Top Chef All-Stars - Ep. #5 - 01/05/11 (Spoilers)

[LindaWhit]

Yay, we're back! And it's a TC First - Chef Colicchio enters the competition. The QuickFire is a time challenge - the remaining cheftestants are to try and beat Chef Tom's time in creating a dish.

In the before-the-show, Antonia calls Angelo's penchant for putting his fingers into others' dishes "Chef's Tourette's". :-) And Richard's confessional yet again calls out Jamie for not cooking.

And we're on to the QF - before Tom C. starts, Angelo points out that Colicchio is sweating, and Tom replies "Yeah, I expected that!" Tiffany says to Tom "That's OK, take your time!" LOL

Tom's off and running - Fabio notes that every one of his movements is coordinated with the next one; everything *seems* to be going smoothly until Tom tosses part of a used fish into a bin...and the bin crashes to the floor next to Padma. "Sorry Padma!" he laughs! So how much time does Tom Colicchio take to make a simple but flavorful soup? 8 minutes, 37 seconds! Holy smokes!

Padma explains that the winner will get immunity AND a Toyota Prius - a HUGE prize! And they're off! Everyone runs towards the fridge...except Marcel, who runs to the bin and grabs the rest of Tom's fish. OK, that is REALLY SMART! And Angelo does crudo after Tom C. suggests they don't do something so simple and that they'll take into account a "degree of difficulty". Sheesh.

Time goes by VERY fast - and Dale Talde has virtually nothing to plate, as his noodles don't come out. Mike's dish looks great, and Marcel wonders if his flavors of his dish (which was served just before Mike's) was helping Mike's dish. Oh come ON, Marcel!

Low end - Dale, Jamie, and Angelo (glad Tom called out Angelo for the crudo!)
High end - Mike, Richard, and Marcel - and Mike Isabella wins!

For the Elimination Challenge, they head to Chinatown to serve up dim sum to locals. Based on previews, this could be a debacle! They have to work as a team to serve hundreds of dim sum diners at a major Chinatown restaurant.

They plan back at the house as to what to make...and WHAT a surprise - Jamie wants to do scallops! You can see everyone look at each other with a "REALLY?" In the confessional, Fabio starts up again with the "This is Top Chef, *not* Top Scallop!" Hopefully *this* is what sends her home! LOL

Carla and Casey take one for the team, and will work the floor bringing food out to the diners, relying on everyone else to prepare and get their dishes done. Dale, Angelo and Jamie will all do TWO dishes - really, Jamie? Several chefs say she's the slowest chef - how can she manage two dishes in a high pressure environment?

They go shopping, and Fabio is squicked out by the Chinese market guys cutting turtles up for soup - he used to have a turtle for a pet, so he's not happy with that!

They have to make 180 portions of dim sum dishes...it's hollered out that if you said you'd do two dishes, you *have* to do two dishes! Jamie's initial dish isn't working out, and when Antonia asks her to talk about the second dish, Jamie walks away saying "I don't have time!"

Hmmmm.....Jamie's getting a LOT of camera time - could this be IT for Miss Top Scallop, boys and girls? ::::Fingers crossed:::::

Susur Lee is the guest judge. Carla remembers how centered and zen-like he was on TCMasters. Mike Isabella is going to be the expeditor, while Carla and Casey are going to be wheeling the carts around.

They're now showing the dining room, and everyone's waiting for the dim sum...and they do NOT look happy! Some food comes out; and then it bogs down again. Everyone tries to pull together, but they're really falling apart. Antonia completely drops the ball on getting Casey's dish out, and yet is bitching about people standing around. Tom goes down to the kitchen, and tells them they have to move faster - diners are leaving! Some diners are actually getting up from their table and walking over to the dim sum carts to get their own plates or taking them out of the hands of those cheftestants who are bringing dishes up from the kitchen.

Comments from the diners: "I can't tell what I just ate - it was fried meat, but I don't know what type of meat!" And even more pointed: "Caucasian dim sum." Ouch. :-)

This Challenge was *no one's* finest moment. How are they going to pick a winner out of what was definitely a debacle? And there are a lot of unfavorable comments for not-so-good food. I guess it's figuring out which was *really* bad and which was just "meh".

It's time for JT - Padma comes into the Stew Room and asks to see Casey, Antonia, Carla, Tre, and Jamie. And these are the LEAST favorite dishes! They didn't get enough food up, and they weren't good dishes.

Jamie's taken TWO hits for her scallop dumplings and the overcooked, oily long beans. Hmmm...but then Casey and Antonia also get hammered. I *hope* Tre's OK based on what we heard about Jamie, Antonia and Casey's dishes. The judges need to finish talking, so they're sent back to the Stew Room, and asked to send up....

Tiffany, Angelo, Dale, and Fabio. These are the favorite dishes! Susur Lee pays Fabio a big compliment re: his playfulness with his dish, and when asked, Fabio said he had zero experience with Chinese cooking. And Dale Talde wins the challenge.

Now the judges deliberate about who's outta there. Jamie, Casey and Tre all get slammed yet again. Can't figure out who it's going to be - PLEASE just make it Jamie and put us all out of our misery? PLEASE?

And we're back at JT - and it's Casey. Holy CRAP. Jamie actually gets to stay again???? Come ON, judges! Even Casey said she and EVERYONE expected to hear Jamie's name, even Jamie did! Jamie said in the Stew Room to everyone else "I'm shocked it was Casey! She didn't get the brunt of it from the judges; I did!" So everyone knows, including Jamie, that she should have been out of there!

Damn. I cannot BELIEVE all of these good chefs are leaving before Jamie!

Previews for next week - looks like Marcel's being an asshat yet again - he gets into Dale Talde's face on a boat, and Dale's previously seen anger could come out again if Marcel doesn't shut up!

:::Sigh:::: I cannot believe this has happened yet again. WHEN are the judges going to get Jamie OUT of there? She's skating, yet again! Will be an interesting read of the Bravo blogs!

[aching]

I'm watching Season 5 on DVD as I missed it when it originally aired - I'm only three episodes in, but I'm struck by how different Jamie was back then. She LOOKS better now, but she seemed to COOK a lot better then.

[goodhealthgourmet]

i don't recall what i thought of her physical appearance in S5, but i agree with you on the cooking...back then i was pretty impressed with her. now, not so much.

[aching]

She's lost some weight and looks more glammed up in the current season. But in S5 she seemed really focused and intent on her food, wheras this season she's like a deer in the headlights!

[a213b]

I just remembered, stylistically, one thing that drove me NUTS during my viewing.

During one of the prepping/cooking montages, instead of the Elves' standard quick cuts, the quick cuts were used in conjunction with fast push-ins/pull-outs, Dutch angles, etc, and I found it both irritating and incredibly jarring.

Just wondering if it bothered anyone else; it's something I've not ever seen on any of their TC series until now, and quite frankly with a show both so popular and so heavily formatted, I'm surprised they did it -- even though it's only been the once thus far this season.

[NellyNel]

Actually, I meant to mention that too - except I thought it was entertaining!

I loved the bit when they froze a picture of Mike I and had: "Mike I - "Expeditor"
and then
the split pictures of Carla and Casey - "Servers" or whatever it said - I thought it was hilarious!

I'm sure it was someone having a giggle with that ...and not meant to be taken seriously.

[huiray]

A couple of links discussing "dim sum" / yum cha.

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/758441
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/737634

[Joanie]

Wow I'm away from the computer for a few days and >400+ comments already? Sheesh.

- I knew everyone would be up in arms about Casey leaving but her dish sure wasn't a hit.

- I'm in the Nelly Nel et al. camp that Marcel was joking about the flavor passing on to Mike's dish. That seems like one of the more mundane comments to get all upset about. And why should he not seem pissed and/or disappointed when it came down to 2 people and he didn't win the money or car? I'd have a hard time keeping a smiley face on.

- Didn't Jamie kind of rag on herself when she suggested a scallop dish? I didn't see anyone mention that but I thought she kind of went "I know I know" when she brought it up.

- Tif Faison is much more easy going this time around. Too bad she's out of a job since her restaurant Rocca closed suddenly last week (not sure if that's been mentioned).

- Still not on that Tre bandwagon that everyone's on, both looks and cooking wise. None of the male top chefs get me going the way Tre seems to for the other ladies. I do like Angelo's height tho.

[aching]

***- Didn't Jamie kind of rag on herself when she suggested a scallop dish? I didn't see anyone mention that but I thought she kind of went "I know I know" when she brought it up.***

Jaime said "Laugh it up" to her teammates when she proposed making scallops - she clearly knows that it's a bit of a joke.

[goodhealthgourmet]

