Bev doesn't get all gangsta like Marcel because I'm sure that discussion would be even longer than the one about Marcel.

[cowboyardee]

Oh, I hope I hope I hope Beverly drops some rhymes next episode.

[LindaWhit]

Oh, just freakin' KILL ME NOW if she busts out some rhyming.....EVER!

[monavano]

I was surprised how Tom bitched about he potatoes. Not that they were raw, but he wasn't liking the dish as a whole. Plus, he complained about the cheese, when in the past, the chefs have gotten huge props for making pommes dauphinois and the like.
How can you go wrong with meat and potatoes?

[soupkitten]

i can certainly see the impulse to do a very classic french gratin, after the QF of french mother sauces. if she'd pulled it off it may have been a totally different story.

[Caitlin McGrath]

"How can you go wrong with meat and potatoes?"

Do them badly.

[monavano]

But Tom didn't like the concept, forget about the execution. I think it's a classic side for steak but apparently Tom didn't see it that way.

[chowser]

I think because it's a classic side that he didn't care for it?They don't want classic, BTDT a million times by home cooks. I think she needed to take it up a notch. Plus, as the judges said, it's a very heavy dish, especially w/ a huge steak and in the heat.

[bobbert]

+1. It was 104 degrees plus that day. Heavy, creamy, cheesy. Did I mention it was 104 degrees? That's why a cold soup was a good move. Imagine if they did a thick cream soup? I think that was his point (aside from them not being done right).

BTW, on Tom's blog he mentioned that Ty-Lor had to take a break from the grill to come inside to "regulate his temperature" once during the grilling. That makes me believe that much more that his "teammates" hung him out to dry. The A/C made it look downright comfy inside. They should have given him some type of immunity award for his efforts.

[LindaWhit]

I think there's a Bravo TV website video-only that shows that the medic was concerned about Chris J. being outside while he cooked his ribeye steaks as well and made him stop cooking and get in shade, drink LOTS of water and make sure he wasn't going to pass out.

[monavano]

Is the outside heat going to make cream curdle in your stomach? Again, not ranting at you, but I just don't get these rules of what to eat and not eat depending on the weather outside.
Soup? No soup! It's raining outside! Nothing wet!
;-)

[bobbert]

I don't know, maybe it's a regional thing or maybe after dinner is done, you eventually go outside into the weather. I think there are "hot" weather foods and there are "cold" weather foods and most restaurants seem to use the weather (and therefore seasonal ingredients) as a very basic guide if not a hard and fast rule. Up here in New England - in winter we tend to eat the heavier dishes - the stews, roasts, root vegetables, even drink the darker beers, etc. Gazpacho in January in Maine? Hard to find on a menu even though pretty much every restaurant is heated.

[monavano]

I'm with you. I cook seasonally mostly (love the farmers markets!) but don't rule anything out due to the season to temp.
A dish that comes to mind is my cheddar corn chowder. It might be sweltering out, but I still enjoy the creamy, cheesey potato laden soup.
Of course, I keep a couple quarts for the wintertime.

[monavano]

Do you eat Clam Chowder in July??

[bobbert]

I expected that question. Very basic rule. I think in Maine in July, you're still looking at temps topping out in the 70's. 90+ degrees? I'm usually not going for the hot, thick chowder. Give me the cold lobster roll and a fresh garden salad on those days. Sure, there are always exceptions but I think Tom's point (one of several) is that you usually don't think "...104 degrees out. I'm looking forward to a heavy, creamy, hot dish". At least I don't. Maybe if I lived where it was warm to hot all the time and the only way I could ever have my chowder was to eat it when the temperature was high outside, I'd probably feel differently.

[monavano]

I'd eat a lobster roll any day, any time.

[LindaWhit]

Ditto that. But they *are* best on a hot summer afternoon driving up the coast and stopping at a favorite lobster shack in Maine. :-)

[mcf]

Yeah, cold and with only a very light dressing of mayo. Not hot and creamy.

[LindaWhit]

'Zactly. And no freakin' celery or other frippery. And on a proper top-split New England-style bun.

[mcf]

Yep, which I leave on the plate after eating the lobstah with a fork. :-)

[monavano]

That makes me scratch my head, the talk of the heat and not eating anything creamy. What does the outdoor temp. have to do with dining in an air conditioned room?
This isn't a rant at you, just in general.
So what it's hot out? You can't have a bisque or the like? Scalloped potatoes is not a heavy side. It shouldn't be gloppy, just creamy, so how is it a bad choice.
Again, similar dishes have been praised in the past.
And I don't get not cooking during hot weather. I have central air and I cook not depending on the outside temperature and my oven does not significantly heat up my kitchen. I braise during a heat wave!

[cowboyardee]

I personally could eat a heavy meal when its hot out or a light meal when it's cold (putting aside issues of seasonal ripeness, etc) - it doesn't bother me. But just from a pragmatic standpoint, at least you understand that some people don't feel that way and if you cook a really heavy meal on a hot day in a competition, you're likely to get criticized for it, right?

[monavano]

Oh sure. I think I'm an outlier as I just never lose my appetite or not use my oven in summer.
I still don't think scalloped potatoes is heavy whatsoever. A sturdy braise? Sure, but not potatoes.

[bobbert]

Ah, central air! Very few homes, even expensive ones, have a/c up here in Maine so the thought of even turning the oven on when the temp is in the mid 80's or above simply doesn't occur to us. I'll stick by my general rule about hot weather and cold weather foods and yes, I have had a fruit salad in winter and a chowda in summer.
I just think those potatoes are something Tom C. would not have put on his menu when the outside temp was 104. If it were executed well, she probably would not have been sent packing but it was just one additional thing on top of several other, more important things..
I do believe Tom will adjust his thoughts about the weather and food as the competition moves on as it was over 100 degrees every day during filming IIRC. I can't imagine going through the entire top chef season without cream or heavy (er) sauces. Still, I believe we're going to see most of the dishes on the "lighter side" because of the outside temperatures. We'll have to wait and see.

[cowboyardee]

I think the issue with the gratin (aside from the execution) was pretty much what you said - it wasn't competition worthy. The judges, Tom in particular, seem to appreciate simple foods and classic dishes - but the catch to that is there still has to be something about said dish that makes it stand out, something that shows off the cook's skill. That something could be a minor reworking of a classic dish or flawless execution of a tricky technique - but the trick when you're cooking simple is it still has to be memorable and special. Even if Whitney had gotten the execution right, I still doubt that her gratin would have been something special, because there was nothing about it that would have distinguished it.

[californiabeerandpizza]

I've neve been to Dallas (or Texas) but I think if you're waiting for a cold day to eat something creamy you're going to have a long wait.

[monavano]

Good one! They were eating a big ole steak, so, not exactly light fare to begin with. Texans sure do love their steak.

[chowser]

Yes but given that there's steak, it makes sense to go lighter on the sides. We see people ask that all the time on Home Cooking when the meal is heavy, they want a light dessert. And, in the winter, imo, it's less important than in the summer. Personally, those steaks were huge--I'd never eat something that large when it's hot out.

[mcf]

I never eat/make meatloaf, braises, stews in warm weather, and I rarely eat cold salads in winter... I would never eat a hot cream soup in hot weather, either, but I would have chowder in Maine. I don't think it's just convention, I think we tend toward seasonality naturally and that we need and metabolize a lot more of those calories to stay warm in colder weather so our cravings often/usually follow. It's not a rule so much as a natural, seasonal adaptation. Only thing that large I eat when it's hot out is lobstah; the bigger the better, up to 4.5 lbs or so.
:-)

[cowboyardee]

Good point. Still, might be best to hold off on the heavy dishes until you get the odd day where it's a brisk 87 degrees.

[JAB]

Ty-Lor and his steaks; lighter fluid? Seriously? Did any else notice that the steaks were being submerged in some type of liquid after coming off of the grill or am I delusional?

[soupkitten]

food safety issues galore with this meal, to be sure. very questionable decisions re the steaks, i just can't get over it, sorry!

[LindaWhit]

Saw both of those. LOTS of lighter fluid and some liquid submersion after marking the steaks. To keep them moist, I guess?

[monavano]

I've never heard of submerging steak. I'm surprised none of the judges complained of tasting lighter fluid.

[cowboyardee]

Are people talking about the liquid he was spraying on the grill WHILE the steaks were cooking? I assumed that wasn't lighter fluid. Maybe just spraying down a flare up or maybe some kind of oil or liquid to generate a little more flavorful smoke.

Or did someone see him lighting the grill with lighter fluid? I think it's kind of a myth that people can taste the lighter fluid used from starting a grill... if you do it right, anyway (don't let it soak into the charcoal, don't use more than you need, aim for the charcoal only, don't cover the grill while it's burning the lighter fluid off, and don't put the meat on the grill until the lighter fluid has fully burned off and then some).

I'm sure now someone's going to respond about how they can always taste lighter fluid, regardless of how it's used. A response in advance: I don't believe you. While some people admittedly have amazing palates able to detect the tiniest bit of lingering flavors, chances are much greater that either you've had grilled foods where the lighter fluid is used badly, or else you're imagining the flavor because you know someone used lighter fluid.

[soupkitten]

from what i saw there was a little bit of "all of the above" going on. ty did use copious amts of lighter fluid in one shot (i do not know whether chimneys were available but they have been in past TC grilling challenges). however these were the big weber ranch kettles, not dinky little backyard kettles, so you have the "omg SO much lighter fluid" thing going on that is the same deal that you get when home cooks see a pro putting in "handfuls" of salt into a 6 gal kettle "OMG SO MUCH!" when really it's 2 tbsp in 4-5 gallons of pasta water.

in another shot, ty was handling a flare up on the open grill by spraying/dousing the area w water. it was the obligatory open flame shot, same as the flambe moment i everyone were suteeing.

in yet another shot, ty was removing the marked steaks and tossing them into a tub of what looked to be plain water. the steaks were submerged. i have no idea what this was and am unfamiliar with anything resembling this treatment for steaks, but would love to get an explanation. at this point my takeaway on the steak execution remains a big WTF?

[cowboyardee]

Ah - I didn't catch the actual lighter fluid shot. As I said above, I think any controversy about using lighter fluid is much ado about nothing. If no one tasted lighter fluid, it wasn't a problem. But I have no idea what the hell he was doing putting steaks in liquid off the grill. Or what the point of it was. I've seen that done with hot dogs, I guess, but they were to be served over the course of the next 12 hours or so (hospital food). At best, I imagine that would sort of dilute the nice smoky flavor from the grills.

[ladybugthepug]

I've heard people claim they can taste a gassy taste from a natural gas powered smoker. I would most definitely call bullshit on that. As for the lighter fluid? I would agree that you can't taste it with all your caveats, but then again, it's because people don't do all those things that you CAN taste it. I just don't see what's so hard about using a chimney starter.

[cowboyardee]

A chimney starter isn't hard. But it is a little slower. That could be a factor in a competition, though it didn't seem like it in the particular one. He also just might not have had a chimney starter - you can't really fit one in a knife bag to take it with you.

[ladybugthepug]

I guess you're right. Now that I think about it, the lighter fluid fit in there much better.

[John E.]

I have found chimney fire starters to produce coals ready for cooking faster than using lighter fluid.

[Ruth Lafler]

Hey, we can agree on something!

[cowboyardee]

If so, that's only when you don't need many coals (and even then it's neck and neck). Lighter fluid is faster when you need a whole lot of charcoal for a big grill (or several big grills as was the case here) and you only have one or two chimney starters. Then you need to use the coals from the chimney starter to light the rest of em.

When I'm grilling (as opposed to smoking) I seldom use so few coals that they'd fit into a single chimney starter.

[ladybugthepug]

But cowboyardee, he had like 50 chimney starters in his knife bag. I mean come on. He knew straight out of the box that he was never going to be able to meet ALL of the proper lighter fluid usage rules you previously outlined. ;-)

[saeyedoc]

I think he was purging them in ice water to stop the cooking process. Since they were going to flash them in the convection oven later, I guess he thought it would be more predictable that way. Never seen that one.

[JAB]

That's all that I could come up with as well like shocking but with tepid water as opposed to the ice water that we're used to seeng.

[potato or yam]

I'm pretty sure the steaks going into ice water were the ones being grilled by Chris Jones for his steak "carpaccio." He seared them on the grill, threw them in the ice water, and then sliced and served it cold. I still think it's kind of weird but makes more sense for his dish than for the steaks being served as the main course.

[monavano]

From Tom's Blog:
For the most part, the chefs did very well with this Quickfire Challenge. That’s the kind of work I expect from chefs of this caliber in a competition of this nature.
*****
That sums it up. No one chef is jumping out at me as being "outside of the box" or going the extra mile. Richard Blais and the V brothers were so damn impressive, gutsy and talented.

[huiray]

WARNING: POSSIBLE SPOILERS for those who don't want to know *anything* about upcoming TC Texas episodes.

I've only just noticed that the Bravo website has a Cheftestant Scorecard in the menu on the left side of the page. The page it links to lists in tabular form the winners of the QF and EC of each episode and the loser/eliminated chef. The "results" are filled in up to episode 6 (this last one) but the table also lists the titles of *all* the remaining episodes, which may or may not be "too revealing" to those who want to know nothing at all about what's coming.

