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CHOW Recipe Lab #3: Coleslaw

aidam. May 5, 2009 05:55 PM

Here it is, May's recipe lab! This time our focus is on coleslaw since summer's just a few weeks away. The first draft of the recipe can be found here - http://www.chow.com/recipes/23356 -- so give it a gander.

You know the drill, but just to review: Take a look at the recipe for specifics, please cook it up and weigh-in on everything (we'll check in regularly too), and post your ideas for improvement by next Friday, 5/15. We'll have the second draft up for you shortly thereafter. (For details on how to participate in CHOW Recipe lab, check out this thread, http://www.chow.com/topics/604269)

  1. FoodFuser Nov 5, 2011 06:33 AM

    One raves for the slaws that our handles have harnessed.
    One craves for the crunch of our cabbage.

    1. p
      patmatw Nov 5, 2011 04:04 AM

      I would love to have the recipe for coleslaw from the Hazelwood Cottage Restaurant in Wakefield, MA they made so many years ago. I used to work in the "new" Hazelwood, and I enjoyed their food so much. There was shredded green pepper in the slaw, and I believe there was Worcestershire Sauce in the dressing, but that's all I know. There were so many foods there I would love to duplicate now.... Finnan Haddie casserole (in cheese sauce)...among others. Even their cheeseb urger club with french fries was the best I ever tasted anywhere.

      1. b
        barbara Kohlenberg Aug 4, 2009 02:55 PM

        I made it recently with white cabbage, carrots, red onion, grated finely. Then added lemon juice, good quality olive oil, and feta cheese. Yumm. Light and flavorful!

        3 Replies
        1. re: barbara Kohlenberg
          p
          patmatw Sep 4, 2009 04:41 PM

          I don't know if this is appropriate to this thread, but my favorite coleslaw ever was one made at a restaurant I worked at years ago. I don't know the recipe, but it was fairly classic mayo based dressing, but the coleslaw included minute shreds of green pepper. Not much I don't think, just enough to make it unique and delicious.

          1. re: patmatw
            p
            patmatw Nov 5, 2011 04:04 AM

            Gosh, I loved that coleslaw so much I posted twice about it!

            1. re: patmatw
              Shrinkrap Nov 5, 2011 08:38 PM

              That's funny!

        2. c
          ClearEye Jun 29, 2009 10:31 AM

          I use the simplest possible recipe, but I still have a couple of tricks up my sleeve that gives my cole slaw a crowd pleasing taste. Please forgive lack of measurements--I just eyeball the amounts. For small amounts I use pre-shredded coleslaw mixed cabbage/carrots, and for larger amounts I pull out the food processor and shred my own.

          Trick # 1 - Instead of mayonnaise, I use Kraft Miracle Whip. It's sweet, and people expect some sweetness in their slaw. This way I don't have to get complicated with added sweetening. Also, no one minds that Miracle Whip has only half the fat of mayonnaise.

          Trick # 2 - I use a little bottled white horseradish. A little goes a long way, but it makes an enormous difference. You get zing w/o extra sourness. For a family of 4, just a teaspoon will do. For a summer barbecue, one Tablespoon per every 12 servings is about right.

          People ask me for the recipe for the dressing, and are surprised when I tell them about the horseradish, but it is the ingredient that really makes the slaw.

          3 Replies
          1. re: ClearEye
            JK Grence the Cosmic Jester Jun 29, 2009 10:49 AM

            The horseradish sounds absolutely brilliant. Miracle Whip, on the other hand, holds the same place as margarine in this house. It shall never darken my doorstep. I use mayo and add just a little sugar for the sweetness.

            1. re: ClearEye
              alkapal Jun 30, 2009 03:49 AM

              also, clear eye, the miracle whip has mustard, primarily, and other dressing-friendly spices, which add to the cole slaw's flavor. i really need to include the horseradish next time i make slaw. (ps, try tossing some fresh and "really juicy" chopped summer tomatoes with a little miracle whip, then stir in some small chunks of crunchy iceberg lettuce. add some fresh ground pepper. simple, but yummy!).

              here's a little bit of information re mayonnaise vs. miracle whip
              http://www.neatorama.com/2006/12/22/w...

              1. re: alkapal
                kchurchill5 Jun 30, 2009 08:22 AM

                My friend makes one with cucumber, mushrooms, scallions and red pepper and mixes it with miracle whip and serves it in romaine or small lettuce cups as a side. It is really good. I have never made it, but it is so simple. I see some grape tomatoes too, but she swears by only the 4 main veggies. And it is really good. The dressing is light however. Not too heavy, s/p is what she said, but it tastes like something else, not sure. It is really pretty in the lettuce leaves.

            2. ssgarman Jun 19, 2009 08:56 AM

              Let me pre-face this. I love to cook from scratch...from the minute to the macro. But slaw is an exception for me. This is simple and I believe the best. Not from scratch, but I've tried from scratch and can't make it any better. Grab a few bags of your favorite chopped slaw mix, maybe a bag of shredded carrots. Toss in a jar of marzetti's slaw dressing (about 1/2 of what they recommend), I find one jar tops 3 lbs of slaw mix fine. Now here is the kicker...grab a jar of Jamaican Jerk seasoning. Do not skimp here...it takes considerably more than you would guess...a full 15-20 grams for 3 lbs. If you love walnuts...toss in a few, though it stands up by itself. This sounds too damn simple, but it works. Perfect on top of some chopped pork shoulder with a vinegary sauce on a cheap bun. Trust me.

              3 Replies
              1. re: ssgarman
                alkapal Jun 22, 2009 02:08 AM

                i'm going to try that, ssgarman. i think i'll cut the recipe in half, though, because that's a lot of slaw! what brand jerk seasoning do you use? (i've made jerk seasoning from steve raichlen's bbq bible -- for baby back ribs. btw, they were awesome!).

                i think this may be close to that recipe: http://www.paleofood.com/marinade.htm (scroll down)

                <fwiw, this jamaican marinade for wings sounds so delicious! it's from "bahama breeze" restaurant: http://www.recipezaar.com/jamaican-marinade-372965
                http://www.bahamabreeze.com/recipes/a...
                >

                1. re: alkapal
                  kchurchill5 Jun 22, 2009 09:35 AM

                  Marzattis is not all bad, I have used it. I love jerk seasoning too. I would add some jicama for a little more crunch and maybe a little cubanella for heat. Then you got me. I like some heat but all in all sounds good.

