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Demeyere Atlantis stuff looks great

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mmdad Sep 25, 2009 02:20 AM

I already have a nice collection of allclad but I am currently addicted to my new hobby of collecting life lasting cookware. I can't do cast iron(I cant have iron in my diet) so I am thinking about adding the http://www.surlatable.com/gs/demeyere... to my kitchen.

I see that set and its essentially the exact pieces and sizes I use daily. Its a perfect set.

I love my allclads. allclad is 20 minutes away from me and I love made in usa products.

But, for fun when funds allow I wouldn't mind picking up some demeyere, just because I love cooking.

Its probably ostentacious of me, but I love to cook and love cookware.

Has anyone bought this set? Is the demeyere stuff worth the money, they do seem a bit overpriced. Its definitely double what I would pay for comparable allclad.

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  1. Soop RE: mmdad Sep 25, 2009 02:32 AM

    I just thought of something; does no iron include stainless steel?
    And also, if you're collecting the best, have you considered copper?

    1. Politeness RE: mmdad Sep 25, 2009 02:53 AM

      mmdad, Demeyere Atlantis definitely is two steps up from All Clad. The Atlantis line (like the Sirocco line) has a substantial copper disk in the base of its non-sauteuse (that is, its vertical-sided) pots. Even if all else were equal, copper diffuses heat better than aluminum, but the layer of aluminum in non-disk All Clad construction is thinner than the Atlantis's copper layer (thickness is directly correlated with conduction efficiency). As frosting on the cake, the Atlantis also sandwiches the copper in even better-conducting silver (albeit a very thin layer of silver). The Atlantis conical sauteuse is of an aluminum sandwich construction, but there, too, the aluminum thickness between the stainless layers is thicker than the aluminum layer in the All Clad lines.

      1. n
        Normandie RE: mmdad Sep 25, 2009 07:55 AM

        I don't have a set, mmdad, but I do have the Atlantis in a covered saute pan and the covered casserole (5 quart, I think).

        The stuff is fabulous! FABULOUS. Great heat conductor, great for deglazing, handles stay cool as long as they're not right over the flame, goes in the oven, goes in the dishwasher, easy to clean, food browns beautifully but doesn't stick. The only "con" I see to it is the price tag, which is high as you noted, but, honestly, to me...worth every single penny. I'm not a big AllClad fan, so take this for what it's worth, since you're happy with your AC, but, to me, the Demeyere Atlantis is head and shoulders above AC. (More comfortable handle design for me, too, but that's very personal to every hand.)

        The Silvinox lining in the Atlantis is great. I think a couple of Demeyere's other lines feature that, too--probably Apollo for sure, but that's not much less expensive (I don't think)... Go check out Demeyere's site to see if some of the less expensive lines feature it.

        It certainly is an investment, but really wonderful stuff to cook with, IMO.

        1. cityhopper RE: mmdad Sep 25, 2009 09:06 AM

          WOW, it is R E A L L Y nice.

          I love that the Demeyere line does not have the rivets. No where near my price range but I envy those who can add these pieces to their cookware collection. :-D

          5 Replies
          1. re: cityhopper
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            Normandie RE: cityhopper Sep 25, 2009 10:18 AM

            I don't really see it go on sale, cityhopper, but a friend of mine was able to obtain a display sample of one pan at half-off. Then it becomes more affordable. Nothing wrong with the pan she got, just "used" in the salesroom. So if anyone's interested and has access IRL or online to places who do that, it might be worth a shot.

            And of course you just don't know, in this economy. Seems to me like just about everybody is putting everything on sale...

            1. re: Normandie
              cityhopper RE: Normandie Sep 26, 2009 11:22 AM

              What an awesome deal your friend received on the display unit. I would snatch one up in a heartbeat too if I can across a similar offer.

              In the meantime, I'll probably visit Sur La Table to get a good feel of the pan (and lust over it to myself LOL).

              1. re: cityhopper
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                Normandie RE: cityhopper Sep 26, 2009 04:29 PM

                Yes, I'd do that, too, if I came across a sample.

                The thing is, though, I can't really think of another Demeyere I need. I try to find reasons to need them, ha, but it's hard to justify getting a pan "just for fun" at that price. I am looking to replace my sauce pans, but even I can't rationalize paying their prices for something that I basically only simmer veggies in. I do a sauce in a saucepan or saucier or a pastry cream maybe twice a year. Hmmm...maybe I should commit to baking more cream-filled goodies so I can get my Demeyere. :-)

                I'll tell you what, though, city. Check the pan out at SLT, but don't buy it there. Well, that is if you agree with me that SLT's prices tend to be high anyway? A good source online might be The Knife Merchant. He carries Demeyere. So I'd go see it in person then comparison shop online.