[cowboyardee]

A question tangentially related to the episode:

Does anyone normally skin their bell peppers before cooking em? Is this one of those expected things in fine dining that I just never noticed? Do you do this? Have you seen it done? Regularly?

I'm not talking about removing the skins from roasted peppers - previously when Tom mentioned skinning peppers (about Tiffany Derry's Thai curry), I had assumed that was what he was talking about. But it was clear this episode that he thinks bell peppers (maybe all peppers?) should be skinned before cooking in any fashion.

[ratgirlagogo]

This was news to me as well.

[wattacetti]

My Micheline-star-trained chef friend has done this for service. I have also seen this demonstrated as a mise en place technique.

[monavano]

It's a nice presentation for sure. I've never done it, but then again, I adore bell peppers skin and all.

[huiray]

Never really thought too much about it, but it's true I dislike the skin on the "usual" GREEN bell peppers in particular. I don't normally like bell peppers (again, the "usual" squat, rounded-rectangular type) that much so can't say I ever paid attention to what people were doing with bell peppers on any TC in the past.

Still, I wouldn't skin chile peppers, certain other types of small sweet peppers that I do like, poblanos, etc. I would be astonished if Colicchio really did think *all* peppers should be skinned. I would think it ridiculous of him. :::raisedeyebrows:::

[davis_sq_pro]

I can't imagine Colicchio himself doing that. He's all about food in as close to its natural form as it can be served, blah, blah, blah. I don't even know how you'd successfully skin a bell pepper and be left with anything useful to work with. The closer to the skin you get, the more intense the color and flavor...

[cowboyardee]

He's mentioned it more than once. He says the skins are bitter when cooked.

Also, it seems to me he's not quite as big into the foods' 'natural form' as you make it seem. He seems to get annoyed when people bury a great ingredient in a dish or complicate things just for the sake of complicating them, but he serves and likes a lot of things that have been processed quite a bit from their natural state.

[davis_sq_pro]

I based that statement on my one dining experience at Colicchio & Sons. Perhaps "natural state" was the wrong term, but the food definitely seemed much less processed than what I'd expect to be served at many other restaurants at a similar level (price point, reputation, or whatever you define as a "level" -- trying not to get into that discussion here!).

Another way to put it is that I could look at a dish there and pretty much figure out what went in to each component. Perhaps his other restaurants aren't like that? I couldn't say. Hope I haven't over-generalized based on my one experience.

[cowboyardee]

I haven't been to any of his restaurants, so i could be speaking out of turn as well. Just extrapolating from his comments on this show and some of his recipes that I've seen online.

[Miss Needle]

In one of Colicchio's cookbooks (Think Like a Chef?) he has mentioned that bell pepper should be skinned. I think he's known for that as Sam Talbot from Season 2 said to another contestant that Colicchio hates skins on peppers.

And while Colicchio's restaurants serve food that is closer to the "natural form," he has great admiration for chefs who don't serve his type of food, provided it's done well. He once said that Pierre Gagnaire, who incorporates a lot of "molecular gastronomy" techniques, is one of his favorite chefs. When I ate at Pierre Gagnaire, I had no idea that it was a mg restaurant at first because I was struck by was the flavor of the food, and not by the bells and whistles that I think many mg chefs use just for the sake of using them. I think cowboyardee's assessment of Colicchio is on the money.

[cowboyardee]

I would think that a lot of chili peppers are too thin-walled to effectively skin (without roasting, anyway). Then again, I've never tried. But he really does seem to think that any thick walled pepper should be skinned before you cook it. I'm not sure, but I don't think this opinion would apply to raw peppers.

[samlev]

My wife, who is trained at Le Cordon Bleu Paris, stated that in french cuisine they skin the tomatoes, any variety of bell pepper, plus a couple of other veggies that surprised me. This also caught me off guard as well, and I have been eating her food for years and never noticed.

[cowboyardee]

I know that tomatoes are often skinned, though I thought of that as a textural thing. I might just not be versed enough in French food to have noticed that bell peppers are skinned as well.

Out of curiosity, you don't happen to remember what those other surprising veggies are, do you?

[samlev]

I do not remember but I will check with my wife and will let you know.

[Bart Hound]

I've seen Jacques Pepin skin peppers (with a veggie peeler), and the same for the thick ends of asparagus and the stem of broccoli. In fact, after peeling, he says the best and most tender part of the broccoli is the stem.

[chowser]

That's what the guys in the broccoli field say, too. They joke about people paying more for the crowns when the inner stem is protected and tender.

[cowboyardee]

I skin broccoli and cook the inner stems. My wife still ignores em and goes for the crowns.

[KailuaGirl]

The stems of broccoli (and artichokes) I fully comprehend and agree that they are very tasty. The big difference, at least to my thinking, is that bell peppers aren't as solid/dense as broccoli, asparagus, or artichokes. While I'm not a bell pepper fan in general, I am curious.

[KailuaGirl]

So do you skin them just like peeling an apple? It sounds like so much extra work, but then I don't think I've ever had a skinned bell pepper in my life. I'm just wondering if the taste/texture difference makes it worthwhile.

[kubasd23]

my favorite part of broccoli by far is the stems. I always get the weirdest looks, but happily trade my crowns for others stems :)

[pine time]

I can't take the texture of peach skins. I'll even admit this embarrassment: if I can't get skinned peaches, I'll settle for canned. There, I said it (and I even grow peaches, but I blanch/peel them.)

[debbiel]

Do you have one of those serrated peelers? Works pretty well for peeling peaches.

[debbiel]

I also love broccoli stems. And cauliflower stems. And cabbage core. And celery hearts.

[ladybugthepug]

I'm about fed up with with this cake stuff. Top Chef Desserts was last month. It's lame when people win for it, and it's lame when people go home for it. If they want dessert, give out double immunity and let them make the dessert, and make them ineligible to win whatever prize they're giving out. It's not a baking competition. I highly doubt that cake wins anything in TC Desserts.

Totally thought this whole episode was a bore.

Had to rewind the recording when they showed a picture of that girl cooking with her dad. Did NOT look like her at all.

[monavano]

I have to say, the quick fire challenge produced some damn amazing food. And then the chefs cook dinner for 200 people and it could not have been more uninspired. Well, dessert looked good.
Gazpacho? Seriously? A freaking raw soup. No cooking and no particular talent needed to make it.
6 hours to make scalloped potatoes and you still serve them raw? Buh bye.

[bobbert]

Nothing to lose in the quickfire - no PYKAG - so why not go for it? No need to play it safe. In fact, taking a chance is the only way to win the quickfire. Here, they're playing to win vs. playing not to lose. It's one person will win immunity vs. one person going home. The chef that wins the quickfire really has no excuse for playing it safe in the elimination challange because they ain't going nowhere anyhow.

[monavano]

Most of that food was playing not to lose. Prepping and poaching shrimp that took 6 hours was so wimpy.

[Jase]

The recipe posted looked like it was more than just prepping and poaching shrimp.

[monavano]

I'll have to check that out. I thought the judges were grousing about her having so little to do for the dinner.

[Caitlin McGrath]

I think only Heather was grousing.

[soupkitten]

re that dish, when tom c. visited the kitchen during prep and talked to straight edge dakota, she explained that beverly was doing the shrimp, sarah was doing the soup base (forget whether sarah also did the mousse but i would suspect she did this the 2nd day), and she herself (dakota) was doing all the knife-work, which to me meant all vegetable prep outside of the actual gazpacho base, or perhaps she helped prep-cook for sarah as well. if beverly was *still* doing shrimp through the second day, it means that she didn't really have time to do anything else, and the other 2 chefs on her course (sarah, dakota) would have had to have picked up her slack somewhere. additionally, from how the recipe appears, it looks like the pickled watermelon rind that was apparently assigned to beverly, that heather asked her about, never got done. perhaps not an essential part of the gazpacho, but then again it may have elevated the final dish.

[mcf]

Yeah, the recipe involved more, but Beverly didn't do it, others did.

[Ruth Lafler]

Still, deveining 400 shrimp was probably the toughest of all the prep tasks. What did anyone do that was harder, or even as hard?

[mcf]

I don't have a dog in this fight. I think Heather is very aggressive and used to a tight ship and teamwork and Beverly's pretty consistent self absorption at the expense of others means she gets no slack from Heather. I don't know yet if Heather's a bully, though she's certainly more than assertive. Some folks react badly and openly so to people who seem to think only of themselves even when part of a team. Whether Heather bullies others and remains an antagonist in general remains to be seen. Just because she's a crybaby doesn't mean Beverly's weaker; she's turned off someone else's pot, demanded first service at a store counter LOUDLY and assertively, and taken over more than her share of work space. Time will tell us more about who's who. I'm not going to bat for either one of them, except for certain actions.

[wyogal]

Nobody has a dog in this fight. It's a TV show. Entertainment.

[mcf]

Some people take it waaaaay too personally at times, all sorts of stuff from their own lives gets mixed up in their feelings about the show. And just as some folks can be rabid sports team fans, frex, some have their favorites that they root for and take it very personally when they're gone.

[chowser]

Good insight.

[chowser]

I like Nyesha but when one of the top dishes is her compound butter and wine reduction, done in six hours, you have to wonder about the level of competition. Whitney deserved to go home, even if her potatoes gratin weren't raw because there couldn't be a simpler, less creative, less time consuming dish. Few chefs have embraced the challenges this season--maybe Paul for using the super hot chili. LOL, I think Sandra Lee, Paula Deen or Rachel Ray would do well against these chefs.

[monavano]

I think the potato is such a sublime food. TC got me to making pommes dauphinois and it taught me that scalloped potatoes should be done low and slow. When done right, the simple potato is amazing.
But you're right, it was a very easy dish to put together. Everyone played it safe.
The male chef who cut his hand deserved a lot of props for sheer guts.

[chowser]

Definitely. I'm not downplaying potatoes gratin or even a baked potato, at all (darn and now you have me craving that) as tasty food goes. It's just not Top Chef quality. At least deconstruct it or throw some liquid nitrogen on it, at leasT. :-)

[mcf]

Foam it. ;-)

[LindaWhit]

Have we seen ANY foam yet? Is it possible that this could be a foamless season?

[huiray]

Please let's not tempt the fates by drawing attention to that word!!
:-D

[LindaWhit]

::Snort:::: I sowwy.

Fate? What are you doing here? ::::Shoo!:::: Nothing to see here, move along. :-)

[chowser]

We can laugh but sadly this competition has become so ho hum because no one is wiling to do more. What's next, a baked potato?

[goodhealthgourmet]

with compound butter.

[mcf]

And rilly, RILLY good gravy.

[mcf]

We can dream.

[KailuaGirl]

LOL!

[John E.]

There were about three interesting moments from the last season of TC JD. One of them was when a contestant won a dessert challenge because of the gravy flavored foam he used in the dessert. The reason I found it interesting is that Marcel Vigneron made a cameo appearance on that episode. (Apparently he is friends with one of the competitors).

[chowser]

See, that would have been unique. Liquid nitrogened Ice cream potatoes to make it light for the Dallas heat, some sodium alginate balls of cheese, foam cream. I can just imagine what the cattlemen would say about that.

[mcf]

I can, too. ;-)

[JAB]

Ouch, LOL!

[goodhealthgourmet]

