the word decadent applying to food
When did the word decadent start applying to food? The official defintions are:
DECADENT (noun)
A person who has fallen into a decadent state (morally or artistically)
Nouns denoting people
Hypernyms ("decadent" is a kind of...):
bad person (a person who does harm to others)
DECADENT (adjective)
Marked by excessive self-indulgence and moral decay
Synonyms:
effete
Context examples:
a decadent life of excessive money and no sense of responsibility / a group of effete self-professed intellectuals
Similar:
indulgent (characterized by or given to yielding to the wishes of someone)
It seems like a negative comment rather than a positive one
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Scargod
Aug 29, 2009 03:34 AM
Some of us know absolutely for certain that we will go to hell for the desserts we eat! Heaven or hell? Before, during or after eating dessert? Sometimes hard to tell the difference here on earth surrounded by the sinful excesses of desserts, especially at the buffets! That's why I don't go to buffets... sinful.
Now, where did I put my squeeze bottle of chocolate syrup and the Cherry Garcia? -
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my dad used to refer to really over-the-top, sweet on top of sweet on top of sweet, dessert offerings as *decadent.*
as in: "wow, the double-dutch-brownie triple earthquake with fudge chunk chocolate ice cream, cookie crumbles, hot fudge sauce, whipped cream and chocolate sprinkles really sounds decadent. i'd better have another piece of your mom's peach pie instead." ;-P
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FoodFuser
Jul 17, 2009 10:50 PM
Mea culpa decadentata
I've eaten more feasts than I oughta.
Yet when Sunday will dawn
I'll awake, and I'll yawn
And assemble another Frittata.›5 Replies-
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re: Leonardo
Paula76
Jul 18, 2009 08:43 AM
I beg to differ...some of my most adventurous and exciting times have involved food so for me, to think of a dessert as decadent is fitting as the potential pleasure it could provide if such promise is fulfilled is an almost erotic experience.
Call me sad if you like but I don't consider myself lacking in excitement for it...
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re: Leonardo
danhole
Jul 19, 2009 11:00 AM
I hardly ever have a dessert in a restaurant, so it baffles me that the word decadent brings dessert to mind. Now there was one chocolate mousse cake that I had that was over indulgent., therefore could be called decadent, but I shared with 2 other people, and we all had quite enough of it by the end. Not so decadent in my book. But there are 2 other dishes I have had, that were not desserts, that I considered to be decadent, as in dishes I would only have on very special occasions because they were so goo and probably not that healthy. Still, my mouth waters every time I think of these dishes!
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Caralien
Jul 17, 2009 07:01 PM
Recommended reading: Benjamin Franklin talking to his gout:
http://www.bartleby.com/109/3.htmlor pairing foie gras and sauternes: too much at once! unless in small portions.
There are the decadent books (yes, I've read them all
)http://www.amazon.com/Decadent-Cookbo...which also include a turduken, in which the only piece eaten is the olive.
So yes, it can be taken to extremes. But indulged in occasionally? The negativity makes it oh so succulent and more appealing.
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re: kattyeyes
Caralien
Jul 17, 2009 07:12 PM
all food is good and innocent (per Sam Fujisaka in a defense for white trash food monnikers being inane).
Food=good. Pleasure=good
What's the problem?
(being realistic, yes, I've gained weight in my 30s, but who cares? I enjoy food and am less neurotic). Cheers to good food and wine.
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re: Caralien
kattyeyes
Jul 17, 2009 07:59 PM
The "problem" is there can be such thing as too much of a good thing. I, for one, would like to continue to fit in my current clothes and not "graduate" to a new size, thank you--thus my references to "naughty" and "behaving." The food is always good. I know both how to cook it/bake it and where to find it out. That is not a problem. But restraint sometimes is. Oh, well!
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mrbigshotno.1
Jul 17, 2009 05:48 PM
I don't care about references to something being "decadent", "sinful" etc. I don't like or think it's funny or "cool" to characterize a well prepared food item as "addictive like crack" how would someone know unless they are a "crackhead"? Sorry this term just doesn't fit and isn't funny!
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re: mrbigshotno.1
kattyeyes
Jul 17, 2009 06:42 PM
I refer to Fancy Feast as crack for cats. My sincere apologies to any "crackheads" I may have offended! ;) But Fancy Feast IS a magic vehicle for medicine for my cat takes 3x a day. I guess those of us who wouldn't recognize crack if it stared us in the face ought to just say it something is sooooooooooooooooooo addictive. But crack sounds edgier.
Others get bent of shape when people say food is "naughty" or that you're being "naughty" when you're eating certain foods. I say being naughty is fun--but I prefer how my clothes fit when I'm "behaving" better (or to be dull, being careful about my caloric intake).
Decadent desserts--bring 'em on! I'll walk 'em off and eat yogurt as penance later on!
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re: mrbigshotno.1
Scargod
Jul 18, 2009 06:09 AM
I don't see anything wrong or inappropriate about the terms decadent or sinful. Some people can sit and eat ice cream till the whole container is gone or eat a cake pan of brownies in one sitting. How about a whole bag of chips or one beer after another, till they're all gone? And these and others are not addictive, like drinking Cokes for the sugar and caffeine? No chocoholics out there? There's no "sinning" involved in gluttony, lack of discipline or loss of control?
Surely part of a food being labeled "decadent" is the potential harm it could do if consumed in excess. Desserts called "Death by Chocolate"?