                1. re: Normandie
                  mnosyne RE: Normandie Sep 26, 2009 06:49 PM

                  Last year, I was looking to buy a 3.2 qt Demeyere Scirocco saucepan, and I found a really good sale (I thought) at Sur La Table. It turned out that they were selling the pan without the lid. Purchasing a lid AND the sale price pan would have come to more than buying the 2 pieces new on Amazon, which I did. Sometimes a bargain is not a bargain.

                  1. re: mnosyne
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                    Normandie RE: mnosyne Sep 27, 2009 11:32 PM

                    Exactly, mnosyne. Just my personal experience, but whenever I comparison shop online for something, SLT never seems to have the best price (at all). But I don't know SLT that well, and it could just happen to be the particular things I've shopped for.

                    But, additionally, Demeyere--especially the Atlantis line--seems to be one of those names that vendors don't relax the prices on. You really have to keep your eyes open to find a special deal on Atlantis. (I have seen some good sales on their mid- to lowest-end collections, though, and although some of them are not multiply, but instead have disk bottoms, I still have the feeling they're better quality than a lot of cookware. This company seems to know what it's doing.)

          2. l
            Leper RE: mmdad Sep 25, 2009 04:21 PM

            MMDAD, City Kitchens in Seattle is having a serious sale on Demeyere Atlantis until October 1st. (They will ship.) www.citykitchenseattle.com

            2 Replies
            1. re: Leper
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              mmdad RE: Leper Sep 25, 2009 08:10 PM

              Thanks everyone. I am not sure I totally agree that they are better than the allclad from my experience but they are certainly nice. I love my allclad handles- its a common complaint but they seem to work perfect for me. The demeyere 4 piece set is just the perfect sizes and they look great so that is what I want to get. I do not have the finances at the moment but as soon as I do I am getting the 4 piece set. I would love to hear more from those who have these pans so keep talking if you can.

              Thanks everyone

              1. re: Leper
                cityhopper RE: Leper Sep 26, 2009 11:15 AM

                Correction on the link you posted:

                http://citykitchensseattle.com/

              2. r
                RGC1982 RE: mmdad Sep 26, 2009 07:37 PM

                Demeyere Atlantis is better cookware than most All Clad. Handles are riveted, and the pots are either clad or disk bottomed, depending upon use intended. When you buy All Clad, you are committing to "all clad all the time" in terms of construction, as well as uncomfortable handles and rivets.

                That said, I am not a fan or Sirocco, which has very uncomfortable "stylish" handles, so I would recommend sticking with the Atlantis, which is a fabulous, easy to clean and high performing line, or the lower cost Apollo (good for some pieces, Atlantis has better designed disk bottoms).

                As for the OP who asked about iron in stainless steel: Yes, iron is used to make steel, but in stainless steel cookware it is in alloy form and is non-reactive. Cast iron is reactive. Yes, some high quality copper is also the same price as Demeyere Atlantis, but it is harder to maintain.

                I am sure that the All Clad nation will likely write some kind of nasty response, but please keep in mind that I too have some All Clad and have been able to compare them side by side. All Clad is very good cookware, but there are better things out there.

                19 Replies
                1. re: RGC1982
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                  Normandie RE: RGC1982 Sep 27, 2009 11:35 PM

                  People should also keep in mind that some Demeyere lines have metal lids, while some have glass lids. Since there are fans of each lid type, it's definitely something people need to double-check about any particular Demeyere collection they may be interested in.

                  1. re: Normandie
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                    E_M RE: Normandie Sep 28, 2009 05:49 AM

                    All of the lids are interchangable among the different product lines (so the people at SLT say, and it also appears that way from reading the company brochures) so one can order them separately and mix-n-match..

                    1. re: E_M
                      cityhopper RE: E_M Sep 28, 2009 06:23 AM

                      Just wanted to say thanks to both of your previous posts. I actually took some time to view the website, it appears the Atlantis line is considered their 5-star cookware and Apollo is their 4-star cookware. Both are recommended for professional use. Considering that, looking at Apollo pieces and saving a few extra dollars may be worth it as I assume the quality and the uses in a home kitchen would suffice.

                      1. re: cityhopper
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                        Normandie RE: cityhopper Sep 28, 2009 07:06 AM

                        YW, city. I don't have the Apollo, simply because I preferred the Atlantis styling, but I have seen some of the Apollo pieces in person and, JMO, but based on that and my satisfaction with Atlantis, I wouldn't hesitate at all to buy Apollo or even from the less expensive collections.

                        Does the website say anything about its warrantee policy, btw?

                        Oh! MetroKitchen is having a sale on Demeyere. I haven't compared their sale prices to full price, though.

                        http://www.metrokitchen.com/category/...

                        And the Knife Merchant offers free shipping on orders above $50, which isn't insignificant, because it's not lightweight stuff. www.knifemerchant.com

                        1. re: Normandie
                          cityhopper RE: Normandie Sep 28, 2009 10:47 AM

                          30 year warranty (10 year for professional use).