                  1. re: alkapal
                    ssgarman Jun 22, 2009 11:50 AM

                    I use the cheapy Tone's spice. I've tried others, but it seems to be as good as any. And it does make a considerable amount. I usually only make it when I fire up pork shoulder or ribs...so I usually draw a crowd.

                    The jerk seasoning has enough kick, really. I'm a food junkie, and as I said, I usually take everything to the extreme. This one is so simple, and extremely good as is.

                2. JoanN Jun 15, 2009 06:46 PM

                  I’ve been making a lot of cole slaw lately. Just some kind of inexplicable craving. I’ve made slaws with and without jicama; with and without apple, onion, and carrot; and with and without mayo. And so far one of my favorites is the Sweet Slaw from Jean Anderson’s “A Love Affair with Southern Cooking.” Suddenly remembered Chow Recipe Lab, came back here to check, and whaddya know? The Recipe Lab recipe isn’t all that different from Anderson’s. Her recipe has no apple, dill seed or black pepper. It uses only green cabbage, no red. And it calls for about 1/3 less mayo and half as much cider vinegar. But really. It’s damn close as far as flavors are concerned.

                  So I checked to see what people who made the Recipe Lab recipe had to say. Can it be true? All that criticism and not a single person actually tried the recipe as written?

                  I think Recipe Lab is a fun idea, but it’s useless to me if people are going to reject the recipe without even trying it. If so, there’s no need for the people at Chow to come up with a recipe to begin with. They could just say “Veal Scaloppini" (or whatever) and let the arguments begin.

                  I’d love to see the Recipe Lab concept work. Seems to me it needs a clearer statement of purpose and a more experimental and trusting audience. If it’s truly going to be a recipe lab, a tester ought to start with the recipe as written and be very specific about the changes made to improve that recipe. If anyone reads the recipe and says it’s not for them and they’re not at all interested in trying it (and don’t we all do that all the time when looking through a cookbook?), then there’s no need to respond to the Recipe Lab thread. As with the hugely successful Cookbook of the Month, don’t tell us you hate the recipe or have some suggestions for how to change it if you haven’t even tried it. If Recipe Lab is to work (IMHO), people need to trust the originator and try the recipe as written. Otherwise, instead of Recipe Lab it should just be called What’s Your Favorite Recipe for XXX? No need for a baseline at all.

                  3 Replies
                  1. re: JoanN
                    HillJ Jun 15, 2009 06:52 PM

                    Unlike say the popular Home Cooking Board's COTM, Recipe Lab invited variety and experimentation. The "host" said up front that she was looking for feedback.

                    Unlike COTM, it doesn't have several months and several leaders under its belt (yet) to have worked thru some of the terrific suggestions you've made here JoanN.

                    If a baseline is forthcoming, the "host" of this idea needs to check in far more often by written post. Again, the conversation coming thru COTM has had alot of generous cooks moving the discussion along and consistent leadership commitment.

                    Your points regarding this thread are interesting.

                    1. re: HillJ
                      JoanN Jun 15, 2009 07:07 PM

                      You make very good points, HillJ, and I'm only going to argue with a rather insignificant one. In actuality, having been there from the beginning, COTM has had no leadership other than those of us who have volunteered along the way. It's been the commitment of the participants, not the leaders, who have made it the success it has become.

                      1. re: JoanN
                        HillJ Jun 15, 2009 07:10 PM

                        Humble of you JoanN. I've been reading along since the beginning and it took a shared group think to create such a lovely month to month post. I have high hopes Recipe Lab will be just as fortunate. You've all been volunteering-kudos.

                  2. m
                    MazDee Jun 14, 2009 10:55 PM

                    Do you have a June recipe yet? Or will there be one? ( I followed the slaw thread, but haven't been swayed from my old favorite. Just me!)

                    1. HillJ Jun 10, 2009 03:30 PM

                      Baby pea slaw. Shell, steam and chill 3 cups of baby peas and substitue the chilled peas for the cabbage. Delicious!

                      13 Replies
                      1. re: HillJ
                        kramos Jun 11, 2009 04:36 PM

                        Thanks for all the great responses! We will take another look at the coleslaw recipe, adjust it according to your suggestions and post a new recipe within the next couple of days. In the meantime, if anyone else wants to give the recipe a try, please post what you thought and what changes you might make.

                        1. re: HillJ
                          softsecret Jun 14, 2009 08:34 PM

                          I love the Baby Pea idea... yummm... I used to have a Mexican friend who made Pea Salad with Mayo, diced onion, chopped tomoto and canned peas...delish! Yours sounds so good... I miss Pea Salad...

                           
                          1. re: softsecret
                            HillJ Jun 15, 2009 04:36 AM

                            softs-I had the pea slaw at a friends house recently. It was so unique. I've made it twice at home for my family and my kids are eating peas!!! :)

                            1. re: HillJ
                              kchurchill5 Jun 15, 2009 05:12 PM

                              Pea salad, frozen baby peas, diced red pepper, red onion thin sliced, chopped tomatos and mayo, a little garlic powder, just a little and a dash of hot sauce and fresh dill, s/p. My Moms favorite. Great salad. I love that salad.

                              1. re: kchurchill5
                                HillJ Jun 15, 2009 05:38 PM

                                kc-the ingredients list on the pea slaw I've been trying included rice vinegar and a dash of mint (no dill). More of a slaw/vinegar base. But the variations are endless!

                                1. re: HillJ
                                  kchurchill5 Jun 15, 2009 05:43 PM

                                  Sorry if I missed that, mint and rice wine would be a great combo.

                                  I make minted creamed peas hot, but a similar type of flavor. I love mint with the peas.

                                  Totally agree, endless combos. My neighbor made one with brown rice, mint, peas and all green. I wish I could remember the flavors but don't. but I light vinaigrette. What I would do to go back and try to copy that recipe one more time.

