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Deymeyer vs. Falk cookware

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wsw1001 Jan 3, 2010 11:12 AM

I am looking to buy some new cookware and had sorta been leaning towards All-clad copper core until recently. Based on what I have researched it is between the Deymeyer stainless or Falk copper cookware. I know there are pros and cons to both. I think over all the Falk might be better but being single and busy alot I am afraid that I may not devote enough time to keeping the copper clean. Interested in how hard the copper is to keep clean and how easy the Deymeyer is compared to the copper. Thanks for the help....Scott

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    ChowTO RE: wsw1001 Jan 4, 2010 08:25 PM

    I have the 11" and 13.5" Demeyere proline -atlantis frying pans...trully incredible product and never a doubt of the quality since day one..i have the All-clad 8" copper core frypan and for some reason despite all the negative comments i think the 8" copper core works quite well..i'm also looking at the Falk copper and keep changing my mind as to which pieces to purchase.The brushed copper of the Falk is supposedly easy to clean..the Demeyere you can clean with your hand...once i had to use a bit of Bar keepers friend for some burnt on cheese..took no time at all.When the All-clad exposed copper tarnishes it's a matter of seconds with BKF and the copper shines like new,so i would think that the Falk copper would be easy to detarnish once a month or so..i'm looking at the Falk 11" wide peices..and also the big cauldrun that's not on the copperpans site.

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      E_M RE: wsw1001 Jan 5, 2010 04:41 PM

      The Demeyere can be put in the dishwasher. The Falk needs to be handwashed and polished on a semi-regular basis, if you want to keep the shine.

      2 Replies
      1. re: E_M
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        ChowTO RE: E_M Jan 7, 2010 06:29 AM

        Just purchased the Falk saucier Try me piece with cover..if it's anywhere near the quality that the fans claim then i could see myself spending 2k in the future for copper,they look sweet..it's not easy clicking 2k away without ever seeing a Falk pan.

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          ChowTO RE: ChowTO Feb 27, 2010 07:47 PM

          My Falk 1.5qt saucier arrived,,this is the highest quality piece of cookware i have ever seen..very heavy copper.
          The shape is perfect for a saucier.
          The pan has about 8 hours of cooking sauces,oats,and it won't tarnish..looks new even after deliberately cooking with high heat to try to tarnish..brushed look is also very nice,kinda glows..seems alive.
          I will be purchasing more Falk pieces...like a kid in a candy store.yup she nice.

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        Seitan RE: wsw1001 Feb 27, 2010 08:30 PM

        Chow, what did you mean by "despite all the negative comments' when referring to the copper core? Just curious.

        3 Replies
        1. re: Seitan
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          ChowTO RE: Seitan Feb 28, 2010 07:56 AM

          Negative as in ..not enough copper,too thin,warping,dents easily,overpriced..my 8" ACCC is really nice and seems well built..i payed half price "another try me peice"so seems ok.I went to WS and William Ashley -bloor n yonge-last night to pick up some bar tenders friend copper version,they were all out,seeing as this saucier doesn't want to tarnish i saved myself some $$.Looking around at the cookware i feel the prices are all ridiculous,,willam ashley has the 7.9"..11"..13"? demeyere pro line fry pans for less cost than the AC copper cores,compared side by side each of the demeyeres could be melted and 4 AC's built,i noticed the whole All clad CC line is the same diameter..so the 8" frypan seems well built and the larger pieces seem flimsy...the demeyre sauce pots are very expensive and not that impressive,the copper core are almost the same price.they had mauviel copper that made me smile for the fact that i payed less than half for my wayyyyyyy nicer 1.5 qt copper saucier.If these prices stay this high then i'm shopping over the border for everything.Just ordered a larger pressure cooker from over the other side of the lake,see i'm already ordering
          from over there...they want to overcharge here?..i'll spend my money elsewhere.

