Should pizza be allowed to burn eventhough it is baked in a coal oven?

[asianteasets]

I just got back from eating pizza at Totonno's Pizzeria on Neptune Avenue near Stillwell Avenue in Coney Island, where it is reported to have really great pizza. I hadn't been there since the 80's, so I thought that I would like to try and see if it was still as good as it was then ( even though they burned the underside of the crust. Well, of course their prices went up, and the pie got much smaller.

When the pie was brought to the table I could see that the crust hadn't bubbled up, which I was always used to when eating at a really good pizzeria. When I lifted up a slice it was stiff and bendable and it was really burnt on the bottom. I remembered that when I was last there it was also burnt bunt nothing like this. When I asked the waitress if they always burnt the crust, her retort was that that is way it was supposed to be because it is baked in a coal oven, and that she know pizza. I didn't want to argue with her so I just left, and decided to post this here to get a consensus of opinions.

.

-----
Totonno's Pizzeria Napolitano
1524 Neptune Ave, Brooklyn, NY 11224

[tex.s.toast]

I ate at totonnos for the second time in as many months last week and thought the pies were really on point - if anything i wouldnt have minded a bit more char on each of the two pies we go. The sauce is really great, the cheese excellent, and the balance between those two elements and the crust was great.

Just to be clear, did you eat your pizza? (you mention lifting the slice and complaining that it had been overcooked, but did you actually taste excessive char?) I'll grant that the service is extremely surly, its just not clear to me from you post if you complained based on the appearance of the pie or the taste.

im not sure what you mean by stiff and bendable, those seem to be opposite descriptors, in my view.

Also, what does a crust which has "bubbled up" have to do with the over-charring? I noticed in our most recent visit that the large pie we ordered didnt seem to have the same puff to the crust that the pictures of the pies in the news clippings on the wall did - perhaps they have changed the crust or it wasnt at its puffiest that day - although on our medium pizza there did to be some more volume to the cornicione/bones, it was discrepant enough from our first pizza (a large) that we speculated that they might even use the same amount of dough for both sizes but the smaller stretch of the small pie left more dough for the outer rim.

I will say there does seem to be some relationship between coal pies and well-done crusts - made it to pepe's in new haven for the first time this summer and experienced pies so well-done that they were likely seconds away from being garbage (some in our party didnt care for the ultra charred bones, but i thought they were pretty delicious). maybe this is just all a matter of taste?

[sugartoof]

I actually welcome the return of more charring. I associate it with the best pizzas I've had, and you don't get it on a standard NY slice, or fast food pizza. I know it's a pretty specific thing though, and for some, it's like being served burnt toast.

Then again, it's possible the OP got a burnt pizza, and just confused us by discussing the merits of charring, etc.

[JFores]

I've been eating at Totonno's a lot more than Di Fara in recent years (karma?) and I've actually had really consistent experiences. They've never messed up any of my orders, but I could see it happening. It's also still pretty hot out so the chance of burning a pie in any oven is a lot higher (go to Di Fara for a daily demo.)

-----
Di Fara Pizza
1424 Avenue J, Brooklyn, NY 11230

Totonno's Pizzeria Napolitano
1524 Neptune Ave, Brooklyn, NY 11224

[loratliff]

I like char and have noticed that most pizzas in the city seem to have quite a bit of it. I don't know if it's a trend or a recent development, but many of the older good places that have coal ovens (e.g., John's) all serve pies with a fair bit of it.

[sugartoof]

A couple things going on here....

You may just not like that much char, in which case, places newer style places like Motorino are more your style, with a wetter center crust, some darkness, but not a full on char. I personally love char, and can't get enough. I'm in the minority though.

Next, I think the concept of New York pizza, or a New York slice has changed since the 80's, and they're trying to offer a hybrid of styles to keep up, which in the end don't work for their own style pizza. If the ovens get older and you want to crisp your crust, it means leaving it in longer than you should.

Finally, it could just be that Totonno's has gone down hill. You wouldn't be the first to report as much.

-----
Motorino
349 E 12th St, New York, NY 10003

[asianteasets]

I really appreciate the fact that people are taking the time to write a comment on my post. I would like to mention that it black on the bottom. Not just a little here, but really black. on the bottom. I tried scrapping it off; I could do this because the crust was so stiff; which was another thing that I had never seen before. Eating all that carbon is not a healthy thing to do. And at $16.50 for a very small pie, I thought was a little pricey.

By the way, when I meant that the crust was stiff, I meant that you could not bend it ( as people usually do ) without it breaking.

[tex.s.toast]

i dont think recommending Motorino to anyone averse to char is a good idea (and its my favorite pizza in nyc)

I guess it depends on whether the char-aversion is a flavor-based or texture based issue; motorino's pies have deeply smoky flavors of almost overdone toast, but they are at the same time puffy and soft in texture. the extra crispy well done parts of most coal oven pizzas, in my experience, have brittle, crackly textures very very different from the dark char on a Motorino pie.

-----
Motorino
349 E 12th St, New York, NY 10003

[sugartoof]

You just summed up why I did suggest Motorino, since the OP indicated some type of charring is okay. It's char as an accent, not a burnt bottom hard crust.

I prefer Keste actually, and they're pretty light on the char in my experience.

-----
Motorino
349 E 12th St, New York, NY 10003