48" Pro Style Range Need Help on Decision Making!!!

[d_fish]

Hi Everyone. We are in the process of purchasing a home and we plan to remodel the kitchen before we move in. I found this site while researching pro-ranges. I realize there is a lot of information on this site and have scoured the forum, but still have a few questions for those in the know.

To provide a little background first, I am not an avid baker, I probably bake 2-3 cakes per year and occasionally cookies. My husband and I enjoy cooking and primarily use a gas cooktop, we currently own a Dacor 6 burner pro cooktop and a Dacor wall oven. We haven’t ever used more than 3 burners at once. We rarely use our single oven, but find that once or twice per year we wished we had 2. We usually start things on the cooktop and finish them in the oven. We also use our rotisserie on the bbq a lot. I would say I use the oven primarily for roasting vegetables.
After appliance shopping this weekend, my husband insists on a 48 inch gas range as they look great. My preference would be a 36 inch gas range and a single electric wall oven to give use more flexibility. We are leaning towards an all gas range versus dual fuel due to what I perceive as problems with combining electronics with heat.

I am willing to “throw my husband a bone” and go with the 48 inch range as I usually get my own way and this is important to him. But his decision is based on a look. I do believe the 48 inch range will look great and we certainly have the space. But then I don’t want to spend the money putting in an electric oven right now if we go with the 48. I can work the kitchen design so that I reserve space in a cupboard and have it wired with a receptacle so that I can put an oven in at a later date if we find that we absolutely need an electric oven.

My questions/concerns with the 48 inch range are:

This is for ranges in general. The ovens seem to so close to the floor. It seems like we’d be stooping or at least doing deep knee bends to check on items in the oven. Does anyone find this back breaking or a problem?

Is it a mistake going all gas?

Our preference at the moment is Wolf because it seems like Viking is just too unreliable. I am not fond of the look of the Dacor range, but do like their cooktop. I was going to look at Thermador all gas, but again I have read many negative things about them. We were thinking of 6 burners and ? I make pancakes 2 x per month and wouldn’t use the griddle for anything else. But sales persons mentioned you could use the griddle like a simmering plate. Is that true?

What brand is the most reliable?

Are open burners hard to clean?

Sorry for all the questions, but I just want to ensure we are planning our kitchen and spending money wisely. Thanks for you help!!!

[Td61]

A Wolf is worth every penny!

[koigirl]

Will try not to repeat what others have already said. We have a 36" AG Wolf range. At the time we bought it, we could have bought the 48" floor model for the same price. I really thought I wanted a separate electric wall oven so we went with the 36". However, in retrospect, one clear advantage to the 48" for me would have been the 18" oven for small tasks - quick to preheat and useful for many small daily tasks (which sounds like most of your oven duty). A 36" oven takes a long time to preheat (30-40 minutes) because it's such a huge cavity. Sounds like six burners will be more than you'll ever need. I'm a prolific cook and I've never used more than 5 burners at a time and 5 is very rare (think holidays). I agree that you are wise to go with all gas unless you're really hung up on having self-cleaning ovens. The first major (expensive) repair on most ranges/ovens is replacement of a control panel damaged by heat, often after a self-clean cycle. I deflinitely think open burners are the way to go if you're looking at pro-style ranges; the flame pattern is definitely superior. And yes, the infrared grill is described as superb. Another bonus on a Wolf is the infrared oven broiler - you can turn out some wicked Ruth Chris type steaks using it. Do the 30-inch range with an electric wall oven or go with the 48" and enjoy an infrared grill - that would be my advice. Oh yeah, as for the bending over, the ovens are definitely low to the ground. Not an issue for us but might be for someone older - you'll have to decide that for yourself.

[d_fish]

Thanks for the info everyone. I re-read my post and I did write it in such a way that you would think we don't cook often, but we are actually prolific cooks. The intent of my post was that we make do with what we currently have in our kitchen. When I plan dinners, I sometimes make things ahead so that I only have to reheat an item. But I plan a menu keeping in mind my current kitchen limitations.

WIth that said, I have used 4 of the 5 burners on my cooktop at once. But usually no more than 2 or 3. My oven is primarily used for roasting, broiling or reheating. I am fond of baking.

After reading a prior thread from RetiredChef, it was convinced to move to a unit with a grill instead of griddle. Sound far more funtional and I would actually use a grill. I like the idea of being able to grill vegetables or bread without having to turn on my bbq.

I do not want a self cleaning oven as I feel that I have burned out 2 ovens now using that feature. My Dacor no long seems to heat to temperature and I believe it is because I used the self clean feature albeit I only use it once a year and the oven is 4 years old. It just doesn't seen to heat properly.

I do like the sound of the infared broiler. My current method of turning out a good steak is to sear it in a Le Creuset cast iron pan and finish in the oven. Broiling seems less messy - well at least on the top of the range.

With that said, I really like the look of the 48" range and think I would enjoy using it. My biggest concern was going AG instead of DF. But I don't think that really matters based on feedback. Thanks again everyone.

[ruby765]

I sell all these brands and have them available to cook on and my hands down favorite is the Viking with the griddle. We use that griddle for everything: pancakes, of course, but also bacon, sausage, hash browns, grilled cheese, scrambled eggs, fried eggs, etc. I have also used it as a warming tray to keep back up platters of food warm before they go out to feed people.

