Why do people often not tip for Chinese take-out?

[kpaxonite]

Why do people often not tip for Chinese take-out even though they tip for virtually every other kind of take-out....

[Bill Hunt]

I do not know. I usually do, and also thank the folk, who put the order together.

Hunt

[josephnl]

I rarely have take-out food, but when I do it's at a local Chinese restaurant where I phone in my order and pick it up from a cashier who gets the order from the kitchen, and takes my money. Tipping her seems about as appropriate as tipping the checker at the supermarket. Thank you's are always in order, but honestly, tipping in this situation seems bizarre to me.

[josephnl]

I must be totally clueless, but I don't even understand this post. Except on the very rare occasion when the kitchen has done something extraordinary and very special for me, I never tip the kitchen. So therefore, why in the world would I even considery tipping for take-out food? When I eat at a restaurant I am a very generous tipper...usually at least 20%, and for good service often 25%. These tips are for the servers...not for the kitchen. But for take-out food, I have never even thought of tipping. Who would this tip be for....and why would it be appropriate?

[jhopp217]

Wanted to add something to this, because it dawned on me the other day. I always go to the same place. I usually don't tip because the tip cup, if visible at all, is almost hidden away. That being said, when I order it delivered (which is exactly 1/4 mile from my house. I always over-tip (IMO) for the trouble. If it's raining or snowing, I always throw in an extra $1-2

[Disneyfreak]

I don't tip for take out. Never thought about it really. I do tip for delivery and for waitress/waiter service of course.

[Mpulvers]

I think I started tipping for takeout when I noticed how hard working the women were at the takeout counter of our best local Chinese restaurant. I rarely figured out a percentage, but simply handed two folded singles to the woman who handed me the package (after she checked to see all items were included and properly packaged). These women hustle for hours on end.
Now, I pretty much do that whenever I pick up food from a restaurant, unless there is a good reason not to. I think good service and hard work (with, unfortunately, inferior pay) deserve recognition. Not to introduce a disparate topic, but I also tip the hotel room-cleaning
staff.

[thew]

always tip the hotel staff! preferable on a daily basis, but at least 1st night and last (last covering all the days in between)

[James Cristinian]

I see lots of justification for not tipping. The bottom line is, even if these folks are not working for tips, they surely are not making big bucks working the checkout station, or another part of the staff. If they can get an extra four or five bucks a night, it mignt help them get some gas money for the rest of the week. If you can afford to eat take out, you can afford an extra dollar for the hard woking staff.

[Roland Parker]

Why restrict it to people at takeaway places? Supermarket cashiers often work just as long hours, almost always on their feet the entire time, and yet we don't tip them, do we? What about store clerks? There's plenty of service positions that require long hours and they don't receive tips.

As much as I'm aware of the comparatively hard physical toil that takeaway places require, I am going to save my tips for when I actually receive service. Otherwise it's not unreasonable for me to assume that the cost of the food is sufficient contribution towards the salary requirements of the person selling me the food.

[thew]

i tip when i sit. i tip when it's delivered. i rarely tip when i pick it up myself

[jgg13]

Likewise. When I pick it up myself, i'll sometimes leave something in the now ubiquitous tip jar, but only in the circumstances that i'd normally utilize a tip jar (which isn't very common and involves me really wanting to show extra appreciation for some reason)

[bagelman01]

Prejudice-Bigotry-Racism

Before anyone jumps on this I must relate a story from my young adulthood 40+ years ago.

I went to have Chinese food for lunch with my grandfather in lower Manhattan. He was then in his 70s. The lunch bill came to about $10. He left a 50 cent tip. I was surprised, as gramps was always a big tipper and service had been excellent. I put an additional dollar on the table which he could not see. Tipping at that time was average 10%.

That night I asked my father about this low 5% tip. My father explained the rationale> The Chinese restaurant staff lived 10 to a room provided by management, were provided with meals and uniforms and didn't have wives and children living with them. As such, they had low expenses and were to be tipped according to their needs, not the size of the check. Dad had grown up in New York in the days of a 15 cent Chinese chow mein or chop suey luncheon with no tipping.

