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Are you making a dairy meal for shavuos?

My husband generally argues that a dairy meal is not hardy enough for him before he is about to go study all night. So I thought I would make the first day lunch the dairy meal but i'm not sure what to make that will be filling for him and the other 3 or 4 men that usually come for lunch, especially when they are used to a cholent. Any suggestions? What are you making?

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    1. re: DeisCane

      Deis, I don't like dairy meals either (I don't eat fish and am lactose intolerant).

      Azna, If they don't mind eating fish I guess that's a good meal plan!

      1. re: pitagirl

        Lactose intolerance makes a lot more sense than "not hardy enough." That sounds like brainwashery to me, more evidence that we've overemphasized meat in the kosher world.

        1. re: DeisCane

          First of all, lactose intolerant people can generally eat cheese--hard cheese like cheddar or mozzarella, not soft like cottage cheese. Second of all, there are Lactaid pills. Third of all, don't shuls have refreshments for the all night learning? And does a person going to learn all night really need extra calories? He/she'll be sitting all night, not running a marathon. Fourth of all, lots and lots of things (pasta, beans, etc) are filling without use of any meat. If they were not, all the vegetarians in this world would be running around munching every 30 minutes or so.

          1. re: emacat

            emcat, not the forum for this, but lactaid pills are not for everyone (trust me I learned it the hard way) and I personally avoid all dairy at this point.

            People like fleish at a yontiff meal why is that "brainwashery"?

            1. re: pitagirl

              Liking meat for yomtov (and shabbos) is one thing, saying a non-meat meal is "not hardy enough" is another entirely (never mind that studying on Shavuos is not exactly running a 10k or working in a coal mine).

              1. re: pitagirl

                My family has discovered (in a way that makes soo much sense, yet we didn't think of it ourselves) that if you look at the nutrition panel on cheese and there are 0g sugars, then there is no lactose in the cheese. There are a few select brands that make even ricotta cheese that have 0g sugar, and looking at several of the "hard cheeses," the same thing, so my lactose intolerant family members are able to eat things like lasagna again if the right brand of cheese is used. Lactaid pills definitely are not for everyone or for everything, and I know I am somewhat OT here, but it is possible to enjoy dairy once again if supremely careful about reading labels. Good luck!

                1. re: asf78

                  Thanks for the info on cheese! That will be helpful here:)

            2. re: DeisCane

              Where's the "like" button? Well said DC.

              For the OP -- how about Eggplant Parm. for lunch? Veggie Chili and Tacos? And, yes... Fish. If your men are of the " I hate fish" ilk, you can do tilapia with your favorita bread crumbs or salmon baked in a honey and soy sauce mixture.

        2. If he has meat at night, he won't be able to eat all the cheesecakes that they have in Shul.

          1 Reply
          1. I will be going away to a hotel this year, but if I were home it would be dairy - that is the way I was brought up. I always prefer diary over meat anyway. My favorite meal of the day is a good breakfast.

            Lets see - Shavous - Cheese blintzes, cheese cake, baked ziti, eggplant Parmesan , lasagne, ice cream, baked salmon, fried flounder, - I sure hope the Kutchers offers plenty of dairy options. I know they have something called the blintz bar. - I hope its 24 hour :)

            1. My wife usually does a veggie chicken parm that is pretty hardy and dairy.

              3 Replies
                1. re: peanutgallery7

                  You buy the Morningstar Farms veggie chicken pattie and cover it with tomato sauce and mozzarella.

                  1. re: DeisCane

                    More or less. My wife ususally browns the patties in a pan first so that they stay firm under the sauce and cheese. Also, usually a pizza sauce is better than plain tomato. Add some garlic bread and you have a fine sandwich.

              1. The yearly quandary is such: Shul serves pareve (kugel and cake) so we could do meat, but then there's the coffee issue. A real coffee-drinker who is staying up needs milk not cream (although the real real coffee drinkers go black) and since the lower watt personalities are sent up to give shiur at the wee hours of about 3 in the a.m., the men need the caffeine to get through. Many don't do the one-on-one in our Shul. So we go Milchigs at night and we do push for the hardy (correct spelling, guys). We do a butternut squash soup with good bread, two kinds of fish, a potato side, a pasta (linguine in garlic olive oil and sundried tomatoes if you're lactose intol) and some kind of vegie side (ratatouille if you're lactose intol). Day meal is going to be meat because the "men" in my family usually sleep ridiculously late and I just ignore their needs in place of my own. No guests are invited on the meal that follows the all-nighter. Yours can either do the meat or do what i do for the night meal.

