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Creating tasty memories for an 11 year old...

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locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 02:28 AM

I am traveling with my wife and daughter (born and raised in Los Angeles) for her first trip abroad to Paris next week. We will be staying near George V metro for a week and will of course venture out to see the sights, however, the point of the trip is to create memories (in the Proustian sense) of Paris that speak to the quality of refinement of taste that is quintessentially Parisian. For example, my daughter has never experienced a patisserie, a bistro, or watching the world pass by while nursing a hot chocolate and/or croque monsieur. Her idea of a garden is an organic farm...So, my question for you all is this: Can you describe a couple (or more) reenactable experiences you had as a child or had with a child in Paris related to food/eating/restaurant that had a transcendent (surpassing the ordinary; exceptional) quality? If you remember it fondly, then my daughter might as well....

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    Maximilien RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 03:03 AM

    First time I was in Paris. I was 9-ish (1979) and food was not as much as important as it is now, but there were some memorable moments...

    Those memories are intesecting my niece's life right now (6 1/2 y) who is living in Paris now.

    Eating "Crepe au Sucre" from food stands
    Eating "Feuilles de Palmier" and fresh Pain au Chocolat.
    Drinking diabolo-menthe (7-up and mint syrup) on a terrasse. (and getting mixed up because limonade in Quebec is not the same thing as in France!!)
    Watching roasting chickens in portable rotisserie on the side walks
    Seeing all the nice produces in street markets (meat, fish, ...)
    Eating Carambar after Carambar (or for my niece, Fraises Tagada)

    Another thing that is nicely parisian, is to find a school (with kids the same age as yours and watch them all rush to the closest patisserie to get their fix!

    I was at the President-Wilson st. market where there are very nice produces and what can impress children are the fully headed ducks and chicken and rabbits ready to be sold!!

    And at 11, as a girl, (more than a boy IMO) nothing beats being treated like a princess at Brasserie type restaurant; (We were, my niece, sister and I, at Au Pied de Cochon this tuesday and it was a blast.)

    I think the experience more than the exceptional itself (hard without a frame of reference) is what she will remember most (if she likes it)

    Enjoy!

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      Ptipois RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 03:08 AM

      What a lovely project!
      With such delicacy of heart, you deserve the best.

      Most of the places where I gathered my best childhood memories are either gone of drastically transformed, so better stick to the present with possible dips into what remains of the past.

      1. Watch the world pass by
      For the hot chocolate I recommend sitting either at Les Deux Magots or at the Café de Flore.
      By no means should you sit outside (where the show-offs are), inside is where it really happens.
      At the Flore, there are three levels of show-offiness. The real cheap crowd (which includes people who may own a yacht or two) sits outside or in the glassed veranda, ogling around to make sure everyone is looking at them; actors, TV and media people sit in the inside room at floor level (where the owners of the café also sit occasionally), and writers, famous journalists, publishers or professors and the odd politician sit in the upstairs room, which I recommend.
      The hot chocolate at Café de Flore is delicious. I usually order it with a jug of hot water on the side for it's quite thick.

      Pâtisseries: there are two styles of pâtisserie in Paris. The old-fashioned style, which is vanishing, and the trendy, haute couture style of Pierre Hermé, Hugo et Victor, and the like. I much prefer the old style, which you can find at the Stohrer pastry shop (51 rue Montorgueil), which has been around since the 18th century. I think they have some sitting space (salon de thé). One of my very favorite pâtissiers is Carl Marletti on rue Censier, near the église Saint-Médard. Great éclairs, religieuses and millefeuille. There are four little tables with chairs in front of the shop which you should pounce upon before they're all taken by Japanese girls in bérets holding compact cameras.

      When you're done, go towards the church (16th century, you may enter it for a few minutes, it is quite interesting inside because of a clever architectural trick which is not food related so I'll just let you guess it). Past the church, walk up the rue Mouffetard. Pass the first crossing with the tiny rue Daubenton, then stop at the second crossing with the rue de l'Arbalète, and have a drink at the Café Mouffetard which is the quintessential Parisian 'bougnat' (coal vendor) café. The old rue Mouffetard with the doll houses and the market stalls will certainly make it a fond memory.

