high end dining in thailand, laos, cambodia, vietnam, malaysia/singapore - 6 weeks

[pinstripeprincess]

i hate people who do this, but i promise i'll sift through the board more later... but can anyone help me out with high end/fine dining in thailand, laos, cambodia, vietnam and malaysia/singapore?

the food is cheap over there so i'm not as concerned with street/market/stall/small shop food right now as much as anything that i might need a reservation for and would be making an "investment" in. i'll definitely check out the asian blogs like chubby hubby for ideas.

so yeah... what places are doing interesting fine dining work?

thanks so much!

[pinstripeprincess]

just thought i'd update everyone... this is a plan as i go kind of trip so bangkok is the only place i've made any reservations for. i've noted down the other suggestions but probably won't reach a single one until 2-3 weeks into my trip.

i've made reservations for nahm, sra bua and should have one for bo.lan. i really wanted to focus on thai fine dining as its nothing i would get at home and wasn't sure if the continental/euro places took advantage of the unique ingredients in thailand to create a potentially really amazing fusion. also just noticed that sukhumvit 38 is a late night stall area (until 3am) so i'm going to do an early dinner at bo.lan... hang out in this party nabe then check out the high in the sky bar at long bar and then at the end of the night make it out towards soi 38. am curious as to why bo.lan didn't come up in this conversation though... the blog that someone linked listed it as better than nahm for them.

[Melbourne Foodie]

Hi Pinstripe P,

Some quick info for you: We were in Thailand last year (for about the 5th time) and were getting a bit frustrated by the lack of critical restaurant reviewing (everywhere, inc down south).. after asking around, we were told that it is basically illegal to criticise someone's restaurant publicly. So you won't find any true restaurant reviews. They are mostly thinly veiled ads...

Are you planning on going to Luang Prabang? We were there a few years ago, L'Elephant is French/Laos cuisine, and while not fine dining, it's bistro food, Laos-style. We liked it. Tamarind for authentic Laos food in a restaurant environment. The night markets have some little laneways with stalls (graze as you go). Luang Prabang is amazing and definitely worth visiting.

We are going to Cambodia next year so I will keep an eye out for any recs!

[madcao]

I recently spent five weeks going through Singapore, Cambodia and Vietnam. I'm not generally interested in fine dining while traveling as I love street and local food, but here are two great places in Hanoi:

La Badiane
http://www.labadiane.hanoi.sitew.com
This lovely French restaurant the #1 restaurant on Tripadvisor. Their food is more modern than the French cooking that we get in LA. We didn't get to go for lunch, but they have some good lunch deals. Dinner is great, and they have one of the few bars in Hanoi that serves real booze (instead of counterfeit Johnny Walker, etc. which is the norm). The chef here recommended that we go to the second restaurant I'm going to recommend below.

Halia
http://www.halia.com.sg/hanoi/html/ha...
Halia is not as well known as La Badiane and is not as busy, but I had one of the best meals during the entire trip -- we had two tasting menus that were $40 and $50 each which would have been $150ish in value in the U.S. If you're interested I can dig up some of my photos from these restaurants.

[pinstripeprincess]

thank you for the halia recco! i like when chefs recommend other places. if you can post up any photos that'd be great.

i'm not super keen on the high end restaurants (i'm pretty fine-dining-ed out at this point... i really question the value and the experience after getting some michelin stars under my belt) but it seems like the value would be great and the ingredients interesting. i'd like to try a couple per major city and expect all other dining to be street/local especially in the smaller cities.

[M_Gomez]

Do be aware that Halia is Singapore-owned though and, even if they have one or two Vietnamese-inspired dishes on their menu, they would serve pseudo-South-East Asian fare, e.g. Indonesian gado-dado. etc., and not strictly Vietnamese or Indochinese food which you're probably looking for.

In Singapore, the original Halia restaurant is located in the Botanic Gardens, close to the spot where ginger, turmeric, galangal & other root plants are cultivated. I'd had breakfast, lunch & dinner there before, but it didn't leave much of an impression on me. Maybe the Vietnamese branch is better. By the way, the name "Halia" comes from the Malay word for "ginger" :)

[madcao]

Interesting - I've never been to the Halia in Singapore, but the one in Hanoi is modern continental, not Asian, and it was a nice change from all of the Vietnamese food we'd been eating for the past month.

Here are the two tasting menus that we had, along with a few photos of those items. Because it was quite dark, I wasn't able to capture some of the plates as well as I wish, but I think you'll get an understanding of what the food is like (I blew out the contrast on some of the photos so you could see better). Everything was expertly prepared, and the service was impeccable. They even gave us a special dessert at the end as we were on our honeymoon.