          1. re: ChowTO
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            Seitan RE: ChowTO Feb 28, 2010 11:06 AM

            Ok, thanks. I hadn't heard those comments about ACCC before (well, except for the overpriced one). Value for money, and since you actually have used both, which do you think is the better buy: ACCC or Demeyer Atlantis?

            Thanks

            1. re: Seitan
              Sid Post RE: Seitan Aug 12, 2012 09:37 PM

              The Demeyere fry pan needs to be seen in person to be appreciated. The web just doesn't do it justice. The 3.2L saucepan can be a little off putting since the sides are relatively thin stainless steel to offset the weight of the heavy base. To have that much weight in the base and still get the pan to balance is hard believe.

              All-clad is over rated IMHO. I still don't like the handles. The dutch oven I have has thin sides just like the demeyere saucepan. In a saucepan they are okay, not in a dutch oven. :-( Lesson learned.

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          jeffreyem RE: wsw1001 Feb 28, 2010 09:58 AM

          Fry pans I would go Demeyere all the way. the Falk has a hard edge where it transitions from the bottom to the sides where the Demeyere is a smooth transition, and I personally like that better, I also think the Silvinox finish on the Demeyere is fantastic.. Funny I was just looking at an ACCC 10" deep Fry pan at WS I really liked the form factor, but discovered is was very similar to the 2-3 quart saucier AC MC2 I already have.

          19 Replies
          1. re: jeffreyem
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            ChowTO RE: jeffreyem Feb 28, 2010 02:49 PM

            Seitan for a frypan the Demeyere 11" pro line without a doubt,it's so over engineered you'll never need to replace it for any reason,you can swing this pan at cars traveling on the 400 and not worry about damage..online $200..+20 for delivery,5% conversion of funds+maybe gst+pst..no more than $260 delivered and you have a pan for life.I bought my pan from Epicure for 3 bills + all taxes on "sale"and still think it's worth every penny.
            They like to deal so ask with an email.

            http://www.epicureshop.ca/

            Free shipping here across the lake.. -http://www.125west.com/default.aspx?
            200+5% exch funds=$210 and if the border decides gst+pst=$237..a no brainer.
            Just noticed the 125west.com site says shipped from Belgium..could be trouble with duties.

            1. re: ChowTO
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              Seitan RE: ChowTO Feb 28, 2010 03:18 PM

              That Epicure link shows the 28cm (11") Demeyere fry pan listed at $400.00 CDN.

              I'm in Calgary, does William Ashley in T.O. have it for less?

              1. re: Seitan
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                ChowTO RE: Seitan Feb 28, 2010 03:47 PM

                The prices they show are always higher online..don't know why...i'll email and get a price,they're having a sale.Ashley i think was the same overprice...skip the 125 west link,they ship from the manufacturer and i don't know what duties would be from belgium,,the best price will be from across the border definitely..there's 0 duties if shipped from the US..but i'm sure the pan from epicure would come in under 300.

                1. re: ChowTO
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                  jeffreyem RE: ChowTO Feb 28, 2010 04:02 PM

                  Metro Kitchen $199 plus free shipping in the US 11" Demeyere just got it a week ago.

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                    ChowTO RE: jeffreyem Feb 28, 2010 04:15 PM

                    I don't remember what i bought from cookware.com but remember the shipping was reasonable. http://www.cookware.com/Demeyere-5562...
                    Cuttleryandmore has the best shipping rates into canada.no demeyere though.14 pound pressure pot costs $20 to ship to my door...

                  2. re: ChowTO
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                    Seitan RE: ChowTO Feb 28, 2010 08:21 PM

                    There is a local retail store here (The Happy Cooker) that can bring it in for $379. + tax. Hoping to find it for less.

                    1. re: Seitan
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                      ChowTO RE: Seitan Mar 1, 2010 06:47 AM

                      They'll order online from the US and make $130..i shopped for an induction portable..found a place and they wanted $560.00+taxes=$640..i came home and clicked online and in 3 days i was cooking inductionly..$299.00US$..total-$340.00 Can$$...i don't mind paying say an extra $60-70 and keep my money in canada but i refuse to be $$ raped.
                      I need a larger pressure pot..store here $500....online $249.00,will come in under 300Can$$ delivered..now why should i pay $500+13%=$565!...what?i owe these businesses a hi end living?

