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The US and the UK: Divided by a Common (Culinary) Language

Caitlin McGrath Apr 25, 2009 07:17 PM

In the "One more tea rant" thread on the General Topics board, Paulustrius floated the idea of a thread with this title to address food and cooking-related vocabulary/language differences in our respective transatlantic versions of English.

(It'd be interesting to note the differences in other English-speaking countries, as well. I know not all Commonwealth nations use the British conventions, and that Anglophone Canada, for instance, uses most of the same terminology the US does.)

So here are a few for starters.

From the tea thread:

US French press vs. UK cafétiere

A few more:

zucchini vs. courgette

eggplant vs. aubergine

bell pepper vs. capsicum

snow pea vs. mangetout

arugula vs. rocket

romaine vs. cos

cilantro (or fresh coriander or Chinese parsley) vs. coriander (for the leaf)

dark chocolate vs. plain chocolate

all purpose flour vs. plain flour

baking soda vs. bicarb or bicarbinate of soda

cookie vs. biscuit

french fries vs. chips

potato chips vs. potato crisps

  1. Paulustrious Apr 20, 2010 09:09 AM

    Some brands names are so iconic that they can leave you wondering if you are not from that part.

    When I make an apple pie I always use birds.
    I keep an arm and hammer in my fridge

    Javex sounds like a programming language, while Domestos sounds like an Mexican employment agency.

    1 Reply
    1. re: Paulustrious
      smartie Apr 20, 2010 03:54 PM

      Bird's is custard in the UK
      Domestos is bleach - Clorox here in the US.

    2. h
      Harters Apr 17, 2010 07:14 AM

      I was reminded of this thread on our current "What's for Dinner" (in Home Cooking). Here's one I think we missed first time around.

      Over = With

      As in Americans will serve something "over rice", we serve it "with rice".

      18 Replies
      1. re: Harters
        buttertart Apr 17, 2010 07:25 AM

        Hmm...in my experience in the States "over" means main dish on top of a bed of rice, as in some Chinese restaurant lunch plates - rice served beside the main course would be "with." Is this a southern US locution? I haven't spent much time below the Mason-Dixon line.

        1. re: buttertart
          LindaWhit Apr 17, 2010 08:10 AM

          Agreed - I use both terms - I serve cashew chicken over rice (the cashew chicken and veggies spooned on top of the rice), but a stuffed chicken breast is served with rice (i.e., the chicken is alongside the rice).

          1. re: LindaWhit
            Harters Apr 17, 2010 09:31 AM

            Must just be my perception then. Perhaps the "over" just jumps off the page to me and it doesnt when folk have used "with". We'd still usually say "with" even when it's literally "over"

            1. re: Harters
              LindaWhit Apr 17, 2010 01:15 PM

              Yes, that makes sense.

              1. re: Harters
                buttertart Apr 17, 2010 04:28 PM

                Gotcha (as we say here).

                1. re: buttertart
                  Harters Apr 18, 2010 03:41 AM

                  Slinks away, stage left.....................

                  1. re: Harters
                    LindaWhit Apr 18, 2010 06:09 AM

                    No, no, Harters - I'm pretty sure buttertart's kind of "gotcha" means "we understand", not "ha-hah!" with pointed fingers. Please re-enter, stage right. :-)

                    1. re: LindaWhit
                      Harters Apr 18, 2010 07:05 AM

                      Damn. It's another of those bloody translation issues!!!!!!!!!

                      Finger pointing triumphalism is often implied with Brit Gotcha's. As in this very famous newspaper headline: http://www.sterlingtimes.co.uk/gotcha...

                      Sometimes my country's "best" is not always reflected in our newspapers. LOL.


                      1. re: Harters
                        smartie Apr 18, 2010 07:12 AM

                        without even looking this must be that famous Sun headline during Maggie's war!

                        1. re: Harters
                          buttertart Apr 18, 2010 08:25 AM

                          No Harters dear, I would never say "gotcha"in that sense to you. I meant I realized "where you were coming from" to use another US idiom, I understood why over/with would have struck you. Two countries divided by a single language department.

                          1. re: buttertart
                            cathodetube Apr 18, 2010 05:30 PM

                            Think I would just say I get it. What part of the country are you from? Gotcha to me means like fooling someone - as in you faked someone out and pulled the wool over their eyes. Kinda of like when you hide around the corner from someone and then jump out at them making them scream loudly. Maybe I have been here too long and I don't know what is what anymore.

                            Is having your 'nose out of joint' an expression used in the US?

                            1. re: cathodetube
                              alanbarnes Apr 18, 2010 06:14 PM

                              Californian here, but I've lived in Oklahoma, Massachusetts, Texas, and Ohio. "Gotcha" is often used to mean "I understand" in all of those places.

                              And yes, having your "nose out of joint" is a somewhat old-fashioned expression for being annoyed.

                              1. re: alanbarnes
                                Caitlin McGrath Apr 18, 2010 06:25 PM

                                It is pretty obvious when "Gotcha" is used orally whether its meaning is "I've caught/surprised you" or "I understand," from the tone and inflection with which it is said.

                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                  alanbarnes Apr 18, 2010 07:56 PM


                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                    Harters Apr 19, 2010 02:32 AM

                                    Gotcha ;-0

                                    I'm beginning to regret mentioning "over" and "with". LOL

                                    1. re: Harters
                                      BobB Apr 19, 2010 02:18 PM

                                      Let's just consider the subject over and done with then, shall we? ;-)

                                      1. re: BobB
                                        LindaWhit Apr 19, 2010 02:49 PM

                                        LOL! BobB for the win. ;-)

                                2. re: cathodetube
                                  buttertart Apr 20, 2010 06:48 AM

                                  Presently New York City but have lived in the midwest and in northern California. Everywhere I've been people use it in that sense. Gotcha BobB, this conversation should be ovah!

              2. c
                cathodetube Aug 11, 2009 03:07 AM

                The creeping Americanization of the UK means that they usually say fries here now. I blame MacDonalds!

                9 Replies
                1. re: cathodetube
                  Harters Aug 11, 2009 04:47 AM

                  Certainly "fries" is becoming more commonly used - particularly amongst the generation that frequents burger places

                  There are, erm, certain types of restaurant which will also say "fries" instead of "chips". Usually places I wouldnt want to eat in. "Fries" are marginally worse than the now ubiquitous "fat chip", which is also an abomination to our national cuisine. A chip, whether to be eaten with fish, steak, eggs or whatever, should be chip shaped. Tis no wonder that we no longer have an empire when we've let this happen to us.

                  1. re: Harters
                    cathodetube Aug 11, 2009 07:24 AM

                    And what about the use of 'frites' for the skinny fries. Or should it be 'shoestring'? Does/did anyone in the US call them 'freedom' fries? I couldn't ever believe that story.......

                    1. re: cathodetube
                      Harters Aug 11, 2009 07:40 AM

                      I don't mind them being called "frites" - so long as it's in a French restaurant or, at least, one with pretensions to be.

                      1. re: cathodetube
                        Paulustrious Aug 11, 2009 10:18 AM

                        Believe it. Here is the wikinfo..

                        On March 11, 2003, Representatives Robert W. Ney (R-Ohio) and Walter B. Jones, Jr. (R-North Carolina) declared that all references to French fries and French toast on the menus of the restaurants and snack bars run by the House of Representatives would be removed. House cafeterias were ordered to rename French fries to "freedom fries". This action was carried out without a congressional vote, under the authority of Ney's position as Chairman of the Committee on House Administration, which oversees restaurant operations for the chamber. The simultaneous renaming of French toast to "freedom toast" attracted less attention.

                        Frogs' legs had no such bounds.

                        Another extract from that same article that made me laugh was an atypical French understatement...

                        The Embassy of France in Washington, D.C. made no comment beyond pointing out that French fries probably come from Belgium. "We are at a very serious moment dealing with very serious issues and we are not focusing on the name you give to potatoes," said Nathalie Loisau, an embassy spokeswoman.

                        1. re: Paulustrious
                          Das Ubergeek Aug 11, 2009 11:15 AM

                          Oh God, I remember that. "Freedom" fries have long since gone away, though some places now call them "American" fries or just plain "fries".

                          The one that did take me aback was an ice cream shop on Main Street in Woodbridge, New Jersey where I spent three minutes trying to figure out what made "Liberty Vanilla" different to "Vanilla". (Hint: Liberty Vanilla contains eggs.)

                          And my French friend's reaction to the whole debate was very similar to the embassy's: "Ce que vous voulez appeler un mets belge, nous nous en foutons comme de nos premières culottes."

                          1. re: Paulustrious
                            Caitlin McGrath Aug 11, 2009 11:38 AM

                            However, it was pretty much considered silliness outside the HOR. To answer cathodetube's question, the general public didn't adopt that locution.

                            1. re: Das Ubergeek
                              cathodetube Aug 12, 2009 02:25 AM

                              I know this is slightly off topic, but has the US banned imports of Roquefort cheese now? I read it somewhere. If so, why?

                              1. re: cathodetube
                                LindaWhit Aug 12, 2009 05:42 AM

                                It wasn't a ban, per se - it was an extremely high tariff on the import. It was retaliatory against the EU's ban on accepting imports of hormone-treated beef from the U.S.


                                The high tariff has been dropped. For now.

                            2. re: Paulustrious
                              cathodetube Aug 12, 2009 02:26 AM

                              Thanks for that explanation Palustrious- very interesting and strange!

                      2. Paulustrious Aug 10, 2009 10:48 AM

                        Tuxedo - Dinner jacket
                        Hog - Pig
                        saran {wrap} - clingfilm
                        burner - ring
                        ragu - bolognese (approx)
                        fish sticks - fish fingers

                        6 Replies
                        1. re: Paulustrious
                          cathodetube Aug 11, 2009 03:04 AM

                          Brits now say hog roast and not pig roast. Speaking American seems to be a badge of pride now. Sometimes that is good!!??
                          They also say hob instead of burner. Ring would refer to the coiled elements on electric cookers which are uncommon now.

                          1. re: cathodetube
                            alkapal Aug 11, 2009 03:28 AM

                            i think more americans say pig roast than hog roast.

                            1. re: cathodetube
                              Paulustrious Aug 11, 2009 06:38 AM

                              I should mention that burner is used here for electric as well as gas. Times must have changed since I lived in the UK. In them thar days, a hob was the complete unit (= American cooktop) and you had gas rings and everything round here was just fields.

                              1. re: Paulustrious
                                cathodetube Aug 11, 2009 07:27 AM

                                A lot of British homes now have separate hobs, ie ceramic, halogen, gas, mounted in a countertop. The oven is separate. If you still have an old fashioned cooker , then that it the complete unit like a US stove is. You would still say on the hob if you are talking about cooking something on the top, ie not on or in the grill (eye level or not!) or in the oven. Personally I am a big fan of eye level grills. Or should that be broiler?!

                                1. re: cathodetube
                                  BobB Aug 11, 2009 07:39 AM

                                  There's another one: cooker (UK) = stove (US). The word cooker is never used on its own in the US, but only with an adjective before it to refer to certain small appliances (e.g., rice cooker, pressure cooker, slow cooker, etc). Anything with a cooking surface on top and an oven of some sort in the middle is a stove.

                                  1. re: BobB
                                    Caitlin McGrath Aug 11, 2009 11:34 AM

                                    Or occasionally a "range."

                          2. s
                            smartie Jun 11, 2009 02:27 PM

                            we have forgotten these Heinz products available in the UK but not in the US (unless on the British sections)

                            Heinz sandwich spread - hard to describe, kind of a mayo with bits of peppers, pickles etc, great on hot toast
                            Heinz Salad Cream
                            Heinz Tomato Soup - fab nothing like it
                            Heinz Beans - might have been discussed earlier but not like US baked beans.

                            20 Replies
                            1. re: smartie
                              Ruth Lafler Jun 11, 2009 03:02 PM

                              I used to see sandwich spread around. Isn't salad cream basically the same as Miracle Whip?

                              But the topic is not foods that exist in one place but not the other (atlhough it did drift a bit that direction), but rather foods that have different names in the U.S. and the U.K.

                              1. re: smartie
                                kattyeyes Jun 11, 2009 06:55 PM

                                If Heinz sandwich spread is mayo-like with bits of peppers, pickles--isn't that a variation of tartar sauce (plus peppers)?

                                1. re: kattyeyes
                                  Ruth Lafler Jun 11, 2009 08:58 PM

                                  As I said, sandwich spread exists in the U.S. I don't think Heinz makes it for the U.S. market, but Best Foods/Hellman's does: http://www.bestfoods.com/products/san...

                                  1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                    alkapal Jun 12, 2009 03:38 AM

                                    yes ruth lafler, that's exactly the one i was thinking of, too. it's like a more mayonaisse-y thousand island dressing.

                                    1. re: alkapal
                                      Ruth Lafler Jun 12, 2009 09:46 AM

                                      Yup. I hate mayo and wouldn't touch the stuff, but I remember my grandmother liked it.

                                    2. re: Ruth Lafler
                                      Paulustrious Jun 12, 2009 08:07 AM

                                      I'll try to remember to buy some next time I'm out and see if it is roughly the same as my memory. However alkapal's use of the word mayonaisse-y would make me think it isn't. Heinz salad cream is not the same as Hellmans mayonnaise. The salad cream is sweeter and sourer than Hellmans. My guess is just more sugar and vinegar plus something to make it yellower. (Might be the malt vinegar?) The same may be true of the sandwich spread.
                                      And then there is piccallili, a condiment I don't remember from the USA. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, just that I cannot remember it. Home-made is the best...


                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                        LindaWhit Jun 12, 2009 08:46 AM

                                        Piccalilli definitely exists in the U.S. I saw it often when I lived in central PA. Ours often doesn't usually contain the cauliflower or green beans, but instead is often based on green tomatoes:


                                        And here's an early recipe: http://tinyurl.com/lr4lzn

                                        1. re: Paulustrious
                                          Ruth Lafler Jun 12, 2009 09:49 AM

                                          We're talking about three different things: mayo, "salad cream" and "sandwich spread."

                                          From previous discussions, I think the closest to "salad cream" in the U.S. is Miracle Whip.

                                          "Sandwich spread" is what was being described as "mayonaisse-y Thousand Island dressing" and seems to be basically the same product in the U.S. and U.K.

                                          1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                            Atahualpa Aug 10, 2009 07:52 AM

                                            You can occasionally get Salad Cream here in Toronto, Canada. It is definitely not the same as Miracle Whip. Thinner, tart-er, maybe even sweeter.

                                            1. re: Atahualpa
                                              LindaWhit Aug 10, 2009 07:56 AM

                                              Heinz's Salad Cream is sold in U.S. supermarkets now as well. I *think* in the international aisle, but also perhaps in the condiment (mayo/mustard/ketchup/BBQ sauce) aisle.

                                    3. re: smartie
                                      Harters Jun 12, 2009 05:57 AM

                                      "Heinz sandwich spread - hard to describe"

                                      How about "vomit in a jar"?

                                      But Heinz Tomato Soup is what you just have to have if you're feeling a bit poorly and run-down. A life restorer if ever there was one.

                                      1. re: Harters
                                        buttertart Jun 12, 2009 06:32 AM

                                        How does it differ from Campbell's tomato soup, the US kiddie lunch special and sentimental favorite of many adults (incl me) in the US?

                                        1. re: buttertart
                                          smartie Jun 12, 2009 06:00 PM

                                          Heinz Tomato soup is nothing like campbells, firstly it's ready to heat no adding of water or milk. It's smooth with no bits, it's darker and it kinda burns the back of your throat and as Harters says it's perfect if you feel a little unwell.

                                          But I can't agree with his description of sandwich spread being like 'vomit in a jar'. But like Marmite - you either love it or hate it.

                                          1. re: smartie
                                            Paulustrious Jun 13, 2009 05:09 AM

                                            A very graphic description. If he attacks any more of my condiments I will marmalise him. (Not heard that word in the US).

                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                              kattyeyes Jun 13, 2009 06:15 AM

                                              Had to look that up. Sounds very Willy Wonka a la when Augustus Gloop falls into the Chocolate River. ;)

                                            2. re: smartie
                                              Harters Jun 13, 2009 07:13 AM

                                              True, true.

                                              I can't abide Marmite, either.

                                              But I do lurrvve Gentleman's Relish.

