Gas vs. electric

[ttoommyy]

I haven't had a gas stove top or oven in over 20 years...and I miss it. I currently have a glass electric stove top and although it is a clean and neat look, I'd rather be cooking with gas! Do others out there who have electric stove tops long for the more natural way of cooking over a gas flame like I do? Just curious.

[Val]

I'm with you...moved from NJ (gas stove) to SWFL (electric everything) and I do miss cooking with gas, even years afterwards. And everytime I watch a cooking show or video and they just turn on their gas stovetop, there are pangs of jealousy and longing! hahaha!

[bushwickgirl]

I have successfully avoided electric stoves for most of my adult life, having had just one electric stove in an apartment, back in the early 80's. So since I don't have electric I can't really properly respond to your query, but just wanted to pimp gas cooking, which I do every chance I get. It'll be interesting to see the responses and opinions here.

[JoanN]

For the past few months I've been going back and forth between a gas stove top and a glass electric top. HATE the glass top. I'm constantly fiddling with the temperature to get what I'm looking for, something that's just so much easier with gas. And my wok, even though it's a flat-bottomed one, just doesn't function as well on glass. And although it's not something I do often, you just can't char peppers on a glass stove top.

The one thing I do like about the glass top is that one burner has a "sure simmer" feature and it really works well. It's easily adjusted from a very slow simmer to a fast one and I find it holds the temperature steady. Great for making long-simmering stocks.

[Chemicalkinetics]

I don't think many people here advocate electric over gas, except at very low heat. Electric stovetop has better control at low heat than most gas stovetop.

[Politeness]

ttoommyy: "I'd rather be cooking with gas!"

There are three ways to read that strong affirmation: (1) you prefer the way that a gas burner WORKS compared to your (present) electric cooking surface; (2) you prefer gas as an energy source generally (for whatever reason, such as cost per BTU/calorie), and prefer a gas furnace, a gas water heater, etc., also; or (3) you are nostalgic for the flickering flame. I cannot address the latter two, but I can address the first.

"Electric" covers two entirely different kinds of technology. What you probably have now is resistive electric, where the electricity heats up a coil (which may be exposed or under a glass surface) or, in the case of a halogen cooktop, filaments within very hot light bulbs. The hot cooktop surface then conveys heat to your pots and pans mostly by conduction, and secondarily by radiation, the radiation to conduction ratio being a bit higher with halogen cooktops.

But there is an entirely different kind of electric cooktop that uses an entirely different technology: induction. An induction cooktop does not itself get hot; it _induces_ the pots and pans themselves to get hot with an oscillating magnetic field. The transfer of energy from cooktop to pot is by cool magnetism instead of by conduction in the form of heat, and is done at the speed of electromagnetic radiation -- the speed of light -- which is much faster than the transfer of energy by conduction.

A pot on an induction cooktop will heat up much faster, for a given input of energy, than a pot on gas. I'll repeat that, because those who have used only resistive electric cooktops frequently refuse to believe it. Induction heats faster than gas, it does.

Induction can also be turned DOWN faster than gas. Turning down an induction burner reduces the heat instantaneously. There effectively is no difference between turning off an induction burner and physically reemoving the pot that was sitting on it from the cooktop entirely. When you turn down a gas burner, there is some residual heat in the (usually cast metal) spider that has been holding the pot above the flame, and that heat continues for a brief period to transfer heat to the pot. But the instant that you turn down an induction burner, all of the heat transfer is in the other direction, from pot to cooktop, because the cooktop always is cooler than the pot.

When you are using cookware that has a high heat inertia, like cast iron, which is relatively slow to heat up and rather slow to cool down, there is much less overshoot when you use it atop an induction burner. (Also, from the time you turn on an induction burner, the _inside_ of the cast iron pot is being excited by the magnetism and starts to heat without having to wait for energy in the form of heat to be conducted through the thickness of the cast iron from the outside surface.) Likewise, with a pressure cooker, you can adjust the pressure (the little bar that shows how high the pressure inside the pot is) instantaneously in real time with an induction cooktop; you cannot do that with a resistive electric cooktop, and the response is more sluggish with gas.