***- Didn't Jamie kind of rag on herself when she suggested a scallop dish? I didn't see anyone mention that but I thought she kind of went "I know I know" when she brought it up.***
~~~~~~~
i Googled her the other day out of curiosity and her Twitter feed is the first thing that comes up. looks like she's making jokes at her own expense there as well:

had to bring it back...good or bad...RT @Bravotv: #topscallop
7:34 PM Jan 5th via TweetCaster

NYE @beechwoodvenice...scallops, parsnip puree, house made Bacon, cabbage slaw...gotta represent the scallops that night!
9:27 PM Dec 29th, 2010 via TweetCaster

Chickpeas done right...gotta poke fun at myself, yeah? http://twitpic.com/3l08xz #topchefallstars
4:28 PM Dec 29th, 2010 via TweetCaster

[LindaWhit]

Whoa. Hadn't hurt about Rocca closing!

[huiray]

http://www.mysouthend.com/index.php?c...

[LindaWhit]

Thanks - I saw the closing noted on bostonchefs.com after I read what Joanie said, but hadn't heard anything more (nor had time to Do The Google). :-)

I do hope Tiffani finds another place locally soon. I'd like to try her cooking, as I never made it to Rocca.

[kahudson]

Why did some cheftestants team up to create additional dishes? That just seems like added work and pressure when as I understand it, they were not required to conceive, prepare and cook extra ones. Wouldn't they have been better off if they made one dish per person and the requisite number of plates?

[NellyNel]

I was surprised they did this too.
They seem to hate it when they are forced to work with someone, so it is surprising they actually choose to.

[SeoulQueen]

This show needs to be renamed "Top Product" . It was bad enough having Dawn hand washing liquid shoved down our throats on Top Chef Just Desserts. Every challenge now seems to have some ridiculously over the top product as a prize and the viewers then have to watch that product either being edited into the show in an obviously blatant manner or watch it as a full length TV ad ( the sheer number of TV commercials shown between breaks is ridiculous too - thank goodness for DVR).

Yes, Mike Isabella won a Prius for 8:37 minutes of effort but to then have that cheesy scene where the car is waiting outside and he walks up to it and gets in? Followed by Marcel talking about it in his "confessional" section?? The show hit an all time low for me right there. In fact, I was surprised Dale received nothing for winning the elimination challenge. I was expecting Padma to announce that Dale had won a 10 day trip to Hong Kong courtesy of Air China or something similar that tied in to the dim sum challenge and gave another company the chance to place their product.

I can envisage Top Chef becoming "Coca Cola's Top Chef" or maybe "Top Chef by Kraft Foods." The ultimate product placement, no?

[a213b]

I understand the frustration, and while I am sure you know this, it bears repeating -- these shows, while significantly less costly than scripted shows, are nevertheless quite expensive to make. So if a production company (e.g. Magical Elves) can offset/defray those costs by trade outs, then doesn't it behoove them to do so?

And by doing said trade-outs, they are contractually obligated to do scenes such as the one you mentioned with Mike, or even the constant, random cuts to kitchen brands during montages.

It certainly can be annoying, but it helps to understand from their point of view. Besides, you haven't stopped watching/discussing it, have you? If the frustration ever boiled over to the point where a decline in viewership could be directly linked to product placement/trade-outs, then I assure you they would stop in a heart-beat.

[John E.]

None of that bothers me at all. Bravo isn the business of making money. PBS telethons are much more annoying.

[ipsedixit]

SeoulQueen,

I'm not sure why you are bothered by the product placement -- it is supposed to be part of the show.

It's why they make it so upfront.

In fact, most gameshows do the same thing. The ultimate might just be Wheel of Fortune ...

[LindaWhit]

Let's see. Top Chef isn't the *only* show that has production placement.

Survivor - Mountain Dew, Doritos, and countless others
American Idol - Coca-Cola, AT&T
Sex and the City - Apple Macintosh, Jimmy Choo shoes (and any of another gazillion other fashion designers they mention - perhaps not paid advertising, but even better - FREE advertising!)
The Biggest Loser - Ziploc
Extreme Home Makeover - Serta, Lumber Liquidators, Sears, Ford
The Apprentice - any of the episodes has various sponsors for which they're doing a "job"

And just think of all of the football Bowl games: Progressive Gator Bowl; Tostitos Fiesta Bowl; Hyundai Sun Bowl; Allstate Sugar Bowl; AT&T Cotton Bowl.

This is the way it's worked for over 60 years in television. Remember "Texaco Star Theater" or the Colgate Comedy Hour? From the 1950s - a single ad sponsor of a show. It changed a lot in the 1960s, but it came back with a vengeance with Survivor and Mark Burnett financing most of the initial season by selling product placement to various advertisers.

This 2005 article might give a good idea of how much product placement there is in reality and regular TV shows, including daytime soaps: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/02/bus...

It ain't going away any time soon. So either learn to ignore it, or turn off the TV.

[DGresh]

and for those of you old enough to remember, "Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom"!

[LindaWhit]

Of course - I used to watch that ALL the time, DGresh! The Texaco Star Theater and Colgate Comedy Hour were a bit before my time, but Wild Kingdom was smack dab in my growing up period. :-)

[DGresh]

you must be my age :)

[LindaWhit]

:-) The only time I didn't get to see Wild Kingdom was when Dad was home and wanted to watch 60 Minutes (OR if Dad wasn't home, and we kids had already seen whatever was on Disney). IIRC, it was 60 Minutes on CBS, Wonderful World of Disney on ABC, and Wild Kingdom on NBC - 7pm on Sunday night. ;-)

[John E.]

Can anybody remember the first notable product placement in films?

Yep, it was ET. Coors and Reese's Pieces paid to be in the movie. Mars was first offered the deal for M&M's but turned it down.

[ipsedixit]

Can anybody remember the first notable product placement in films?

Yep, it was ET. Coors and Reese's Pieces paid to be in the movie. Mars was first offered the deal for M&M's but turned it down.
_____________________________________________

ET was not the first. Maybe the most notable, but then it depend on what generation you are talking about.

http://www.filmcritic.com/features/20...

[John E.]

I guess when I read about it, it must have been referi g to modern movies ie the last 50 or 60 years. Nobody was doing it in the 70s or 80s prior to ET that I'm aware of.

[ipsedixit]

Sure they were. Omega and Aston Martin for the 007 Bond movies come immediately to mind.

[John E.]

Actually, since I don't think Astin Martin ever paid to have their car in the Bond films a better example might be the crappy AMC cars in a couple of the Roger Moore 007 films. I recall a flying Matador and a Hornet that did a loop de loop.

I guess I didn't choose my words carefully enough. ET did change the way things were done in product placement however.

http://www.suite101.com/content/adver...

[SeoulQueen]

I don't watch a lot of TV and I don't watch any of those shows. Based on what you just wrote, I'm glad I don't although I thought Biggest Loser was a weight loss program... thought a company like NutriSystem would advertise rather than Ziploc?

The product placement bugs me because it's become more and more intrusive - it wasn't this bad when Top Chef originally started. Back then it was shopping at Whole Foods and cooking in a GE kitchen with the occassional guest judge hawking their latest cookbook (given as a prize for winning.) Now it's product placement sponsored challenges and prizes and additional irrelevant scenes including those products. I miss the "old" Top Chef.

[Withnail42]

It does get monotonous. Certainly it has become a point of parody. And it's not like the product placement reduces the amount or length of commercials.

[a213b]

But that's because Elves and Bravo are two entirely separate entities. The former uses placement/trade-outs to offset costs, while the latter sells commercials to make money.

In fact, it's the revenue Bravo makes from the commercials that in part helps determine their deals with production companies (e.g. Elves) in terms of what Bravo will pay for a series (e.g. Top Chef).

In short, the product placement effectively has nothing to do with commercials, and vice versa.

[debbiel]

I was under the impression that there is some relationship (of course, I'm not an expert in this--just read a few pieces several years ago). The argument was that while fewer and fewer people watch commercials (due first to vcr and now to dvr), commercial time became less valuable. Product placement then became more important. I don't know if that is true, but it makes intuitive sense to me. If Bravo can't get as much money as it wants for commercials, it will pay the TC production company less for the show. The production company would need to make that money up somehow. Voila--Mike Isabella sits in his new Prius.

But like I said, I have no firsthand knowledge. This might be completely off.

[soupkitten]

<< Mike Isabella won a Prius for 8:37 minutes of effort >>

the dismissiveness bugs me a bit-- it's like saying carl lewis won an olympic gold medal for 9.99 seconds of effort. mike i is not my fave person on the show, but the point is he's worked and trained his whole life to be able to have the skill set to put a complete and cohesive dish on the table in 8 1/2 mins, and have the final effort beat out those of his (formidable) competition. he's not some doofus spinning a wheel or picking door number three on let's make a deal-- he developed a skill set with which he managed to earn a pretty nice prize for himself-- dang, let him have it, and some acknowledgment of his skill and talent.

[SeoulQueen]

How was that being dismissive? Yes, he won a car for 8:37 minutes of effort. That's a fact. I didn't write it to be dismissive but if you want to read too much into it, I can't stop you.

[Withnail42]

Feel I should add a positive point to this. Perhaps it was mentioned before. But have to say Fabio walking his turtle was priceless!

[mariacarmen]

yep, i mentioned that too. i loved it. someone tried to say it was all set up for the cameras, as in faked, but i choose to believe it.

[huiray]

http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.c...

[LindaWhit]

Loved this comment:

"Nothing against Casey and whoever else helped her cook her dish, but that blackened charred chicken foot with its clawlike toes, it looked like some twisted fossilized pendant of unfathomable dark magic that should be dangling from a golden chain around Voldemort's neck."

[Withnail42]

I'm shocked. This seems to defy any sort of common sense. And it dose make one think that the producers have a hand in things. Keeping the villain in keeps people watching.

Lets see Big Mouth Jamie (finally) makes two simple and inevitably bad dishes and she gets to stay. Antonia makes a good dish and a bad dish, and ruins an other contestants dish. Casey makes a challenging dish entrusts it to another while she works the front of the house and is kicked off.

Perhaps since Jamie has proven that she is entirely uses less in the kitchen Antonia had to cover for her as well distracting her from Caseys dish. If so that make it the third week in a row that she has gotten a contestant sent home.

Ironic that Sushar(sp) Lee is there. His place in NYC has gotten nothing but bad reviews.

[Miss Needle]

Susur was on Top Chef Masters and pretty much rocked the competition. He did lose, however, in the finale.

[Withnail42]

I know his place in Toronto has an excellent reputation. As does he. I was just commenting on the NYC connection.

[Miss Needle]

I think NYers are a minority of the TC viewers. I'll bet that most viewers would probably think of Top Chef Masters when they see him as opposed to the lukewarm reviews of Shang.

[huiray]

It's interesting. I've never eaten at Shang in NYC; and from the website the menu seems like a mixture of Japanese and Chinese fusion and I believe the place is supposed to be attempting somewhat "upscale" Chinese. Variable (good/bad) to lukewarm reviews as Miss N says.

However, I also remember reading elsewhere that not so long ago a top-flight Hong Kong chef decided against opening a restaurant in NYC and a supposed reason given was that folks in New York would not go for Chinese food that might cost $100 or more per person...instead expecting Chinese food to always be 'cheap'. I can't locate an article from a web search - anybody know if this was true? Comments?

[Ruth Lafler]

Your argument would be couched more correctly if you didn't imply that Antonia somehow botched Casey's dish. Casey clearly had no idea how to make chicken feet, which have to be braised until they are soft. There's no way that anything Antonia did at the time of service could have changed the fact that Casey's chicken feet hadn't been braised properly.

[momjamin]

I'm surprised so many people are surprised that Casey went instead of Jamie. I knew when they said Casey's food was inedible AND the hungry diners in the restaurant were leaving it on the table, thus proving it really was "inedible", and a judge calling it "inedible" wasn't just hyperbole.

[LindaWhit]

Well, as others have said - all of the judges said Casey's dish was inedible. That trumps two bad dishes that, at least, were edible.

[SeoulQueen]

But Antonia was the one who cooked it - who's not to say that the dish would have been fine if Antonia had cooked it properly?

If Casey had been entirely responsible for her dish, including executing it, then I could better understand why she would have to go home for an inedible dish but the judges all said the execution was what killed that dish. Casey didn't cook it, Antonia did. So I really thought the judges would take that into consideration and Casy wouldn't go.

Jamie should have gone home - she cooked 2 bad dishes. If I recall, Tom C was not there the week Dale Talde was sent home on Season 4 and A. Bourdain was the guest head judge. Tom C wrote on his blog that he disagreed with the decision and said Dale should have stayed because he only cooked 1 bad dish while someone else cooked two bad dishes and that it was simply a numbers game. So if Tom was to follow his own rules, Jamie should have been sent home.

This competition has lost all credibility with me. I'm just watching it now to see what other excuses they give to keep Jamie. Seriously is she sleeping with one of the judges or producers or black mailing them??! At this point I won't be surprised if she ends up winning the whole thing - maybe she cuts herself again and finagles a hospital stay long enough to get her into the final 3! LOL!

[LindaWhit]

Antonia just finished it. I do believe Casey did all of the precooking, and it was just being finished and plated by Antonia. Regardless of the "finishing", the judges (and especially Susur Lee) said how Casey had said she wanted it finished was incorrect, I believe, whereas Antonia was using the proper method. So would Casey's method have made the dish even worse?

Hey - I don't disagree with you that Casey didn't cook her entire meal - that's an ongoing issue that many of us feel is unfair - if you are on the FOH, you're relying on someone else to at least partially cook and plate your food.

However, having said that - Carla and Casey volunteered to be front of house. They didn't draw knives or the short strand of spaghetti. They *volunteered.* They took themselves away from their own food. Not for nothing, but 7 seasons of TC has taught at least the viewers that cheftestants should *not* volunteer for FOH! LOL

As for what Tom said in his blog regarding when Bourdain, et al chose Dale Talde to PYKAG...even *Tom* noted that he wasn't there to see/taste Dale's food (which is what he tells viewers when they bitch about who was sent home). Sorry - he can't have it both ways! He doesn't play by the numbers game - except he wanted to when he wasn't there for Dale Talde's ousting. The "rules" are he goes home for whichever dish tastes worst - and Casey's was completely inedible. And if a dish is inedible (and Jamie's, while they were "bad" - they at *least* were edible!), it doesn't make sense to keep the person who cooked an inedible dish.

[John E.]

How could Tom not have tasted Dale's food? Dale won even though Tom didn't taste it? How is this even possible?

[soupkitten]

in the last para, LW is talking about a prior season, when dale t. was sent home. bourdain was filling in for tom c, who was absent from that episode. there was a bit of a kerfluffle at the time bc dale was pretty much steamrolled into making a soup by his team (which included lisa), which he was unfamiliar with & didn't want to make, which bourdain was very, very critical of.

ETA: actually i would cite this as one case in which the main complaint from the judges (bourdain) was in regards to the "authenticity" of a dish rather than flavor.

[John E.]

Now I remember that spisode although I don't understand the context of why it's being brought up now. Dale didn't get sent home for one bad dish (butterscotch scallops) he got sent home for that dish AND he was the executive chef for the losing team in restaurant wars. It wasn't that Dale was unfamiliar with the soup, he had nothing to do with it. The problem with Lisa's laksa was too much smoke, not authenticity (unless that is referring to the smoke).

[teezeetoo]

i loved this challenge though it was a disaster for the competing chefs. i wish we had read or heard more about the respect ethnic cooks deserve who turn out fabulous and abundant dim sum, get no "star" recognition for it (unless they are David Chang) and work for low wages under tough conditions. There was a star chef from Hong Kong, several years ago, who considered opening a high-end Hong Kong style restaurant in NYC and decided not to. Rationale? New Yorkers wouldn't pay 100.00 a dinner for non-European food. They assume all Asian food should be cheap.

[debbiel]

You just can't really compare one episode's decision to another. Dale made one bad dish. How bad was it? Was it inedible? How great a difference between bad was there between Dale and the other person? Was it less than the difference between Casey and Jamie?

While most of us seem to think Jamie has stayed way past her welcome, there were reasons for each stay. They weren't going to cut someone for being injured. I think that's stupid, but it's a reason. The rules of the tennis challenge were absolutely stupid and her teammates played it poorly. So her food wasn't tasted. How can she go home if she is not judged? And this week? Casey's food was deemed inedible. Inedible. I hate that she was in FOH too, but the food she put out had to be judged.

It seems a bit much to assume Jamie is sleeping with someone or black mailing someone. She has, however, been quite lucky.

[cowboyardee]

Well said.

[Ruth Lafler]

Seoul Queen, if you read the other discussions about Casey's dish, you'll understand that Casey's dish was badly prepared from the beginning and nothing Antonia did could change that: chicken feet need to be braised for a long time in order to be edible, and Casey didn't do that.

[SeoulQueen]

Not necessarily, you can plonk chicken feet into boiling water for 5-10 minutes and then deep fry them - but the deep fryer temperature has to be super hot so that everything cooks.

I got the impression that was where the dish got screwed up.. Antonia did not fry them at high enough heat which is what Casey found out when she went back into the kitchen? I thought I heard her say something about the temp? I thought Tom also had said that the prep was fine but that the execution had failed? Eh I could be wrong. Watching that entire service was a confusing disaster!

But I do agree with others - they should stop insisting that chefs have to do team stuff and FOH roles as part of the challenge. If it's mandatory that needs to be taken into consideration in the judging and they should include the chef(s) who did the actual cooking when the dish is judged.

I'm still expecting Jamie to win the title with 5 dishes all featuring scallops! LOL!
Watching her poor cooking skills has made me decide I never want to eat at whatever restaurant she is cooking at.

[Ruth Lafler]

Antonia had them in the deep fryer and Casey said they should be in the wok -- if that's what Casey wanted that was still ridiculous. With a deep fryer you can plonk them in and leave them while you do other things, but a wok has to be monitored -- to cook it in a wok would have required Antonia to abandon prep on her own dish(es). If Casey had a dish that needed that kind of intensive last-minute cooking she shouldn't have been the first one to volunteer to be FOH. At least Carla had the sense to volunteer with a cold dish that she could make in advance. It was bad planning, bad pre-prep and bad execution.

As for Tom going by his own rules, another of his "rules" is that you shouldn't criticize the judges' decisions if you haven't tasted the dishes. Going by that rule, he shouldn't have criticized the decision to send Dale home you mentioned above, which means his application of the "numbers" rule invalid at its inception. BTW, there are no actual "rules" about how the judges are supposed to judge -- it's simply their judgement based on the dishes they have before them at any particular challenge.

[debbiel]

The problem with also judging the chef(s) who did the actual cooking while someone is doing FOH is that puts those chefs at a disadvantage as well. They have extra work to do. Work on the FOH chef's dish may detract from their own, or, in order to do theirs as well as possible, they may need to slight the FOH chef's dish a bit.

[John E.]

The whole reason the producers set up challenges in this manner (FOH stuff) is to make it more challenging. They want the chefs to turn on one another to add to the tension and drama.

[debbiel]

I understand why they are doing it. I just don't like it.

[gaffk]

Just watched this episode . . . what a disaster that EC was. But it produced the funniest line from Carla. When Tom showed up in the kitchen mid-service and Carla remarks that you know when dad shows up where he shouldn't be, you're in trouble. Ain't that the truth!

[LindaWhit]

I had forgotten about that - that could go the the "Top Chef Best Lines" thread. :-)

[ipsedixit]

I wonder if TC would ever have an EC where the dishes are judged "blind".

That is Tom, Padma, et al. would judge each dish not knowing who made it.

I'm not saying any of the judges are playing favorites, but there's gotta be an inherent bias involved, whether they admit to it or not.

[Caitlin McGrath]

They had one challenge where they judged blind, don't remember which season. I would love to see them do it regularly. They develop biases about the contestants' strengths as the seasons move along, but they came into this season already having ideas and biases about them, so it would be even more useful.

[ipsedixit]

I think it would be especially relevant during the finale episodes -- where the judges are so familiar with each chef.

I suppose that's why they have guest judges, to counterbalance the inherent biases that Tom and Padma may have and/or develop.

But still, I think it would interesting to have it on a more consistent basis.

[JasmineG]

One thing that I've read from the judges, though, is that by the finale they're so familiar with the styles of the chefs that they would easily be able to tell whose is whose just by the food. I'm sure that's even more so in this season.

[ipsedixit]

Gnocchi? Fabio!

Crudo or sashimi? Angelo!

Plating with a spoon? Angelo! (per Spike)

[Nettie]

Scallops? Jamie!
Liquid nitrogen? Richard!

[debbiel]

I agree. Even early in this season, they might have guessed certain chefs, having had much of an earlier season with each chef.

[John E.]

