620884 Mon May 18 15:59:16 -0700 2009 98 29 Not About Food 0 4695334 When our local supermarkets introduced a 5 cent charge for their film bags I was ticked. The option was to purchase "green bags" at about $2C. Why didn't I do this before? The old bags are now annoying - too many and too many trips through the door. With the stronger, larger bags the two of us have everything inside on the first trip. The old film bags were always "useful" and should be reused -- until the pile got so big I had to find something to do with them. The practice of charging for bags is spreading in Ontario and some jurisdictions are mandating it: http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/635931 "Why did it take so long?", I ask from the road to Damascus? Mon May 18 15:59:17 -0700 2009 55318 DockPotato 1 4695348 Sometimes it takes a carrot and other times it takes a stick to change our behaviours. I always had cloth bags in the car and nylon bags in my purse that I repeatedly forgot to either bring into the store or forgot I had in my purse. Seems a measly nickel is all it took to change that for me. And I would agree with you in that it's easier to pack my food into fewer bags. But have you noticed that the only ones really gaining are the stores who charge extra for a previously free item with no rebates for us? Mon May 18 16:05:25 -0700 2009 4695334 219915 tuttebene 2 4695416 at my co-op they give you 10 cents off per your own reusable bag, or you can optionally donate the 10 cents to charity. the reusable/green bags only cost 90 cents, and they are very sturdy, so it's pretty much a no-brainer. i think the local grocery chains give you five cents off/bag. Mon May 18 16:32:17 -0700 2009 4695348 46030 soupkitten 3 4695451 At one, but not all, of the Trader Joe's in this area, if you bring your own bags you get a ticket for a giftcard raffle, which I think is drawn weekly.. Mon May 18 16:46:14 -0700 2009 4695416 159317 greygarious 3 4696564 Yup - I just brought 5 plastic bags to Roche Bros. on Sunday, and got 25 cents off my bill for bringing the bags. :-) But those plastic bags are also perfect for kitty litterbox cleaning as well. Tue May 19 06:13:06 -0700 2009 4695416 10532 LindaWhit 4 4702991 LOL, Kitty Litter, that is exactly what I use them for. I do actually use my green bag my grocery store Publix sells for 2 bucks during summer and spring. During winter I get paper. I use it around my plants and for the fire place. I always ask for double but I do reuse them, I don't throw them out. Plastic I ask my publix every month or so and they give me 20 or so free. KITTY clean out. Also, the plastic bags are great to cover a cast if you break a bone. Duck tape and plastic grocery bag and in the shower. No leaks. I had a cast on for 4 months and I would of been hurtin' without those bags and duck tape :) It was summer time and I was not about to give up the pool. Thu May 21 06:20:21 -0700 2009 4696564 232829 kchurchill5 5 4771986 Plastic bags are also good for filling up packages for mailing. Great cushioning. Sun Jun 14 12:18:24 -0700 2009 4702991 147113 ola 3 4696882 Our local groceries are supposed to give a discount for bringing bags, but routinely the teens working the registers don't do it. I do like Trader Joe's bring-a-bag raffle, even tho I never win! :) Tue May 19 07:58:23 -0700 2009 4695416 65780 jujuthomas 4 4696912 I've won those twice in my Burlington, MA store. Always fun to walk around and fill up a bag! ;-) Tue May 19 08:06:05 -0700 2009 4696882 10532 LindaWhit 5 4696985 That's why I fill out the ticket every time I can! but I don't always remember my bags. I do hope that charging for plastic bags will encourage more people to use cloth bags, altho I do see the need/uses for a few plastic ones. Lately I've been pleased with myself if, after an afternoon of shopping, i return home without one new plastic bag to add to the collection. :) Tue May 19 08:27:25 -0700 2009 4696912 65780 jujuthomas 3 4700548 I have no problem recycling and being conservative in my household; however it bugs me that the stores want me to purchase their "green" bags, but don't want to give me any discount or perk for using them or bringing my own. In essence I am saving the store money by not using their plastic bags and increasing their profits by purchasing their green bags. It would help if the retailers would try to encourage their customers to bring reusable bags instead of penalizing them for not. It also drives me nuts when I see several of my green friends with 25-30 reusable bags that they have purchased because they normally forget to bring them along. Just my two cents... Wed May 20 09:41:45 -0700 2009 4695416 228711 snix 4 4700625 My thoughts exactly. And has anyone given any thought to the carbon footprint of those cloth and or plastic coated "green" bags? Where are they made, how much pollution is produced and how much energy is required, etc....Hmmmmm Wed May 20 10:04:48 -0700 2009 4700548 219915 tuttebene 5 4700686 I have also had the annoying experience that these bags tend to get holes in them VERY easily. And no, I'm not overloading them. So they're getting thrown out anyway. However, I do like the idea of reusable bags - it;'s just my mission now to find better and stronger ones than the ones they sell at my local supermarket. Wed May 20 10:19:22 -0700 2009 4700625 63569 flourgirl 6 4700719 try reusablebags.com. I