The anti-Chinese prejudice continues over the years and this is just one way it manifests itself.

i am particularly tuned in, as my wife and I have a daughter from China. in our case it gets us better service, seating and menus at Chinese restaurants.

As fr my own tipping habits at take out joints, they have already been posted down thread.

[fourunder]

The anti-Chinese prejudice continues over the years and this is just one way it manifests itself.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

very true words when applied to many ethnic groups,..... where any type of service is given.

Thanks for sharing.

[wincountrygirl]

I do not tip for any take out. If I get delivery, I tip the person who brings the food.

[ttoommyy]

Perhaps a wait person can expand on this, but I seem to remember from my days as a waiter that in restaurants where a server rings up the take out order a tip should be included because the POS register systems used in restaurants figure out the income tax taken from a waiter's pay based on the dollar amount of the food served and estimated tips based on this amount. If a waiter rings up a good share of take out orders one night but does not have tips in accordance with the amount of food sold, I would think that wait person may be taxed on more than he actually made that night.

I have not waited tables in years and my memory is sort of blurry, but I seem to think what I've written above has some credence to it.

[ErnieD]

I get takeout very very rarely. I generally throw down a 10% or so if I do, but that comes to MAYBE $10 a year in tips, probably less, so I really don't have a horse in this race. That being said, most people I know don't, so this system people keep referring to where servers are being taxed or tipping out others based on sales seems kind of insane. And I'm not sure what the expectation of the customer is meant to be here-are we supposed to be asking about the pay and job duty structure at every restaurant we order takeout from? I have sympathy if people are getting their income calculated unfairly, but expecting people to figure out the particulars of a restaurant's structural underpinnings and then tip accordingly seems like a recipe for disappointment.

[Roland Parker]

I never tip for takeaway.

When you sit down at a proper table in a restaurant, you are being served by a waiter/waitress. That's who the tip is really for, not for the chef or anyone else in the restaurant. In short the tip is for the service, not for the food. In the old days when there was considerably more "service" everwhere, it was expected to tip whenever you received a service - bellboys, delivery boys, gast station attendants and so on.

When you're picking up takeaway you are not getting service from the restaurant. You're merely picking up a bag of food. Think of it this way: do you tip the cashier at the supermarket? No. Do you tip the boy who carries your groceries to your car (at the few places that still have them)? Yes, because he's providing a service. Do you tip the salesman at a clothing store cash register, even though what he/she does is essentially no different than the cashier at a restaurant? No.

Tips are really meant to reflect the service being provided, not the goods being exchanged.

[Asomaniac]

To an outsider like myself, the US tipping culture seems bizarre. The tips people expect in restaurants in places like NYC for example are ridiculously large (20% instead of 10% or less anywhere else in the world), and in addition to restaurants, in the US you seem to be expected to tip people absolutely anywhere just for doing their job (coffee place, etc). After a week in New York I got so used to tipping being everywhere that as a reflex I almost tipped a random person in the street for giving me directions.

Despite the big tips people can expect, service is quite often not particularly good. Service in restaurants is often very fake, too, very obviously only geared towards tips. I realise that the waiters are there to make money and don't work for fun. But service is a lot less fake and more heartfelt in Japan, where I live, and where tips don't really exist. They treat you well because they take pride in doing a good job in addition to earning their wage. Like everyone else, I also worked as a waiter when I was a student and it came naturally, as it does to most people, to automatically be freindly to the restaurant guests if they were not unfriendly to me. So I find this very obviously fake friendliness for tips only quite off-putting.

I still tip the 20% when I visit NYC as I accept that that is how they do things there and I am a guest who should adapt to local customs. What I find harder to accept is that when service is downright rude - does not happen often - and in such circumstances I only give 10% (still way too much if the waiter is not doing his/her job at all), waiters in the US have the cheek to question the level of tip after providing very poor service (even running after you once you have exited the restaurant). Why on earth do they expect to get a 20% tip after poor, lazy and unfriendly service as a matter of course? Tips are meant to reflect the service provided, but very often the waiters simply want their 20% tip for just being there. In Paris, service is often impossibly rude, but they don't have the cheek to then also demand a 20% tip...