What is a bit funny us the reaction we give to shows like this. I posted how this EC was set up for the chefs to fail. Well, duh, that's the point. If everything went smoothly then it would make for boring television. The challenges aren't set up to be fair. They are set up to pit one chef against another. The producers are glad that Jamie is still around. Having someone to hate makes viewers interested and helps the ratings as well. Every season seems to have someone who is a target for nasty comments except for seasons 5 and 7, I don't recall if they did. The only person that didn't deserve the a use, in my opinion, was Robin of TC 6. She might have been annoying, but Mike and Eli went overboard. They should have just ignored her like Brian and Kevin seemed to. (I think Jamie deserves most of what she is receiving and when I say that I'm referring to what the other chefs are sayingon the show, maybe some posts about her have been a little over the top).

[dcdavis]

I think this was the worst episode of Top Chef ever! Impossible challenge. Throwing chefs into a completely different world. Two serving and one expediting and cooking! Just ridiculous! Oh gee, the guy who grew up on Asian food won! What a surprise. Sounds like a set up to eliminate specific people. Very disappointing! They could have attempted a version Dim Sum in the Top Chef kitchen and eliminated the overblown service aspect. It isn’t Top Service. It's Top Chef!

[debbiel]

Hmm..I agree that the challenge was bad for having two people work front of house. But otherwise, I thought it was a great challenge. I wouldn't call it a "completely different world". I think chefs would have some knowledge of Chinese cooking or, like Fabio, have enough understanding to use some flavors with techniques one is comfortable with. Who do you think they were trying to eliminate specifically?

[Miss Needle]

Yes, I think the challenges are pretty varied and not designed to eliminate a specific person in mind. Catering challenges favor the caterers. Restaurant wars favor those who work in restaurants. Ethiopian food challenges favor ... er, no one.

[dach]

There is nothing crippling about ethnic food challenges.

Tiffany D has done very well on these "ethnic" challenges -- getting tops in ethiopian and indian food in her season, and getting top mention in dim sum in TCAS. So her results are no fluke.

And she isn't one with the particularly worldly food background, but she clearly has a great feel for flavors, what tastes good and the techniques to pull it off. That's what a "Top Chef" should be.
"
"

[Ruth Lafler]

Well, the Ethiopian challenge should have favored Angelo, who had worked in an Ethiopian restaurant.

These challenges are not unfair because the judges don't penalize you for making a dish that isn't authentic. They want you to be "inspired by" the cuisine, not try to replicate it: the Ethiopian challenge was a good example, since Tiffany, who had never eaten Ethiopian food, won using her "inspiration." Or Episode 4 when Dale won for a dish he served at WD-50 even though he didn't try to use their signature molecular gastronomy techniques; all he had to do was present a delicious dish that could credibly be described as being inspired by Wylie Dufresne's cooking.

No one who has made a well-prepared delicious dish has ever been sent home from Top Chef just because it wasn't authentic enough or failed to meet all the guidelines of the challenge in some way. Now, if you make a crappy dish that lands you in the bottom group, how well it fit the parameters of the challenge may be a factor they consider, but the fact is, on Top Chef, if you present the judges with a good dish, you won't be sent home (until close to the end when sometimes there are basically all good dishes and the judges have to split hairs to decide among them, since they aren't allowed to say "everything was delicious and you can all stay")

[The Dairy Queen]

Ruth, I agree with you. Their food doesn't have to be "authentic", it just has to taste good, be edible, and be inspired by the cuisine. I'm pretty certain Fabio's ribs on this EC weren't "authentic", but they apparently tasted good, and that was enough.

~TDQ

[Miss Needle]

Oh, you're right. I totally forgot Angelo had experience with Ethiopian food.

I will say, however, that I think chefs who have experience in a certain cuisine do have an advantage over the others, even if they don't have to make it authentic. They may not always be the winners, but I think it's easier for them to understand the flavor profiles and techniques.

[The Dairy Queen]

Sometimes I think having experience in a particular cuisine can work against them. Angelo didn't win the Ethiopian challenge; Tiffany did. And didn't she win the EC that same episode with a Mexican-esque dish? I think inspiration counts more than authenticity sometimes.

~TDQ

[Miss Needle]

Didn't Angelo come in the top in the Ethiopian challenge? If so, I don't think his experience worked against him.

[The Dairy Queen]

Tiffany won. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Chef...

I think it can work against you if you try to be too rigid. Angelo was near the top, but Tiffany won.

~TDQ

[Miss Needle]

I am aware that Tiffany won. But wasn't Angelo in the top tier along with Tiffany?

[huiray]

Yes. In fact, IIRC, Samuelsson even asked him if he was actually Ethiopian, because the dish he prepared was very much in character for the cuisine.

[Ruth Lafler]

Yes, except that I think it did work against him: he did a faithful version of the dish, but it wasn't interesting or creative or particularly inspired, which is what the judges are looking for.

It's kind of like what I told my students when I was a tutor: when I ask you what the answer to the question is, it's not because I need to know the answer -- I already know the answer! With a few exceptions where they specifically asked the chefs to recreate a dish, the judges don't want the contestants to show that you they make traditional dishes just as they are traditionally made -- they "already know" those dishes. They want to see the chefs put their own stamp on the dishes they make. It's Top Chef, not Top LineCook!

[The Dairy Queen]

Yes, he was in the top.

~TDQ

[huiray]

...according to the palates and expectations of Colicchio & Co - i.e. the judges. Food that is authentic to an ethnic cuisine and entirely tasty to a native diner or even other people may well be objectionable to the tastes of Colicchio & Co.

p.s. Not responding specifically to you, TDQ. Just a general comment/opinion about this facet of the overall discussion.

[Ruth Lafler]

That's true, too. "Know your audience" is always good advice!

[dcdavis]

All true! I guess I was in a mood that day!

[goodhealthgourmet]

"Impossible challenge. Throwing chefs into a completely different world...Sounds like a set up to eliminate specific people. "
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
now we're starting with conspiracy theories? the chefs have to expect that they'll be thrown into unfamiliar territory, that's part of what makes for a good challenge..and good TV. besides, they all come from varied professional and personal backgrounds so how would you expect the producers to come up with challenges every single week that fall within the realm of ALL (or none) of the chefs? it's just not feasible. when they had that challenge at Le Bernardin was it unfair to the chefs who didn't have strong seafood backgrounds? was the challenge at Le Cirque a setup to eliminate the chefs who don't specialize in French cuisine? what about offal challenges? or the one with exotic proteins?

[John E.]

I wonder what impact this series is having on Jamie and the restaurant where she works. She has come off so poorly (deservedly) that there must be some negative feedback getting to her.

[tofuburrito]

Piling on Jamie has been particularly harsh on this board. It would probably be inaccurate to project the feelings of the few who post here to a general consensus in the world at large.

[LindaWhit]

I'm pretty sure the piling on Jamie is happening on many other blog websites as well.

[tofuburrito]

I agree but from what I've read, it is more of the "why can't she get it together?" nature rather than the "I hate her guts!" variety.

[NellyNel]

No one is saying we hate her guts..
We are saying she has been terrible thus far, on allstars AND she has an obnoxious, snotty attitude.
(Both of which are entirely true.)

[tofuburrito]

Well, I would say opinions rather truths. I agree she hasn't been performing up to previous standards but to me it gets weird when people start making character assessments and create psychological profiles based on seeing a person for a few minutes per week on a TV show.
We don't know what was going on in her life at the time, there could be any number of reasons why she has been struggling.

[The Dairy Queen]

I don't know anything about Jaimie or her restaurant or even her performance on her previous season of TC, but I do feel bad if this show is starting to drive customers away from her restaurant. She may just not be cut out for competitive cooking, but that doesn't mean she isn't perfectly capable of running her restaurant.

What I think is odd, is that she seems to be performing very poorly in AllStars when, presumably, she did very well in her original season in order to become an AllStar. Has it just gotten that much more competitive, or is she just worn out or something?

Anyway, it most certainly would be better for her image for her to pack her unused knives and go (I don't know who said that, but I love it) soon, than to continue limp along with poor performance and/or a bad edit. Unless, of course, she's going to pull the SECOND top chef MIRACLE and dazzle us for the rest of the season.

I did think the scallop montage was hilarious. She is perhaps stuck in a rut. She probably gravitates towards them because they are so quick (and delicious when done well.)

~TDQ

[cowboyardee]

She was always kind of moody, and even when she was doing well in her original season, she tended to rely on just a few go-to techniques and tricks (not that I'm faulting her). Stefan lusting after her (that was her main storyline), joking or not, allowed her to come off in a more sympathetic light.

In this season, she's seemed to be in a bad mood since episode 2 (possibly because she thinks she is blamed for Jen's departure, if I might hazard a guess). I think she might have been feeling a little intimidated already, and that she just got in a bad head space after that episode and it has made her come off as whiny, undeserving. I see no reason to believe she's actually a bad or particularly unpleasant person, but she probably doesn't have enough composure and charisma and on-the-fly cooking chops to be on reality TV and do herself or her business many favors.

[The Dairy Queen]

Interesting, thank you!

~TDQ

[soupkitten]

i didn't mind jamie until on her season they visited le bernardin and jamie basically snootily turned her nose up at all the food there. the whole experience was wasted on her and she obviously thought it was beneath her to attempt to cook fish like eric ripert's kitchen does. i could not believe the look on her face while she was eating one of the dishes-- she looked like i look when i'm face to face with a plate of microwaved white castle sliders-- just disgusted and not trying to hide it from the camera. in my mind, there will be no redemption for jamie after that-- i'm convinced she wouldn't know good food from a wheelbarrow of manure, much less cook it. jamie needs to go write an encyclopedia set full of food she doesn't know about and can't cook, or get out of the biz, or hang out with elia or something.

[joonjoon]

Yes, for me the Le Bernardin episode is what defined Jamie as a chef.

You're in the presence of one of the world's greatest chefs, in one of the world's greatest restaurants..and all you can do is complain and whine about how it's not your style? Celebrity treatment at a 3 Michelin star restaurant is beneath you?

Jme does NOT deserve to be on TC All Stars.

[debbiel]

Have people been making character assessments of Jamie? I thought they were just doing that for Jen and Angelo. :)

[AMFM]

ok. i'm gonna stand up for jaime. she's not done much. and she was wimpy when she cut her finger but she hasn't proven to be a bad person. she's not hating on anyone else. she acknowledges she's been a weak link. she cooked a few decent things. comparatively...

i think it's easy to make her look bad for tv but she really hasn't been that awful. do i think she should be top chef? no. do i think she deserves the crazy vitriol on here? not really.

[JonDough]

I just think it is crazy that she went from "my food is better than theirs" attitude to the down beaten attitude she has now.

[chowser]

I might have missed it but what "crazy vitriol"?

[AMFM]

wanting her to wear a clown suit? implying she must be sleeping with people?
"couldn't believe what a B jaime was". i mean it may be hyperbole but people are harsh to her considering compared to contestants in other seasons it seems she's just been lackluster and trying to hide.

[John E.]

The clown suit reference was about making Jaime participate in the team challenges. She refused to go out with her food at the tennis challenge. The comment wasn't really about clowns.

To what are you referring when you say someone is implying she must be sleeping with people? I have no idea what that means.

[Ruth Lafler]

Not implying, saying: "This competition has lost all credibility with me. I'm just watching it now to see what other excuses they give to keep Jamie. Seriously is she sleeping with one of the judges or producers or black mailing them??! "

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/7577...

[John E.]

I must have missed that post and this thread is way too long to look for anything. With the exception of the reference to her influencing the producers, I don't think the criticism of Jamie has been that far over the top, there just has been a lot of it. I'm sure Bravo and the Elves are thrilled.

[NellyNel]

I must say, I did think she was a bit bitchy when she said "I thought the beans were delicious - she must have PMS (Antonia)"
and when she snapped at Antonia and said "I don't have time"

I call it as I see it!

[AMFM]

see i thought antonia was too. i could NEVER work in a girl kichen. too much estrogen. and i am one! :)

but i get we all see things differently. i by no means want to be her best friend - or have her on my team for that matter! i just still find others more annoying. :)

[chicgail]

No one complained about too much testosterone in the kitchen when Michael V snapped at Robin in the kitchen in Season 6. We all - men and women - have much less tolerance for women's anger or irritation than we do when men are that way.

[Miss Needle]

I think Jamie has been getting it pretty badly. This was on her twitter account:

"Happy holidays to all nice people out there who have nothing but rude things to say abt me...sincerely, Jamie."

[chicgail]

I can imagine that her feeling may have been hurt. But, hey, if you put yourself on reality TV, you've got to take all the editing and the chatter that goes with it.

[tofuburrito]

I agree but I don't think the people doing the chattering (myself included) are immune from criticism. Forum posting is the same, you're putting yourself out there and whatever comes back at you is part of the deal.
The fact that someone like Jamie isn't here to give her side makes her an easy target.

[chicgail]

<<The fact that someone like Jamie isn't here to give her side makes her an easy target.>>

How do we know she's not here? Just saying.

[Worldwide Diner]

Even if she was, she can't tell you to eff off because she'll immediately get banned.

[chowser]

The feeling isn't exclusive to this board. Check out the Bravo blogs and read the comments. Even Tom had unflattering comments about her action (or inaction) in the tennis challenge.

http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/season-8/blogs/tom-colicchio/some-dim-dim-sum
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/season-8/blogs/tom-colicchio/tennis-serve
http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

I've yet to read a great positive review of her performance on the show so far.

[LindaWhit]

I haven't read TWoP yet during the All-Star season, but I can only IMAGINE what's been said there!

[John E.]

When I said deservedly I was referring to the way her competitors are reacting to her nit people piling on with insults on websites such as this. I make a few snide comments but so far I don't think I've been mean spirited. I haven't yet written too much about Marcel though.

[jujuthomas]

It was an entertaining episode, but omg, Dim sum was a train wreck! I'll have to read the blogs this evening at home.
I'm seriously bummed that Casey went home and Jamie is still there! augh! As others said, I knew Casey would be the one when they said inedible, but I still held out hope for Jamie.

[NellyNel]

I watched it again last night, and couldn't believe what a B Jamie was!
She definitely should have gone -no question!
She had 2 bad dishes AND she wasnt out on the floor like Casey was.

I hadn't caught when she said "the beans are delicious - she just must have PMS (Antonia)!
And how rudely she told Antonia she didnt have time to work on the bean dish.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[SDGourmand]

I think this is the first time that everyone is in agreement about contestant going home.. The longer she stays the more her image is getting killed.. She is so miserable and has a negative answer to everything she does..

[lisavf]

Anybody else notice how on the alltopchef website, after a contestant is told to PYKAG, their photo is faded out to look like an apparition? Kind of cool.

http://www.alltopchef.com/

[nomadchowwoman]

I enjoyed this thread almost as much as the episode. Actually, I watched all of the episodes yesterday, and all I can say is "wow" to the eliminations so far. I was actually afraid Carla was going to get sent home last night, and that would have really sucked. I'm in total agreement about the FOH unfairness. I find it amazing anyone agrees to put him/herself at such a disadvantage. I wonder what would happen if noone agreed to do FOH.

[dach]

foh duties was unfair, but thats how they decided that themselves.

i thought it woulh have been fairest if they take foh shifts. it was irking seeing dale aloofly wipe his shoes with all the chaos going on.

such chaos is what happens without incentive to organize the kitchen, everyone out for themself. lots of ego. communist fallacy!

[huiray]

"it was irking seeing dale aloofly wipe his shoes with all the chaos going on."
-----------
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/7577...

[Ruth Lafler]

I don't think Carla was anywhere near elimination -- I think that was a case of editing making it look closer than it was. They criticized the blandness of the dish, but at least it was properly executed, as opposed to Tre's dish that was bland AND poorly executed and Jamie and Casey's dishes that were hot messes.

[nomadchowwoman]

I was afraid she was--esp. after the shock of how those earlier episodes played out. But I watched all the episodes in a row and definitely was not as attuned to the nuances in editing as you all are. But I didn't want to read earlier threads before watching the episodes. Now I'm going to keep up w/the episodes so I can keep up with this, which I find just as entertaining and enlightening.

[cowboyardee]

Right before they announced who's going home, Tom said something like "Carla, a good sauce can't save a bland spring roll." And I thought, oh, NOW they mention the sauce. Well, Carla's not going home. They might as well have mentioned it in cooking or presentation.

This is one of my pet peeves with the show. They edit out elements of the food and the judges' opinions of it seemingly just to create fake dramatic tension.

[a213b]

sigh ... that's what reality editing is. On this and pretty much every other show. I'm fairly confident in this statement, because I work in "unscripted" television.

The presentation of the characters is manipulated to set up tension, drama, and story arcs. As I've said before, best to take all presentations with a grain of salt.

[cowboyardee]

Sigh...
I'm well acquainted with reality, thanks. It's still annoying, regardless of the reality TV precendent and market pressures involved.

[aching]

I also wish they would spend more time on the food! Of course, I would be happy if they made it a two-hour long show so that they could show more food and keep the drama - but they would probably lose a lot of viewers if they did (present company excluded). =)

[debbiel]

+1 A two hour show focused more on the food (including more of JT) would be great.

[chowser]

I agree. I also think that Antonia wasn't in danger of leaving, either, with her shrimp toast that everyone raved about. It wasn't her fault that Jamie messed up the beans that she prepped, although it was a poor decision for her to agree to work w/ Jamie. I do think it shows the high level of competition here. You can have an excellent dish and still be in the bottom.

[gmk1322]

I think I got it figured out...Jamie has adopted the strategies developed by Dr. Grant (Sam Neill) in Jurassic Park to stay in the competition. If you recall the T-Rex can only see you and then eat you based on movement, if you didn't move you were safe. Jamie has taken this one step further and it is working surprisingly well, if I don't actually cook then they can't judge/kick me off.

But I do HATE these challenges that force a contestant to rely on their competition to make their dish properly and then send them home for that dish being bad!

[LindaWhit]

ROFL! OK, I like the "avoid the T-Rex" method of cooking, gmk. ;-)

[jackbauer]

I'm looking forward to seeing Marcel and Dale scrap. Not sure who to root for, they both suffer from a chronic case of little man's disease.

[LindaWhit]

I'll take Dale in a heartbeat in that scrap.

[Withnail42]

Remember folks all we saw were edited previews.

[LindaWhit]

I have a feeling what we saw in the previews is going to be mostly it - a lot of chest pounding from both. I think (hope!) Dale T. has grown and won't get physical.

I still think he'd win in a scrap between the two, however. ;-)

[Withnail42]

Let's hope it does come to that. I like Dale. Always thought he could be a real dark horse for the win. Hate to see him turn into The Cliff of this season. For that matter I hope they get as far in regards to mirroring to season two as they can.

I felt that Marcel for his part was victim of editing that took advantage mean girl Ilan (and what ever his fixation/fantasy about Marcel was) and his lap dog Ellia stirring things up.

[Worldwide Diner]

Marcel has been threatened with physical harm many times but he has never threatened anyone with physical violance that I've seen. Didn't he get whacked with a bottle at a bar? People are crazy....

[attran99]

This episode was like watching an amazing train wreck....you couldn't take your eyes off the screen! I loved seeing Tom's bad-ass skills come into play....I know that that definitely couldn't make something in 8:37...amazing work! I'm so glad that Dale's finding his stride, and showing what he's really capable of.
Marcel needs to grow up. His snide comments (meant sarcastically or not) do not help his case. Just let your cooking speak for itself...no need for the childish behavior or on camera antics.
How Jamie made it through instead of Casey really shocks me. Is it me or does Jamie not seem as focused or determined as she was in Season 5? In my opinion, if she doesn't want it as much, she should get out and let a more deserving cheftestant have a shot.

[goodhealthgourmet]

"Is it me or does Jamie not seem as focused or determined as she was in Season 5? "
~~~~~~~~~
did you see the link in last week's thread to the Isabella interview? you should watch the video - he said straight out that she doesn't want to be there and knows she can't hold her own against the others.