[M_Gomez]

Honeymoon in South-east Asia - how nice :) Congratulations!
Love your photos.

[erica]

Yes, please dig up those pics!! Many thanks!

[pinstripeprincess]

looks like malaysia and singapore will have to be nixed for lack of time, not sure what i was thinking for 6 wks, and it'll be a toss up between laos or cambodia... any thoughts on the remaining places? love the recs for vietnam, looks like i'll be in for a treat there. am curious about dress code though since i am essentially backpacking.

[mikey8811]

You've prob nixed the least interesting for sightseeing places - they are essentially cities, although the same could be said for HCMC & Bangkok. Laos & Cambodia are a bit of a culinary wasteland (at least to thus uninformed palate). T-shirt, shorts & trainers were fine for me - this is dining in the tropics after all, and most tourists will be dining after a long day out.

[justintime]

t-shirts and shorts will not fly at some of the high end places that have been recommended to you. in bkk you'll be turned away at the door. vietnam you'll probably get seated but not without some funny looks. laos and cambodia, you can probably wear whatever you want. my philosophy when it comes to dining is if you look like a backpacker you'll be treated like one, which is to say not as well as if you dress at the same level as the locals eating around you. some might disagree but for me it's mostly a respect issue. not so tough to pack a decent outfit without much space though, especially in this climate.

[pinstripeprincess]

pretty much what i was thinking, but have been debating if i could just purchase clothing while in bkk... except that i kind of dislike shopping under pressure. it looks like (nahm, sra bua and sirocco and the khaisilk group restos in ho chi minh) would not be happy if i showed up in tourist gear.

i've been trying to find reviews on some of these places and so far gaggan is the main one that has been ambivalent. the only molec gastron of indian cuisine, awesome. but it looks like it's all spherized, foamed, and nitrogen... is there anything really compelling about the molec gastron use or is it kind of technique for techniques sake?

[PhilD]

I had a good friend who used to get his clothes made when he arrived in India, had the laundered locally and then threw them away when he left. So getting some clothes made on your travels works.

Justin's advice is good though lots of the high end places are in high end hotels and well off locals and business people who frequent these places dress well - but modified for climate. You are in the capital cities of most places so expect capital city standards at good restaurants.

If you get to Siam Reap in Cambodia the restaurant at Raffles is probably the best bet - good food, cheap by western standards but expensive by local ones.

Gastron looks very interesting - he even has the same plates as El Bulli. On the blog I read it did seem like he was trying to push the concept too far, I think trying to squeeze MG into an Indian straight-jacket sets artificial boundaries which has resulted in some odd dishes i.e. Indian risotto.

[Delucacheesemonger]

Agree about Raffles. The room had ceilings so high, it damn near had clouds in it. Setting and service will make you feel like a Maharani. l would do lunch as food , while, good, was not great. But you have to experience the place. IMVHO, one of the jewels of the Raffles chain. Also try the Settha Palace in Vientiane, smaller version, but no less splendid for rooms or food. Have fun and good eats.

[justintime]

i'd just pack a nice linen dress, some sandals and a light wrap or something like that (assuming from your name you are female!). i'm an obsessively light packer and have a couple of go-to dresses that pack well, take up very little space and look nice.

as for gaggan... i hear what you are saying though it's not just about gaggan, i find molecular gastronomy is always a little too much about technique. the most disappointing thing in the restaurant is, IMO, the raita yogurt spheres. some things just were not meant to be spherified and the calcium or whatever they use to get the surface to solidify makes the raita taste weird. ironically the best thing in that restaurant is the chicken tikka, which is prepared more traditionally.

[pinstripeprincess]

thanks PhilD and justintime for the thoughts.... i'm going straight into bangkok so i'll bring one nicer dress to get me through my first few nights of fine dining there and then see what i can get made ;)

i did notice those EB plates and it made me wonder if it was too much of a riff. i think i'll pass and focus on the thai offered by nahm and sra bua (which both look amazing) and get some cocktails at sirocco.

[mikey8811]

I've been to Sirocco and Nam Phan, Nam Kha in shorts and trainers. I was at Nahm in jeans and trainers but ladies in my party wore shorts and sandals and there was no issue with that. It's really up to you I think - if you feel it is a bother to get dressed up and are rushing from a sight to the restaurant without the time to return to your hotel to get dressed then you should still be able to get in.