When you have a boil-over or a spill on an induction cooktop, the spill will not burn on -- the cooktop does not get hot enough for that -- but you do want to wipe it up right away, so you simply move the pot aside and wipe off the merely warm (it is warm because a hot pot has been sitting on it) cooktop with a rag or sponge before replacing the pot on the same burner and resuming your cooking. You cannot do that with either a resistive electric or a gas cooktop.

There is much less danger of children burning themselves on an induction surface than on either a resistive electric or gas cooktop. You will never catch your sleeve or scarf on fire from an induction cooktop. In the summer, the induction cooktop still can cook food without heating the kitchen at the same time.

So [grin] tell us why you hate motherhood, apple pie, and induction cooktops. [grin]

[ttoommyy]

I don't really understand what that last sentence means, so I'll just say that I miss cooking with a live gas flame. I like it. That's all. :)

[Chemicalkinetics]

Do you live in an apartment? Is there any way (reasonable), you can get to a gas source?

[ttoommyy]

High-rise condo. No way to get gas. It's my lot in life until we retire and move to our dream house somewhere and I can build my own kitchen!

[Chemicalkinetics]

Ttoommyy,

High rise condo sounds very fancy to me :)

You will survive. I have been living in apartments for more than 15 years and have been using electric coil stoveop. The problem is the slow response, but once you get used to it, you can work around it. It is not impossible to work with, just a less convenient. I guess I am saying that the foods do not have to come out worse.
So what is your dream kitchen going to be like? Fancy gas stove with high thermal power? Or most like convection oven? :)

Best wish

[ttoommyy]

Not very fancy...it's just a big apartment buliding. lol
Like I said earlier, it's been about 20 years that Ive been cooking on an electric stove top, so I am "used" to it, but I still envy those with a gas stove top.

My dream kitchen would be all gas...the way (cave)man was meant to cook. It does not need to be high end, just quality. And I definitley want an indoor grill as part of it.

[Politeness]

ttoommyy: "I don't really understand what that last sentence means" I guess you would have to be a fan of MSNBC's "Morning Joe" to get the impact.

"I'll just say that I miss cooking with a live gas flame. I like it. That's all. :)"

That's a very good reason; I listed it as (3) in my earlier response, but the reasons were not ranked in order of importance. My response earlier addressed only the reason listed (1).

[paducahrider]

ANSWERING YOUR LAST QUESTION:
1. THE COST OF MOST INDUCTION UNITS IS STILL AT THE TOP END OF THE SCALE.
2. THE COST OF REPAIR WILL BE HIGHER THAN ALMOST ANY OTHER TYPE.
One repair will wipe out years of low energy usage.
Until these factors are reduced,, I can'y see the value of this type of range, unless cost is no object.
Oddly enough, that has been the case in a surprising number of purchases for new homes, over the last decade.
Not surprisingly, many purchasers have regreted those extravagant outlays when they are compounded throughout a home, which, in no small way, has helped drive the price of homes into the stratosphere.
Thanks for your time.

[Politeness]

paducahrider, We can speak only from personal experience, but in the first ten years we owned an induction cooktop, it did not need any repairs. When it did need a repair in its tenth year, it needed a very specific part that no longer could be obtained at any cost. The maker, Jenn-Air, a division of Maytag, was part of Whirlpool Corporation's acquisition of Maytag, and after the acquisition, Whirlpool Corporation, completely, utterly, and thoroughly abandoned all legacy Maytag and Jenn-Air products in the field. We found that Whirlpool Corporation did not even have a LIST of former Maytag and Jenn-Air products, much less maintain a warehouse of replacement parts. So we never spent even one cent on repair of our Jenn-Air induction cooktop, but we did have to replace it when it needed its first repair.