      Do take her to the Café Charbon on rue Oberkampf where she will experience a much larger version of Café Mouffetard. Impressive. If she likes great French fries (actually Belgian fries), grab a paper "cornet" at La Frite Bruxelloise on the same street, going towards boulevard de la République.

      2. Eat while the world passes by (outside)
      For the Parisian bistro experience, I am thinking of places as diverse and different as Chartier (the last surviving "bouillon", a large working-class bistrot with people's cooking like pied de cochon, cassoulet, blanquette...), Claude Colliot (modern, refined, very personal touch but no show-off), Le Bouchon et l'Assiette (modern Basque cooking with sharp, clean tastes), Chez Dumonet-Joséphine (a bit too touristy for this occasion, though), L'Ebauchoir, Le Châteaubriand (dinner) or Zinc Caïus. All different, all perfectly Parisian, all delicious.

      For ice cream, I still believe Berthillon is still unmatched. So is Christian Constant. It is difficult to say which is the best. Berthillon still does some flavors better than anyone else and so does Constant. It all depends of your itinerary.

      There is no Parisian experience without a couscous, so take her either to Chez Hamadi (rue Boutebrie, warning, hole in the wall) or to the more elegant L'Atlas, boulevard Saint-Germain.
      BUT for the ULTIMATE "see the world eat around you" experience, nothing beats the big Tunisian cantinas on boulevard de Belleville and near Ménilmontant, the likes of Chez René et Gabin - plentiful, greasy, tasty food and, well, the world. Do not miss the fricassés and the complet poisson.
      A Turkish-Kurdish variation on the theme may be found in the lower part of rue du Faubourg-Saint-Denis. I recommend the high-ceilinged Derya, on that street.

      Finally, I believe there is no Parisian experience without Vietnamese/Laotian/Cambodian food, so, taking in account the "see the world pass by" aspect, I warmly recommend Tricotin or Wong Heng.

      If I can think of other places to watch the world pass by, I'll add them here.

      6 Replies
      1. re: Ptipois
        Parigi RE: Ptipois Nov 4, 2010 06:14 AM

        Greatly enjoy this post.
        Hahaha, indeed re the Flores (1) the hot chocolate is a well kept St Germain secret, and (2) the 1st flr is the see-and-be-seen place, not downstairs, not, especially not the terrasse.
        But I doubt that children catch on to that, even Heloise.

        1. re: Parigi
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          Ptipois RE: Parigi Nov 4, 2010 07:42 AM

          The 1st floor of Le Flore has a very, very nice atmosphere. It is one of the places where you can feel you're in the heart of the real Paris. Actually I would not describe it as the seen-and-be-seen part of the café, the ground floor is more like that. The upstairs café is where you go when you do not particularly wish to be seen. It is also generally quieter than the downstairs parts. The hot chocolate (served upstairs and downstairs) is indeed really good.
          I would also recommend not to fall into the Angelina trap, everything you may ingest there (from hot chocolate to pastries) weighs at least one ton, and so does (mentally speaking) the world that passes by and sits there.
          Costes as it may be, I prefer the Café Marly or, better, Le Fumoir.

        2. re: Ptipois
          mangeur RE: Ptipois Nov 4, 2010 12:11 PM

          I with I were 11....

          1. re: Ptipois
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            locmgr1 RE: Ptipois Nov 5, 2010 12:39 AM

            Wonderful post. As for patisserie, I believe as does our President Obama, in teachable moments, and I believe this is an opportunity to introduce my daughter to the scientific method. We will try both styles and search out the truth...;-)
            Is Christian Constant the same as Cafe Constant mentioned on another post as being near the Eiffel Tower?
            Which of the couscous restaurants has the best food?
            Thx again...