[PhilD]

Mikey - I think Tom would agree with you, from his blog (http://www.TomEatsJenCooks.com/795/da...) about Nahm:

"However, the biggest problem is that nahm is meant to be a serious restaurant but it felt like some middling hotel’s dining room. The interior is a touch bland – like it was modelled on a 1990′s Buddha Bar album cover - and the clientale were pretty much all Australian retirees or hotel guests in tracksuit bottoms."

He also reviews a lot of the other top restaurants in Bangkok - some good advice which I intend to follow when I get over there later this year.

[pinstripeprincess]

ah! i think that blog might be quite helpful. i'll have to poke through more... i was hoping for more of a consensus but as the majority of people eating at the fine dining places tend to be tourists it's highly likely that there isn't enough breadth between restaurants not return visits to really discern past a simply enthusiastic traveler.

[mikey8811]

Maybe that depends on the season. Among retirees, I also saw Aussies of the trendy Darlinghurst type. Also saw Pierre Hardy with a drop dead gorgeous blonde model and a bloke sporting the Euro playboy look.

It's worth going to for the food alone but I guess I was nostalgic for Darley Street Thai days...

[klyeoh]

I miss Darley Street Thai, too. When I first dined there in 1996, it was an epiphany.

[PhilD]

I third that - I think my epiphany was around '96 as well. I went on to live close by and it was my local thai take away. Despite mixed reviews Nahm in Bangkok is on my list for our trip later in the year.

[justintime]

i'm frankly surprised about sirocco. i've seen them turn people away, escorted out through the service elevator, for being underdressed, and their dress code is explicitly laid out at the entrance to the elevator banks. i really would not go after rushing from sight seeing. clothing choices aside, this is a hot and sweaty city!

[klyeoh]

pinstripeprincess - I presume you're still looking for fine dining? Epicure Singapore just did an excellent expose on Cambodian fine dining recently. Some recs, according to their food reviewer, Leisa Tyler, are:

- Meric, Sivutha Boulevard, Siem Reap, Tel: [phone]. Website: www.hoteldelapaix.com. An 8-course Khmer menu degustation is priced at US$31. This restaurant's been credited with bringing back old, sometimes obscure Cambodian recipes & serve them in luxe environment. Dishes included green mango salad with local snake, frangipani petals & baby corn, served with prahok (local fish sauce).

- Cuisine Wat Damnak (behind Wat Damnak) which just opened in April 2011. Tel: [phone]. Website: www.cuisinewatdamnak.com

Cambodian fine dining in a wooden house in Siam Reap - serves 6- or 7-course tasting menus priced from US$15.

Amuse bouche includes puffer fish from Lake Tonle Sap. Borbor soup is made from "a stock of quail's bones, seafood, mushrooms, turnip & garlic -served withg seared prawns, quail meat & local pork sausage, topped with deep-fried garlic, ginger, black peppercorn & sawtooth mint." Don't you think that sounded absolutely irresistible?!

- Sugar Palm, Ta Phul Road, Siem Reap. Tel: [phone]. Lunch for two is priced at US$15. This is also a cooking school, but it offers Cambodian homestyle food, which is quite similar to Thai cuisine, e.g. pomelo salad, and amok - a steamed souffle-like seafood dish (a close cousin of Thai "hor mok").

- Romdeng, 74 Street 174, Phnom Penh. Tel: [phone]. Website: http://friends-international.org/shop/restaurants.asp?mainmenu=shop&page=restaurants

Dinner for two is US$30. They even offer fried tarantulas & ants, if you're feeling adventurous!

- Malis, 136 Norodom Boulevard, Phnom Penh. Tel: [phone]. Website: www.malis-restaurant.com
Dinner for two is US$40. Very classy restaurant in French colonial building's garden courtyard.

[pinstripeprincess]

still fine dining yes! i figure there must be a lot of low-med end recs on this board and that i'll let my feet, nose and eyes help me figure out that stuff.

these suggestions are amazing!!! absolutely what i was hoping for... i really wish i was going with a group just get a full banquet experience, but c'est la. that soup from cuisine wat damnak is a must try. very exciting suggestions!

[mikey8811]

Hi KL (Peter)

Have been to Meric when it was helmed by Paul Hutt, a Teague Ezard alum. I remembered it cost more and the dishes do sound exotic but the taste was only so so. Overall, the impression was Cambodian cuisine seems to be a poorer cousin of Thai and Vietnamese - just my 2 cents.

[klyeoh]

Absolutely agree with you there, mikey. I'd only had Cambodian food in San Francisco/Oakland and also Singapore (http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/739958) but never in its homeland, and I also got the impression that the cuisine's somewhat similar to Thai (especially Isaan) but less spicy & less intense in flavors. But am really interested to try it in Siem Reap or Phnom Penh though.