As I said, I live in Japan where tipping does not exist (except that sometimes a 10% service charge is added to the bill so does not go to the individual waiter, and even this service charge is rare), and yet service tends to be superior to service in the US. Very odd.

I understand that in many instances there is basically a pretty exploitative system in the US where the servers are paid very little so need to make up the shortfall with tips. Still, the tipping culture has spread like a virus beyond the reasonable rationale to help out people who earn very low hourly wages with good tips . Also, in the whole "will work for tips" thing, many servers seem to have forgotten the "will work for" bit.

[thew]

you say you understand the system, but clearly you dont - waiters in paris don't demand a large tip because they are payed an amount commensurate with people in other jobs and the cost of living. in the US waiters get a lower wage than anyone else, as the tip is part of their wage. SO they expect to get a tip, because without it, they can't live.

then you want them to be friendly, but not fake friendly. they don;t know you, so thy arent your friend, they work hard jobs, and might not feel friendly to people who happily give them 10%.

it is very simple to understand... the food costs 20% more than it says - that 20% (+ whatever portion of the price goes to salary) is the waiters. that is all. It is no different from paris or japan, except you control the waiters paycheck, not the restaurant.

so to dock them half their pay from your meal because they were unfriendly - well - that's why theyre unfriendly

[Asomaniac]

You seem to imply you have read and understood my post, but you clearly haven't. I have very clearly said that I would give the 10% when they are downright rude, which as I said does not happen often. The fake-friendly thing is something I don't enjoy, but I still give the 20%, as I said.

If however they are particularly unfriendly and downright rude I don't see why I should tip them an exorbitant amount. If people in other jobs behave like this to their clients, they will lose their jobs or get reprimands. Why is this any different?

I could see if they behaved like this because they have to deal with an arrogant, unfriendly or in some other way unpleasant customer - hard to stay friendly in the face of bad treatment. If the customer is polite and undemanding, I don't see any justification for rudeness. If you work in a service industry in whatever position and do not want to perform a minimum amount of service, perhaps you should not be surprised that you won't do very well.

Also, I should add that I am not talking about restaurants where 20% of the bill still comes out as not very much. I am for example talking about rude waiters in a restaurant where the bill came to 450 dollars for two people. That's a tip of 90 dollars for a total of about 10 minutes the waiter spent with us that evening. Each waiter has a lot of tables, and the grand total at the end of the evening is a lot of money, certainly more than if the waiter worked on a Japan or Paris salary plus tips according to local customs. If the restaurant does not add a percentage of the bill automatically to the bill as service charge, and the service was utterly crap and rude, I still fail to see why I should give that person 20% (or in the above case, almost 100 dollars) for the privilege. Interestingly, all my experiences of spectacularly rude and/or arrogant service were in expensive restaurants where waiters who can expect to make 20% tips will make lots of money, in cheaper ones so far service has been normal.

[thew]

i agree with most of what you say

what i'm saying is if you think 20% is exorbitant you are seem to missing how large a part of their income it is in the US, as opposed to japan or paris or anyplace else.

i know i'm glad my clients don't to get to choose my salary

[markqin]

Asomaniac, this is a great discussion you gave on tipping in general. I sign-up for chowhound just so I can reply to your message to let you know. Most service is fake friendliness, it is not a true desire to provide good service, but a true desire to get a bigger tip. Unfortunate that the system is set up like this. Tips are definitely expected, and it doesn't seem like the customer has descretionary judgement about tipping. I also like how you said you almost tipped a person for giving you direction. That was pretty funny!

[josephnl]

If a server is truly rude (which is fortunately very very rare), I let the management know and tip nothing. A truly rude server has no business being in the profession.

[bagelman01]

getting back toi the specific question of this thread, tipping for Chinese Food takeout.

"A truly rude server has no business being in the profession." The kid at the counter bagging yoiur order and taking your money is NOT in a profession. One of our local Chinese takeouts has a rude 17 year old male at the counter at night. I happen to know him, he goes to school with my daughter. He doesn't want to be there. He'd like to participate in High School sports and date, BUT his family requires him to work many hours each week for little or no pay. Yes, slavery/servitude does exist in family run takeaway joints. Complaining to his parents that he is rude won't help, they don't speak or understand much English.