                          Products with non stick coating: 5 years guarantee (not for professional use).

                          http://www.demeyere.be/Default.asp?CI...

                        2. re: cityhopper
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                          FoodFool RE: cityhopper Jan 3, 2010 08:30 AM

                          I have had the Apollo for 4 years (a 5-pc set came with our induction top), and have to say it is an absolute PLEASURE to use. I am older, and the sheer weight of the All-Clad and the Costco Signature (good value) is just too hard for me. I LOVE the Demeyere Apollo. BTW, in addition to their high-end and Apollo lines, they have a "Resto" line which you can find at some restaurant supply houses, at good prices. Resto is especially good for those larger pieces, like stockpots and big braisers. I have some random pieces, one of which, a large braiser I found at TJ Maxx, is one of my favorite pots. I think it is a Sitram--is the exact diameter of the largest burner and has a glass lid. Very useful. I guess my points are: (1) Demeyere cookware for induction is absolutely wonderful (imho), and (2) Think about whether you really need the HEAVY cookware. Demeyere makes cookware specifically for induction and in my opinion, they make the best (though expensive). For pieces you don't use every day, look around for those random ones at discount stores like TJX or Marshall's.

                        3. re: E_M
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                          Normandie RE: E_M Sep 28, 2009 06:58 AM

                          This is to E_M: That's useful to know, re the interchangeability. That's certainly one way to cut the cost at least a little bit--for exampel, if you have two different shape but same size vessels you wouldn't use at once, you could get one lid. I did that with two pots from another manufacturer (can't remember which right now, but it was a savings).

                        4. re: Normandie
                          r
                          RGC1982 RE: Normandie Sep 28, 2009 06:35 PM

                          Good point. I avoid glass lids like the plague. I absolutely hate them, so my pieces all have stainless steel lids. Some retailers will let you buy your lids separately, and you can then choose your preference. 125West, the retailer I have purchased from several times, bundles the stainless steel lids with the pots. I don't recall specifically, but I do seem to have some notion of seeing or reading about some glass lid options.

                          The stainless steel lids for Demeyere all appear to be well made and interchangeable; I just don't like the feel of the funky Sirocco handles.

                          1. re: RGC1982
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                            Normandie RE: RGC1982 Sep 28, 2009 09:16 PM

                            I dislike glass lids intensely, too, RGC. I just don't know why I do. :-) It makes sense to me when others say they *like* them, because it allows them to monitor the cooking, etc., but to me for some reason they seem too bulky, need more attention storing, etc.

                            I really like the Demeyere metal lids because they're the flatter type, easier to store, etc., and fit very well to make the seal. I often use them with my other, non-Demeyere SS cookware, too.

                            1. re: Normandie
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                              mmdad RE: Normandie Sep 28, 2009 09:27 PM

                              You know these demeyere are super nice but I got to check some more out today and I can't help but think that the allclads that I own are much more sturdy and more durable feeling. I like the idea of no rivets but honestly it doesn't inspire confidence. I plan on getting some demeyere at some point but I can see why so many dig the allclad stuff.

                              1. re: mmdad
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                                Normandie RE: mmdad Sep 28, 2009 11:06 PM

                                Well, again, it always comes down to what each of us feels comfortable with and our priorities.

                                I understand why you mean by sturdy if you're referring to the solidity of the AC. I know the bottom of the Demeyere pans seems thinner, for example. But for whatever reasons, mine have been durable. I have used the Demeyere saute *a lot*, especially.

                                And you certainly have a lot of company on the rivet issue, mmdad. That seems to be one of things cooks feel strongly about, one way or the other. The one thing I've noticed is that the rivets of some of my pans get etched in the dishwasher. I don't care so much, looks wise, but I wonder if that will weaken them (over years' use). So I think that's why I like the Demeyere welding. But notice Soop's post above re D's 30-year-guarantee. AC's warranty is lifelong, isn't it? I wonder if the handles are why?

                                1. re: Normandie
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                                  mmdad RE: Normandie Sep 29, 2009 12:20 AM

                                  Yeah the demeyere seem rather thin and even though they are 7 ply when you give them the knuckle rap that just don't ring like an all clad. they are beautiful but I think I may only want 1 or 2 speciality pieces in my kitchen. I actually like the rivets. I understand the pain a toothbrush cleaning every once in a while means but I think its durable. I have no clue if demeyere's welds will ever be a problem but I do feel that allclad rivets will not be a problem ever and like you said they both have great warranties. I like them both but may prefer allclad for everyday use.

                                  1. re: mmdad
                                    Politeness RE: mmdad Sep 29, 2009 07:58 PM

                                    mmdsd: "...the demeyere seem rather thin and even though they are 7 ply when you give them the knuckle rap that just don't ring like an all clad."

