Regional favorite that you just didn't get once you finally had a chance to try it

[cycloneillini]

Several years ago when I still lived in Illinois, a corporate merger brought us together with folks from Texas, specifically Houston (where I now live). Whenever the Houstonians came to IL for any length of time, they would talk about having "Whataburger withdrawals" and how Whataburger makes the best fast food burgers in the world. Well, I have to tell you, I've been in Texas eight years now and I still don't get the obsession with Whataburger. I find them dry and tasteless no matter what you dress them up with. Has anyone else had a similar experience?

[RGC1982]

I too moved to Texas, and still don't get the obsession with pickled jalapenos on EVERYTHING. They are good on somethings, but not everything.

[janetms383]

Deep fried pickles! uck!

[Cascokat]

I'm a native Californian now living in Texas. I've been searching for three years trying to find REAL Mexican food around here! What is it with putting chili on everything? I just don't get it!

As for the Chick-Fil-a, as soon as you get your order, open the bag that the sandwich is in. Otherwise, you loose the crunch (found out the hard way).

I agree with the "what's-so-great-about-Whataburger" comments. However, give me an In-n-Out burger ... seriously. PLEASE. GIVE me one! :)

[MinkeyMonkey]

Yes, In-n-Out burgers are the best ever!! I, too, am no longer in L.A. and although I hardly ever eat burgers, I do miss those. And, most visitors agree, they are surprisingly good fast food and better than expected.

When in Santa Fe, we tried frito pie because "we just had to" and "I always have this when I'm here". No, not special, just something I can make at home.

Krispy Kreme in Florida, before they were available everywhere. Meh, not so special.

What I DID like were the cheese curds in Oregon from the Tillamook dairy...so very good!

[RetiredChef]

Funny how people are so different - the first thought I had when I read the OP was In-N-Out, don’t get it. Here are the first 4 American items that came to my mind.

In-n-Out burgers – (belch), greasy, nasty pasty cheese, tons of relish in their ‘secret’ sauce and those disgusting fries, sorry I’m not sold by the marketing so I don’t think only ultra-cool Californians eat here.

Nantucket Bay Scallops – These are revered as the black truffle of scallops, actually they have just a bit more flavor then regular bay scallops but don’t even come close to high quality diver sea scallops.

Boiled Peanuts – wall paper paste, yuck why destroy such a nice nut?

Tillamook cheese – Nothing wrong with this cheese, but to some it is the holy grail of cheese, it’s a decent quality mass produced cheese, nothing more and nothing to go ga-ga over.

[linguafood]

Never had boiled peanuts myself.... but it's not a nut. It's a legume.

[RetiredChef]

peanut is a legume.

However in culinary terms we use the term nut quite differently, walnuts and almonds are technically drupes and cashews and corn nuts are technically seeds, but we seem to call them nuts without the diction police coming in to correct us.

So while a ground nut is technically a legume, most people would be scratching their heads as they reached for a monkey nut and cracked it open - wondering why in the world would someone would call a simple goober pea a legume?

I suggest a compromise Pass the peagumes please. ;)

[linguafood]

Ha! "Peagumes" is something I would pass on without ever trying them '-)

That sounds awful...

[thew]

i had peagumes once. no big deal - shot of penecillan fixed it right up

[Ed Dibble]

Growing up in Oregon, we loved Tillamook because back in those days so much cheese was cheesewiz, Kraft American slices and the like.

If you ever get the chance to taste real long aged Tillamook (3-5 years old), that is something special.

[goodhealthgourmet]

i felt the same way about Chik-Fil-A when i lived in ATL. i didn't eat meat at the time so i never even tried their chicken biscuit, but i didn't understand what everyone thought was so great about the waffle fries - meh, and the lemonade! why does everyone love their lemonade so much?

[lynnlato]

I hear what you're saying, sister! I've lived in CLT for 13 yrs now and I still don't get it. My kids love it though and family that comes to visit from PA loves it also. I hate their fries, the lemonade is ordinary and while I like their chicken, it doesn't "wow" me. I do think they have great customer service, clean restaurants and a slightly healthier menu than most fast-food restaurants though. And I do like their cole slaw.

[Davwud]

I had heard so much about how CFA was so great. I decided I'd give it a go. It was bland and very unappetizing. All in all, I thought the whole visit sucked. I truly don't get it.

DT

[turqmut]

Their sandwiches are much better if they're very freshly prepared. If they sit long at all the chicken loses it's crunch and gets kind of steamy/wet. They are fantastic when they're "new".

[ktmoomau]

I am not a huge fan of the lemonade, but living up north (well in DC which is technically below the mason dixon, but has poor Southern food in general), their sweet tea is the best that you can find around here.

If I want a fried breaded chicken sandwich I like theirs, but it is something I would go any great distance for.

[beth1]

Thank you. Now I miss Whataburger. I'm in San Diego now, but we had them when we lived in Florida. Now we have In-and-Out. They're good. I don't get the whole pickled carrots and jalepenos in EVERY taco shop. They don't really do it for me. The California burrito, however, is a different story.

[StatenEats]

Beth, I am from San Diego and now in NYC. I could kill for a California burrito, a Rubio's fish taco and an In-and-Out burger.

[Cinnamon]

Me too, and I'm in L.A. It's just that it's after 10pm and I don't want to go out, though.

I'm not really into any region's pickled stuff, I agree with Beth. Not long ago in Prague I ordered a cucumber-tomato sandwich. What I got was pickles, grilled cheese, grilled tomato and mustard on hot bread.

[ipsedixit]

Scrapple.

[steakman55]

Yes, by all means, scrapple. OTOH, What-a-burgers are one of the great sandwiches in the history of the world, particularly double meat and cheese. If you could have those with Chik fil a waffle fries and lemonade, it would be perfection. But scrapple, no way no how.

[Passadumkeg]

I love scrapple and lug it 500 miles back up to Maine. My Yankee wife, however, is not enthused.

[lynnlato]

Scrapple is just a breakfast hot dog, shaped differently of course. Pig scraps mixed with cornmeal and flour, plain and simple. Now livermush, on the other hand...

[san antonio eater]

I've got to concur on the Scrapple thing. Gross. As a native Texan, however, I have never understood the What-a-Burger phenomenon. They were ok when I was growing up in a small town and they were the only fast food around, but we never eat them now. Those What-a-burger onions! Yech - they stay with you for days.

[Mawrter]

Word. I shudder. I get scrapple with my hog share, and hand it over to friends / family that like it.

[linguafood]

Philly Cheesesteak.... guess you have to grow up with it. But then, not a lot of Non-Germans 'get' our love affair with white asparagus --

[Glencora]

I'm afraid I'm a non-German who doesn't "get" white asparagus. I was in Germany a few Springs ago and kept ordering it by mistake. Once it was listed on the chalkboard as "spare ribs." I thought it would meat! I love green asparagus but white doesn't appeal to me at.

Another for me was chicken fried steak in Texas.

[linguafood]

Wait -- the asparagus was listed as "spare ribs?" Perhaps a really, really bad attempt at the word 'asparagus'? Whoa. I feel that's another customer I should add '-D

Speaking as one of those crazy Germ's who go absolulety apesh!t about that stuff -- one factor I'm sure being that it's _such_ a seasonal thing: only about mid April thru June 24, and that's it for the year -- I find that white asparagus has much more flavor than green asparagus. Well, not all white asparagus is created equal.... but I'm sure you got the 'good' stuff, and just didn't care for it. Neither does my man, who's non-German and doesn't get it either. That, and smoked herring with raw onions '-D ha.

[EWSflash]

You want to see some faux-pas-riddled menus that tried their best to accommodate the English-speaking customer, go to engrish.com and take a look around.

[linguafood]

Oh, I have that site bookmarked, but haven't gone on it in a while. Pee-yer-pants funny stuff....

[kubasd]

I have that site bookmarked as well! So hilarious....

The menu part is def my favorite

[lagatta]

I love both kinds of asparagus. The white kind is also common in France. And I love the German springtime meals designed around asparagus. Smoked herring, are you from the North, linguafood? That is also common in the Netherlands. I do like it, but not always the easiest thing to digest.

[linguafood]

Both my parents are from Northern Germany, tho my dad had the higher appreciation for all things fishy -- I still remember our last dinner with him, where matjes, raw onions, and pan-fried potatoes were served.... much to my husbands disappointment, who tried filling up on the potatoes. My dad was incredulous to hear that matjes was not everyone's cup o'tea.

Let's say it's not something I want to eat every day, but whenever I return to Germany, I get a LOT of the stuff I can't really get around here -- herring in dill creams sauce, herring salad with apples, onions, and red beets, smoked fish, teewurst....

ah. only two more weeks :-D

[Passadumkeg]

We had herrings, rye, cheeses, and hard boiled eggs w/cold cuts for Easter breakfast.

[linguafood]

Ah -- hard boiled's a bit hard-core for me, I prefer a soft one for breakfast. Unless I have a toasted slice with cream cheese and sliced hard boiled egg on it.

Really looking forward to German breakfast again!

[Passadumkeg]

Sliced boiled eggs are an integral part of the Norwegian frukost bord, breakfast table; layered on smorbrod, open faced sandwiches.

[linguafood]

Schmecksville!! Only... 9 more hours till breakfast --

[lagatta]

linguafood, please report on your gastronomic visit. Suppose that should be on the "international" board.

[linguafood]

Hmmmm.... which gastronomic visit are we talking? I leave for Berlin in a little over a week, and will be there till early August.... which means a LOT of resto visits :-D. I'm excited! And the international board is quasi my home!!!

[operagirl]

Agreed on Philly Cheesesteak sandwiches. Tasted like junky processed crap to me.

[Mawrter]

You might have _had_ junky processed crap.... there's plenty of it. The good stuff is *VERY* good to me, but then I'm a native. You have to do someplace with a good rep among locals, with good meat and good rolls, and I prefer it with provolone (not Whiz), fried onions, mushrooms, and hot and sweet peppers.

[kchurchill5]

It was par ... nothing like I thought. I make awesome cheese steak, but good meat, good cheese and cooked right. I did enjoy the atmosphere and I am sure that is what it is all about as many similar type foods. So overall, good, but quality, NO. But like I said ... atmosphere and history and tradition is just as important!