[NellyNel]

This time,around, she seems like she is on a constant supply of valium!

[ipsedixit]

Anyone been to Jamie's restaurant in LA? Beechwood? It generally gets mostly positive reviews.

[goodhealthgourmet]

i *used to* want to go...until this season of TC started. i live right up the street and pass it every day, but have zero desire to eat there now that i've witnessed her behavior and attitude this time around.

[ipsedixit]

Maybe it really doesn't matter that she was on TC, because maybe like on TC she does none of the cooking at Beechwood.

[goodhealthgourmet]

VERY good point.

[Ruth Lafler]

I would not consider Mike Isabella a reliable source for what Jamie thinks or feels. Is there any reason to believe otherwise, considering his condescending attitude towards women chefs in general and his hate on Jamie in particular?

[JonDough]

He got along with Jennifer Carroll just fine. Maybe his dislike for Jamie is from him believing that Jaime is the reason Jennifer was kicked off?

Btw - Jamie is a mess. Has she made one successful dish yet? It definitely doesn't look like she is on her game.

[cowboyardee]

First episode elimination challenge, Jamie's dish was in the top. However, it was just a recreation of one of Eric Ripert's dishes. I don't know how faithful it was.

[sommrluv]

On the extended judges table, I think it was Gail that said Jamie is looking and acting more deflated than her scallop dumplings. ;)

[chowser]

I didn't like Mike his season because he came off as arrogant and anti-woman. But, the more I've read about him, from interviews with him and others, I think his sarcastic humor didn't come over well. He and Jen seem to have a great working relationship and a lot of respect for each other. His comment about Jamie, if it's from the same interview I've seen, was initiated by a viewer who asked if he thought she didn't want to be there. This episode shows that Jamie should go back to not cooking--she was doing so much better without.

[JonDough]

I really enjoyed Mike I's and Fabio's tweets from last night.

Mike: How funny is that @jamielauren didn't cook a dish again. LMAO

Fabio: Jamie ??? ONE CLAM ?? are you F kidding me ??? LMAO

It does feel like she is being picked on..but I am sure everyone feels like she should pack her unused knives and go.

[goodhealthgourmet]

did you watch the interview? Mike said that Jamie has made it clear to all of them that she doesn't want to be there. i may not be Isabella's biggest fan, but i don't think he'd say something like that point-blank unless it was valid.

[ipsedixit]

Maybe that's just Jamie being passive-aggressive. Feigning ennui and disinterest only so there's no pressure on here because she REALLY wants to win.

[aching]

Or maybe she knows she's not going to win and wants to be able to say afterwards that it was because she wasn't really trying and wasn't really into it - rather than because she wasn't good enough.

[debbiel]

I sure hope not aching. That would be very, very sad and pathetic and...icky.

[chicgail]

sad, pathetic and icky. But also human.

[John E.]

I think you nailed it. If she doesn't really try, she can't really fail.

[John E.]

I especially don't wish to hear about any of Jamie's dates.

[huiray]

http://www.chicagonow.com/blogs/reali...

[LindaWhit]

Interesting.....

I asked Dale, would he cross the street to avoid any fellow contestants?

"When you are in a kitchen, it's a very different dynamic. Marcel [Vigneron, Season Two] is a guy who I'd like to go out and have a drink with, but being in the kitchen with him is not my cup of tea. It's frustrating; he's really difficult. I cannot imagine working in a kitchen with that guy."

And I *love* the way the article ends: "By the way, Dale is a die hard Bear's fan, but has a nagging suspicion the Patriots may go all the way. Secretly, I hope he is right."

:-D

[goodhealthgourmet]

"Dale is a die hard Bear's fan"
~~~~~~~~
really? just one of them, not the whole team? hmm, i wonder which particular Chicago player he's rooting for ;)

[gaffk]

Ugh, punctuation violations should be overlooked as long as the meaning is clear.

[huiray]

Yes. It might be easier if people just simply said that they did not like Dale.

[gaffk]

Yes, my name is gaffk and I don't like Dale Talde.

[goodhealthgourmet]

@gaffk, anyone who has ever worked as an English teacher or editor would be inclined to disagree with you on that one...including yours truly.
@huiray, my comment had nothing to do with Dale, i was responding to the blogger's misplaced apostrophe.

[gaffk]

Actually, I was an English major and worked a few years as a writing instructor at a public university. If we all proofread every posting with the same rigor as student papers?

[goodhealthgourmet]

i hear you, and i know we all make mistakes...even i can admit i've posted the occasional typo ;) but errors like the one above always make me nuts because they're typically not isolated incidents...and to ignore them is to perpetuate the problem.

anyway, i should have posted a smiley emoticon after my comment because it wasn't intended to be taken so seriously!

ETA: smile added. fortunately i was still within "edit" time.

[gaffk]

lettuce all keep it lite ;)

[chicgail]

The whole point of punctuation is to make meaning clear. Apostrophes that people throw into plural words drive me crazy.

[ipsedixit]

Susur Lee: "I could sit in front of the TV for 2 or 3 hours and not finish one of those chicken feet"

Random customer: "Caucasian dim sum" That was probably putting it kindly. Chinese folks are usually much more direct, esp. at dim sum.

Green beans aren't exactly a dim sum dish.

Those were some of the most pathetic scallop dumplings I"ve ever seen in my life.

More Susur: "You don't steam store-bought dumpling skins that are meant to be boiled"

Preview of next week ... um, isn't that a total ripoff of The Next Iron Chef?

[goodhealthgourmet]

"Preview of next week ... um, isn't that a total ripoff of The Next Iron Chef?"
~~~~~~~~~~~~
yes! that's exactly what i was thinking. i'm interested to see where in NY they go fishing - i assume it will be the Long Island Sound.

[ipsedixit]

Better question is, would you really want to eat a fish caught off the shores of Long Island?

(Relax people, I jest I jest ... I know the fishing is perfectly fine along Long Island).

[chowser]

LOL, so you don't think they said "caucasian"? I couldn't hear it so need to go back to that scene. Hmmm, is there a pc chinese equivalent for "caucasian"?

[Fukui San]

I think there's an implied sneer in the term they used that was translated as "caucasian". Maybe "whitey" would have been a better translation.

[soupkitten]

bakgwei, i'd assume. . .

[huiray]

pak kwei lo. (白鬼佬)

There were also some uncomplimentary things being said by the customers that were not subtitled by Bravo...

[The Dairy Queen]

Such as?

~TDQ

[chicgail]

Do share.

[ipsedixit]

There were also some uncomplimentary things being said by the customers that were not subtitled by Bravo...
________________________

Yes, like "what the hell is going on" ...

[chicgail]

It was on a subtitle. We have to assume the translation was accurate.

[JasmineG]

Why do we have to assume that? I figured at the time that it was Bravo's TV friendly translation of what was said. I'd love a native speaker to translate for real for us.

[chicgail]

I guess we don't have to assume anything. If someone has another translation, please post it.

[raebmv]

I don't remember any of the translations as being inaccurate. But I'm fairly sure that they only televised the relatively polite comments. Believe you me, older Chinese food are NOT amused when you mess with their dim sum. I once brought a family friend to a dim sum that did a few 'fusion' dishes (think truffle, foie gras) - it was certainly not appreciated. lol.

[dach]

"Preview of next week ... um, isn't that a total ripoff of The Next Iron Chef?

It was also done on Ramsey's Masterchef before NIC

Maybe it will become a standard challenge? How about hunting and butchering a rabbit... saw that on english countryside cooking show

[foodseek]

I look forward to these episode recaps -thank you Linda! In agree with most posters , the EC should not include one or two chefs having to work the front of house especially while their dishes are being "watched" and plated by other competitors. It puts the front of house chef at a disadvantage to say the least. And at this stage of TC All Stars they are not getting any Brownie points for taking one for the team. I have to watch the episode again because I thought I heard Dale comment on the other chefs lack of dim sum experience (not surprising) and the way the kitchen was being run (also no surprise). Because of his attitude, I was not rooting for Dale on this challenge. I was hoping Fabio would get the win.

[debbiel]

Serious Eats is back to recapping TC. This one is so-so I think, but I like the Rachel Ray/Tom comparison.

http://www.seriouseats.com/2011/01/re...

[LindaWhit]

OK, this is a line I missed last night - a MAJOR duh! moment! LOL

"Marcel—who may or may not be Wolverine's puny, adorable little brother—took the opportunity to enlighten us all on the locale. "Chinatown is like going to China," he explained. "Everyone there is Chinese." "

[NellyNel]

LOL
Who said that?!

[goodhealthgourmet]

it's in the Serious Eats recap.

[lisavf]

Let's talk Angelo for a moment. I completely forgot about this until I was just reading the episode recap on EW:

"Speaking of mean: Let's discuss Angelo's memory of picking grains of rice with his father. What started out as some sort of emotional reverie turned into a weird confession about their strange father-son relationship. "My job was to sort through every single granule of rice and pick out all the bad ones," he said. "And I'll tell you, if there was a black one in there, my ass was grass." It didn't help that his dad was proud of him only after he went on TV. Angelo has layers like an onion, I tells ya."

I think there's more to Angelo than meets the eye. Maybe his "helping" everyone is really a symptom of needing everything to be "perfect" for his father. How truly sad!

I never did understand all the hate for Angelo last season. Sure, he's a bit of an odd duck, but his food seems to be pretty consistently good, and he's not all about the drama. I hope we find out more about him as the season goes forward.

[LindaWhit]

Interestingly, that's really NO different than Jennifer Carroll and her "father issues".

But she got ripped apart for what she said in the confessional about her father saying winning was everything, 2nd place was nothing and "what would he think about 2nd to last?"

I think most of these chefs have perfection issues. We *know* Blais is a perfectionist, as is Marcel, Jennifer, Angelo and several others. Where they got it? Don't know - but family relationships can always have an effect on raising those issues later in life, yes?

[chowser]

I agree--I actually think Angelo's is far worst. His fond memories are with his father and cooking that way? I feel bad for him, far worst than someone whose father thinks winning is everything.

[cowboyardee]

"I actually think Angelo's is far worst."
___
Agreed. People made a lot of assumptions in Jen's case, when all we really heard was that her father was competitive. So what?

Angelo straight up said his father was harsh and demanding when he was a child, and never was proud of him until his success on Top Chef.

[NellyNel]

I can't believe we are now comparing ideas about who had a worse childhood!

LOL

We are all in need of help!

[cowboyardee]

Ehhh, it's fun.

[mariacarmen]

AND on re-watching the show today (taped), I noticed that he said that his dad was proud of him UNTIL he got to Singapore, which seems to say that once he got sick on national t.v. his dad was disappointed in him. I felt bad for him, he actually looked like he might have been about to tear up.

[JuniorBalloon]

Huh, I heard the opposite. That he'd never seen his Dad express pride until he went to Singapore. Will have to watch it again.

jb

[NellyNel]

No -maria is wrong - I re-watched last night, and he definitely said his father had never been proud of him before...

[mariacarmen]

ok, transcribed word for word: "before i went to Singapore he was like telling everybody 'oh my son's on t.v.' - and i'd never seen my father proud of me, it was the first time in my life, so that meant a lot to me."

"<<BEFORE>>" he went to Singapore his dad was telling everyone about his son being on t.v. i guess that can be open to interpretation, and maybe i'm reading too much into the being sick thing, but it seems clear his dad was crowing about him before Singapore. anyway, nitpicking.

[jcattles]

"<<BEFORE>>" he went to Singapore his dad was telling everyone about his son being on t.v. i guess that can be open to interpretation,"

My take on it was that his dad was proud of him for making it to the finals in Singapore & Angelo realized it right before he left . I don't think his comment had anything to do with him getting sick in Singapore.

That's the problem with reality tv, alot of it is taken out of context so we never really know the full story behind a comment.

[mariacarmen]

it's very true.

[DGresh]

I agree. I imagine it simply means that in the break between the bulk of the season and the finale he went home to see his folks, and his dad was bragging all over the place about his performance. No more and no less than that.

[debbiel]

That's my take to jcattles. I assume that in the time between filming most of the season and going to Singapore, his Dad expressed how proud he was of him.

[John E.]

I happen to like Angelo. I didn't like him so much at the beginning of TC 7 but I thought his interview comments were pretty funny. I still don't like the way he says 'with' however.