                1. Wow, that's quite a discussion on the use of "hearty". I'll certainly think twice before I post again or even read this forum given some of the attitudes here. But in any event, we do not eat poultry or meat except on shabbat and holidays. So, it is hearty to us as our stomachs are not used to it on a daily basis. Its not normal or healthy to be eating cakes and such in the middle of the night and so he will not be eating any of that.

                  1 Reply
                  1. re: azna29

                    Here is another thought (pardon the lengthy post):

                    You could serve a milchig appetizer (some actually do cheesecake), reset the table and then salad and then a meat meal. My husband heard a shiur about this why this custom is salient to Shavuot (it was one we hadn't heard before).

                    The korban for Shavuot at the Beit HaMikdash was 2 challot (lechem mishnah). The typical kashrut regarding challah at meals is that a challah served at a diary meal cannot be served with a meat meal (and vice versa) sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

                    You are particularly recalling the korban of lechem mishnah by having one of the challot with your dairy meal and the other with your meat.

                    we might do that this year.

                  2. making grilled tuna and a mushroom cassarole (dairy) new recipe for me so I will post afer i make it if a) it is good and b) if anyone wants it

                    15 Replies
                    1. re: Prettypoodle

                      I love Shavuot! No cleaning, no fast, nothing to build.....and dairy! I love my dairy dishes and it seems so special and different to set the table for a yom tov meal with them.

                      For dinner tonight: grilled salmon, potato-leek gratin; sauteed kale; and this killer dessert called Oh God. Tomorrow lunch: salad, fency mac & cheese with truffles, sliced tomatoes. Dinner will be a cheese souffle. There's a quiche in there somewhere, too.

                      Chag sameach to all!

                      1. re: Mollybloom

                        I'd love to know what your Oh God dessert is! Please share...

                        1. re: EmpireState

                          Oh God! is an aberration of nature that manages to cram a year's worth of fat calories into a single slice of pie. It's adapted from Jill Conner Brown's wonderful "Sweet Potato Queens Book of Love," but I have made it even more terrifyingly caloric. Because that's what I do.

                          You blind bake two pie shells or you can use graham cracker or oreo ones. Then you whip a container of cool whip, a can of sweetened condensed milk, and 16 oz. of whipped cream cheese together. You can add cocoa powder and heath chips at this point. I know I always do. You pour this into the pie shells and refrigerate. You then mix 10 oz. shredded coconut with a bunch of chopped pecans and a stick of melted butter and put it on a cookie sheet in a 350 oven. Keep checking it, because once it starts to toast, it goes fast and it can burn. (with that much fat and sugar, you could have a real conflagration.) You let this stuff cool off completely, then you mix in an assortment of white and dark chocolate bits and spread it over the top of the pies. Keep it cold, and when you dare to serve it, drizzle the best caramel sauce you can afford over the top of the whole thing.

                          Every single person who has ever eaten this invariably moans, "Oh, GOD!" at the first mouthful. Hence the name.

                          Chag Sameach!

                          1. re: Mollybloom

                            Thanks. It sounds awesome, but didn't you know that fat/calories don't count on Shabbat and Yom Tov? Chag
                            Sameach to you as well!

                        2. re: Mollybloom

                          Ugh, it's 7:00am. Time to get out of bed and get started. Only one meal home but 18 people, which around here means 20 or more, and the walk-ins will be teenage boys. (I wonder where I can borrow some chairs?)

                          Lunch tomorrow at 3:00 (Linner?)
                          spinach-cheese squares (from Recipes for a Small Planet,) mushroom curry (original Moosewood,) baked salmon with yogurt/cottage cheese dressing (ibid,) yellow split pea soup (Low Fat Moosewood,) salad bar, rice and/or quinoa. Purchased cheesecake.

                          1. re: SoCal Mother

                            first night: roasted butternut and pear soup, seared tuna on arugula, oven-roasted tomatoes and lingini and olive oil, tomato salad, couscous, almond/butter cake, tiramisu

                            dairy lunch meal with guests that have small children: mac and cheese, spinach quiche, rolled turbot and sauteed vegetables/parmesan sauce, lasagna, maple cheesecake and standard cheesecake

                            meat lunch: poached salmon, chicken breast stuffed with wild rice and dried fruit/apricot sauce, salad

                            meat dinner: chicken soup and matza balls, hardy veal stew

                            1. re: SoCal Mother

                              Still getting phone calls from teenage boys. (Note that it is only 2 hrs until yomtov starts.) We are now up to 20. I own 17 chairs. Changed the soup to lentil. Bought 3 containers of ice cream and made a box of Duncan brownies but I added butterscotch chips to make it dairy on purpose. I will need to make the fish and rice on yomtov because my refrigerator is completely full.