                                    You are comparing apples and oranges. The seven-ply Demeyere pieces are saucepans and stockpots, and they have seven plies in the base only, and for a very good reason. (Most of the heat that is conducted up the side of a vertical-sided pot goes to heating the room, not the contents of the pot, and it is energy that is drawn away from heating the pot at its base, where it can do some good.) All-Clad, more concerned with marketing than function, either does not understand the reasons, or chooses to ignore them. For the curved-side sauciers, the Demeyere pieces are five ply all the way up the sides, and they are thicker than the relatively anemic All Clad gauges, because a thin aluminum "filling" between the stainless outer layers really is not all that efficient to conduct heat.

                                    Incidentally, except for the handles, the five-ply Demeyere Atlantis pieces are the same as the less expensive five-ply Demeyere Apollo pieces, so, unless you are showing the handles off to your guests, you can save some money by getting the five-ply pieces from the Apollo line, leaving more money to spend on the seven-ply Atlantis pieces, which are different from (and better than) the Apollo equivalents.

                                    1. re: Politeness
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                                      E_M RE: Politeness Sep 29, 2009 08:07 PM

                                      So the Atlantis with its disk bottom is better for flat bottomed pots, where the cooking is done from the bottom up, as opposed to a wok, where the food is supposed to be cooking on most of the interior surface?

                                2. re: mmdad
                                  danwalk RE: mmdad Sep 29, 2009 04:02 AM

                                  A bit of a dissenting view here. While Demeyere is indeed the cream of the crop when it comes to SS cookware, I would question your need to buy any of it if you already have a complete set of All-Clad pots and pans. Why not take a serious look at what you have and look to fill gaps instead of duplicating what you own with a needless set?

                                  Do you own an enameled cast iron Dutch oven, for example? (I know you can't ingest iron but as you have been told in another thread, you would be ok with this.)

                                  Also, in terms of rivets and cookware, I was in your camp before purchasing a Sitram Catering saucepan with a welded handle. I can assure you that there is absolutely no way I can see it fail. It is a dream to clean an interior sans rivets.

                                  Last but not least, I wonder why you are excluding high end copper cookware from your search. If you are considering just a few pieces to supplement your collection, you really should investigate 2.5mm stainless steel lined copper vessels. Some of the best are manufactured by Falk Culinair:

                                  http://www.copperpans.com/

                                  Best vessels that take advantage of copper's characteristics: sauciere's (including the 1.5 qt. "Try Me" piece) and fry pans.

                                  1. re: danwalk
                                    m
                                    mmdad RE: danwalk Sep 29, 2009 09:46 AM

                                    Dan thanks for the reply.

                                    As for cast iron. I love the stuff but I think I am more interested now in pottery like emile henry. I can use the stuff and I like the flametop collection so I am looking at one of those.

                                    As for demeyere. They are fantastic and the welds may just be fine.

                                    But as you said I have allclad and I feel confident in them and their rivets.

                                    I like cookware right now as a hobby. I have no needs really for anymore its just fun. I plan to get a demeyere or two. But no longer really feel urgency.

                                    As for copper, well I just cant be bothered. I know the benefits but I honestly don't feel like worrying about the cleaning and polishing and such. I know some people just let them patina but to me I would be driven crazy by them.

                                    SS is simple and the allclad makes me happy. So I am good.

                                    The only desire is a few demeyere in the future.

                                    1. re: danwalk
                                      cityhopper RE: danwalk Sep 29, 2009 02:55 PM

                                      Thanks for mentioning the info on Sitram cookware.

                                      While I have no complaints about the performance of my current SS cookware, I complete loathe the rivets. I am not looking replace anything but look to add certain specialty pieces that I do not have from the Sitram and Demeyere cookware lines.

                                    2. re: mmdad
                                      r
                                      RGC1982 RE: mmdad Sep 29, 2009 02:10 PM

                                      I don't think that the Demeyere disk bottoms are thinner than AC, I believe they are thicker. However, the dear marketing folks at AC don't publish these specs (if they are published, please tell me where to read them) and so you are left guessing.

                                      Truthfully, my biggest complaints about AC are that 1) Clad is not the best choice in every situation; but it is fine for many situations; 2) I, unlike you, hate to clean rivets. Plus, I have experienced rivets loosening, not on AC but on other lines, so the confidence you have in rivets is just not there for me; 3) AC handles are less comfortable that Demeyere Atlantis handles. I am not alone in this assessment, and there are several previous threads on these boards with posts from others complaining about the same thing.

                                      This is not to say bad things about AC, but it is meant to explain why I prefer Atlantis. It is possible for a weld to fail too, but I have never experienced it personally, so to each his own. As I said, I have some AC too, and it is great stuff, but this is just my preference.

                                      My final word on copper -- Love the stuff, especially Falk, but you have to be willing to care for it. Good choice to stick with SS if you are not that into cleaning it by hand.