                2. re: ChowTO
                  tzakiel RE: ChowTO Mar 1, 2010 07:17 AM

                  I got the Demeyere 12" proline recently, and love it. Here is the writeup and pics:
                  http://www.jonvandalen.com/lte/2010/0...

                  1. re: tzakiel
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                    ChowTO RE: tzakiel Mar 1, 2010 07:42 AM

                    LOL!!!...Actually the 400 is a highway and them cars travel about 100mph..140kmph for the metrics,but even at 400mph's i'm sure the pan would survive,,my 11" pan seems heavier than the 13"..strange.
                    I didn't know Demeyere made a 12".

                    1. re: ChowTO
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                      Seitan RE: ChowTO Mar 1, 2010 08:12 AM

                      So, is Epicure cheaper than what it's website is saying? Or should I try to bring it in from the US?

                      1. re: Seitan
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                        ChowTO RE: Seitan Mar 1, 2010 10:23 AM

                        Seitan..i emailed Epicure...
                        Why would you "try" to bring it in?...it's simple and legal.some prices from these canadian shops should be illegal.i have the postie knocking at my door with packages all the time.
                        Make sure the # of the pan is 55628,some say Atlantis and some are marked Pro-Line,they both the exact same and click away,check the shipping,if it seems high,wait an hour,click again,the more stuff coming over the border from onliners the cheaper the shipping.You won't pay duties.if your unlucky they'll charge you Alberta tax whatever that is,shipping here is about 20$..yours could be cheaper shipping if coming from around california...click around.
                        Also a tip...USPS..US Postal service is the best.

                        1. re: ChowTO
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                          Seitan RE: ChowTO Mar 1, 2010 06:51 PM

                          What I meant was try scour the internet for US online shops that carry it for less and order from them. So far, no luck finding anything for under $300. US or Canada.

                      2. re: ChowTO
                        tzakiel RE: ChowTO Mar 1, 2010 10:54 AM

                        duly noted

                        1. re: tzakiel
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                          ChowTO RE: tzakiel Mar 1, 2010 11:28 AM

                          tzakiel,what pot rack do you have on your link,,looks really nice,i need a new one,the one i have is getting smaller,,only thing missing to make it really pretty and over the top is a copper Falk 1.5qt try me piece.

                          1. re: ChowTO
                            tzakiel RE: ChowTO Mar 2, 2010 08:18 PM

                            It's actually not big, the one I have... but it's from Crate and Barrel and they have other variations that hang or have 2 sides. I like the quality.

                            Gray wall mounted pot rack
                            http://www.crateandbarrel.com/search....

                            1. re: tzakiel
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                              ChowTO RE: tzakiel Mar 3, 2010 09:05 AM

                              Pretty sure we have a crate and barrel around here somewhere...i meant i need another rack,maybe 2..i'm on the copper site gawking and about to order some more copper cookware,my little saucier is lonely.

                              1. re: tzakiel
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                                Seitan RE: tzakiel Mar 3, 2010 10:41 AM

                                tzakiel, how do you find the handles on the Atlantis pans? Do they seem long-ish to you at all? They seem to stick straight out more than angle up. Just curious. Thanks.

                                1. re: Seitan
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                                  ChowTO RE: Seitan Mar 5, 2010 04:57 PM

                                  If i may..the handles are perfection.they will stay cool even after hours of cooking.perfect size,perfect feel... really..they have made the ultimate frypan,get one before they decide to improve it and muck it all up,,i noticed that my favourite online store just started carrying Demeyere..http://www.cutleryandmore.com/
                                  the line isn't all posted on the site yet but i'm in for another 11" proline..i know they'll improve it one day so i'm making sure i have another of the old unimproved models.