Few chefs have embraced the challenges this season
~~~~~~~~~
bingo. talent/skill level aside, most of them have either been playing it way too safe, or ignoring the point of the challenges and just cooking what they want to. Tom seems pretty exasperated by it, and i can't say i blame him.

and yes, Whitney deserved to go, but it REALLY must have sucked that her mentor was one of the judges who sent her packing.

[momjamin]

Houston Press review/blog: http://blogs.houstonpress.com/eating/...

[monavano]

Agreed. This was one boring episode.

[Evilbanana11]

Every season someone bitches about a contestant only cooking Asian food. So what? Asian food is so broad and encompasses so many different cuisines, tastes,flavors and techniques. Why is it, if a chef cooks French, Italian and Spanish dishes he is considered versatile and yet if another cooks Japanese, Thai and Chinese he's a one trick pony?

[Worldwide Diner]

You have to look at the context. I don't have a problem with someone cooking Asian as long as the challenge isn't cooking some other specific cuisine. And to say that Beverly is cooking Asian is being charitable. She's cooking mostly Korean.

[Evilbanana11]

If you talking about the sauce challenge, the goal was to make a new sauce that stems from the mother sauce. Paul infused his with ginger and lemongrass and ended up in the top 3. I don't understand why you would have a problem with Beverly and not Paul.

[Worldwide Diner]

My main point is I don't think Beverly is very talented. I don't have a problem with someone cooking Asian cuisine - since I'm Chinese and there's not alot of stuff that I don't eat. I just think that Beverly defaults to Korean cuisine, even when the challenge isn't suited. Paul shows versatility by being able to use certain ingredients commonly used in Asian cooking, but he didn't overwhelm his sauce with the ginger and lemongrass, whereas Beverly presented essentially a soy sauce based dish. I just think Beverly's range is unduly narrow.

[Ruth Lafler]

You're right: no one says "Oh, s/he always cooks European."

[Caitlin McGrath]

Hugh Acheson makes kind of the same point regarding Heather's comment in his blog (he doesn't seem to be a great fan of hers).
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

[chowser]

He's really funny, too.

"Heather can’t remember who shot J.R., but she’s pretty sure it's Beverly. "

"Heather hates Beverly. Hates. Heather wonders why Beverly always cooks Asian food. I want to ask Heather why she is always bossy while cooking white people American food. Beverly’s problem is that she’s a bit too soft-spoken and wispy. It’d be awesome if she just suddenly put Heather in a sleeper hold to stop the conversation."

I wonder when the judges get to see the backstage drama--during the judging or after the series airs.

[Ruth Lafler]

Apparently I'm not the only one who theorizes that Heather is bullying Beverly because she's smaller.

[chowser]

Soft spoken and wispy doesn't read to me like smaller. It reads to me like wall flower. Sure I believe people have theorized that it's a size thing, maybe a fat thing, maybe an ugly thing, maybe a racist thing since she talks about the Asian cooking, maybe an envy thing of having a husband and baby (or two), maybe she has a secret crush on her. Everyone hastheories. But, as you said in the other thread about the newborn and people running off on tangents, this is along the same lines--we have no idea why Heather dislikes Bev and only know that she does. I've seen no proof, action, or otherwise that she dislikes Bev because she's a small women and weak.

[babette feasts]

You say small and weak but women know that the tiny petite ones are the fiercest of all. They have something to prove and will stop at nothing. Seriously, I am not large but the most intense, driven women I've known have been the tiny ones, and they scare me.

[Caitlin McGrath]

In his blog this week, Tom says, regarding Heather's cake, "We judges don’t know what’s going on behind the scenes and didn’t know it was Ed’s recipe (I learned that by watching the episode this morning!)" so there's your answer: when it airs (or when they get their copies to view so they can write their blogs anyway). They only learn during judging what the contestants volunteer on their own or under questioning from them.

I like how self-deprecating Hugh is in the blog.

[goodhealthgourmet]

when Heather won the other night using Ed's recipe [for the second time], i wondered again - as i have quite often over the years - just how many JTs might have ended differently if they had all the facts.

[soupkitten]

although it was ed's recipe, i believe tom c. addressed this issue in his blog, when he pointed out that it was the execution of that recipe that was important, and that if she had done the same recipe badly, or if ed had done his own recipe badly, for that matter, it could just as easily have been a losing dish. i think that would go for the mis-execution of any recipe, no matter how brilliant. for all we know, it isn't really "ed's" recipe either, and it's a base cake recipe of someone else's he memorized. heck, it could be just a 1-2-3 cake.

[John E.]

Ed should not even mention that it was 'his' recipe. He could have kept 'his' recipe to himself. Once he gave it up, he gave it up. If he (or anyone) wishes credit for when a recipe succeeds, should he (or anyone) receive blame for when a recipe fails? That's a can of worms the judges do not care about. All they care about is if the food is successful.

[goodhealthgourmet]

yeah, my post kinda came out wrong. my bigger issue was that she made the same cake for two challenges, not that it was Ed's recipe...and yes, as you pointed out, it's not really *his* recipe, though it might have been nice if she had at least thanked him for providing her with the ratios (and any other info) she needed to pull it together. and speaking of pulling it together, didn't Lindsay & Grayson do the streusel & the peach salad that went on the cake? i may not be a huge Beverly fan, but for all of Heather's bitching i'm having a hard time seeing how she did *so* much more work in the kitchen herself. i know she helped set up outside, but as far as food prep goes, hers didn't strike me as a huge undertaking. of course i wasn't in the kitchen to see it all for myself, so what do i know?

[soupkitten]

the whole dessert course, in general, seemed pretty simple-basic to me too, but then, all of the courses really could have been much stronger/more interesting/better executed. i think it really was a "best of the worst" situation-- as the judges pointed out, yes, there were 200 diners, but there were 13 chefs, and you would expect better things from the meal. for the life of me i don't know what some people (hello grayson and cali-chris) were doing the whole time, but so much of that is editing. but it's like everyone went into bad buffet-food mode, when they had enough hands on deck to make interesting, good, well-executed food. hell, they will have half the # of chefs, split into 2 groups, to do restaurant wars... better step it up in a big way.

sucks that someone won a car for their lackluster efforts at ec, when so many more of the qf dishes actually seemed to better showcase everyone's skill set, pov and talent.

[chowser]

I wish they had told the whole group that they're falling short. That a peach cake won (and had to be divided in labor, how long does streusel and cutting peaches take?) is sad. Did anyone have a time consuming role? I'll give it to Heather that she expedited and that must have been hectic. But what was she doing the other 5 hours, other than making a cake?

[soupkitten]

oh, that type of expediting for group dinners isn't a picnic, and just making all your handwritten lists, assembling your 200 plates and garnishes for each course (800 plates total), so that everyone is served the same course simultaneously... it takes more time than anyone would think-- until the first time they get burned at a charity dinner and wreak themselves. folks can call heather a raging one-eyed zombie megabitch all they want, but it seemed like she had that handled okay, and expediting would have consumed most of her (and lindsay's) time on the second day. maybe that even answers my question (what was grayson doing?)-- she was probably stuck in some corner away from the hot kitchen, cutting and garnishing cake for a couple hours, at least, while heather and lindsay were counting plates and making garnish set-ups.

[bobbert]

I give them some credit and I'd be willing to give them extra credit for the expediting if they did a good job. It was the expediting that was the real failure with the 3rd course. The firing of the steaks is basically what almost sent Ty-lor home. Tom C gave them credit when he told the other judges what Heather was doing and who knows, maybe that helped put the cake into the drivers seat of the Toyota. In restaurant wars, taking that kind of leadership role often results in your head on the chopping block. Of course, in this case, the judges did not know about the "firing mess-up" and as a result there was only the positive of Heather "stepping up" (potentially a risky move).
I certainly would not place the entire expediting screw-up (the firing of the steaks) on Lindsay and/or Heather and I not only wonder where Grayson was during this time but, as I asked before, where were the 6 chefs (Dakota, Sarah, Beverly, Edward, Chris J., and Paul) who were already done with their courses? You would think someone (anyone???) might have taken over the steak expediting at that point so that the dessert people could start their plating.

[goodhealthgourmet]

sucks that someone won a car for their lackluster efforts at ec, when so many more of the qf dishes actually seemed to better showcase everyone's skill set, pov and talent.
~~~~~~~~~~
i think that's what was really nagging at me. winning a car for being one of several contributors to a dish that was merely the best of a pretty bad showing is ridiculous. it's too bad the judges couldn't just withhold the prize on the grounds that no one actually earned/deserved it.

[LindaWhit]

Wasn't there one season where there was an EC where no one was declared a winner and Tom made them do a "do-over" with *two* cheftestants eliminated the next episode?

[kubasd23]

Yeah, I think so, that sounds right. He said he couldn't declare a winner because nobody performed like a winner. They were just picking the worst of the worst to go home.

[goodhealthgourmet]

i think you're combining 2 occurrences. TC2 Ep 4 - they did declare a winner, but no one was eliminated and 2 chefs went home the next week. TC1 Ep 8 - there was no winner of the EC but Miguel still got the boot.

the difference this time around is the prize - they didn't give away so much swag back then, and i'm sure they were obligated to give someone the car in light of Toyota's sponsorship of the show. i'm sure the judges didn't really have the option of withholding the goods.

[chowser]

Maybe at this point, they can do a sweep of 3-4 lower performing chefs, get rid of them to light the fire under the rest. Maybe the bottom three last week could have just been let go.

[LindaWhit]

I could swear it was a later season, ghg. But no time to go check Wikipedia's progress charts for each season - time for dinner! :-)

[John E.]

Is it possible you are remembering last season's TC 8 where they had an episode where nobody was eliminated because everyone's dish was so good? That was the huddled masses episode where they did genealogy that said way back Mike and Antonia had a common ancestor. (I thought they overdid that one. I would not be surprised if they discovered a common ancestor with Colicchio too).

[huiray]

But that episode had a winner - Antonia Lofaso - whereas Linda Whit is thinking of where they had no winner.

[John E.]

You're right of course but I was pointing out an eposode where no contestant was sent home, which has not happened too many times. (Plus it was recent).

[bobbert]

No too long ago there was a restaurant wars where both sucked so bad that they did a "do over". That may have been 2 seasons ago IIRC. One sucked again and the other was really good.

[huiray]

In Season 3 episode 9 (Restaurant Wars) Colicchio declared both teams bad enough for there to be no winner. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Chef_(season_3)#Episode_9:_Restaurant_Wars All went on to episode 10 ("Second Helping") where they repeated the Restaurant wars with Tre being kicked off. (Just 1 was eliminated) That was the first time they ended up with 3 finalists whereas they had two finalists in both Season 1 and 2.

In Season 5 episode 6 ("12 Days of Christmas") they had the "malfunctioning refrigerator" and Colicchio sent no one home as a result, although a winner (Hosea Rosenberg) was declared. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Chef...
In the following episode 7 ("Focus Group") two cheftestants were sent home (Eugene Villiatora & Melissa Harisson).

[bobbert]

Season 3 ??? Wow. I would have bet it was just a couple of seasons ago. This is 2007, isn't it?

[huiray]

Yes.

[LindaWhit]

Wow - it was back in Season 3? How time flies when you're having fun. (And I *knew* you'd find it, huiray! LOL)

[Caitlin McGrath]

Yeah, when she was double-checking the ratios with him, she said it was a genoise (which she pronounced "jen-wah," just as they tend to misprounce brunoise "broon-wah"), so a basic cake he was smart enough to memorize before coming on the show, and which Heather has executed well twice now.

[chowser]

This is interesting because I thought the first time when she did the tres leches, I thought she said she has made it before, no mention of it being Ed's recipe but this time around, they mentioned it was the same cake and it was Ed's recipe. The first time around, it looked disastrous. Who would stack a tres leches cake? OTOH, a poorly made tres leches cake still tastes good, imo, so she lucked out. And, how are there any contestants on this show who don't know to learn a cake and a dessert before coming on?

[soupkitten]

well that would be the the basic cake (genoise) to memorize, if you could only learn one-- it's so versatile. but it's a stretch for ed to call the recipe "his" in that case, even if he did commit the formula to his memory.

[John E.]

How are those two terms correctly pronounced?

[goodhealthgourmet]

zhen-wahz (or zhe-nwahz) and broon-wahz

[John E.]

Ok, the 's' at the end is not silent. I can't say that I have ever uttered those words out loud in my entire life.... wait, I just did.

[goodhealthgourmet]

precisely. and the "g" in genoise should be soft.

every time i hear a chef mispronounce either of those words (or dacquoise), i wish i could sic one of my old french teachers on them ;)

[chowser]

If there's an "e" after the s, you pronounce the s. So a chinois would be shee- nwah.

[LindaWhit]

I seriously love the twists and turns these threads take. :-)

[Manassas64]

I've enjoyed reading it all even if I haven't contributed anything. I admit, I don't watch it with my full attention, so I miss a lot of what you all see. Plus, this thread's version of the show is much more entertaining than the actual show (as sad as that sounds).

[goodhealthgourmet]

on a related note, i was catching up on episodes of Chef Hunter, and when the narrator said that one of the candidates had studied under Paul Bocuse, he pronounced it "beaucoup." [cringe]

[piccola]

That's particularly true when you're talking about desserts in Top Chef. I mean, most of them aren't comfortable enough with baking and pastry to improvise so I'm sure they memorize basic recipes in case they're stuck with the sweet course. So there's not as much ownership, so to speak, as there might be with other dishes where they feel confident enough to really innovate and put their stamp on it.

[huiray]

Max Silvestri's recap.
http://eater.com/archives/2011/12/08/...

He got into serious (i.e. non-jokey) language mode in slapping down Heather Terhune. Hard.

[mariacarmen]

oops, beatcha to it! (see above.)

[huiray]

Ah. :sheepishsmile:
I didn't see your post - because I was posting in-between reading and your post was already in the "closed" mode [I'm sure you know what I mean] and I assumed I had read it already.

Anyway, in a similar vein let me post here then what Silvestri said about H. Terhune:

"Heather loves any opportunity to take a crap on Beverly, and she criticizes how Beverly always cooks Asian things. "If I were the judges, I'd be sick of it." I did the quick math, Heather, and I know that if I was a judge I would get sick of your petty, cruel face way quicker than I would get sick of Asian food. Do you know how big Asia is? Do you know how big your face is? Big, but not as big of Asia. Eastern cuisine offers exponentially more territory to explore than does your scowling mug barking at strangers."

[chowser]

LOL that jumped out at me, too. And, the picture of Heather's puckered face.

My son's response when she said that was, "Yeah, and you only make white people food. That must get pretty boring to the judges."

[Worldwide Diner]

The quickfire challenge was about making a mother sauce. Beverly ended with a dish made with soy sauce. It just doesn't make sense. No wonder she ended up in the bottom. Ignoring Beverly's abandonment of her newborn child, her tendency to cry, her cutting in line, her soiled work-space, her lack of team-work - she just doesn't seem very talented.

[mcf]

Where were you when male contestants left behind babies and babies about to be with that condemnation (which they didn't deserve either)? Beverly is all about Beverly, but saying she's abandoned her child is a cheap shot at working women everywhere as well as at her. There are enough legitimate criticisms to make.

[huiray]

Correct.