                                      1. re: mmdad
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                                        FoodFool RE: mmdad Jan 3, 2010 08:38 AM

                                        Interesting--just goes to show that different people have different priorities. I think the Demeyere cookware is likely to hold up quite well--it is optimized for cooking on induction, and they build them to last. There is no way these pots are going to warp. As for being "sturdy," I guess for some people that means they have to have a lot of weight. Not in my case. This is high-quality and worth the money. I gave my All-Clad and the Costco Signature set I tried to my kids. They have gas stoves and it works great on them. Just a word from an old lady who still cooks a lot--you don't need to lift 10 pounds of pot to cook 10 pounds of food. Do the math, and remember nobody gets any younger ;-). There will come a time when you will appreciate exemplary quality that doesn't have to weigh a ton, unless you are a weight-lifter anyway and want to work out when you cook. Just my 2c.

                              2. cityhopper RE: mmdad Oct 17, 2009 03:18 PM

                                So I (stumbled) into SLT and saw the Demeyere pans (in person) for the first time and I fell in love. The feel of them--perfect. No rivets--smooth interior on cooking surface. Only if they let me borrow one for a few days would this have completed my dream. I'll keep my eye on the market and if it takes one piece at a time, I will have a few in my ultimate cookware collection.

                                :D

                                2 Replies
                                1. re: cityhopper
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                                  islandkim RE: cityhopper Oct 17, 2009 06:48 PM

                                  Zabar's in NYC is another place that carries Demeyer. Check online for some of the pieces they carry or if you're in NY, go to the housewares dept. on the second floor--they have a big selection and decent prices.

                                  1. re: cityhopper
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                                    FoodFool RE: cityhopper Jan 3, 2010 08:42 AM

                                    I haven't found SLT to ever be the best-price source of anything. And, unless your love is for the higher-end lines of Demeyere SLT carries, shop around and look at the Apollo and Resto lines.

                                    Regards, from someone who fell in love with Apollo (the cookware, not the God)

                                  2. pikawicca RE: mmdad Oct 17, 2009 06:55 PM

                                    I have several of the cheapest Demeyere ("Resto" line) pots and love the hell out of them. Even cooking, absence of annoying rivets, what's not to love?

                                    1. m
                                      matt71 RE: mmdad Dec 7, 2009 09:51 AM

                                      I have had Demeyere cookware for around 10 years. I've been cooking for over 60 years on and in every sort of heat source, wood-fired, kerosene, gas including professional hotel range, coil electric, glass top electric, induction, and camp fire. I've used plain aluminum (no longer), stainless lined aluminum (all clad) tin-lined copper, stainless-steel lined copper, copper core (all clad), copper clad (all clad), plain cast iron, enameled cast iron (Le Creuset), scan pan, circulon, original calphalon, aluminum core stainless (all clad, mauviel, demeyere), calphalon non-stick, non-stick aluminum restaurant wear, pretty much any material you can name.

                                      Demeyere is absolutely the best. No question.

                                      I don't have Atlantis, but I have Sirocco - same construction, different design and finish - and I also have Apollo - less expensive, less elegant, but superb. I venture to say the most used piece in all the cookware I own is the Apollo 9.25" skillet - surely 6 days out of 7. Next comes the Apollo MaxiGrill - use it for baking, broiling, grilling, griddling, keeping things warm. No matter what, get yourself this piece. After using it once, I got a second one. The Sirocco saute pan is incredible - remember to use lower heat than any other cookware, it's super efficient. Really, don't get anything but Demeyere.

                                      2 Replies
                                      1. re: matt71
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                                        citizenconn RE: matt71 Dec 10, 2009 02:25 PM

                                        I had several Demeyere Atlantis pieces which I ended up selling and keeping my All Clad MC2 instead. I did like the Demeyere fry pans which do not have the thick disk on the bottom. But, the saute pans and sauce pans were just too heavy in the long run because of the thick discs on the bottom to be very functional for me. I prefer the uniform thickness up the sides of the All Clad MC2 line.

                                        1. re: matt71
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                                          Skiploading RE: matt71 Jan 26, 2010 02:25 PM

                                          I wonder if you can tell me about the differences between the silvinox finish on the Apollo and the Brinox finish on the Sirocco. In a fit of madness, I bought some Sirocco on EBay, and now regret that I did not get Atlantis (with the same finish as the Apollo.) I want to start using the pans but have hesitated. Is there really a lot of difference in the cleanup? Can you say anything to make me feel less bad about this purchase? I know the heat distribution is the same. Thanks

                                        2. a
                                          Aussiesurfer RE: mmdad Jan 23, 2010 03:33 PM

                                          I tried using a le crusinet wok on a new Miele induction plate. It will not heat enough to cook anything. Could someone please confirm that Demymere wok will not exhibit the same problem.