                                  Nice flavors. Anything with peas to me is just fine ... I use to pick all the pods off the plants and eat the peas before I walked back to the house. Mom and Dad always said ... didn't you pick any peas. Then my Dad would find all the empty pods in grass from the front yard to the back yard across the back road. I guess I should of hid the pods :)

                                  1. re: kchurchill5
                                    HillJ Jun 15, 2009 06:17 PM

                                    Too funny-pea pods! I was the only pea lover in my clan until this darn slaw recipe came along-now it's peas, please! from the 12 yr old :)

                                    1. re: HillJ
                                      kchurchill5 Jun 15, 2009 06:19 PM

                                      You started a whole new bunch of pea peddlers!!

                                      1. re: kchurchill5
                                        HillJ Jun 15, 2009 06:21 PM

                                        Guilty! Now if I could only get him to eat an egg!

                                        1. re: HillJ
                                          kchurchill5 Jun 15, 2009 06:34 PM

                                          LOL, don't give up. make it green!

                                          1. re: kchurchill5
                                            HillJ Jun 15, 2009 06:39 PM

                                            :-0) I'm not above trying a few tricks. I tried adding applesauce to scrambled eggs once and he didn't speak to me for two days-I was being punished for "sneaky behavior unbecoming a Mom"....stay tuned.

                                          2. re: HillJ
                                            s
                                            smtucker Jun 15, 2009 06:40 PM

                                            My kid started to eat eggs the day we took her to a farm, she harvested the egg and the farm crew scrambled her egg on a camp stove. That egg is still her barometer for eggy goodness. Kids..... _sigh_

                                            1. re: smtucker
                                              HillJ Jun 15, 2009 06:42 PM

                                              Great idea smtucker! Said kid of mine was invited to a farm around his 5th birthday and wanted to take the chickens home so their "babies" wouldn't get stolen by the farmer for breakfast eats. What can I say, my boy is a bit odd (like his Mom).

                          2. n
                            notsochubbychubette Jun 8, 2009 10:49 AM

                            my favorite is red cabbage coleslaw with raisins, carrotts and poppy seeds!

                            1. d
                              DishDelish Jun 7, 2009 03:01 AM

                              I love mixing half lemon juice and half wine vinegar for the sour, then a little sugar to offset it, a more recent idea my family came up with is to add cherry tomatoes cut in half for festivity and some awesome flavor. Also, freshly ground pepper is a must for the finishing touch.

                              2 Replies
                              1. re: DishDelish
                                p
                                paprkutr Jun 14, 2009 08:41 PM

                                I make mine with all lemon juice mayo and a little sugar to give the sweet and sour taste. Simple with just white cabbage and carrots.

                                1. re: paprkutr
                                  d
                                  DishDelish Jun 15, 2009 02:51 AM

                                  If I was to choose between the vinegar and lemon I would choose lemon, I love citrus! =) We also do White cabbage, it is the best in my opinion.

                              2. l
                                lexpatti May 11, 2009 08:15 AM

                                I"m in the "no mayo" coleslaw group. I change my coleslaw everytime I make it as far as the "other stuff" I put in it. But my dressing, I love: oil (half canola, half sesame), rice wine vinegar, sugar. I always add lightly sauteed nuts (almonds last night) and I love a sweet in it like raisins or cranraisins. I love lightly sauteed ramen noodles too.

                                16 Replies
                                1. re: lexpatti
                                  kchurchill5 May 11, 2009 11:42 AM

                                  Yep, my changes everytime. Just made a Mexican one with lime, cumin, chili powder, vinegar and jicama.

                                  Same with you I love all different kinds which makes it fun and interesting.

                                  1. re: kchurchill5
                                    1sweetpea May 20, 2009 07:42 AM

                                    I'm forever riffing on my own recipe ideas. However, I'm quite partial to an Asian-inspired coleslaw, since I'm not a fan of creamy, mayo-laden coleslaws (neither is my waist!). I don't salt the cabbage too heavily, but I use some, then squeeze out liquids before proceeding to add unseasoned rice vinegar, lime juice and orange juice, which gives me the right amount of sweet and sour without having to add sugar or honey (I'm allergic to pollen and avoid bee products as a result). My oils of choice are toasted sesame and raw sesame. I always use green onions, a bit of garlic and lots of ginger. I try to make it colourful, so green and purple cabble are musts, plus shredded carrots and thinly sliced red bell peppers. If I'm feeling spicy, I either chop up a couple of Thai bird chiles or use some nanami togarashi (which is 7 flavours hot pepper). If I have neither handy, a squirt of two of sriracha does the trick. Toasted sesame seeds (sometimes black ones) get tossed at the last moment and it is served. For a meal, shrimp or shredded freshly poached chicken breast can be added. This is an awesome summer salad entree that is low in fat and positively bursts with flavour. At this point, I taste. If it needs salt, I'll add a dash or two of fish sauce or nama shoyu or tamari (high quality soy sauces).

                                    1. re: 1sweetpea
                                      alkapal May 20, 2009 07:57 AM

                                      sweetpea, that riff sounds te-riff-ic!

                                      for a little thai angle, i sometimes toss in a splash of fish sauce, and a wee bit of sugar (like a som tum relative....).

                                      1. re: 1sweetpea
                                        kchurchill5 May 20, 2009 08:00 AM

                                        I agree, that sounds wonderful. A nice twist. I do like the mayo, but love to try unique ones.

                                        1. re: 1sweetpea
                                          David A. Goldfarb May 20, 2009 08:29 AM

                                          That sounds excellent. I think there would be a lot more participation in this discussion if that were the starting point--more like "rethinking coleslaw" than trying to perfect a basic coleslaw, which doesn't seem to leave much room for variation before it becomes something else.

                                          1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                            kattyeyes May 21, 2009 10:59 AM

                                            Good point/suggestion. Maybe that's how the next recipe should start--conceptually as you mention above (in this case "rethinking coleslaw"), then we get to chime in on what goes in the mix, then first draft. And because everyone would have a chance to offer suggestions to steer a recipe in one direction or another, there might be more participation overall, since those suggestions helped shape the discussion.