[Worldwide Diner]

I said ignoring those things - those are a summary of things other people posted. My only point is she's got no talent.

[teezeetoo]

kudos to Ty for not whining and not throwing others, who should have helped, under the bus. Count me in the "heather" camp: she may be annoying but she clearly helped others get their jobs done and she ran a damn tight ship. she could have finished her cake early and said "I'm done, good luck to the rest of you." I have no take yet on Beverly, though she hasn't impressed me with any range, but Paul is the only chef who interests me so far.

[chowser]

I"m not a big Heather or Beverly fan but if it weren't for Heather, they would have continued to flash those steaks. She stopped them. It could have been far worst if she just stuck to her task of cake.

[bobbert]

13 freaking chefs and NO ONE knows or checks where the diners are at on the 2nd course??? I know they're usually in the back of the house and rely on others (or an auto system) to tell them when to fire the next course but... Lindsay gets nervous and starts to fire the steaks - not one of the other potential TOP freaking chefs says "...maybe we should peek into the dining room to see where we're at". Six of the chefs were done at this point – their courses were served already. Why didn’t anyone say to Lindsay or Heather – “…hey, we’re done. You guys start to to plate your desserts. We’ll take over the expediting because WE HAVE NOTHING LEFT TO DO EXCEPT TO MAKE SURE THE STEAKS COME OUT PERFECT.” As much as I don't care for Heather, I have to agree with you - she's the only one who apparently even thought about, I don't know, looking to see what was going on with service vs. guessing.

[DougRisk]

haha, that is really good.

[Worldwide Diner]

I don't like or dislike Heather but she at least appears competent and willing to take a leadership role. Can't say that about the rest of the chefs who seem willing to fly under the radar on team challenges.

[John E.]

I believe your last sentence is the problem Tom Colicchio has with the way the contestants have responded to the challenges thus far in the competition.

[huiray]

@WWD: I don't think anyone is particularly defending Beverly, so I don't know what conceptual leap you are making. The sub topic here is how Heather is behaving (according to the show as shown ). Beverly deserves criticism too, along the lines of what you delineate, but I'm not sure what you are conflating together here - what *is* your point? For the record, I don't like Beverly too - but neither do I like Heather as shown on the show.

[mariacarmen]

that was hilarious!

[Joanie]

That's awesome, her face is GIGANTIC.

[mariacarmen]

http://eater.com/tags/top-chef

omygod....

"The chefs are challenged to present a dish with a personalized mother sauce. A mother sauce? Maybe this is why the men were nervous about being outnumbered. Padma says, "ready for the mother of all Quickfires?" I'm disappointed Padma would engage in such punnery. Many of the chefs, having not made these base sauces since school, are nagged by the proper mother sauce preparation. Chef Fearing is exacting and it's clear there will be no womb for error. But there's no uterus trying to fake it; they have to cervix the best dish possible and fallope for the best. For Nyesha, who says sauce is her favorite thing, it's a labia of love."

[LindaWhit]

Max is in fine form with this review. :-)

I also liked this towards the end:

"Ty-Lor, despite a wound and no sleep, was left hung out to dry while Beverly inspected shrimp rectums for half a day. And like, I'm sure the shrimp were SUPER clean, but come on, guys. I'll take a molecule of shrimp shit over an overcooked steak any day."

[JAB]

4 lousy stiches!

[John E.]

It must have been pretty deep though. Otherwise they would have just taped him up. Remember that he stayed till the clock ran out and THEN went to get it taken care of.

[JAB]

True, he didn't miss any of the 6 hours aloted however, we then got to hear the excuse of him not having received enough sleep for 4 stitches?

[mariacarmen]

he had to wait in the ER all night for people with other, more serious injuries.

[soupkitten]

yes. "gunshot" was mentioned.

[KailuaGirl]

And any ER has its share of motor vehicle accidents overnight. I can see where a few stitches in someone's hand would be at the bottom of the go-to list.

[JAB]

Exactly, therefore, he had no business in the ER for that injury.

[mcf]

Where *should* he have gone for sutures after the medic told him he needed them?

[JAB]

Knowing what was at stake the next day, he should have manned up and put a butterfly bandage or liquid bandage or something of the sort.

[Worldwide Diner]

He did man up. He didn't bitch and moan. He drank a bunch of espresso and then worked his station. You're pissed off because he complained about waiting for 6 hours to get stitches?

[JAB]

Who wouldn't know about the time that it would take in a metropolitan emergency room to be seen for such a minor injury? Can you imagine the ER DR., having just taken care of the bullet wound to come across Ty-Lor's wound?

[mcf]

He DID. And he never complained or used it as an excuse.

[jcattles]

I'm thinking maybe they need to hire medics that can stitch them up on site. I would probably save some time and headaches.

[John E.]

Huh? I don't understand the point you are trying to make. He cut himself. It required stitches. It took a long time (overnight) at the ER to get it done. He did not sleep much but refused to use that as an excuse or any excuse for the overcooked steaks. What exactly is your concern about this?

[JAB]

I must have missed the refused to use that as an excuse part.

[John E.]

Watch the judge's table part on a re-run. I don't think any of them made excuses and took responsibility for their dishes.

[JAB]

I never said judge's table. He's heard lamenting about only having received an hours sleep for what I consider a poor and elective choice to go to the emergency room for what ended up only needing 4 stitches.

[Ruth Lafler]

Unless he knew when he made the choice that it was going to take all night and only need four stitches, how can you say it was a bad choice? Hindsight is 20/20. It could also be that it wasn't in fact his choice: that for liability reasons production insisted he get it stitched.

[fara]

i don't understand why they don't have a doctor on site, or some kind of PA that could do that stitching. he wasted a whole night in the ER? How many people have cut themselves?

[cowboyardee]

I'm sure they have some interns and/or a PA to deal with such issues. But when you get a busy night in the ED, staff gets moved around and stiches and that kind of thing gets put on the back burner.

[chowser]

I'm wondering what the liability insurance would be like if they treated contestants--plus, what the added cost would be to have a full time doctor ready. Medics are enough to take care of the situation and make sure the right care is given.

[LindaWhit]

They have medics, who have been shown on camera. Ty-Lor told the medic to clean it up and wrap it up and he'd finish prep. THEN he went to the hospital. At the hospital's ER, you're at the mercy of triage. His wound was obviously not as important as what else came in that night, and he had to wait. Simple as that.

[goodhealthgourmet]

His wound was obviously not as important as what else came in that night, and he had to wait.
~~~~~~~
i definitely heard him say something about people with gunshot wounds needing to be taken in ahead of him.

[chowser]

It was all done on his off time, all complaints aside. I'm not a big fan of his but he accepted his problems w/out making excuses and other than his mentioning it when he got back, he didn't bring it up again. It would have been easy for him to do that at JT, but he didn't. I don't think his lack of sleep affected his results as much as his decision to do the steaks and the flash cook them and that was made before the sleep deprivation. He didn't complain about being treated last (lol, as in "I'm in a competition here, I need service NOW!"), he was fine with it. What's wrong with saying you're tired when you are?

[LindaWhit]

"He didn't complain about being treated last (lol, as in "I'm in a competition here, I need service NOW!")"
~~~~~~~~~~~~

:-)

[cowboyardee]

I don't know exactly how deep it was, but it looked like a puncture wound. Generally speaking, it's wise to seak treatment for any puncture wound that's moderately deep, just because of the possibility of infection. Hard to say without seeing the wound a little more clearly.

At any rate, he finished his work for that day, went to the ED, came back and got the job done and didn't seem to screw over anyone on his team but himself. So I don't really see much reason to criticize him. Sometimes you go for stitches and you're there for an hour; sometimes it takes all night. Probably just bad luck.

[moto]

with some wounds even just two stitches can make a big difference in getting the bleeding stopped and giving the wound a chance to clot and heal. a cook would not want a wound that kept seeping blood on his hand where it affects his grip and could get onto the food and prep surfaces. where the wound is located can also reduce the effectiveness of other remedies like butterfly dressings. Bravo no doubt deliberately chooses not to have a physician's assistant available for a number of reasons -- cost, liability issues, and the all important drama of making a contestant choose to go to the e.r.

[KailuaGirl]

You're undoubtedly right about the reasons Bravo probably chooses not to have a PA available but, given the frequency with which people seem to be stabbing themselves on TC, they might want to rethink that decision. It might cut down on the drama somewhat, but would probably also reduce liability since they are now on notice that some cheftestants have needed ER attention for stitches.

Regardless, Ty-lor did spend the night in the ER but then came back and finished his assigned job. Even when he could have complained about others not picking up the slack and/or screwing up his dish in the finishing stage (I know that was his own fault for deciding to do the steaks that way, just sayin') he kept his mouth shut and shouldered the blame. I'm with those who give him props for that.

[chowser]

Who hasn't spent time in the ER and then talked about the wait after? He's got a camera on him. He never made excuses, instead, he said he'd do what it took to make the steaks. The medics wanted to pull him from cooking and he said no way. The medics told him to go to the hospital--who knows what is in their contract as medical care goes and he's not a doctor to know what is needed.

[Manassas64]

As the owner of a 40 year old scar on my thumb from cutting an orange that needed 4 stitches, I take exception to the word "only."

4 is a lot of wound. One stitch, maybe 2, I can see not being a big deal.

[chowser]

Exactly--and as nonprofessionals, we see a lot of blood, we see a deep cut, the medic tells us to go to the hospital. We go.

I've worked in an ER, and seen far too many people come in well after the fact because they're afraid it'll be nothing, from heart attacks to broken bones to serious cuts. Let trained pros decide.

[soupkitten]

hand and head wounds are notoriously hard to call, for nonprofessionals. they tend to bleed a lot, and if your hand wound isn't cleaned and dressed properly, you can get a major infection. if you wait too long to get stitches, it isn't an option anymore. ty was not a pussy for going to the er for his hand, on his own time. it may not have even significantly affected the outcome of the episode, that the injury or the er visit even happened, as he soldiered through pretty well, hurt and sleep deprived, and the (questionable) execution decisions were made prior to the injury.

[chowser]

I agree--and the proof of it is that he didn't bring it up at judges table or mention it at all, other than as he was downing his espressos. He sucked it up and worked w/ it, w/out asking for anything special.

I banged my head on the refrigerator and I couldn't get over how much blood there was, soaked through a towel, so I headed for the ER. I had no idea (who can see the top of her head, through hair and blood. The doctor told me he could shave my hair, do a few stitches and I'd have to live w/ a bald spot and a small scar or he could leave it and I'd have a slightly larger scar. I guess it was a waste of time, in hindsight, but who knows?

[mcf]

Tom noted it in his blog. He never offered it as an excuse. Tom found that very admirable.

[Caitlin McGrath]

Tom's comments at JT right before the elimination were surprisingly harsh. Not just, "your dishes were bad" but "maybe we shouldn't have let you in the competition in the first place." He seems pretty frustrated at the underwhelming food coming from chefs with reasonably serious pedigree. It does seem as if they're playing to stay, rather than playing to win. And while it's technically only necessary to avoid being kicked off to get to the final three, it's not very inspiring to watch, or, I imagine, to judge. I hope that as things are winnowed they start to show more fire (excuse the pun).

[LindaWhit]

Read his blog (huiray posted the link above). He explains exactly what you said - they're playing to stay in the middle of the pack right now, not win.

[Caitlin McGrath]

I hadn't read it when I posted, obviously, and looks like huiray and I were posting around the same time. Anyway, interesting that Tom acknowledges that part of the reason for the lackluster cooking is the nature of the challenge. I hope that after next week, when they're down to ten, they'll stick with more individual challenges and things will start looking better.

[ipsedixit]

Yeah, group challenges (or group dishes) suck.

[LindaWhit]

Hope so as well. I understand the need for group challenges early in the game, but it doesn't usually highlight the cheftestants' dishes as well as it could.

[ratgirlagogo]

His final goodbye to Whitney was the harshest I ever remember him giving - something like " usually it's really hard for us to pick the loser but you made it easy." Yikes.

[monavano]

I missed that. My dvr cut off at the end. But I agree with Tom. I'd be mortified if I served raw potatoes. I knew she was going as soon as the judges mentioned it.

[mcf]

Absolutely, overcooked or undercooked/inedible loses every time.

[steve h.]

Lots of competent chefs creating decent meals. No head cases so I'm not sure I see much in the way of drama. Who does one root for and why?

Lambent mediocrity, in my opinion, is the hallmark of this season.

[JuniorBalloon]

I'm not enjoying this season as much as seasons past. It should be called "Stop Chef!" this year.

"I think I'll make an enchilada with a flour tortilla" Stop Chef!
"I think I'll push my way to the front of the line at the meat counter" Stop Chef!
"Padma is looking so hot..." Stop Chef!
"I'm going to cook 200 steaks on a grill by myself" Stop Chef!
"These potatoes are not quite done but I'll serve them anyways" Stop Chef!
I'm going to serve a nasty looking cigar to some upper crusty air heads" Stop Chef!
"I'm going to cry now" Stop Chef!

I'm sure there are more.

jb

[John E.]

It will be interesting to see if this season is able to grab our attention better as the episodes progress. I remember having similar thoughts at this stage of TC7 and while not my favorite season, my interest did increase the more I got to know the contestants.

[Worldwide Diner]

I like the "Stop Chef." Kinda of like "C'mon Man" on Monday Night Countdown.