[josephnl]

I generally would not tip someone just "bagging my order". I always tip servers except as I said, on the very rare occasion when one might be truly rude.

[tommy]

From where did you get this analysis?

I was more under the impression that people generally don't tip on take-out period.

[kpaxonite]

As I mentioned earlier in this thread

"http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/3836...
I don't want to call anyone out but look at April 1, 2007 (it isn't an April fools joke..

)

I have seen similar comments in other threads but this one stood out
"

And to be more specific I don't tip at fast food joints this was in reference to places that are generally or at least 50 percent sit down

[tommy]

Are Chinese take-out joints generally 50 percent sit down?

As noted above by Karl S, people who work for tips (servers, bartenders) are often tipped. People at cash registers make at least minimum wage, and tipping isn't "required."

Customers who don't tip servers on take-out are probably not being as gracious as they could be, given the societal norms around tipping people who make 2 dollars an hour.

I hope your question has been answered.

[ErnieD]

That post also mentioned that he doesn't tip in pizzerias unless he knows the employee. And even if the poster had said he tips for every other type of takeout, it's one a four year old post. I think it's kind of stretch to imply that people "often" tip for every kind of takeout except Chinese.

Tipping for takeout is not really customary in this country, although some people do so. I certainly wouldn't have assumed that post was an April Fools joke.

[tommy]

As some have mentioned, it's customary to those who understand that they probably should. But yes, many people don't seem to realize this.

[small h]

<As I mentioned earlier in this thread...>

And as I mentioned earlier in this thread, there's nothing in that post about not tipping at Chinese restaurants simply because they are Chinese restaurants. Why do you continue to insist that there's something there that isn't?

[kpaxonite]

Yes the thread I posted specifically mentions Chinese restaurants....

[small h]

Except nowhere in that thread does anyone say they tip on takeout except if it's Chinese takeout. And this thread bears it out.

Q. Why do people often not tip for Chinese take-out?
A. People usually don't tip for any kind of take-out, Chinese or otherwise.

You haven't provided any evidence whatsoever to support your hypothesis. Maybe it's time to let this go.

[tommy]

It would be difficult to not agree.

[dave_c]

"Why do people often not tip for Chinese take-out even though they tip for virtually every other kind of take-out...."

I would say that statement is not true.

People generally do not tip for any type of take-out while people do tip for delivery no matter what cuisine.

[Indy 67]

Admittedly, not a Chinese restaurant, but our local Japanese restaurant puts a line through the space next to the word "tip" on a charge receipt for take-out. No need to guess about tipping for take out at this place.

[ttoommyy]

I tip for delivery and never, ever for take out. I'm 50 years old and never realized people tipped on take out.

[MRS]

i'm 36 and didn't realize that take out wasn't delivery...oops! i thought if you pick it up that was your whim or something. Like, you had to have that place but they don't deliver so, you'll suck it up and go get it.

[ttoommyy]

No, takeout is very different from delivery. The former is not the result of the lack of the latter. (Did I just type that???) Many places where I live have both and advertise as such. The takeout trade is very brisk here becausee we are a small but over-populated town with a lot of pedestrian traffic going to and coming from work.

[bagelman01]

If I order food to go from a primarilly eat in restaurant, I am likely to tip, as a server is generally taking tome from their station and is usually paid less than minimum wages, and may have to tip-out other staff on the value of my order.

If I phone in an order to a take-a-way place, I do not tip, it doesn't matter if it is Chinese or not. Those employees are not paid sub minimum wage, did nopt provide special service and are no different than a clerk in any retail establishment who ring up a sale and hand me a parcel. In fact in most take-away Chinese in my area, the customer takes the sauces, napkins and utensils and puts them in the bag, not the employee.

None of this applies to delivery, for which I tip on all occasions.

[neel2004]

I don't tip for Chinese takeout because pretty much every Chinese restaurant I've picked up from has 90% of their business in carryout or delivery sales. The transaction involves the cashier (almost never a server) picking up the bag from the kitchen windows and handing it to me. There is no server involved, and no prep done by a server. More times than not, I have to ask for chopsticks, sauces, more than 1 napkin, etc.