NY delis not impressed, some chicago style Italian sandwich, OMG, what is the deal with that. The south I enjoyed most. Oysters fried, I don't like but that is just me. CA, pretty good, TX didn't like the style of cooking at most places. OK, KS and NE had some awesome BBQ however and was impressed by the food. Seattle, I don't have a complaint, but I did eat mostly seafood, but impressed.

[Mawrter]

Are you all talking about white asparagus like it's a Philly/PA thing, or is it just we're a bunch of SEPAians talking about white asparagus? I'm confused. And intrigued. I would be very happy to find a good local source for white asparagus!

I think of it as a Western European thing... the Spanish serve a lot of preserved white asparagus on salad, and in season in France and Italy. It's hard for me to find and if anyone knows of a good source, I'd be thrilled!

[linguafood]

The latter. I've tried white asparagus in the U.S. and it's just not the same. The terroir is actually important for it to develope its flavor... and the best asparagus still comes from Germany :-D

[Mawrter]

Well, I can't disagree since I've never had it in Germany. I think the terroir thing might be partly because it's a perennial. That is why I don't allocate space for it myself - I need my garden to be producing something more than once a year.

[Kelli2006]

I'm German and I never understood the love affair with white asparagus. It was a religion with my grandparents on both sides, but it's just "meh" to me.

[jesssala]

I lived with Germans (IN Germany) for about 6 years, I LOVE white asparagus! Fresh from the field, with fresh from the field (AKA organic - yes, you CAN taste the difference) boiled salted potatoes, a slice of boiled ham and a velvety hollandaise sauce on the asparagus. OMG my mouth is watering....

[linguafood]

Thanks, mine too, now '-). Ah well, 'only' have to wait another 6 months... >sigh<

[ElsieDee]

Boiled peanuts (in the south).

[lynnlato]

This is what I was going to post. Boiled peanuts are disgusting, IMHO.

[alkapal]

good! more boiled peanuts for me!

[bayoucook]

and me!

[Boccone Dolce]

Try them again Elsie. My first taste was like nibbling on a bo- weevil.
When someone brought them back from a roadside stand -they were hot and they were worlds better. Still not something I seek out (I really don't like to eat with my fingers all that much) but they were better hot.

[Cinnamon]

Me too. And I still remember the really good boiled-peanut pie at Billy Carter's restaurant in Plains.

[kubasd]

and me! especially the spicy ones.... my favorite southern snack ever, and I dont' even like regular peanuts. Side note, anyone make them at home?

[bayoucook]

I do, all the time. The easy way: in the crockpot with salt or cajun salt, cayenne etc. if I want spicy, even crab boil sometimes. Usually put them on before bed, then eat them sometimes the next day. Can just boil them stovetop too.

[alkapal]

bayoucook, from where do you buy your green peanuts?

[bayoucook]

Hi. Our Walmart Superstore has them a few times a year, and I also get them at farmer's markets and local stands. Just the smell of those green peanuts takes me back!

[DishDelish]

Boiled peanuts, a Hawaiian favorite! My hubby introduced me to this, it is not bad. He wanted to make them but we couldn't find raw peanuts anywhere in Alaska.

[alkapal]

harvest is in september, so you can get some fresh "green" peanuts online, soon.

[DishDelish]

I never thought of getting them online. What a great idea. Thanks! ;)

[alkapal]

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/430248
some sources mentioned here. i also recall "lee brothers" being mentioned: http://www.boiledpeanuts.com/index2.html

for roasted peanuts, i adore "golden gourmet" peanuts from n.c. crunchy, big, delish! http://www.peanut.com/locations.asp sign up for their email special offers. i just got a BOGO deal.