            1. re: locmgr1
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              Ptipois RE: locmgr1 Nov 5, 2010 01:09 AM

              Re. Constant : there are two Christian Constants. One is a chef-restaurateur, formerly from the Crillon, who nearly purchased the whole Eastern part of rue Saint-Dominique and runs his restaurants there, and one is a pâtissier-traiteur (caterer) who has a shop on rue du Bac and another one on rue d'Assas. This is the one I am recommending.

              Re. couscous: the two addresses are very different.
              Chez Hamadi will serve a type of proletarian Tunisian couscous - fine-grained, red from the fatty spiced broth it is mixed with before serving, and served with the broth and vegetables on the side, plus meats of your choice: lamb, chicken, grilled lamb chops, merguez, veal or lamb kebab, meatballs, oven-roasted sheep's head, osbane (offal sausage).
              L'Atlas serves the more elegant, aristocratic Moroccan couscous from Fes (fassi), fine-grained (unmixed with the broth therefore quite white), and the usual Moroccan garnishes: plenty of vegetables, stewed lamb or chicken, mechoui lamb (slow-roasted), kebabs but no osbane or sheep's head.
              I can't tell which one is the more delicious. Both places have excellent food.

              1. re: Ptipois
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                locmgr1 RE: Ptipois Nov 5, 2010 01:42 AM

                Thx again!

          2. souphie RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 05:56 AM

            I'm true to my beliefs, so my little girl, going 11 (well, going 17, really, but technically still 10) had her palate trained at home and in some top restaurants. Like me, she's a regular at Le Cinq and she loves the attention there. In the past, at Bernard Loiseau or at Au Bon Accueil in Malbuisson (Doubs), she learned to appreciate what true good icecreams and purées taste like, and this experience is still available at Le Cinq, Ledoyen, Lasserre, La Table de JR (where they might take less care of her). Sorbets from Christian Constant also are the kind of things that is important in educating one's palate, if you ask me. And you should get the most classic pastries -- Pichard jumps to mind.

            Another thing: take it easy. One or two great experences are enough. Plus, one or two different croissants every morning.

            1 Reply
            1. re: souphie
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              locmgr1 RE: souphie Nov 5, 2010 12:49 AM

              souphie: We will also attempt some of the finer restaurants --I must have my own Parisian moments as well. Thx for your suggestions.

            2. hychka RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 11:53 AM

              My wife and I want to bring our grandchildren with us to Paris (our children selfishly won't let them go without their parents) and think about the prospects on each trip. We notice children having much fun in the parks. Walking on Montorgueil would also be memorable.

              1. Parigi RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 12:30 PM

                A walk in a nice market is in order.
                The market should not be too big. Something like Richard Lenoir would be overwhelming.
                The Maubert or Monge or St Eustache or Montorgueil market is smallish and user-friendly and is centrally located. From George V you can take the n°1 metro line to get to Montorgueil or St Eustache easily.
                Point out to her all the different colors of a fresh veg and fruit stand.
                Let her smell the roast chicken and roast potatoes.
                Let her choose a piece of pastry.

                You can find those markets' opening days and hours on line.
                And go to Gocce di caffé one morning. You can have a cappuccino - a good one for once- just as the Romans make it. She can have a cioccolatta. You can share a couple of mini-pastries and enjoy the passage des Panoramas, one of those fabled passages couverts of Paris. Still so Zazie dans le métro…

                Take her to a bonbonnerie. Near the Gocce di Caffé is A La Mère de Famille. Get her one of those multi-color paté de fruits.

                1 Reply
                1. re: Parigi
                  Parigi RE: Parigi Nov 4, 2010 04:03 PM

                  Gross. Of course I meant pâtes de fruits, not paté de fruits, duh.

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                  ElaineL RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 02:20 PM

                  What a wonderful post! We are taking our daughters to France next summer - a week in Paris and a week en Bretagne- and it will be their first trip as well. I have saved this thread for future reference!

                  And to reply to your question - I first went to Paris when I was 10. We had dinner at Le Souffle which I remember as being so different and delicious. Also, having pate de fois gras on baguette and all of the patisserie windows - it was so difficult to choose just one!