[Joanie]

Or Coach Ditka's "Stop It!" on ESPN's Sun. pregame.

[LindaWhit]

I want a "LIKE" button for JrB's "Stop Chef!" post. :-)

[Ruth Lafler]

"I'm going to buy frozen, precooked shrimp!"

[davis_sq_pro]

I just realized that there is a real pattern forming this season with regard to shrimp-based issues... Next up, a shellfish allergy?

[LindaWhit]

It's this season's Top Scallop debacle.

[soupkitten]

do you think the chefs might be going for shrimp because it's texas?-- gulf shrimp--

[LindaWhit]

It is quite possible, being that it's probably readily available and fresh.

[KailuaGirl]

Hilarious and spot on!

[JAB]

I like it as well. Or, "Chef Please!".

[vorpal]

Agreed. This season, despite having barely begun, is so far the most forgettable season to date. I've found that it's been all downhill since season 6, however: season 7 was alright, 8 was dull, and this season is frightfully bad. None of the chefs are jumping out as particularly skilled and the challenges seem really stifling towards the creativity and abilities of the chefs.

Overall, I'm barely watching anymore; I save the episodes for when I have something tedious to do as background distraction.

[debbiel]

I just watched the first six episodes back to back (was out of the country). About midway through episode three it became a chore; I finished out of some warped sense of responsibility to finish that which I start. I'm hoping that the remaining episodes will be a bit better (surely watching one per week will help). No one stands out as particularly skilled, I can't actually remember any dishes of interest, and I currently do not care who is sent home or who ultimately wins.

[chicgail]

Just saw Last Chance Kitchen and I was surprised to see that everyone was still there. I'm not surprised they didn't send anyone packing home (that would have too much of a spoiler), but I didn't expect all the eliminated chefs to still be being featured on camera.

I wonder if there will be some kind of a cook-off or if they will all be brought back in for something.

Certainly eliminated chefs have been brought back to be line cooks or sous chefs in past seasons, but this gives at least the appearance that it will be something more.

[Manassas64]

With any reality show, the contestants voted off are usually sequestered for a while so they might as well let them out to play.

Of course, as the LCK group grows, they'll need more than one burger to split between them ;o)

I thought it was interesting that Chef Fearing was being a stickler about the clarified butter. It was like a Coq au Vin flashback.

[LindaWhit]

The sequestering is what I noted above to Joanie. I'd bet that either the guys just asked the producers, or the producers chose to have them come back on to quietly talk (a la "Chopped" judges) about their LCK cookoff.

[Ruth Lafler]

They make two of the dishes for a challenge like this -- one for the judges and one to look pristine for filming. You could clearly see Whitney cooking more than one burger and frying more than one egg.

[John E.]

When told to PPYKAG none of the chefs has ever 'gone home'. They are sequestered in a hotel suite somewhere until the last episodes before the two part finale. If they were actually allowed to go home, their presence at their jobs, hometowns, etc. would tip off that they did not win Top Chef and let the cat out of the bag.

[cowboyardee]

+1 this

[Ruth Lafler]

Yup. That's true of all these competitive reality shows. That's also why there's often a challenge near the end where they bring eliminated contestants back to help the people in the final group.

[John E.]

I've never seen another competitive reality show other than Top Chef and the FN shows. (I suppose that's a reference to Survivor. Those references go right by me).

[Ruth Lafler]

Actually, it's a reference to the grand-daddy of the "creative-people-competing" reality shows: Project Runway.

[John E.]

I have not (surprise) seen that one either.

[chicgail]

It's totally true that the eliminated chefs are always sequestered and not allowed to go home, but they are usually not visible to anyone. This is the first time that we have seen them - almost as secondary judges - as part of the ongoing competition. I think something more is afoot.

[chowser]

It's also the first time we've seen anything after the fact, other than blooper footage. I think it just makes sense to let them watch and be part--rather than sitting in a sequestered room all the time. I read that in the first Survivor show, they sequestered the contestants in a luxury hotel on a remote island somewhere. For THAT, I'd try to get eliminated! An apartment where you're not allowed to be seen by the public would be tough for weeks on end.

[ratgirlagogo]

<I read that in the first Survivor show, they sequestered the contestants in a luxury hotel on a remote island somewhere. >

They still do - they've done it every season. At some point the producers began referring to it as the "Ponderosa" and offering Ponderosa videos on the Survivor website.

[Ruth Lafler]

"Survivor" actually has two sequestrations: the early eliminated contestants get whisked off to some luxury location; the ones that are eliminated but on the jury stay nearby at a not-so-luxurious-but-with-plenty-of-food-and-medical-care camp -- that's the one they show on the "Ponderosa" videos.

[John E.]

I have not watched that particular episode of LCK. My response about the contestants being sequestered was based on your first sentence where you expressed surprise to see everyone. I guess I did not digest your entire post before responding. I wish they would show more of the eliminated contestants on the Bravo TV Top Chef. Can you imagine the grilling the newly eliminated chef goes through once they join the others?

[huiray]

On TC7 they showed the eliminated chefs every episode (online videos) arriving at the sequester apartment and the chit-chat before and after each arrival amongst the chefs there. The sequence started with the very first one kicked off, that John dude with the waist-length dreadlock.
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

[John E.]

Yeah, that's why I mentioned Bravo TV Top Chef (not Bravo TV on-line Top Chef). I don't particularly like to watch television on my computer and tend to avoid it.

[huiray]

Oh. OK. Still, I imagine you're watching LCK online, as that's where it is... :-)

[John E.]

Nope, I'm watching LCK on-demand from Comcast on a 50 inch HDTV.

[dmjordan]

I watched LCK and was really annoyed that the eliminated chefs were constantly asking them questions, which I'm sure the producers had a hand in. It's tough enough to complete their challenges and now you have to answer their questions too?

[jcattles]

I can see that Heather was being abrasive, but nobody else was standing up to take charge. Lindsey tried but she made the mistake of firing the steaks to early. There has to be a leader to make sure everything runs smoothly. It seems Heather is used to running a kitchen and expects it to go her way. Do I think she could be a little nicer? Yes, but anytime a woman stands up for herself or takes control, she's considered a bitch. Look how everyone talked about Jen from season 6 when she did that in the military challenge. (was that the right one?) It is obvious there's no lost love between Heather & Beverly. The chefs do seems to be out more for number 1 more this season than ever before.

I got the feeling from Tom's comments to Ty'lor at JT before they sent Whitney home, that the judges knew about the problem with firing the steaks. Again, I'll have to rewatch it to see. I wish Bravo would post Tom's blog already. I think it was a very stand up thing for Ty'lor to do, taking responsibility for the steaks even though he wasn't the only one to cook them.

[cowboyardee]

"Yes, but anytime a woman stands up for herself or takes control, she's considered a bitch. Look how everyone talked about Jen from season 6 when she did that in the military challenge."
________
Nah... I think Heather comes off as sort of an obnoxious bully (at least in this challenge), but i loved Jen. Jen was assertive and direct in putting a stop to problems as they came up. Heather was whiny and vindictive in bitching about people after the fact. Big difference.

[yummfood]

I agree, loved Jen and her assertiveness while being very professional at the same time. That season was great.

[chowser]

Exactly. I have think that episode garnered her a lot of respect and put her out as one to watch. She was assertive without being a snaky bitch, like Heather is coming off.

[Ruth Lafler]

Furthermore, if Beverly were a man she'd be getting less flak for not helping and more credit for being competitive and having a successful strategy. Women are still expected to be more self-sacrificing and helpful and less competitive.

[soupkitten]

i think she's taking female chefs back 20-30 years, when it was acceptable for the (male, french) chef in charge to say: "women do not belong in a professional kitchen because of the following bullet list including crying constantly, doing prep at a snail's pace, being a poor team player, and taking too long to pee."

[Ruth Lafler]

Crying constantly? Did she cry in this episode? Exactly how many times has she cried that you consider it to be "constantly"?

[mariacarmen]

she did cry in this episode. she got emotional when telling Ed how much she'd always admired him. again (as above), i'm not criticizing - just stating a fact.

[Ruth Lafler]

Unless she's crying during the actual cooking/competitive portions of the show, I don't think it's anyone's business whether she cries. What she does in her "downtime" is irrelevant to her cooking or her competency as a chef.

[mariacarmen]

people are complaining about having to watch her cry - it paints a picture of her - exactly what the producers are trying to do. i don't care either way.

[John E.]

Oh for crying out loud. There was a Thanksgiving episode years ago where one contestant only made a salad and got booted. I don't remember his name, but it was not Beverly.

[cowboyardee]

That was carlos. IIRC that episode featured some of the worst, most lameass elimination challenge dishes ever served from a group. The food on that challenge (make modern thanksgiving fare) made the food from this weeks challenge look like the tasting menu from Noma.

[John E.]

As I recall something as pedestrian as cream of mushroom soup won that challenge (Elia) and Mike did about three courses himself because he could see that his twice baked potaoes and corn on the cob weren't going to be enough ( I think he also did an amuse and a cheese course at the end). That was the episode where Marcel broke Frank's sunglasses and Frank later threatened to beat Marcel so bad his own mother would not recognize him. Ahhh, the good old days of Top Chef. It has become more civilized since that season.

[cowboyardee]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Michael's twiced baked potatoes were served as a side... to his own dish that also featured mashed potatoes. Keep in mind that the challenge was to serve 'cutting edge' thanksgiving food. And he wasn't even really in contention to go home since Carlos and Betty were clearly even worse.

That's an element I sometimes sort of miss since the first two seasons: where the bad dishes weren't just bad - they were freaking ridiculous. It can actually be more entertaining to watch than a season like this one where everyone is pretty much competent but no one stands out too far, good or bad.

[chowser]

Freaking ridiculous is far better than plain old potatoes gratin with no twist or roasted vegetables. That's even less than the cafeteria lunch ladies did on Chopped! Show us that you're a chef, not a food assembler.

[cowboyardee]

At least a gratin is cooked. And respectable (though simple) if done right, just like a risotto. Carlos had even more time IIRC, FAR fewer plates to serve, a challenge that explicitly asked him to make cutting edge food, and dude made a salad. A mediocre salad at that. There is no comparison between the ineptitude sometimes on display during the first couple seasons and the mistakes of more recent contestants.

[John E.]

While I have not read Tom C.'s recent blog, I believe the problem he has with the first several challenges this season is that nobody is attempting to stand out by doing something really good or creative Ugly Chris may have been attempting to do so with his 'cigar' but he failed.(His Cindy Lou Who hairdo is starting to bug me a little).

[KailuaGirl]

LOL! Cindy Lou Who? Perfect and seasonally appropriate! The hairdo is bugging me, too.

[cowboyardee]

That is, in fact, what Tom C said. And a lot of posters on this thread.

But here is something that doesn't get mentioned:

Yes, many of the best contestants on TC have come out with guns blazing, trying to go for the win on every challenge (the top 4 from season 6, Richard Blais, Hung, Stephan). It was a good strategy for them and made them look like great cooks, which is just as important IMO as actually winning the competition. But I think it was a good strategy for them BECAUSE they were so talented and had a clear edge on the rest of the field. For someone who is less talented and not a clear favorite, it may be better to play challenges safe and make it to the end, where you can leave a great impression on the basis of just a few open ended challenges. Look at Mike Isabella or Kevin Sbraga, or Dale and Casey from season 3. Any of those guys might have just made an early exit if they had taken more risks early.

This season, I don't know whether it's the tight field or the competitors' lack of confidence, but everyone (maybe not Paul? time will tell) seems to be waging a war of attrition... which might just be any individual's best shot at helping their career this season.

[fara]

season 2 is still one of my favorites

[Ruth Lafler]

I'm talking taking flak from you all and the other chefs, not the judges. The judges didn't seem to care that she only worked on the shrimp.

There were other chefs in this competition who didn't do much -- I don't see people ragging on them. Did it really take all the efforts of three people (Edward, Chris Moto, and Paul) to prep steak carpaccio with some grilled veggies? The judges sure weren't impressed! Did it take all of Dakota and Sarah's efforts to make the non-shrimp parts of the gazpacho (considering the shrimp was the only part that was cooked)? And is Lindsey even on this show? I think the main issue is not that Beverly only prepped shrimp, but that their dish was served first, which left her with time to help, but what about Dakota?

BTW, Tom says: "Heather took heat from the others for assuming that role in order to keep things moving, because it needed to happen, but the other chefs were her competitors, not her employees, and they didn’t have to listen to her."

[monavano]

I think Beverly is getting singled out in part because of editing. She's being portrayed as slow and unaware of those around her.

[californiabeerandpizza]

Agreed - what were all those other people doing for six hours? I thought the gazpacho looked like the best part of the dinner (I think I'm going to make it in the summer). I seem to recall someone saying they couldn't taste enough watermelon but other than that they seemed to like it, even if they weren't blown away by it, but I think it was a good start and showed some thought was put into the progression of the dinner, which is something Tom is always looking for. I think this was one of those rare challenges where there wasn't enough to do for the number of chefs. It probably would have been more interesting if they had split into two groups with each group serving half of the attendees.

[Ruth Lafler]

Also, I was just thinking that Beverly wasn't on Heather's team for the prep, so why should she (or anyone) have helped Heather during their prep time and what skin was it off Heather's nose if she took six hours to prep the shrimp? That didn't affect what went on during dinner service at all!