Do I have to be something before I can know about it? I sure hope not! How about the sayings like, "If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck... or, "I can see by your outfit that you are a cowboy".
I think I can know decadent food without being overweight or without having a bad diet.
Metaphors are commonplace in communicating meanings. Perhaps it is not PC to use drug references for you. Perhaps we should use phrases like, "He was all over that dessert, like a duck on a June bug" or "that broad had roller heels for that dessert tray!"?-
re: Scargod
Those were NOT roller heels...
Anyway, I believe decadence can be an appropriate word when describing food/eating. I recently made chowser's "Man-Catcher" brownies. One batch calls for 3 sticks of butter, 6 eggs, and 4 c sugar (2 of those brown). They are delicious, rich, fattening, and artery-clogging and I have eaten more than my share. If this isn't decadent, what is? And what's wrong with that once in a while?
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re: fern
kattyeyes
Jul 18, 2009 06:38 AM
Well, shoot, it's EASY to "catch" a man when he's WEIGHED DOWN like that. ;) Problem is, you have to keep feeding him. JK, JK!!!
Speaking of words that don't work (I agree with you guys that "decadent" DOES work beautifully, btw), I'm watching Food Network and this woman just said, "It SMELLS like a million dollars!" Um, yeah? I get LOOKS like a million dollars, but SMELLS like it just cracked us up.
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re: Scargod
babette feasts
Jul 18, 2009 10:42 AM
makes me happy to be atheist, don't have to worry about sin and can eat as much chocolate as I see fit
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re: Scargod
babette feasts
Jul 19, 2009 12:09 AM
I don't think food is sinful, and applying the term to food, especially desserts, really irks me. I'm a pastry chef, so what am I, the devil? Decadent, yes, but not sinful. Now gluttony can certainly be taken to an unhealthy extreme, but two ounces of chocolate once a week - i.e. a particularly intense restaurant dessert - may be decadent or indulgent but it is neither sinful nor gluttonous in my book. My desserts are neither 'wicked' nor designed to kill you, but ideally bring a few moments of joy in this life that needs more of it.
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re: babette feasts
Scargod
Jul 19, 2009 03:34 AM
Yes, you are the Devil's Advocate!
As I said, I have MY definitions for some sins which might mesh well with your definitions of decadence. I like my one cup of strong coffee each morning and a scotch in the evening. I love good chocolate, though rarely have it around.
I have my hot button words, too, like, "all you can eat buffet". I'd much rather have one of your desserts!
You should post some pictures of your desserts! Your avitar is a tease and hardly satisfying. From what little I can make out, it looks like a work of art. -
re: babette feasts
An example of how dessert can be sinful:
Pope Leo X (from the de' Medici family; one of Michaelangelo's great patrons) is rumored to have had a naked, prepubescent boy, entirely covered in gold paint, pop out of a cake at a feast celebrating his election to the papacy. The boy died shortly thereafter due to toxins in the paint.
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re: Scargod
reading your comment made me think about the time my mother in law saw my eight year old boy eat one slice of nice ham (without any bread) and she called that a "decadent behaviour". We were all having breakfast at the table and he ate the same things we did: an egg and ham sandwich. However, after eating his sadwiched he asked me if he could have just one slice of that nice ham, to which I agreed. Trying to comply with "etiquete", he took the ham nicely with a fork, folded it with his silverware and started eating it with fork and knife (which I personally find exagerating because he could have eating it with his hands). When my mother in law saw him eating the ham, she right away said to my husband that the kid was being "decadent" (in a negative way) by eating the ham without bread. Now I would like to ask you and the rest of the Chow gang wether you think its decadent for an eigh year old to try a piece of ham without turning it into a sandwich, something "decadent", especially when he has already eating a nutritious meal in the style and way my husbands family finds "proper". (btw, he is not overweight).
I think maybe it is the difference in cultures. I come from a latinamerican country while my husbands family come from The Netherlands. Maybe in the Netherlands think that eating ham without bread is decadent...? maybe some one of you can help me find the reason for such way of thinking. Thank you
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re: Reginabonita
linguafood
Nov 18, 2011 09:26 AM
Ha! What a lovely MIL.
One of my favorite "dinners" as a kind was "cheese without bread". Gouda, a thick slice. Who needs bread, I say? Thankfully, my dad wasn't a jerk about it.
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re: Reginabonita
Not decadent. (I'm a MIL and I would never say that. In fact I find anything of any sort my grandchild does is adorable. Look--he walks! Look--he eats! Look--he eats ham with his hands. Sigh, he's so cute.) He asked for the ham, he ate with a fork using the best manners he knew, and so what's the problem MIL? But, I'm not from Netherlands, either.
I wouldn't worry about this too much. It is too bad MIL didn't keep her opinion to herself. You are not at fault.
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Sam Fujisaka
Jul 17, 2009 05:27 PM
What would you call my ravioli made of Alba Quercus Reserve ham, foie gras, and Caciocavallo Podolico cheese; with a sauce of more Caciocavallo Podolico, 1787 Sauterne from Château Yquem, a large pinch of saffron, and a touch of reduced Tieguanyin tea, topped with Périgord truffle?
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JungMann
Jul 16, 2009 08:50 AM
Food can certainly be indulgent, which is what "decadent" connotes in relation to food. It's the same concept as calling chocolate "sinful."
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