i'm going to find out if they'll sell them raw.....

~~~~~~
look! "boiled peanuts" on facebook (notice the festivals): http://www.facebook.com/pages/Boiled-...

[DishDelish]

Thanks Alka! I think my hubby wants to make them himself though so I'm going to look for raw peanuts online. I just found some on Amazon and I'm going to add it to my wish list!
I'm going to have to become a friend of boiled peanuts on facebook. ;)
Or maybe I can just ask him to bring some home from Hawaii...

[alkapal]

dish, call lee brothers and ask when the green peanuts will be in (sometime in september-october, iirc). then order them to boil! i think i'll have to do that this year -- and revive my boiled peanuts thread.

[DishDelish]

I just talked with my hubby yesterday about bringing home some raw peanuts from Hawaii. If he doesn't end up bringing them home for some reason I'll give them a call. =)

[alkapal]

when's harvest in hawaii? raw peanuts are one thing, but raw "green" peanuts (fresh out of the ground) are another.

[DishDelish]

I have no idea??? I'll have to ask my hubby.

[steakman55]

Perhaps they weren't salty enough, or were not cooked to right doneness, or mushy, or maybe you just didn't have them with a Coke. At any rate, done properly, they are unequalled.

[bayoucook]

yes, or a cold Barg's in the bottle - I seek them and find them addictive

[synergy]

Boiled peanuts. Couldn't get them down. I don't understand the love of them sorry.

[alkapal]

synergy, you did shell them, i hope! ;-).

[berkleybabe]

Oh yeah. We were coming back north from Fla., stopped at a roadside place where they came right out of the big cauldron....I'd rather eat wallpaper paste or poi. Bleah.

[kattyeyes]

OMG--poi--another regional favorite I just don't get! ;)

[DishDelish]

It is one of those tastes you have to grow up with I think, my kids love poi! I on the other hand do not ... but I try not to let them know that I don't because I want to encourage their adventurous palate. I added sugar and butter to it once and thought it was ok, but my hubby made me swear that I would never let the kids know I did this because he wants them to like it the pure Hawaiian way. I do like Kahlua pig in taro leaf though (which is the leaf of the taro root that they make poi from). Taro leaf sort of reminds me of spinach, which I love.

[alkapal]

you *did* shell them, right? ;-).

[Kajikit]

I desperately wanted to try boiled peanuts so we bought a bag from a roadside stand... one peanut each and we were DONE. Talk about vile! Smushy, soggy, and burnt-tasting all at once. What a waste of five dollars. But at least we know NEVER to buy them again!

[alliedawn_98]

Boiled peanuts from those roadside stands aren't a very good example. Lots of times they use dried peanuts and you should use green. If they tasted burnt and were soggy, then they were overcooked. A good boiled peanut tastes a lot like a fresh, not dried, black eyed pea when cooked.

[KristieB]

I agree. I found them more than slightly repulsive...(shudder)

[kchurchill5]

Love them!!

[bayoucook]

Me too!! So much so that I buy canned ones when they're not around.

[Morganna]

Maidrites in Iowa. :) In the end, it's just steamed ground beef. ;)

[sebetti]

As a former Maid-Rite employee (DSM zoo - one summer before college), I can reveal only that there is also a mystery powder that gets added which makes it much more than just ground beef....oh so much more!

Oh, hell. I ate them everyday for a summer and I still never got them.

[Morganna]

They served them at our school cafeterias, and they always ran out of them because those would be days when everyone bought hot lunch. Along with taco and pizza days, too. Don't get me wrong, maid rites were better then the regular turkey tetrazini crud by a long shot. I mean, I like just plain ground beef and all, still, I don't get why it's such a huge "thing". :)

[RGC1982]

Okay -- what, exactly, is a Maid Rite? Is it a burger?

[Morganna]

Take ground beef, put in a pan, add water (some people add minced onion, or some other flavouring), stir and stir until meat is browned thoroughly, cook covered, so it steams, as well. Serve on a bun (usually pretty wet, as well). There is great debate over what it is proper to serve it with. Catsup, mustard, pickle, onion. There are purists who debate this, but I -think- the most common is mustard and pickle. Not sure on that. :)

The term "loose meat sandwich" is completely accurate. :)

[turqmut]

And this is as bad as it sounds.

[Catskillgirl]

I just had a flashback to grammar school. There was something called "beef crumble" served weekly over whipped fake potatoes. The beef was loose and definitely wet - I'm betting they were serving us bastardized Maid-Rite's under another name. :-)

[Cinnamon]

Too bad the middle part of the country didn't have more Asian immigrants early on. Sigh. (Though I have had great fried catfish and roasts there, and very respectable BBQ in KC.)

[sebetti]

MaidRite's originated at a local (mostly small town) Iowa franchise named - MaidRite -- now owned and trademarked by the MaidRite corporation. There is a 'secret' spice blend that is added to the loose beef that makes it a MaidRite rather than a loose beef sandwich.

I think there were a lot of towns that were simply too small to have a McDonalds so they had MaidRites instead, hence the nostalgia.

Although I don't think it qualifies as gross or bad, they are exceptionally uninteresting.

[Morganna]

Oh I never thought they were gross. Just uninteresting, and messy . :)

[Bob W]

Great thread.

Boiled p-nuts -- most definitely. A vile product.
Scrapple -- not quite that bad but still pretty bad.

Now as for Maidrites -- AKA loose meat sandwiches -- I have to say that when I discovered these in Gainesville FL, at a place run by an ex-Iowan, I have to say I very much liked them and frequented that place often for a cheap relatively healthy lunch. This despite the disgusting name of loose meat sandwiches.

Here's one that I know leaves people cold: RI clamcakes. They always ask, "Where's the clam?" The answer: "If you squint, you might be able to see a bit of clam." If you want to eat clams, you order clams. You don't order clamcakes to eat clams. You order clamcakes because you're really hungry and you're at the beach. Clamcakes are summertime comfort food for Rhode Islanders. They are basically the same as conch fritters, for people who have had them in FL.

[al b. darned]

I lived in RI for ten years and never really got "stuffies," aka stuffed quahogs. Really just half a big clam shell filled with Stove Top Stuffing and put under the broiler. They claimed to have chopped quahogs in them, but I could never taste it.

The clam fritters we had in Vermont actually had discernible clams in them, but maybe that was a Long Island recipe, since the clams came from there (along with annoying relatives).

[Bob W]

Oh yeah, stuffies are just like clamcakes in that there is little clam in either, but you should be able to see little bits of clam. In any event, stuffies are best eaten drenched in hot sauce (and accompanied by a cold Narragansett), so whatever clam flavor there might be is totally overwhelmed.

Nuf said about all things Long Island 8<D

[al b. darned]

I hear you can get Nastygansett again but I'm not sure why you would want to.

The LI Clam Fritter recipe was very good, it was the relatives that came with them that were annoying.

[bayoucook]

As a life-long southerner I have to defend boiled peanuts. Maybe yours weren't cooked correctly? I don't know ONE person who doesn't crave them down here - I guess b/c we're raised on them. I love them plain boiled with salt, or jazzed up with crab boil and cajun seasoning. I guess it's a regional thing....

[Bob W]

We got some from a bus parked by the side of the road near Gainesville FL. I'm pretty sure that was a good source. LOL Mrs. W loves them -- she grew up visiting relatives in rural VA -- but me, not so much.

[Cinnamon]

A little OT, but one thing I loved about driving into NYC was that you could - if you wanted to - buy sugarcane off the back of a truck just over the bridge into the Bronx.

[BrooksNYC]

I've only ever had boiled peanuts at restaurants in Charleston, SC, but was instantly smitten. LOVED 'EM.

[alkapal]

bayoucook, i think i've asked you before about your source for green peanuts?

[bayoucook]

Hi alkapal! Yes, they're sold at the local groceries in season, as well as at roadside farm stands and produce stores. When I can get them, I boil a ton of them and freeze them.

[Ed Dibble]

Cincinnati chili. Not chili - just weird.

[jmckee]

It is weird. It is also indeed chili, albeit not of a bent that agrees with some other regions' conceptions.

[alwayscooking]

Not only doesn't it match other chilis, it just isn't good (and I've had the 2 major contenders). I guess only a local could stomach it. It tastes like someone read about chili and then went to their pre-war, mid-western pantry and threw stuff together.

[Davwud]

I'm not local and I love it. We often stop in a Skyline when we're driving through.

DT

[turqmut]

I've always found it odd, too, but I believe Cincinnati chili came from Greek immigrants interpretation of chili.

[Cinnamon]

That is the perfect description, of an awful food.

[themis]

When I saw this thread topic, my mind blurted, "Cincinnati chili." There is room in my philosophy for the possibility that I just have never had a good version -- but I have to say, just by basic components, it seems like a terrible idea from the start.

We have Whataburgers here, and I like to refer to them as Mustard Sandwiches. Doesn't seem to matter which location you make it to or what you order, it's just going to be swimming in fluorescent yellow mustard.

But then, we have In and Outs here as well, and I haven't sussed out their appeal, either. I don't want to have to learn some sort of secret language to get a decent burger and fries. I just want a decent burger and fries, and I have never gotten one there.

[travelmad478]

I had the same reaction--my first thought on seeing the thread title was Cincinnati chili. I find it pretty horrible. My best friend is from Cincinnati and she insisted on taking me to Skyline, as well as some pizza place (Rose's, I think?) and an ice cream place (the name started with a G) that are all supposedly local standouts and her nostalgic favorites. They were all bad. Not just mediocre--bad!

[Davwud]

I can't comment on the other two but Skyline is not bad. You just don't like Cinci chili is all.

I firmly believe if they called it some other name, more people would like it.

DT

[alwayscooking]

Anything served atop watery overdone speghetti tastes evil.

[travelmad478]

> I firmly believe if they called it some other name, more people would like it.

That may well be true, but no matter what you call it, I don't like cinnamon-tinged Sloppy Joe meat, which is essentially what Cincinnati chili is. And the vile hot dogs served with it don't improve matters.

[Davwud]

That's fair enough but if you read threads on it people complain that it's not chili. It is, just a different kind. It really isn't anything like what is expected and is thought of as crap.
It's like saying that Tex Mex isn't Mexican. Of course not, it's Tex Mex.

DT

[jacquelyncoffey]

Cincinnati chili was the first thing that pooped into my head, Skyline is pretty bland, and I never bothered to try any others. The pizza place is LaRosa's, and the ice cream place is Graeter's. LaRosa's is lousy, their sauce, which everyone raves about, is loaded with sugar. Graeter's I didn't get until I tried the Black Raspberry Chunk, which is their specialty. I love it, and any other flavors with the chocolate chunks, those are key. The other flavors are meh, not even close to the ice cream I could get in CT - sigh :-(

[travelmad478]

Those are exactly the places I was taken to. That pizza sauce was NASTY. I couldn't believe anyone would serve it! Since when is pizza supposed to be sweet?

I had the black walnut ice cream and it tasted like bad gum.

[alkapal]

>>>>Cincinnati chili was the first thing that pooped into my head<<<<<

i'm guessin' that was a freudian slip?

[jacquelyncoffey]

It most definitely was a slip, an appropriate one at that ;-)

[BobB]

The ice cream place is Graeter's. I found it to be pretty decent. I have yet to try Skyline or any other Cincy chili, but my understanding is that you can't look at it as chili, that's a misnomer, it's actually a sort of Greek-style meat sauce.

[jmckee]

....except that it IS indeed chili. Not chili as understood by Texans or chile as interpreted by New Mexicans, but an oddly spiced chili.

As a native Cincinnatian I kind of wonder why folks are so opposed to our local specialty. Like it or don't -- but it is chili, and it is ours, and we love it. It's every bit as much chili as Philly Cheesesteak is a steak sandwich, as a Chicago deep dish pizza is a pizza.

[BobB]

"It's every bit as much chili as Philly Cheesesteak is a steak sandwich, as a Chicago deep dish pizza is a pizza."

