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Persian/Iranian

tatamagouche Sep 30, 2010 07:47 AM

In my 40 years I've never seen a restaurant that called itself Iranian, only Persian.

Of course, in my lifetime, politics have been such that the distinction makes sense in terms of restaurateurs not wanting to scare Americans (who may or may not be quite aware of the CIA's role in shaping the Iranian government of today) off. But if I understand correctly, it may also be a distinction that they themselves care to make precisely as a personal political statement. Or for that matter a culinary one, the cuisine having ancient roots.

Can anyone speak to this?

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    DeppityDawg RE: tatamagouche Sep 30, 2010 08:12 AM

    It's true that "Persian" and "Iranian" are not exact synonyms, but I suppose that for most restaurants, both terms would apply accurately. So if they only use "Persian" then there must be a reason. Political, maybe. Phonetic, also (too many different pronunciations floating around for "Iranian"). And there is a tendency to use "Persian" for things with ancient roots and cultural significance, as you said: Persian rugs, Persian leather, Persian cats (?), …

    6 Replies
    1. re: DeppityDawg
      tatamagouche RE: DeppityDawg Sep 30, 2010 08:23 AM

      Yeah, I was thinking about the fact that when it comes to food, we really only see "Iranian" attached to caviar, presumably as a strictly geographical signifier.

      1. re: DeppityDawg
        Pedr0 RE: DeppityDawg Sep 30, 2010 08:56 AM

        As above "Iran" is political rather than cultural term as ethnic Persians are the majority but not the only people living in Iran eg: Kurds, Azeris, Turkic, Arabs. Azerbaijani and Turkish cuisines certainly are not the same as Persian so therein lies the difference.

        1. re: Pedr0
          luckyfatima RE: Pedr0 Dec 22, 2012 01:55 PM

          Yes, this sums it up. Not all Iranians are Persians. Persian is an ethnocultural identity while Iranian is modern political identity.

        2. re: DeppityDawg
          mariacarmen RE: DeppityDawg Sep 30, 2010 09:08 AM

          Had a BF from Iran about 25 years ago - during the time of the hostage situation. He and his family called themselves Persian, but the whole community i met did that before the hostage crisis - none of them called themselves Iranian (and when they said Iran it was "Ee-rahn"). Food was Persian too. Persian was ethnicity, and Iran was the country where they were born.

          1. re: mariacarmen
            tatamagouche RE: mariacarmen Sep 30, 2010 10:38 AM

            Got it—thanks Pedr0 and mariacarmen. That makes sense.

            1. re: mariacarmen
              c
              cresyd RE: mariacarmen Dec 23, 2012 12:53 AM

              Agree with all this, but just to put a little more context - similar to Africa, the countries and borders in the Middle East weren't decided by where the cultural/ethnic groups lived, but largely due to European geopolitics. So feeling a stronger connection/relationship with cultural/ethnic signifiers as opposed to nationalities isn't uncommon to the region (with some noteable exceptions).

              Also regarding Persian, I wonder if in the West it also has something to do with distinguishing themselves from being "Arab". Persians and Arabs do see themselves as culturally/ethnically different, where in Europe/North America there isn't always as much knowledge of the differences. So while Iranian, Lebanese, Saudi may all blend together as being part of a similar geographic region, saying "Persian" indicates a specific culture.

          2. Perilagu Khan RE: tatamagouche Sep 30, 2010 09:24 AM

            Bought a box of Byzantine Delight the other day. It was delicious, but the flavors were rather confusing.

            2 Replies
            1. re: Perilagu Khan
              tatamagouche RE: Perilagu Khan Sep 30, 2010 10:37 AM

              Like.

              1. re: tatamagouche
                mariacarmen RE: tatamagouche Sep 30, 2010 12:38 PM

                like! good one. both of you.

            2. q
              Querencia RE: tatamagouche Dec 22, 2012 08:58 AM

              A major Iranian restaurant in Chicago, Reza's, calls itself Persian; my sense of this is that "Persian" is now the marketing term for Iranian. We also have a grocery store, PARS Grocery, that is "Persian". All I can say is that the food is wonderful, surpassing politics.

              2 Replies
              1. re: Querencia
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                ferret RE: Querencia Dec 22, 2012 10:55 AM

                Reza's has been "Persian" since it was a little hole in the wall 30 years ago. Growing up in Chicago in the 60's and 70's my friends whose parents emigrated from Iran always referred to them selves as Persian. It's a cultural identity in that the name Iran is a 20th century political designation. It's more analogous to "Assyrian" being the cultural identity for Christian Iraqis.

                1. re: Querencia
                  h
                  Harters RE: Querencia Dec 22, 2012 02:19 PM

                  I suspect you are right about the "marketing term". Here in the UK, restaurants also describe themselves as Persian. Perhaps hardly surprising given the "bad press" some western countries (mine included) gives to Iran.

                2. RealMenJulienne RE: tatamagouche Dec 23, 2012 02:51 PM

                  I have one friend who is a modern-day Iranian citizen, so draw what conclusions you will from a sample size of one. She insisted on being called Persian and would get upset if the term "Iranian" was used in conversation to describe people, restaurants, whatever. She was not afraid of discrimination, rather she just did not want her ethnic tradition associated with the current administration.

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