have several of the Acme bags sold on their site - they are TOUGH. I've had them 6-7 years and one seam has given way in all that time, and that's on the handle so it's still usable. They are advertised as carrying 20 lbs each, they're washable and they have their own (attached) pouches, which makes putting them in my purse or breifcase more convenient. I have other bags for clothing shopping because they have longer handles that go over the shoulder. (also from that site and also with their own pouches.) Wed May 20 10:25:48 -0700 2009 4700686 65780 jujuthomas 7 4701739 Thank you! That's great info - I really appreciate it. Wed May 20 15:12:55 -0700 2009 4700719 63569 flourgirl 8 4702933 hope you get something you like there. It's a great site with many eco-friendly and useful items. The Acme bags are made in the US, btw. (in answer to tuttebene) Thu May 21 05:47:53 -0700 2009 4701739 65780 jujuthomas 6 4703543 flourgirl, haunt the thrift stores! I grab any big tough canvas bag I can find! (I don't particularly like the non-woven flimsy green bags most market offer for sale.) Or, if you sew, get some yardage of canvas and go to town with it. Big plus of making your own? Sizing the handles to suit your stature and how you carry it (in hand or over shoulder, say). I've found the straps some of the store branded non-wovens to be uncomfortable with a full load or the wrong length for shoulder-carrying. You'll get tired of a canvas bag long before it gives up the ghost. Cay Thu May 21 09:14:56 -0700 2009 4700686 49525 cayjohan 4 4700670 You know, the reusable shopping bag seems to be the new hot giveaway item. I went to a conference and got a branded reusable bag. I went to a hardware store and they just gave me one of their branded bags to carry my stuff home in. My sister's school just gave her one. Add these to the ones we bought years ago before this whole thing caught on and we now have way more "green" shopping bags than we can ever use. Wed May 20 10:14:47 -0700 2009 4700548 102571 mordacity 5 4701905 I've noticed that as well. Companies that used to give out t-shirts are now giving out bags. So that's what I have. My Pop Cap bag & my Best Buy water bottle. I have quite enough t-shirts, thankyouverymuch. Wed May 20 16:10:16 -0700 2009 4700670 13722 small h 6 4702927 went to a rock concert not too long ago and bought a t-shirt, got a fabric bag instead of plastic. AWESOME. :) Thu May 21 05:45:54 -0700 2009 4701905 65780 jujuthomas 5 4731629 i've actually never purchased a reusable canvass bag, ever. i have about ten of them in rotation, all free from non-profits, radio stations, search engines, etc... if you hate the logo, you can always wear the bag with the logo side towards you or just flip it inside out. some of these bags i've had for about ten years and they're still in great shape. Mon Jun 01 01:25:38 -0700 2009 4700670 64215 cimui 2 4696607 Whole Foods gives me ten cents for using my cloth bag. Tue May 19 06:29:02 -0700 2009 4695348 13722 small h 1 4695690 if it takes charging to stop people taking so many bags for only a few items then that's good. However, the packers and cashiers give away too many bags. I usually repack my items at the checkout and give half the bags back only to see them get thrown away which irritates me. Mon May 18 18:11:54 -0700 2009 4695334 22559 smartie 1 4695824 I studied abroad in Prague in early 2007 and found myself in for a nasty shock the first time I went to the grocery on the corner, loaded up my basket, and paid, only to discover that they didn't have any bags at all. The larger grocery chain a few blocks away charged for large plastic bags, as did their CVS equivalent with paper bags. If you didn't want to pay, you didn't get a bag - you were expected to bring your own, especially to the smaller places. I was told this had been common practice for a while, although I'm sure some of that is due in part to the fact that the Czech Republic used to be a communist country. Interestingly enough, the only grocery store that readily gave out plastic bags free of charge was Tesco. Mon May 18 19:09:40 -0700 2009 4695334 150942 whitneybee 2 4696214 It was that way in the south of France a couple of years ago, although most stores had bags for purchase. We ended up bringing them all back, and re-used them for many, many things. We've purchased cloth bags for a couple of stores and use them for a 5 cent reduction each at the counter, but when I forget to throw them in the car, the plastic bags work really well for disposing of stuff from the cat box. Unless they've been poorly sealed. Mon May 18 22:29:37 -0700 2009 4695824 237929 tracylee 2 4747235 "although I'm sure some of that is due in part to the fact that the Czech Republic used to be a communist country" That has nothing ot do with being a former communist country. Pretty much everywhere in Europe for many years you had to pay for your bags. I was born and grew up in Germany and for the last 30 years you had to pay for your bags. I hope similar things will happen here in the US. Fri Jun 05 19:38:43 -0700 2009 4695824 13239 honkman 3 4748460 As an exchange student in Belgium in the early 70s, I recall that we always brought cloth bags to the store, so we would not have to pay for theirs. Sat Jun 06 12:51:37 -0700 2009 4747235 25595 masha 1 4695932 i went to the link and i find it rather disappointing that many comments were against