                                            1. re: kattyeyes
                                              s
                                              somervilleoldtimer Jun 15, 2009 09:20 PM

                                              Or more than one direction, i.e. for Asian slaw, do this; for western slaw, do that, etc.

                                          2. re: 1sweetpea
                                            Shrinkrap May 20, 2009 10:20 AM

                                            I love asian inspired slaw. I usually use "napa" cabbage and chili flake, and/or serrano for heat. .What cabbage do you use? How long do you salt? How long does yours stay good to eat?

                                            1. re: Shrinkrap
                                              kchurchill5 May 20, 2009 11:21 AM

                                              My fave is Napa for some, Asian probably Napa, just good ol green for Mexican and creamy but I buy what looks good and what is at the market.

                                            2. re: 1sweetpea
                                              Niki in Dayton May 22, 2009 10:01 AM

                                              My husband doesn't eat mayo, so I often make slaws very similar to the one you describe above. For a Thai-styled slaw, I also like to add cilantro, Thai basil, and chopped peanuts, add some steamed shrimp and it's a yummy healthy summer meal.

                                              Another favorite is jicama slaw. We matchstick jicama and granny smith apples on the mandoline, add slivers of jalapeno, some chopped cilantro, and sometimes some chopped flat leaf parsley. For the dressing, I put a teaspoon of honey in a bowl, add lime juice and rice wine vinegar, some salt and pepper, and a little olive or peanut oil. Whisk and toss over the slaw. It's all good!

                                              1. re: Niki in Dayton
                                                kchurchill5 May 22, 2009 10:43 AM

                                                Jicama slaw and apples I love. I add honey, lime, red pepper, rice wine, canola but I add sliced red peppers, some green slaw, a little red onion and papaya, Cilantro is a must. I love this slaw. It is a favorite of mine which I make a lot. Salad shrimp or large leftover grilled shrimp is great for this. Just toss in and serve. I love it. A simple quick dinner.

                                                1. re: Niki in Dayton
                                                  chef chicklet Jun 13, 2009 07:56 AM

                                                  I don't have a problem with mayo, but we all love the change to something different. I am saving your slaw nid, can't think of anything that would be more refreshing on one of out hot summer evenings here in no ca.
                                                  thanks!

                                                  1. re: chef chicklet
                                                    David A. Goldfarb Jun 13, 2009 09:56 AM

                                                    A Filipino shredded salad that doesn't use cabbage is called achara, made with shredded green papaya, carrot, onion, and some thinly sliced hot peppers with vinegar, sugar, garlic, ginger, black pepper and salt. The papaya, carrots, onion, and hot pepper should be salted overnight to draw out the liquid, and then rinsed and squeezed out before adding the other ingredients.

                                                    Green papaya can be found in Asian markets. It should be firm and totally unripe.

                                                    1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                      alkapal Jun 14, 2009 12:51 AM

                                                      david, do you salt the papaya for thai som tum similarly?

                                                      1. re: alkapal
                                                        David A. Goldfarb Jun 14, 2009 05:00 AM

                                                        I've never made som tum myself, but looking up a few recipes, it looks like it's traditionally pounded without salting.

                                                        The achara I've made is based on the recipe in Amy Besa and Romy Dorotan's _Memories of Philippine Kitchens_--

                                                        http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1584...

                                                        1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                          alkapal Jun 14, 2009 06:18 AM

                                                          ok, well i think you might like to try making som tum. it is pretty easy, so long as you can get the green papaya. fortunately, we have access to a lot of vietnamese markets around here, and in one i've found the bag of already-prepared green papaya. of course, it is cheaper to buy your own, and there is another local market that has the green papaya, and then i use my little julienne shredder.

                                          3. David A. Goldfarb May 9, 2009 02:33 PM

                                            So, I made it with a few changes--more of a hack than a test--and here's what I noticed.

                                            1. The coarse grater attachment on a food processor is good for the carrots and apples, but too fine for the cabbage, unless you like really fine coleslaw, which tastes a bit mealy to me. I shredded the cabbage with a 4mm slicing disk (I'm using the Kitchen Aid DVSA food processor attachment on my stand mixer, which uses the same disks as an 11-cup Kitchen Aid food processor).

                                            2. "Small" cabbage is a bit hard to define, but I'm fairly sure I got at least 8 cups from this recipe, and before adding the dressing, I was feeling that my 13 cup mixing bowl was a little on the small side.

                                            3. Instead of mayonnaise, I used an equivalent amount of rouille, following Bourdain's recipe in the _Les Halles Cookbook_, which unlike most recipes I've seen for rouille, does not use breadcrumbs, but is essentially a blender mayonnaise made with two egg yolks, a roasted red pepper, lemon juice rather than vinegar, 3 cloves of garlic, and a few threads of saffron, salt and pepper to taste, and about a half cup of olive oil drizzled slowly into the running blender. This makes for a really interesting coleslaw, but not as neutral as one made with mayonnaise.

                                            4. I like seeds in coleslaw, but I didn't think dill seed would blend so well with the rouille, so I substituted caraway seeds, and this worked well.

                                            4 Replies
                                            1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                              David A. Goldfarb May 9, 2009 08:51 PM

                                              Okay, after serving two sizable helpings with dinner, I put some of the above batch in a 7-cup container and still had lots left over, so I'd estimate the yield to be around 11 cups. Maybe alongside "small cabbage" it would be good to specify an approximate weight. We're going to be eating coleslaw all week.

                                              1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                d
                                                dfrostnh May 14, 2009 04:49 AM

                                                I agree that a standard measure of some kind should be used to specify the amount of cabbage. I'm one of the official cole slaw makers for our town ham and bean suppers. The mayo based recipe I use is based on a recipe from a National Grange cookbook. Cabbages vary not only in size but also in the density of their leaves. Early in the season, the leaves are much looser and more tender. Later in the summer, the heads are very dense and heavy. Even a small cabbage is going to make a lot of slaw. The dressing recipe uses 1/2 the sugar I use but the same amount of vinegar and mayo I use to dress enough cabbage/carrots that will fill the largest Tupperware bowl (usually buy 2 of the largest cabbage heads I can find and use3-6 carrots). For a family size batch of slaw, this seems like way too much dressing.
                                                The dill seed is a surprise. I use the traditional (for New England, anwya) celery seed. However, the flavor could be very good since my "secret ingredient" is 1/4 cup of dill pickle juice. My sister says my cole slaw is too sweet but the bean supper habitues recognize my slaw and prefer it to everyone else's. In fact, usually, I'm the only slaw maker.
                                                I hate recipes that are not specific about amounts. Two small heads from my supermarket would generate far too much slaw for a family. If I make the recipe I would use a half head of each.