I actually agree with you there, but probably not in the way you'd like. ;-)

[alwayscooking]

Oh my goodness - I so agree. I thought I just hadn't tried enough places for either the cheesesteak or pizza - the chili I've, unfortunately, have had enough times and places to really know that it's just not very good (having not grown up there, I wasn't given the Cincy taste training).

[jmckee]

I don't think it's training. I think it's genetic; we're born knowing that here chili is a more runny, oddly spiced concoction that naturally should be served atop spaghetti with cheese, onions, and beans.

[emmyru]

I am a native cincinnatian who now lives up North. It kills me that I can't get to skyline easily. So I just have to defend the stuff. I will say though that I think you really have to be from Cincy to enjoy it. The first time my now husband came to Cincinnati with me and tried skyline he hated it. I almost had to end our engagement. Now he loves the stuff. I also like Larosas so maybe I just have bad taste in food. :) Now I want a 3 way and a coney.

[Sandwich_Sister]

My husband is from Columbus Ohio, and my father is from Cleveland, move to florida when he was 19 and has been here ever since though. Anyway the first time I ever had cincinati chilli was when my husband, then boyfriend at the time made it for me. I thought it was delicious although I was weirded out when he said the meat sauce was what he always puts on his hotdogs for a chili dog.

My southern roots, I had never heard of that, we always just put day old southern bean and meat chili on our chilli dogs.

[travelmad478]

Ditto! ;-)

[MakingSense]

Cincinnati chili is basically the meat sauce component of moussaka.

A brief history is included with this recipe
http://whatscookingamerica.net/Beef/C...
but it's fairly common knowledge:
"Macedonian immigrant Tom Kiradjieff created Cincinnati chili in 1922. With his brother, John, Kiradjieff opened a small Greek restaurant called the Empress.
The restaurant did poorly however, until Kiradjieff started offering a chili made with Middle Eastern spices, which could be served in a variety of ways.
He called it his "spaghetti chili."
Kiradjieff's "five way" was a concoction of a mound of spaghetti toped with chili, chopped onion, kidney beans, and shredded yellow cheese, served with oyster crackers and a side order of hot dogs topped with more shredded cheese."

[san antonio eater]

oh my! can't say that sounds very appetizing but next time I am in Cincinnati I am goin to try it - just to say I did!

[Bob W]

Here in the DC area we have a small chain called Hard Times Chili that offers a few different kinds of chili. I confess to always getting the Cincinnati. I kinda like it.

[kubasd]

Same here. It's actually the only time i've had cincinnati chili, and I loved it. I got it served over cornbread with cheese, sour cream, onions, and tomatoes... Just delicious and perfect after a late night of drinking.

[lvanleer]

I also admit to getting the Cincinnati style at Hard Times in the DC area because my mom made a similar version and served it over spaghetti with cheese and onions even before Hard Times opened.

[StewieBoy]

Crystal Bergers are the same - mustard on a bun with dry burger to sop it up. Nasty bit of business!

[bayoucook]

The ones I've had were delicious. Mustard, catsup and onions on a steamed soft roll. Heaven.

[KevinB]

Grits. I apologize in advance to Southerners, but on annual golf trips to South Carolina, I tried - I really did - to get into grits, but just never made the leap. Honest to god home fries are what I want with my morning eggs.

Love Waffle Hut, though!

[markabauman]

Lutefisk

[sebetti]

errrr....I don't think anyone actually likes Lutefisk. It's just tradition.

[hilltowner]

My grandfather LOVED lutefisk. LOVED.

[Morganna]

Oh yeah, lutefisk. bleah! Lefse, warm, fresh, with butter, YUM but lutefisk!? eeeww. :)

[Passadumkeg]

I like lutefisk.

[Morganna]

Eeee! You're EEEEVil. ;)

Lutefisk is... just... weird texture, weird taste, ewgie. :) I will admit, I only had it once, back when I was in my teens. MAYbe I'd like it now... I like a lot of things now I couldn't stand then. :)

[Passadumkeg]

I associate lutefisk w/ Christmas and a huge smorgosbord feed. I prefer lutefisk to Poptarts any day.

[Morganna]

Yah, that's when I had it. Visiting a friend's family up in Minnesota around the holidays. Big party, food spread, ooo lala. I had fresh, gramma-made lefse with farm butter (one side of the family had a farm with cows, mOooooOOO!). I know I'll never be able to repeat that particular lefse experience, so I just cherish it in my mind. :) But the lutefisk, it... it scarred me. ;)

[Chocolatesa]

Actually I'd like to try that sometime. My mom is from Sweden and I love Swedish food.

[Morganna]

I'm a heathen, I don't like grits in the south, either. Though I have to be honest, the only grits I've ever seen available in the south were plain, made with water, and maybe served with some butter. I prefer my grits doctored by cooking them in chicken broth and chipoltle powder then mixing in shredded sharp cheddar. :)

[Mawrter]

That sounds like Southern polenta to me, and I'd like it. Nothing more insipid to me than polenta made with plain water ... it needs to be cooked with something flavorful!

[Morganna]

Shhh you'll start a fight. :) polenta and grits are actually relatives of each other. Well, technically, they're the same idea, and they're also the same as cornmeal mush, from early American cooking, but don't say that out loud, we'll get whacked. They're cornmeal that's been cooked to soft in liquid. Those from the south have vociferously stated that the cornmeal used in grits is different from that used in polenta, and I don't have enough expertise in either product to either confirm or deny this (some people say southern grits are treated with lye, but that's hominy grits, and not all southern grits are hominy grits from what I understand). Aaaanyway, Alton Brown did a show on grits, and said that really, polenta and cornmeal mush, and grits were the same thing. I have known Alton to be mistaken about some things, but not very often. :) There, now we've gone and started a war!

BTW, for those of you convinced that I am wrong, or Alton is wrong or whatever, I am not going to respond to posts "correcting" me. It is good enough for me that I've had polenta, grits, and cornmeal mush, and I've actually -made- all of them, as well. I'm content with my opinion, but thanks for trying to make me see the light if you're so inclined.

[applehome]

Polenta = plain or corn grits, (not hominy). Maybe - but you ignore what people say about their differences at your own peril - not anybody else's. Your pre-refusal to engage in a good dialectic hurts us to some extent - there's nothing like a good debate that people can learn from. Is Polenta and Grits really the same thing? Can I make Polenta from a tube of grits? But mainly, it's up to you (as it is to each Chowhound) to learn to differentiate for your own benefit.

The culture and lore - the origins and evolutions and names and products and recipes are different - and these differences are important in food. Is eating Italian beefsteak the same as the porterhouse at Peter Luger? Is blue-fin tuna carpaccio the same as sashimi? The products are somewhat the same, the experiences are not.

Just because YOU can't tell the difference between hominy and plain corn or all the wonderful heritage grains (like the specialized Italian red trentino flint corn for polenta) or new-crop vs. stored, or any number of other incredible variations (including the grain size and milling method), doesn't mean that others can't or don't get into it and learn to appreciate the wonderful variations of corn.

Have you even been to the Anson mills site or others like it? The background page is particularly wonderful. The founder, Glenn Roberts, speaks of the foods his mother used to talk about, growing up in the low country - the foods that were no longer available because people had stopped differentiating and understanding their heritage. People like Roberts have spent a lot of time bringing back the heirloom varieties and differentiating and experimenting with modern corns. Obviously, it's meaningful to someone.

I'm no Southerner, but being Japanese, I get into rice seriously, and can taste differences in grades of rice, as well as types, freshness (again, new crop). I love to taste different rices side by side - compare a standard grade calrose, like Nishiki with their premium product, Tamanishiki, and really understand that underlying "riceness". Most Americans who didn't grow up with rice every day could care less whether they're eating Carolina long-grain rice or California medium grain calrose. Pass the gravy.

Ditto corn. It's cultural, and there are real differences that the cultures understand - even if those on the outside do not. It may all be the same to you. But those that are seriously into grits or polenta will know what differentiates them, what corns milled in what ways, mixed with what ingredients, will yield the results they seek. You can certainly use Quacker Oats quick grits for your polenta, but if you tasted great examples of each, made by people who know and understand their heritage, they won't be made from the same product. (Of course, grits lovers wouldn't be caught dead with the cardboard tube stuff, either.)

As far as Alton goes, his grits program perfectly shows the level he operates at. He simply didn't get into any detail - his research staff never delved into the real effects of nixtamalization, how its done today, and by whom, or just explore the differences in flavor between plain and hominy grits. It's a TV show - what you remember from it is what you wanted to. Unless you've got all his programs indexed to the scenes, in a searchable database, it's hard to use entertainment videos as references. You're much better off with BOOKS!!! With indexes! Get a copy of Harold McGee's On Food and Cooking. He gets into the size of milling, the differences between dry-milled and wet-milled products - he indicates that Polenta was originally a barley product, talks about the different ways the flavors are developed. Alton is rarely going to be the best person to quote or reference - he's not a primary source, neither a chef, a researcher, a writer nor a scientist - he's a TV star.

[MakingSense]

Thank you, Applehome. A beautiful explanation of why real grits are worth soaking overnight, why they don't need anything other than plain water, and why I don't mind tending them on the stove for 60 to 90 minutes until they look just right.
Oh, and why, when that sweet, pure corn smell fills my house, I know in my heart and soul, why it's worth paying so much for them.

And I feel like that about good rice too. Ah, the sweet scent of it...

[alkapal]

applehome, you say "tube of grits"; do you mean the quaker quick grits?

i love all kinds of good grits, but sometimes don't have an hour to make them, so i have and use the quaker. when i have the designer grits <irony intended>, i'll use them, too. right now, i'm using bob's red mill polenta/grits <their label>, which are light yellow. i need to re-order my rockland plantation stone-ground grits, too: http://thenibble.com/reviews/main/rub...

<ps, the link has some interesting info about white vs. yellow grits.>

[Morganna]

Just fot the sake of clarity, I can tell the difference between hominy grits and cornmeal. I can even tell the differences between cornmeals (I happen to keep a fancy local cornmeal on hand that has a much more complex flavour and that I like a great deal, it's from Nitty Gritty Grains)..

What I was saying was that I couldn't tell the difference between polenta and cornmeal mush and grits. As recipes go, they're the same thing, the same process, pretty much the same end product with only the variations you get from -any- recipe when you vary the ingredients. From a technical standpoint, grits, polenta, and cornmeal mush are prepared the same way.

They're three names for the same thing. Just like in latin America, each country has their own name for tamale, but they all -mean- the same thing, the same general preparation method, even if the ingredients vary a bit and thus the flavour. It's the same food concept.

[applehome]

Yes, of course, all corn mush is corn mush. All beef is beef, all sushi is sushi, and all beer is beer. But just like you don't barbecue real Wagyu Strip for 12 hours, you don't eat all grits as polenta. We're chowhounds - foodies. We yearn to tell the difference between Kurobuta and the supermarket leaned out pork - we want to learn the best ways to cook and eat both. So I'd be real interested in having some of that Italian heirloom red trentino flint, cooked by a polenta expert - maybe even several experts who would argue about cooking times and recipes. And I'd love to try some of those shrimp and grits that prize-winner made against Flay in his Shrimp and grits showdown in Georgia. I wouldn't have him cook my polenta, and I wouldn't have those Italian food expert chefs cook my shrimp and grits.