                              I suppose I will miss them when they leave home. I know that Ralph's and Costco will miss me.

                              1. re: SoCal Mother

                                SoCal Mother, you are my hero. How did it go? I'd love to know how you shop and cook for such a big crowd.

                                1. re: serenarobin

                                  You will miss them when they leave home. But then they will come home for Yom Tov, and their friends from high school will also be home for yom tov, and one of them will have have a chavruta he learned with in Israel and another a college chum each of whom happen to be in town for yom tov, and of course you will invite their friends for a meal so that everyone has time to catch up, and (did I mention that each of these childhood friends is now married with ttwo-year-old twins). You will need a bigger sukkah, and possibly a bigger house.

                                  1. re: serenarobin

                                    You should read her notes and advice for NCSY onegs......a must-read for any parents of a pre-teen son.


                                    1. re: vallevin

                                      Thanks to the pointer to the chuckle. This line was my favorite:

                                      "Don't buy any sort of candy that can be tossed into the air and then caught in the mouth. "

                                      1. re: AdinaA

                                        I am flattered! Look - I live in a tourist and college town so unexpected guests are a common thing. Not only do my kids bring friends home but our shul will send us students with no notice and tourists with usually a few days notice but not always.

                                        I try to always keep in the house:

                                        1. Vacuum packs of soup. (Those creamy vegetable soups I get at Trader Joes and Henry's. Whole Foods has them also but they are more $$$.) Whichever soup I open for Friday night I try to have an extra one in the pantry. If I find out before Shabbat that I am having an extra kid, I can always add more soup.

                                        2. Several packages of Meal Mart deli from Costco. They are 1.5 lbs. each and are vacuum sealed and will last several months. (Yes, we have had boys show up in the middle of a meal.)

                                        3. Canned corn, toasted sesame seeds, toasted almonds and other things to make a salad. If I know in advance I am getting more kids I can throw together the sesame noodles from Kosher by Design. Add some salad veggies to it if I have any. Costco sells salad bags with hashgacha and we are big salad eaters so I almost always have extra tomatoes, cukes and lettuce for surprise guests.

                                        4. Challah and chumus. As my son said, if lunch is not so great we eat a lot of challah and chumus. I don't bake challah and my kids prefer Sabra brand so this can get fairly expensive. Challahs warmed up on the blech get eaten quickly. My kids like deli sandwiches with regular bread and we almost always have regular sliced bread. I also buy sliced challah.

                                        5. Rice. It keeps, cooks quickly and scales. I make duck sauce chicken almost every Friday night and it makes a nice sauce for the rice.

                                        I always have paper plates in several sizes and I make everything in half-steam pans (from Costco of course) so it will all stack in the fridge. I sometimes even will put rice or other things cooked on the stove in the pans if I am short on refrigerator space. (Learned that one from a senior center cook.) Unfortunately Costco doesn't sell the lids so I need to get them in Smart & Final (and they are a bit pricey) or use aluminum foil.

                                        1. re: SoCal Mother

                                          Thanks for the excellent advice SoCal Mother. Looks like being able to scale up is really important, as is having back-up food available. And big trays.
                                          It's really nice to hear about how you prepare for and host guests. Thanks again and please keep posting your menus/tips!!

                                          1. re: serenarobin

                                            I had to laugh - this Shabbat we cooked on Thursday night for 6, and we ended up with 9 for dinner and 10 for lunch. That's what I get for bragging...

                                            You do realize that our additional guests are almost always teenage boys who each eat twice an adult portion, but don't care what it looks like.

                          2. Looks like I will be having meat for tonight's meal. Kutsher's had a lakeside BBQ from 2-5 so if you add 6 hrs to 5pm you get no dairy till 11pm.

                            1 Reply
                            1. re: MartyB

                              A lake side bar b que sounds lovely!

                            2. I'm not a big fan of dairy and Shavuos was always one of my least favorite holidays foodwise. but I like the minhag of eating cheesecake, washing and waiting 15 minutes and eating a meat meal.