[PhilD]

I would also agree, on our trip we kept hoping for a revelation but failed to find it. I often wonder if this is because it is an immature restaurant cuisine, in other words it has not crossed over from the home kitchen. And given the turmoil Cambodia has suffered over the years I expect that process to be far behind more stable places like Thailand.

I think the same for Vietnamese food, most of the food I try in Vietnam is only OK and doesn't excite. However some of the young Vietnamese chefs in Sydney are now delivering much broader based menus (all apparently authentic - hate that term) which are quite stunning. As there is more to American food than burgers and hot dogs and there is also more to Vietnamese than Pho and Bahn Mi - although you wouldn't think so from reading rave reviews of Vietnamese restaurants.

[klyeoh]

For Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon), I rather liked Au Manoir de Khai and also Nam Phan - both by the Khaisilk Group - peerless for fine-dining in the city:

http://www.khaisilkcorp.com/restauran...

My personal fave is actually Nam Kha, but noted from the website above that it's closed for renovations. But if it's re-opened when you're there (it's situated on Dong Khoi St), do give it a try.

[pinstripeprincess]

you are fantastic. thanks so much and thanks to charles for calling you out ;) i will definitely look into all these places. i'm crazy excited :)

[justintime]

in bangkok, try nahm or sra bua for very high end, cutting edge thai. gaggan for molecular gastronomy/experimental indian, sirocco for high end pan euro/med and a spectacular view. all will require reservations and put a nice dent in your wallet. ;-)

[pinstripeprincess]

nice, thanks! it's nice to have a few names to google since no one seems to be talking extensively about this stuff. what do you think of the tatler set of websites? http://www.thailandtatler.com/ they seem to be the most comprehensive site that i can find so far.

[justintime]

Tatler is probably ok for high end, but I believe its either a pay for placement publication or they take advertising into consideration when listing and ranking. I would not consider them.objective but I may be wrong.

[pinstripeprincess]

i suspected as such. good to know! thanks!

[klyeoh]

I'd second Sirocco. Critics often said that its standards have eroded since it first opened 2003-2004 thereabouts (Oliver Stone was dining in the table next to ours when we were there then), but I think Sirocco still set the benchmark for cosmopolitan fine dining in Bangkok.

[alliegator]

Vote 3 for Sirocco. I went for the first time 5 years ago, and it's practically the main reason I stop for a day or two in Bangkok on the way to my usual haunts in the south.
I was there very recently and can say that if there has been any kind of decline, I sure have not noticed. The food and the view are absolutely stunning.

[pinstripeprincess]

does anyone know of any other resources i can look at that might provide this info?

[Charles Yu]

I think our fellow chowhounder 'masters' - klyeoh and fourseasons should be able to help you out?!
( Message to klyeoh and FS: Hello guys, I know ' the princess in person! Fellow Toronto CH. Your help will be greatly appreciated! )

[klyeoh]

I'll leave FourSeasons to recommend fine dining in S'pore since I'm now in Kuala Lumpur & will concentrate on the options here:

- For good Mediterranean, try Le Midi at Bangsar Shopping Centre. It's got some of the BEST continental cuisine I'd tried since I relocated to KL here in 2011. The views over the KL skyline are simply incredible, the service is top-notch. Ask for the table next to this fantastc display aquarium where little translucent jellyfish are swimming: http://www.lemidi.com.my/

- For the best Spanish-style roast suckling pig, go to El Cerdo at Changkat Bukit Bintang. Best book ahead as it's one of the most popular restaurants in KL: http://www.elcerdokl.com/

- For modern-fusion/continental, either Third Floor at JW Marriott (by Chef Ken Hoh, an alumnus of Tetsuya Wakuda) or Chef Takashi Mimura's Cilantro at Micasa Hotel (http://www.cilantrokl.com/index.html) are good bets.

- Another good option is Frangipani at Changkat Bukit Bintang - very beautiful restaurant & good fusion-French/Malaysian cuisine (think foie gras with apple-curried rendang sauce). My personal fave dining spot: http://www.frangipani.com.my/

pinstripeprincess - Let me know if you need any more specific recs.

[Charles Yu]

Peter! I know we Torontonians can always count on you from across the miles!! Thx!

[klyeoh]

Just as we'd expect good dining tips from you if & when we visit Toronto, Charles :-D

pinstripeprincess - here's another useful thread on KL dining spots:
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/752754