That level of service at most Chinese take-out centric places is no different than a McDonalds -- sometimes even less because the meal comes already bagged from the kitchen.

I do tip for takeout at our local diner, chain steakhouse, or other overwhelmingly sit-down restaurant.

[sedimental]

This is my experience as well (in several different places). I have always been puzzled by some folks that talk about the servers getting a tip in this situation. I can't imagine why the kitchen staff would put the food on plates first- then pass it to the servers- to have the wait staff scrape it into containers???? Or are people saying that the servers come into the kitchen to walk around the staff -while they are cooking -to "dish it up"? I have never seen either.

The hostess takes the order on the phone, the kitchen staff place your food in pagoda style cardboard containers and plastic tubs. It is bagged up from the kitchen-and the hostess rings up the receipt- when you come in. There is no "service" or anyone taken off their regular duties. I see all take out restaurants do it this way, if they have *significant* take out business.

[Sooeygun]

People are referring to the server taking the order, bagging up the order, making sure there are napkins, cutlery, condiments, etc and then looking after the payment. The kitchen still 'plates' it, just into take out containers.

I have seen this at places that are primarily eat in, like the sushi place I go to. I do tip there (and the server usually brings a cup of green tea while I am waiting). At the Thai place where I get take out, I don't. They have a separate take out area with a separate cashier.

[sedimental]

Yes, "primarily eat in" is the operative phrase. This thread seems to be arguing something that rarely exists in most parts of the country. "Chinese Take Out" restaurants are pretty much geared up to serve take out in the most cost effective way possible. That would NOT be having servers answer the phones or bagging up orders.

[jgg13]

I'm always mystified by the whole "server answering phone & bagging order" thing that comes up in these threads. My assumption is that we're talking about people in the heartland, because it's not something I can ever recall seeing. Even places near me (boston) that do takeout as a side, the host(ess) will take the order and bring the food out from the kitchen. In a more bar-like setting, it'll typically be the bartender.

[Karl S]

Agreed. In my experience, it's extremely rare for a server to be doing this work. But I grant it's possible, so there's a variant on the normal custom for that circumstance.

[Sooeygun]

The places I get take out lunch don't have bartenders or hostesses. so it has to be servers looking after it.

[jhopp217]

Do you mean takeout or delivery? I only tip for takeout at one restaurant and that is because if I call at 8:01 it's ready by 8:04. It's a mexican place and is lightening fast. As for delivery, I usually tip a minimum of $5

[Karl S]

There are many many threads on the issue of tipping for takeout.

Let me bottomline it: tipping is for servers who are legally being paid at a lower minimum wage (and the US custom standard would generally be 15-20% for full service on pretax total including liquor/wine and gross of any coupon; 10% for buffet service). If you are getting takeout at a full service restaurant and it's a server who gives it to you and has to ring it up as their sale (which means there is IRS withholding for tip on their sale - this only became true in the past couple of decades, so it's an area of evolving custom), then you have a situation where a tip on takeout is worth discussing.

But, if it's a takeout place or a cashier or hostess (which are subject to a higher minimum wage), then you'd only tip if you were getting special service or trying to bribe for special service in the future; you can omit the tip without an ounce of guilt in such situations. That is the norm for Chinese and Italian take-out joints in many areas.

YMMV.

[tokyo]

Karl S explains it precisely as I understand it. Where I live, the take-out orders are prepared by kitchen staff- just put into boxes instead of plates- and brought out by a hostess. Neither of those positions rely on tips where I come from. Thus, no tipping is involved.
I used to be a hostess and never expected a portion of the servers tips, neither was I ever given a tip by a customer when I gave them their take-out order. It was part of my job, for which I was being paid a fair hourly wage.

[escondido123]

I've never tipped for food that I buy at a restaurant to take out. I am otherwise a generous tipper for both meals served in a restaurant or for meal delivery. But tipping for no service...I've never heard of that.

[rinkatink888]

I tip, around 10% for takeout, and since we generally do business with the usual Chinese restaurants, they remembered us and I think we get better service.

[rasputina]

People tip for take out? I tip for delivery or for sit down service but not for take out. Do you tip at the McDonalds drive through too?