                                              1. re: Harters
                                                alkapal Jun 14, 2009 12:02 AM

                                                harters, would you please describe gentleman's relish's flavor and texture? it has anchovy as a base flavor, right? is it generally available, or only from higher-end purveyors, like fortnum & mason? i have it on mr. alka's shopping list while he's in london. is there a "best" version?

                                                1. re: alkapal
                                                  Peg Jun 14, 2009 12:56 AM

                                                  As far as I am aware there is only one version - Patum peperium gentlemans relish, in a round white pot with black lettering. (Though at Christmas the packaging can change to somethng fancier). I've seen it in Asda (Walmart), and other supermarkets.
                                                  Anchovy is not the'base flavour', it is THE flavour. Well, spiced up a bit. They do a salmon spread too (similar pot) though I've not tried it.

                                                  1. re: Peg
                                                    alkapal Jun 14, 2009 06:59 AM

                                                    thanks, peg. so, it is a proprietary product. i found a "recipe" taste-alike (allegedly) on recipezaar. http://www.recipezaar.com/Patum-Peperium-the-Secret-is-out-Gentlemans-Relish-228778

                                                    but here's a slightly different "copycat": http://www.hungrybrowser.com/phaedrus...

                                                    which one (if either) do you think looks about right to you?

                                          2. re: Harters
                                            cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 04:04 AM

                                            The recipe for the Heinz Tom Soup has changed though, not the same as it is a lot sweeter. The nostalgia link just isn't there for me any more. I would rather have chicken noodle soup made with chicken stock and quick noodles.

                                        2. Peg Jun 8, 2009 11:35 AM

                                          US gravy seems to be any kind of sauce, whereas UK gravy is made of meat drippings (or Bisto).

                                          And another thing - I've seen a lot of US posts referring to food by colour instead of flavour (color/flavor).
                                          Like 'red sauce', 'yellow cake', 'white gravy' - in the UK I've never heard food referred to in this way - we tend to refer to flavours instead. There also seems to be a US chocolate cake dyed red - what's that about?

                                          25 Replies
                                          1. re: Peg
                                            LindaWhit Jun 8, 2009 12:03 PM

                                            The US "gravy" being sauce is usually limited to New York/New Jersey Italian families (or those that grew up around them). Not sure if it's also out there for other areas of the U.S., but despite having grown up in northern NJ, "gravy" to me has always meant meat drippings in the roasting pan mixed with flour, seasonings, and Kitchen Bouquet or Gravy Master.

                                            Red sauce gravy (i.e., pasta sauce) has always been spaghetti or pasta sauce for my family, never "gravy".

                                            1. re: LindaWhit
                                              kattyeyes Jun 8, 2009 01:59 PM

                                              In my family (of Italian heritage) your last sentence describes "sauce"--not red, not tomato, not pasta or spaghetti--all that is understood. If my mom says she's going to make a pot of sauce, I know. Outside my family, I have learned that sometimes I need to explain what "sauce" means to me. ;)

                                              It's funny how that cutoff line seems to separate NY/NJ from CT...unless there are other Italians in CT who used to say "gravy"--we didn't in my hometown, and my town is a sister city to Melilli, Sicily, so we've got serious Italian roots here. Very interesting.

                                              1. re: kattyeyes
                                                thew Jun 8, 2009 05:44 PM

                                                and it was more in NJ than NY, and within NY it was more in teh suburban and outer boroughs areas

                                            2. re: Peg
                                              nanette Jun 8, 2009 12:08 PM

                                              The UK has brown sauce aka HP Sauce.

                                              Red cake is red velvet cake. Wikipedia reports that it is dyed red to mimic earlier colours of chocolate or from the substitution of beets during WWII.

                                              1. re: nanette
                                                Caitlin McGrath Jun 8, 2009 01:52 PM

                                                And it's not really a chocolate cake, as most recipes contain only a couple of tablespoons of cocoa powder.

                                              2. re: Peg
                                                kattyeyes Jun 8, 2009 12:18 PM

                                                Your UK gravy description makes more sense to me (gravy = pan drippings).

                                                That's kind of funny about our (US) tendency to refer to food by color. I believe the chocolate cake you reference is red velvet. Someone from the southern part of the US can answer you better than I can, so I will step aside and let an expert give you the lowdown there.

                                                I should say, though, there's a difference between white cake and yellow cake. I can't explain what it is precisely, but it goes beyond the color. Yellow is my favorite cake (for birthdays)...with chocolate frosting.

                                                1. re: kattyeyes
                                                  JoanN Jun 8, 2009 12:44 PM

                                                  A white cake contains whole eggs; a yellow cake contains only the yolks.

                                                  1. re: JoanN
                                                    kattyeyes Jun 8, 2009 02:01 PM

                                                    JoanN, thanks. I'll admit this publicly--if only I had ever made a yellow cake from scratch rather than Duncan Hines (butter recipe golden), I would know that. It's on my list of things to try. I have baked plenty of other cakes and cookies from scratch, but DH butter recipe golden was always my b'day cake of choice and it still tastes good to me...with my own chocolate lover's frosting.

                                                    1. re: kattyeyes
                                                      alkapal Jun 9, 2009 03:04 AM

                                                      sista kattyeyes, try adding a bit of vanilla extract and an extra egg to your duncan hines butter recipe. yum!

                                                      1. re: alkapal
                                                        kattyeyes Jun 9, 2009 04:48 AM

                                                        Must try it--thanks, sis. You know ol' Duncan and I are old friends.

                                                        1. re: kattyeyes
                                                          alkapal Jun 9, 2009 05:04 AM

                                                          i made diamond shaped "cupcakes" in those silicone cups. they tasted like little pound cakes.

                                                          1. re: alkapal
                                                            kattyeyes Jun 9, 2009 05:13 AM

                                                            Those kinda diamonds would be THIS girl's best friend! ;) Shine on, sista!

                                                            1. re: kattyeyes
                                                              alkapal Jun 9, 2009 05:29 AM

                                                              wilton silicone cupcake molds in various shapes are neat. i also have the square and triangle shapes shown here. http://www.amazon.com/Wilton-Diamond-...
                                                              they're also available at target.

                                                              1. re: alkapal
                                                                LindaWhit Jun 9, 2009 09:45 AM

                                                                Oh, I can't use those silicone pans - nasty rubbery smell (and taste!) the first time I used one when they first started being sold. Turned me off them forever (kinda like I can't drink vodka and OJ after a it chose not to stay in my stomach after a high school party <g>).

                                                                I do have an antique square/diamond cupcake pan tho. But I don't make all that many cupcakes. :-)

                                                                1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                  alkapal Jun 10, 2009 05:54 AM

                                                                  ah, that's too bad. these wiltons don't have any discernible odor, to me. if you were on the vanguard of trying the "new" silicone baking containers, perhaps the products have been improved quite a bit since you tried them and got turned off. plus, i think wiltons is a premium brand.

                                                                  1. re: alkapal
                                                                    LindaWhit Jun 10, 2009 10:10 AM

                                                                    I know Wilton's a very good brand. And I'm sure they are better than they first were. But remembering that smell in the house just icks me out every time I contemplate buying another one.

                                                                    1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                      kattyeyes Jun 11, 2009 08:57 AM

                                                                      I discussed this yesterday at a local (trusted) kitchen store owner. She assured me Wilton's molds don't smell. She did say, like so many other products, quality of ingredients (or lack thereof) in the actual moldmaking could have yielded that smelly result you encountered back when. They had little standalone fluted cupcake molds (12 in a pack). Quite adorable--you'd just stand 'em on a tray to bake. Maybe when you see a shape that grabs you, you'll try again. ;)

                                                                      1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Jun 11, 2009 01:30 PM

                                                                        I was just given some of those standalone cupcake molds as a gift. I was a bit concerned, as I have a couple of other silicone pans (also a gift) that I don't particularly like - they don't smell bad or anything, I just don't like the way baked goods come out in them. But I read a piece from the NY Times from a while ago that said the cupcake molds are the most effective of the silicone pans. I'll see if I can find it.

                                                                        ETA: Here is the article. She doesn't discuss the cupcake molds in the article, but does list them in her recommended items. The article also states the issue that leads to smelly results like Linda's: pans manufactured with fillers, as opposed to pure silicone.


                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                          Ruth Lafler Jun 11, 2009 03:05 PM

                                                                          Speaking of cupcakes, that's another one for the list:

                                                                          US "cupcakes" are "fairy cakes" in the UK.

                                                                          1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                            LindaWhit Jun 11, 2009 03:47 PM

                                                                            Ahhh, interesting, Caitlin, on the use of fillers instead of pure silicone. Perhaps that's what they did early on in the manufacture of these things. I do admit I don't recall whether the silicone pans I bought years ago were made by Wilton - I can't recall the name. I just remember I got them at Sur la Table (which is a bit of a drive for me), and was ticked I had to drive there to return them.

                                                                            At this point - I have enough metal pans (inherited from Grandma and Mom gave me some), so I'm good.

                                                      2. re: JoanN
                                                        Caitlin McGrath Jun 8, 2009 02:06 PM

                                                        Interesting that you say this, Joan, as my reading of recipes has always shown white cakes to be made with egg whites only (the lack of yolks giving the white color), and yellow cakes made with either yolks only or whole eggs, depending on the recipe.

                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                          kattyeyes Jun 8, 2009 02:14 PM

                                                          Here's an explanation from Joy of Baking that's on the same page with you, Caitlin:

                                                          Have you or Joan ever made this particular cake, by chance?

                                                          1. re: kattyeyes
                                                            JoanN Jun 8, 2009 02:49 PM

                                                            Now I'm thoroughly confused. Just checked a bunch of recipes and you're right, Caitlin. All but one of the recipes for white cake uses whites only.

                                                            But the link you provided, kattyeyes, says what I did originally: "the difference is that a yellow cake contains just the egg yolks, whereas a white cake contains whole eggs."

                                                            Since I'm obviously not sure what I'm talking about, I'll now bow out of this discussion.

                                                            1. re: JoanN
                                                              Caitlin McGrath Jun 8, 2009 03:00 PM

                                                              Ha, Joan, I was on my way to say the same thing: "Since I'm obviously not sure what I'm talking about, I'll now bow out of this discussion", as I looked at a variety of recipes (on the web) for "white cake" and some used whites only, some whole eggs.

                                                              Oh dear, mass confusion and no real answers! Chocolate cake for everyone.

                                                              1. re: JoanN
                                                                kattyeyes Jun 8, 2009 03:02 PM

                                                                Sorry, Joan, I've contributed to the confusion, too. Here's the quote from Joy of Baking:

                                                                "Before we begin I should first explain the difference between a yellow and a white butter cake. If we put the mixing methods aside, we find that while the two batters both contain butter, sugar, eggs, flour and milk, the difference is that a yellow cake contains just the egg yolks, whereas a white cake contains whole eggs."

                                                                This is NOT what Caitlin stated--sorry for the confusion. I guess the concept as a whole is a bit confusing, given the variations between recipes.

                                                    2. s
                                                      smartie Jun 4, 2009 06:01 PM

                                                      US pigs in blankets - UK sausage rolls

                                                      16 Replies
                                                      1. re: smartie
                                                        Sam Fujisaka Jun 4, 2009 06:48 PM

                                                        Toad in the hole

                                                        1. re: Sam Fujisaka
                                                          Caitlin McGrath Jun 4, 2009 07:08 PM

                                                          Egg fried in the middle of a slice of bread with a hole cut out of it


                                                          Sausage baked in Yorkshire pudding

                                                          1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                            paulj Jun 4, 2009 08:54 PM

                                                            I can't think of a typical American dish that is similar to toad in the hole. I make it every now and then, but that based on book-learning. Never had it made by someone else.

                                                            Parkin is another uniquely British dish - it's a Yorkshire gingerbread, heavy in rolled oats and molasses.

                                                            1. re: paulj
                                                              greedygirl Jun 5, 2009 01:29 AM

                                                              I love toad in the hole, but rarely make it because my other half isn't keen. It's sausages and Yorkshire pudding (both of which he likes). What's not to like?

                                                              My mother used to make parkin a lot when we were kids - haven't had it for years.

                                                          2. re: Sam Fujisaka
                                                            Gooseberry Aug 12, 2009 11:38 AM

                                                            I get them confused; once called Toad in a Hole "Pig in a Shed". My family's kept that name, ever since.

                                                          3. re: smartie
                                                            greedygirl Jun 5, 2009 01:27 AM

                                                            Pigs in blankets here are chipolatas wrapped in streaky bacon - typically served as part of Christmas dinner with roast turkey etc.

                                                            1. re: greedygirl
                                                              Harters Jun 6, 2009 08:09 AM

                                                              As opposed to pigs in blankets that I had for breakfast in West Virginia - sausages wrapped in pancakes. In the UK, I've done them like this with Staffordshire oatcakes. Both a fab start to the day.

                                                              Mrs H is retiring at the end of September and has vowed to take up baking as a hobby - parkin is one of her favourite cakes so I'm looking forward to autumn on a number of levels.

                                                              1. re: Harters
                                                                greedygirl Jun 6, 2009 08:49 AM

                                                                Staffordshire oatcakes?

                                                                1. re: greedygirl
                                                                  Harters Jun 8, 2009 06:00 AM

                                                                  I think they should start marketing them as the Potteries Wrap


                                                                  Sprinkle with cheese, pop under the grill for a minute of so, wrap round sausage or bacon. Breakfast is served, ma'am.

                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                    Paulustrious Jun 8, 2009 08:53 AM

                                                                    Haven't had them for ages. I used to get them in Stoke. I like them with an egg. Here's a recipe I've used.


                                                            2. re: smartie
                                                              kattyeyes Jun 6, 2009 08:14 AM

                                                              Just to be sure we are on the same page in the US (as I think there are variations), I think of pigs in blankets as hot dogs wrapped in Pillsbury crescent dough. At parties, they're usually those little cocktail franks in something similar like crescent dough or maybe puff pastry.

                                                              1. re: smartie
                                                                nanette Jun 8, 2009 03:12 AM

                                                                I wouldn't say that pigs in blankets (US) are the same as sausage rolls (UK) as in the US they are frequently mini hotdogs wrapped in dough, where as a sausage roll is sausage meat cooked in puff pastry and then cut into pieces.

                                                                1. re: nanette
                                                                  smartie Jun 8, 2009 05:14 AM

                                                                  I would agree with you Nanette! I am not sure what you would call Pigs in Blankets in the UK and I have had them there.

                                                                  Any US equivalent to a Scotch Egg? A boiled egg centred in sausage meat and deep fried.

                                                                  1. re: smartie
                                                                    nanette Jun 8, 2009 07:49 AM

                                                                    I've not had them here, I think they might have "dog" in the title.

                                                                    I can't think of anything equal to a Scotch Egg. Good thing.

                                                                    1. re: smartie
                                                                      BobB Jun 8, 2009 07:52 AM

                                                                      No, on the rare occasions I've seen Scotch Eggs in the US, that's what they were called. I'm surprised we don't see more of them over here, it seems like something that would fit right in with Southern cuisine.

                                                                  2. re: smartie
                                                                    cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 04:01 AM

                                                                    Pigs in blankets are whole sausages in a pastry/croissant crust. Sausage rolls are chopped up sausage meat in flaky pastry. Not really the same and usually much nicer/

                                                                  3. s
                                                                    smartie Jun 4, 2009 04:49 PM

                                                                    we have not mentioned the confusing names for meal times
                                                                    usa breakfast lunch and dinner

                                                                    UK - breakfast self explanatory although a cooked breakfast usually means a fry up of bacon sausage, eggs, beans, toast etc etc
                                                                    lunch can also be called dinner - school dinners are school lunches, it also depends on your class and where you originate.
                                                                    tea - this can mean 4pm cup of tea, sandwiches, cakes, biscuits, scones OR
                                                                    it can mean your dinner (never lunch though) again class and geography dependent
                                                                    supper - this is dinner or supper or a very late snack
                                                                    dinner - either lunch or dinner.

                                                                    1 Reply
                                                                    1. re: smartie
                                                                      Caitlin McGrath Jun 4, 2009 05:32 PM

                                                                      Discussion of meal names above starts here: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/6150...

                                                                      As you will see, the US versions aren't so cut and dried, either.

                                                                    2. s
                                                                      smartie Jun 3, 2009 04:30 AM

                                                                      I thought of another difference - the word salad!