If you do end up going with the grill, PLEASE make sure you have adequate ventilation. Indoor grilling will put off a lot of grease, smoke and heat (even infrared grilling), and you need a much more powerful ventilation system to pull that out of your house. Because you are going to need a higher CFM unit, consider one with an external blower that mount on the outside of the house. It's not pretty, so if you can locate it on the back of the house, or where it can be hidden by landscaping, this helps. This will cut down (not eliminate) on the noise from the ventilation system. Lastly consider make up air. Todays houses are built so tightly that it can be difficult to pull enough air in from the outside to replace what your ventilation system is trying to remove, and you need that air circulation for the system to work efficently. Sometimes this is as easy to achieve as cracking open a window in the kitchen, but some areas do have make up air regulations so you will want to check with your contractor.

[321jeanclaude7937]

I don't have any answers but I have questions. We are looking at the 48" GE Monogram gas range dual system for our kitchen. ANy users on this one and also what kind of hood would be best? We are also looking at the microwave drawer. Has anyone used this? I can't remember the brand we looked at but there is more than one. We remodeled the kitchen after hurricane damage in 2005 and put in another glass top electric. It has a crack all across the top so we are doing what we really wanted to in the first place with the gas 48".

[RetiredChef]

Answers to your questions:

>>>The ovens seem to so close to the floor. It seems like we’d be stooping or at least doing deep knee bends to check on items in the oven. Does anyone find this back breaking or a problem?

I don’t but I’m used to it. I also have dual wall ovens and it is easier to work out of those.

>>>Is it a mistake going all gas?

Not at all – IMO, dual fuel is a marketing gimmick, it’s costly to purchase and install if you don’t have the 220 V line already. The supposed benefits will not be noticed by 99.9% of all cooks.

>>>We were thinking of 6 burners and ? I make pancakes 2 x per month and wouldn’t use the griddle for anything else.

Then skip the griddle, most people who purchase these don’t use them very much and I know a few people who have just turned their griddle into a spice rack area. I have an after-market griddle that get’s placed on top of the burners for the once a month pancake fest.

Your other choices are the French top – I don’t recommend, costly to run, heats the whole house, takes a while to get to temp or with Wolf the Grill – which is imo the only reason to by a wolf. They have a infrared Ceramic grill that no-one else has. It produces true 1000 degree grate temps and is a wonderful unit.

>>>But sales persons mentioned you could use the griddle like a simmering plate. Is that true?
Yes and no, it tends to take the seasoning off of your griddle, btw you can use the grill that way too. I have boiled water on mine in a pinch.

>>>What brand is the most reliable?

Historically speaking wolf has been, but Viking has made some good accomplishments in the recent years. However as of 09 Wolf still used some of the beefier internal components.

>>>Are open burners hard to clean?

NO – And do not get a sealed burner, there a many drawbacks behind that technology if interested I will give you a video to watch that shows why.

Comments:

It doesn’t sound like you cook all that much so I would not suggest the 48” monster. Secondly if I was re-doing my kitchen today I would be taking a very serious look into a induction cook-top and double wall-ovens. Within 5-10 years induction will be about 50-75% of all units sold.

My bias: I own a 48” Wolf and love gas, but induction blew my socks off, I do chef demonstrations part-time for a large appliance retailer so I get to use a lot of different equipment and talk to a lot of service people.

[dmd_kc]

The 48" stainless range is, in the words of a realtor I talked to the other day, the canary in the coal mine of the early 2000s' real estate bubble. If you're going for looks, I'm sorry, but your husband is barking up the wrong tree. High-end and forward-looking kitchen designers are running away from stainless as fast as their legs can carry them. The "industrial" look is dead dead dead, and will date as badly as avocado green and burnt sienna.

For a family that cooks as you describe, you have no need for a $10k range. I'd encourage you to look at a nice 30" consumer model at the $2k price point. I have a dual-fuel Electrolux with one small lower oven (where warming drawers usually are) and love everything about it.

There are several 30" models out there with one big and one small oven, with the smaller one at the top. That looks extremely functional to me.

If money's no issue, then go for it. But I truly believe you could find a lot more utilitarian uses for those extra thousands.

[RetiredChef]

Dmd,

Hmmm, I would disagree, stainless steel appliances are a classic kitchen appliance color/look they have been around for a long time (50+years residentially longer commercially), just like white and stone counter-tops. Until commercial kitchens get rid of stainless steel you will always find that it will be acceptable in homes. What does come and goes in style are colors, so it would be much riskier putting in dark cabinets and red appliances than classic SS or white appliances.

[baloo]

We have a viking 48 inch dual fuel with 6 burners and griddle. We have had it for a little over two years and I love it. The open burners are really easy to clean (everything comes apart, so I think it's actually easier than sealed). The griddle is actually more useful than I expected, because you can use it for lots of things besides the usual pancakes that you would think of. I actually use it to heat up leftover pizza (that way the crust doesn't get soggy like in the microwave). It's also great for making quesadillas and I'm sure you'll think of things too. I don't find the ovens on the bottom to be a problem, as long as you have adequate space for the doors to open. If you do end up getting the 48inch range, you might not really need a wall oven since you will have two ovens on the range. Mine has two--one is larger than the other, which is kind of nice since you don't have to heat the large oven if you're not cooking something so big.