                  1 Reply
                  1. re: ElaineL
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                    Oakglen RE: ElaineL Nov 4, 2010 04:05 PM

                    What kid would not rejoice at being offered the three souffle menu at Souffle? And nearby, at Chez Flottes, the Aligot, a mashed potato dish, is equally memorable.

                  2. v
                    vielleanglaise RE: locmgr1 Nov 4, 2010 04:33 PM

                    I remember my father taking me to bustling café near the Gare St Lazare an early summer morning after debarking from the boat train and experiencing a culture shock: the waiters and barmen in the bustle of the morning "feu", the hissing of the espresso machine, businessmen drinking their cups coffee at the bar next to guys nursing beers at 7 in the morning. There was also the novel odour of "brown" or uncooked tobacco in the air, which you smell rarely these days (though the "blonde" variety is still omnipresent). I'm sure you can find such a place in the George V neighbourhood. Perhaps one of the big cafés on the Place d'Alma.

                    At some point I'd take your daughter to one of the crepe stands at the bottom of the rue St Denis and translate, or have translated all of the flavours, both sweet and savoury, before choosing just one.

                    My kid hates markets, but if I take him to the ones at Barbes, Belleville, with the stall holders yelling as they hawk their wears, old Arab ladies wielding their shopping caddies like lethal weapons, and beggars with deformities straight out of the Bible he doesn't get bored.

                    During your stay, I'd also take her for lunch during the "coup de feu" to a brasserie or café, not necessarily an excellent establishment, but a bog standard one, but that has it's kitchen open at the end of the bar onto the salle so that she can see the chefs and plongeur/sous chefs dealing with dozens of covers at the same time and witness the waiters shouting "Chaud!" to clients and staff alike as they make their way through the restaurant laden with plates.

                    Again at almost any café let her try the snacks and drinks that kids can eat here: Croque Monsieur, croque madame, steak haché à cheval, lait frais, menthe à l'eau, diabalo grenadine, or if you'll let her a panaché "bien blanche", or a monaco. At some poin t during your visit, you coulsd also order a coffee serré, or even a calvados or a brandy or vielle prune and let her "faire un canard" - dip a lump of sugar into the drink before sucking whichever ordinarily illicit liquid out of it.

                    My last suggestion might make some Parisian chowhounders scream, but I still remember it from my childhood visits here: the horrible and brash rue de l'Harpe in the 5th and its Greek tourist trap restaurants with their gaudy but incredible window displays. Don't stop and eat anywhere. Just walk and look.

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                      locmgr1 RE: locmgr1 Nov 5, 2010 12:13 AM

                      Thanks for all the help! Now I have to get to work mapping all these places out and translating some of the menu items. Thank you Paris Hounds!

                      1. sunshine842 RE: locmgr1 Nov 5, 2010 12:58 AM

                        Don't forget to ask *her* what *she* would like to try...especially if you've been going over travel books with her (as you should be) -- she's more than old enough to have an input into the process, and you just might be surprised by what she wants to see/do/eat.

                        The DK Eyewitness Guides, by the way, are excellent - they offer great photos of landmarks, things to eat -- particularly great for family trip planning so everyone can see what's on offer, and far more interesting than bricks of type in a "regular" guidebook.

                        3 Replies
                        1. re: sunshine842
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                          locmgr1 RE: sunshine842 Nov 5, 2010 01:52 AM

                          I'll look into the DK Guides, and not to worry, as an American male traveling with his wife and daughter, I will only create the illusion of being in charge of this sojourn in Paris. ;-)

                          1. re: locmgr1
                            sunshine842 RE: locmgr1 Nov 5, 2010 06:39 AM

                            ROFL

                            We've been pretty shocked (but thrilled) at some of the stuff our offspring have come up with over the years...stuff we NEVER would have thought they'd enjoy, but they did.

                            1. re: sunshine842
                              Parigi RE: sunshine842 Nov 5, 2010 07:26 AM

                              I once ordered jellyfish salad for two 13-yr and 11-yr old sisters, more for the sake of novelty for them than anything else. Was suprised that they not only liked it and, yes, crânaient to high heaven about it. You'd think those 2 little girls were Hemingway catching a big fish.