                                                1. re: dfrostnh
                                                  kchurchill5 May 14, 2009 04:56 AM

                                                  I agree with exact amounts. Even my recipes I am guilty of I say dice 1 medium onion. Well a medium onion to me the big FL sweet onions may be way different then someone's onion in Canada. Cabbage can be a huge difference in size. I just bought one the other day that was huge compared to the ones I got back in March for St Paddy's day. 1 cabbage shredded dependent on size could really produce different total amounts of slaw.

                                                  1. re: dfrostnh
                                                    s
                                                    somervilleoldtimer Jun 15, 2009 09:19 PM

                                                    Hmmm. I've never put dill pickle juice in my coleslaw, but I always put some sweet pickle juice in my potato salad dressing (which, in addition to the juice, includes mayo, cider vinegar, paprika). Plus always celery seed.

                                              2. JK Grence the Cosmic Jester May 8, 2009 02:06 AM

                                                I can tell you without making the recipe: Salt the cabbage. The salt pulls out some of the water in the cabbage. If you don't do this, you'll end up with soupy coleslaw as the salt in the dressing pulls the water out instead. Just shred the cabbage, toss with a couple teaspoons of salt, and let it sit in a colander for a couple of hours. Then rinse off the excess salt, pat the cabbage dry with paper towels (or give it a whirl in the ol' salad spinner), and continue with the recipe.

                                                6 Replies
                                                1. re: JK Grence the Cosmic Jester
                                                  l
                                                  LizATL May 8, 2009 05:08 PM

                                                  Yep. I second this advice strongly! Aside from getting rid of excess water, this technique makes any slaw much easier to eat with a fork bc it gets somewhat soft (but is still crunchy).

                                                  1. re: JK Grence the Cosmic Jester
                                                    FoodFuser May 8, 2009 09:08 PM

                                                    Yes. I'm in the salt-then-squeeze camp. (Salt heavily, place in muslin towel in colander to drain, then twist to octopus head to squeeze all water, then rinse and repeat to remove salt, whose only purpose was for osmotic dehydration of the cabbage.) If this is a "lab" testing, then an awesome comparison could do side by sides of salted-squeezed vs simply shredded.

                                                    Secondly, and no less importantly, is the method of shredding and the resultant thickness/diameter of the product to be dressed. This literally comes down to the tenth of the millimeter. What a waste of time to see a recipe that says no more than "shred cabbage, and combine with dressing".

                                                    I've never used the buck-a-bag preshredded cabbage, but would be willing to if it would standardize the beginning thickness of the recipe description.

                                                    I use a Benriner mandoline, and perhaps a separate tewting subsection of slawmakers who do same would be fun, as we could standardize a starting thickness and final chopping dimension.

                                                    I'm betting/hoping that I'm not the only CH slaw maker who calibrates their Benriner, and has access to a caliper micrometer to measure the output.

                                                    Lab means science means repeatable and publishable results. Let's go for it.

                                                    1. re: FoodFuser
                                                      w
                                                      walker May 9, 2009 12:37 PM

                                                      I bought a Benriner and the instructions are minimal -- you can adjust the size? How? Screws underneath? Thanks.

                                                      1. re: walker
                                                        FoodFuser May 9, 2009 01:02 PM

                                                        Yes, screws underneath. Cool tool, eh?

                                                        These links might be helpful, too
                                                        http://kitchen-parade-veggieventure.blogspot.com/2007/06/how-to-use-japanese-mandoline-benriner.html

                                                        http://www.thekitchn.com/thekitchn/cookware-tools/product-review-benriner-mandoline-047203

                                                        http://www.marketmanila.com/archives/benriner-japanese-slicer

                                                        http://cookeasyvegan.blogspot.com/sea...

                                                        1. re: FoodFuser
                                                          w
                                                          walker May 10, 2009 01:58 PM

                                                          Thank you SO MUCH for this great info on Benriner. How did you find these sites?
                                                          I'm so glad I bought a protective glove (Polar Bear Cut Resistant Glove from askthemeatman) -- can't wait to use it -- maybe I'll make some slaw.

                                                          1. re: walker
                                                            FoodFuser May 11, 2009 04:36 PM

                                                            That glove is marvelous. I hang the Benriner, and the glove, on a cabinet exterior, on 4d finishing nails. Makes for less cleanup time and worry of drying. There's nothing like a good open air gravity drip dry.

                                                  2. greygarious May 7, 2009 09:31 AM

                                                    The Recipe Lab concept had a lot of promise, but doesn't seem to be working out as well as we all expected. The quantity/flavor/ingredient issues sank the tamale recipe; there wasn't much interest in the meat loaf, and the coleslaw doesn't seem to be getting people enthused, either. It may be that if you're a proficient enough cook to be interested in developing a recipe, you already know what ingredients you want to use and can tell by just reading the recipe if it will be your idea of "good".

                                                    Ingredients aside, it looks to me like that quantity of cabbage would yield quite a bit more than 6 cups of slaw.

                                                    33 Replies
                                                    1. re: greygarious
                                                      s
                                                      smtucker May 7, 2009 10:38 AM

                                                      I have to agree. Each of the three recipes has had a fatal flaw for me. The tamales was a huge amount and sweet. The meatloaf had 6 oz of tomato paste. This simply didn't appeal to me at all. And now the cole slaw has way too much mayonnaise.

                                                      It is hard for me to justify spending money to create a recipe that doesn't have a flavor profile that appeals to me. But I will keep reading the recipes each month and hope that one strikes the right cord.

                                                      1. re: smtucker
                                                        aidam. May 7, 2009 04:01 PM

                                                        Hi, guys. Greygarious and smtucker, do you have specific recipes you would be interested in participating in? We're always open to suggestions.
                                                        thanks!