In the years since we bought that Jenn-Air, however, induction cooktops have become more mainstream, and it has been a top priority of some makers to make the appliance as reliable as possible. There is no inherent reason why a cooktop that uses induction technology should be any less reliable than a coil-top resistive electric cooktop or range, and, in fact, because the electronic controls are not subjected to the high temperatures that coil electric cooktops generate, there is reason to believe that they will be more reliable in the long run than modern resistive electric ranges and cooktops that have electronic controls.

As for initial cost, induction units almost always will be comparable in cost to low-end gas ranges, which is to say, more expensive than resistive electric units, but will cost only a fraction of the cost of the aggressive-looking "commercial" gas ranges like Wolf or Blue Star that are styled to look as if they will eat the remainder of the kitchen.

We did not buy our induction cooktop with an eye to saving on our utility bill, however. In fact, our electric bill DID come down, but that was just a nice lagniappe. We bought an induction cooktop simply because it cooks better, end of story. That's where our priorities were and are.

[bushwickgirl]

LG induction cooktop, $2,000, Electrolux 30" hybrid induction cooktop, $1,699, GE Profile induction cooktop, $2,299, LG 30" self-cleaning gas range, $1,200, low-end GE 30" gas range, $450.00, price range for 30" gas ranges, various brands, $350-$550.
(Home Depot price quotes.)

How is a induction cooktop price comparable to a low-end gas range?

Speaking of reliability, you can't beat a gas range for reliability and longevity.

[Chemicalkinetics]

Bushwick,

Distracing you for a second. I have seen a couple gas range, but have not really work with one since I were a kid. The gas range that I have seen in my friend place is not very good at keeping the low setting. That is the flame is either off or in medium. There is no real real steady low setting. I think that may be true for a lot of gas range since people sell flame disffusors and flame tamers. So, do you have much problem with yours gas range? Or is this really only a problem with low end gas range?

[bushwickgirl]

I have a low setting on my burners, but it won't go any lower than the setting or it goes out. I do the restaurant technique when cooking and pull the pan to one side of the burner, rather than fuss with the flame, if it's too hot, but the low setting on my burners is a very low flame. This setting capability is better than gas stoves I've had in the past, which required fine manual adjustment for a low flame.
This inability to get the flame set to very low may be a problem with really low end gas ranges and possibly gas ranges in general, given the flame diffusor and flame tamer sales figures, but the higher-end gas ranges all have burner control settings now. Mine's not anything really high end, just a big workhorse and quite new, with some bells and whistles and the ability to set the burners without fussing around.

So what do you cook on? Induction, gas, campfire?;-) You know, it's more the ability of the chef than the energy source that makes a good meal, IMO.

[Chemicalkinetics]

Buckwick,

Almost forgot to reply. I have lived in apartments for the last 15+ years, so I have been using the electric resistance coil range. The kind which many complain about. Like I told Ttoommyy a few posts above, one can get used to any of these heat sources, even electric coils :) They have a slower heat response, so I just have to wait longer, but it isn't really that horrible. I usually prep 90% of my food and then turn on the electric stove to medium and prep the rest of the 10% while keep an eye. So it doesn't have to really waste too much time.

Yeah, I know. The ability of the chef matters more than any heat source or cookware. Except if you are stuck with a microwave oven. In that case, there is not much cooking skill to leverage. :)

When I get to buy my first house, then I will probably go for a gas range if possible.

[bushwickgirl]

Chem-
Yes, you just learn how to work with the stove you have, until you can get the one you want.

Exactly on the microwave, although I was stuck with only that option for awhile and although it's certainly limited, I was able to do stews and pasta without much trouble.

[Politeness]

Bushwickgirl: "LG induction cooktop, $2,000

We ourselves bought one of those one year ago, for two-thirds that price. You could buy one today for $1709 m(or maybe less, with a little shopping). http://www.universal-akb.com/lg30elincolc.html

Bushwickgirl: "Electrolux 30" hybrid induction cooktop, $1,699"

$880: http://www.searsoutlet.com/d/product_details.jsp?pid=7915&ind=78

Bushwickgirl: "GE Profile induction cooktop, $2,299"

$1,018: http://02bf91a.netsolstores.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=3947

BlueStar RGTNB304BSS 30" Cooktop with 4 Burners: $2,860: http://www.universal-akb.com/bl30corg...