                                                                      an egg sandwich in the Uk is called egg mayonnaise not egg salad, ditto for tuna, brits would say a tuna mayo sandwich (it usually has sweetcorn in it). Brits do not say egg salad or tuna salad and expect it to be mixed with mayo. If you ask for a tuna salad in the UK you would get a green salad with tomatoes cucumbers etc with a can of tuna on it, an egg salad would be a green salad etc with slice eggs on it.

                                                                      4 Replies
                                                                      1. re: smartie
                                                                        Harters Jun 3, 2009 09:04 AM

                                                                        I recall ordering a chicken salad in North Carolina on our last trip - it turned out to be a deeply unpleasant surprise of gloop on a plate - not at all the nice crisp leaves and piece of chicken I was expecting

                                                                        1. re: Harters
                                                                          smartie Jun 3, 2009 03:01 PM

                                                                          yep Harters, in the UK a chicken salad has leaves salad vegetables and pieces of chicken on it. Here in the US you get bits of chicken mixed with mayo.

                                                                          I have lived in the US for a few years now and still confuse myself and others with food terminology and expectations.

                                                                        2. re: smartie
                                                                          Paulustrious Jun 4, 2009 06:04 AM

                                                                          But oddly, potato salad is mayonnated.

                                                                          1. re: smartie
                                                                            cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 04:00 AM

                                                                            In the UK, I wouldn't expect an egg sandwich to have mayonnaise in it. That would just be sliced egg, probably with just pepper and salt. Or egg and tomato, or egg and onion possibly. The mayo would have to be requested.

                                                                          2. Paulustrious Jun 2, 2009 12:46 PM

                                                                            Clams vs cockles ( not precisely, but close enough if clams is not prefixed.)

                                                                            Shark vs Rock salmon, Huss

                                                                            Dover sole vs Dover sole - not the same fish at at all (cf. robin)

                                                                            Fluke (?) vs flounder

                                                                            Periwinkles vs winkles

                                                                            Vindaloo. In NA it is primarily a flavour rather than a 'temperature'.

                                                                            Vancouver crab (Toronto and maybe elsewhere) vs Dungeness crab

                                                                            20 Replies
                                                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                              Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 01:03 PM

                                                                              On the west coast of the US, and I'd venture to guess in Vancouver (the Pacific coast down to the Monterey Bay is its harvesting ground), it's known as Dungenses crab.

                                                                              1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                MMRuth Jun 2, 2009 01:09 PM

                                                                                Is there a similar crab in the U.K. though? I seem to remember some references to certain types of crab in the David books.

                                                                                1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                  Harters Jun 2, 2009 02:08 PM

                                                                                  Crab is usually just sold as "crab". Although there may a cachet attached to certain ports where it's landed - such as Cromer, in Norfolk.

                                                                                  I have to say, one of the joys of an English summer is to sit outside a seaside pub eating a crab sandwich for lunch and watching the world pass by. Thick white bread, but not too thick, a generous buttering and a good thickness of crab with nothing more than a squeeze of lemon and a grind of pepper. By comparison, you can keep your Michelin starred places.

                                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                                    MMRuth Jun 2, 2009 02:09 PM

                                                                                    By the way - have you seen that the COTM is three of E. David's books?

                                                                                  2. re: MMRuth
                                                                                    Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 02:28 PM

                                                                                    I have no idea! Only Paulustrious can clarify, but I just assumed he was lining up North American vs. UK on the Dungeness front, as with the other.

                                                                                    1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                      Paulustrious Jun 2, 2009 02:48 PM

                                                                                      That was me being ignorant. Sorry, not my intention. It is known as Vancouver crab in many places in Toronto. I am ignorant of the rest of NA.

                                                                                      Dungeness is in the UK, but the one the crab is named after is Dungess in Washington. I had assumed it was the same big red crab we get off the coast of the UK. I was wrong.

                                                                                      Next time I will check with The Great Google.

                                                                                2. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                  thew Jun 2, 2009 01:55 PM

                                                                                  can you explain this vindaloo temperature thing? i'm not following

                                                                                  also fluke is specifically summer flounder i believe

                                                                                  1. re: thew
                                                                                    BobB Jun 2, 2009 01:59 PM

                                                                                    Yeah, I wouldn't say temperature either. Vindaloo on either side of the pond is one of the spiciest dishes on an Indian menu, but in the UK it's generally prepared a LOT hotter (as in chile-hot) than it is here. Here I order vindaloo and have to ask for it extra hot - over there I usually just order Madras, which is one level down in heat, and it's still hotter than most US vindaloos.

                                                                                    1. re: thew
                                                                                      Paulustrious Jun 2, 2009 02:57 PM

                                                                                      In the UK there is very much a 'heat' associated with a curry type. In ascending order of fierceness it goes...

                                                                                      Madras, Vindaloo, Tinderloo, and/or Phal

                                                                                      In reality these should be associated with flavours. So if I have a vindaloo in Toronto it does not necessarily blow my head off. The UK one would give me hiccups after the first couple of mouthfuls. At one time (maybe even now) you could order a vindaloo Rogan Josh, meaning a rogan josh spiced up to seriously hot.

                                                                                      Sorry about the fluke-flounder thing. Once again the Chow police have battered me into submission with a promise to do better next time.

                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                        paulj Jun 2, 2009 04:19 PM

                                                                                        According to my first Indian cookbook (an old Penguin paperback, 1970, UK), vinegar is the defining ingredient in a Vindaloo. 'The quantity of red pepper is a matter of discretion."

                                                                                        1. re: paulj
                                                                                          thew Jun 3, 2009 06:34 AM

                                                                                          from my time in india - vindaloo in india, as in here (NYC) is a specific type of "curry" (yeah i know but it's convenient) based on vinegar, AND is the hottest "curry" - the sourness is a Goan preference, and the heat came when the portuguese introduced the chili pepper to india.

                                                                                          Here, as in india, to order a vindaloo rogan josh would make no sense, as they are two completely different dishes, it would be like ordering a lasagna fried fish.

                                                                                          Phaal is a british dish, not heard of in india, and as of yet i have not had a phaal i liked - all heat and zero taste. I like it hot like that, but it must taste good too.

                                                                                          tinderloo? that i've never heard of.

                                                                                          1. re: thew
                                                                                            Paulustrious Jun 3, 2009 08:26 AM

                                                                                            I had. Just did a google. Not many hits even allowing for spelling variants.

                                                                                            LOL...My new spell-checker just objected to google - it suggested: Go ogle.

                                                                                            How amazingly appropriate.

                                                                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                              waytob Jun 8, 2009 07:05 AM

                                                                                              Similar to the British use of the word "chutney' for any kind of stewed savoury pickle. You will never be served a sweet mango 'chutney' in India, chutney refers to a very specific kind of condiment. The equivalent of British chutneys are probably the sweet mango 'chhundo' or the like

                                                                                              1. re: waytob
                                                                                                thew Jun 8, 2009 07:20 AM

                                                                                                really? i seem to recall sweet mango chutney in india, but maybe i'm mistaken

                                                                                                1. re: waytob
                                                                                                  JoanN Jun 8, 2009 07:56 AM

                                                                                                  "You will never be served a sweet mango 'chutney' in India"

                                                                                                  I've never been to India, but there are certainly plenty of mango chutney recipes from authoritative Indian sources. Here are the ingredients in a mango chutney from Madhur Jaffrey's "World Vegetarian" that I made once and it was definitely sweet, although spicy as well.

                                                                                                  2 Large green mangoes
                                                                                                  2tsps salt
                                                                                                  2-4 cloves garlic, peeled
                                                                                                  1 inch fresh ginger, chopped
                                                                                                  12 floz cider vinegar or distilled white vinegar
                                                                                                  14 oz granulated sugar
                                                                                                  4 tbsp golden sultanas
                                                                                                  half tsp ground turmeric
                                                                                                  1 tsp cayenne pepper

                                                                                                  According to Julie Sahni, preserved relishes, especially those made with fruits, often contain expensive ingredients so are reserved for special occasions such as wedding banquets. Perhaps a chutney such as this one just wouldn't be served at an everyday meal.

                                                                                                  1. re: waytob
                                                                                                    Harters Jun 8, 2009 01:26 PM

                                                                                                    "Similar to the British use of the word "chutney' for any kind of stewed savoury pickle."

                                                                                                    I always work to the premise that a chutney is a preserve with no identifiable pieces. Otherwise it's a pickle.

                                                                                                    Except that our best known commercial brand, Sharwoods, has some very nice big pieces in its mango chutney.

                                                                                                    I currently have three home-made chutnies - beetroot (still the 2006 vintage), mango and plum. And pickled onions.

                                                                                                    1. re: Harters
                                                                                                      waytob Jun 9, 2009 12:08 AM

                                                                                                      Chutney has evolved the same way as Chicken tikka masala...it is not an Indian original, however due to popularity has become part of "Indian cooking"
                                                                                                      We have acchar in India and sweet pickles have unique names -

                                                                                                      katki keri - made from extremely finely diced green mango soaked in a sugar syrup (chaansni)) with chilli powder and spices
                                                                                                      Chhundo - grated green mango again in a sugar syrup, with vinegar and spices
                                                                                                      Limbu achhar - lemon quarters with sugar and spices to make a sweet/sour pickle

                                                                                                      Chutney is generally liquidy or a thick paste, but rarely will have whole fruit pieces in it

                                                                                                      1. re: waytob
                                                                                                        Paulustrious Jun 9, 2009 10:33 AM

                                                                                                        Chutney apparently derives from Hindi chatni and this is one site's spin on it which backs up your post.


                                                                                                        But the word in the UK came to mean chunks of stuff in a spiced 'sour' sauce, whether sweet or savoury, vegetable or fruit. Possibly the most famous, Branston Pickle, doesn't use the word chutney.

                                                                                                        As a kid I used to read the labels of everything I ate. Niacin, thiamine and so on I remember that Branston had this magic secret ingredient rutabaga that I had never seen. I had no idea what part it played in the pickle. It was many years later that I realised it was swede and that they were just trying to make the relish more esoteric.

                                                                                                        Now what makes a relish different (or the same) as a chutney? Is a relish more finely minced? I've never seen Gentlemen's Relish West of the Atlantic.

                                                                                                      2. re: Harters
                                                                                                        buttertart Jun 9, 2009 06:38 AM

                                                                                                        Harters, would love a recipe for beet(root) chutney, perhaps you could post on Home Cooking? Beet lover here.

                                                                                          2. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                            Atahualpa Aug 10, 2009 07:33 AM

                                                                                            I'm in Toronto and I've never encounter "Vancouver Crab". Go down to the St. Lawrence Market and it is all Dungeness.

                                                                                          3. Peg Jun 2, 2009 12:01 PM

                                                                                            UK - brown bread.
                                                                                            US - wheat bread?

                                                                                            UK - white coffee.
                                                                                            US - not sure, but I don't think it's called 'white'... coffee with cream maybe - but is coffee really served with cream, or is it milk?

                                                                                            17 Replies
                                                                                            1. re: Peg
                                                                                              Ruth Lafler Jun 2, 2009 12:25 PM

                                                                                              Brown bread in the US would be "whole wheat" bread. And yes, it would be "coffee with cream" -- I think most people who drink coffee use half-and-half which is fairly close to what the UK would be "table cream" (I think there was an earlier post on the variations on cream).

                                                                                              In the same vein as "corn/sweetcorn":

                                                                                              "beets/beetroot" -- in the US when you refer to eating "beets" that always means the beetroot. If it were the greens, that would be specified.

                                                                                              "pickles/cucumber pickles" -- as a huge pickle lover it drives my Dad crazy, but in the US "a pickle" is always a cucumber pickle of some kind. In the UK the type of pickle is specified, and the type of sour pickles you would find on the shelf in every grocery store in the US are hard to find.

                                                                                              1. re: Peg
                                                                                                JoanN Jun 2, 2009 02:40 PM

                                                                                                It may be a New Yawk thing, but here the equivalent of "white coffee" is "regular." No idea why white coffee is "regular" while black coffee Is "black," but it is. If you order "regular" coffee, more often than not you'll get coffee with whole milk. If you want cream, half-and-half, or skim you need to specify.

                                                                                                1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                  Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 03:26 PM

                                                                                                  It's definitely a New York thing. Visitors from other areas get a rude awakening when they get coffee from, e.g. a deli (as opposed to a "coffeehouse," Starbucks, etc. where you add your own) and don't specify black. I think nowadays "regular"="white coffee," at least it seemed that way when I lived in NYC, but my mother, who grew up there, says that back then regular meant both milk and sugar.

                                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                    MMRuth Jun 2, 2009 03:33 PM

                                                                                                    My understanding is that regular means both milk and sugar. I'll ask next time I'm in a deli!

                                                                                                    1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                      alanbarnes Jun 2, 2009 03:47 PM

                                                                                                      In Boston, regular definitely means milk and sugar.

                                                                                                    2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                      JoanN Jun 2, 2009 03:48 PM

                                                                                                      I've lived in the city for more than 40 years, and now that you mention it, Caitlin, I do indeed have a vague recollection of "regular" meaning both milk and sugar. I'm just guessing, but I'll bet that the whole problem of how much sugar and what kind (especially once the substitutes started to become popular) was just more trouble than it was worth and so, with the sugar selections always on the table or packets tossed into a takeaway bag, "regular" came to mean with milk. The sweetener was do it yourself or not as you pleased.

                                                                                                      I'll be curious to hear what your deli folk say, MMRuth. And make sure to note how old the person is that you ask. ;-)

                                                                                                      1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 04:04 PM

                                                                                                        Now that I think about it, I think people just specify if they want something other than whole milk + one sugar, as you note with black and other types of dairy. I do remember hearing people say, e.g., two sugars, so they prob. do the same with other sweeteners, along with saying ifthey want it "light" (lots of milk). Can you tell I never ordered coffee at a deli or corner bakery?

                                                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                          kattyeyes Jun 2, 2009 06:14 PM

                                                                                                          You got it--whenever I go to Dunkin' Donuts, my exact order is:

                                                                                                          small, decaf, hazelnut, light, two sugars, please!

                                                                                                          I refer to it as a hot coffee shake. It is megatasty! My mom and two of my closest buddies like it just the way I do, too.

                                                                                                          1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                            Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 07:17 PM

                                                                                                            So is a "regular" coffee milk and one sugar in your neck of the woods, ke? Perhaps a northeastern thing rather than a NY thing?

                                                                                                            1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                              kattyeyes Jun 2, 2009 07:23 PM

                                                                                                              Almost! CREAM and one sugar = regular.

                                                                                                              If you want milk instead of cream, you'd have to ask for it specifically.

                                                                                                              Some folks also ask for coffee "light and sweet" but that is sweeter than two sugars and too sweet for me.

                                                                                                              1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 08:07 PM

                                                                                                                This taxonomy is getting almost as fine as the names for rolls Harters posted about above! [grin]

                                                                                                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                  mogo Jun 2, 2009 09:46 PM

                                                                                                                  'Round here (Toronto, possibly Canada-wide) "double-double" is what you'd say for coffee with two cream, two sugar. I think this is the most popular option as the term is so widespread -- say double-double and everyone knows you're talking about coffee, but single-double or double-single (etc) is not so entrenched in the vocabulary.

                                                                                                                  1. re: mogo
                                                                                                                    kattyeyes Jun 3, 2009 06:08 AM

                                                                                                                    That's funny. When you say "double-double" it reminds me of a popular McDonald's commercial from my growing up years: "Double-double cheese-cheese burger-burger, please!"

                                                                                                                    Anything double around here would be espresso-related.

                                                                                                                  2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                    Harters Jun 3, 2009 08:54 AM

                                                                                                                    Particularly, Caitlin, as "regular" in this sense, is not a word in, erm, regular use in the UK - except for those places which are American influenced or owned, such as Starbucks or its lookalikes.

                                                                                                                    And then "regular" means "small", as opposed to whatever contrived name they've invented to replace "medium" and "large" :-(

                                                                                                                    Go into almost anywhere, other than these sort of chains, and ask for a coffee, you'll get white (with milk).

                                                                                                                    1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                      kattyeyes Jun 3, 2009 08:59 AM

                                                                                                                      <<And then "regular" means "small", as opposed to whatever contrived name they've invented to replace "medium" and "large">>

                                                                                                                      Yup, sometimes it's that way here, too. And I'm with you on why can't we just have small-medium-large. So much simpler.

                                                                                                                      So the "white" in UK is always cream, not milk? I'd say here in the US it's the opposite.