[Worldwide Diner]

Heather was already done with her prep. Heather was helping to pull service together and she noticed that Beverly was still doing shrimp. It obviously doesn't affect Heather personally, especially since she won the challenge. Heather's point was that if Beverly was working in Heather's kitchen, Beverly wouldn't last. In short, Heather was saying Beverly sucks because she's slow as molasses. I'm not sure if Heather tried to boss Beverly around during cooking, but Heather did call out Beverly in the stew room.

[Ruth Lafler]

Except Beverly doesn't work for Heather -- it was none of Heather's business how long Beverly took with her shrimp. And the dessert team (not just Heather) had taken on the task of pulling service together -- so again, Beverly had no obligation to help, and Heather had no right to "call her out."

[Worldwide Diner]

You're right that Beverly doesn't work for Heather; however, it was a team challenge and rational people may have the impression that people who are done with their assigned tasks are supposed to help the rest of the team. No one, including Heather, said Beverly had an obligation. It was more of "I can't believe she spent 6 hrs. doing shrimp." Thus I think Heather's point is that Beverly is slow, as opposed to being lazy. As for the right to call someone out on a TV show, I think any contestant has the right to do that and they do. If Heather doesn't have such right, then they should throw her off the show.

[Ruth Lafler]

"Rights" are different than "rules" -- Heather didn't break any rules in calling Beverly out, except for the rules of how you treat people who are your colleagues. The fact is that it wasn't justified: she's not Beverly's boss, and Beverly had no obligation to help Heather just because Heather wanted her to. There were plenty of other people who did less than Beverly (including Beverly's teammates, who if you look at the recipe, just pureed fruits and vegetables), so why single Beverly out? My take is that Heather is a bully who is singling out someone she perceives as being smaller and weaker.

I'm not sure what the timeline was, either. If Heather was asking Bev to help during their prep time, then Bev was certainly under no obligation to help with Heather's food prep. If she was asking for help with service on the day of the event, then she was out of line because Bev's dish was going first (unlike Heather's which was last) and Bev was perfectly justified in working on finishing and plating it.

According to the recipe, the shrimp were poached for 30 minutes and then chilled. The only way that Bev would still be "working on" her shrimp would be if she decided to do the poaching and chilling on the day of the event, rather than letting them sit in the fridge overnight, which sounds like an excellent choice from the point of view of freshness of the shrimp, but like it may have led to some fairly tight timing in getting the shrimp poached, chilled and then the dish plated. So the fact that her she was still "working on her shrimp" had nothing to do with the fact that it allegedly took her six hours of prep time to devein the shrimp, but on the fact that she decided not to poach them in advance.

[Worldwide Diner]

I fail to see under any definition of "rights" that Heather can't call out Beverly? They're not co-workers. They're competitors in a cut-throat contest. And I'm sure they're encouraged to belittle each other. Heather could've kept her mouth shut, but where's the fun in that? Now we got two people to bitch about. I can bitch about how pathetic Beverly is and you can bitch about how Heather is a bully.

[Jase]

LOL! So Heather is competitor in calling out Beverly but Beverly is focusing on her shrimp and not helping isn't considered a competitor. She should drop what she's doing instead?

[Worldwide Diner]

LOL! They're both competitors - Heather is a bully, and Beverly just sucks as as chef.

[John E.]

I do not believe sxism is the main cause for the 'flak' it is that you refer. I also think editing has a lot to do with it. What is it that we did not see that helped to cause the drama? So the reason Marcel got so much 'flak' is because he is male? Play the sexism card only when it is really there otherwise I believe it diminishes it when it really does happen.

[Ruth Lafler]

Well, Marcel got a lot of flak because he's the kind of guy who gets a lot of flak because of his personality -- anyone who behaved the way Marcel did would have gotten a lot of flak (although Marcel got more than he deserved, IMHO).

In this case, I don't think what Beverly supposedly did deserves any flak. So why is she getting it? She's getting it because Heather has told us that she deserves it. And why does Heather think she deserves it? IMHO it's because Heather is a bully who is picking on someone she sees as being weaker, in part because she's physically a small woman.

And why are people going along with Heather's assessment? Because Beverly has been portrayed as a stereotypical weak woman who is "constantly crying." Do you think that (a) Heather would have called out Eddie for taking six hours to prep a few veggies to grill, or Chris for braising a few greens and (b) that a large segment of the audience would have piled on? I see way to much of the "women are bitchy/men are competitive" dynamic on Top Chef, both on screen and in the discussion threads, to give people a pass on this.

[John E.]

I did not see enough interaction on this episode to answer your questions. I will stand by my opinion that sexism has little to do with why Heather was calling out Beverly or even why anybody is giving any flak to Beverly. As I said earlier, to play the sexism card where it does not clearly exist diminishes (if I'm using the term correctly) those that are really the recipient of sexist remarks and behavior (I cannot use the word victim, it's overused).

[LindaWhit]

Yes, I think Ed would have been called out for taking 6 hours to prep vegetables to grill.

Beverly has put herself out there for the world to see; the editors are just taking what they're given and running with it. With both her and Heather.

[mcf]

Absolutely. I don't get the obsession with labeling Beverly as small and weak and Heather as Big Mean Bully. So far, from my perspective, Beverly has been obnoxious in one way, and Heather in another way. Outspokenness isn't enough to classify someone a bully, not when she's addressing legitimate complaints.

[Ruth Lafler]

Well then why wasn't he, because that's what he did! Did you see that course? There's no way three professional chefs each put six hours of prep work into it!

In their six hours of prep time, Bev's teammates pureed raw fruits and veggies -- they didn't even cook anything! Chris braised some greens, Nyesha made compound butter -- why weren't they called out for not accomplishing great things in their prep time? Bev had way more to prep (400 shrimp to devein, poaching liquid to prepare, shrimp to poach) than most of them, but she's the one Heather called out. Why?

[Worldwide Diner]

Probably because Ed and others did help out after they finished their tasks in a timely manner. The fact is you don't know how long the others took to finish their tasks and what else they did since we weren't shown. You just assumed that everyone else moped around doing only their wn tasks.

[chowser]

Heather dislikes Bev. Maybe it's sexism and she hates all women, maybe she hates tiny women, maybe she hates Korean Americans, maybe she's threatened, maybe she thinks Bev is self centered (down to pushing her way in front of the butcher to get service and to taking up too much counter space and making a mess and turning off Nyesha's water) but to put it down to sexism, imo, here is a stretch. No one else but Heather has a real problem w/ Bev. On the board, people have picked up on what Heather said, plain and simple. If another contestant slammed Edward, people would have piled on him. It's not sexism--it's falling for what they want viewers to believe. If you want to talk about sexist stereotypes, I think Nyesha falls into a very feminine one--quiet, diligent, puts her head down and gets the work done and looks smoking hot in a bikini. If Heather were hating someone because they're "feminine", Nyesha would be an obvious choice, too..

This conversation reminds me too much of the defense of Carla when I, and others said she did either very well or underperformed, and it turned into a sexism argument--only after the discussion, she underperformed twice in a row which ultimately sent her packing.

[mcf]

Maybe because he's not as apparently self absorbed and self serving as Beverly has seemed to be so far.

[soupkitten]

ed also made the bottom 3 for those vegetables. tom c basically called his work on that course a throwaway, said he expected more of a contribution from him. if whitney hadn't served such an awful dish ed very well may have paid the price for those veggies. ed also was helping with the steaks at a couple of points. beverly is in the mode that does draw ire from other people-- she is doing just enough work to skate by week after week, without doing anything to help others or be a good team player.

[LindaWhit]

^^^ THAT from mcf. Not self-absorbed.

And ^^^ THAT from soupkitten. In the bottom 3 for only the veggies.

[JuniorBalloon]

For me, when Beverly strode up to the meat counter and demanded to be served immediately is when she went on my d-bag list. Deciding whether I like a contestant or not is based on what comes out of their mouths not someone elses.
jb

[Ruth Lafler]

That was like, two seconds of footage, that was taken out of context (you couldn't see the whole meat counter, who else was there and who else was being served). Are you so sure you really know what happened? Sure enough to make a judgement about a person's entire character from it?

[JuniorBalloon]

For goodness sake I'm not condeming her to hard labor for the rest of her life. I'm just watching a silly show on tv and can think what ever I'd like. None of us knows what is and isn't being shown out of context. If she behaved that way, she is a d-bag and if she didn't and I hear about it I'l be more than happy to change my idea of her.

jb

[linus]

ruth is right. usually 'round here, character is judged by haircuts.

[soupkitten]

hey you can tell a whole lot about a top chef contestant by their hair! for example, everyone with a faux-hawk is a pretty good chef, moto-chris is a terribly confused individual who wonders why the grinch would be taking the tree (or his "little buddy" richie) away, and that john guy with waist length dreadlocks from a few seasons past, is a horrible, gross, disgusting man, who absolutely can't possibly be able to cook, despite being nominated for a james beard award---- you can just tell, by his hair! :)

[chowser]

Do you know what Heather said wasn't taken out of context? Do you know that she wasn't lead on to say what she did, to bring on drama? Are you sure enough to make a judgement about a person's entire character from it? Yet, you're wiling to bend over backward to give Bev the benefit of the doubt, say that Beverly's actions are out of context and we don't know what happened but still call Heather a bully and theorize that she has it out for someone because she's girly and tiny and call her sexist. Playing it both ways shows a huge bias.

I'm trying to figure out in what context a person would say what Bev did at the counter, even if it's 2 seconds of footage. Why would it matter who else was there? And, how do you know it was taken out of context?

Not taken out of context, I think I'd roll my eyes at someone who wrote themselves inspirational notes, like, "You're the next winner of Top Chef, congratulations" and left them all over the place. I'd also say the crying bugs me. I don't care if it's typical that women express themselves by crying, I don't like it in a professional setting. I don't care if it's typical that men express themselves by getting angry. I don't like that in a professional setting either. Michael Chiarello is your typical Type A type guy and I don't like him at all. Be a professional, whatever sex you are.

[Ruth Lafler]

It was taken out of physical context and also out of time context. Maybe she was there first and the clerk kept overlooking her. Maybe there was a free clerk at the other end of the counter and she was trying to get his attention. Etc. You can't know from what you saw.

My theory is a theory, and clearly stated as such. I don't see Beverly crying in a "professional setting" -- I see her crying about things unrelated to the competition, on her "personal" time. She's not bursting into tears in the kitchen, or asking for sympathy or special consideration or using tears to manipulate. Most "professionals" don't have cameras following them around filming their private moments. In contrast, Heather called out Beverly in a professional setting, in the stew room, surrounded by her colleagues.

I guess I find unreasonable that people are so judgmental in what they consider acceptable behavior when that behavior is extraneous to either the competition or the other contestants. Anyone who deviates the slightest bit is treated with such derision, and their quirks are magnified all out of proportion (Did she leave notes "all over the place"? She put one note on her mirror. Were there others?) and their characterizations are repeated ("constantly crying") until they become accepted as facts.

[mcf]

"I guess I find unreasonable that people are so judgmental in what they consider acceptable behavior when that behavior is extraneous to either the competition or the other contestants."

So character traits may only be assessed within the context of the competition? Character is character, we each respond to different ones. If I were Beverly, I think I'd be more offended by characterization as a weak, frail victim than as self absorbed and not a team player.

[chowser]

As a small Asian woman, it never occurred to me that a large woman would hate me that much just because my size made me seem weak. I'd much rather she hate me because I'm a tough self-absorbed competitor who would shut out the world to win.

[mcf]

Perzackly.

[Ruth Lafler]

People are hating on her here for being weak with her "constant crying" -- whether she actually is weak or not.

[Worldwide Diner]

People are hating on her here for being weak with her "constant crying" -- whether she actually is weak or not.
***
You are conveninently ignoring Beverly's other misdeeds already chronicled elsewhere in this thread. Furthermore, I'm not sure anyone is arguing with you about whether Heather is a bully or not. So what if Heather is a bully? Heather's bullying didn't cause Beverly to insert herself in front of the butcher and demand service.

[Ruth Lafler]

I'm not characterizing Beverly as a weak, frail victim. I'm saying that Heather may be singling Beverly out for bullying because *Heather* perceives her as being weak because of her small size (and at the risk of being sizist, Heather appears to outweigh Beverly by 100 pounds). Bullies pick on people they perceive as being weaker or more vulnerable in some way. As has been discussed many times, restaurant kitchens have traditionally been macho environments. People have been bullied on Top Chef for being young, for being old, and for in other ways not fitting into the hard-ass chef mold. Beverly's appearance and demeanor make her a target for bullying.

[chicgail]

There was a bullying incident with Marcel who was not much younger, older, or smaller - or less hard-ass - than anyone else. What he was was consistently irritating and annoying and when the other contestants had too much to drink they physically attacked him - or attempted to do that. The target for bullying may not be just showing up as "victim material." at all.

[cowboyardee]

"There was a bullying incident with Marcel who was not much younger, older, or smaller - or less hard-ass - than anyone else."
________
Actually, he was the youngest and smallest. If he had been 10 years older and built like Cliff (the fella who pinned him down), that season would have been quite different.