                                  1. re: ChowTO
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                                    ChowTO RE: ChowTO May 18, 2010 02:58 PM

                                    My Falk 1.5 qt saucierre is 3 months old...use her daily,i'm loving it!....when the copper tarnishes it looks a deep red..1 minute with Barkeepers friend and it's brand new again,and will look clean for about a week before it starts tarnishing.i prefer the red tarnished look though,the inside Steel inner is also easy to clean.
                                    I see why the Falk copper is so highly rated.

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                    ProtonVehiCROSS RE: wsw1001 May 19, 2010 05:05 PM

                    Comparison of Demeyere Atlantis vs. Falk Copper (Heat Transfer and Boiling Speed)

                    You buy copper pans for heat transfer speed and the benefits of its resulting responsiveness to changes in heat. You buy other pans like Demeyere because they are easier to care for.

                    Ease of care is important to me, but so is performance. I wanted to find out for sure if the heat transfer differences were very substantial, so I bought a Falk 10.5 quart 11" stock pot and a Demeyere Atlantis 8.5 quart 9" stock pot. (Falk is 2.5mm brushed copper coated with a .008" thick stainless (not tin) lining. They are equivalent to high-end Mauviel or Bourgeat in technical respects, except that they have a brushed finish rather than a mirror polish.)

                    Starting with a room-temperature stove (in both tests) on a 15k BTU gas burner on high-heat, I timed how long it took to bring *equal* amounts of cold water (same temperature) to a rolling boil.

                    The Demeyere took 26 minutes to reach a rolling boil.
                    The Falk took 19.5 minutes to reach a rolling boil.

                    The Falk was extremely responsive to temperature changes. Cutting the heat ceased the boiling within 5-10 seconds.

                    The Demeyere responded to a heat cut in 8-15 seconds or longer. Restoring the heat resulted in similar lags in returning the pots to full boil. Copper was certainly the more nimble and you could see how a responsive it would be for sautéing or cutting the heat in the event the pan got too hot.

                    The only real shortcoming in that particular test was that I was comparing an 11" pan to a 9" pan. The broader surface area of the Falk would certainly cause it to absorb more heat and boil water faster. So I also compared an 11" Falk fry pan and an 11" Demeyere fry pan, boiling approximately 4 cups of cold water on a cold stove in both cases.

                    Again, the Falk won the contest, boiling water approximately 4 minutes faster than the Demeyere fry pan, all things being equal. This size-for-size comparison was as fair as I could make it. If you're looking for cooking responsiveness and rapid boiling, copper's the only game in town.

                    I ended up keeping the Falk pans and returning the Demeyeres to Sur la Table. For me, the ability to sauté on lower heat; boil water faster; or quickly "rescue" food that's getting too hot (by cutting the heat and obtaining a rapid cool-down) outweighed the benefits of being able to throw the pan in the dishwasher.

                    The Demeyeres are wonderful pans - beautiful and easy to care for. If you have an induction stove, I'd go with them because copper would require an ugly (and hot) iron lug to be placed underneath the pan. If you have gas, copper is certainly a more nimble metal when it comes to heat responsiveness. The Falks I bought cleaned nicely with Bar Keeper's Friend.

                    The Demeyere has a brighter silver finish on the inside which I found shows tiny hairline scratches caused by Bar Keeper's Friend (or the green Scotchbrite pad) - whereas the Falk's stainless interior was immune to such scratching.

                    Both brands are heavy, but Falk is heaviest - some people complain about the weight of copper pans but I think it's just whining to complain about a 5-8lb weight of a pan (it's not that heavy once you get used to it).

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                      CharlieTheCook RE: wsw1001 May 20, 2010 01:03 PM

                      I have a visceral dislike of disk-bottomed cookware. The last time I checked, Demeyere is just such an animal. It might be good disk bottomed cookware, but disk-bottomed nevertheless.

                      13 Replies
                      1. re: CharlieTheCook
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                        E_M RE: CharlieTheCook May 21, 2010 06:13 AM

                        Demeyere's straight pots are disk-bottomed. Their saucieres/sauteuses are not.