                                                                                                                      1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                        greedygirl Jun 3, 2009 09:08 AM

                                                                                                                        White coffee is always with milk. You don't get coffee with cream that much any more. And it's always single cream, which is roughly equivalent to half-and-half in the US.

                                                                                                                      2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Jun 3, 2009 10:53 AM

                                                                                                                        So, while you don't have "regular" coffee in the Northeastern sense, it's the same thing: if you don't specify otherwise, it comes with milk (though maybe not sugar, as we've discovered here "regular" coffee means in NY and Connecticut). I think it's less so in NY now, but time was, if you just ordered coffee at a non-coffee house type place, you automatically got "regular."

                                                                                                    3. Caitlin McGrath Jun 1, 2009 08:30 PM

                                                                                                      Here is another:

                                                                                                      US corn vs. UK sweetcorn

                                                                                                      In general parlance in the US, if you say corn, it's assumed it's assumed you mean sweet (eating) corn; for feed corn, one would say field corn. Is this latter what's called maize in the UK, or am I missing other shadings of corn there?

                                                                                                      17 Replies
                                                                                                      1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                        kattyeyes Jun 1, 2009 08:40 PM

                                                                                                        Hmmm--whenever we get corn on the cob that isn't as good as we think it should be, my mom calls it cow corn!

                                                                                                        1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                          Caitlin McGrath Jun 1, 2009 08:58 PM

                                                                                                          Field corn, cow corn, clearly alternate names for same meaning!

                                                                                                        2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                          alanbarnes Jun 1, 2009 08:40 PM

                                                                                                          Hmmm, in my experience (influenced by growing up in the Southwestern US), "corn" refers to what the rest of the world knows as maize. It can be sweet corn or field corn. Corn tortillas, blue corn, etc. all refer to field corn. Corn on the cob implies sweet corn unless you're in a predominately Hispanic area. Popcorn gets its own special designation.

                                                                                                          How are these things differentiated in the UK?

                                                                                                          1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                            Caitlin McGrath Jun 1, 2009 09:05 PM

                                                                                                            Well, I'd qualify that in the US we say "corn tortillas" (distinguishes corn from flour), "blue corn" (distinguishes "blue" variety), etc., but what I was getting at was that in the US when we refer to corn the vegetable, it means sweet corn (in US culture at large, vs., as you say, Hispanic area; see katteyes' post above). Corn as vegetable in particular is the corn vs. sweetcorn distinction above.

                                                                                                            1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                              alanbarnes Jun 1, 2009 09:31 PM

                                                                                                              I agree that when you serve corn as a vegetable in the US, it's implicit that it's sweet corn. But the vast majority of the corn grown here isn't served as a stand-alone vegetable.

                                                                                                              Most corn is not consumed directly by humans. It's used for animal feed, ethanol production, or the manufacture of food-like substances (eg High Fructose Corn Syrup). But of the rest, most is ground into flour. Think cornbread, polenta, tortillas, etc. And all cornmeal is made from field corn.

                                                                                                              So while I agree with you that "corn" can imply "sweet corn" when describing a dish, that's like saying that "wheat" implies bulgur. Fact is, people eat a lot of corn in the US. And only a tiny portion of it is sweet corn.

                                                                                                              1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                Caitlin McGrath Jun 2, 2009 10:48 AM

                                                                                                                Sure. My contention, though, is that when people in the US say "corn," they mean sweet corn. When they are talking about the products made from corn that they eat, they don't call them "corn," they say cornmeal, masa, polenta, grits, etc.

                                                                                                                So I don't think it's the same as saying wheat implies bulgur, because people do not talk about eating "wheat" when they're talking about eating specific wheaten foods. They might mention wheat flour, wheat berries, bulgur, etc., just as they use modifiers or other names when talking about those corn products. When people in the US just say they're eating or cooking with corn, they do mean corn as vegetable, don't they? Otherwise, they'll say they're using cornmeal or eating corn tortillas or whatever.

                                                                                                                The UK term "sweetcorn" is more specific because it differentiates, but seems to be equivalent to what we mean in the US when we just say corn, in a dining context.

                                                                                                                1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                  Paulustrious Jun 2, 2009 12:20 PM

                                                                                                                  >> Fact is, people eat a lot of corn in the US. And only a tiny portion of it is sweet corn. <<

                                                                                                                  In fact Americans eat most corn in the form of corn syrup. (That's a total guess, but it stands a reasonable chance of being true)

                                                                                                              2. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 10:10 AM

                                                                                                                Well I'm not sure about all that - but not only do they call their regular "corn" - "sweetcorn"...but they also call "baby-corn" sweet corn!

                                                                                                                I remember sharing a Chinese meal with my in-laws(English) - and they kept referring to the baby corn as "sweet corn"!
                                                                                                                At first I thought it was a family quirk - but nope - it's an English thing!

                                                                                                                1. re: NellyNel
                                                                                                                  Harters Jun 12, 2009 10:46 AM

                                                                                                                  "I thought it was a family quirk - but nope - it's an English thing!"

                                                                                                                  Nope - I think it's a family quirk.

                                                                                                                  Baby corn, such as you get in Chinese cooking, is baby corn.

                                                                                                                  Sells in the supermarkets usually in 250g packs (sometimes half and half with mangetout) - looking online my usual supermarket, Sainsbury, has it at £1.52 a pack.

                                                                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                    Caitlin McGrath Jun 12, 2009 04:18 PM

                                                                                                                    How interesting. One really doesn't see fresh baby corn in supermarkets in the US, only canned (tinned).

                                                                                                                    1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                      Paulustrious Jun 13, 2009 05:06 AM

                                                                                                                      In my ex-part of the UK, although things came in a tin they were still canned. Possibly a hangover from tinning being the process of applying tin to the cans.

                                                                                                                      1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                        Harters Jun 13, 2009 07:06 AM

                                                                                                                        Equally interesting that you don't generally have fresh which, as you'll appreciate, is a much better texture than tinned (which we also have).

                                                                                                                        Looking online, the major crop comes from the Punjab and is supplied by Bharti - Del Monte. Seems they supply all of our major supermarkets. I know we import a lot of that sort of crop from kenya and surrounding countries.

                                                                                                                        1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                          Caitlin McGrath Jun 13, 2009 04:00 PM

                                                                                                                          Absolutely, I'd imagine, though I don't believe I've ever had fresh. Were fresh available here generally, or used even by restaurants, baby corn would no doubt not be loathed as it is by so many people. I'm going to bet it's simply not in enough demand to be produced domestically or from our major suppliers of imported produce, which are various Latin American countries.

                                                                                                                          1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                            Harters Jun 14, 2009 09:26 AM

                                                                                                                            "Were fresh available here generally, or used even by restaurants, baby corn would no doubt not be loathed as it is by so many people."

                                                                                                                            Don't be so sure. :-)

                                                                                                                            I find it a bland, boring and almost entirely pointless veg - one that really only adds texture in a stirfry.

                                                                                                                          2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                            Sam Fujisaka Jun 14, 2009 06:49 AM

                                                                                                                            Thailand, Taiwan, and China are the biggest producers of baby corn. Other baby corn producers include: Sri Lanka, Indonesia, India, Zambia, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Guatemala, Nicaragua - and others.

                                                                                                                            1. re: Sam Fujisaka
                                                                                                                              rds246 Aug 10, 2009 02:39 PM

                                                                                                                              There is one farmer at my farmers market that sells baby corn (seasonally of course). I'm in Southern California.

                                                                                                                              1. re: Sam Fujisaka
                                                                                                                                Gooseberry Aug 12, 2009 11:32 AM

                                                                                                                                We may produce it, but I still don't know why we eat -or pay a fortune for -it, Sam. I find it sort of bland, nothing like an ear of corn.

                                                                                                                  2. greedygirl May 31, 2009 10:55 AM

                                                                                                                    Here's another one inspired by another thread!

                                                                                                                    Grill (US) vs barbecue (UK)

                                                                                                                    12 Replies
                                                                                                                    1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                      MMRuth May 31, 2009 10:58 AM

                                                                                                                      Yes - my sense is that in the UK, barbecue just means to cook things outdoors on the grill, whereas in the U.S., "BBQ" means specific types of cooking - ribs, pulled pork, etc.

                                                                                                                      1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                        LindaWhit May 31, 2009 12:57 PM

                                                                                                                        Although in the U.S., "BBQ" has also come to mean just grilling as well. Much to the ire of true barbecuers. :-)

                                                                                                                        1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                          paulj May 31, 2009 02:16 PM

                                                                                                                          I think that in many parts of the US, BBQ was the same as grilling, just as it is in the UK and Australia. But in the past 20 years or so, fans of the 'true', slow cooked, smoked style (whether Texas, KC, Memphis or Carolina) have fought to (re)define it to fit their orthodoxy. Without the influence of the BBQ competition circuit, Food Network, and retailers of smoking equipment, most Americans would still equate BBQ with burgers on the backyard grill.

                                                                                                                          Santa Maria BBQ is an example of a style that is closer to grilling than the Southern closed cooker smoking. As a cooking method it owes more to California Spanish/Mexican influences than anything from the South. It probably will resist any efforts to change the name fit the new orthodoxy.

                                                                                                                          1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                            Harters May 31, 2009 02:31 PM

                                                                                                                            Not "just" the process. It is the equipment as well. And an event.

                                                                                                                            It goes like this invitation. "Would you like to come to lunch on Saturday? We're having a barbeque. I'll be barbecuing some lamb chops and sausages on the barbecue".

                                                                                                                            A "grill" is something in the kitchen - with overhead heat - usually above the oven ( a salamander in the restaurant trade, in the UK and, I think, in the US as well). I "grilled" bacon on the "grill" for breakfast this morning.

                                                                                                                            1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                              LindaWhit May 31, 2009 03:15 PM

                                                                                                                              As to that "indoor grill" of yours - for household use, we in the U.S. call that the "broiler"....ours is most often within the oven itself for electric ovens and for gas oven, a separate compartment located below the oven. It's just a different knob setting to have the upper coils to be used in an electric oven for heat vs. the ones on the floor of the oven. I haven't had a gas oven for years and years :::::Waaahhhhh!:::::: so I honestly can't remember if there's a separate knob for the broiler. I don't think so.

                                                                                                                              1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                Harters May 31, 2009 03:26 PM

                                                                                                                                Ah, that's it - "broiler". I knew I knew the American word!

                                                                                                                                I cook on electric and UK ovens come as "single ovens" , which also has a grill/broiler, or "double ovens". We've a double oven - the main fan-assisted oven is just an oven, above that, there's a small conventional oven that can be switched to grill/broiler. We mainly use the small oven just as a grill, but it's sometimes handy to work with two ovens, if you're cooking things that need different temperatures.

                                                                                                                                1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                  LindaWhit May 31, 2009 04:15 PM

                                                                                                                                  I would LOVE the two ovens, Harters! I do have a small convection/toaster oven that helps when I need different temps, but it's not like having two separate ovens.

                                                                                                                                  ::::Sigh:::: Someday.

                                                                                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                    Caitlin McGrath May 31, 2009 07:41 PM

                                                                                                                                    In the broil vs. grill discussion above, Paulustrious posted a link showing examples of ranges ("cookers" in UK parlance) with the double oven/grill: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/6150...

                                                                                                                                    Better gas ovens have a broiler feature in the top of the oven, so you can effectively adjust the rack's distance from the heat (I haven't had the privelege of using one). And some higher-end ranges now have infrared broilers built in.

                                                                                                                                  2. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                    paulj May 31, 2009 03:33 PM

                                                                                                                                    In that common US usage, broiler supplies radiant heat from above (or possibly from side). Grill heats from below. In this usage, a grill cooks with a combination of contact (from the hot metal support grill), hot gases, and radiation.

                                                                                                                                    In broiling in that sense is a modern derivative of roasting meat before an open fire, whether on a rack or spit. Grilling is more akin to cooking over hot coals.

                                                                                                                                    Southern US BBQ (usually) uses indirect heat, no radiation, and smoky gases no hotter than the boiling point of water.

                                                                                                                              2. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 09:50 AM

                                                                                                                                I was just going to add
                                                                                                                                Grill (UK) VS Broil

                                                                                                                                In the Uk they don't use broiled the way we do
                                                                                                                                For instance in the UK Burger Kings ads say : "Flame Grilled" NOT "Flame Broiled"

                                                                                                                                1. re: NellyNel
                                                                                                                                  Harters Jun 12, 2009 10:34 AM

                                                                                                                                  In fact, we don't use "broil" at all.

                                                                                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                    NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 10:48 AM

                                                                                                                                    I wasn't sure about that.

                                                                                                                                    I know it drives my DH crazy (English) when I say I'm going to pop something into the "broiler"!

                                                                                                                                    In England that part of the oven is called the "Grill"!

                                                                                                                                    Oh - I just remembered another one!
                                                                                                                                    An ice cream sandwich is a "choc ice" !!

                                                                                                                              3. s
                                                                                                                                smartie May 30, 2009 07:10 AM

                                                                                                                                for British Jews v American Jews

                                                                                                                                smoked salmon v lox or nova
                                                                                                                                salt beef v corned beef
                                                                                                                                lockshen pudding v noodle kugel, brits don't make it dairy but always parev
                                                                                                                                beigel v bagel - although Brits mostly now call them bagels
                                                                                                                                there are no bialys in the UK but you can get platzels though not the same

                                                                                                                                Gefilte fish, whilst Brits do make boiled gefilte fish, it is more common (and nicer) to buy or make it fried. Americans have never heard of it.

                                                                                                                                there must be other differences but I can't think of any more.

                                                                                                                                7 Replies
                                                                                                                                1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                  thew May 30, 2009 07:16 AM

                                                                                                                                  we say smoked salmon in the US

                                                                                                                                  also lox isn't smoked.

                                                                                                                                  1. re: thew
                                                                                                                                    smartie May 30, 2009 11:19 AM

                                                                                                                                    Lox and nova are not terms used in the UK

                                                                                                                                    1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                      thew May 30, 2009 02:06 PM

                                                                                                                                      but smoked salmon is a phrase used in the USA.

                                                                                                                                      and lox still isn't smoked ;)

                                                                                                                                  2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                    JoanN May 30, 2009 07:32 AM

                                                                                                                                    A friend from London seems to use the term "salt beef" to refer to both corned beef and pastrami. Or, perhaps I'm just misunderstanding what he's asking for. Is pastrami called something else in the UK?

                                                                                                                                    1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                      Harters May 30, 2009 02:16 PM


                                                                                                                                      No - pastrami is pastrami. And I think it's the same as I've had in the States

                                                                                                                                      But, just to confuse matters further, I think "salt beef" is what we'd call the product Americans call "corned beef". Something similarish in texture/taste to pastrami. I'm referring to what I would call "Jewish salt beef", as opposed to "Irish salt beef", which to me, seems very different.

                                                                                                                                      In the UK, "corned beef" is a tinned/canned product, which is nothing like pastrami or salt beef (either sort) Still makes a fine sandwich with lots of Colmans mustard - or hash (to be slathered in brown sauce)

                                                                                                                                      1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                        JoanN May 30, 2009 03:36 PM

                                                                                                                                        Okay. Got it. Thanks, Harters. So when my friend says he wants a salt beef sandwich, he's not talking generically. He specifically wants what we'd call corned beef. And if he wanted pastrami he'd say so. (Although I must say, the last time we had this conversation he didn't seem to be all that sure what pastrami was. But then, although he now lives in London, he's a Scot. And maybe that makes a difference.)

                                                                                                                                    2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                      BobB May 30, 2009 10:12 AM

                                                                                                                                      This fourth-generation American Jew grew up on lockshen kugel, never noodle kugel. It was made dairy, though, and usually served at a fish & dairy-based brunch.

                                                                                                                                    3. Paulustrious May 30, 2009 06:24 AM

                                                                                                                                      Ground beef - Mince and sometimes mincemeat
                                                                                                                                      Ground pork - Mince(d) pork

                                                                                                                                      Then we have the whole UK confusion of mincemeat also being the sweet diced fruit / suet blend. The word mince usually means savoury except in terms of mince pies which usually means either sweet pies or your eyes. Unless it says mince pie and potato. Oh, I give up. It's a context thing.

                                                                                                                                      And I still cannot get used to the North American pronunciation of tuna. (UK = tchew-nar, NA = two-nuh, Boston = different)

                                                                                                                                      5 Replies
                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                        Peg Jun 2, 2009 12:03 PM

                                                                                                                                        I'm UK and I say 't-yoo-nah', or 'toon-ah'.