                                          6 Replies
                                          1. re: Aussiesurfer
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                                            snax RE: Aussiesurfer Mar 12, 2010 07:11 PM

                                            I'd be interested to find out if the Demeyere wok worked well on an induction cooktop too.

                                            1. re: snax
                                              pikawicca RE: snax Mar 14, 2010 02:38 PM

                                              Works great; that's why I bought it in the first place.

                                              1. re: pikawicca
                                                s
                                                snax RE: pikawicca Mar 14, 2010 04:13 PM

                                                Ohh pray tell, so you are one of those people who choose not to use a carbon steel wok. Do you use the wok on a super high heat? It shows in a youtube video that a medium high heat is sufficent when using the wok.
                                                Also which design did you choose? flat base, round base, round base with 3 little legs, ControlInduct.

                                                I've been using my Demeyere saute pan, and while I don't find food sticks, I do miss the rounded shape, and the fact that the bottom is hot and the sides are a little cooler.

                                                1. re: snax
                                                  pikawicca RE: snax Mar 14, 2010 05:30 PM

                                                  Wok? Where did this come from?

                                                  1. re: pikawicca
                                                    Politeness RE: pikawicca Mar 14, 2010 06:03 PM

                                                    pikawicca: "Where did this come from?"

                                                    http://www.kitchenclique.com/52932.html

                                                    1. re: Politeness
                                                      pikawicca RE: Politeness Mar 14, 2010 06:15 PM

                                                      Wow, that's a beautiful piece of cookware, but $245 for a wok seems very wrong to me. People who cook with woks 3 meals a day could feed their entire family for a year on $245. Sorry, this is just the way I'm feeling at the moment.

                                          2. tzakiel RE: mmdad Feb 17, 2010 05:31 AM

                                            I love the Atlantis cookware. After much research online I decided to start investing in it.

                                            I did a long write up and photos here:
                                            http://www.jonvandalen.com/lte/?p=1236

                                            6 Replies
                                            1. re: tzakiel
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                                              Seitan RE: tzakiel Mar 14, 2010 06:20 PM

                                              So is there any difference between the Atlantis and the Apollo? Is it just the handle design?

                                              1. re: Seitan
                                                Politeness RE: Seitan Mar 14, 2010 07:05 PM

                                                Seitan: "So is there any difference between the Atlantis and the Apollo?"

                                                Big differences in the disk-bottom pieces; just handles in the 5-ply pieces.

                                                1. re: Politeness
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                                                  Seitan RE: Politeness Mar 15, 2010 11:45 AM

                                                  In the disk-bottoms, what are the differences?

                                                  Also, I notice they have the pasta insert for both Atlantis and Apollo which look identical, except they are different prices.

                                                  1. re: Seitan
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                                                    Seitan RE: Seitan Mar 30, 2010 10:14 PM

                                                    Ok, curiosity got the better of me, and I ordered the Atlantis 3 qt. sauce pan which has been on sale. There's no kitchen store in my city that sells Demeyere, so I had to order it online.

                                                    First Impressions: The outside is rather plain jane. The stainless looks almost like aluminum. It's not brushed stainless, not satin, not polished mirror chrome, and there's no copper ring around the bottom or anything to give it a distinctive look. It doesn't look ugly, just plain.

                                                    The handle is nice, not too round, not too flat. It has a big wide fork where it's attached to the pan, helping keep it cool. The handle slopes up from the pan then straight out, unlike a stick handle which is straight out at an angle. The unit I received, however, has one side of the fork of the handle welded to the pan a little lower than the other, making the handle tilt slightly to one side. The handle has a bigger loop than most handles I've seen for hanging on a big hook if need be.

                                                    When picking up and handling the pot, it definitely feels bottom-heavy. This is due to the 7 layer bottom piece. Holding it in my hand, gravity pulls it down and away from me. Not as heavy as cast iron, but very solid. I would have to get used to the bottom-heavy feel, which can seem a little unbalanced compared to most pots.

                                                    The sides are suprisingly thin. My Cuisinart multiclad pan sidewalls are definitely thicker. I wonder how they'll perform in terms of heat retention.

                                                    The inside where the sidewalls meet the bottom disk is a sharper 90 degree angle compared to most pots I've seen. Speaking of the insides, the finish really looks aluminumy, if that's a word. It reminds me of aluminum pots I've seen in restaurant supply stores. The finish has grinding or polishing streaks in it, even though it feels perfectly smooth. It tricks your eye into thinking those streaks have texture. It looks kind of like the back side of an aluminum hub cap. It is stainless steel though, as I read somewhere, all traces of iron (I think) are removed from it in a chemical catalytic process.

                                                    The lid has a slight dome shape to it. The top of the lid handle is wider than most lid handles and is close to the all-clad D5 lid handle in size, but smaller. The lid fits about the same as other lids I've experienced. The product sales pitch is that they are 'tight fitting', but I wouldn't call them that. They are of avaerage fitness. Same as my Cuisinart pots. It would be even better if the lids were a bit more dome shaped, but that's probably nit-picking.