I really don't understand why, as a chowhound, you will distinguish some foods, but not recognize that others will do the same for other foods, perhaps ones that you do not appreciate. I realize that, that argument could be taken to the extreme - why, for example, l do I not appreciate those that wish to differentiate between McD's and BK, and write about that difference here. But, in fact, we have a board dedicated to that purpose, even if I can't appreciate it.

There are an incredible number of different tamals and tamales all over Mexico alone, never mind the other Latin and South American countries and regions. It would indeed be a wonderful Chowhound tour to try to experience every one.

[Morganna]

That isn't the point or the distinction I'm trying to make. Frankly, your attitude in this discussion is precisely why I was unwilling to engage in the first place. Yes, there are tons of different styles of tamales but they're all STILL TAMALES and no one tries to say "no, these aren't tamales" when you are talking about them.

Yet people like you continually insist that polenta and grits and cornmeal mush are -different- which is -confusing- to people who don't know much about this cooking stuff or about cooking with cornmeal specifically. So what happens is newbies ask "What is grits? Is it like Polenta?" they get rebuffed, told very pedantically "No, they're not".

Which, in one respect might be technically correct, it is still misinformation for the poor schmuck who has fallen into this little web of elitism. Yes, grits are -too- like polenta. And cornmeal mush. It's the same food concept in the same way that the diversity of tamales in Latin America are all still tamales and you can still just call them tamales even if one set is wrapped in corn husks and another in banana leaves.

As for why I'm "picking on" grits, it is grits/polenta that I see this elitist attitude happening most frequently with. People come away confused, thinking that they're missing some very obvious difference given how vociferously grits hounds defend the difference between grits and polenta.

And, by the way, anyone who can make good grits can make good polenta can make good cornmeal mush. Thinking that you need to be some special sort of person to prepare one or the other successfully is also elitist. It's liquid, cornmeal of some sort, and flavourings. It's not rocket science. Folks implying that there's some special secret you have to be born knowing or spend years learning is just another reason I hate this conversation.

For those folks who have never had grits or never had polenta, and who have been confused (as I was for years) about what magical difference there is between them that you think you're too much of a visigoth to undertand because of how emphatically people defend one or the other from being likened to one or the other... there is no magic. It's cornmeal of some sort, cooked in a liquid of some sort, with whatever spices or flavourings you might apply.

[applehome]

Absolutely - And steak is red meat of some sort, cooked over heat in some way, with whatever spices and flavorings (sorry US spelling) you might apply.

You can't make too much of this food stuff, you'll end up being a food nerd of some sort - a foodie or even a chowhound, for crying out loud...

[bayoucook]

Morganna - the first time I had polenta (creamy, in Italy) I loudly said "But this is just like grits, with cheese!" - loved it. And I make great grits, polenta and cornmeal mush. Love that stuff!

[Sam Fujisaka]

Just another note on "heritage grains". There are so few grain varieites in use in the US now that Americans don't seem to understand how vast is crop genetic diversity and have come up with "heritage varieites" when one or two traditoinals somehow leak back into the system. Rice, maize, potatoes, and beans each still count with thousands of traditional varieties still grown around the world. Just go south of your border to start finding many, many traditional maize and bean varieites.

[lynnlato]

I don't "get" grits as a breakfast food - my tastebuds always wanted to know why there wasn't any brown sugar and maple syrup on it (they always confused grits w/ cream of wheat). But I like grits as a savory side with shrimp, scallops or even as a substitute for polenta (they are very close cousins).

[poptart]

I totally agree! The watery, run-of-the-mill ordinary grits are a real yawn. Only had grits once that were truly wonderful...coarse ground, flavorful.

If given a choice between regular grits and regular cream of wheat, I'd choose cream of wheat!

[turqmut]

Depending on how they're prepared, grits can be stellar or terrible. I had some at a plantation bed and breakfast that were incredibly good-cream maybe?

[quazi]

if I had only tried grits at waffle hut(waffle house maybe?) I would hate them too. thin watery grits. go to a better restaurant and get shrimp and grits. then tell me. The best way to have them is stone ground made with milk and/or stock. it ike the difference between boiling bag white rice and good basmati

[lynnlato]

Amen! Well said, quazi. I love shrimp and grits.

[MakingSense]

Then you still don't really like grits.
You could just as easily pour the shrimp sauce over pasta, couldn't you?
Proper grits should be stone ground, made with water. http://ansonmills.com/recipes-corn-2.htm
Maybe you have never had really good grits, prepared properly.

They are perfect breakfast food with butter, salt and pepper. Never, ever with syrup! That hurts my teeth to think about it.
If you're at home, you can cut up your fried eggs into the grits but that looks tacky when you're in a restaurant.

[bayoucook]

Making Sense - agree totally. A quick grit or an instant grit (ugh) never gets in this house. If we can't get stone ground, we get the original long-cooking ones. Salt, freshly ground pepper, real butter....yum. Grillades and grits, a favorite too.

[Davwud]

We have some quick grits around but they're usually covered up when we cook them.
I have to admit, I was stunned how exponentially better stone ground grits are.
Instant grits are about as good as rice cakes.

DT

[lynnlato]

I have had them prepared "properly" and I don't like them. The only way I like them is shrimp and grits style. Call it what you want, but that's my preference. I think generally Northerners look at grits and think "oh, like cream of wheat" but then taste it and are shocked that it is a savory dish, not a sweetened one. I understand that they are not traditionally served w/ syrup or anything sweet. I was just saying that's the expectation from someone not from the south, generally speaking.

[MakingSense]

That is so odd. I was visiting some friends in the Nawth and was served a bowl of what I assumed to be some sort of textureless, overprocessed grits, until I put the vile crap into my mouth.
OMG!!! What was that? Wallpaper paste???? Nope. Cream of Wallpaper Wheat. That stuff isn't even fit for hospital food. Why would anyone eat that?

[fern]

Are you referring to shrimp grits or cream of wheat? I love a bowl of steaming cream of wheat with brown sugar stirred in. Actually, now that you mention it, wallpaper paste isn't so far off! Even so, l love it. It's good chilled, sliced, and fried in butter, too.

I have never had grits! I ought to change that, yes?

[Davwud]

Just make sure they're good.

DT

[chef4hire]

tacky, but Betsy's pancake house doesn't seem to mind...2 eggs over easy, grilled andouille and double grits, please ~ $5.65 and I can mash it all together without one sideways glance

LOVE me some grits

[bayoucook]

Me too, chef. In fact, it may be my main comfort food. When I get sick, I crave them - just grits in a bowl with a spoon, real butter and freshly ground black pepper (stomach growling).

[al b. darned]

As a Northerner, I don't get grits, either. To me they taste like bland Cream of Wheat. They're ok once in a while, but not every day for b'fast. I'll take home fries with my bacon & eggs, please.

[Avalondaughter]

Grits are like popcorn - not much by themselves, but are a vehicle for salt and butter.

If you can eat polenta, you can eat grits. Purists will tell you they're different. They're not.

I also like grits baked in a casserole with lots of garlic and cheese. BTW, I'm a northerner whose completley northern family always likes cheese grits at holidays. I don't know how this came to be.

[kattyeyes]

Maybe the milkman had a southern accent? JK, JK! ;)

[jmckee]

Well, um, yeah, they ARE different; polenta is made from cornmeal. Grits are hominy. Texture is very different, a bit more of a firm bite to grits.

[MakingSense]

They ARE different and you can taste the difference once you eat REAL grits and polenta. You'll never do that if you're covering up the corn flavor with garlic and cheese. The pure corn flavor is missing from supermarket grits and most standard products. God save us all from <shudder> instant grits which must be one of the last vestiges and outrages of Reconstruction.

Anson Mills markets their own grits grown organically from heritage seed.
For a description of the differences among the types of corn used for polenta v. grits and among the various types of grits:
http://ansonmills.com/grits.htm

And they are something all "by themselves." Clouds of Southern Dreams that make the butter and salt proud.

[applehome]

Corn or plain grits = polenta, made from the whole corn kernel. Hominy = posole, made from corn that's had the hull removed and stripped of their bran and germ, either mechanically or by nixtamalization (processed with alkali). Hominy grits = grits made from the processed hominy. So not all grits are = polenta.

Quick grits = finer cut grits which cook quicker.

Instant grits = tasteless junk, just like instant oatmeal, etc... parboiled, powdered, processed beyond recognition... it's not even the same food

Nixtamalization not only enhances digestability, but also offers nutiritional benefits - conversion of niacin and amino acids to a more absorbable form. Its invention probably saved the Meso-American civilizations.

[KevinB]

Well, all this exposition might explain why I still don't like grits; I don't like polenta either. Flavourless mush. If I have to have a starch, I'd rather have pasta, potatoes, or bread (white rice is OK for Asian food) than grits or polenta.

[alkapal]

applehome, your explanation is right on!

and to think many chowhound threads on grits have gone on and on and on!

[Mawrter]

I can't remember ever liking grits in the South, either, although recently my dh started making a breakfasty thing with polenta meal - you know, cook it like cereal, add salt, butter, honey. I like it. But we all do better with protein in the morning, so I never bothered to see exactly how unorthodox his is.

[Chocolatesa]

I've never had either grits or polenta (with the exception of firm polenta in a tube bought at the grocery store and fried in a pan with some sliced cheese on top, didn't love it, didn't hate it as far as I can remember) but I'd like to try some sometime.

[mollyomormon]

Paella. Maybe I've just never had a great version, but every time I have had it, some of the seafood has been overcooked and the rice tends to be gummy. I love the idea, but the execution has always fallen short for me.

[linguafood]

Ah, see. Good paella is a whole other story --

[mnos]

Sweet Tea. It is so syrupy and excessively sweet. I like iced tea with maybe a little bit of sugar but sweet tea is over the top.

[al b. darned]

Actually I prefer mine unsweetened. That stuff they sold at McD's last summer was enough to melt your teeth. If that was even a faint example of sweet tea, no thank you.

[alkapal]

mickey d's sweet tea (year round here and florida, i know for sure) is the "sweet tea" sugar profile.

[EWSflash]

The kid at McD's drive-through told me they put 4 pounds of sugar in for every three-gallon recipe of sweet tea they make. Made my teeth hurt and my stomach churn. Sweet tea is an abomination of the tea leaf. And I lived in Tennessee far a few years as a kid.

[kattyeyes]

If that's true, THAT is VILE!!!

[Sam Fujisaka]

That's no more, and possibly less, sugar than what's in a soft drink (and the reason I don't drink them).

[bayoucook]

Sweet tea is a staple here in the South. For a gallon of tea I use a scant 1/3 cup of sugar; my family has always made a very lightly sweetened tea, the way we like it.

[kattyeyes]

That sounds much nicer. I have nothing against sugar--just can't fathom having more gallons of sugar per gallons of liquid as outlined above.

[beachmouse]

To me, the key to sweet tea is to ask for it half sweet and half unsweet so you can taste the tea along with the simple syrup. Any restaurant in the South I've been in is pretty much used to people sometimes asking for it that way.

[TampaAurora]

A cut sweet tea or an Arnold Palmer will make any day better.

[ktmoomau]

oooh I loooove Arnold Palmers...

[HungryRubia]

Ugh! I hate sweet tea too! I don't get it!

[swamp]