this mandate; many people feel at a loss when they now have to find other methods to throw away their trash instead of said grocery bags--that is not recycling, that is reusing in the minimal definition. i don't understand the households that manage to produce so much waste, as the bulk of mine would end up recycled or composted. sigh. and are the grocers ripping us off this way? should THEY be the ones to foot the bill for biodegradable bags? well... these bags needs particular sorting for processing; in the end, they end up in the landfill with everything else. small bags, within bigger bags, within even bigger bags... so the problem i see, i suppose, is not that people are selfish about the .05$ they are shelling out for what used to be free; but they have so much refuse, they don't know where to put it. Mon May 18 19:53:24 -0700 2009 4695334 224803 dumpycactus 2 4696001 Until recently, the LCBO used to put your purchases in one of their plastic bags. They were excellent bags, very suiyable for re-use. I used to keep several for that purpose in the trunk of my car, for use where I did not get a bag with my purchase. Now they are stopping this, and people will end up buying bags to replace them. Ecologically counterproductive, IMHO. Mon May 18 20:23:56 -0700 2009 4695932 54222 ekammin 3 4699453 i've never taken a bag from LCBO/grocers. i just put it in my bag/purse/backpack. i don't believe it's counterproductive if someone uses their own bag, remaining in use for years. this is clearly a generalisation as well. some people keep around their grocery bags. some people throw them away immediately. it's not like EVERYONE can change overnight, but at least these are small steps that plastic bags aren't so necessary as they have manifested themselves to be. Tue May 19 23:04:52 -0700 2009 4696001 224803 dumpycactus 2 4696424 I think it would be nice if everyone would be more aware of the garbage that they produce and resort to prevention. However, until retailers are legislated (like in Germany) to "own" the packaging they produce and be responsible for it's recycling, the consumer is really quite limited in their choices. And in large, urban centres, dwellers in highrises often don't have many resources for composting and storage for recycling because older (and sadly often newer) buildings are not set up for separating trash. Plastic bags are a small part of a larger problem. If retailers were serious about saving money, they would stop providing bags altogether so in part it's still about economics for them. Tue May 19 04:41:27 -0700 2009 4695932 219915 tuttebene 3 4699475 i agree it IS a very difficult issue to tackle, and of course, i don't believe the onus is completely upon us as consumers. one of the biggest things we can do, really, is to make our vote with our dollar. don't support this, don't buy that. i live in Hong Kong part of the year. it's a pretty sad story over here! many retailers have eliminated plastic for cloth reusable bags; i don't know how much better this can be. Tue May 19 23:18:24 -0700 2009 4696424 224803 dumpycactus 2 4702401 I started to keep all the plastic bags I got in a week in a heap in the kitchen: I was appalled. Yes, a few are handy for lining a small waste basket, but I had LOTS! Now I have a supply of string net bags that scrunch down into a little lump in my purse, and expand to hold pretty much anything, and make me look like I'm an expat Eurotrash sophisticate, hauling home my wine and baguette. Wed May 20 20:14:50 -0700 2009 4695932 41016 Meann 3 4771937 Hee! I love it! That is a GREAT argument for the net bags. Sun Jun 14 11:49:11 -0700 2009 4702401 64882 Vetter 1 4699132 I'm very much in favor of recycling and the enforcement of it, so needless to say, I favor the 5c charge for HDPE grocery bags. People hate being hit in the wallet, so hopefully this added expense will encourage them to go GREEN and purchase reusable ones. Less plastic in the landfill is always a good thing, and in addition to that, we need corporations to become more proactive in this effort by utilizing plastics we presently recycle. Here in NYC all we are expected to recycle is HDPE and PETE, only. Polystyrene and polypropylene are not recycled at all and wind up in our landfills. Corporations need to understand that yes those plastics provide tremendous convenience, but they also take forever to degrade. As I understand it, PS and PP are used widely because they are cheap, so I say pass the expense onto the consumer for the transition. It wouldn't be a first. Tue May 19 19:47:22 -0700 2009 4695334 10609 Cheese Boy 1 4700646 I have a friend who cuts grocery and other plastic bags in strips and then crochets them into cute purses and other things. It's a great way to recycle the bags! Wed May 20 10:10:04 -0700 2009 4695334 168446 LJBTampa 2 4700862 I will be crocheting mine into a giant reusable bag! Wed May 20 11:04:46 -0700 2009 4700646 136906 lucygoosey 1 4701018 At one time Save-A-Lot charged for bags (1999<) but usually had boxes near the customer packing counter. Now they still have boxes but added those plastic T-shirt bagging fixture with a supply of bags. Stores want to really sell you cloth bags with their logo/printing on them, but I would fear being accused of theft or proving I purchased them. So I came up with a plan to use a collapsible (folding) crate. (See the first link below) BTW- I did get 