                                                                                                                                        1. re: Peg
                                                                                                                                          Paulustrious Jun 2, 2009 12:17 PM

                                                                                                                                          The U sound varies throughout the UK, in words like Tuesday, news etc. Your t-yoo and my tchew are very close. I was just trying to find a phoenetic equivalent. (Phonetic in the US)

                                                                                                                                          1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                            Harters Jun 2, 2009 01:59 PM

                                                                                                                                            I've just listened to myself speaking aloud - yes, it's a very sad life I lead on this Tchewsday evening.

                                                                                                                                            Then we have the word "stew", which I pronounce "stchew"

                                                                                                                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                              kattyeyes Jun 2, 2009 02:50 PM

                                                                                                                                              I have friends who have Polish-speaking parents who do the same pronunciation (nyoo) of both "new" and "avenue"...so is it a European-based thing (not specifically UK)? I also know a native NYer who says these words the same way.

                                                                                                                                              1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 03:54 AM

                                                                                                                                                My aunt from Yorkshire used to say tooner for tuna! Why I don't know!

                                                                                                                                          2. s
                                                                                                                                            smartie May 27, 2009 02:45 PM

                                                                                                                                            whilst the Brits all use ketchup we also call it red sauce to differentiate it from brown sauce which is HP or OK sauce. In America red sauce means tomato sauce for pasta.

                                                                                                                                            I also have not heard Americans use the term spaghetti bolognese.

                                                                                                                                            American lasagne seems to usually have ricotta cheese in it but the Brits would never or rarely use that.

                                                                                                                                            Home fries do not exist in the UK, they would be called fried or sauteed potatoes.

                                                                                                                                            14 Replies
                                                                                                                                            1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                              kattyeyes May 27, 2009 05:30 PM

                                                                                                                                              In my house (US), sauce means tomato sauce for pasta by default. "Making a pot of sauce" is what my family always said and still do. It baffled me when I moved in with someone and announced I felt like making a pot of sauce and was asked, "What KIND of sauce?"...as if there was any other kind of sauce than what I was talking about. It's an Italian thing, I guess--unless you are the type of Italian who calls sauce "gravy." In my family, gravy is an accompaniment for turkey or meatloaf. I am an all-American mutt, too watered down to claim much more than a quarter of any particular heritage, maybe that's part of the issue.

                                                                                                                                              1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                BobB May 28, 2009 07:46 AM

                                                                                                                                                The term spaghetti bolognese is fairly common in the US, though not as universal as in the UK. And in both places it all-too-rarely means true bolognese, it usually just means tomato sauce with some ground meat added.

                                                                                                                                                1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                  Harters May 28, 2009 08:42 AM

                                                                                                                                                  I doubt if anyone from Bologna would recognise the spag bol we generally cook in Britain as being "their" ragu.

                                                                                                                                                2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                  nanette Jun 8, 2009 03:05 AM

                                                                                                                                                  I think the difference with lasgana in the UK is that they use a white sauce rather than red sauce, not that there isn't any ricotta. As far as I understand, this a Northern Italian v. Southern Italian thing.

                                                                                                                                                  1. re: nanette
                                                                                                                                                    NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 09:47 AM

                                                                                                                                                    I lived in England for 6 years and lasagna was always served with red sauce...but def. not ricotta. My area did have a large Italian population though, so perhaps that's why. (?)

                                                                                                                                                    1. re: NellyNel
                                                                                                                                                      guster4lovers Jul 12, 2010 10:55 PM

                                                                                                                                                      The US version uses a red sauce with mozzarella and ricotta. I believe it's the southern Italian version (although I could be mixed up).

                                                                                                                                                      UK lasagne is usually made with red sauce (similar to a bolognese) and a bechemel. That's the northern Italian way.

                                                                                                                                                      1. re: guster4lovers
                                                                                                                                                        alkapal Jul 13, 2010 05:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                        no cheese in uk lasagne? or just mozz, like this, with a bit of parm? http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/lasagne_82381

                                                                                                                                                        by the way, you all who are lovers of lasagnes-of-all-stripes, check out the bbc's recipe pages for some nice variations of beloved lasagne: http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/sea...

                                                                                                                                                        1. re: guster4lovers
                                                                                                                                                          alanbarnes Jul 13, 2010 09:33 AM

                                                                                                                                                          I think your description of Southern vs. Northern lasagna is generally correct, and it's probably fair to say that the first predominates in the US and the second in the UK (although I'll leave that for people with better knowledge of British-Italian food).

                                                                                                                                                          But to say that one is a "US version" and the other a "UK lasagna" is a bit of an overstatement. There are plenty of places here that serve Lasagna Bolognese, and presumably places in the UK that serve Lasagna Napoletano.

                                                                                                                                                          1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                                                            greedygirl Jul 13, 2010 09:42 AM

                                                                                                                                                            I am actually quite fond of the seventies style lasagne, beloved of old-fashioned pubs, which made heavy use of cheddar, and had bolognese sauce as the base. Very rich, comfort food.

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                              JoanN Jul 13, 2010 09:57 AM

                                                                                                                                                              I'll take your word for it, but cheddar in a lasagne just sounds sooooo wrong.

                                                                                                                                                              1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                greedygirl Jul 13, 2010 10:06 AM

                                                                                                                                                                Of course it's wrong, but it's from the seventies! My Mum used to make curry with raisins in it back in the day. Now that is not just wrong, it's criminal.

                                                                                                                                                                1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                  paulj Jul 13, 2010 12:15 PM

                                                                                                                                                                  would it sound better if described as noodle and ground beef casserole with cheddar?

                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: paulj
                                                                                                                                                                    JoanN Jul 13, 2010 12:22 PM

                                                                                                                                                                    Oh, man! Hamburger Helper with Cracker Barrel! LOL

                                                                                                                                                                2. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                  Paulustrious Jul 14, 2010 08:56 AM

                                                                                                                                                                  I'm with you. Nothing better than a 3 inch cube of food. Even better with some emmentaler so you can be more connected to your meal as you eat it.

                                                                                                                                                      2. Ruth Lafler May 27, 2009 09:01 AM

                                                                                                                                                        I can't believe this isn't on here already....

                                                                                                                                                        In the U.K. a "bap" is a sandwich on a soft roll (the soft roll is actually the bap).

                                                                                                                                                        In addition:

                                                                                                                                                        In the U.K., faggot = meatball.

                                                                                                                                                        When I was there with a girlfriend as a teenager, a company was introducing a line of frozen meatballs with the advertising tag line "Take a faggot to lunch" which had us in gales of laughter!

                                                                                                                                                        16 Replies
                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl May 27, 2009 09:19 AM

                                                                                                                                                          Although faggot is also used as a derogatory term for a homosexual in England.

                                                                                                                                                          On a similar theme, do you have fag=cigarette?

                                                                                                                                                          1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                            Ruth Lafler May 27, 2009 10:12 AM

                                                                                                                                                            I think perhaps the derogatory usage has migrated over from American slang fairly recently. I'm pretty sure that in 1978, the word didn't have that meaning (or they wouldn't have been using it in advertising).

                                                                                                                                                            And yes, after all these years I still do a double take when one of my English cousins says he's going out for a fag!

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                              Paulustrious Jun 3, 2009 08:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                              That's because he's got his own, Ruth. Otherwise he would be bumming a fag.

                                                                                                                                                              And the 'alternative' meaning of faggot goes back way before 1978.

                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                Sam Fujisaka Jun 3, 2009 11:31 AM

                                                                                                                                                                "Faggots" used to refer to gathered firewood.

                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Sam Fujisaka
                                                                                                                                                                  alanbarnes Jun 3, 2009 12:49 PM

                                                                                                                                                                  Gathered and bound into bundles. Same root as the Italian fascio, which is the etymological source for the name of the Fascist movement.

                                                                                                                                                                  According to the OED, it sometimes referred specifically to the bundles of fuel used for burning people at the stake. Heretics who recanted were required to wear an emblem of a faggot on their clothing as a reminder of the punishment for relapse.

                                                                                                                                                                  It's amazing what you learn when you spend six years as an undergraduate assiduously avoiding any classes that might possibly have practical application.

                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                                                                    LindaWhit Jun 3, 2009 01:11 PM

                                                                                                                                                                    I knew of "faggots" meaning gathered firewood from reading historical novels, but didn't know of the etymological source as well as heretics wearing the emblem as a reminder not to relapse.

                                                                                                                                                                    You learn all sorts of things on Chowhound. :-)

                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                      Caitlin McGrath Jun 3, 2009 01:43 PM

                                                                                                                                                                      Ditto to your entire post (both paragraphs), Linda!

                                                                                                                                                                2. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                  Ruth Lafler Jun 8, 2009 09:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                                  Yes, and when you combine that with the English meaning of "bum" then you get quite a picture. ;-) I wonder if my cousin has ever thought of that ... might be enough to get him to stop smoking!

                                                                                                                                                                3. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                                  cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 03:52 AM

                                                                                                                                                                  And on that note, why does Gok Wan call breasts bangers? Totally bizarre.

                                                                                                                                                              2. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                                Harters May 27, 2009 10:14 AM

                                                                                                                                                                "Bap" - geographical reference to a soft bread roll.

                                                                                                                                                                It's what they call them about 10 miles north of me. Twenty miles south east, they are "cobs". Where I am, it's a "barm (or "barmcake"). And then there's "oven bottom muffins" - which are flatter and denser - and not to be confused with "English muffins" (which are American , but we have them now in England) or "muffins" (which are English and are teacakes to be toasted).

                                                                                                                                                                And just to correct, a "meatball" is a "meatball" in the UK as it is in the US. A "faggot" is a "faggot" - very different beastie made from pigs offal, such as heart and liver, and then wrapped in caul. Very much a regional dish from the West Midlands and almost invariably served in a very rich gravy. Further north (where I am), we call them "savoury ducks" - although they don't have duck in them . Go figure. Needless to say, the alternative use of the word by Americans (and now known to us) is a source of puerile humour.

                                                                                                                                                                Ruth's frozen food company was most probably Brains Limited, who are the market leader of commerical faggots. Even though Brains Faggots, don't have brains in them. They don't taste too bad either - if you're an offal sort of person.


                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                  Ruth Lafler May 27, 2009 10:22 AM

                                                                                                                                                                  Ah. I've been spending an inordinate amount of time in the Midlands, obviously (my cousins at the time lived between Nottingham and Leicester, and now live in Manchester).

                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                                    Harters May 27, 2009 10:47 AM

                                                                                                                                                                    Ah, yes. I think I recall you mentioning on a much much earlier thread that you'd visited my home city of Manchester.The Cheese Hamlet in Didsbury rings a bell - five minutes drive from me and the second best cheese shop in the north west.

                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                      Ruth Lafler May 27, 2009 01:03 PM

                                                                                                                                                                      That's right! I spent a lot of time (and money) in The Cheese Hamlet. My cousin was a little mystified -- until he sampled the cheese I bought. Then he had to admit that he was enjoying cheeses he never thought he liked.

                                                                                                                                                                      They've since moved to my cousin-in-law's childhood farm in Derbyshire, which is going to make foraging for good chow a bit more challenging next time I visit.

                                                                                                                                                                      On topic: In the U.K. what we would call sheep's milk cheese is called (more accurately), ewe's milk cheese.

                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                                        Harters May 27, 2009 02:01 PM


                                                                                                                                                                        Feel free to contact me next time you visit - I'd have some good Derbyshire tips for you (including one of the best farmers markets I know for miles around).

                                                                                                                                                                        On topic, I'd always think of it as sheep's milk cheese - but I can understand why the pedants amongst our nation would say ewe's - there ain't much milk coming out of a ram.

                                                                                                                                                                  2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                    Paulustrious May 27, 2009 02:56 PM

                                                                                                                                                                    In Liverpool the cobbs were the crusty rolls (aka crusty rolls) and the barms were the soft ones, sometimes flour dusted. They were also known as barm cakes, though not technically cakes at all - unless they had suet in them.

                                                                                                                                                                    Come to think of it, I and not quite sure what a cake is (technically) . Never heard of faggots as savoury ducks. If they ever sold them here in NA I think Brains Faggots would have to undergo some name change. Here are a couple of adverts...



                                                                                                                                                                  3. re: Ruth Lafler
                                                                                                                                                                    NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 09:46 AM

                                                                                                                                                                    Also a sandwich in the UK - a" Butty" - ie - bacon butty or chip butty (the best!!)

                                                                                                                                                                  4. Paulustrious May 25, 2009 05:24 AM

                                                                                                                                                                    Streusel vs crumble (somewhat arguable)

                                                                                                                                                                    7 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                      relizabeth May 25, 2009 06:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                                      flapjacks (usa) vs. pancake
                                                                                                                                                                      ???? syrup soaked oat bar vs. flapjacks (UK)

                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: relizabeth
                                                                                                                                                                        Harters May 25, 2009 07:10 AM

                                                                                                                                                                        I suppose, therefore:

                                                                                                                                                                        Pancake (US) vs American Pancake (UK)

                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: relizabeth
                                                                                                                                                                          kattyeyes May 25, 2009 07:21 AM

                                                                                                                                                                          UK flapjacks are US bar cookies--(here) not necessarily syrup-soaked oat bars. Example, our Magic Cookie Bars or Hello Dollies (7-layer bars) are bar cookies. UK folks would call them flapjacks, right? Or is it specific to oats/syrup?

                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                                                                            Harters May 25, 2009 07:34 AM

                                                                                                                                                                            Flapjack as I'd understand it in the UK (whether homemade or shop bought) - butter, sugar, golden syrup, oats. Mix & bake.

                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                              kattyeyes May 25, 2009 04:17 PM

                                                                                                                                                                              If so, that's definitely not a one for one with our bar cookies. We had this discussion on Soop's "shall we make a recipe" thread a while back, but now I see a flapjack is kind of its own thing. What do you call a bar cookie, I wonder?

                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                                                                                Paulustrious May 25, 2009 04:45 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                A barmaid

                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                  kattyeyes May 25, 2009 04:47 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                  Oh, you mean a tart!

                                                                                                                                                                      2. Caitlin McGrath May 20, 2009 03:45 PM

                                                                                                                                                                        Here's one gleaned from the "Desserts of the British Empire" thread on Home Cooking:

                                                                                                                                                                        sprinkles/jimmies (varies in the US, covered at length in other threads) vs. hundreds-and-thousands

                                                                                                                                                                        5 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                          Atahualpa Aug 10, 2009 07:08 AM

                                                                                                                                                                          AKA Nonpareils

                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Atahualpa
                                                                                                                                                                            BobB Aug 10, 2009 07:15 AM

                                                                                                                                                                            Yes... though there is also a different confection that was called nonpareil when I was a kid, and apparently is still available in specialty shops. It's a slightly rounded chocolate disc about one inch in diameter covered with tiny white candy dots. http://www.oldtimecandy.com/nonpareil...

                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                              alkapal Aug 11, 2009 01:53 AM

                                                                                                                                                                              bobB, it's the candy dots (nonpareils) that lend their name to that candy -- classic movie snack food, too!

                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                                kattyeyes Aug 11, 2009 03:43 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                Ahhhh, nonpareils...a.k.a. Sno-Caps. It ranks right up there with Raisinets for me as candy to eat in the movie theater! ;)

                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: Atahualpa
                                                                                                                                                                                LindaWhit Aug 10, 2009 07:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                But nonpareils are harder and crunchier than sprinkles/jimmies. Not as hard as dragees, but still crunchier than jimmies - which have no crunch at all.

                                                                                                                                                                            2. MMRuth May 19, 2009 12:02 PM

                                                                                                                                                                              Here's one I just came across today - "coarse fish". Per an angler's website:

                                                                                                                                                                              "every creature that swims in freshwater that isn’t a trout or a salmon; in the US, they are known as “white fish” or “suckers”."

                                                                                                                                                                              3 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                Harters May 19, 2009 01:59 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                ""coarse fish". Per an angler's website:"

                                                                                                                                                                                I'm not an angler but I think this is an angling term rather than culinary. "Coarse fishing" - in freshwater - as opposed to "sea fishing".

                                                                                                                                                                                But don't quote me.......

                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                  MMRuth May 20, 2009 04:15 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                  Elizabeth David used it in a recipe calling for a sorrel sauce, that she wrote goes well with "coarse fish". I then looked it up, and found the term on the angler's site. For some reason, by the way, when I cooked the sorrel it had a really unpleasant smell, so I pitched it.