I visited Wisconsin and tried the boiled whitefish that everyone raved about. HORRIBLE. I am a huge fish eater and just could not understand it.

Just for the record I am a native Texan and absolutely love Whataburger, one of the main things I missed when living in Wyoming for a few years. Pickled jalapenos make them even better.

[emerilcantcook]

When I was living in WI, I never understand the deal with fish boil either. But of course I don't practice the meatless Friday thing and I like fishy fish. I also think it is more of a symbolic ritual rather than a meal that people consume just for the taste. Most locals I knew of treated the Friday fish night as a social outing.

Cheeseballs also scared me, a lot. Especially when they were pinkish.

On the other hand, bratwurst on mash is something I dream about every other day.

[chowser]

Marmite, vegemite, frickles

[pastry634]

I live in Milwaukee, and I still don't get the fascination with butter burgers. One of the most famous burger places in the city (Solly's) puts a ridiculous amount of butter on the burger. I cannot describe the amount in words, so I'll let the link do the talking. Regardless, I think its quite disgusting.

http://roadfood.com/Reviews/Overview....
(And yes, that puddle below the burger is all butter)

[Jen76]

I was born and raised in Milwaukee. I miss butter burgers (along with good frozen custard, stuffed pizza and the cheesecake squares from National Bakery), especially from Kopp's. Culver's opened a store here in metro-Phoenix, but they've never been as good as Kopp's, imho.

[Chocolatesa]

I love butter! That looks delicious :D When I was a kid we were too poor to afford real butter so when we bought it instead of margarine for Christmas I'd eat it straight in tiny spoonfuls :P

[purple goddess]

There is a very fine art to the spreading and eating of Vegemite. Spread right, on white toast, with lashings of butter, it is God's own food. The key is to have a very thin layer.

White toast with Vegie and sliced tomatoes = best hang/bong over food ever.

[KevinB]

"Hangover" food I eat five to six hours after the event. But when does one eat "bong over" food? 5 or six minutes later?!

[purple goddess]

yep. Great food for the munchies.. or so I've been told.

[ola]

poutine

[lagatta]

I'm Québécoise and don't like poutine. Think it is a waste of frites. But often people use it as a greasy thing to ingest upon pub-closing time.

[Bryn]

I just find that restaurants use such crappy gravy. I love a good poutine with squeaky curds and good gravy.

[The Chemist]

Living in Montreal, I can have it about once a year and enjoy it. Any more than that and it's too much. It's hard to avoid when you have friends inviting you to La Banquise every weekend. If I have it, it has to be the classic, non of this 20 toppings thing. And the cheese MUST be squeaky curds...

If you can't hear the squeak, it's not poutine.

[Mawrter]

I was all excited to try it.... and finally got a chance about five years ago, after many poutine-less trips to Montreal. And.... yuck.

[travelmad478]

I had the same reaction to poutine when I had it in Montreal this past winter. Yech, mainly. I had plenty of other great food in the city but that was a major disappointment. I'd rather just have french fries with gravy, diner style.

[Mawrter]

Good eating in Montreal! Love that city!

[BrooksNYC]

Great poutine is absolutely world-class. I'd kill for good poutine in NYC! And yes, Montreal is a fabulous city.

[John Manzo]

You can find "good poutine" anywhere in Canada.

[Davwud]

LOL

DT

[alliedawn_98]

Fried tenderloins (pork) in Indiana. I lived where they supposedly have the best tenderloins and they are shipped even to Great Britain. I simply wasn't impressed with them at all.

[lynnlato]

Wow, the South is taking it tough, eh?

[fern]

I'd been told not to miss the toasted ravioli in St Louis,, MO but I wasn't thrilled.

[mom22tots]

Okra...no matter how it's prepared, I think I'm missing its appeal.

[felix the hound]

Have you tried indian style okra ( bindi)?

[mom22tots]

No...totally unfamiliar.

[huaqiao]

I think the South gets the brunt of the hate because they have more distinctive regional cuisine. I really can't think of very many regional foods here in Southern California. Anything that's any good gets exported pretty quickly(French dip, pastrami burger, ranch dressing).

[poptart]

Ranch dressing! I never got that one. Milky dressing on a salad is kind of gross to me.

[janetms383]

Ranch dressing on a pizza! Don't get it, don't want to

[Passadumkeg]

Fried okra.

[phoenikia]

Gjetost (Brown cheese) from Norway.

Marmite and Vegemite.

Foie Gras in France. Regardless of the price/treatment/presentation, it just tastes like underdone fatty liver to me, and I'd rather eat other things in France.

[Humbucker]

Proper Foie Gras IS underdone fatty liver, is it not?

[phoenikia]

Yep, guess I just don't get it.

[Passadumkeg]

Gjetost is just Norwegian peanut butter, enjoy it just the same.

[lynnlato]

Is that salmon paste in a tube? A Swedish friend of mine used to turn his nose up at peanut butter, saying "it's the most vile thing on Earth" and in the same breath would tell us how he grew up in Sweden eating salmon paste in a tube. This I found to be the most vile thing ever. I guess another example of a regional thing. :)

[hangrygirl]

Gjetost/Geitost/Brunost is brown cheese, traditionally made with Goat's milk - although I prefer versions that use part cow's milk, as it's a bit milder:

"Brunost is made by boiliing a mixture of milk, cream and whey carefully for several hours so that the water evaporates. The heat turns the milk sugar into caramel which gives the cheese its characteristic taste."

People usually hate it or love it, but I think the flavour's tangy, sweet and delicious! I kind of think the psychological thing of it being brown has a lot to do with it.

IMPORTANT NOTE:
If you are in Norway and want to try Brunost, do not confuse it with Gamalost, another brown cheese. Literally translated, it means "old cheese", and it's much more of an acquired taste.

Wikipedia compares the flavor to Roquefort, I compare it to old socks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamalost

[Passadumkeg]

In case I forget, happy 17th of May! I might work as a kayak guide in Hardanger Fjord in the summer of 2010.

[lynnlato]

Interesting... I have to say, it sounds good to me. The Brunost, that is. :)

[kattyeyes]

That's funny--I do think "old cheese" is reminiscent of old socks. :)

[Mawrter]

See, honestly, I think "old socks" is a good thing on some cheese. I haven't tried the Norwegian thing, but I would, given the chance.

[kattyeyes]

I know what you mean as there are enough cheeses in the world that fit the "old socks" flavor profile, so clearly people eat them and like them. They just don't do it for me. I tried one just the other day when I was cheese shopping and what it was, I don't recall (no need to remember something you'll never buy). I was especially grateful for the next cheese nibble I sampled after that to get that socky taste outta my mouth.

[Mawrter]

I know exactly what you mean. When it's bad, it's bad, and you want that taste OUTTA your mouth!

[Passadumkeg]

So many tastes are learned. After living in Norway for 5 years, we are very fond of gjeit ost. There is always a block of Ski Queen in the fridge and when we go to Portlnd, we pick up a better grade of brun ost. It is as common in Norway as horrid American (erzats) cheese is here. We usually have the gjeitost at the start of a frukost board breakfast on top of Wasa Knekebrod and topped w/ warm sliced hard boiled egg.
I hate these "what don't you like" threads' so un chowish and very whiney. Too much negative energy. I feel that if a culture or large group of people like something, there must be something to it.

[alkapal]

yet those very threads are some of the longest! go figure! passa, i agree with you; i think the "what i don't like" threads are not very useful. <although i cannot claim that i've *never* posted on one. ;-) i think this thread, though, is not quite in that category.>

[Passadumkeg]

While I'm grousing, I also wonder about this Northern dislike of Southern food. Scargod and I just finished a road trip through the deep south and the best food we had was southern. Grits are new to me and I love them; especially w/ a thick slab of country ham and a couple of eggs. This was in southern Georgia. An incredibly beautiful area. Savannah may be my favorite US city.

[fern]

I think sometimes people want to share in the experiences of others by joining in with a "Yes! I know what you mean!" or a "Listen to this one!".

What is unfortunate is when we devolve into "That is DISGUSTING. How can anyone eat that?" and "Jane, you ignorant slut, if you weren't so far beneath the real chowhounds you'd be eating this thing the right way and loving it."

Now I have to go google some of the foods in your post. I can't resist. :) I learn so much here. Love that.

[fern]

I love cheese so had to look into those you mentioned. Saw the brun ost described as caramely. Sounds delicious. I will watch for it, although life in suburbia doesn't always provide.
All of the recent travel focus on the area has gotten my attention. I could begin my trip research here with some cheese. :)

Not implying we're taking a big trip, it will be a long time off.
Still, it doesn't hurt to prepare.

Did you and Scargod post about your trip? I'll search around.

eta: Found it. Here's the link in case others are interested:
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/618143

[Passadumkeg]

Fern, we are on the tail end (2 more years) of putting 5 kids through college. We drive 21 and 23 year old SAABs; eat from our garden and from what I hunt, catch and forage; we seldom dine out; but boy do we save up for vacations when we usually visit our kids. My "new" Miata is 21 years old, but it gave me reason for a chow trip w/ Scargod, God bless him. June 20 we go visit 2 of our kids that live in Asia and see my new grandkeg.
Carpe Chow!

[fern]

My hat is off to you! Our last one (of 6, but one didn't really go to school much) goes off in the fall. 3 in school next year. I think we can, I think we can...
The Miata sounds like a howl, and your trip! What a blast!
We're like you, driving the cars until they give a little cough and then wander off to die. No cable TV, even had dial up until less than a year ago! Our kids think we're Amish. I've always planted a garden but have decided not to buy ANY flowers for pots or beds this year and only put in edibles. I'm excited about that.
We've never had lots of extra $ but we have managed to get the kids through college (so far!), give them study abroad experiences, and take some great trips ourselves. Just depends where you want your money to go, right?

2 kids in Asia at the same time, wonderful!
*Hearty congratulations* on the new baby, what an exciting and joyous trip it will be.

[bayoucook]

fern - that is exactly what I objected to earlier in this thread. It's so unpolite to say that a region's beloved food is disgusting. Much better to say it just wasn't to your liking. I had a hard time with this thread a few times since it seemed to dump on the South a lot. Then I realized 1) we're a very distinguishable area; and 2) most people lump all southern food into one place, like Making Sense talked about in one of the earlier responses. Virginia food is not the same as Mississippi food - even Mississippi food isn't like Mississippi food! We have the Delta region, the central part that is a country of its own, and the south, totally different from the rest of the state. So - I got over it! But I still cringe at "disgusting". It's rude!

[fern]

I'm with you. My guess is people don't necessarily intend to be that rude but fail to realize that when you dis my food you dis my culture/family/history. Don't talk about my Momma, either.

I find the history of it all fascinating but I'm generally curious, anyway.

I've enjoyed this thread for that reason, learned many things about who eats what and where. Like you said, it's too bad when folks don't approach with an open mind or at least try to be polite if their experience wasn't positive.

I do think the insults and snobbery get ridiculous but also believe most of the time the poster just didn't think that part through.

Maybe I have to believe that in order to justify my addiction to this site. :)

[bayoucook]

(laughing) me too!

[thew]

i disagree. if i find, say, natto disgusting, that reflects nothing more than my personal taste about a food. it reflects nothing about how i might or might feel about japanese culture, or your family.

[kchurchill5]

I love southern food, however I did say the philli steak was gross or disgusting. Please don't put me in that category. I just can't agree with cheese whiz and processed meat. Southern cooking is fresh local ingredients. Now beef on weck, NY, fresh meat good rolls, fresh made. Chicago pizza, Yuck, but not disgusting, Just not my idea of pizza is all.