6 of them and use some of them to organize my pantry. After telling friend of my plan he didn't think those would hold up and went with some nesting baskets in a color that the local stores do not use. (See second link below) http://www.globalindustrial.com/gcs/prod/30011929/i/productInfo.web http://www.itpbaskets.com/home.php?cat=253 Wed May 20 11:49:27 -0700 2009 4695334 60276 RShea78 1 4701682 The general concept of shoppers being more responsible for their own bags has been relatively common in many countries for a long time. It really is about time that U.S. consumers do the same. Considering that we represent only 5% of the world's population but create 25% of the world's green gas emissions, anywhere that we can make individual changes will help in reducing our impact. We use canvas bags, assorted TJ's bags, and reuse doubled paper grocery bags. The doubling of these paper bags immensely extends their practical life span - usually can use them for months of weekly use. When these bags are on their last leg, we use them to store our recyclable paper products, and the whole package goes in the recycle can. Wed May 20 14:51:10 -0700 2009 4695334 64003 bulavinaka 1 4701758 UK supermarkets still offer the thin bags - usually free, some companies charge. All now offer the thicker bag for sale. My usual chain offers it as a "bag for life". You buy it (costs 10p). When it develops a hole or the handles break, you take it back and they give you a free replacement. It's worked - most shoppers seem to have them now. Across the water in Ireland, the government now levies a tax on each thin bag. I think it's around 20 cents. Wed May 20 15:17:20 -0700 2009 4695334 154102 Harters 1 4702553 I notice at the "value" chains in Toronto (No Frills, Food Basics, Price Chopper), boxes are available without charge at the checkouts. These stores have charged for bags for years. Since I do a lot of shopping on my bicycle (not that I'm an eco-freak, I'm just seriously overweight and need the exercise!), I usually bring a knapsack or a duffel bag I can sling over my shoulder. But I do make sure that any fresh meats I buy get wrapped in a plastic produce bag, as the jostling of the ride makes it quite likely that the packaging might tear and get blood and juice over the bag. Which leads me to this: a recent study showed that many reusable bags are contaminated with high levels of bacteria, since most people don't wash their bags. Here's a link: http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/theappetizer/archive/2009/05/20/back-to-plastic-reusable-grocery-bags-may-pose-public-health-risk.aspx Wed May 20 21:48:51 -0700 2009 4695334 48210 KevinB 2 4702981 <<Which leads me to this: a recent study showed that many reusable bags are contaminated with high levels of bacteria, since most people don't wash their bags.>> Great point. I use a couple of old canvas bags that I got at book sales. And I always toss them in with the regular laundry. I've sometimes wondered if the ones the grocery stores sell that look "laminated" are even washable. Thu May 21 06:13:37 -0700 2009 4702553 104084 LNG212 2 4703018 A test of 24 bags funded by the plastics company. Hmmmm. http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/637368 And the bag or bags with fecal material were used as diaper bags. Well, no wonder. Thu May 21 06:38:12 -0700 2009 4702553 139219 Sooeygun 1 4721229 i just noticed we got a 5 cent rebate on each of our own two "recycle" bags we brought to our local giant grocery store here in arlington, va. Thu May 28 05:37:28 -0700 2009 4695334 105717 alkapal 2 4733615 All the grocery chains and local independants have been doing that for many years in Northern California, and many in NYC did it, too. I bring my own regardless, but I surely don't mind it! Mon Jun 01 15:23:09 -0700 2009 4721229 10074 Caitlin McGrath 1 4730221 I love the concept, and have about 10 canvas bags plus coolers in the car, but how do I remember to bring them into the store with me? I keep telling the cashier they should have a sign out in the parking lot to remind people! They say a lot of people say that. I always remember when I 'm on line checking out. Sun May 31 12:03:17 -0700 2009 4695334 11097 coll 2 4730258 Leave the bags on your car seat. Sun May 31 12:24:42 -0700 2009 4730221 64003 bulavinaka 3 4730351 My husband keeps throwing them way into the back every time he gets in! And the passenger seat and floor is my office "desk" unfortunately, chock full of paperwork and samples. What a disaster my car is, I'm embarrassed when people look through the windows. Maybe I should write it on my dashboard in magic marker? Sun May 31 13:07:54 -0700 2009 4730258 11097 coll 2 4730260 whole foods has big signs everywhere - wish all the stores did that! :) Sun May 31 12:25:22 -0700 2009 4730221 65780 jujuthomas 3 4761594 So does PCC in the Seattle area. Something like, "A bag in the hand is worth 2 in the car." Great reminder!! Wed Jun 10 17:31:04 -0700 2009 4730260 11729 kivarita 2 4730261 I keep my reusable bag rolled up & rubber-banded in my purse. You could try that. Unless you don't carry a purse; then I got nothin'. Sun May 31 12:25:41 -0700 2009 4730221 13722 small h 3 4730286 mine smoosh up into their attached little pouches and I still don't remember to take them... it's a matter (for me) of getting them back to the car after unloading the groceries. :\ I just