                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                    Paulustrious May 22, 2009 04:31 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                    To understand coarse fishing one needs to read "The Art of Coarse Fishing" by Michael Green. Unless you are a golf / rugby / acting / cricket etc fan, in which case one needs to read "The Art of Coarse Golf / Rugby" etc.

                                                                                                                                                                              2. r
                                                                                                                                                                                rochfood May 19, 2009 11:36 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                Cans - tins. Was it brought up ? Packaging vs food items. Am I right ? Never went to the UK..just watch the occasional foreign film..BBC America. Tinned beans on toast ?

                                                                                                                                                                                Takeout...Takeaway ?

                                                                                                                                                                                What do they call soda in the UK ?

                                                                                                                                                                                2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: rochfood
                                                                                                                                                                                  smartie May 21, 2009 11:09 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                  soda in the UK usually known by the brand name eg, coke, pepsi, sprite, or just fizzy drinks.

                                                                                                                                                                                  we forgot the word 'produce'. It is not used in the UK for fruit and vegetables which are just know as fruit and vegetables!

                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: rochfood
                                                                                                                                                                                    Das Ubergeek Aug 11, 2009 09:55 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                    In New York, such a thing used to be known as "carryout". Nowadays with the advent of SeamlessWeb, it's normally called "delivery" or "why schlep?".

                                                                                                                                                                                  2. Paulustrious May 9, 2009 04:39 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                    Head cheese vs brawn or souse.

                                                                                                                                                                                    In terms of pronunciation we have tomato and yoghurt.

                                                                                                                                                                                    I am unable to Americanise gammon as in 'gammon and eggs'.

                                                                                                                                                                                    2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                      LindaWhit May 9, 2009 06:12 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                      I had to go looking up gammon to see that it is a particular cut of bacon or ham steak, right? (From a different area of the pig.)

                                                                                                                                                                                      And I did find this for British ex-pats in the States if you want to order back bacon, gammon, Lincolnshire sausage, Cornish pasties, etc: http://www.britishbacon.com/comersus6...

                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                        JoanN May 9, 2009 06:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                        I once recommend ham and eggs when my British friend wanted gammon and eggs and that seemed to do the trick for him. Don't know, though, just what kind of American ham gammon would be. There are so many different kinds of ham here, both cooked and uncooked, and I have trouble keeping them straight without a scorecard.

                                                                                                                                                                                      2. Caitlin McGrath May 7, 2009 08:36 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                        Thought of another:

                                                                                                                                                                                        Whole wheat vs. wholemeal

                                                                                                                                                                                        9 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                          smartie May 8, 2009 05:07 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                          Golden syrup = nothing. Whahhhhhh, I want to bake some cornflake cakes for my coworkers but all the recipes I have call for Golden Syrup and I cannot get that in Florida.

                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                            Paulustrious May 8, 2009 05:58 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                            You can in Canada - I have a can in my kitchen. Treacle was difficult in Fl as well. Molasses just aint right for a treacle tart.

                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                              LindaWhit May 8, 2009 06:37 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                              Smartie - are you sure? I can find Lyle's Golden Syrup in cans in my local supermarket in the Northeast - I *think* either in the International aisle or the aisle with maple syrup and honey. I haven't purchased it there - but I know I've seen it. (I had some in my cupboards that I've pulled out to use based on this thread!)

                                                                                                                                                                                              But if not - you most certain can order it online.

                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                                                TroyTempest May 19, 2009 11:13 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                Be sure that when you buy the golden syrup that you use it before the expiry date. Don't leave it in the larder too long.

                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: TroyTempest
                                                                                                                                                                                                  LindaWhit May 19, 2009 12:18 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                  WAY too late for that ~ I've had the two bottles, one currently unopened, for about 8 years or more, I believe. What I used from the opened bottle a few days after the above post was still fine. And I'm still alive. :-)

                                                                                                                                                                                                  And there was no expiration or "use by" date on the bottles.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Paulustrious May 22, 2009 06:46 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                    It's almost pure sugar - it will last forever when resealed. It is possible the sugar will crystalise, but heating it up will redissolve it.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Don't keep it in the fridge.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                      LindaWhit May 22, 2009 06:54 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                      That's what I thought, Paulustrious. I liken it to it being similar to honey. And it's now in the pie safe - front and center and visible when I open up the cupboard doors. I did have to heat it up the last time I used it, but have turned the container upside down so the syrup is at the squeeze area.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Harters May 22, 2009 10:04 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                        I dread to think how many years we've had the tin. A couple of spoonfuls or so every year and that's it. Lasts forever.

                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                alanbarnes May 8, 2009 07:08 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                I've seen Lyle's in Florida grocery stores in areas where there's a substantial expat Brit population. Right next to the cans (er, tins?) of Batchelors Mushy Peas.

                                                                                                                                                                                            2. Paulustrious May 6, 2009 12:47 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                              Gyro / Shwarma vs Doner Kebab

                                                                                                                                                                                              Accroding to Lord Wiki...

                                                                                                                                                                                              Shawarma (Arabic: شاورما‎), also spelled Chawarma, Schawarma, Shawirma, Shwarma, Shuarma, Shawerma, Shoarma, Schwarma, Shoermeh, Siaorma, or Shaorma.

                                                                                                                                                                                              That must be right up there with pillau rice as having the most alternatives. I saw at least ten different spellings in UK Indian restaurants.

                                                                                                                                                                                              1. Caitlin McGrath May 5, 2009 08:17 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                Is okra known as lady fingers in the UK? (In the US, lady fingers are cookies.)

                                                                                                                                                                                                2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                  paulj May 5, 2009 08:41 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                  From Wiki:
                                                                                                                                                                                                  "Okra (American English: [ˈoʊkɹa], British English [ˈəʊkɹə], [ˈɒkɹə]), also known as ladyfinger, bhindi (Indo-Aryan) and gumbo"

                                                                                                                                                                                                  Have an old Penguin paperback of Indian cooking that uses Okra (lady's fingers), as well as the Hinid Bhindi.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                    greedygirl May 6, 2009 02:00 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Can be, but most people call it okra these days.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. h
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Harters Apr 30, 2009 08:28 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Americans call them shrimps.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Australians call them prawns

                                                                                                                                                                                                    In Britain, we use both words and, for us, size is important.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    The shrimp is a tiny thing, about 5mm long. Anything bigger is a prawn.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Shrimps are, almost exclusively, fished from Morecambe Bay (off the north west coast of England) and, almost exclusively, they find their way into one of life's little luxuries - the potted shrimp. Nothing more than shrimp, butter and a touch of seasoning. Eaten as a starter with bread.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    It's the same beast that you find in the Netherlands and the Flemish part of Belgium where they turn up in salads and, my fave, the shrimp croquette. I'm in Belgium this weekend and can't wait to devour some croquettes (and a main course of mussels if the season is still open).

                                                                                                                                                                                                    15 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Paulustrious Apr 30, 2009 10:36 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                      I miss those - I lived in the area for three years. And the odd thing is, the smaller the prawn / shrimp the more flavour it has. I remember smiling when I saw giant shrimp for sale.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      (As an aside, in my memory Americans call them shimp - singular.)

                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                        BobB Apr 30, 2009 11:02 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                        The closest thing you're likely to find this side of the pond are tasty little Maine shrimp, which are in season in late winter.

                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                          Agent Orange Apr 30, 2009 11:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Yes, shrimp is the word in both the singular and the plural. Like fish or deer.

                                                                                                                                                                                                        2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                          Eat_Nopal Apr 30, 2009 11:09 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Actually... Prawn is used extensively in the U.S. referring to the larger beasts. In my experience... anything smaller than U20 is almost always shrimp... anything bigger is often referred to as prawns.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          I guess we just have a larger definition for large =)

                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Eat_Nopal
                                                                                                                                                                                                            BobB Apr 30, 2009 11:15 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                            Possibly in some other parts of the country, but I've never seen the term prawn used here in New England, outside of the occasional curry house run by British Commonwealth expats.

                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                                                              Caitlin McGrath Apr 30, 2009 01:22 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                              I see prawn used often by Chinese restaurants on their menus. And, now that I think about it, my ex-MIL, who is from Hong Kong, used prawn to refer to anything larger than small-medium shrimp.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                BobB Apr 30, 2009 01:36 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                Looks like a West Coast usage, then. We'll have to start a new thread: East Coast and West Coast, One Country Divided by a Common Language. You say potato, we say edible tuber. ;-)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                It's not strictly culinary, but I'm curious as to how far west you have to go before numbered highways acquire the definite article. You drive on the 101, we drive up 128.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Caitlin McGrath Apr 30, 2009 01:52 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I lived in New York for a number years, but I don't remember offhand whether I saw prawn used there.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  To your second point: you are mistaken, my friend. I drive on 101. Only in Southern California do they drive on *the* 101. To Northern Californian ears it sounds just as odd as it does to you.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                    MMRuth May 1, 2009 04:06 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I see prawns in Chinese restaurants in NY all the, fwiw.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                                                                LindaWhit Apr 30, 2009 03:23 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                There was a tapa dish on a restaurant's menu in Somerville, MA that were called "prawns" - large, head-on shrimp. Aura in Boston has had prawns on their menu and I know I've seen it elsewhere. Now, perhaps, they just call them that ever oxymoronic "jumbo shrimp".

                                                                                                                                                                                                              3. re: Eat_Nopal
                                                                                                                                                                                                                alanbarnes Apr 30, 2009 12:12 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                Here in NorCal, spot prawns are called "prawns" regardless of size. Apparently they're true prawns, which are biologically distinct from true shrimp. Although once they've been incorporated into a coctel de camarones, the distinctions seem to fade...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Harters Apr 30, 2009 02:13 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I'm not sure about what "true shrimp" might be in the US. The shrimp I mention earlier has the latin name of "Crangon Crangon". Known as the brown shrimp in the UK and the grey shrimp in France/Belgium/Netherlands. Same beast.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                    alanbarnes Apr 30, 2009 03:06 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    It has nothing to do with geography; it's all biological taxonomy. But although there appears to be a consensus that shrimp and prawns are different suborders or infraorders of decapods, there's conflicting information about how and where the line is drawn. I'll leave it to the taxonomists to sort out.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    From a culinary standpoint, the distinction between shrimp and prawns appears to be primarily regional and linguistic, having nothing to do with the taxonomic categories.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                                                                                                                      kattyeyes Apr 30, 2009 03:42 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Maybe Pepe the King Prawn can help sort it out:

                                                                                                                                                                                                              4. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                NellyNel Jun 12, 2009 09:40 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                I don't know about that -
                                                                                                                                                                                                                I remember ordering a "prawn cocktail" in an Italian resto in England - and what I got was a bunch of baby shrimp mixed in with some ghastly orange dressing!

                                                                                                                                                                                                              5. Caitlin McGrath Apr 29, 2009 12:48 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                Okay, I can't believe the chocolate bar comparison hasn't come up yet.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                Milky Way - Mars Bar

                                                                                                                                                                                                                3 Musketeers - Milky Way

                                                                                                                                                                                                                If that's not confusing enough, until quite recently the US had a Mars Bar, too, which was nougat studded with whole almonds, covered in milk chocolate. It's no longer made, though (it was always less common, harder to find in my lifetime).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                Lord only knows why M&M/Mars couldn't have the same name for their candy bars the world over. Snickers is the same everywhere, I think, though greedygirl said in another thread that it used to be called Marathon in the UK.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                8 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                  smartie Apr 29, 2009 02:44 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  yep Snickers used to be called Marathon, it got changed about 10 years ago.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                    greedygirl Apr 29, 2009 02:48 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Hang on - a Milky Way is a Mars Bar in the US? How confusing is that? And weird because a lot of sweets were renamed to conform with some kind of international standard a while back - so Marathon became Snickers and Opal Fruits became Starburst. But some obviously slipped through the net.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The nougat studded with almonds is still available in France I think, where it's also known as Mars.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Caitlin McGrath Apr 29, 2009 02:58 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      No a US Milky Way is a UK Mars Bar (or is that what you were trying to say?). What you know in the UK as Milky Way is 3 Musketeers in the US. The almond-studded one was the US Mars Bar (discontinued). Confusing, indeed!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      So I assume Americans not in the know who hear of deep-fried Mars Bars think "huh," but have no idea they're hearing about deep-fried US Milky Way.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I assume the other names weren't changed because it'd be super-confusing to have the name of one switch to the name of another pre-existing, different bar, and that become something else!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Apr 29, 2009 08:45 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Just amending as I reread my response to you, greedygirl, that I realize "or is that what you were trying to say?" sounds a bit rude. Apologies for that, as what I meant was really, "Maybe that's what you were saying," as I realized that I could simply have not understood you and was being dim.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Agent Orange Apr 29, 2009 02:56 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Wait, wait... are you sure? The revered and unobtainable Mars Bar, so lauded by Brits and Canadians, is just ... a Milky Way? I thought Mars simply were not available anywhere in the States. I was hoping to try one on a future trip to another Anglo country. I am so disappointed.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Apr 29, 2009 03:30 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Sorry to rain on your fantasy travel parade. It's a Milky Way.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Blush May 2, 2009 11:37 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          And to add more confusion, American Milky Way bars are made at a plant in Newmarket, Ontario, Canada, on the same line as Canadian Mars Bars. Canada doesn't keep any of the Milky Ways; they all get shipped across the border for sale in the US.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Blush
                                                                                                                                                                                                                            guster4lovers Jul 12, 2010 06:03 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I hate to be the voice of dissent, but milky way (US) are nowhere NEAR as delicious as mars bars (UK). The chocolate is entirely different (like any UK candy bar, the chocolate is much richer and less "waxy" tasting), and the caramel isn't of the same quality. However, if you don't get down to the level of what it tastes like, it is the same. They did sell the UK version in the US for many years, but it was discontinued and now is only available in UK import stores.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            The milky way (UK) bar is, however, the same as (US) 3 musketeers (although my British husband swears that the milky way is better).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            If you don't believe me on the Mars bars, taste them side-by-side with a US Milky Way. Then you'll see.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    3. Pat Hammond Apr 29, 2009 11:29 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      There's caster sugar in the UK, which is super fine sugar here

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. BobB Apr 29, 2009 07:56 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        All these comments and no one has yet mentioned one of my favorites: hard candy (US) = boiled sweet (UK).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        4 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: BobB
                                                                                                                                                                                                                          toastnjam Apr 29, 2009 11:06 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          But what flavour boiled sweet? Lemon, orange, blackcurrant (yuk), butterscotch, blackballs....

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: toastnjam
                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Harters Apr 29, 2009 11:40 AM


                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Plenty of choice here - http://www.aquarterof.co.uk/

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I see the website also reports that the packaging of Sherbet Fountains is to be changed from paper to plastic. In some countries, there'd be rioting on the streets to protest.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: toastnjam
                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Caitlin McGrath Apr 29, 2009 12:36 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              What!? Blackcurrant is the best, and unfortunately, something we only get in the US when buying imported British or French candies (er, boiled sweets). Probably in part because blackcurrants aren't really grown here (this has to do with plant disease; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcur... ).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: toastnjam
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                BobB Apr 29, 2009 01:00 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Sour cherry, please!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            2. s
                                                                                                                                                                                                                              smartie Apr 28, 2009 06:16 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I was thinking doughnuts or donuts as the Yanks call them.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I miss British doughnuts - slightly crispy outside dredged in castor sugar, doughy inside with a good dollop of strawberry or raspberry jam - heavenly.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              American donuts are too sweet, the texture is just wrong and all that frosting in sickly flavours like strawberry and caramel.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I will be back in Blighty for a few days in July and I am heading straight to a bakery for a doughnut and a Chelsea Bun.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              18 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                queencru Apr 28, 2009 08:24 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                I didn't really see any difference in the donut varieties, to be quite honest. Not all American donuts are the Krispy Kreme types (which I have had in the UK) that are really sweet. We have plenty of other types.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Jen76 Apr 28, 2009 08:45 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  What is castor sugar?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Jen76
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    toastnjam Apr 28, 2009 09:35 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Castor sugar = superfine sugar or bakers sugar.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Jen76
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Harters Apr 29, 2009 01:46 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Very fine sugar - but not as fine as icing sugar.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        The Dairy Queen Apr 29, 2009 04:43 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        By icing sugar, do you mean what we Americans call powdered sugar?