IMO, people have been overthinking this whole thing. It is entirely possible that both of the following are true:

1) Beverly is genuinely annoying to some, with overly emotional demeanor and mild thoughtlessness about others in the competition or in line for meat at the supermarket.

and

2) Heather saw not only someone who annoys her, but also someone smaller than her; someone the other chefs have mixed feelings about and aren't likely to stand up for, someone less aggressive than her and less willing to publicly fight back... so she bullied her (easily distinguished from leadership because Heather waited until the challenge was over and then made a public show of her criticism). In other words, she picked the easiest target and went after her. Sound like a bully to anyone?

Sometimes, when it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck... it's just a duck. Heather came off as mean-spirited most likely because ... she was being mean-spirited.

[chowser]

To her face, Heather called her out that one time about spending too much time with the shrimp. It wasn't professional but we've seen people do it in the JT often. Everything else was to the camera. Bev said she was shocked to hear how Heather felt so it's not like she bullied her all along. Heather just said how she felt in the stew room, and again, we don't see what lead up to that. If we have to give Bev the benefit of the doubt about being aggressive at the meat counter, we should give Heather the benefit of the doubt about that scene. I'd say Heather is possibly more mean girl than bully but I don't remember her talking about Bev to other contestants, or rallying others against her. Really, Heather is about bigger than everyone else there. People rub each other the wrong way all the time, not just based on size or whether a woman has "too feminine" attributes. For the record, I don't like Heather and would be happy for her and her cakes to leave. But, if we're supposed to give Bev the benefit of the doubt, we should give Heather the benefit of the doubt.

[cowboyardee]

When did I say people have to give Beverly the benefit of the doubt about the meat counter?

I said Bev is the apparent weakest person in the group based on size, demeanor, and social standing, and Heather's behavior was a fairly clear cut example of picking out the weakest person in her environment, going after her in a mean-spirited and totally unproductive way, and justifying it by saying 'well she was annoying.'

Marcel was annoying too. And Ilan was still a bully. It's not that complicated.

[mcf]

I'm not sure I share your assessment of Beverly's strength/weakness. She seems to have little concern about the reactions of others while in pursuit of her own goals. She seems pretty darned assertive to me, even aggressive.

[cowboyardee]

Does an aggressive person offer no response when called out publicly as Beverly was? I would have responded quite a bit more assertively in her shoes, and I'm just middle-of-the-road on the passive/assertive/aggressive scale.

Being entitled and oblivious is not the same thing at all as being aggressive.

[mcf]

Often, it's the strongest folks who most easily dismiss the provocative behavior of others, either due to superior self control or lack of concern about what others think or say about them. We don't know if that's Beverly, but yes, some very assertive folks are capable of completely ignoring provocation, while more aggressive folks often cannot stop themselves from rising to any bait.

[cowboyardee]

Beverly has not exactly been a paragon of emotional self-control to this point. I'll stick with my assessment.

[chowser]

And maybe that's why Heather dislikes her, not because of her size but that she's come off as emotionally immature. Is she young?

[cowboyardee]

I think she's in her early 30s, so not really. She still comes off as an easy target and a bit immature though.

[Robinez]

Beverly is a lactating Mother and was told to leave her baby within 24 hrs after she got the call for TC. So, yes she is emotional. And, yes it is a big reason why she keeps crying.

That said, it is also a big reason why she shouldn't be on this show. She should have stayed at home with her new baby and gone to a rodeo with her husband instead. It's not like they had a finite number of contestant's this year and they would miss her ( although I am sure they always have a couple back up contestant's in case someone backs out ,etc) they had a bunch of extra's.

She is all over the map with her emotions and I can imagine it is difficult to work with her. But, removing someone's braising liquid because YOU decided nobody was using it was the straw that broke the camels back for me, not the crying.

[chowser]

No, sorry, not you--I just meant it's been said in the thread (and to be honest, I don't always read who writes every post, just read the post). I should have been more clear.

I think it's possible that Heather is picking on Bev like that. Or it's possible that she dislikes her for any number of reasons. People rub each other the wrong way all the time, often w/out bullying intents. I also don't underestimate Bev. I think she's weak. And, it seems a few people dislike Heather and Sarah so is she the lowest in social standing?

[cowboyardee]

My point was just that it's entirely possible to both dislike someone for legitimate reasons AND to express it in such a way that constitutes bullying. I believe that's what's happened here, Depends on how and when you go about speaking up.

BTW, I don't mean that to be an especially damning criticism of either contestant at this point. We all have our moments that we are not proud of, and these contestants are surely under some stress. It was just one episode. Perhaps Bev is just a bit oblivious and makes more of an effort to mind her peers from now on; perhaps Heather just let slip in a moment of frustration and doesn't habitually pick on people who can't really defend themselves, Time will tell.

[Withnail42]

It was mob mentality. Marcel for what ever reason (deserved or not) was the odd man out and least able to defend himself. He became a target of a couple of the others who instigated the attack.

[cowboyardee]

Exactly. Just because a person is annoying or obnoxious doesn't mean the people attacking him aren't bullies.

[soupkitten]

um. well i think it's problematic to think that heather is just arbitrarily going around picking on people who are physically smaller than her. i haven't seen her "pick on" dakota or lindsay or richie or chuy or whitney or anyone else for that matter. heather has at least given reasons for griping about beverly specifically, and these reasons were performance based-- and, other folks have had similar criticisms for beverly. i just don't see these issues as being invented in order to pick on somebody.

as far as macho, it's maybe for another thread. the pecking order in professional kitchens has, historically, had heterosexual females firmly at the bottom, true... the thing about a competition is that folks are coming in as equals, somewhat-- it isn't as if an individual is hiring people and they are trying to fit into an existing (and created) "culture" and possibly getting hated on or "hazed" or whatever (which does not happen as much as it used to). also, nobody has the noob excuse here. everyone has had something of a career, everyone has worked in pro kitchens for some time, and has overcome obstacles and toughed it out, until they "arrived" at the executive level. i don't buy that sarah or chuy or keith or heather or beverly has traveled a soft cushy road. beverly is an exec and i don't really think that she's weak, though there's probably something going on... the chicago chefs in particular all play in the same pool. maybe heather and beverly have had some conflicts in chicago prior to going on the show, which are playing out here. just as some chefs are buddies with their hometown colleagues, some chefs have prior grudges. and they all gotta go back home at the end of the season.

the editors are playing up the conflict between heather and beverly for all that it's worth, to create some kind of interest in the contest this season (yawn). looks like we will see if they can play nice together next week, but i am guessing both are professionals and they will do fine.

[Worldwide Diner]

looks like we will see if they can play nice together next week, but i am guessing both are professionals and they will do fine.
***
I'm hoping for a knife fight.

[KailuaGirl]

LOL! You're too funny.

[chowser]

" Anyone who deviates the slightest bit is treated with such derision, and their quirks are magnified all out of proportion"

Is this sort of what you've done to Heather? What is a professional setting when they're sitting in the stew room for hours on end w/ endless alcohol, or sitting in bleachers with each other and crying? When you're on camera, you're a professional--and that includes Marcel getting so angry at Dale; Hosea and Leah making out, etc. It's off competition, but it's part of the show, we're going to formulate judgements on what we see.

Maybe the topic came up in the stew room on who did what and what worked and didn't and Heather said that about Bev, in addition to others? We have no idea but we could contrive an explanation to make her seem like a very nice person for all the situations. As you said about Bev, you can't know from what you saw. So, again it comes down to a bias on being willing to reach to make excuses for one person's behavior and doing the same to another to excoriate her. You've really hammered on Heather's bullying and sexism, based on the same rationale of others disliking Bev.

[LindaWhit]

Well stated, chowser.

Ruth - no matter what, we're all judgmental here. We based what our *opinion* is on what we see on the show. Just as those of us who dislike Beverly for what she's done, you dislike Heather for her bullying. Same diff, isn't it?

[linus]

"Ruth - no matter what, we're all judgmental here"
speak for yourself.

"We based what our *opinion* is on what we see on the show."
this is disingenuous, as many here have admitted they realize what they see is manipulated through editing, and their opinions are coloured by that, and it's obvious other conclusions and opinions are drawn on previously held prejudices, experiences, etc.
again, speak for yourself.

[LindaWhit]

Regardless, linus - your judgment and opinion is based on what you see on the show as well. Until all of the footage is shown to all of the viewers, we are forming are opinions based on what we see and what we've experienced in our own lives. An opinion is a personal view or appraisal based on what is known at the time. None of us have the full facts in front of us, unless you have a secret "in" with the show and have seen hundreds of hours more footage than the rest of us.

How your opinion is any formed any differently from the rest of us, I'm not quite sure. But this topic is surely dead by now, having been beaten into submission on both sides, with nary the twain meeting in the middle.

[chicgail]

Linus, consider that we're all judgmental as human beings - not just here, but everywhere. I know that it's noble to deny it, but frankly I have point of view about everything and so do you - including your point of view about Ruth's point of view about Heather's point of view about Beverly. etc. etc.

And of course our opinion is based on what we see on the show. What else do we have to go on?

I don't know of anyone here who is actually on the set and sees everything that goes on that never makes it to the screen.

If you have opinions that are based on something other than what you see on the screen coupled with your own "previously held prejudices, experiences, etc.", I'd love to know what those are.

[chowser]

What do you draw your opinions on for this show?

[linus]

i don't understand why others are putting words in my mouth.

i merely said a) calling everyone here "judgmental," in the sense judgmental can mean, "Having or displaying an excessively critical point of view." (one common online definition) is an inaccurate generalization.
and
b) stating everyone here SOLELY bases their opinion on what they see on the show is an inaccurate generalization.

[chowser]

It's the nature of reality tv. The show edits what they want you to see and viewers follow. If contestants don't want that, don't go on. But, we all draw the line on what's acceptable on being judgemental and what's not. I wonder if your opinions, that you've drawn on the show and contestants, might be considered "judgemental". Is it judgemental to call Heather a bully and mean spirited? Is it judgemental to call Bev weak and unable to defend herself? Is it judgemental to say Ty-Lor should have stayed away from the ER? Or, are those opinions?

Your definition of judgemental differs from what I think of it as, which is (from google):

"A value judgment is a judgment of the rightness or wrongness of something, or of the usefulness of something, based on a personal view. "

That's very similar to an opinion, in my opinion/judgement. And, in the case of Webster:

" the process of forming an opinion or evaluation by discerning and comparing"

[linus]

i don't understand what you're saying or what you're asking me in regards to my post.

[chowser]

Yeah I was trying to figure out what you were saying in response to my post (that an opinion and a judgement weren't that different and we all have them) and misunderstood.

[ladybugthepug]

Does anyone think we can get this sumbitch up to 1000 comments about this subject before Wednesday's episode? I think we can! There's still plenty of life we can beat out of this dead horse people!!!!

[KailuaGirl]

Too good! LOL...

[LindaWhit]

LOL ladybug! I think this particular thread's length more than makes up for the poor showing of under 100 posts for Episode 4 on the night before Thanksgiving. Not that anyone had anything to do that night or the next day or anything. :-)

[momjamin]

Hey -- there was a Thanksgiving knife injury, right, Linda? Which seems to be in line with this season! (Hope you're healing well...)

[John E.]

Linda, when I saw this episode I thought to myself that the thread on it would be short because i thought it was a fairly boring and uneventful episode. How wrong I was. I also got curious about past seasons of Top Chef and did a search. Is it possible I found the first recap you ever did to start a Top Chef thread? (Season 3 Episode 3)

It was surprising how few of the Chowhounds that posted back then are active now. (I was not one of them. I'm relatively new here, my first posting was March 2010). I'm guessing that besides yourself I might have recognized only a two or three other usernames.

[LindaWhit]

I'll have to search for the TC3 threads, John. I think back at that time, several people were doing recaps or starting "live blogging" threads. We also had a bit of a different format - someone would start the thread, and lots of us would then add to it as the show was going on in separate posts. But there wasn't a "full recap" as I've been doing recently.

[chowser]

LOL. I'll bet Bev brings her newborn to fancy restaurants and lets her toddler run wild and make a mess and THEN undertips! That'll do it.;-) Point taken--I should have bowed out long on in this discussion.

[dmjordan]

I was just thinking that i was glad that a new episode is on tonight. Maybe we can take a break on the Heather/Bev/shrimp situation and whether TyLor REALLY needed stitches. Oops, just remembered that Heather & Bev are working together tonight!

[linus]

i would agree an opinion and a judgment aren't that different. however, i think judgment and judgmental are two different things; judgmental, for me, carries...a pejorative element, i guess.
thus, my point was, yes, everyone makes judgments about this show. however, not everyone is judgmental about it.

[chowser]

I agree-- I think my point, that got lost in all my verbiage, is that we all draw the line at different places on what is judgemental and what isn't. There are the obvious extremes that are easy to tell (eg. calling someone unworthy because of appearance) but there are many shades of gray. We all make judgements; at what point does it become judgemental?

[Ruth Lafler]

Enough with the crying! Crying may be annoying, but crying in the stands at the rodeo doesn't affect anyone in any way. Unlike calling someone out in front of her colleagues.

[John E.]

From a viewer's standpoint I was more annoyed at Beverly's several episodes of weeping than I was at Heather's bossiness although truth be told I don't really care much about either one of them. I don't recall if in past seasons (discounting All Stars) I had a favorite at this point.