[chowser]

Yeah, but he could order a cheesesteak wit and not be given a hard time in Philly.

[John E.]

Yea, I find that annoying too. I might be going to Philadelphia in the near future and if I do, Pat's and Geno's are not on my list of places to have cheesesteaks. I've heard that Tony Luke's is better but I don't know which location is best.

[gaffk]

There's only one location in Philly that I'm aware of--Oregon Ave in South Philly. His other locations are outside the city.

[John E.]

It turns out my relatives don't actually live in Philadelphia, but in Haverford. I don't know anything about that place. I was also thinking of going to 10 Arts downtown. (If I here a lot of profanity from the kitchen we'll know Jen is working). We probably wouldn't do both on the same trip though.

[gaffk]

Haverford is an easy trip to the city--by car or train (as long as it isn't a weekday rush hour).

I thoroughly enjoyed 10 Arts--not only do they have Jen, but a super pastry chef as well.

There are actually a lot of great restaurants in Philly. You should check out the Philly CH board as you get closer to your visit.

[roxlet]

Karma. That's what I thought about Casey going home. After she was sous chef for Carla in Carla's finale and suggested the sous vide idea, she then trashed talked about Carla in a subsequent interview. That being said, I thought that there should have been greater recognition that both she and Carla "took one for the team" by pushing the carts and therefore had less control over their dishes. But really -- it was shocking that Jamie didn't go home. She was in the kitchen the entire time and was responsible for cooking not one, but TWO bad dishes. Does she need to be hit with a silver bullet? This was really a miscarriage of justice, though I do believe that karma figured in it.

[sommrluv]

I really hope this team mans up and puts Jamie in some crap role like front of house. No, Jamie, you are serving first. NO, jamie, you must wear the clown costume while we make fair food.

[debbiel]

"NO, jamie, you must wear the clown costume while we make fair food."

Hilarious!!

[C. Hamster]

"NO, jamie, you must wear the clown costume while we make fair food."

BWAH!!!!

[LindaWhit]

NO, jamie, you must wear the clown costume while we make fair food.
~~~~~~~~~
Oh, from your fingers to the producers' ears. :-D Of course, it would have to been done in time travel mode, as the show has already been taped.

But one can always wish, can't one? ;-)

[sommrluv]

:)

[John E.]

Tom said that one inedible dish is worse than two bad dishes.

[soypower]

'Finally, a Top Chef Miracle (pronounced MY-RI-CULL)!'

I wish they would have made them use the same ingredients as Tom. I think that would have been even more interesting.

This show may be turning into the best-of-the-worst fiasco I feared. Of course I'll still watch. But I'm waiting for when they take all the winners and put them in a competition. I suppose they only have 6 so far, so it may be a short show. Have I mentioned this before? Apologies if I have. I really am trying NOT to sound like a broken record.

[mariacarmen]

Linda, thanks and great as usual, but you missed TIFFANY TAKING OFF HER BRA AND WIPING ANTONIA'S FACE WITH IT!!! Why did that make all the boys run away?
I agree that if Casey's dish was simply inedible then she should have gone home, but is it all her fault it was inedible if Antonia was supposed to help? were they completely done and ready to plate for Antonia to do? ok, and watching Casey clip off those little chicken nails grossed me out - looked like she was cutting baby's fingers off!
Jamie's time is coming...... i can SMELL IT.
i love Fabio and his turtle, i choose to believe that is true.
i also love that he said "the first MIRE-acle" about his ribs coming out perfect.
As for the QF, it was really difficult for all those chefs to fight over space getting their ingredients and cookware as compared to Tom having the whole space to hiimself - that took a lot of time off for him.
I do love that comment about not knowing what the meat was in the dim sum from the Asian woman's perspective - i love dim sum but it is not always that i can discern what i am eating!

[Ruth Lafler]

I think the problem with Casey's dish was in the concept: chicken feet are basically all bones and cartilage and need to be braised to soften them enough to eat. Whether Antonia used the right technique to finish them didn't really make any difference if Casey hadn't taken the time well before service to make sure they were cooked until they were tender enough to eat! It seems to me that Casey knew enough to know that chicken feet are traditional for dim sum but not enough to know how to cook them.

[saeyedoc]

I recall Casey asking Antonia how she was reheating the feet (implying they were already cooked). When Antonio told her she was deep frying them, Casey told her they should be reheated in the Wok. I think they were beyond saving at that point.

[LindaWhit]

I did miss the bra episode, mariacarmen - I was busy typing towards the end and missed a lot of the house stuff, but caught the end of it. Since I hadn't seen what prompted the mass exodus of the guys (although I knew it had to do with a bra!), I didn't put it in. Sowwy. ;-)

[jujuthomas]

that clip had me HOWLING! especially with Jamie on the floor in a fetal position laughing. :)

[LindaWhit]

I wish that was a bonus clip on the Bravo site. :-)

[Nettie]

I haven't been a big Tiffany fan (her season was before I started watching), but her comments about what would have happened during the QF if she weren't wearing a bra totally cracked me up.

[chicgail]

Tiffany's behavior and her relationship with the other contestants is dramatically different from what it was on her season. Huge transformation. I couldn't stand watching her on that season. I find her delightful this time around. And especially that comment about wearing a bra.

[LindaWhit]

Wasn't it Tiffani (with an "i') who was making the bra remarks and not Tiffany (with a "y")? (Asking everyone, not just you, chicgail.) Since TiffanY was just on last season, I'm thinking the reference that Nettie makes saying she didn't see TC until after Tiffani's season makes it TC1's Tiffani.

And yes - I didn't like Tiffani in TC1. I *really* like her in All-Stars. I do hope she does well.

[chowser]

I don't know if they're more relaxed this time around but there are a few contestants I like more this time around, Tiffani, Mike I, Dale, Antonia, Angelo right off the bat.

[LindaWhit]

I'll agree with you on Tiffani, Mike I, Dale T. and Antonia. I'm still reserving opinion on Angelo. He *does* seem to be shown in a better light this season, at least a bit more relaxed and laughing with the guys.

[Nettie]

Yes, I meant Tiffani, not Tiffany Derry (I didn't look up the spelling before posting).

[goodhealthgourmet]

yes LW, it was Tiffani Faison from TC1.

[debbiel]

I've really liked Tiffani this season, too. I'm not taken enough with her food yet (I guess, since I can't really recall it), but I hope she does well.

[John E.]

Is there some sort of gang in New Jersey, Maryland and D.C. made up of chefs? Mike Isabella seems to be greeting them with their gang signs all the time. He did this during TC Season 6 as well. Or is he merely a wannabe? He really seemed to be a wannabe in his season, always trying to attach himself to the Voltaggios like a Remora or lamprey eel.

[chicgail]

I actually like the new, overweight Mike Isabella a lot better in this season. He's still not who he thinks (or at least says) he is, but I am enjoying him and his cooking.

I thought it was Marcel using gang signs, which seems so much more in his weird character.

[Parrotgal]

I noticed Marcel and his bad self last night and wondered if he really thinks anyone with that hair (and that attitude) is hip hop? What a loser!

[NellyNel]

Sorry, but calling Marcel a "loser" is just plain mean spirited....
Isnt that why eveyone hates HIM - because you all think he's mean spirited?

Such hypocricy!

[karenfinan]

you know, on another blog someone stated he seemed like he had mild Asperger's.I AM NOT DIAGNOSING HIM but I can see why this person would say that. I am of opinion that there is something just "off" in his relating to others- not meanspirited, but sort of clueless and off a beat, if that makes any sense.

[chicgail]

If anyone on the show has Aspergers it would be Angelo.

[cowboyardee]

When I read karenfinan's post initially, I didn't expand Nelly's post above, and I just assumed she was talking about Angelo.

[debbiel]

I see absolutely nothing in Marcel that makes me think Aspergers. And I have a good bit of knowledge and experience in the area. Quirky is not the same as Aspergers.

[chowser]

There was just an article in the WaPo yesterday about chefs losing weight and Mike Isabella was there, having lost 40 pounds since TC All Stars. He said he realized he needed to lose weight there when he couldn't move around the way he did in his season. He does seem to be more fun this time around and less full of himself.

[cowboyardee]

A few thoughts:

I'm going against the crowd - I hope Jamie stays in. I hope she avoids cooking, makes second-worse dish after second-worse dish, messes up collaborations with others, and hangs on by a thread till the very end. Not because I like her especially (though I do think some people are being a little overly harsh in their hatred of her - it's not really her fault she's still around... heck, she's done almost everything she could to get booted). Just because it's making for a good story. It's improbable as hell that she's still around at all... wouldn't it just be crazy if she won? I'm rooting Jamie for eventual winner, by virtue of self-implosion of the other contestants, multiple disqualifications, and judging oversight. Baseball analogy: if your team's pitcher throws a homerun, you hope he pitches better next batter. But if your team's pitcher throws 3,5,10,12 homeruns in a row, eventually you start hoping for another homerun next pitch, cuz history is being made. As Jennifer Carroll stormed off the Top Chef set, she cast a bizarre curse on this season. That curse is Jamie's invincibility.

Also, I'm glad to see Dale get another win. Always liked Dale. Also liked Susur Lee as guest judge.

It's looking like Angelo is, at this point in the season, the front runner to win the whole shebang - a couple wins, and consistently near the top of the heap. I'm just wondering how all the Angelo haters are feeling about this.

I'm also wondering why anyone every volunteers to push carts (or whatever team-oriented but self-injuring job might apply). This isn't season 1 anymore - you know the judges won't give you any bonus points, and it takes time away from your dish. I'm all for team players, but this isn't a team or a professional kitchen. It's a competition. Don't volunteer unless your food has already been served - everyone takes a turn pushing carts. At least draw straws or something.

Finally, I'm hoping one of the blogs reveals whether the problem with Casey's dish was Antonia's final cooking of it, or something much more basic (meaning Casey's fault). I'm thinking the latter, but I can't tell for certain.

[Miss Needle]

This is what Tom says on his blog:

"Perhaps had she made them herself they might have been better, but that was another risk she chose to assume in leaving their execution to Antonia while staffing the front of the house. I doubt it, though. It’s rare that a dish cannot even be eaten; when it happens, the chef responsible for it clearly must be the one sent home."

[goodhealthgourmet]

i honestly might have to stop watching the show on principle if Jamie makes it to the finale. as it is now, every day when i drive by the restaurant where she works (i live right up the street) i have to resist the urge to pull into the driveway, walk in there, and tell her she sucks.

[cowboyardee]

If she wins - will you keep driving by and doing nothing, change your route, or give in to the darkside and maybe make the nightly news?

[goodhealthgourmet]

i might make the nightly news..but not in the way you'd imagine. i'll channel my inner hippie/pacifist and stage a sit-in ;)

[LindaWhit]

And if you ever DO decide to tell her that, ghg, you must report back to us. :-)

[John E.]

Go in there, order the scallops and tell them your name is Casey.

[goodhealthgourmet]

it would be even better if they didn't actually have scallops and i tried to order them, insisting that Jamie *must* make a scallop dish.

actually, i should order scallops, soup and chickpeas - all of which are on the menu at Beechwood - and request my chickpeas well done ;)

[John E.]

Wait until after the finale so you can congratulate her on her big win and ask her when she is going to open her own restaurant using the $200K as seed money.

[LindaWhit]

"it's not really her fault she's still around... heck, she's done almost everything she could to get booted)..."

When Mike Isabella said in an interview a few weeks ago that Jamie had pretty much indicated she didn't want to be there, and *even Jamie* knew she should have gone over Casey last night, why didn't Jamie just up and say "I'm quitting - I'm not the best chef here and I know it, and Casey/whoever shouldn't be leaving"?

As for the FOH situation - I think the "taking turns" is a good idea - rotate in/out as your dishes are served. HOWEVER...that then can disrupt the flow of the FOH, which could be more of a cluster-you-know-what .

I just think they should have someone else serve. These are chefs, not FOH people. (Except for Stephen, and even then, he was just an annoying FOH! LOL)

[John E.]

After a few chefs did that in earlier seasons they don't let the chefs make those decisions anymore. Or at least they don't show the video of it anymore. Bowie was told it wasn't his decision to make in Season 3 in his attempt to save face but was eliminated because he made two crappy dishes.

[momjamin]

TC Just Desserts had a volunteer go home. Different spinoff, but more recent.

[John E.]

They haven't let the chefs on the original TC do this since Mia in season 2 I believe. I don't get it either in the case of the desserts show. She didnt get to see her kids any sooner although I suppose they let her speak to them on the telephone or video skype.

(My post above should have said Howie although he may remind some people of a bulldog).

[cowboyardee]

There is A LOT of money on the line (not to mention professional reputation and branding). Whether or not you feel like being there, once shooting starts, you are there and your reputation is on the line. It's asking a little too much of these chefs to just volunteer to quit when they're outmatched.

That said, I have no idea why Jamie is acting like she doesn't want to be there. To be fair, I'm not sure that we can take Mike I's word as gospel on the matter.

[debbiel]

I don't see Angelo as a front runner. I just don't see anyone as a front runner yet. No one is wow-ing consistently.

I agree that folks should know not to take one for the team. I also think the show's producers should set things up so no one has to take one for the team. No more cart pushing or front of house work!

[LindaWhit]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Chef...

Angelo and Dale Talde both have two EC wins, and Dale has a QC win. But Angelo has more "high group" buckets so far, while Dale is just "In" - meaning safe in the middle group if he didn't win.

Tre and both Tiffani/Tiffany aren't doing as well as I had hoped. In fact, Tre's got several "Low" buckets for the EC challenges, and he's just been lucky with immunity or someone else being drastically worse than him.

[NellyNel]

Right, and I as I mentioned on another thread - Blais hasn't been very impressive thus far.

[LindaWhit]

No, I'm hoping he (Blais) picks it up. I would *really* like him to win this one. :-)

[NellyNel]

Me too, Linda!

He was my pick as winner. I like his food style - it's exciting, and I like his personality.

I do think he will gain momentum, and win it all!

[debbiel]

I would love to see Blais start to show and eventually take it all. And really, it's still early.

[tofuburrito]

I don't see Angelo as a front runner. I just don't see anyone as a front runner yet. No one is wow-ing consistently.

I think Angelo is wowing consistently, Dale & Antonia are very strong and Blais seems to be flying under the radar.

[cowboyardee]

Angelo has a stronger start this season than, say, Harold did at this point of season 1 (and in fact, I think his dish would've had a strong chance to win episode 4's elimination challenge had he been on the winning team). The other chefs are talking about him in interview as one to beat. Seems like front runner status to me.

[chefhound]

The whole cart thing is so old-school. Almost all the dim sum places here (Toronto), and definitely the the top places, retired that a long time ago. The food gets cold as the carts get pushed around, not to mention the constant opening and closing of lids. And you run out of food all the time. Also, it's less hygienic - people talking, sneezing around the carts.

We have forms (little menus if you will) with the items listed and you just write how many you want in the little box next to the item. The food is prepared to order and comes out fresh. Don't they have that in NY? Strangely, for all the times I've been to NY, I've never tried the dim sum. I guess it's because I can't afford to waste a meal in NY with something I know is better at home.

Anyway, my thoughts on Jamie: she won't win but she'll hang on by virtue of always making the second-worst dish, as you suggest Cowboyardee, and be the Lisa of this season.

As for Angelo, he's weird but he's talented. I agree he's the front runner right now. I hope Blais can catch up.

I also agree with you on Dale - I've always admired his no-bullshit attitude so I'm glad he won this one.

One last thought: I think Marcel was just joking. My read on him is that he's socially awkward, insecure and trying so hard to be cool but not mean-spirited. He's passionate about food and says stupid things to cover his disappointment in his own performance. He usually tries to boast that his dish was better than whoever won but I don't think he actually says anything truly mean. He generally says my dish was better that his/hers but he doesn't say stuff like your food is crap and my dog wouldn't even eat it or really mean things like that.

[Worldwide Diner]

I like to see my dim sum before I order it so I prefer the carts. A good dim sum joint should have steamed carts to keep dishes warm. Ordering from a form does have the advantage of letting you know what all is available.

[Ruth Lafler]

Except that there are often things on the carts that aren't on the menus. I think each way of doing it has it's advantages: ordering off the menu means the food is fresher and hotter and that you get any dish you really want; carts are more fun and you're more likely to choose something you're not familiar with. Most places I know in the SF area do some kind of combination. A lot of places only have carts during peak times, but I don't know of a place with carts where you can't also order off a menu.

[NellyNel]

Thanks chef, thats exactly what I have been trying to say about Marcel.

And after a re-watch - I stand by what I say.
I liked how in awe of Tom he was, and you could see on his face how gleeful he was to watch Tom work. It was sweet.
In the entire show, he does not make a negative comment about anyones food (and i can't recall that he had in any of the previous Allstars episodes.
He only said he was surprised Jamie took on 2 dishes in the challenge because "she is probably the slowest one in the kiitchen"
Not mean spireted at all, just stating what is probably fact.

[Indy 67]

Please clarify how the comment (and I'm paraphrasing) "Mike's dish won the quickfire because the judges had the taste of my food in their mouth" isn't a put-down of Mike's food.

[NellyNel]

He was JOKING

[barndog]

No, he wasn't.

[chefhound]

He's saying that his dish tasted so good that it lingered on the judges' palates. It was a joke.

And it's not really mean to Mike. Marcel is just doing his usual thing - self-aggrandizing to make himself feel better. He's not saying Mike's dish isn't good - he's just saying he thinks his was better.

[Indy 67]

Yes. I got the message that his dish tasted so good that it lingered on the judges' palates. My point of view is based on the logical but unspoken follow-up: "Therefore, without my great taste lingering in the mouths of the judges, Mike could not have won."

We completely agree on Marcel's self-aggrandizing. I simply think his comments are frequently at the expense of others. You don't. Neither one of us can prove which is the correct interpretation.

[NellyNel]

Even if you believe that he is demeaning the other chefs - which I personally havent seen - he is just doing what ALL the chefs do!
Carla may be the only one who hasnt done it. Maybe Richard.

What about Jamies "I believe i am a better chef than my teammates"
THAT's obnoxious!

[Nettie]

Maybe that's why I like Carla and Richard better than the others--they don't put down the others. Carla, as far as I know, NEVER says anything negative about someone else (I think I saw a quote from her once to the effect that if you don't say something, they can't use it to make you look bad), and Richard very rarely--I think only about Lisa once during his season, and about Jamie a few times this season. Speaking of which, did anyone catch his wry smile when Jame was saying that she should have gone home in the stew room at the end of the episode?

[Miss Needle]

Ha ha, I did see that smile -- though I think it was probably edited in. Blais was probably smiling at something totally different. Seems like the editors want us to think there's a story with him and Jamie.

[LindaWhit]

Well, there *is* sort of a story - Blais has called Jamie out twice for not cooking. To her face. So while I saw the wry grin on his face as well, I'm thinking there's a good chance it wasn't edited in as a reaction to another comment. It could very well have been just about that - Jamie saying she should have gone home.

[Miss Needle]

I think there are a lot of stories going on that we as viewers aren't privy to. Unless I see Blais's reaction to Jamie's comment in the same frame, I think it's the editors making us thing that there's more than there really is.

[Indy 67]

I see an important distinction between critical remarks that have a basis in fact and critical remarks that are pure fantasy. If a chef makes a demeaning remark about Dale's quickfire dish, that may not be nice behavior, but the comment is rooted in fact. Week after week, Marcel's remarks reflect wishful thinking and rationalization, but don't seem particularly rooted in fact.

As for Jamie... At this point in the competition, her behavior is so irrational that nothing she says makes any sense or should be taken seriously.

Do you know the scene in the movie "Monty Python and the Search for the Holy Grail" where King Arthur gets into a sword fight with the Black Knight? Jamie is the Top Chef equivalent of the Black Knight, spouting brave comments and offering to cook two dishes when everyone knows all she wants is for the misery of competition to be over.

Link to the Black Knight clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7...

[LindaWhit]

Yeah, but when Jamie gets a "flesh wound" she goes to the hospital. The Black Knight just hollers at King Arthur "Come back here and fight like a man!"

;-)

[NellyNel]

ok, give me an example of a critical remark that you are referring to.
I have seen every episode so far twice, and I can't remember Marcel trash talking anyone...but whatever

Black Knight - LOL

[chicgail]

Perhaps "trash talking" is an interpretation that lives with the individual viewer. Consider that if you like Marcel, you wouldn't find it. If you don't like Marcel, you'll hear a lot of it.

[Indy 67]

I've cited the example from this week's episode (Mike's creation was the winning dish because I...), but I'd have to re-watch past episodes to supply any more specific examples. Unfortunately, that is something I have neither the time nor the inclination to do.

If it matters deeply, I'll post an example on this thread after I watch next week's episode. And that's my point. I'm very confident that Marcel will make some sort of remark next week and every week he remains in the competition. He's clearly not getting the recognition he feels he deserves, and his comments are his effort to compensate. What's truly sad about Marcel's behavior is that many of his comments have no basis in reality outside of his own head.

[Worldwide Diner]

Marcel does think his food is better than the other chef's but that's not "demeaning." Demeaning is saying their food taste like saw dust or garbage.

[debbiel]

Black night reference--score 100 fantastic pointing points for Indy 67.

[kmcarr]

There is a bonus video on Bravo's Top Chef site with several of the chefs sitting on the balcony of their condo discussing the QF challenge. This subject comes up; Marcel believes that the MSG in his dish carried over while Tom and Padma were tasting Mike I's dish, enhancing the flavor of his dish. Marcel doesn't sound like he is joking. I believe he can't accept the fact that they preferred Mike's dish to his so he has to come up with a lame excuse to explain it.

Here is the video: http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

[jeanmarieok]

Toronto has very good dim sum - and I like the little forms, too. The last place I had cart service was in SF, as a matter of fact.

[The Dairy Queen]

I love the forms because you know exactly what you're getting and that it will be coming out hot from the kitchen. But the carts allow for a little more serendipity, which I also like, assuming they manage the carts well and you're situated at the beginning of the circuit and the food isn't cold.

~TDQ

[huiray]

I wouldn't be so dismissive of dim sum carts. They are fine in their own way. Just go up to a cart and get what you want (card in hand, if needed) if you want to after you note what is being 'offered' from that cart. There's that thing about serendipity too. Depends on the place, also, as to if it comes out piping hot and fresh, or if it sits on the cart before being wheeled around. Simple observation does wonders. Sneezing around carts etc - huh? Perhaps you need to relax a little. Carts usually have stacks of steam trays with the same item in each stack - I don't see why opening the top tray to show a diner what it is would mean that everything gets cold - indeed, in my experience the server would give you a lower tray for your table...and unless you are getting only ONE tray at a time, once the trays (plural) hit your table top they start getting cold anyway before you get around to eating it all...

Order cards/forms are fine too, just depends on which place one goes to. I think both ways are available depending on the town and restaurant - certainly NY and Chicago (at least) does both. Order cards/forms DO require the diner to know what the dishes are - not something everyone can be assumed to know.

Here's a Chowhound thread on carts versus order forms: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/719520

[chefhound]

I'm not being dismissive - I'm just pointing out that it's a bit dated and explaining my reasons why I'm glad we've moved on.

Specifically about this challenge, two chefs were taken out of the kitchen, unfairly affecting their chances of presenting a good dish. If they used the order form system instead of the carts, maybe the results would have been different. And the kitchen wouldn't have been such a mess.

Yes, Casey obviously didn't know how to prepare chicken feet but maybe Carla would have chosen to prepare a different dish if she didn't have to consider getting it done early so she could push a cart.

And my main beef with carts is the frustration of not getting the dishes you want and having to wait for the right cart to come out. I can recall many a time my family sat around waiting for the shrimp dumpling (har gow) that never made it to our table. The cart was emptied long before it got to us. The carts with the unpopular items kept coming around but no takers. Meanwhile, I'm waiting for my favourite soup dumpling that never comes. It's so much better to just check it off a list and be sure you will get the items you want.

[jujuthomas]

I love the idea of a dim sum list!

[huiray]

For myself it is rare that I would not be able to get a particular dish if I really wanted it and it was nowhere to be seen on the carts etc. I just flag down a waiter/waitress and ask specifically for it. The dish will be brought out to you on a tray in most cases. Otherwise, if I see it on a cart and it is clear it is going fast and I really want it I walk over to the cart and get one - so long as it is not on the other side of the room! In many places I go to for dim sum where they use carts there are also servers who walk around with trays of other stuff as well. I enjoy the slight wackiness of the whole experience.

As for checklists, as I said above there are people who would not know what many dishes were from the names alone (especially if they are in Chinese) and not all places with checklists have lists with pictures and/or English names for those less familiar with dim sum. Heck, even I don't know what everything is just by the names alone!

[Miss Needle]

Top Chef is a TV show first and foremost. The carts add to the ambiance of the setting. This is what most people think of when they hear "dim sum." I know some people were questioning the cab a couple of episodes ago.

[momjamin]

Well, I haven't had dim sum in a few years (used to work a couple blocks from Boston's Chinatown, but now am a suburbanite), but I don't have a clue what anything's called beyond "dumpling" -- I always went with a Chinese friend or just pointed at whatever looked good and/or familiar. I can't decide whether a menu would be a plus or a minus for identifying dishes ;-)

[goodhealthgourmet]

- loved Antonia's comment about Angelo's "Chef's Tourette's" and Tiffani's remark that someone would have gotten hurt if she hadn't been wearing a bra during the QF. LOL!
- thought it was fun to see Tom working his magic.
- wanted to smack Marcel for the remark about the flavors of his dish "carrying over" to Mike's. leave it to him to make me root for Isabella to win a challenge!
- honestly thought Jamie was KIDDING when she said she wanted to do a scallop dish for the EC - i rewound it to be sure she was serious.
- knew Casey was going home before they even started cooking - her comment about being able to make a great dish with the chicken feet if she had "time to work on it" in a challenge all about speed was the giveaway...and seeing Antonia not spending any time plating it for her erased any doubt i had about my instinct. oh, and the story about how she wants to be the "baddest-ass" female chef when it comes to butchery, and collects art about butchery? the elves have taken to feeding us a random personal aside like that for the doomed chef each week.
- i hate that Jamie is still there.
- loved seeing Susur again, and thought he was a great judge.
- happy to see Dale doing well, AND happy to see Fabio do something besides pasta or gnocchi...and do it well!
- breathing a huge sigh of relief that Tre dodged a bullet this week (had a momentary panic attack in the beginning when he mentioned that he was doing a dessert - i'm haunted by memories of his peach bread pudding fail.)
- this was a freaking train wreck.
- and finally, anyone else have deja vu upon seeing a particular rooftop clip for next week? bratty Marcel getting in the face of someone who has an overwhelming urge to punch him...hmmm, why do i feel like i've seen this before?

[Miss Needle]

I'm sure you also saw the video of Tre in his wifebeater fishing. : )

[LindaWhit]

- wanted to smack Marcel for the remark about the flavors of his dish "carrying over" to Mike's. leave it to him to make me root for Isabella to win a challenge!
~~~~~~~~~~~
THAT really ticked me off. Marcel remains a petulant little child. The shot of him when someone else wins a challenge continues to show his pissedoffness at the fact that *he* didn't win! And that comment was completely typical of him - which is why he remains on my List for who I want booted and not making it to the finale. He's *not* all that, despite what he thinks of himself.

