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Looking for a tin-lined copper saucier

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E_M Jul 18, 2010 07:48 AM

Has anyone seen one? I like the shapes of Falk and Mauviel (like the "Try Me" pan, a curved saucepan), but both are lined in stainless steel. I cannot find a tin-lined one. Can anyone direct me? Thank you.

  1. tim irvine Jul 18, 2010 10:07 AM

    tin lined copper seems to be a disappearing item. I note that Mauviel no longer shows it in their line-up. I'd try buycoppercookware.com or Dehillerin. Kind of sad all of the classic items that are disappearing from the scene, especially to those of us who believe tin lined heavy copper is the be all and end all for saucepans and saute pans (but NOT for frying pans!),

    5 Replies
    1. re: tim irvine
      e
      E_M Jul 18, 2010 12:55 PM

      Tim, thanks, but both came up negative. They have tin-lined splayed pans, but not curved.

      As an aside...ok, saucepans are generally used to cook liquid at 212 degrees or below, so ok. Things in a fry pan are usually cooked at 400 degrees plus, around the melting point of tin, so I can see how that would not be optimal. But I was puzzled over the saute. I thought to saute one generally used a bit of butter (or oil) and then over a high heat left a protein to sear and develop fond before lowering the heat to braise with liquids or whatever. Wouldn't this first step be too high a heat--especially without liquid--for tin?

      1. re: E_M
        Zeldog Jul 21, 2010 06:09 PM

        The melting point of tin is a bit over 500F, not 400. I deep fry and saute using tin lined copper all the time with no problems, but you do need to be careful. I put some water to boil in a small saucepan once and forgot about it. That was expensive.

        And you can make fond using tin lined copper, but stainless would be my first choice, mainly because it's hard to clean up the tin without abrading it, but with stainless you can be as brutal as you like.

      2. re: tim irvine
        s
        Shaw Oliver Jul 27, 2010 07:46 AM

        Just curious - why do you mention it's OK for saute pans but not frying pans? Both are used for high heat cooking and can be used interchangeably for most cooking techniques. There really isn't a clear definition of a "frying" pan anyway. It's a generic term.

        1. re: Shaw Oliver
          Chemicalkinetics Jul 27, 2010 09:15 AM

          Shaw,

          As you can see in Tim's post below. His definition of sauting does not require high heat.

          Tim:
          "I have never really use my saute pan for high heat activity"

          I suppose different people have different definition.

        2. re: tim irvine
          d
          Danica21 Aug 18, 2010 12:07 PM

          Try this website--
          http://gourmet-web.com/shop/kupfertop...
          They only sell tin-lined copper cookware, and with the Euro/ Dollar exchange rate the prices are pretty good. The prices listed include European taxes, so it is about 15% less to send it to the US (of course there are shipping charges, but not onerous...)

        3. tim irvine Jul 18, 2010 02:48 PM

          I have never really use my saute pan for high heat activity, like searing a chop. A little butter, a little oil, develop some fond, keep it "jumping" and then deglaze and make sauce. I almost always use thin cuts like scallopine, chicken paillards, or filet of sole. The pan is at its best on the sauce phase. My saute pan was my first piece of heavy copper (nearly forty years) and has never needed retinning.

          There is a place called French Copper Studio that says they will custom make tinned copper pans. Their stuff looks very nice. They say it takes like half a year for custom orders but heck, Jamie at Atlantic sometimes takes that long to tin a saucepan!

          2 Replies
          1. re: tim irvine
            e
            E_M Jul 18, 2010 03:19 PM

            Got it. Now, the sole doesn't stick to the tin? I haven't master fish + stainless, but if I remember correctly, fish + tin = ok?

            1. re: E_M
              tim irvine Jul 21, 2010 08:23 PM

              it seems to work ok...definitely better than on SS, but almost everything I cook in a saute pan starts either with roughly equal parts unsalted butter and peanut oil or, for things that are going to tilt towards Provencal or Italian, olive oil (by itself). The other thing is patience...let the first side brown nicely before you try to turn it or you will be having shredded fish! For whatever reason if you are trying to do several batches, only the first will come off without sticking. So either use two pans or one that is large enough for a single batch or do a quick swipe and clean between batches (or dazzle the diners with your beurre blanc).