                        What do you dislike about disk-bottomed cookware?

                        1. re: E_M
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                          CharlieTheCook RE: E_M May 21, 2010 12:00 PM

                          They seem to lack the responsiveness (comparitively speaking) to changes in heat that I believe is crucial for good cookware to have.

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                            ChowTO RE: CharlieTheCook Dec 8, 2010 09:53 AM

                            The Falk is superior in temperature responsiveness..unless you place the demeyere frypan on induction..then they're closer... i WARPED!! my 11"..Demeyere frypan slightly..Iv never abused it, had no problem getting the pan exchanged,was told there was a manufacturing defect,the layers must have seperated...my Falk is still like brand new and i use it everyday for oats.

                            ATTENTION shoppers!!..Cutlery and More has the Demeyere frypans on sale...the 11" is $161.95.

                            1. re: ChowTO
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                              ChowTO RE: ChowTO May 21, 2012 06:26 PM

                              Today i went to the Bay downtown..they are now stocking Demeyere,WMF,Staub,i picked up 2 non stick WMF pans..talked with a salesperson about the Demeyre and she said they had plenty of returns due to warping...got home and yup!..my replaced under warranty Demeyere pan is WARPED!!!!...when cool it's flat,warm it up and it's WARPED!!!!!!

                              1. re: ChowTO
                                kaleokahu RE: ChowTO May 21, 2012 06:35 PM

                                Hi, ChowTO:

                                I would be interested in learning what pan and what line your warped Demeyer is. One of Demeyer's claims, proudly repeated several times in their promotional videos, is that the pans stay dead flat regardless of heat. I'm guessing your pan is an Apollo...

                                Aloha,
                                Kaleo

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                                  ChowTO RE: kaleokahu May 22, 2012 08:25 AM

                                  Aloha kaleokahu,i have the Proline 5 star Atlantis pans...i took another look at the pan and it's perfectly flat..once placed on my ceramic radiant burner and brought up to 70% temperature it starts rocking,at ready cooking temperature it's really warped..taken off and let to cool down it's flat...i remember my first one was warped when cool or hot.

                                  1. re: ChowTO
                                    kaleokahu RE: ChowTO May 22, 2012 01:53 PM

                                    Hi, ChowTO:

                                    Sorry to hear about that. My guess is that there is at least some delamination or unrelieved stress in the pan that is exacerbated by thermal expansion. Was the pan ever subjected to really high heat?

                                    You should exchange it. If they give you any trouble, cue up the video of them bragging about how flat their pans stay.

                                    Aloha.

                                    1. re: kaleokahu
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                                      ChowTO RE: kaleokahu Aug 12, 2012 07:37 AM

                                      Pan was exchanged again without any problems,i'v never subjected the pan to high temperatures..or tossed in cold water after cooking...when i showed up with my warped pan they were out of the11" so i have another 13"no extra charge...i checked a 11" pan that was used by a restaurant for many months and on display on the showroom floor..-WARPED!..hmmmm.Think i'm going with Falk copper from now on,they have a 13" frypan that looks amazing and my bet it's not going to warp,i'll give these 2 i have some time and if they warp i'm trashing them.
                                      Aloha.

                                      1. re: ChowTO
                                        kaleokahu RE: ChowTO Aug 12, 2012 11:15 AM

                                        Hi, ChowTO:

                                        Sorry again... And I'm disappointed that a Demeyere pan would do that. THey have much credibility--and therefore more to lose than most manufacturers. There really *is* a video they put out extolling how flat their lines stay.

                                        I would take a more aggressive approach with the seller if the 2nd replacement also warps--demand your money back. This sounds like a classic Lemon Law situation. Yes, they've tried replacing it, maybe even being nice about it, but the only way to truly make it right would be a refund (which you can apply to the Falk you want).

                                        Aloha,
                                        Kaleo

                                2. re: ChowTO
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                                  Seitan RE: ChowTO Mar 2, 2013 11:01 AM

                                  I've never seen or heard of The Bay selling Demeyere cookware. What Bay is this?