need to make it part of the process. Sun May 31 12:37:01 -0700 2009 4730261 65780 jujuthomas 4 4730425 If you use a written shopping list, write a reminder on top of the list in capital letters. Sun May 31 13:37:30 -0700 2009 4730286 10532 LindaWhit 5 4730571 i like that idea. :) thanks Sun May 31 14:55:01 -0700 2009 4730425 65780 jujuthomas 6 4730603 And...so you don't forget to do *that*, write it on every sheet of a pad of paper that use you for your shopping lists. ;-) Sun May 31 15:06:47 -0700 2009 4730571 10532 LindaWhit 4 4730793 Mine live by the key hooks, so I see them when I leave. Sun May 31 16:33:07 -0700 2009 4730286 215278 corneygirl 5 4741291 yep, ours migrate from the kitchen to by the front door, where they await their next excursion. the best bag i have is from sweetbay in florida, because it folds up and snaps shut -- about the size of a medium size square wallet. plus, when opened, it is a larger-than-average bag! Thu Jun 04 02:49:08 -0700 2009 4730793 105717 alkapal 6 4741442 My Publix folds but haven't looked at Sweetbay. Mine stays in my car, although I am terrible and remembering to take it in when I go. Thu Jun 04 05:48:46 -0700 2009 4741291 232829 kchurchill5 7 4743230 definitely check out the sweetbay. they are neat! Thu Jun 04 15:30:55 -0700 2009 4741442 105717 alkapal 8 4743580 I picked up 2 tonight. What a bargain 2 for 1.50. Thu Jun 04 17:49:21 -0700 2009 4743230 232829 kchurchill5 9 4744302 the big snappy ones? wow, that's a real deal! mine is maroon-colored. Fri Jun 05 04:00:06 -0700 2009 4743580 105717 alkapal 10 4744312 They fold like a wallet too, I love them. Same kind of material as publix, but I like to carry 2 in usually so a great deal. No if I can remember to take them out of the car when I get to the store, lol. I'm great at putting them back in the car which is the funny part. Then I get in and go ... oh yeah ... the bags, but by then I already have a basket and several groceries. New concept, I'll adjust Fri Jun 05 04:12:49 -0700 2009 4744302 232829 kchurchill5 6 4742427 I love Chico bags that collapse to the size of a large egg, and are the size of a larger plastic grocery bag. I usually throw one in my purse/backpack anytime I leave the house. Usual grocery shopping is the classic canvas tote bag since I walk. Thu Jun 04 10:55:00 -0700 2009 4741291 215278 corneygirl 7 4743178 i love the chico bags too. they also have a clip so you can clip them to your handbag or even your keychain, for the forgetful folks. . . Thu Jun 04 15:11:21 -0700 2009 4742427 46030 soupkitten 8 4743291 These are good ones, I agree. My mother was giving them for Christmas last year. Thu Jun 04 15:49:25 -0700 2009 4743178 10074 Caitlin McGrath 9 4743307 the fabric (like parachute cloth) is so thin, i thought they'd shred eventually-- but dh used these bags for 20+ lbs apiece daily, lots of cans and bulk foods, for a couple of years and i think we only had one casualty. a really good product if anyone actually wants to buy a reusable bag ( i shudder to think about how many i must have. . .) Thu Jun 04 15:58:49 -0700 2009 4743291 46030 soupkitten 10 4743638 Yeah they're pretty great. They don't last quite so long for me (need to get a replacemnt every six months or so, the thread holding the straps eventually goes), But I'm generally filling them up with glass bottles of beverages and or sauces till they weigh 60+ pounds which is proably beyond the intended carrying capacity of ANY carrying bag. Thu Jun 04 18:10:03 -0700 2009 4743307 24492 jumpingmonk 3 4730364 I carry a giant purse, the size of a shopping bag, mostly already full; my bags are fabric/canvass, nice big size and not readily rollable. Crumplable maybe. Actually I keep them inside each other like Russian dolls, so it's quite the bundle. Maybe my shopping trips comprise of more than the average amount of merchandise? Sun May 31 13:12:10 -0700 2009 4730261 11097 coll 4 4730833 <Maybe my shopping trips comprise of more than the average amount of merchandise?> Well, you're blessed with a car (aka "giant metal purse"). Since I'm limited to what I can fit into my wire cart - and haul onto the bus - I can't go nuts with purchases. My reusable bag is made of that weird not-quite-cloth-not-quite-paper substance, so it rolls up nice. Sun May 31 16:49:24 -0700 2009 4730364 13722 small h 3 4731622 i do this, too, though w/o the rubber bands. (too lazy) when i travel to countries where plastic bags aren't so ubiquitous and generally cost money, i pack all my shoes in canvass bags turned inside out. when i arrive and unpack, i flip the canvass bags so they're clean on the inside and use them for shopping throughout the stay. btw, i think a canvass bag makes a *fine* man purse. sure makes me look twice in a good way. you know what they say about men with big, reusable canvass bags.... Mon Jun 01 01:13:57 -0700 2009 4730261 64215 cimui 3 4746079 I usually shop on the way home from the gym so I keep my favorite one in my gym bag. It's from Envirosax (www.envirosax.com) and is a work of art - I actually get compliments on it when I pull it out! Fri Jun 05 12:56:07 -0700 2009 4730261 14386 BobB 4 4746992 those are really nice! I'm going to have to keep them in mind if my acme bags ever wear out. :) Fri Jun 05 17:38:17 -0700 2009 4746079 65780 jujuthomas 2 4743926 I purchased a knap sack that folds up into a very small sak that can clip anywhere but I keep in