          2. d
            diamond dave Jul 25, 2010 12:56 PM

            take a look at Lara copper, they are cheaper than most tin lined copper but still make good looking stuff. also try french only web site.

            1. sherrib Jul 25, 2010 03:44 PM

              Ruffoni!

              http://www.williams-sonoma.com/produc...

              Price is not too bad without the monogramming. They don't specify, however, how many mm of copper is used. They do, however, say not to heat to over 450 degrees.

              7 Replies
              1. re: sherrib
                e
                E_M Jul 25, 2010 04:28 PM

                Some times I wonder about those people. Not only does it not list the mm, I can't find how big it is. I am concerned also about many of the positive reviews from people who just use it for decoration, and the brass handle. I wish more cooks weighed in. That first review from someone who claims to use a lot of copper is really negative.

                1. re: E_M
                  Chemicalkinetics Jul 25, 2010 05:52 PM

                  The one mentioned by sherrib does have the size listed. It is a 4-qt (click on the "More Info")

                  1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                    e
                    E_M Jul 25, 2010 06:47 PM

                    Yes! I see it now, thanks!

                    I hate that tab. You'd think the important info would be on the front tab/main page or even title, wouldn't you?

                    1. re: E_M
                      Chemicalkinetics Jul 25, 2010 07:01 PM

                      I know. Sometime I think the priorities are mixed up. As you said, one would think the size of a cookware is pretty important, but this important information is placed in the "More Info". On the other hand, something like "The wide base ensures steady absorption of broth ..." or "included cherrywood risotto spoon ..." should be considered as lesser important, but those are placed on the front page.

                      1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                        e
                        E_M Jul 25, 2010 07:16 PM

                        The included cherrywood spoon was probably of supreme importance to the reviewer who gave it high marks because it looked so nice hanging in her window.

                        1. re: E_M
                          Chemicalkinetics Jul 25, 2010 08:29 PM

                          E_M,

                          Ha ha ha. I thought you meant it in a metaphoric term, but I have finally found the review you were talking about. It is pretty funny:

                          "I hang mine on top of my lg. LR Picture Window for show as they are lovely w/ decorative green or fall, winter fruits, etc. depending on the season..."

                      2. re: E_M
                        sherrib Jul 25, 2010 09:18 PM

                        I HATE having to fish around for what (for me at least) is the most important information!! Makes me wonder who they really are and who they're really trying to sell to. Point is, Ruffoni still makes tin lined copper and WS happens to carry it. You can even decorate your large window with it . . .

                2. tim irvine Jul 26, 2010 07:33 PM

                  I have hefted Ruffoni at W-S and quickly decided not to mess with it. It is not very hefty, and brass handles get REALLY hot REALLY fast. It seems even lighter than the Mauviel "table" line. It is pretty, but anyone who springs for a copper saucepan these days is probably not in it for the looks. They are just lagniappe!

                  1 Reply
                  1. re: tim irvine
                    e
                    E_M Aug 3, 2010 04:57 AM

                    Well, I emailed Ruffoni and asked for the mm of the copper and got no response. So I emailed WS and got this (un)helpful answer:

                    <i>Thank you for your inquiry. At, this time the information you are requesting is not readily available to customer service for review. We discontinued the Ruffoni risotto pan through the catalog/Internet division. We apologize for any inconvenience that may be caused. </i>

                    Now, under the assumption that WS is all one company, why they couldn't get me the information from another division under the assumption I'd go to a store and buy it, I don't know.

                  2. kaleokahu Jul 27, 2010 10:07 AM

                    If you'd send me an email to kaleokahu@gmail.com, I'll give you a (third party's) website where you can get 3mm tinned hammered sauciers and lids at a great price.

                    1. tim irvine Aug 3, 2010 04:34 PM

                      I believe it was buycoppercookware.com where they said Ruffoni was 1.5mm. IMHO even if it were 2.5 mm I'd still go with Mauviel for the iron handles. Brass just gets too hot too fast.

                      1. OCEllen Aug 18, 2010 12:55 PM

                        Have you tried Ebay?

                        1. vikingwoman Nov 25, 2010 02:08 PM

                          I had a 2 litre and 3 litre custom made with iron handles in France with lids about 3mm. Not cheap.

                          Let me know if you are interested.
                          vikingwoman@shaw.ca

                          Charla

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