                                                        1. re: aidam.
                                                          greygarious May 7, 2009 04:36 PM

                                                          There was a discussion on CH about a dish called Aunt Lydia's Chicken, at a defunct NH restaurant. I've never had it and no one had an exact recipe, but the ingredients were intriguing: chicken pieces or chunks marinated overnight in creamy french dressing, tamari, OJ, and honey. Brussels sprouts, red onion, figs, dates, cashews. Maybe it would be fun to list a bunch of ingredients and ask people to come up with amounts and technique for this or some other apocryphal dish. Would this be best as a braise, a stir-fry, roasted, or grilled?

                                                          1. re: greygarious
                                                            e
                                                            Ellen Jun 22, 2009 05:36 AM

                                                            No offense but that sounds like an absolutely disgusging combination. And i've cooked pleny of chicken with fruits but this hits all the wrong notes.

                                                            1. re: Ellen
                                                              alkapal Jun 22, 2009 05:43 AM

                                                              brussels sprouts? yikes!

                                                              1. re: alkapal
                                                                David A. Goldfarb Jun 22, 2009 05:55 AM

                                                                I'm okay with the brussels sprouts, red onion, figs, dates, and cashews, but the creamy French dressing gives me pause.

                                                                1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                                  alkapal Jun 22, 2009 06:16 AM

                                                                  kraft french dressing:
                                                                  1 cup extra light olive oil
                                                                  1/2 cup ketchup
                                                                  1/2 cup mayonnaise
                                                                  2 Tbs. cider vinegar
                                                                  3 Tbs. sugar
                                                                  1 tsp paprika
                                                                  1/2 tsp pepper
                                                                  1/2 tsp garlic powder
                                                                  1/2 tsp onion powder

                                                                  http://recipe-board.kraftfoods.com/to...&

                                                                  i can see that as a marinade, e.g., just substitute a little tomato paste (a T would be enough) for the ketchup, and it looks perfectly reasonable.

                                                                  i'd grill it!

                                                                  1. re: alkapal
                                                                    e
                                                                    Ellen Jun 22, 2009 07:25 AM

                                                                    well actually, both the brussels sprouts and the French dressing gross me out. And who needs figs AND dates? And even if I liked those things, the cashews would be too rich on top of everything else. Icky poo.

                                                                    1. re: Ellen
                                                                      alkapal Jun 22, 2009 07:28 AM

                                                                      i don't think it's a real dish.

                                                                      1. re: alkapal
                                                                        e
                                                                        Ellen Jun 22, 2009 07:39 AM

                                                                        Ok. I feel better now. Unlike country fried steak. Or brain sandwiches.

                                                                        1. re: alkapal
                                                                          LindaWhit Jun 22, 2009 09:41 AM

                                                                          Here's the thread greygarious was referring to: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/359569 It looks like it WAS a real dish.

                                                                          1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                            alkapal Jun 22, 2009 11:01 AM

                                                                            welly well! i still don't think that sauce would be half-bad.** some of the add-ins don't appeal, but it seems the crux is the dressing with tamari, oj and honey.

                                                                            ~~~~~
                                                                            ** "yeah, yeah," you say, "but what about the *other* half!" ;-).

                                                                            1. re: alkapal
                                                                              LindaWhit Jun 22, 2009 11:29 AM

                                                                              Exactly - to me, it's the OTHER half that has me going "ick".

                                                                              I'm actually OK with the tamari, OJ and honey combo; adding creamy french dressing and it goes into the "ick factor" - especially coupled with the brussels sprouts, figs, dates, cashews, and red onions.

                                                                              1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                alkapal Jun 22, 2009 11:46 AM

                                                                                but my point is: what about the dressing's ingredients gives you the ick factor?
                                                                                1 cup extra light olive oil
                                                                                1/2 cup ketchup
                                                                                1/2 cup mayonnaise
                                                                                2 Tbs. cider vinegar
                                                                                3 Tbs. sugar
                                                                                1 tsp paprika
                                                                                1/2 tsp pepper
                                                                                1/2 tsp garlic powder
                                                                                1/2 tsp onion powder

                                                                                these are perfectly acceptable, no?
                                                                                i'm tempted to mix a little batch, for some leftover chicken. i can see the red onion, and maybe almonds --- served on mesclun. i wouldn't waste dates, though they might be o.k. with it. in fact, thinking about it, i have a spinach salad dressing that seems similar.

                                                                                1. re: alkapal
                                                                                  LindaWhit Jun 22, 2009 12:36 PM

                                                                                  No problem with the dressing in and of itself - it's combining THAT with tamari, orange juice, and honey for a marinade that squicks me out.

                                                                                  Perhaps it's fine. But it's nothing that my brain cells would have said "Hey! I've got a good idea - let's combine olive oil, mayo, ketchup, vinegar, some spices, tamari, orange juice, and honey and mix it all together and put some chicken it it and then cook the chicken!" And if the brain cells ever did think that was a good idea, I'm thinking the stomach would vehemently tell those brain cells what-for.

                                                                                  1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                    alkapal Jun 23, 2009 06:49 AM

                                                                                    now, i'm going to try it just as a dare! and i'll be honest in reporting the outcome, whether brilliant or abysmal.

                                                                                    i've bookmarked this in recipes as "weird chicken dish with french dressing."
                                                                                    ;-).

                                                                                    1. re: alkapal
                                                                                      LindaWhit Jun 23, 2009 07:00 AM

                                                                                      I look forward to your write-up. You are brave, taking one for the team. :-)

                                                                                  2. re: alkapal
                                                                                    David A. Goldfarb Jun 23, 2009 06:51 AM

                                                                                    I think it's the mayo. I don't do mayo in a marinade.

                                                                                    1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                                                      alkapal Jun 23, 2009 07:08 AM

                                                                                      that's the intriguing aspect. have you ever brushed fish with mayo to bake or grill?

                                                                                      and looking at that thread again, it doesn't claim that this was a marinade, but a sauce. thus mayo (basically, just eggs, mustard, oil, lemon juice or vinegar) would cook up alright. (i've made that artichoke dip where it uses mayo and sour cream, parmesan, artichoke hearts, and sometimes spinach. that works well. ;-).