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                          masha RE: locmgr1 Nov 5, 2010 03:54 PM

                          Perhaps not transcendant, but I do recall quite fondly stopping with my son -- then age 8 - mid-afternoon at cafes to order citron presse (this was in July, not November). Aside from the refreshment, he enjoyed the ceremony of mixing the water, lemon juice, and sugar. Great way to rest tired feet between sightseeing.

                          10 Replies
                          1. re: masha
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                            locmgr1 RE: masha Nov 6, 2010 06:24 PM

                            Will definitely do that as she is a lemonade drinker. What would it be called with bubbly water?

                            1. re: locmgr1
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                              masha RE: locmgr1 Nov 8, 2010 06:48 AM

                              Normally they bring a carafe of still water. I'm not familiar with it being offered with bubbly water. I would think you might have to order a bottle of bubbly mineral order on the side (une bouteille de l'eau gazeux) but would defer to those with more experience. (The French "limonade" refers to lemon-flavored soda pop, like 7-Up or Sprite, not fresh lemonade.)

                              1. re: masha
                                John Talbott RE: masha Nov 8, 2010 06:52 PM

                                More and more high end places (eg KGB) are bottling and serving their own gassed and still water which does not add more to the plastic refuse pile in Indonesia or wherever nor more to the carbon footprint.

                              2. re: locmgr1
                                sunshine842 RE: locmgr1 Nov 8, 2010 09:53 PM

                                It's called citronnade, by the way...but I'm not sure how you would specify it with fizzy water.

                                1. re: sunshine842
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                                  vielleanglaise RE: sunshine842 Nov 8, 2010 10:59 PM

                                  Some of the Sephardic pastry strores in the 9th sell "citronade" which corresponds to American lemonade and Pulco, the drinks manufacturer have recently released canned and bottled citronade.

                                  Generally, in Paris, the drink described, a citronade that you prepare youself, would be known, as masha writes, as "citron pressé".

                                  1. re: vielleanglaise
                                    sunshine842 RE: vielleanglaise Nov 8, 2010 11:21 PM

                                    guess I've only imagined reading it as such on various menus....might we agree that both terms are used to described the juice of a lemon mixed with sugar and water, while "limonade" is the equivalent of Sprite/7up?

                                    1. re: sunshine842
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                                      vielleanglaise RE: sunshine842 Nov 8, 2010 11:25 PM

                                      Limonade is the fizzy drink, agreed, but I thinlk if you went into a Parisian bar and odered, "Un citronnade", the person seving would say "vous voulez dire un citron pressé?"

                                      1. re: vielleanglaise
                                        sunshine842 RE: vielleanglaise Nov 9, 2010 01:10 AM

                                        You're absolutely right. How could I be so stupid as to mention something I've actually seen?

                                        I mentioned it only because that particular beverage can be referred to in two different ways, and thought it might be a relevant note for the OP.

                                        1. re: sunshine842
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                                          vielleanglaise RE: sunshine842 Nov 9, 2010 01:41 AM

                                          Sometimes these things change monikers in different parts of France. Order a café crème on the Picardie coast, or in Paris and you'll be served two different drinks. If you ask for a "chocolatine" in a Parisian bakery, the server might not know what you're talking about. I'm not saying that "citron pressé" is called "citron pressé" everywhere in France and I think in Paris you'd receive the drink whichever term you use, but in Parisian cafés I've always seen the beverage consisting of freshly squeezed lemon juice, white sugar, ice, and a carafe of water referred as a "citron pressé".

                                      2. re: sunshine842
                                        monchique RE: sunshine842 Nov 9, 2010 02:34 AM

                                        If I may arbitrate: normally a "citronnade" is prepared in advance in a jug (water, lemon & sugar, sometimes with slices of lemon in it) slightly different to a "citron pressé" squashed on the spot. So both exist, but are slightly different versions of the same thing.

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