                                                    The handles have no rivets, either on the pan or on the lid. So no need to clean around them. That is a nice feature.

                                                    The pouring lip on the Demeyere Atlantis sauce pan is rather flat and the edge is almost sharp. This in contrast to the new D5 All-clad which has a more rounded flare to the lip. I tried to create some drips down the side of the pan by pouring water out in in a jerking motion. The flat, sharp pouring edge seemed to work as no drips came down the side. However, there were a few drips directly under the lip. My Cuisinart, with its more rounded lip did not have any drips underneath the lip.

                                                    I then tested the pot against my Cuisinart Multiclad in a heat-up showdown. I boiled 1500 ml of cold tap water in both the Demeyere and Cuisnart Multiclad of the same size, using the same burner on my stove, and timed it from a cold element turned up to medium high. The Cuisinart 3 qt sauce pan took almost exactly 10 minutes from a cold start to a rolling boil. The Demeyere Atlantis 3 qt pot took almost exactly 8 minutes. There is definitely some awesome heat transfer happening in the Demeyere. Even accounting for slight inconsistencies in my test method, I think I'd be safe in saying the Atlantis pots heat up faster than my clad pots.

                                                    I noticed the sidewalls got almost as hot as my Cuisinart clad pots. I was expecting a more noticable difference. I could tap the sides of my Cuisinart pot containing a rolling boil of water with my finger for a split second before pulling it away. Same with the Atlantis, but only a split second longer (not scientific I know). With my Le Crueset pots I can literally hold my fingers on the outside of the pot for a good dozen seconds while it is boiling away with water. Now that is heat rentention. My Cuisinart Multiclad pots seem more like radiator pots in comparison. I'd hate to try to touch an All-Clad Copper core pot at full boil.

                                                    One more thing about the finish. It looks like it would show wear and scuff marks more conspicuously than other stainles steel. After just moving it around my stove a little, I've already noticed some small scratches on the outside bottom that don't come off with Bar Keeper. The finish does seem oddly more soft, yet more stick resistant, but also more prone to wear marks. But this is only a preliminary judgement.

                                                    I plan to do a few more tests, but I will stop writing my review here for now.

                                                    1. re: Seitan
                                                      c
                                                      ChowTO RE: Seitan Apr 5, 2010 08:50 AM

                                                      I'm going with the Fissler Solea line for my pots when they're available..i don't see anything special with the Demeyere pots,actually they look and feel cheap to me.

                                                  2. re: Politeness
                                                    r
                                                    riverwalk RE: Politeness Apr 27, 2010 09:18 PM

                                                    There are some detailed differences between Atlantis and Apollo, for starters you can review the chart at http://www.demeyere.be/default.asp?CI..., and while there, you can click on the various topics such as Technologies. For more in depth details about how each type piece is made differently for it's own use, click on Catalogue and Information then Download Information. You have to scroll to the English translation, but it is worth the information. I reviewed all these things in making a decision for my own cookware, and was amazed that one never hears all their design features in common discussions. Every pan is designed for it's own particular use and type of utensils, for instance some have the triply or 7 layers all the way up the sides, while some types of pans do not, depending on what that pan will be used for in terms of recipes, and how it can be tailored for the best result. They are also the very first manufacturer to make pans for induction, and with Apollo's controlinduc, the pan will not overheat ever on induction. It stops receiving heat at once when a certain temp is reached. No two types of pots or pans are made the same, they are custom tailored in design for the recipes and cooking type of the individual vessel. Saute pans are not going to be the same as a fry pan, etc. It's really brilliant technology and artistry combined. I read up on it all when deciding, I don't sell pans or anything. I also called Sur LaTable and asked which were returned least, and it was hands down Demeyere, never returned for warping, which All Clad definitely is commonly. Demeyere also makes Viking by the way. I love my Demeyere. I would love to get more.

                                              2. p
                                                ProtonVehiCROSS RE: mmdad May 19, 2010 05:11 PM

                                                Comparison of Demeyere Atlantis vs. Falk Copper (Heat Transfer and Boiling Speed)

                                                You buy copper pans for heat transfer speed and the benefits of its resulting responsiveness to changes in heat. You buy other pans like Demeyere because they are easier to care for.

                                                Ease of care is important to me, but so is performance. I wanted to find out for sure if the heat transfer differences were very substantial, so I bought a Falk 10.5 quart 11" stock pot and a Demeyere Atlantis 8.5 quart 9" stock pot. (Falk is 2.5mm brushed copper coated with a .008" thick stainless (not tin) lining. They are equivalent to high-end Mauviel or Bourgeat in technical respects, except that they have a brushed finish rather than a mirror polish.)

                                                Starting with a room-temperature stove (in both tests) on a 15k BTU gas burner on high-heat, I timed how long it took to bring *equal* amounts of cold water (same temperature) to a rolling boil.