[chowser]

I agree--neither are endearing qualities but calling someone out is worst. I'd rather just not see either in a professional setting. If I were on a business trip and someone were crying about missing her family, I don't know what I'd do. I don't like Heather; I'm just not convinced she's as bad as her edits anymore than you're convinced Bv isn't as bad as her edits. It has been argued that people dislike Heather for being assertive and they hate seeing women be assertive so they call her a bitch, as a sexist argument.

[linus]

i guess what i find surprising is any regular reader of this part of chowhound only now discovering this "judgmental" behaviour.

[LindaWhit]

Ruth, you could see at least 3 others standing that the long meat counter, including regular shoppers not in the competition. And does it MATTER how many people were there - even if it were just the other cheftestants? WHY does she get to say "I'm important here, and I have to be served first!" and it's OK?

[KailuaGirl]

I'm with you, Linda. I was really astonished that she (or anyone) would behave that way. I actually like Beverly but find some of her actions so off-putting that I have to try to re-evaluate.

[fara]

I think it's pretty clear that Heather picks on Bev because she's weaker than her, as in she won't fight back the way others would. They've portrayed Bev to be this kind of open, maybe slightly immature woman who doesn't have the toughness of Heather. I see nothing wrong with what Bev's done vs the rest of the cast. Heather on the other hand, gets on my nerves complaining about everyone.

[huiray]

Tom Colicchio's blog is up. Bravo "merely" put the wrong blogger ID on it. (Not a surprise, given Bravo's past "competence")
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

[LindaWhit]

And Tom C. says what many here have been saying for the past few weeks!

"The reason we were so harsh at Judges' Table is that the chefs were complacent and wouldn’t take risks, so they didn’t create dishes worthy of this competition. This group of chefs, more than in any season prior, seemed to be thinking about how to win the game, and at this early stage, seemed to be saying to themselves, “Hey! Just don’t go home! Stay in the middle of the pack until the end. Then step it up.” Like pacing oneself in a marathon. And with a dinner for 200, yes, they could say, “That’s a lot of people -- let’s play it safe.” But they could have been far more creative than they were. "

[huiray]

The link to Tom Colicchio's blog has been corrected by Bravo. The new link is:
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

[Withnail42]

This seems like a challenge were the wheels just sort of came off. Raw potatoes, six hours to do shrimp bad organization in general.Looks like heather is being pegged to be the villain. But he does have a point about the shrimps taking so long. However thought shouting pout 'Who wants to take a ride in my new car?' upon entering the stew room after winning was obnoxious. No one like a bad winner.

Still routing for Shara. she seems like a strong contender do far.

[bobbert]

Well, the judges are starting to get pissed because the chefs have been playing not to lose vs. cooking to win. I think we're going to start to see people being sent home having cooked “good" food that is just not top chef material.

I think this group is as close to a season of Survivor as I've ever seen. With a few exceptions, just about everyone is out for themselves and will throw others under the bus.

The Heather/Beverly dynamic is interesting. I don't like Heather because I think she is not to be trusted. She's being a witch to Beverly BUT she's got a point in her assessment - I just think she could somehow communicate it a bit more tactfully. All Beverly did was shrimp - 6 hours to clean and poach 400 shrimp? Yeah, Heather's got a point.

The most stand-up guy of the night was definitely Ty-Lor. I understand why he went with his cooking method although I'm not sure I would have done the same. He was also cooking on charcoal BBQ grills vs. a restaurant grill where you would have very even temps throughout your surface - I have trouble evenly cooking half a dozen hamburgers on a charcoal grill. With that in mind, marking the steaks on the grill and finishing in an even-temp oven might not have been a bad idea. As Cowboy points out up-thread, the problem with the steaks all coming out uneven really wasn't HIS fault - it was the fault of Lindsay and Heather - the two who were expediting - along with those helping to finish the steaks. They are the ones that really blew it. Ty took all the blame - I think almost all of the others would have been pointing fingers - he has my respect for not doing so although I believe he could have made a legit case for blaming others. Finally, 13 supposedly TOP chefs could not find 6 or 8 medium rare steaks to serve the judges??? Give me a break. Conspiracy against Ty to save themselves or just total incompetence? I'm not sure which but boy does that stink.

In the end - raw potatoes. As Tom says, that was an easy one.

[xo_kizzy_xo]

I was discussing this episode elsewhere, and somebody mentioned the "Survivor" tactic as to why s/he is not liking this season thus far. I can definitely see that, now that I think about it: When otherwise competent chefs are sent to LCK for errors that would have been perhaps overlooked in previous seasons, there's incentive to adopt a Survivor-type mindset.

LCK = Redemption Island, TC style.

[LindaWhit]

BUT....those who are still in the competition have NO idea about Last Chance Kitchen. They think when they're gone, they're gone. Whereas the Survivors know about Redemption Island.

[Worldwide Diner]

Finally, 13 supposedly TOP chefs could not find 6 or 8 medium rare steaks to serve the judges???
***
Ty-Lor wasn't there to do the final plating. So the others were totally throwing him under the bus by not serving the medium rare steaks to the judges.

[bobbert]

Exactly... and the guy is a class act for taking full responsibility when there were (many) others who had their dirty, guilty hands in there as well. Would Heather have done the same???

[Joanie]

I agree with your TyLor comments, I was surprised there was no mention of all the hands on the steak. And yes, could you not find properly cooked ones for the judges.

I'm not as put off by Heather's brusqueness as some others, she makes a valid point about Beverly (altho I agreed with B last week when she said they all made messes while cooking). I just don't like her that much for other reasons nor Lindsay the Martha Plimpton look alike. I was surprised about the cake comment cuz that cake seemed quite different from the 15 year old's party but was probably the same base.

The guest judge is probably some super great chef but he seemed like he should be on a Jimmy Dean sausage commercial to me.

I haven't watched any of the Last Chance Kitchens but do all the chefs hang around and watch subsequent cookoffs like that preview showed?

[mariacarmen]

no, that was the first time. seemed like added pressure, to me.

i agree about Tylor too - very honorable of him, and dishonorable of all the other chefs to not say they had a hand - or should have - with the steaks. I thought Lindsay, although she screwed up, was at least thinking for the team in believing the steaks should have been flashed (too early, turned out.)

[LindaWhit]

This was the first time they had the kicked off cheftestants watching the LCK cookoff, Joanie.

Perhaps the guys asked the producers to be able to watch, since they're just sitting around in their eviction house waiting for the filming to be over? Once you make it to LCK, there's no going back, so it's not like they'd be revealing anything to the TC cheftestants, since they (those still on the show) don't know anything about LCK until they're told to PYKAG.

[roxlet]

And I think it was stand up of Ty-Lor (OK, what's with that name?) not to attempt to throw anyone under the bus. It was his part of the meal, and he was prepared to take the rap for it. And he didn't do a 'poor me' about his hand and having spent the entire night in the hospital.

[babette feasts]

Lindsay fired the steaks. I don't know if it's commendable or just dumb of Ty-Lor not to mention that at judges table. He needed way better backup on the most important part of the meal.

[moto]

a very curious episode indeed. does the American Cancer Society there depend on the cattle barons because the diet/drugs of the cattle they raise and habitually consume increase the cancer rates in their subculture ?

the 'chefs' seemed to be in a depressed state. three guys eliminated, the Moto sous chef, the Bayless protegee, and the gentle Carolina giant, if nothing else were good for the group chemistry. they were supposed to work as a group in sections, but the collaborative spirit seemed missing -- are they that traumatized already from standing in the losers' groups before the judges ? timing the entree steaks properly clearly required collaboration and collective effort, and the most elementary step would have been to establish how much time it took between the initial firing of the meat and completing its plating for service.

rather pathetic that the cake won the car when beef was supposed to be the star of the meal -- the judges would be justified for not awarding any first prize.

the set up for the last chance kitchen didn't appear to be fair -- they should either have to cook with the identical raw protein, or have several to choose between with a coin flip for first choice.

[LindaWhit]

Good point about not using the same protein in LCK, moto. But either way - both meats were lean, so there was that similarity.

[jcattles]

"rather pathetic that the cake won the car when beef was supposed to be the star of the meal -- the judges would be justified for not awarding any first prize."

That's pretty much what I said to my family. She won for making cake in a steak competition. Either the cake was that good or the steaks were that bad.

[soupkitten]

when nyesha was put into the winner's circle for: compound butter-------that really tells you something. like, the whole meal musta really been awful. compound butter is so basic and elementary it's like saying "nice bread crumb and parsley topping on that casserole, dude!"

[DougRisk]

While I don't really disagree, she was more highlighted for not making any mistakes. She made the compound butter, which, if I remember, involved incorporating Bone Marrow and a Wine Reduction into the butter. It is not the most complicated thing in the world, but you need to rinse and roast and clean a lot of bone marrow before incorporating them into the butter.

Plus, she also made some sort of sauce that they enjoyed.

[moto]

from what the producers chose to show us, Nyesha didn't share credit for her compound butter with Ty, who cut himself badly prepping the marrow ; she could have helped someone who'd helped her gain the judges' kudos but apparently stayed mum.

[John E.]

This is repetition of a point made already but we don't know whether Nyesha mentioned Ty-Lor at JT or not. The contestants are standing there for apparently hours while they shoot video and it is edited down to just a few comments.

[chowser]

We also have no idea how much Ty-Lor helped before he was whisked away. Was he just scooping marrow and doing the prep stuff? Does every chef up there mention who helped w/ prep and plating when you're working as a team? Plus, they divided labor so she was left doing it all herself. It reminds me of when Jaime left because of her injury and Jen was left doing all the work they should have done together. Only Jen didn't fare well.

[gaffk]

Except Ty-Lor wasn't whisked away. He had it bandaged and worked until prep time was up. Then he went to the ER.

[davis_sq_pro]

Anyone happen to know what species of animal crawled up Heather's back side and died there?

[LindaWhit]

LOL! Hence, the Queen of Mean moniker she was given. :-)

[Siun]

I dine at her restaurant frequently and kitchen is open and Chef Terhune is always in view with her crew - one reason I became such a fan of her restaurant when it opened was the obvious good spirit in her kitchen - it's clearly superbly run but also a genuinely happy team. Quite the opposite of any mean.

And as someone else noted, I'm no pro but I could prep 400 shrimp in way less time. Beverly always seems to be only looking out for herself - thinking of that Whole Foods scene the other week for example ... Quite different from Chef Terhune getting her cake done and then stepping up to expedite.

[LindaWhit]

Siun, I used the term given her by the Top Chef preview. That's it. I have no personal knowledge of what she is or isn't like.

[chicgail]

I think Siun was just commenting on the discrepancy between how Heather appeared to be behaving on the episode and how she occurs in her restaurant (I've seen here there also). Elves at work?

[LindaWhit]

Those Rascally Elves and their Magical Editing Machines! They've NEVER edited to create a "character," have they? ;-)

[LurkerDan]

It's also possible that at her restaurant, there's a defined hierarchy that everyone operates in. Whereas on TC, there is none, and she has a tough time adjusting to behavior of others that she can't control because she isn't their boss.

[californiabeerandpizza]

Agreed - they don't take orders from her. It seems we have a lot of non-confrontational chefs so I think we will see that most of them end up ignoring her and her constant yapping. Whereas if Dale T. was in the mix it might be different atmosphere.

[huiray]

@ calibeer: I think it would be very entertaining indeed to have Dale Talde there having a face-down with Heather. :-)

[John E.]

Don't you remember Top Chef All-Stars? We saw a kinder and gentler Dale. He did not like what he saw on TC4 and went to anger management. The Dale Talde from TC4 would have been disqualified from TC8 for clocking Marcel Vigneron.

[huiray]

Yes, that's true. So...let's say it would be very entertaining to be able to see Season 4 Dale Talde on TC Texas!

[yummfood]

I miss Dale T. haha, he was quite the character! He was great on TC All Stars and I think he got sent to PYKAG earlier than he should have.

[huiray]

@ LD: Just what I was thinking. In Sable (her home restaurant) she's the Queen Bee. Everyone else says "How High, Ma'am" when she snaps "Jump" at them. On TC, all the chefs are supposed to be her equals and she can't order them around.

[LindaWhit]

On TC, all the chefs are supposed to be her equals and she can't order them around.
~~~~~~~~~~~
As much as she seems to want to do so.

[Siun]

No criticism of you meant Linda ... Really appreciate your recaps each week!

So often on TopChef we've seen group challenges where no one stepped up to get everything complete and served (thinking of the Dim Sum mess for example). I think real chefs step up and lead - Queen Bee's laze about (or just clean shrimp) and expect everyone else to pick up the slack in a team challenge. Expediters inevitably "order" people around - that's how the food gets served ... and of course elves love to create drama.

[LindaWhit]

And sorry for my interpretation of your post, Siun.

The group challenges where no one steps up is exactly what Tom C noted on his Bravo blog. But there *is* a way to get people to do what you want them to do. I know in a restaurant kitchen, it's an autocracy, not democracy. I just think that Heather went about it the wrong way. I wonder what she'd do if Paul or Edward or Chris J. took the reins and started telling *her* what to do. Perhaps we'll get to see in a later episode.

[mcf]

Now *that* would be very informative!