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: The Dairy Queen
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl Apr 29, 2009 05:14 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          That's right. I believe it's also called confectioner's sugar. It's used for making icing (or frosting, for you guys), funnily enough!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: The Dairy Queen
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            smartie Apr 29, 2009 05:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Yes DQ powdered sugar is icing sugar.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Also the Brits don't call it frosting when you mix icing sugar with butter for a cake. It's called icing!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Agent Orange Apr 29, 2009 11:38 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Actually, then use of the term "icing" instead of frosting is pretty common in the South. I'm not sure if I can speak for anyone else, but I tend to say "icing" when the application of butter-sugar mixture is thin and "frosting" when it is thick. To me, icing is usually more dense and frosting airy. Perhaps it's just a personal quirk. Could be because my geographic heritage is a mixture of Southern and Midwestern.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Paulustrious Apr 29, 2009 11:42 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                That is definitely counter-intuitive

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  kattyeyes Apr 29, 2009 11:44 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I'm with you there and I'm from the Northeast--I think of icing as more applicable to gingerbread men; frosting is for cakes. So I think your thin/thick description works well. But I bet this varies all over the place!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The Dairy Queen Apr 29, 2009 11:51 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    That makes sense, except, the expression doesn't go, "Well, that's just the frosting on the cake!" The expression says "icing"--I wonder why?


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: The Dairy Queen
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      kattyeyes Apr 29, 2009 11:55 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      HA HA--maybe that expression has British origins? Now can I have my cake and eat it, too? ;) I know what it means, but that expression has always hit me the wrong way. If I HAVE the cake, you'd better believe I'm gonna EAT it, too. LOL!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: kattyeyes
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath May 2, 2009 12:38 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        The original expression was "eat your cake and have it, too," which makes much more sense given the meaning of the idiom! Somewhere along the way it was inverted.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    queencru Apr 29, 2009 11:59 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I think of icing as something that tends to be in a thin, hard layer- like on a sugar cookie or gingerbread man. Frosting is a bit fluffier and creamier.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Jen76 Apr 29, 2009 01:41 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I agree! I grew up with the same definitions of icing/frosting. Just like queencru, icing reminds me of the thin sugary stuff mom would drizzle over a bundt cake and it would get hard, whereas frosting is usually soft, creamy and fluffy.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Blush May 2, 2009 11:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      It's labeled icing sugar here in Canada, too, and we call it icing rather than frosting. Frosting is what ladies in the 70's did to their hair, before they called it "highlighting".

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                berbadeerface May 19, 2009 01:05 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Completely agree! I'm another Brit living in the US, and there is no comparison with doughnuts. The ones I grew up eating were so monumentally different. The ones here are way too dense, and I think it's partly because they're not usually made with yeast. In England, the good ones are. I made some using an Italian recipe recently, and they were closer to the real thing. They were so good - fresh, warm and doughey!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 03:48 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I love a nice American cinnamon roll - like the Cinnabon ones. Kind of like a Chelsea Bun.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                2. Paulustrious Apr 28, 2009 03:09 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Pork and Beans - Baked Beans (sometimes with pork / sausage)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Faucet - Tap

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Cooktop - Hob

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Range - Cooker

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Pickle - Pickled Gherkin

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  ??? - Silver (skin) onions .... help

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Fava beans - broad beans

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Green beans - string or runner beans

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Aluminum - Aluminium (different pronunciation)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Licorice - Liquorice - (different pronunciation)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Dutch Oven - Casserole dish

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  [Pizza] Pie - Only ever called a pizza in the UK.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Washcloth - flannel

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Apron - Apron, pinafore or pinny

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I am sure that with some of the above the divide is not black and white.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  A couple of things I have (almost) never seen in the US are soup spoons and fish knives.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  25 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    JoanN Apr 28, 2009 03:16 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Soup spoons are common in the US; fish knives, much less so. You'll see them in elegant restaurants, but most who have them at home have inherited them in a complete set of silver service. I have some modern stainless steel ones (along with matching fish forks), but that's very unusual. Modern placesettings rarely include matching fish knives and forks.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      paulj Apr 28, 2009 04:00 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      spatula - fish slice

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I have an old Penguin paperback on Indian cooking that says

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      'Now pick up the bread [chappati] on a fish slice, and if you are using gas, hold over a high flame with out turning. The bread will puff up and is then ready to eat.'

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        JoanN Apr 28, 2009 04:13 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I don't think they're exactly the same, but in the US a silverskin onion would probably be a pearl onion.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Gooseberry Aug 12, 2009 11:22 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          carmel versus caramel! Even when it's spelled with the second A in the States, they don't pronounce it. I quite like that one, said with an American drawl...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Gooseberry
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            LindaWhit Aug 12, 2009 11:27 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I think it depends on where in the U.S. you were when you heard "carmel" for "carAmel". I've never said "carmel" except when referring to Carmel, CA.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I've seen it spelled that way (carmel) countless times, and it drives me nuts. The word is spelled "car-a-mel" (although I know it can be pronounced "kahr-muhl" in some areas, as you noted).


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Caitlin McGrath Aug 12, 2009 01:31 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I'd have to agree with you, Linda. In the areas where I've lived, caramel is pronounced by near everyone just as it's spelled. I fret that it's one of those things that people will start largely mispronouncing because it's so often misspelled. I don't mind that it's pronounced with the elided second 'a' in some areas because it's a geographical variation, I just don't want everyone, everywhere saying "carmel" only because they don't know the word.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                LindaWhit Aug 12, 2009 01:47 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Unfortunately, I think your fretting is way too late, Caitlin. I see "carmel" all the time and have been hearing it more and more pronounced as if it was the California city (accent on the 2nd syllable). Even the "kahr-muhl" pronunciation I noted above has a slight middle syllable, vs. car-MEL, which is just. plain. wrong. when it's used in reference to the candy.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: LindaWhit
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Caitlin McGrath Aug 12, 2009 02:02 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Ugh. That sound you hear is my head banging against the wall.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    LindaWhit Aug 12, 2009 03:21 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Use some caramels to blunt the blow. ;-)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Das Ubergeek Aug 12, 2009 02:20 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Where I grew up (central NJ) it is pronounced with three syllables. The first one is the sound in "fat", the second one is schwa, the third one is the sound in "fell" with a fully-pronounced L sound. CAA-ruh-mell.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Here in LA more often I hear "CAR-mull" with a swallowed L. Makes me insane.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Das Ubergeek
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Caitlin McGrath Aug 12, 2009 02:43 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I grew up in Northern CA, where it is pronounced your central-NJ way, and that's how I heard it most in my NY days, as well. In either place, the latter pronunciation an exception.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I know it cannot help that it's often pronounced "CAR-muhl" by narrators in national ads. In fact, I'm sure that's among the chief culprits, because listeners assume those pronunciations are correct.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Harters Aug 12, 2009 03:31 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Awww. I really wish we hadn't got into pronounciation. We have regional differences as well in the UK with southerners having a long soft "A" and we northerners having it short and clipped. Generally.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Or scone (on which you have jam and cream). We call it a "skon". Other regions might call it a "sc-own".

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Caitlin McGrath Aug 12, 2009 03:53 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        As I said above, I don't mind pronunciation differences that are genuine differences based on region, which are present within almost all nations. No objection there at all.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        What I, and I think LindaWhit, were objecting to in this particular case is the standardization of a certain pronunciation that's not necessarily predominant geographically, based on a more and more common spelling error - one that is seen more and more often in commercial advertising.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Americans certainly say "sc-own," but then most of us haven't heard it said by speakers from the lands whence it came and I assume that's why American English takes it that the 'e' following the 'n' renders a long 'o' (as in stone).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          LindaWhit Aug 12, 2009 04:40 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Exactly - what Caitlin said re: pronunciation.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl Aug 12, 2009 11:28 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Let's not get into the "scone" versus "skon" debate! It's not a regional thing - it's a family thing. My Yorkshire lot all say "scone".

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          If someone asked me for a "carmel" I'd wonder what the hell they were talking about!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            alkapal Aug 13, 2009 04:39 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            as an american, i'd always called it sc-own, until i had one at blenheim palace (in the "pleasure gardens café"), and they pronounced it "skon". then i thought, so *that's* the "correct" pronunciation. btw, it was the best, silkiest scone i've ever eaten! if anyone has the recipe, let me know! (i think a lot has to do with the butter, cream and flour, of course). http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/494915

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: alkapal
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              greedygirl Aug 13, 2009 05:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              You were right - it is a sc-own!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Harters Aug 13, 2009 07:04 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Nah. It's skon to ryhme with John, not scown to rhyme with Joan.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                But I would say that.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  greedygirl Aug 13, 2009 07:36 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Skon is for poshos.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    alkapal Aug 13, 2009 02:59 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    DING DING DING! in the corner over here, we have the sc-owns...and in the opposite corner, the skons. at the bell, come out slugging!


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          2. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Gooseberry Aug 13, 2009 02:24 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            My bad, as the Americans would say!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I know it's silly, but SKOWn strikes me as stupid, whereas CARmel strikes me as charming.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. re: Gooseberry
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    just_M Apr 17, 2010 07:52 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I have always lived on the West coast of the US and for me carmel refers to a candy or a candy coating for things like carmel(pop)corn or carmel apples. Caramel refers to a sauce to top ice cream or a liquid placed in the bottom of flan/creme caramel, etc.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: just_M
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Caitlin McGrath Apr 17, 2010 09:13 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I have lived on the West Coast for a collective 31 years (born here, lived elsewhere at some points), and everyone I know uses caramel for all the things you mention - candy, sauce, flavoring.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        just_M Apr 17, 2010 11:18 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        There goes my West Coast theory (40 years w/short breaks), must have been my Gran.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: just_M
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          buttertart Apr 18, 2010 08:53 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          I think carmel came into use from proprietary names used for confections like Karmel Korn. It's caramel for bicoastal (CA and NY) me all the way.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                3. s
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  smartie Apr 28, 2009 05:00 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  tell you where I get in a mess with recipes are egg sizes. Large British eggs are much much bigger than American large eggs. I would say an American large egg is on a par with British medium.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Also available in British supermarkets are duck eggs and quail eggs.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  13 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Harters Apr 28, 2009 05:41 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    My local farmers' market ( in north west England), has a stall selling ostrich meat. Occasionally, they have ostrich eggs. One is the equivalent of 14 hens eggs - now that is one heck of an omelette. One day, I'll have to buy just to try.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Paulustrious Apr 28, 2009 06:49 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      If you do then blow the egg so you can keep the shell. They are a talking point, and you can start using words like cloaca.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Just One Bite Apr 28, 2009 10:18 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I had a problem with egg color! Last year, I had friends with little kids coming from the US for Easter, and we couldn't find any white eggs to dye! Ended up using the Clarence Court eggs, and dying over the color!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Just One Bite
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        MMRuth Apr 28, 2009 02:19 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        FWIW - I dyed about 80 quails eggs this year, and they were absolutely gorgeous. Much nice than the white eggs I tried, which kept coming out garish.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          kattyeyes Apr 28, 2009 05:46 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          They look like designer malted milk balls. :) What a lovely centerpiece! Note I did not say TABLESCAPE. Nice job!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            The Dairy Queen Apr 29, 2009 04:40 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Oh, those are really lovely!


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Just One Bite Apr 30, 2009 09:57 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Beautiful! I'm going to do that next year. Thanks for the idea, and the photos!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            nanette Apr 28, 2009 01:05 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Second that, smartie. Egg sizes in Europe are different and a medium here is the same as a large in the US. Can really screw up your baking if you aren't aware of the difference.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: nanette
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              greedygirl Apr 28, 2009 01:19 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I didn't know that. Weird, because chickens are generally bigger in the US, afaik.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Caitlin McGrath Apr 28, 2009 01:32 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Laying chickens and chickens raised for meat are separate industries raising different sorts of chickens, though. In all liklihood, the breeds used for both in North America are different than those in Europe.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  paulj Apr 28, 2009 02:30 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Chickens produce eggs in a whole range of sizes, they are then sorted according to size. Sizing standards developed independently in different countries, using different ranges, and different names.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  The Wiki article for eggs has several tables, for US, modern Europe, Australia, NZ

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                MMRuth Apr 28, 2009 02:18 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                That's good to know about the eggs when I cook from British recipes - usually American ingredients, onions etc., are larger. I find quail eggs in our supermarket in Manhattan, but usually buy them in Chinatown, where they are much cheaper. At our farmers' market, I buy duck and pheasant eggs.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Das Ubergeek Aug 11, 2009 09:47 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I had a HUGE problem converting egg sizes (and had correspondingly gooey cakes) until I finally THOUGHT about my great-grandmother's pound cake recipe (pound as in 453.6g), which calls for a pound of eggs, which comes to exactly 8 US "large" eggs. So a US "large" egg is 2 oz. or about 57g, weighed with the shell on.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                2. s
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  smartie Apr 27, 2009 08:09 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  toffee apples - candied apples in the US?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1 Reply
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Caitlin McGrath Apr 27, 2009 09:25 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The ones covered in red candy are candied apples, the ones covered in caramel candy are caramel apples.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. j
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Just One Bite Apr 27, 2009 04:44 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Also discovered Candy Floss = cotton candy.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    And the first time I went to Starbucks and asked for Half and half, they said "half what?" Stumped me! Still laugh when I think about it.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    5 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Just One Bite
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      akq Apr 27, 2009 05:21 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Funny! I remember having some back and forth at a U.K. Starbucks about nonfat milk. I don't remember if "nonfat" was the term they weren't familiar with, or if it was something else. But I think they understood "fat-free" and "skim."

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I also remember being surprised about the "bacon" in a bacon sandwich (didn't resemble American bacon), but was quite happy once I dug in...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I was also surprised at the pronounciation of "fillet" in the U.K.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: akq
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 03:45 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        If you want American style bacon in a sandwich then ask if it is 'streaky' bacon.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      2. re: Just One Bite
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        beachmouse Apr 27, 2009 06:04 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        The US-Canada candy divide that I remember easiest is whether Smarties are a chocolate candy resembling M&Ms (Canada) or a wee puck-shaped candy made almost entirely of flavored sugar (US)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: beachmouse
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Just One Bite Apr 28, 2009 10:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          UK Smarties are Canada Smarties too!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Just One Bite
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            mpjmph Apr 28, 2009 01:11 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Except that one of the 2 factories that makes American Smarties is in Ontario :)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      3. s
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        smartie Apr 26, 2009 11:31 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        a few more things I thought of - Britain has a fantastic selection of creams, double, single, whipping and of course clotted.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I also have yet to understand why the electric kettle has never taken off in the US. I did manage to buy one in Walmart when I first got here but friends come over and ask in astonishment what that item is on my counter.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I did not know what a bialy was when I first came to America, they don't have them in Jewish shops.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        also, corned beef is salt beef and they are not quite the same thing. British corned beef is a reconsituted type of meat which can be bought in a can, or sliced at the deli but it is nothing like deli corned beef.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        10 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Caitlin McGrath Apr 26, 2009 11:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Electric kettles are wonderful. Since I first bought one, I've never looked back.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          I think bialys came to the US with a certain set of immigrants (i.e., from a certain area).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            paulj Apr 26, 2009 12:55 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Asian shops in the US sell quite a few electric kettles. There are even versions specifically for brewing medicinal teas.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            The canned corned beef is readily available in the US, right next to the Spam. Most comes from Argentina, Brazil, or (better ones) New Zealand and Australia. You can find more brands in Asian groceries.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            The deli corned beef, as with most deli things in the US, has its roots in Jewish NYC, traceable back to immigrants from eastern Europe. I wouldn't be surprised if the link between corned beef and St Patrick's day comes more from contact between NY Irish immigrants and Jewish ones, than from old Ireland.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            A number of the other differences between the US and UK come from other immigrant groups in the US. Cilantro comes via Mexico, even though Chinese use it, and apparently it used to be common in Europe. Arugula comes from Italian, though rocket might be an older derivative from Italian (or latin).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: paulj
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Sam Fujisaka Apr 26, 2009 07:58 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I'll blind taste test you on Brazilian / Argentinian vs. New Zealand / Australian canned corn beef.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: paulj
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                alanbarnes Apr 26, 2009 08:17 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Re: canned corned beef. As SPAM is the national meat of Hawai'i, corned beef in a can (aka "pisupo" or "pea soup" - long story) is the national meat of Samoa. It's a big enough deal that you see cans of Ox & Palm being given as gifts at special occasions.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: alanbarnes
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  paulj Apr 26, 2009 08:25 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Of the brands that I've looked at, Ox & Palm seemed to be the 'healthiest', as in lowest in salt and fat, not that differences were that great. Since I only use a can once every two years (more or less), when I have nothing else in the camping box, I can't say much about the comparative taste or texture.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                KevinB Apr 27, 2009 05:01 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Geez, I can't think of a department store in Canada (or any kitchen goods store, for that matter) that DOESN"T have a wide selection of electric kettles. I love mine, since I live alone, and I can heat up water for a cup of coffee or tea in less than two minutes - far faster than using than stove.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: KevinB
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Atahualpa Apr 27, 2009 02:24 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Good article on electric kettles (and a few comments on their absence from the US) here: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/6075...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                2. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  tonifi Apr 29, 2009 06:27 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  We finally began using an electric kettle after my English husband burned up his sixth tea kettle on the stovetop.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  More than twenty years in this country, and he still can't get used to a kettle that doesn't shut itself off.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    cathodetube Aug 10, 2009 03:44 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The salt beef available in Jewish restaurants and areas of the UK is like US corned beef. Selfridges sells delicious salt beef sandwiches. The stuff in the tin is what Americans would use to make corned beef hash.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gooseberry Aug 12, 2009 11:20 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I never noticed an absence of electric kettles when I was in the States. But I was amazed how every home had an automatic coffee filter. I don't know anyone who has that here (South Africa) - most have a cafetiere, or now those fancy electric espresso makers.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Something American which hasn't taken off widely in the UK or SA as far as I can see - the toaster oven. I miss that from my days in the States.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2. Caitlin McGrath Apr 26, 2009 11:08 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Is peanut oil generally called groundnut oil in the UK?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      popsicle vs. ice lolly - is that correct?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        smartie Apr 26, 2009 11:18 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        yes Caitlin it is