                                                The Demeyere took 26 minutes to reach a rolling boil.
                                                The Falk took 19.5 minutes to reach a rolling boil.

                                                The Falk was extremely responsive to temperature changes. Cutting the heat ceased the boiling within 5-10 seconds.

                                                The Demeyere responded to a heat cut in 8-15 seconds or longer. Restoring the heat resulted in similar lags in returning the pots to full boil. Copper was certainly the more nimble and you could see how a responsive it would be for sautéing or cutting the heat in the event the pan got too hot.

                                                The only real shortcoming in that particular test was that I was comparing an 11" pan to a 9" pan. The broader surface area of the Falk would certainly cause it to absorb more heat and boil water faster. So I also compared an 11" Falk fry pan and an 11" Demeyere fry pan, boiling approximately 4 cups of cold water on a cold stove in both cases.

                                                Again, the Falk won the contest, boiling water approximately 4 minutes faster than the Demeyere fry pan, all things being equal. This size-for-size comparison was as fair as I could make it. If you're looking for cooking responsiveness and rapid boiling, copper's the only game in town.

                                                I ended up keeping the Falk pans and returning the Demeyeres to Sur la Table. For me, the ability to sauté on lower heat; boil water faster; or quickly "rescue" food that's getting too hot (by cutting the heat and obtaining a rapid cool-down) outweighed the benefits of being able to throw the pan in the dishwasher.

                                                The Demeyeres are wonderful pans - beautiful and easy to care for. If you have an induction stove, I'd go with them because copper would require an ugly (and hot) iron lug to be placed underneath the pan. If you have gas, copper is certainly a more nimble metal when it comes to heat responsiveness. The Falks I bought cleaned nicely with Bar Keeper's Friend.

                                                The Demeyere has a brighter silver finish on the inside which I found shows tiny hairline scratches caused by Bar Keeper's Friend (or the green Scotchbrite pad) - whereas the Falk's stainless interior was immune to such scratching.

                                                Both brands are heavy, but Falk is heaviest - some people complain about the weight of copper pans but I think it's just whining to complain about a 5-8lb weight of a pan (it's not that heavy once you get used to it).

                                                2 Replies
                                                1. re: ProtonVehiCROSS
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                                                  E_M RE: ProtonVehiCROSS May 19, 2010 05:25 PM

                                                  This was a very helpful post, thanks. But I don't understand how the falk copper would allow you to saute at a lower temperature than the demeyere.

                                                  I understand copper's properties, and agree that it is a superior material for a small sauce pan to regulate temperature. I also concede that it boils water faster but, for a pot whose purpose is to boil water, what is the rationale in buying a significantly less expensive stock pot? I guess I boil less water than you. ;)

                                                  Lastly, according to Sur la Table's youtube videos on Demeyere, the pans excel at retaining heat; that is, the demonstration shows how the contents of the pots continued to cook even when removed from the heat source (or kept on a simmer). I don't believe they make any claim to be responsive. So, how does the Falk allow you to saute at a lower heat?

                                                  EDIT: They continue to cook with the lid ON.

                                                  1. re: E_M
                                                    p
                                                    ProtonVehiCROSS RE: E_M May 19, 2010 05:43 PM

                                                    Copper allows cooking at lower temperatures because the heat transfer is so excellent. Copper is kind of like an 8-line heat super-highway, whereas other materials are going to be less than that -- maybe equivalent to a 3-5 lane highway.

                                                    In order to get a non-copper pan to the same temperature as a copper one, you have to have the burner turned higher, because more of the heat escapes up and around the pan rather than INTO the pan (and into your food). Because copper sucks that heat right up, like a sponge, it quickly captures more heat before it has a chance to escape up and around the pan. It transfers it quickly into your food. Some copper manufacturers talk about copper being a 'greener' and more efficiently cookware due to this property.

                                                    In my own experience, I had to have the Demeyere Atlantis on medium-high heat on a 9K BTU gas burner to cook an egg. There was a longer warm-up time as well. The copper Falks require medium heat and were ready to cook an egg faster than the Demeyeres, and they cooled off a bit faster.

                                                    Also, to sauté vegetables required medium-high heat with Demeyere whereas the Falks require only medium heat.

                                                    For my style of cooking I like a responsive pan. To borrow the car analogy again, I want something that zooms from 0-60 in record time and also stops on a dime. Copper does that. A pan that "keeps cooking" after you remove it from the heat is hardly a selling point in my opinion, unless it's a serving pan intended to keep food warm at the table.

                                                    In fact, just the other day, in using a cast iron pan, I had the heat a tad too high and burned some sugar. It took the cast iron pan 2 minute to stop smoking the sugar after it was removed from the heat. Had it been a copper pan, I'm sure it would've stopped smoking in 20-30 seconds.

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