I missed the Casey comment about butchery...I was more focused on the fact that Jamie was getting airtime. Unless the Elves are doing that because they know she's this season's villain for not cooking anything and still sliding through.

Also glad for Fabio being in the top group and getting praise from Susur Lee. You could tell Fabio was genuinely pleased to get such favorable comments!

And while we know Dale T. won't haul off and belt Marcel, it *will* make for must-see TV. What a surprise - there's going to be draaaaaaaahmaaaaah on Top Chef! ;-)

[charmedgirl]

I guess I'm in the minority again when it comes to Marcel, but I really, really, REALLY think he was kidding when he said the thing about Mike Isabella's flavors remaining on the judges' palates. (Just as I think he's kidding with a lot of the stuff he says that seem to offend folks.) He had that mischevious look when he said it. He knew it was an asshole-y thing to say; he was being tongue in cheek, just to get a rise out of people.

I'm going to reserve judgment on the Dale/Marcel incident in the previews until we get to see the full episode, though I'll admit Marcel looks like he's being a jerk. (I'll also say though that both in his original season and his appearance on Top Chef Masters, Dale proved himself to be less-than-cool headed himself).

[NellyNel]

I am soo glad you agree with me Charmed - I totally thought Marcel was being cheeky and found it rather charming!!
I also noticed he truly looked happy for Mike and gave him a big hug

[Nettie]

I agree that Marcel is probably kidding when he says some of the stupid stuff. But I don't think saying something that you know is asshole-y comes across as mischevious, I think it comes across as you're an asshole.

[NellyNel]

Of course that is true, but I don't think he was saying anything in an ass-holy way - he was totally goofing.

[lisavf]

Nah, he's a twit.

[NellyNel]

lol

[John E.]

According to Stefan you are one letter off.

[lisavf]

Yeah, but I was trying to be polite ;)

[LindaWhit]

LOL! Yeah, I'm just going with this one. We'll see what happens when he gets eliminated. ;-)

[Indy 67]

If he was basically a nice guy -- pleasant to be around, helpful in spite of the competition -- I'd agree that the occasional ***hole comment might be seen as yanking eveyone's chain. However, every program Marcel can be counted on to make a self-absorbed and delusional comment. This season's comments continue the same nonsense he spouted during his season.

Sorry. The pattern is too persistent for me to think there's anything mischievous or ironic about Marcel. If it waddles like a duck and it quacks like a duck, chances are it is a duck. We'll agree to disagree.

[charmedgirl]

Yep! Such is the nature of chowhound and Top Chef fandom. :-)

[John E.]

I think this was another challenge that was a set up for them to fail. There is no way they could have prepared enough food for that many people in the time allowed and in the manner of food expected.

This episode contained the strangest moment in TC history, Fabio with a turtle on a leash. I can tell you exactly how that came about. A production assistant sees Fabio looking at the turtles and comes up with the idea of the video of Fabio with his 'pet' turtle. I wonder how many people will believe he really walks his turtle (and presumably with a plastic bag to pick up the droppings).

[cowboyardee]

Taking a wild guess- I bet that footage of Fabio with his turtle was probably from the submission tape he originally sent the show.

[John E.]

Unless proven otherwise, I'm going with my theory. What are the odds Fabio would have done that?

[Miss Needle]

I think pretty high. They're looking to cast "characters." I believe behavior that can be construed as odd would make for good TV.