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Paulustrious Apr 27, 2009 05:29 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          In my part of the world it was lolly-ice.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      2. q
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        queencru Apr 26, 2009 05:56 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Sprite/7-Up vs. Lemonade. This was not a happy surprise for me when I first go to the UK since I hate Sprite.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. Paulustrious Apr 26, 2009 05:47 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          And then there are cuts of meat such as tenderloin vs fillet. These are quite confusing as the butchery is different between the two arenas. I am yet to see the word entrecote in Canada. I have no idea how to translate scrag end into Americanese.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          9 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 05:56 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Tenderloin is now routinely used for pork fillet - that's how they label it at my butcher.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Entrecote is a French cut similar to sirloin - no? We don't have entrecote either.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Scrag end is such a great phrase! I don't know what the American equivalent is either. Neck of lamb?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              JoanN Apr 26, 2009 05:57 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Cuts of meat are just impossible. I walk around London markets going "What's that? What's that? and my BF walks around NYC markets going "What that? What's that?"

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              There was something that seemed fairly common in London markets that I believe was called a Baron Chop. It was a double lamb chop that seemed to have been cut from the saddle. Looked like a gorgeous hunk of meat. My local butcher had no idea what I was talking about.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 06:10 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                You probably mean a Barnsley chop? Not that common apart from in well-to-do parts of town. I'd have to specially request it I reckon.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  JoanN Apr 26, 2009 06:26 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Ah, yes. Barnsley chop. I guess I thought it rather common since in addition to butcher shops I'd seen them in a couple of supermarkets. Perhaps they were more up-market markets than I'd realized.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 06:36 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Are you coming to London any time soon JoanN? What part of town do you stay in?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      JoanN Apr 26, 2009 06:48 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      His flat is just a couple of blocks from the old Tate. But no plans to come any time soon since we're planning a long trip to South America and are both saving our shekels.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                2. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  MMRuth Apr 26, 2009 07:25 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I think "best end of lamb" is rack of lamb, as well.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Das Ubergeek Aug 11, 2009 09:42 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I know this post is four months old... but the most useful information I have EVER gotten from the grocery store was a guide I picked up for free at Albertson's that translated American beef cuts into their closest Mexican Spanish equivalents, and vice versa. Since I normally buy my beef from Mexican markets, I used to have the damndest time trying to explain to someone what "diesmillo" or "palomilla" are.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    It's amazing that eighty miles south of here, the style of butchery changes utterly.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Gooseberry Aug 12, 2009 11:17 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      The meat, full stop. I actually bring the cookbook into the butcher with me now, if I'm using an American cookbook, to make sure I'm getting the right thing. Even then, my butcher tells me some american cuts are more fatty or thicker than our local cuts, so recipes aren't always successful when followed religiously.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. The Dairy Queen Apr 26, 2009 05:39 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Fun thread! This is just what I need to get me through the Hopkinson, Ottolenghi, and Rose Bakery Cookbooks.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Do you have

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    porcini vs. cepes yet?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    That hung me up for the longest time when we were cooking from Hopkinson!


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: The Dairy Queen
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 05:43 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      They're interchangeable actually. Porcini is the Italian word, obviously and cepes is the French. I think more people say porcini, but I could be wrong.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        The Dairy Queen Apr 26, 2009 03:54 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        It's very uncommon to call them cepes here, except, at a French restaurant.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    2. Paulustrious Apr 26, 2009 05:04 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Thank you for the credit.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Saute vs Fry
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Broil vs Grill
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Grill vs Griddle (well sort of)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Canadian Bacon vs Back bacon
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Bacon vs Streaky Bacon (close enough anyway)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hard cider, vs cider
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Cider vs Apple juice

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Lemonade - equivalent doesn't exist in UK as a word really
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Sprite / lemon soda vs lemonade (Except in the UK you can get orange lemonade)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      supper vs tea (there are regional variations here which include 'dinner')

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      candy vs sweets
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      dessert vs dessert OR sweet

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      English muffin vs muffin (guess that makes sense)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Cookie - Biscuit
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Biscuits (as in biscuits with gravy) - I don't know how to translate that one

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Pancake - nearest I can get is drop scone or scotch pancake
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Crepe - Pancake

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Boston lettuce vs Bibb lettuce

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Pint (16 ounces) vs Pint (20 ounces) - and gallons have same 20% disparity.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      And then there are just words like spud, pasty, banger.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      86 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        JoanN Apr 26, 2009 05:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Speaking of soda, when London BF is in residence here I sometimes get tripped up on that word. I believe that in the UK “soda” refers only to carbonated water and/or perhaps seltzer. Are other fizzy waters called only by brand name or flavor, such as Coke or root beer?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: JoanN
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 05:28 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          They're known as soft drinks or fizzy "pop". Soda is specifically soda water.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Paulustrious Apr 26, 2009 05:45 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            = seltzer as per Joan's suggestion..

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 05:53 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Seltzer only used in conjunction with "alker" as in hangover cure!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                melpy Apr 22, 2010 09:24 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                In UK or USA? Because I live in US and I use seltzer all the time as carbonated water.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: melpy
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  BobB Apr 22, 2010 10:34 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  UK, g-girl's a Brit.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  My suspicion is that seltzer (which has its roots in German) came to American English via Yiddish, but that's just a guess.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        2. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 05:35 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          The broil thing really confused me for a while. I thought it was something special that only American ovens could do!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          "Orange lemonade" = orangeade. But usually called by its brand name, normally Fanta. The American-style lemonade is usually called still lemonade.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          The muffin thing is becoming more confused, as American-style muffins are now very popular here.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Supper/tea/dinner - that's VERY complicated - you could almost write a thesis on it! It's often class-related as well as regional. Really posh people often call their evening meal supper whereas for most people supper is a snack before going to bed. Calling your evening meal "tea" is quite a northern thing.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Dessert vs dessert OR sweet OR pudding.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Biscuits with gravy - doesn't exist. Similarly breakfast sausage.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          And grilling in the American sense is normally called barbecuing, I think.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            queencru Apr 26, 2009 05:57 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            There are regional differences in the US too with dinner/supper, even though we don't have tea. My dad always calls his evening meal supper and I had a college roommate from nearby his area that called lunch dinner.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: queencru
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              paulj Apr 26, 2009 09:25 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              While 'tea' as a meal is rarely used in the US, the dinner / lunch / supper pairing is more variable (in both countries). The lunch and supper articles of Wiki are interesting reading, and likely to leave you more confused after reading than before.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: queencru
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Caitlin McGrath Apr 26, 2009 11:15 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                I believe calling lunch dinner is a pretty old-fashioned thing, not common since the earlier part of the 20th century.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                greedygirl, I have experienced the opposite confusion with the grill vs. broil thing when looking at UK cookbooks: "Put it UNDER the grill? Wha...?"

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                I hope some of our Australian hounds will chime in, too. I recall purple goddess saying in another thread that in Australia, it's eggplant and zucchini (but they do use capsicum), and ketchup is tomato sauce. (In the US, there's an entirely other product called tomato sauce, that is an ingredient.)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  MMRuth Apr 26, 2009 12:38 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Yes, I've had the same confusion about putting it "under" the grill. I was trying to imagine what kind of grill one could cook things under!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    alanbarnes Apr 26, 2009 02:07 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I cook black widow spiders under my grill all the time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Paulustrious Apr 27, 2009 05:37 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      In the US and Canada I do not recall seeing an 'eye-level' grill. Unless you are two years old.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Paulustrious
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        babette feasts Apr 27, 2009 07:21 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Restaurant salamanders can be near adult eye level.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: babette feasts
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Paulustrious Apr 28, 2009 04:17 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          I didn`t know that word - I`ve never worked in the restaurant trade. Here is a n example of a cooker with an eye level grill (broiler).


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Also very common are cookers of this type (both gas and electric).


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          There are two ovens, the top one of which is used primarily as a grill (UK) or broiler (US). Another difference between most UK and US ovens is that the lower element is normally not visible.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      2. re: MMRuth
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        steve8rox May 28, 2010 05:31 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        In Canada, our old electric oven had a suspended heating element at the very top of the oven chamber itself, named a grill, on the control panel.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      3. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        greedygirl Apr 26, 2009 03:40 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Ketchup also known as tomato sauce here. I don't think we have the canned tomato sauce that you have in the States.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          queencru Apr 26, 2009 06:24 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          There are plenty of jar tomato sauces- possibly a smaller selection, but I bought them all the time in the UK.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: queencru
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Caitlin McGrath Apr 26, 2009 06:46 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            queencru, are you referring to, for example, jarred tomato pasta sauce or to the canned (in tins) "tomato sauce" (that's what it's called on the can) that is an ingredient like tomato paste and sold in the US next to the tomato paste? Because people outside the US have occasionally asked on Chowhound what the latter is when they saw it called for in a recipe someone posted.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              paulj Apr 26, 2009 08:02 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I have bought at a multi-ethnic produce stand and grocery, some Italian tomato sauce. It is labeled as Passata di Pomodoro. In small type the English translation is Strained Tomatoes. It's a little simpler than the typical American tomato sauce (no onions, etc), but still usable in the same way. It was shelved in a section with a variety of eastern European products.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          2. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Atahualpa Apr 26, 2009 11:19 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Here in Canada:

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Tomato Sauce = everything from puréed tomatoes (e.g. Itallian Passata – certainly not concentrated like tomato paste) through to fully seasoned, ready-to-use pasta sauce (like a marinara or putanesca).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            So, what are pureed tomatoes in a can called in the UK? Do Brits use passata for that?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Atahualpa
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              greedygirl Apr 27, 2009 01:58 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Yes - that's passata or seived tomatoes. What we don't have is canned tomato sauce with onions etc. We do have pasta sauce, but I thought that was different.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Atahualpa Apr 27, 2009 02:27 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Ah, I'd just consider our tomato sauce with onions, garlic, and maybe a few seasonings in it to simply be very very simple/bland pasta sauce or just think of it as a pasta sauce base to which you can add things.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          3. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            nanette Apr 27, 2009 03:16 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Actually calling lunch dinner might be "old fashioned", but I know plenty of 20 somethings who call lunch dinner. And school lunches are still called school dinners.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            It is very much a regional and class thing as greedygirl highlighted.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: nanette
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Caitlin McGrath Apr 27, 2009 12:16 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Is this in the US or the UK? I was speaking of the US in particular (where school lunches are called school lunches, and the evening meal is dinner or supper, depending on who and perhaps where you are).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                queencru Apr 27, 2009 04:17 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                In the US, I knew people who called lunch "dinner" and the evening meal "supper." It's really a regional thing. My college roommate was from a small town in rural Indiana and my father is from NW Indiana and still uses those terms.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  nanette Apr 28, 2009 03:15 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Sorry, the threading on this has gotten so long and not very well divided it is hard to follow. I meant the UK.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              2. re: Caitlin McGrath
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                purple goddess Apr 27, 2009 04:39 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Caitlin, I've been looking for the other thread on this very subject, but my brain is fried right now.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Tomato sauce is a condiment, passata is an ingredient.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                The other issue that never ceases to annoy me is that you Americans use different measurements. And I'm not just talking about converting from ounces to grams, basic recipe indicators such as teaspoon and tablespoon. A tablespoon in an American recipe is a different amount from the Imperial/Metric measurements used in UK and OZ.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                ED TO ADD: Here's the link to the last discussion on this.. very VERY funny thread!


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: purple goddess
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  queencru Apr 27, 2009 05:20 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I am American and I hate the American measurement system. It would be so much easier to put everything in mL or grams or something, not this teaspoon, tablespoon, pint, etc nonsense.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: queencru
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    paulj Apr 27, 2009 05:51 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    But that American system was inherited, with some modification, from the English.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: paulj
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      alanbarnes Apr 27, 2009 06:52 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      And the British, when they saw a far superior system, were smart enough to adopt it. How many drams in a gill, again?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  2. re: purple goddess
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Agent Orange Apr 27, 2009 09:32 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Much as I wish we'd switch to metric in general, I like our pints and cups and tablespoons etc. If we were ever to metricize, I hope we'd leave our recipes unchanged. At least for cooking. In baking, weights makes much more sense.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    But one thing I've always wondered, does everyone in metric countries have a kitchen scale? Even the people who don't do much cooking/baking? Scales seem to be pretty rare in American kitchens.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Agent Orange
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      smartie Apr 28, 2009 04:58 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Orange, I have a wonderful cup measure made by a company called Tala. I bought it in England about 20 years ago, my mum always used one, and as far as I know they are still available. It is a conical shape made of tin and is marked inside with grammes, lbs and oz, fluid oz, and English and American cups, and separates flour, sugar, rice etc into different weights.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      So I have always used that for baking. There is a generation in the UK between about 45 and 55 years old who were taught imperial measures at first in school and then were wickedly switched to metric so we are capable of interchanging metric to imperial without any problem.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      That being said I still bake in lbs and oz and if I see a metric recipe I mentally calculate all ingredients to imperial before I start.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      But yes, Brits who bake use scales, either the old fashioned ones with weights or the type with a dish and a clock scale.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: smartie
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Harters Apr 28, 2009 05:36 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I think you're right, smartie. I feel pretty interchangeable these days.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I now think of a bag of sugar as 1 kg, not 2lbs. And can cook in metric and imperial. But I'm still 5' 8" and weigh 16 stone (yep, I'm a little fat man).

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        I buy petrol in litres but still talk about the car's consumption in miles per gallon and drive it in miles per hour. Which is a real nuisance when my Spanish brother in law and I do "men's car talk" , as he prefers to think in kilometres per litre and kph. I can usually handle one of the conversions but not two at the same time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        And, on international discussion boards, I always convert to metric as it's, erm, more international. Except a pint of milk is still a pint, even when it's a half a litre.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          greedygirl Apr 28, 2009 05:49 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          I think most people in Britain mix and match a bit. I'm 5'8 too (but not 16 stone!) and can do both metric and imperial.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: greedygirl
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Harters Apr 28, 2009 06:41 AM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            I'm not so sure about the "most". My fave story.....

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            ....I was buying some ham in the market hall at Ashton under Lyne about 5 years back. I asked for 125g. Woman next in the queue is a few years older than me, maybe mid-60s. She says "Ooooh, luv, I'll never get used to that foreign stuff - I'm only just able to work out the new money".

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            It was 1973 when we changed to decimal currency!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Harters
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              purple goddess Apr 28, 2009 03:55 PM

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Brilliant!! We changed to decimal currency the year I was born, but changed to metric in 1973, so I had a few years of schooling in the old system. Like you, I think in metric and imperial.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              I can calculate horizontal length in metric, but I am 5ft 9 (but my ideal weight is 75kgs!)

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Harters