                                                                                      so broken down into components, the ingredients for the sauce of the weird chicken dish are:

                                                                                      extra light olive oil
                                                                                      egg yolks
                                                                                      tomato paste
                                                                                      vinegar
                                                                                      sugar
                                                                                      mustard
                                                                                      paprika
                                                                                      pepper
                                                                                      garlic powder
                                                                                      onion powder

                                                                                      are y'all feeling any less squicky with this emulsion?

                                                                                      1. re: alkapal
                                                                                        David A. Goldfarb Jun 23, 2009 07:10 AM

                                                                                        I've probably had it, but it just doesn't appeal to me to make something that way.

                                                                                        1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                                                          alkapal Jun 23, 2009 07:28 AM

                                                                                          make some fish brushed with mayo? is that what you mean by "make something that way" or were you referring to the weird chicken dish?

                                                                                          i ask because even the aptly-admired jacques pepin has advocated the mayo trick on fish, iirc, and certainly steve raichlen.

                                                                                          1. re: alkapal
                                                                                            David A. Goldfarb Jun 23, 2009 08:54 AM

                                                                                            I admire Jacques Pepin as much as the next guy, but yeah, I'm a bit ambivalent about the idea of grilling fish brushed with mayo.

                                                                                            1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                                                              JoanN Jun 23, 2009 09:45 AM

                                                                                              Surprised you haven't heard of it. It's a rather common, and uncommonly good, maybe a bit old fashioned, preparation. It was my mother's favorite way of cooking fish when I was growing up.

                                                                                              Perhaps some of the variations might have more appeal. I recently reported on a Broiled Bluefish Dijonnaise that I made from "Fish Without a Doubt." I mixed a bit of Dijon and thyme with some homemade mayo, spread it on a bluefish fillet, and broiled it. Simple, and truly excellent.

                                                                                              http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/6001...

                                                                                              1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                FoodFuser Jun 23, 2009 12:11 PM

                                                                                                I use it regularly when broiling fish, or baking-then-broiling bone in chicken breasts.

                                                                                                The beauty is that is an oil that stays in place, and browns under high heat, and retains the flesh moisture.

                                                                                                I've never used it in grilling, because the wire rack would interrupt the continuous coating.

                                                                                                I will confess that I am partial to the bone-in chicken breast treatment because I was first served it from a college girlfriend at age 21. It always segued into the "chicken eating scene" from the movie Tom Jones.

                                                                                                I have since substituted ground coriander pepper et al in the mayo as a replacement for those youthful memories.

                                                                                        2. re: alkapal
                                                                                          kchurchill5 Jun 23, 2009 10:17 AM

                                                                                          I have used mayo brushed on fish with herbs as a sauce, NOT a marinade. It actually wasn't bad. I still like fish especially fresh a bit more clean and pure, but it wasn't bad. I don't think I would do it again, but a friend gave me the recipe and we cooked it together. Not as "yucky" as you would think.

                                                                            2. re: Ellen
                                                                              kchurchill5 Jun 23, 2009 10:14 AM

                                                                              I like all but seperate, maybe a couple of combos together, but not all that. Yuck!!

                                                                  2. re: aidam.
                                                                    kchurchill5 May 7, 2009 08:33 PM

                                                                    The tamales were way too much and just not enough interest. I would like recipes that would serve 4 so they could be tried without wasting.

                                                                    Also an interesting recipe. This coleslaw is generic and with too much mayo to me. I just made Mexican coleslaw with cumin, rice wine vinegar, chili powder, jalapeno, jicama, cabbage red and green, carrot and onion. It has been around forever. No offense but you could buy coleslaw mix, add a few things add an apple an it is done. I would like to see some unique and some original recipes or old favorites re-made.

                                                                    Maybe some simple fish recipes or some simple veggies with a unique twist is what I would like to see. Also ingredients we don't always use, but are still common easy to fine and accessible. Maybe recipes for grilling, summer time, some good ideas for marinades and rubs and sauces that people can use for sauces on meats, poultry, seafood and pastas.

                                                                    Just a thought.

                                                                  3. re: smtucker
                                                                    David A. Goldfarb May 7, 2009 08:32 PM

                                                                    Interesting about the fatal flaw. I wasn't following this topic for the tamale recipe, and I just wasn't that excited about testing a meatloaf recipe, unless there was something really unusual about it.

                                                                    This one's got me thinking about coleslaw, but the fatal flaw (which is not really a flaw with the recipe) is that I've got about a cup and a half of nice homemade rouille left over from tonight's dinner that I should use right away, so if I were to make coleslaw this week, it's going to be with that (in fact, I think I'll do that), and then I wouldn't really be testing the recipe anymore--I'd be making something completely different.

                                                                    1. re: David A. Goldfarb
                                                                      s
                                                                      smtucker May 7, 2009 08:40 PM

                                                                      Yea. There is the requirement that we make the original recipe EXACTLY as published. I think this cuts the number of people willing to play along drastically.

                                                                      I don't think of myself as picky, but these recipes have shown me that I am. There it is. I have opinions about food.

                                                                      I wonder if there should be a brainstorming session before we begin cooking. Post a recipe and people interested push back.... and we come up with ingredients that we can mostly agree upon. And then we fire up the ovens.

                                                                      Not sure, but as I said before, I haven't given up on this idea and will continue to check the recipe every month.

                                                                      1. re: smtucker
                                                                        The Dairy Queen May 8, 2009 12:54 AM

                                                                        smtucker--I agree with you. I was really psyched about this recipe-lab project and fully intended to participate, but I haven't cooked any of the three recipes. That's partly because I've been overwhelmingly swamped and haven't done much experimental cooking of any kind including COTM, but I don't know if that's the only thing holding me back. The must cook exactly as written rule cramps my style, to be sure because I often tweak recipes to lower the fat and sugar, among other things. Also, I try to cook with the seasons and cabbage isn't in season here yet. Also, I don't eat much mayo, so, I wouldn't choose this recipe. I can't explain why I didn't choose the meatloaf. It looked interesting.