[cowboyardee]

Exactly. Kooky behavior + willingness to make a spectacle of yourself is a good way to get cast.

Also, I don't have the clip on in front of me, but I seem to remember that Fabio looked different (thinner, different haircut) in the clip.

[LindaWhit]

The odds are high, IMO - this *is* Fabio we're talking about...one of the great characters on TC. :-)

[NellyNel]

That was my assumption as well, cowboy!

[John E.]

I looked at it again and you're right. It was the Fabio of season 5, thinner and with a better haircut. At least the producers remembered the submission video when they saw the footage of him looking at the turtles.

Somebody needs to tell Fabio that shortribs are beef and that the ribs he prepared for this challenge were babyback pork ribs.

[chicgail]

I thought I mis-heard Fabio's shortribs comment when he presented baby backs.

[chicgail]

How delightful that Fabio did so well on this challenge. It really took him out of his tired Italian pasta comfort zone and he proved he had chops.

[LindaWhit]

And Bourdain's blog is, yet again, hysterical! http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso...

But he really describes what dim sum in Hong Kong is really like - people getting up to get what they want is not uncommon - nor is having the diners walk into the kitchen to TAKE a favored dish to make sure they get it! LOL

And oddly - I'm seeing that tofuburrito responded to this thread when I see it listed in My Chow, but I don't see a message from them posted here - very odd!

ETA: Once I posted this post, tofuburrito's post showed up upthread. :-)

[Miss Needle]

"But he really describes what dim sum in Hong Kong is really like - people getting up to get what they want is not uncommon"

Or in NYC. If the dim sum ladies aren't coming my way, I'll go to them to get what I'm looking for. I get pretty peeved by stale dim sum. I find it pretty common at all of the cart dim sum parlors I've eaten in the US. But I don't think I've got the balls to go into a restaurant's kitchen!

[Ruth Lafler]

There's only tiny but excellent dim sum place in SF Chinatown where you go into the kitchen and get your own tea, and when a fresh batch is ready to go they pretty much wheel it into the middle of the room and say "come and get it."

[The Dairy Queen]

Oh, I love it! What place is that, Ruth?

~TDQ

[Ruth Lafler]

Dol Ho on Pacific.

[The Dairy Queen]

Hmmm...I don't know it, I don't think. I shall have to check it out next time I'm in town. THank you!

~TDQ

[The Dairy Queen]

I'm not much of a Bourdain fan (the bad boy schtick is wearing thin), but the man can write. That blog post is astute and hilarious.

I loved watching Tom in the QF, but it was clear that he had an advantage over the other Chefs because he had more time to plan and because he didn't have to compete for his ingredients and cookware. Still, it's fun to watch the very quickest one of these challenges can go under the best scenario. In his blog he described himself as the pacesetter, which I think is an entirely accurate description.

The whole dim sum thing was painful to watch. But, the moment someone said the chicken feet were inedible, I knew Casey was doomed, even though I really wanted Jaimie to go home. I think Tom said once before (for some reason, I think it was the night at the museum episode, but I could be wrong) that if a dish is literally inedible, they have to send that person home. Oh well. Maybe Jaime will go home next week! We can only hope!

Thank you Linda for the (as always) terrific recap!

~TDQ

[bobbert]

Have to agree. Once the word "inedible" came out I too knew Casey was doomed. Actually next on the chopping block was probably Tre then Jaime - even though everyone was hoping Jaime would go. When are these chefs going to learn not to place their fortunes in the hands of someone else?

[joonjoon]

ROFL @ "Even the mighty Dale managed only to unravel a lonely strand of tragic "pad thai" noodle that the judges examined as if it were a prolapsed intestine." HA!

[John E.]

I thought his best line was this: "Jamie's single clam sat forlornly at the bottom of a bowl like a dried turd."

[LindaWhit]

Tom Colicchio's blog is up: http://www.bravotv.com/top-chef/seaso... Tom pretty much had the QF challenge sprung upon him TWO days before shooting! LOL Funny things didn't get on camera (like the real reason the fish tub fell to the floor).

As for Casey going home, he says "And to all the Casey fans out there who are about to write in to tell me that Jamie should have been sent home instead, I have one word for you: “inedible.” I like Casey very much, too, and I applaud her for going out on such a limb by making chicken feet. And no, she was not sent home because the American judges are not accustomed to eating the feet of fowl. She was sent home because the particular dish she made with them was inedible. Not just bad, but inedible. Jamie’s dishes, and those of the other contestants on the bottom this week, while poor, were edible. However even the Chinese patrons, who not only eat chicken feet regularly but who truly relish them, could not eat Casey’s."

:::Sigh::: Casey took a chance trying to make a *real* dim sum dish, and it didn't work out for her...especially since she left it in Antonia's hands to do the cooking.

[iL Divo]

I hate that I love this show and love that I should hate it but don't

[susancinsf]

I am not sure about the 'especially' in your concluding sentence. My recollection is that Casey asked Antonia how she was making the the chicken feet, and when Antonia said she was deep frying them, Casey replied that they needed to be braised (?). But then, at JT, I believe that Susur Lee commented that chicken feet needed to be deep fried to get cooked properly.

But then Jamie didn't know that the dumpling wrappers she chose needed to be boiled, not steamed (per Lee). However, the result may have been less than optimal, but it was edible.

The most surprising aspect of the episode to me was not who went home, but, rather, the fact that it appeared that, while some discussed 'Chinese food' in a general, generic way, many of them were so clueless as to what dim sum should be that I began to wonder if they had ever been to a busy dim sum place or even tried dim sum!

[cowboyardee]

"many of them were so clueless as to what dim sum should be that I began to wonder if they had ever been to a busy dim sum place or even tried dim sum!"
_____
It's plausible that some of them haven't. It's not like your chef's license is revoked if you aren't familiar with every single variety of the world's cuisines.

[JasmineG]

Dim sum is not some rare and unusual cuisine to not be familiar with. To not even know the concept of it and what one would put together for it makes them uneducated as chefs.

[cowboyardee]

"Dim sum is not some rare and unusual cuisine to not be familiar with."
___
I never said it was. It makes no difference. They're chefs, not doctoral candidates. When I go to an Italian restaurant, I want the chef to know Italian food well; when I eat Thai, I want the chef to know their Thai cuisine. It makes no real difference whether the Thai chef knows Italian and vice versa. Many of the best cooks stick closely to their cuisine.

I have no idea if Susur Lee knows anything about Indian food. But whether he does or not, his Chinese is pretty damn amazing.

[susancinsf]

I think the question of what you would expect from a chef in his or her restaurant is somewhat irrelevant and beside the point.

What I found surprising is that they were competing in a contest where they *knew* that they'd be asked to cook outside of their area(s) of comfort and/or expertise, and yet here was a major (and at least in urban areas such as NYC, very mainstream) cuisine about which many of them seemed to be completely clueless!

Note the discussion of prevelance of 'crudo' above: they know raw fish, but (some of them apparently) have never even been to a dim sum place?

Gotta feel sorry for them to have such limited experience, actually.

[cowboyardee]

"I think the question of what you would expect from a chef in his or her restaurant is somewhat irrelevant and beside the point."
___
Not really. We're talking about what a chef should know.

Now, witihin the context of this contest, we have seen time and time again that the contestants who win are the ones who are able to play any challenge into their strengths. The ones who change their style to the task at hand and make versions of a cuisine they aren't masters of reliably go home. Contestants (notably Richard Blais and Kevin Gillespie) have stated this repeatedly.

If you're a chef specializing in ______ (not Chinese cooking) and you're about to be on Top Chef, I'd think there are much better and more important uses of your time than studying dim sum and every other traditional world cuisine you've missed out on.

[ipsedixit]

I agree with you cowboyardee.

Even alot of Chowhounds are not all that facile with describing, ordering or eating dim sum, much less cooking it.

And lets be honest, alot of Top Chef contestants aren't seasoned chefs that have dined and experienced the culinary world -- like an Anthony Bourdain. Many (most?) are young, fresh out of culinary school, or in their first or second gig behind the stove.

I mean lets take another example. How many of these Top Chef All Stars would perform efficiently behind a sushi bar? Sure, some can make crudo or sashimi, but being an efficient Itamae at the height of lunch hour is a totally different task.

[JasmineG]

The issue is not studying up on it. The issue is that if chefs who are going to be on Top Chef don't know what dim sum is, that makes them uneducated. That is something that a chef should know -- a chef doesn't need to know the specific details of how to make every dish, but if a chef in America doesn't know what dim sum is, they aren't a very well educated chef, and clearly don't have a lot of interest in food outside their own specific restaurant.

[cowboyardee]

"they... clearly don't have a lot of interest in food outside their own specific restaurant."
_____
That's possible. Some very good chefs don't have much interest in foods outside their chosen cuisine.

Or maybe they are interested in other cuisines but just never got around to learning much about dim sum. Example - I recently realized how little I knew about North African cuisine after being asked to cater in that style. And I like all sorts of foods and can have tried and cooked (not always well, BTW) dishes from many cultures. Just skipped over North Africa. Go figure.

On top of that, you are making a BIG assumption that since a contestant didn't cook a traditional dim sum dish that they didn't know what dim sum is. Knowing a cuisine and being able to cook it well enough for a competition are two VERY different things. Probably more than a few consciously chose to make non-dim sum they could pull off rather than butchering something traditional.

[roxlet]

"Just skipped over North Africa"
Ha,ha! Good choice! I spent a year in Egypt and found almost nothing exciting to eat. If you look on the boards that cover that area, there are many lamenting the cuisine in that part of the world, Morocco being the major exception.

[susancinsf]

it wasn't whether they could cook the dish or not...it was also that they seemed to be completely unprepared or unaware of the style of the food and service. Whether they could cook the dishes well or not, many of them chose to make recipes that didn't seem to be very well suited to dim sum service.

[LindaWhit]

Tom or Gail said in their Bravo blog that they weren't plating for a dining room of 250 hungry dim sum diners...they were firing and plating in onesies-twosies, trying to get the plating done "perfectly" and making sure the right number of garnishes were on the plate, when that wasn't what mattered...getting the food cooked and up the stairs was what mattered!

[JasmineG]

Right, the issue isn't that they hadn't mastered dim sum cooking, but that they didn't even seem to know what would be appropriate to serve as a dim sum dish.

[cowboyardee]

"...they didn't even seem to know what would be appropriate to serve as a dim sum dish."
____
You guys keep saying that. What evidence do you have that they didn't know aside from the fact that many of them didn't serve authentic dim sum dishes? (which is a perfectly reasonable move considering they are in a competition, and making authentic dim sum is nowhere near as important as making something tasty and impressive that doesn't get them sent home)

[JasmineG]

It's not about serving an authentic dim sum dish. It's about serving something that would be appropriate for dim sum. Dim sum is about small bites, dumplings, things in small packages. When they were initially discussing what to make, some of them seemed to not know that. It's not about making something authentic, it's about making something that actually fits the challenge. It's the same as in previous seasons when they've had challenges at ballparks or at tailgates and people proposed complicated food that was inappropriate to the challenge.

[cowboyardee]

"it was also that they seemed to be completely unprepared"
____
Why shouldn't they be? A dim sum service is a completely different kind of kitchen experience than the fine dining and American casual most of them are used to. Different organization, different pacing, different focus. Anthony Bourdain said on his blog that this challenge was bound for disaster - that there was no way chefs with no experience at a dim sum place could make service go smoothly.

This is getting to be like saying a professional hockey player should also be great at football just because he is a professional athlete.

[dach]

"Anthony Bourdain said on his blog that this challenge was bound for disaster - that there was no way chefs with no experience at a dim sum place could make service go smoothly."
---
At least one of them did have experience -- Dale T. But here he lost an opportunity or worse, by not putting forth any effort to take a leadership role, or otherwise make friends and impress viewers and look good professionally, by helping everyone look better by offering some useful advise to the group as to the logistics and the different mindset they'd have to come into a dim sum kitchen with. Appropriate, considering they are all executive chefs with leadership and mentoring responsibilities, not simple line-cooks bringing the drama.

And Tiffany D did say that by the end of service they had figured the kinks out of how they needed to work to keep up the required dim sum volume, but by then it was "too late."

Disasters make for good reality TV though. And these are the "all stars", so it is appropriate to give them higher level of difficulty challenges and see how they handle it. Not so well in this case...

[debbiel]

Of course, we don't know whether or not Dale offered advice, or the extent to which he did.

[huiray]

Re: Dale - You should read what he has to say:
http://www.daletalde.com/blog/2011/1/...

[dach]

Dale's blog reads exactly like my impression of his TCAS character

[huiray]

Your take on it is different from mine.

[pitu]

Good point:
"Watching the show last night and listening to the other chefs sayI should have stepped up makes me laugh. The last time I did that on my season, I was sent home. Not once did anyone ask me for help - when we were talking about the dishes, when we were shopping or during service."

[Worldwide Diner]

Casey fried her chicken feet. Where did she get that stupid idea from?

[huiray]

One common way of making dim sum style chicken feet is to, yes, deep fry them first - but then it is followed by braising, marinating, and finished by steaming before serving.

[Worldwide Diner]

I believe all she did is fry them - but I could be wrong.

[huiray]

I don't remember if that was the only thing she did, but what she did NOT do was to complete the process or do it properly for them to become succulent.

[susancinsf]

Well, unless my memory is going (always possible), I think you've got it backwards. She didn't fry them. or do I have it backwards?

As far as I can tell, most recipes call for deep frying, and some follow that by braising. The ones I've had at dim sum places taste fried to me, though I am certainly no expert.

Re my post above, I think Susur Lee's point was that the only way to get them properly done in the time allotted would to deep fry. (not enough time to break down the cartilage, etc. by just braising.)

Does anyone have a recipe?

[Worldwide Diner]

Frying is only a small part of making chicken feet. Most of the time it's being braised. I don't understand Susar's point. Just frying the chicken feet will make them crunchy but not soft.

[Blueicus]

But the deep frying/oil blanching is usually done in the cuisine as a precursor to braising, sort of like how European cuisines sear meat before braising. Similar effect

[chicgail]

Tom may have ONLY had two days, but he had TWO DAYS to think through what and how he was going to do. He sure made it look easy, tho, didn't he?

[Ruth Lafler]

Yeah, he had two days to conceptualize his dish and think about how he was going to prep and cook it, without having to compete with the others for ingredients and equipment, while the cheftestants just had a few minutes (even presuming they started planning the minute the challenge was announced). The only way they could have made it so that Tom was actually performing the same challenge as the cheftestants would have been if they'd made it one of those box of secret ingredients challenges.

[charmedgirl]

I had similar thoughts while I was watching last night. I mean, I didn't know he had two days, but I assumed he had some time, which gave him a huge advantage in terms of strategizing, etc. I thought it was not a fair comparison to then ask the other chefs to completely conceptualize and execute a dish in the same amount of time. I particularly kept thinking that when all the chef interviews about it were so gushing. I know Tom is a great chef, I don't mean to take anything away from that, but I kept wondering why they were so impressed. If they had been told "make a dish as fast as you can" and then had 2 days to work on it, they'd probably be fast and efficient and come up with something tasty too.

[lisavf]

Right, they would have figured out not only the ingredients but every step in the intricate ballet that is food preparation. The cheftestants all talked about the economy of his movements, but he did have time to plan out all of those movements, where to place every item as he needed/used it, exactly what tools he needed, so he was able to calmly walk around and go through the mental checklist and get it all in one pass. It was an amazing feat, but I think what the cheftestants do in every challenge is even more amazing, especially when they pull it off successfully.