[kpaxonite]

No but if I go to even a casual restaurant (not fast food and as many people get take out as people who eat there) I tip 100% of the time and think that not doing so is wrong (albeit tipping less than sit-down is in order..)

[mucho gordo]

This thread has gven me some 'food for thought'. There are 3 places I go to for take -out and all 3 know me yet I usually tip only 1 of them, sometimes 2. I don't remember if the Chinese place has a jar for tips but, there's no reason why I can't give the lady a couple of bucks. I just realized that there's really no difference between take-out and sit-down service. In both cases someone takes my order and brings it to me when ready. I do agree with tipping less for take-out.

[kpaxonite]

Exactly! With sit down service the tip is often also split with kitchen staff etc so I don't see why people wouldn't tip especially when the staff have to do the extra step of placing everything in take out containers...

[escondido123]

If there's a tip jar out I usually do, but that's mainly at places where I actually sit down and eat after picking up my food at the counter. I never deliberately didn't tip at take out places, it just never even crossed by mind--and now my husband tells me he usually does so guess I'll change my ways.

[tommy]

Tips are often split with the kitchen staff? Not in my experience. Bus boys maybe, but not kitchen staff.

[LorenM]

Depends. I worked as a cook in a fine dining establishment some years ago and the waitstaff tipped the cooks and bussers. The bussers and bartenders tipped the dishwashers. It usually didn't amount to a whole lot but on days like Mother's Day and Valentines I would end up with about $80 or so in tips in addition to my wage.

That said, I don't tip for takeout either.

[tommy]

That doesn't qualify as "often" to my mind.

[LorenM]

It's not common but I wouldn't say it is (was) uncommon either- at least when I was in the business 15 years ago, it wasn't that uncommon as I had colleagues whose kitchens worked the same way with some variation. I think it was more common in higher end restaurants where tips were often a $100 or more.

[tommy]

Have you ever heard of anyone tipping at a McDonald's drive-through?

[im_nomad]

I have tipped at drive-through places lots of times. Usually just leaving the change from the dollar or what not, nothing to jaw-drop over. I was one of those chain restaurant workers once, so I empathize.

[MRS]

Sorry. Do you mean delivery food? We tip for every and any type of food we have delivered to our house, and sometimes extra in crap weather. believe me- it pays off when our order gets put to the front of the line-up, and the delivery guy proves it by showing up ASAP at my door.

[thew]

take out is to-go. you pick it up. delivery is delivery

[small h]

I'm curious where you got the idea that people make the distinction between Chinese takeout and everything-else takeout. I might throw my change into the tip cup, maybe, but I don't normally tip for takeout. Not for Chinese, not for pizza, not for sandwiches.

[kpaxonite]

On this board there was someone in a thread writing about how they don't tip for Chinese take away...

[small h]

Care to provide the link? Maybe there's an explanation lurking in the thread.

[kpaxonite]

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/3836...
I don't want to call anyone out but look at April 1, 2007 (it isn't an April fools joke..

)

I have seen similar comments in other threads but this one stood out

[James Cristinian]

Take a look at April 1 post and then Bill Hunt's. Hunt, a class act. I always give a buck minimum, and plus the extra coins.

[small h]

If you're referring to jfood's post, there's nothing in there to indicate that he tips on takeout *unless* it's Chinese takeout. He doesn't tip on takeout unless he knows the kid behind the counter, or unless his order is prepared by someone whose primary job in the restaurant is tip-dependent (server, bartender). It has nothing to do with the type of food served by the establishment.

[ediblover]

I'm consistent. I don't tip takeout. So, I don't tip for Chinese takeout.

I say, if you feel obligated to tip, don't tip. If you feel that the person did a wonderful job and really contributed to you having a good time and WANT to tip, tip. This situation is pretty much impossible with a takeout where the interaction is measured in seconds.

[rockandroller1]

"I'm consistent. I don't tip takeout. So, I don't tip for Chinese takeout."

THIS

[chicgail]

Me, too.

[Harters]

Where I am in the world, folk would be amazed if anyone even considered tipping for take-out.

[S_K]

Ditto.

[ipsedixit]

I didn't realize they didn't. Shame on them.

[Atahualpa]

Is this genrally so?