All cultures and regions have different cuisines which is what makes cooking interesting, we may hate the pizza or the burgers or the style of cheese steaks but over all cuisine in unique and is what makes the area. Southern as a generalization is wide spread but very unique in many areas. I like most southern cooking, but from what I have found. Fresh local ingredients which I think makes it great food with a unique style.

So if I said disgusting to NY Philli Cheese Steaks, sorry, but I didn't see much fresh meat or cheese in the one I ate. Sorry Philli lovers.

[Passadumkeg]

A good cheese steak is steak and provolone on great bread. I won't eat the cheese whiz ones.

[kchurchill5]

Now true, good beef and good cheese is nice. Just everyone I had while up there was cheeze whiz and crappy beef. Maybe the wrong places which could of been. My cheese steak has good steak and cheese. Next time is there recommend a place for me. I can't remember the name but it was recommended as a landmark, but to me ... not good. but I am sure there are good places. Provolone is great

[Passadumkeg]

"South Street, South Street, where all the hippest meet..." is a tourist trap of Philly. Hollyeats and the local chow board have some good recs. I left the area in '71! I did, however, teach our maid in Bolivia to make dynamite cheese steaks, using tenderloin and freshly delivered baguette.

[kchurchill5]

Now that is my type of cheese steak!! I wish I remembered where I went recommended, but just not good to me. Maybe just expected more. I'm going up next month and will get some recs before I head up there.

Maybe I was just too damn COLD to enjoy anything to eat last time. It was 35, cold rain, drizzle sleet which didn't help. My taste buds were probably froze. This FL gal doesn't like anything under 70, lol.

[Passadumkeg]

Sounds like summer in Maine.

[Bob W]

I differentiate between a "cheesesteak" a la Philly, which in my humble opinion consists of uniformly bad ingredients that when combined create something unique, and a "steak and cheese" like what I'd get in Mass or RI, the basic ingredients of which -- meat, cheese, and bread -- are all better than what you get in Philly. For example, the "steak bomb" at the long gone Ann's on Needham St. in Newton, Mass. Now that was something hound-worthy.

[kchurchill5]

I think I seen the Diners Drive in and Dives and pretty much expected what I got, but at the same time with all the hype over it and I can eat junk food and it doesn't bother me, but I just expected more. Now one of the NY hot dogs on the street as bad as it was for me was good. So next time I go, I will get some good places to go. When we went we didn't have much time so we went to some famous corner in Philli, 1 place on 1 corner and another on the other side. Both longtime favorites I guess. Well, I ate it and it was fine but I wouldn't eat it again. There was this small restaurant in upstate MI years ago, no longer but the owners were from Philli and NY. They sold beer of weck, good NY hot dogs, Philli cheese that was awesome like you are saying. Real meat, real cheese and good bread. Now that was good. But by the time I was old enough to enjoy those classics, they were closing. Yes Bob W I am in search next time of a GOOD real cheesesteak.

[Bob W]

"When we went we didn't have much time so we went to some famous corner in Philli, 1 place on 1 corner and another on the other side. Both longtime favorites I guess."

That's gotta be Pat's and Geno's on S. Passyunk Ave in South Philly, right across the street from each other. I've been there once, during my pre-internet chowhounding days. I got a cheesesteak at Pat's and like you said, it was ok. But the cult that has arisen around these things is, IMHO, way, way out of proportion to the actual product. Surely a roast pork sandwich with broccoli rabe -- which I sadly have still not had the pleasure of devouring, since I've been to Philly only four times in my life, all of which came before I even heard of roast pork sandwiches -- is a superior sandwich.

[Passadumkeg]

There is good Philly w/ above ingredients.

[kattyeyes]

I think this thread has been fun as so many people have chimed in to "defend" their regional favorite that someone else "just didn't get." In fact, through those posts, we've all had a chance to learn about what's considered good or authentic about a particular regional favorite, so some might try a dish again in search of a better version.

If you have learned to love the flavor of old socks, please continue to enjoy it--and have my portion, too. Everyone won't love everything--that's life. Alternatively, I think it would be "un chowish" for people to visit an area and say, "That just SOUNDS gross--I'll never try it!" People who have posted at least gave something new a shot and decided, "Not for me!"

[fern]

We have a friend who often brings a cheese we refer to as "The Sweat Sock Cheese". It fits and we enjoy it. :)

I agree, it's been fun to see what others say in defense of "their" food. Good info, things to be learned.

[kattyeyes]

HA HA...one of my mom's oldest friends would always refer to our Pecorino Romano as "that stinky cheese!!!" Pecorino Romano of all things--can you imagine? And yet, for sure, there are others who would chime in and say, "You know--*I" think it's stinky, too!"

Cheers and happy eating!

[bayoucook]

k - my point exactly!

[Sam Fujisaka]

But, keg, you've posted 489,321 times about how you dislike Spam!

[Humbucker]

"I hate these "what don't you like" threads' so un chowish and very whiney. Too much negative energy."

Isn't it a little inconsistent for you to say that when you routinely add a bit of negative energy to any thread mentioning spam? I understand that you don't like it and it was probably associated with some terrible experiences for you, but there a lot of people who genuinely do like it.

When I was kid my mom used to cook me spam and I enjoyed it. When I became a smart aleck teenager, though, I gave my mom the whole "spam is disgusting and unnatural" spiel whenever she tried to buy a can even though I continued to like the taste. Now I realize that there are a lot of worse things than spam out there and I should just enjoy spam because I like it, instead of being faux-repulsed by it because of what other people say.

However, my mom really liked Arby's roast beef sandwiches, too, so maybe I'm genetically flawed...

p.s. I like gjetost, too!

[EWSflash]

Hmmm- A big fat plain Arby's roast beef with a little horsey sauce and a little of that weird sweet arby sauce is probably my biggest guilty pleasure. That and Kraft mac & cheese.

If that constitutes a genetic flaw then so be it. I yam what I yam, as Popeye said.

[operagirl]

My grandma loves Gjetost, and I've bought it a couple times on my own. Never managed to get through a whole package of it though -- after a few nibbles, it starts tasting like an odd combo of caramel and kraft mac 'n cheese.

[pacheeseguy]

I sell it in my cheese shop, it's a very good selling product.
Many folks enjoy Gjetost melted over a slice of apple pie or apple dumplings.
I like it with a slice of crisp apple or pear on a cracker.
But a little goes a long way, it is sweet.

[dinaofdoom]

it is also delish melted on a tart apple pie.
mmmmmm.

[Passadumkeg]

Kalvi Salmon paste in the tube, yum! The perfect topping for the perfect smorbrod. We have a tube of salmon w/ dill in the fridge right now.

[poptart]

Not sure if it's the same kind but I bought a tube of salmon paste at Ikea and it was soooooooo good!!!
so many wonderful possibilities of what you can spread it on.

[lynnlato]

I despise live in all its forms EXCEPT foie gras. Chicken livers? Blech! But, for me, foie gras is fatty, creamy goodness. I don't get the iron/metallic tastes that I get from other liver dishes.

[LJNew]

Gjetost tastes a little like peanut butter rubbed on a goat. It is admittedly an acquired taste that if you live in the US there is not much reason to acquire.

However, it is transformed when thinly sliced on hot toasted whole grain bread and gets all melty. It is also delicious whne you are crossing the fjords on a norwegian ferry on a rainy day and go into the little cafe for gjetost on a waffle and a cup of steaming coffee. Then you start to love it.

[kattyeyes]

I love your explanation of peanut butter rubbed on a goad! Priceless. Should I ever cross the fjords as you describe, I shall find a little cafe to experience gjetost just as you outlined above.

P.S. The dog in your avatar cracks me up--looks like a smiling dog when it's small, then when you mouse over it looks like an attack dog! ;)

[LJNew]

Thanks kattyeyes - I thought it was a good "chow hound"!

Actually the cafes are on the ferries. It is much quicker to cross the fjords by ferry than try to drive around them, so the norwegian highway dept. operates a whole system of ferries along the west coast. My recolleciton is they all seemed to have little cafes on them, so if its too cold and nasty to stand outside you go inside and have a snack. I assume it is still the same, although I have not been in about 10 yrs or so. Need to go back and research this I guess!

[al b. darned]

As I noted in a previous post in this thread, I grew up in Vermont and live in central NY state. My "problem" with most Southern food is it is so often deep fried, covered in thick gravy, or over cooked. My general perception of Southern food is "unhealthy."

IMHO, chicken-fried steak is a good example.

Greens to me mean Swiss chard, beet greens, spinach, etc. steamed until just heated thru, crisp, and bright green in color, served with a sprinkling of lemon juice, salt & pepper, and sometimes butter. To me, greens fried in fat until they are mushy and are more brown than green is not only unappetizing, but also unhealthy. Even Alton Brown prepared greens this way on one show and proclaimed how good they were, but not to me.

It seem that I am not the only "northerner" to feel this way. About ten years ago, Bob Evans" opened a bunch of restaurants around here. Within five years they were all closed.

[LaLa]

Southerner biting her tongue.

[MakingSense]

I just got a few of the dawgs from under the porch to walk down to the tackle shop with me to get me some chew.
Spittin' makes all us Southern hicks feel better.

[Morganna]

Yeah, well, sorta me to, and I'm no southerner. Fried steak, done right, is wonderful. :)

[bayoucook]

another southerner really biting her tongue (they just don't know)

[kattyeyes]

Well, don't bite your tongues, then. Change the perception if it's out of line with reality. I'm sure al b. darned comes in peace and I do, too.

al b. darned said:
My "problem" with most Southern food is it is so often deep fried, covered in thick gravy, or over cooked. My general perception of Southern food is "unhealthy."

I don't know about overcooked, but most Southern foods I've loved are covered in gravy and unhealthy (biscuits and gravy is a great example). I love biscuits and gravy--just don't consider them health food. And, thought you may not have voted for her as such, Paula Deen (Queen of Butter) hasn't helped the image of Southern cooking much. Help us out here!

[bayoucook]

Okay, I can only speak for South Mississippi b/c it's my home, but I have relatives in North Mississippi. Here on the coast we have an abundance of fresh fish and seafood and that's probably the basis of our diet. We might fry the fish or seafood, at most, twice a year, if that. Our fried seafood comes from poboys and church fish fries. Yes, we will have the occasional un-healthy meal (we have to/we crave it), but mostly we eat lean chicken and little red meat along with our seafood. Growing season lasts all but two months of the year, so we have fresh fruit and veggies most of the time. We grow oranges, limes, and lemons in the back yard. We "overcook" our turnip greens because they taste good like that and the potlikker is richer. I haven't had a biscuit and gravy since I left home at 18. Breakfast is oatmeal and fresh fruit, eggs on Sunday. We get takeout Chinese, pizza or fast food maybe twice a month. We make soups, stews, and gumbos, and make a meal of garden veggies and never miss the meat. We're known for growing fresh catfish and we love that too - I haven't fried any in over 30 years, love it baked/grilled/broiled. I've been here almost all my life and everyone I know eats like this. We're as health-minded as people in other states are. We KNOW we can't live on breaded/fried/gravied things all the time, but oh! what a delight it is when we can have those goodies! Does that help?

[kattyeyes]

Speaking just for myself, and smiling while saying so, I never thought all southerners were eating fried food daily...any more than I think anyone anywhere else is these days. I'm willing to guess ol' al b. darned didn't think so either. But the fried/gravied goodies ARE traditionally southern, no? Shoot, I'm of Italian heritage. Would I love to eat a cannoli daily? Sure! Do I--of course not. Wait, one edit: I DO think Paula Deen probably eats naughty, fried, buttery meals of her choosing every day. More power to her!