my purse. Takes up less space than a small travel pack of tissues but can hold a whole bag of groceries. As it rides in my purse I never forget it and use it frequently. Thu Jun 04 20:12:19 -0700 2009 4730221 178869 juliewong 1 4731085 I have been using sturdy canvas shopping bags for about 10 years now. The local store offered .05 a bag rebate if you reused the bags they sold back then for .99cents I STILL have all the bags I bought 10 years ago! They repaid for themselves in rebates, plus I could stuff them with 20 cans, and they never ripped (A huge plus when you live in a 3rd floor apartment like I did back then) I now have over 100 different reusable bags I have collected over the years, and I often just hand them out to people in local stores who I see ask for "double bag it" They always thank me, and I think it helps promote the no plastic cause/ Sun May 31 18:37:35 -0700 2009 4695334 54116 gryphonskeeper 1 4733674 Starting today, all retailers in Toronto, not just grocery stores, are required to charge 5 cents for bags. New bylaw no longer permits free plastic bags with purchases. All profits stay with the retailer though....I'd like to see a bylaw applied to manufacturers to reduce their packaging!!!! Good intentions on the part of our mayor, but quite likely another boneheaded move on his part. Bottled water was an earlier target in an effort to reduce plastic in landfill - why not outlaw the producers from using plastic packaging rather than make consumers pay extra AFTER the pollution causing product is produced? At times, it doesn't make sense to me (even though I always use cloth bags....) Mon Jun 01 15:50:28 -0700 2009 4695334 219915 tuttebene 1 4743587 I have to admit I some plastic for kitty litter and I use paper that I shred for my garden so it does work out Thu Jun 04 17:51:41 -0700 2009 4695334 232829 kchurchill5 1 4744623 Three of the major grocery chains in Ontario are bringing in grocery bags that are larger and stronger. http://www.thestar.com/living/article/645852 Fri Jun 05 06:38:33 -0700 2009 4695334 139219 Sooeygun 1 4747801 I read recently on the local news site that a member of the Philly City Council wants to enact a 25 cent charge per plastic bag. That seems a little extreme to me...but I work in the city and even in our cafeteria I've seen people take 2 or 3 plastic bags when one would be enough. Shoot. now I can't find the article about it. Sat Jun 06 06:45:40 -0700 2009 4695334 65780 jujuthomas 2 4748086 I think the measure needs to be extreme to emphasize the seriousness of this issue. Plastic bags are a lose-lose proposition of just about everyone except those that are in the chain of producing and selling plastic bags. I have nothing against those in the chain - they are involved in providing a product of which there is a demand for. The problem is the demand is like cigarettes - ultimately, it's not healthy for society as a whole. Sat Jun 06 09:15:09 -0700 2009 4747801 64003 bulavinaka 3 4748098 but what if they are recycled plastic bags? how is that harmful to "society as a whole? Sat Jun 06 09:22:30 -0700 2009 4748086 105717 alkapal 4 4748362 These are things just off the top of my head. I don't have the facts in front of me on the rate of plastic bags being recycled, but it is extremely low. While some plastic bags are made of recycled plastic, most of them end up either in the landfill in one form or another, or flotsam & jetsam. I love the fact that recycling and reusing is on the upswing, but recycled plastics can be used in so many better ways. We have decking that is made of recycled plastic. It will probably outlive me and my children. Plastic bags are a petroleum-based product (for the most part) and are a one-use product like gasoline. It's an inefficient use of a dwindling resource whose sourcing and production also contributes to green house gas emissions, as does the production of plastic bags. Plastic bags have a knack for clogging drainways as well as getting into the ocean environment and reeking terror on various sea organisms. The Chinese govt is seriously considering banning plastic bags because of the the huge litter problem which is in direct correlation to its burgeoning consumer economy. I think if consumers can be "retrained" to think that the concepts of disposable and convenience don't have to be tied together, then we will reduce a lot of waste that is generated in this world. Sat Jun 06 11:55:56 -0700 2009 4748098 64003 bulavinaka 5 4749616 I was waiting in line at the supermarket yesterday and noticed there is a big bin to recycle plastic bags, which looked like it was overflowing. I wondered if they just reuse the bags, or actually melt them down and remake? I had to wait for the cashier to check something in the back of the store, so I had lots of time to ponder this question. I guess it would be gross to use someone else's dirty bags.... Sun Jun 07 02:41:12 -0700 2009 4748362 11097 coll 6 4749841 I emailed Giant once and asked, they said the bags are shredded and used to create new products - I can't remember what specifically. Sun Jun 07 06:54:51 -0700 2009 4749616 65780 jujuthomas 5 4755071 "The Chinese govt is seriously considering banning plastic bags because of the the huge litter problem which is in direct correlation to its burgeoning consumer economy." The Chinese government banned the thin, cheap plastic bags over a year ago. "Plastic bags