What drink should I order at the King Cole bar?

[MarlaPR]

Staying at the St. Regis and want to go and have a cocktail at the King Cole bar. What should I order?? Not wine, surely.

[joisey al]

Wow, staying at some nice digs.....the bar is famous for their Bloody Mary's. Cheers!

[clembeauchamp]

Yes, definitely not wine. The bloody mary is great but you probably won't go wrong with anything else. There is a cocktail menu but I am a big fan of their dirty martinis.

[gutsofsteel]

Get a classic cocktail: a Manhattan, a martini (classic, not dirty), a negroni, an old-fashioned...

note: a classic martini is made with GIN, not vodka.

[small h]

A martini is made with gin. A vodka martini is made with vodka. "Classic martini" is a retronym, like rotary phone or acoustic guitar. And I'm sorry we have to resort to it.

[MarlaPR]

Wow, I wished I had asked earlier. Ended up ordering a glass of champagne that ended up being $34. Silly, wonder where that bar menu was now.

[small h]

Yikes! I hope it was worth it.

[MarlaPR]

Sadly, no.

[gutsofsteel]

A martinin is made with gin. Period. I'm sure a cocktail made with vodka and vermouth is lovely, but it isn't a martini.

[small h]

Then what's a "classic martini"?

[hcbk0702]

Gin
Dry vermouth
Dash of orange bitters (optional)

Cracked ice. Stir. Garnish with lemon twist.

If you replace the gin with vodka, the cocktail is officially called a kangaroo (usually no bitters as well). Because of vodka's incredible popularity, people just referred to it as a vodka martini and the name stuck. Most cocktailians refuse to recognize that term though! Martinis require gin by definition.

[small h]

Thanks for the info re the kangaroo. But if you put bitters in my martini, I will send it back.

[gutsofsteel]

A ratio of 3:1 or 4:1 gin to vermouth. No bitters. Olive or lemon twist. Shaken or stirred.

[small h]

Yeah, you're missing my point a little bit. I know how to make a martini. You said, at 6:59am, that "a classic martini is made with GIN, not vodka." Then, at 11:12 am, you said "A martinin (sic) is made with gin." So are you saying there's a difference between a "martini" and a "classic martini"? If so, what is it?

[gutsofsteel]

In my view , a "classic" martini is one where the proportion of gin to vermouth is either 3:1 or 4:1. I recognize that a martini may also be gin with just a hint of vermouth, but this is not a "classic" martini.

[small h]

Ah, thanks. That clears things up. I drink dry martinis, then, not classic martinis. I have a vague recollection of reading something a few months back about the newly popular and ultimately more "authentic" (according to the article) gin to vermouth ratio of 1:1 or 2:1.

[gutsofsteel]

In my opinion, you have to taste the vermouth. If you drink a glass of gin and the vermouth is so scant as to not be discernible, that's not a martini. That's a glass of gin.

[hcbk0702]

Pegu Club's signature martini, the "Fitty Fitty", has a gin to dry vermouth ratio of 1:1, along with 2 dashes of their housemade orange bitters. Not to everyone's taste, but I like it a lot.

CHOW's "The Perfect Martini"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAZj6D...

[small h]

That is exactly what I half-remembered. I don't think I'd like it. I prefer that the vermouth lurk in the background, muttering quietly to itself, and not stealing the spotlight away from the gin.

[gutsofsteel]

That is a "Fitty Fitty" - not a martini.

I have had many a martini at Pegu Club - they know the difference very well.