                                                                        I guess COTM works pretty well because everyone who wants to participate can,hopefully, find one or two recipes in the book that looks intriguing to them, where as this recipe lab is all or nothing. Either the recipe looks like something you want to try, or it doesn't.

                                                                        ~TDQ

                                                                    2. re: smtucker
                                                                      Shrinkrap May 17, 2009 11:35 PM

                                                                      Recipes using seasonal produce from my CSA would be great!

                                                                      1. re: smtucker
                                                                        Will Owen Jun 10, 2009 04:39 PM

                                                                        "And now the cole slaw has way too much mayonnaise." Tastes differ; to me "too much mayonnaise" is almost a nonexistent category. But I do agree with the main thrust of these arguments, that starting with a thoroughly (if to some tastes badly) developed recipe and making everyone do just THAT is not exactly the creative process I'd expect a CH exercise to be. I've done some of the Cook's Digest test recipes, and while Mr. Kimball's approach to cooking and mine are yards apart I do like the fact that they ask whether I did anything different, and what. This gives me some leeway if I see a way to a dish that will please me more. As for this one, I like my cabbage shredded, not chopped or grated, and my favored dressing starts with equal parts mayonnaise and buttermilk. Having thus become set in my ways I'm not too likely to tag along on this particular expedition.

                                                                      2. re: greygarious
                                                                        alkapal May 13, 2009 04:13 AM

                                                                        a half head of a medium cabbage yielded me at least four good cups of slaw just the other day.

                                                                      3. chef chicklet May 6, 2009 03:34 PM

                                                                        Great here is a recipe lab that I can actually do and feel like I won't be wasting my money. No disrepect intended here, I just mean that if its trial and error, I can't afford to do that. I think I can actually help with this one too.

                                                                        I like it all, the fuji apple to me would be a good addition, both taste and texture would be beneficial. I am concerned about the dill. I can't remember if it's fresh or dried, but dill at 1.99 for a wad of it, I'll pull out my dehydrator see if I can keep it awhile. You know, usually we only need 1, 2 at the most, Tablespoonsof dill. The stores are selling it by the huge bunch, so you do get your money's worth.
                                                                        Hmm guess I could always make pickles!

                                                                        Well its a shame I didn't see this earlier, this would of been pretty nice with the BBQ turkey breast we're making today...oh well. BBQ weather is right around the corner.

                                                                        I'll accept the challenge.

                                                                        10 Replies
                                                                        1. re: chef chicklet
                                                                          Caitlin McGrath May 6, 2009 04:05 PM

                                                                          chef chicklet, recheck the recipe - it calls for dill seed, not fresh dill.

                                                                          1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                            chef chicklet May 6, 2009 06:52 PM

                                                                            Dill seed? hmm. Must be a pickling spice.
                                                                            I looked into my spice cabinet, and all I have is dried Dill Weed, I guess I was thinking of that instead.

                                                                            Thanks so much Caitlin, I sure appreciate the heads up, because I would of surely used the wrong ingredient!

                                                                            1. re: chef chicklet
                                                                              Caitlin McGrath May 6, 2009 07:31 PM

                                                                              I think you're right, that dill seed is used for pickling, but it seems familiar in this context, so it may be that I've seen it in other coleslaw recipes in the past.

                                                                              1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                s
                                                                                smtucker May 6, 2009 07:54 PM

                                                                                I thought celery seed was more common in cole slaw. Unfortunately, we are not great fans of mayo-based cole slaw so I won't be trying this one out.

                                                                                1. re: smtucker
                                                                                  Caitlin McGrath May 6, 2009 08:09 PM

                                                                                  Hmm, maybe it was celery seed I was thinking of. At any rate, like you, I don't like the mayo-based slaws, so it's theoretical.

                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                    alkapal May 13, 2009 04:10 AM

                                                                                    i've seen celery seeds in slaw, too. dill seed i've seen, too, but not in slaw -- the texture seems a little strange for slaw, but....who knows? here is a photo: http://www.sproutnet.com/dill_sprouts...

                                                                                2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                  FoodFuser May 13, 2009 11:05 AM

                                                                                  Dill seed is available in Indian stores. Named "Soa sag".

                                                                                  A few pinches of dill AND celery seed, crushed in the mortar and pestle to release oils, is mighty good in slaw.

                                                                                  1. re: FoodFuser
                                                                                    alkapal May 14, 2009 05:44 AM

                                                                                    food fuser, doesn't it stlll leave little flaky bits? but maybe in coleslaw it doesn't matter.

                                                                                    1. re: FoodFuser
                                                                                      chef chicklet May 19, 2009 11:22 AM

                                                                                      Thanks, I'll check next trip, becauce I can't find it at any of my markets, large and small.

                                                                                3. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                  Shrinkrap May 20, 2009 10:22 AM

                                                                                  NVM

                                                                              2. b
                                                                                BigE May 6, 2009 10:38 AM

                                                                                This should be an interesting one; everyone has their own opinion on cole slaw.

                                                                                I think I'll try it out this weekend for dinner on Mother's Day.

                                                                                3 Replies
                                                                                1. re: BigE
                                                                                  roxlet May 6, 2009 11:06 AM

                                                                                  Yes, that's true. This is a case of a coleslaw recipe I would never make. I like my coleslaw to be tangy since I ususally make it to eat with fairly rich thinks, like pulled pork or ribs. I have to say that I find the idea of apples as well as apple cider vinegar to be kind of a turn off.

                                                                                  1. re: roxlet
                                                                                    bayoucook May 6, 2009 03:34 PM

                                                                                    I've had apples and jicama (similar to me) in cole and enjoyed it. This one looks pretty traditional to me for a mayo slaw.

                                                                                    1. re: roxlet
                                                                                      David A. Goldfarb May 7, 2009 08:14 PM

                                                                                      I like coleslaw that's got some sweet and some sour, so I can see a tart apple and cider vinegar. Some use sugar in their coleslaw, but I'd prefer apples, if one wants a sweet note. This looks like as satisfactory a coleslaw recipe as any. I'd probably add a little cayenne powder, unless I was serving it with something spicy and wanted a contrast.

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