[flourgirl]

I have the GE Cafe Gas Range - and I have no problem whatsoever with the burners keeping a low setting. Especially the simmer burner that is precisely designed for this - but even one of the power burners in the front keeps a super low setting with no trouble at all.

[bushwickgirl]

I'm sure shopping around is the thing to do for a better deal than Home Depot and I would certainly do that if I was in the market. My point was that induction cooktops are still quite high-end and certainly not compapable to a better gas range w/o the self cleaning feature.
Anyway, to each his or her own and I do appreciate the info about inductions.
Noticed a post on another similar thread, that the poster actually placed newspaper on the cooktop, then placed her pots on same while cooking, so as not to have any cooktop cleaning to do after. Have you tried that?

[Politeness]

bushwickgirl: "Noticed a post on another similar thread, that the poster actually placed newspaper on the cooktop, then placed her pots on same while cooking, so as not to have any cooktop cleaning to do after. Have you tried that?"

We have done with parchment paper instead of newspaper -- easier to see the cooktop's centering rings through parchment paper. Incidentally, I _think_ tanuki soup placed "his" pots on newspaper, but I could be wrong. .

[iluvcookies]

My aunt now lives in a senior community where there is no gas, only electric. She sorely misses the old gas stove with a pilot light from her house as a kid since nothing she cooks on the electric burners comes out right for her. For someone who learned the fine points of cooking on one type of stove, the switch to another can be devastating.

[hobbybaker]

Hi- iluvcookies, that is exactly what I am afraid if i relocate especially to outside of the US, which might happen to me sooner or later. That is also the reason I buy almost exclusively All-Clad SS, which can be used on whatever the stove will be:)

[mcsheridan]

YES! I've been without gas since I relocated to NJ from a Manhattan apartment over 20 years ago, and I STILL miss it! Yes, I got used to electric; I can make it work. I still don't like it; so much so that this year, I'm switching back to a gas range. Ten years ago, I converted my heating system in the house from oil to gas, but as the electric range was still functional, I couldn't justify the replacement cost.

It's nearly dead now, and Ding-Dong to it! Got a nice 5-burner gas range all picked out, complete with Two power burners, one regular burner, one simmer burner and a center-mounted oval burner for grills/griddles or just big oval dutch oven.

I can't wait!

[Chemicalkinetics]

Wow. :) Are you sure you need all that 5-burners with two "power" burners features? Or are you over-compensating what you have missed. :) Just teasing you. Congratulation.

[mcsheridan]

Weeeellllll....maybe there's just a Teeny-weeny bit of overcompensation going on. Just maybe. :)

Thanks.

[Elispappy]

I have always enjoyed reading the eternal "gas vs electric" debates on various boards. I sort of understand why the majority prefer gas (I had a gas range in my first house), but after 12 years with two different smooth-top electric units, I have to say, I'm pretty sure I can cook up anything the 'gas-heads' can, and it will taste equally good and be equally easy to prepare. I just don't think anyone in a blind taste test would ever be able to discern between gas and electric on a properly prepared dish.
I guess what I'm saying is, I'll put my electric-cooked food up against anyone's gas-cooked food any time, anywhere! :-D
(No, I'm not B Flay, and this isn't a "Throwdown" episode LOL!)

[bushwickgirl]

The point here is "properly prepared dish;" there can be no throwdown between gas and electric. A capable chef will get good results from any energy source, given some experience with that source. The technique used for cooking with gas or electric is a bit different but if you have a grip on your stove, and can manipulate the food and cookware accordingly, then you're ok and will get equally good results between the two. Preference between gas or electric is a personal style choice; sometimes, though, it's just about where you live and what type of stove is available to you.
B Flay would not debate this.