                                3. re: ChowTO
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                                  iyc_nyc RE: ChowTO Nov 11, 2012 09:36 AM

                                  ChowTO, I'm not sure if you're still active on this site, but if so -- can you report back on warping with your remaining/replacement Demeyere Proline frypans? What are your current thoughts on them in general? I know you initially had a great experience with them, until they warped.

                                  If other CHers have experience on this, I'd appreciate your thoughts too.

                                  Many thanks!

                                  1. re: iyc_nyc
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                                    wabi RE: iyc_nyc Nov 11, 2012 10:48 AM

                                    I recently bought several Falk pieces and have to say that I could not be any more happier with them. I didnt buy frying pans however..I went with sauce pans and saute pans. I love the frying pan work to either cast iron or to DeBuyer frying pans which I absolutely love.

                                    The sauce pans and saute pans however are very solidly built...and will truly last a lifetime.

                                    1. re: iyc_nyc
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                                      ChowTO RE: iyc_nyc Dec 10, 2012 07:39 AM

                                      Hello lyc_nyc!!..I'm still lurking once in awhile...so far the replacement has been OK..i use about 3x a week and the pan is still flat,i have 2 -13"ers now,but i'm going Falk from now on...especially that these Demeyeres have went wayyy up in price.

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                              ellabee RE: wsw1001 Nov 11, 2012 04:57 PM

                              I wouldn't worry much about maintenance on Falk pieces. More than a year ago, I bought a small Falk saucier (the 'try-me' piece), and shortly thereafter got an excellent ebay deal on a Mauviel skillet (2mm copper, lined w/stainless). They've both been in constant use since.

                              What's astonishing to me is how the brushed surface of the copper on the Falk piece has resisted tarnishing. The skillet and saucier are both stored in the open, hanging on wall hooks. The skillet might be in use marginally more often, but not by a lot. I cook on gas; when I wash pots and pans, I put most of the effort into the inside of the pot, only scrubbing the outside if there have been spills or spatters. The Falk doesn't appear to have tarnished much at all, with only a bit of darkness on the base. The mirror-finish Mauviel is rounding into its third cycle of darkening, then turning brassy-colored. I've polished it twice, and plan just to let it go to see if it stabilizes on the silvery-brass look, or continues to change.

                              I love the dull glow of the Falk brushed copper, and if they still made a two-handled version of the 11" x 3" saute pan, I'd be seriously craving one. I've gotten used to their rather odd-looking stainless steel interior, and am impressed at how unmarked it appears after all the whisking that's happened inside it.

                              1 Reply
                              1. re: ellabee
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                                ChowTO RE: ellabee Dec 10, 2012 07:46 AM

                                YUP!!!!..and if you decide to detarnish a bit o bar keepers friend makes these awesome copper vessels look like knew!.there's also a copper version of barkeepers friend that doesn't quite work as the origiginal version"you need more elbow grease" but the copper will stay untarnished much longer with the copper BKF version..took me awhile to fully realise but these coppers are no brainer purchases.
                                seriously a no brainer...i never check my Falks for warpage!!!!

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                                laraffinee RE: wsw1001 Dec 11, 2012 06:25 AM

                                Hmmm...that Demeyere warp issue is pretty weird. I have the Demeyere Proline pans in the 9 1/4" and 11" and have been working them hard and absolutely Love them! I just ordered the Atlantis Sauté pan in the 4 1/2qt size because I am SO happy with the line. I cook with gas and these pans don't need to go with more than a medium flame to cook well. If I want to make something with a really high flame, i use my de Buyer carbon steel pans, which could probably take a blasting blow torch and still be fine. I have been very happy with my specific cookware - tin line copper sauciers, high heat carbon steel, Demeyere for mid range flame sautés and my Staub for oven roasting, etc. I have seen a bit of Demeyere bashing on these boards, but I have been really happy with the line.

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