are a lose-lose proposition of just about everyone except those that are in the chain of producing and selling plastic bags." Unfortunately, in places like China where plastic bag production is of vital economic importance to entire cities, the local effects of such bans can be devastating. This video includes a good example of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cR2AR98iq4&feature=channel_page It's a very tough predicament for developing countries like China, which are facing pressure from a wide variety of environmental groups on one hand and by local governments and citizens on the other. It makes one wonder, if developing countries can make such a tough decision, why can't rich ones like the US. Mon Jun 08 20:06:53 -0700 2009 4748362 80170 Condimentality 6 4755121 >>Unfortunately, in places like China where plastic bag production is of vital economic importance to entire cities, the local effects of such bans can be devastating.<< The problem with many cities in China is they have in essence become factory towns. They've become so specialized in many instances that they are known to manufacture one to a few basic products that are usually related to each other. An acquaintance who specializes in sourcing "attachments" for the garment industry (buttons, pendants, zippers, etc.) told me over a year ago that China would face the exact problem that you refer to. For instance, he said that there is one city that is known for producing buttons for the clothing industry. That is all this city is known for - buttons. When he visits this city, he finds buttons lying around everywhere. Each is worth minute fractions of a penny on average so no one bothers picking them up - in essence, they are worthless. Because this town has become so specialized in this product, everyone tries to undercut each other to the point of huge losses in hoping that they can capture market share in the long run (sound familiar?). Factory ownership turnover is high because so many go out of business, then reopen under a new name and/or new owner. This predicament is a result of overspecialization on a mass scale. This neglects one of the most basic tenants of economic integrity - diversification. It's like so many of these cities and towns are each like a basket of eggs ready to be dropped. Mon Jun 08 20:25:32 -0700 2009 4755071 64003 bulavinaka 6 4755195 You know, I was so excited to hear about the bag ban in China (and India) and heard it was actually enforced in China -- or at least in cities like Shanghai. Alas, not so. Street food still relies on it in huge part. You get almost everything in very thin, clear plastic bags so your dirty fingers don't touch the food and you can eat whatever you've picked up while walking / leaning up against a wall. It's true that chain grocery and convenience stores -- the ubiquitous Kedi, for instance -- won't give you bags unless you pay for them. And locals do save whatever (thick) plastic bags they end up with to use and reuse again and again. I'm not too, too worried for small Chinese towns that currently rely on bag production although the short term effects are indeed terrible to see; the country is *remarkably* flexible... far more so than the US, in many ways. These towns WILL find a replacement. The survival instinct is incredibly strong. Mon Jun 08 20:56:29 -0700 2009 4755071 64215 cimui 7 4755357 I want to share your optimism, cuimui, and, to an extent, I do. China as a whole has proven itself to be very adaptable with regards to its relatively new market economy. However, the gains from this process lately tend to be concentrated in the hands of a few (mostly on the coast) at the expense of those in the center and the west. Local governments in the periphery have very limited fiscal resources to put towards attracting new business, so it may be up to the center to be proactive in finding replacement, sustainable industries for these areas. I guess my main point (to try to keep things on topic and related to food) is that whether you're talking about food safety issues, plastic bag bans, pollution that affects agriculture, or whatever with regards to China, local governments are going to find themselves faced with well meaning imperatives from the central government while, at the same time, being expected to maintain both a high level of economic growth and accountability to local residents, whose livelihoods are at stake. So, as things are in any other context, when China makes big changes, there's always a price to pay, whether short-term or long-term. Mon Jun 08 22:54:42 -0700 2009 4755195 80170 Condimentality 4 4748466 The manufacturing process used in "recycling" still consumes energy. So rather than hand out disposable, recycled bags, far more energy is conserved if you reuse the bags you already have. Sat Jun 06 12:53:27 -0700 2009 4748098 25595 masha 1 4762649 I'm only annoyed because my poor memory hasn't gotten me into the habit of bringing my own bags to stores. I remember in university I would bring my backpack to the grocery store and cram it as full of cans and other cheap heavy non-perishables as I could and beside me were other students doing the same things. Now I don't carry a backpack everywhere, but I really should think about it when I go shopping. Put the bags in the backpack, then I have multiple reusable options. Thu Jun 11 06:32:12 -0700 2009 4695334 123543 