[joonjoon]

I don't see why this is an issue - Tom's only job was to set the clock. Almost everyone was able to present some dish in that time. We also got to see Tom cook and knock shit over. Why the complaints?

[LindaWhit]

I have to agree with joonjoon. The cheftestants NEVER know what they're going to have to do during a QF - never knowing the ingredients they can/cannot use. That's part of the entire contest, isn't it? They're always required to think on their feet in a short amount of time - this go-round, they just had less time in which to do so.

[NellyNel]

Did dale try to make those egg noodles himself?

I'm pretty sure he did.
I mean - wth was he thinking?!

[LindaWhit]

Yes, he did.

[NellyNel]

How can you possibly successfully make noodles and then use them in a dish - in less then 10 minutes?
wth?

[LindaWhit]

Not sure how Dale thought it (making noodles) would work, Nelly, but he tried it. And failed. :-/

[Ruth Lafler]

I'm not complaining, just noting that for all the talk about Tom doing a quickfire and the cheftestants gushing about what he did, he still wasn't operating under the same conditions they operate under for every challenge.

[LaPomme]

Agreed. Tom prepared something in under nine minutes. All of the other contestants had to conceptualize, scramble over each other for ingredients, and then prepare the dish in the same amount of time. The amount of work involved isn't really comparable. It was neat to see Tom cook, though.

[saeyedoc]

It's not like they were competing against Tom, just each other.

[NellyNel]

Right. didn't the previews say they were going "head to head" with Tom?
I was a little dissappointed, but I still enjoyed seeing him work!

[joonjoon]

Are you suggesting Tom had some kind of unfair advantage over the contestants? I'd beg to differ. Every single contestant here has over a dozen quickfires under their belt while this was Tom's first. And if you'd read the Bourdain blog you'll see that Tom's cooking was genuinely impressive and something that comes from decades of hard work - almost like watching an old kung fu master.

The fact that this was Tom's FIRST quickfire, cooking in the QF kitchen for the first time - for him to pull off that dish in 8 minutes really showed he's the real deal.

[tofuburrito]

I was thinking the same thing. Plus people seemed to be assuming he knew what would be available ingredient-wise before he got there. I don't know if that was the case.

[debbiel]

I don't think anyone is suggesting he had an unfair advantage (in what? he wasn't competing with them). Folks are just pointing out that having 2 days to think about this and not having to race with other people is very different. And I don't think anyone here is suggesting that it wasn't impressive cooking. Of course it was!

[LaPomme]

Since Tom isn't a contestant, any "advantage" is a moot point. My point was that the comparison between what he was able to do and what the actual contestants had to do isn't very meaningful.

[Ruth Lafler]

Well put!

[goodhealthgourmet]

My point was that the comparison between what he was able to do and what the actual contestants had to do isn't very meaningful.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
agreed. it was fun to watch him, but i think the producers are probably running out of inspiration/ideas for QF challenges and this conveniently provided one.

[JuniorBalloon]

I agree they operated under different conditions. I asked up thread whether or not the cheftestants were allowed to do some off camera planning. Tom in his blog noted that he, unlike the cheftestants, didn't know where the olive oil was and had to check it out before doing the QF. I wouldn't be surprised if they were given time to make a bit of a plan before they were given the "Go" signal.

jb

[chowser]

I agree. Having two days to go over what he's going to do, and plan it out makes a huge difference. The contestants were saying he had no wasted move, just went from one to the next quickly. It was fun to see but it's like telling Lance Armstrong two days ahead of time what the route he's going to ride is and seeing how fast he can do it. And, then giving the rest of the field no warning, making them race each other for the finish to try to beat that time.

[Lori D]

But they have more time to think than the time that is presented.

There is a break between the time that the QF theme is announced and when the contestants actually start cooking.

[Miss Needle]

I remember reading an article about Next Iron Chef where they said that they give a few minutes for the chefs to gather their thoughts before a quickfire. The article said that if the chefs didn't receive the time before the challenge, some bad TV would ensue.

I wouldn't be surprised if the TC contestants received some time to think things through.

[Caitlin McGrath]

Spike said in an interview (after the Night at the Museum episode) that after each QF and EC is announced, the producers spend time going over the rules of the specific challenge and the contestants sign an agreement, so we know they have some time before they start cooking. Prsumably they spend that time thinking, as well.

[LindaWhit]

Yes, I'm aware this isn't "real time" based on what we see on camera. Rules of each contest are explained, they have to sign something for *every* challenge saying they understand those rules, based on something I read a few weeks back. Meanwhile, they can be plotting what they're going to make, depending on how long it takes to get paperwork signed, etc.

But the time frame in which they have to create anything is always a shortened time period. Quickfires are always timed. They still have to think on their feet, especially if someone else grabs what they were going to use.

[Ruth Lafler]

Exactly. They can plan, but they don't always know what ingredients are going to be available, especially if someone else grabs what they were planning to use first. Tom may not have known where the olive oil was (before checking out the kitchen in advance) but at least he didn't have to fight anyone off for his fish.

[charmedgirl]

No complaining here. Merely commenting.

[Withnail42]

Can't feel too sorry for Big Tom have two days to prepare for the quick fire. That's only two more days than the contestants have!! No doubt everything was in place for him to make the fastest dish possible.

[Worldwide Diner]

It would be much more fun if they didn't give Tom advance notice and we can all watch him flail around.

[huiray]

Here's a comment (amongst many) from TWoP about those chicken feet:
http://forums.televisionwithoutpity.c...

[LindaWhit]

I've not ever had chicken feet, but it looks like Fukui San knows whereof he speaks.

Which just reiterates Tom saying Casey should go.

[mariacarmen]

love that guy's handle - "Fukui San"! (from the original Iron Chef.)

[lisavf]

Heartbreak for Casey, but she didn't take her own advice from last episode - you have to be responsible for your own dish. As soon as I saw that Antonia was ignoring Casey's dish, I knew Casey was done for.

What a fun quickfire challenge! Did anyone else notice how Padma threw the keys to Mike, as if to keep him from giving her a hug? Looks like that's where he was headed, and she didn't want that again!

Good for Dale on the win - his dishes looked tasty. Angelo seemed disappointed at the win, but he was also gracious about it.

Service WAS a disaster, but I don't think they should have been responsible for running the food. That seemed to put the runners at a real disadvantage, and it would seem unnecessary, as the restaurant's regular runners would seem better equipped to handle service, and just let the chefs COOK. That's what they are there for.

Exciting episode all in all!

Richard does not seem to be at the top of the pack as everyone expected. His performance overall so far has been lackluster - two QF wins and one Elimination win, all as part of a team win. No individual wins at all.

[Nettie]

I hate that they make people work front of house AND responsible for dishes. If they made everyone do it, fine, but this way makes it so unfair to the people who aren't able to put out their own food.

[Miss Needle]

I also don't agree with that. This is where Carla was smart serving a dish that didn't need to be cooked (even though it was on the bottom).

[lisavf]

Yes, she prepared a dish that didn't have to be cooked, but, in theory, all servings had to be 100% completed and plated before service started in order for her to successfully provide trolley service, while everyone else was able to continue to complete and plate dishes throughout service. So it did place additional restrictions on her, which I do think is unfair (although I agree she was smarter about it than Casey). But then again, she volunteered to do service (they both did), so they had to deal with the consequences.

[phee]

WTH??? First off, this was almost painful to watch. You were spot on, Linda, when you said this challenge was no one's finest moment. But why is Jamie still there?!? While I think I would have dinged her for doing two dishes and not doing either well, the judges seemed to give her more credit for doing two dishes.

[debbiel]

First, credit for doing no dishes. Now, credit for doing two crappy dishes. Why, it all makes sense! Argh...

Yes, it does seem that Casey's dish was bad, but...but...JAMIE!!! (And the unfairness of not being able to make your own dish.)

[tofuburrito]

I thought Jamie or Tre would be going but they did say the chicken feet were inedible and the diners wouldn't eat them. I don't think Antonia is at fault either, I think she did her best with everything else she had going on and the chicken feet were just a bad idea.

[phee]

Good point. If I had to come up with a dim sum dish, chicken feet is probably one of the LAST things I would attempt!

[debbiel]

I agree that it looked like the chicken feet were probably the worst dish. I have just always disliked challenges that take some away from their own cooking. I'd be much more comfortable with her elimination if she was in the kitchen with her chicken feet.

[JuniorBalloon]

Again this was a poorly designed challanege.

Really enjoyed the episode. Watching Tom cook was a gas. I wondered if after the challenge was explained if they had a chance to walk around the kitchen, see where there items were and then assemble back at the table for the "ready set go"?

That said having someone go home for a dish they didn't make is bad, but it's bad design of the challenge. I suppose if it was me and I knew someone else was going to cook my dish I'd go over the specifics very carefully. It seemed when Casey went down to check on it, Antonio wasn't aware of how Casey wanted it prepared. Still, no one should cook and not get judged and no one should go home when they didn't cook.

jb

[cowboyardee]

Best I was able to tell from the comments and blogs, the problems with Casey's dish were Casey's fault, not Antonia's. The big issue it seems was that it was so grisly that it was impossible to eat, and that would be because she didn't braise them long enough. Final cooking wouldn't have made much difference.

[tofuburrito]

I have to wonder why she asked Antonia to begin with since she was already involved with two dishes whereas as Tre, Marcel, and Blais only had one with no additional responsibilities.

[cowboyardee]

I get the impression (and I know this is based mainly on her edit, which can be misleading) that Antonia has a lot of integrity. She has been the only outspoken voice at times she felt other chefs were being unfairly shafted ("that's harsh" after Dale L's comments about Elia's fish, defense of Jennifer Carroll's contribution to her team), she did not throw Casey under the bus at judge's table (to be fair, Casey returned the favor), she seemed to be the only one hustling in the kitchen this week as things got ugly (again, could have been the edit).

Given that, it would make sense that another chef would ask for her help rather than others'.

[NellyNel]

I am liking Antonia now...but I remember she did something snake-like that really annoyed me on her season.
I can't remember what it was, but I was incredulous - and I really hated her after that...
Anyone recall?
My memory is pretty bad

[tofuburrito]

I don't remember anything snake-like from Antonia. I remember Ming sided with Spike over Antonia in a dispute that was funny rather than controversial and I think she was a good sport when Spike rubbed it in.

[NellyNel]

Maybe it wasn't a snake like move, bu I do remember she did something to cause me to dislike her!
Who knows what is was!?
I like her now though

[cowboyardee]

She got into it big time with Spike. I just don't remember exactly how it played out. Spike wanted to make soup and she didn't and the judges said soup would've been good. Or something. And they blew up at each other.

But Spike was a bit of a mischief maker and instigator that season and it didn't make much sense to me to hold another contestant's arguments with Spike (Antonia, Dale T.) against them. Still, can't remember all the details.

[sommrluv]

I wasn't an antonia fan before either, but I have to admit, I like what's she's putting out now. (attitude wise).

On a somewhat related note, I noticed she and all the female chefs seem to be groomed a bit better, attractive, makeup, nice outfits under those coats...not seeing a lot of bed head and under eye circles. Not that I care, but as a fellow chick I have to wonder if they didn't like what they looked like on tv in their season.

[The Dairy Queen]

Or, maybe they didn't like how they appeared on camera and made some changes/got some advice.

I only started watching last season (late comer, I am) but I like Antonia, too. She seems pretty cool.

It's unfortunate they have to throw each other under the bus. On Survivor (and even Amazing Race), the crew updates Jeff (Phil) on anything that was particularly interesting or nasty. If it doesn't come out naturally at Tribal Council (finish mat), then Jeff (Phil) will just ask: I understand someone threw someone's socks in the fire (or whatever) to force it out into the open. It would be nice if the judges on TC already knew who had helped whom with prep, etc.

~TDQ

[John E.]

There was a challenge where Antonia and Spike working together with Zoi. Spike wanted to make butternut squash soup and Antonia resisted even though she had immunity. They made some kind of beef carpaccio and ended up in the bottom and Zoi got PPYKAG. At JT Spike mentioned the soup and they said it sounded good and that's what they should have made.

I posed this question before...does anybody here eat all that much raw beef and raw fish? It just doesn't appeal to me. I'm not quite the hayseed that makes me seem to be, but I don't get it.

[goodhealthgourmet]

"does anybody here eat all that much raw beef and raw fish?"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
at home, no. but when i eat out, absolutely...and bear in mind that for these challenges the chefs are making dishes they'd serve in a restaurant, not something they'd necessarily throw together for a quick meal at home on a random Tuesday.

[soupkitten]

raw meat and fish is really well suited to restaurants, because restaurants can get really spankin'-fresh stuff, moreso than the home cook, and the equipment is better suited to keep food at optimum freshness-- commercial refrigerators cool foods faster and keep them colder, for example, than home fridges. so these foods make sense at a restaurant where there is quick turnover of a very delicate fresh food product. customers do like to order these dishes at restaurants for these reasons rather than making them at home, it's much better from a food safety standpoint imo & i don't blame them!

[John E.]

Of course I realize this is about restaurant chefs. I just don't order this type of food even when the opportunity arises.

[goodhealthgourmet]

"I just don't order this type of food even when the opportunity arises."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
and that's certainly your prerogative, but why do you find it puzzling or surprising that some of us do? one could just as easily turn it around and question why you don't order these things. it's just a matter of preference, like with anything else.

[John E.]

I'm not ridiculing anyone for ordering and/or eating this food. I simply asked if anyone did order it. I didn't indicate any surprise, I simply expressed an opinion and it seemed as if I was getting a lecture (bear in mind) from you in response. That's the only reason for that reply.

And it seems there seems to be a disproportionate amount of this type of food being prepared on TC. I suppose that's the question I had. I also think there is a lot of fish on this show but I do understand that I live in the middle of the country but more than that it can be prepared quickly.

[ipsedixit]

Is there really a disproportionate number of raw beef and fish dishes on TC?

Last night QC had only one raw fish dish -- Angelo's crudo.

The EC challenge, best I can recall, had no raw food (although the chicken feet might come pretty close).

[goodhealthgourmet]

not last night, but this season it seems like they've been heavy on the raw - crudo, carpaccio, gazpacho...

[NellyNel]

and there was last years big thing - Ceviche (I know it's not considered "raw", but....)

[goodhealthgourmet]

@John E., where did i say you were ridiculing anyone? i think you took my earlier response too personally, but i apologize if i offended you somehow.

and yes, they have been putting up too many raw preparations this season. i think it came up in last week's thread...? or maybe i was just thinking it in the ongoing Top Chef discourse in my head :)

[cowboyardee]

"and yes, they have been putting up too many raw preparations this season."
_____
I don't get that impression. Of course, that's harder to verify this season since the Bravo site doesn't have all the recipes from this season clumped together. But still I haven't noticed anything too egregious in terms of raw preparations. Angelo likes them - that's his style. Maybe it's because his dishes have been prominent this season?

What else has set off raw-food-alarms in your head? It seems to me that the other contestants are only rarely putting up raw proteins.

[goodhealthgourmet]

it's not just angelo. gazpacho has been done at least three times, if not more. in the relay/team challenge with lamb two of the teams did carpaccio. there's also been cured salmon, raw uni w/caviar, pickled scallops, several crudo dishes, sashimi...that's a lot of uncooked meat & fish in only 5 episodes.