Pincus 1 4762830 With the new law in Toronto, enviro bags are the new plastic bag! They are taking over my house and we seem to accumulate more wherever we go (giveaways at conferences, freebies if you spend more than X dollars at Shopper's Drug Mart, etc, etc). I think this is a good thing, but it's getting kind of out of control at my house, since we already had plenty. I like the ones that can be crushed up small and come with their own little carrying case, because I can have that handy in my purse for unplanned stops at the store. I've also started using them to cart laundry around the house, and find that quite handy too - because I can use one hand, instead of the two required to carry a laundry bin (oh these little domestic details!) Thu Jun 11 07:26:28 -0700 2009 4695334 12120 julesrules 2 4765332 No law you have to take all the freebies if you're overwhelmed! Thu Jun 11 19:56:21 -0700 2009 4762830 10074 Caitlin McGrath 3 4766298 But they're FREEEEE ;) Fri Jun 12 07:52:21 -0700 2009 4765332 12120 julesrules 4 4767409 Reminds me of the egg scene from Through the Looking glass: `I should like to buy an egg, please,' she said timidly. `How do you sell them?' `Fivepence farthing for one -- Twopence for two,' the Sheep replied. `Then two are cheaper than one?' Alice said in a surprised tone, taking out her purse. `Only you MUST eat them both, if you buy two,' said the Sheep. Fri Jun 12 12:40:17 -0700 2009 4766298 14386 BobB 1 4768060 I suppose ours is not the only household where nothing is simple, direct. Even passing the salt is a tortuous process. Our situation with the new bags took an unexpected turn tonight. Actually it's probably been veering off right along without my noticing our vessel's new bearings. I dislike multiple trips to bring in our groceries - intensely. The biggest selling point to me was that the larger bags had me in the house in one go without the accumulation of a huge vinyl cache. I stated that at the start of this thread. "I think we'll need another bag." That's what I heard from my wife tonight in the line at Sobeys. "Are you sure?" I asked, looking with alarm at the number of bags she has amassed since my OP. Yes: tonight we made extra trips to unload - with much larger bags! Those smaller, flimsier bags exacted economy through my laziness and their frailty. Then a thought struck me... How do you suppose that all those vinyl flimsies that passed before are now being recycled? Fri Jun 12 16:13:09 -0700 2009 4695334 55318 DockPotato 1 4768653 I mentioned above that we bought bags in France. They were much bigger than the kind we get in the grocery store today for re-use. We brought them back, and since my ex had broken his leg in France, and I was working full time, when he resumed doing laundry, they were great on a rope for lowering laundry and dry goods to the basement so he could concentrate on getting himself down the stairs. Fri Jun 12 20:21:11 -0700 2009 4695334 237929 tracylee 1 4771010 this little folding hard sided cart is very handy to avoid lugging multiple bags: http://www.completek-12.com/productcart/pc/viewcategories.asp?idCategory=118&pageStyle=H i've used it to haul stuff to a club meeting, and today i used it to haul the mac and hard drive to apple for an appointment. the yankee candle bag also fit down in it, and i could easily move heavy/awkward/bulky items. be sure to get one with a long enough telescoping handle. also, on google, i noticed a site that had a large version of this type of cart -- with an 80# capacity. Sun Jun 14 00:40:05 -0700 2009 4695334 105717 alkapal 2 4789262 Hmmm, that's something else to look at. We were just discussing grocery-shopping today, post-surgery before I can get behind the wheel again. The walking will be good for me, but lifting grocery bags is a no-no, so we were considering a roll-along suitcase. Fri Jun 19 21:18:53 -0700 2009 4771010 237929 tracylee 3 4790023 tracylee, it's much better than a suitcase for your needs, in my opinion. and i like these fold-up go carts better than the open wire carts, too, because they're more versatile for carrying all types of items -- not just grocery bags. this discussion may give you further ideas, although i think it is from photographers about hauling equipment. but it had some interesting comments and features to consider, esp. regarding push vs. pull, and pneumatic wheels vs. hard wheels, etc. http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/005wW5 the baby stroller 3-wheel push type of set- up might be better than a pull cart. easier to push than to pull a load, and no twisting of the body, or torque on the torso ;-). this swivel cart has nice features: http://www.elderstore.net/canvasswivelcart.aspx this "versa-cart" could help you around the house, too: http://www.wdrake.com/WalterDrake/Shopping/ProductDetail.aspx?CID=Home&SCID=Storage+%26+Organizers&ProductID=0000144162&SiteNum=0&sortBy=Rank%20ASC ~~~~~~ though not for you tracylee, but maybe others, these in-cart bags are quite neat: http://www.kaboodle.com/reviews/set-of-2-portable-folding-shopping-bags Sat Jun 20 08:54:26 -0700 2009 4789262 105717 alkapal 4 4790113 Thanks, alkalpal! I'll run these by my SO when he comes by to visit today. And yeah, twisting is out, also, at least for awhile. I expect he'll do all of the heavy work, so we'll see which wheeled thingy he prefers! Sat Jun 20 09:39:02 -0700 2009 4790023 237929 tracylee