I'm jealous every time I read about a Chowhound (from the South or California) picking citrus fruits in their yards. I say all the time "I wish we all could be California girls!" Lucky you! My cat is anxiously waiting for her new lemongrass to grow again in place of the *lemonhay* that's left behind since last summer. Right now, the only thing that's growing back outside is chives and it's just refreshing to see something GREEN again!

Maybe it would be akin to people not from my neck of the woods thinking New Englanders only eat lobster, fried clams or N.E. boiled dinners. Or that people from Philly only eat cheese steaks and cream cheese. :) But I honestly don't think any of us are quite so narrowly defined--north or south.

P.S. I don't know how many years it's been since you were 18, but I think you might be overdue for some biscuits and gravy. ;) I agree, it is truly a delight!

[bayoucook]

Thanks kattyeyes - it was never a fave of mine or I probably would've had it.
I really dislike that white sausage gravy on a biscuit, don't know why. I think it is akin to what you said about New Englanders, etc., the south is a pretty well defined region, and we are capable of eating some weird stuff to those not used to it.

[kattyeyes]

HA HA! OK, well, I'll eat your portion, then.

[bayoucook]

You know what I did love? Tomato gravy! Just remembered it. Mmmm

[kattyeyes]

What is it?

[bayoucook]

I've never made it, but you make a roux out of bacon drippings, add some onion and probably other stuff, then chopped tomatoes and water, seasonings, until it's thick and gravy-like. It was good on biscuits with eggs.

[alkapal]

love tomato gravy. my mom serves it on plain white rice (or toast). hers is simply made with bacon drippings & white flour roux, and finely chopped peeled and seeded tomatoes, milk, salt and a little pepper.

so simple, so summery good.

[bayoucook]

that's right, alka, it did have milk in it
gonna try some this weekend

[kattyeyes]

Let's not get into trouble. Here is the link to the Saveur recipe:
http://www.saveur.com/article/Food/Tomato-Gravy

Note when you are viewing the recipe online, there's an "address" that begins with http://www.saveur... That's what you can cut and paste so you don't need to go to the trouble of paraphrasing the recipe. Ca va bien? :)

[bayoucook]

trying again:

http://www.saveur.com/article/Food/Fr...
that's what I get time and again after following your directions

[kattyeyes]

Okeydoke, so you posted (another regional favorite MANY don't get!) fried okra. Is that the page you were trying to share? If so, it worked perfectly.

Edit: Please check your e-mail. We'll figure this out offline, K?

[alkapal]

good post. i've never seen fried okra like that, though. ;-).

[bayoucook]

That's one way my family has always cooked it. The other is to put the slices of okra into a mainly cornmeal mixture (after dipping in egg white) and frying in oil in a cast iron skillet. It gets kind of loose that way, and tastes so so good, different from the other recipe, but both delicious.
One friend I have uses tempura batter on his.

[alkapal]

i use a mac, and select and copy the url address in the header of the item i want to link, then paste into my chowhound post.

re saveur's recipe, let us know how you like it. they've fancied it up.

mom's recipe doesn't have garlic, thyme, cream (!) or even onion. (maybe some onion, but maybe not). try it on rice.

[kattyeyes]

Oooh, I'll bet. Sounds good and fattening and not unlike that other "health food" I enjoy from your part of the globe. ;) I'll have to try it, so thank you for explaining. I went 20 years without knowing about biscuits and gravy, either (we were an SOS family).

alkapal: It's like the Depression-era food thread in which so many dishes were served on toast! When my mom doesn't feel like making a big dinner, she'll often still go to something on toast.

[alkapal]

a quickie way to make the tomato milk gravy is to use canned tomatoes, when you have no good summer tomatoes. updated technique: use a stick blender!

[MakingSense]

< "But the fried/gravied goodies ARE traditionally southern, no?" >

Nope. Not just Southern. Anyplace that people flour/bread or otherwise coat meat and cook it in fat on the stovetop and cook it in or serve it with a sauce is the same thing. Swiss steak, braised meats, etc. are common across the US. They're part of the tradition of German cooking that was spread throughout the Great Plains during the Westward Expansion.
Southerners love their Chicken Fried Steak but there are similar "nameless" items on family tables and as Blue Plate Specials in diners across the country. Heck, down to Salisbury Steak, whatever that is supposed to be.
Here's a recipe for Braised Cube Steak from last month's New York Times. We used to call this Smothered Steak. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/04/din...

Paula Dean is like Gypsy Rose Lee - she's got a gimmick. Nobody I know eats like that or uses any of those so-called Southern recipes.

[al b. darned]

I'm sorry if I offended anyone...it was not intended. I was not as clear as I meant to be. I guess that's what happens when you try to be lucid at 4 am. Even if I didn't offend, but you have a differing opinion please do not bite your tongue. Speak up...that's how we learn.

To all who did respond, thank you for your enlightenment. Your points are well taken.

I did not mean to imply I thought that all southerners, or anyone else for that matter, ate unhealthy every day. I know that is not the case. With the exception of the over cooked greens I like most "southern" food, but I still don't get fried green tomatoes.

I guess I meant that the perception of southern foods is as I described. And this perception is not helped by FN or Travel.

>>>
Paula Dean is like Gypsy Rose Lee - she's got a gimmick. Nobody I know eats like that or uses any of those so-called Southern recipes.
<<<

It's not just Paula. Whether it's AB, Bourdain, Zimmern, Fieri, or whoever, whenever they do a show on or in the South they inevitability feature something drowned southern style gravy, fried green tomatoes, fried dill pickles, fried okra, or some similar "classic southern dish." And there is some southerner right next to them happy to oblige them and gush about how this is "true southern food and we eat this every day."

In all fairness, tho, buffalo wings and chili cheese fries ain't exactly health food.

OTOH, while I have spent a good portion of my life in NE, I had never heard of a "NE Boiled Dinner" until I was living somewhere else.,,and have never had one. I don't know anyone who has. Lobster and/or clams were/are special treats.

BTW - Philly cream cheese is not and never has been made in Philadelphia. It is made in upstate NY.

[bayoucook]

al, you didn't offend anyone, I think the south had to be targeted b/c we ARE a distinct region of the US, and my state is #1 in obesity, so we all know the score here. My reply answered for me and those people I know and come into contact with on a regular basis, and we do eat pretty normally I think. But that fried stuff is never far from our minds!

[kattyeyes]

I never knew that about Philly cream cheese. That's pretty funny, actually!

I made a N.E. boiled dinner for the first time Saturday night so I could have leftover corned beef for hash, then reuben soup. It was really tasty! But I don't remember having it very often growing up and I've lived in CT my whole life (OK, not yet!). I know my mom made it this past St. Patrick's Day (we used her leftover CB for our maiden reuben soup voyage). And I don't remember anyone referring to it as a N.E. boiled dinner, either, but that's what the recipe was called on the corned beef packaging.

I do agree the perception of southern foods is as you described, though, as that was my perception, too. And also agree FN and TC don't do anything to shatter those perceptions.

[MakingSense]

Don't worry about it, but please try not to buy into to stereotypes about the South. Central Casting does more than enough of that to us and we're an easy target.
The Food Network and media do the same thing to most areas of the US because it's easy. They pick the outlandish or colorful or things that people are already familiar with so they don't have to do a lot of set-up. And they're into entertainment.
Hey, let's face it, the South has some colorful people who actually work at being colorful. When they do New England, they want that good accent and the stereotypical Yankee.

There were good reasons for the original recipes for long-cooked greens and fried green tomatoes which don't really exist anymore. I've moved on and I think a lot of others have too.
Hardscrabble subsistence farmers in the rural South grew what they could in their yards. They grew greens year-round and picked them as they needed them. Those greens were often tough and HAD to be cooked until they were tender enough to be edible. They long-cooked greens out of habit.
I now cook greens as a seasonal food, knowing that they're best young and fresh, and especially after the first frost in the Fall. Those cook quickly and stay bright, even a little crisp, and still have a lot of flavor.
Green tomatoes were making-do food. When Fall came, the tomatoes stopped ripening on the vine and there was no way that you would waste precious food. You figured out a way to make dinner out them, so you fried them up or made relish from them. Since they were good, people started cooking them as a regular thing.

There's a lot of history in most of our Southern food just as there are in the foodways of most of the heritage foods of America.
We've lost so many of those stories today. Why we eat what we eat in certain sections of the country. There are probably things in Vermont that you ate for certain reasons at certain times of the year before refrigeration, long haul shipping, and supermarkets.
That's the basis of local, seasonal and regional foods that we got away from for so long in the US. What a pity! And how nice that we are rediscovering it.
Maybe some of these traditions don't really translate very well to other sections. Maybe they do.
I actually think it would be a shame to homogenize American food so that we all eat the same things everywhere. I don't cook with walnuts and maple syrup. I use pecans and cane syrup. My food is who I am.
Why should you eat Southern food in Vermont unless you're a Southerner pining for home?

[al b. darned]

>>>
I actually think it would be a shame to homogenize American food so that we all eat the same things everywhere.
<<<

I couldn't agree more!!

As I read thru the the comments here, especially yours, it got me thinking about "stereotypical ethnic cuisine." Being of Russian/Polish heritage, I cringe when I think that some people think Hillshire Farms kielbasa or Mrs. T's perogies are authentic. Fortunately there are a couple of stores locally that make a mean kielbasa and the perogies they sell at the Ukrainian church down the road a couple of times a year freeze nicely. So is all locally made Polish food to die for? No. The perogies from one of the places that makes great kielbasa are kind of nasty and so are their cabbage rolls.

I certainly wouldn't put most of this food in the "health food" category, either. There seems to be an abundance of "brown food" in the typical Polish cookbook. But just as with "southern food," this is what the poor folks ate in the "old country," brought it with them, and fed it to their kids. There is plenty of that "traditional" food I don't care for, either.

As for green tomatoes, we used to (and still do) just bring them in and put them on the window sill and let them ripen. (Some people put them in a paper bag to do this.) The one year I had too many green ones I made marmalade and "green tomato mincemeat" from them.

[EWSflash]

"Brown food"- LOL
That's my opinion of German food in general (never been there, I admit). Brown and either sour or overly sweet.

I haven't had enough Polish food to form an opinion of it, but perhaps it's tsimilar. I've got German on all sides of me, inc. near-100% on DH's side. My beloved mother-in-law will combine raw hamburger, sauerkeraut, and minute rice in a big bowl, mix it up, throw it in a casserole and cook until the rice is "done". Surprisingly, with a whole bunch of salt and pepper it tastes pretty good, but wow, is it ever German. My mother was much more into fresh foods, aside frorm frequent forays into the 1960s-style American culinary abominations-you know, TV dinners and so forth..

[linguafood]

German food is neither brown, nor overly sour (not even well-made sauerkraut is) or sweet. Whatever that concoction your MIL cooked up doesn't sound like anything I've ever heard of -- it may well be one of those home invented dishes.

German food beats the crap out of Polish food, that's for sure.

Visit. Eat. Enjoy.

[Caroline1]

Unless you're Polish, of course.

[EWSflash]

I hope to. I'm not claiming to be any kind of expert on German food, just pointing out to al b. darned that my experience with Brown Food is usually German rather than Polish.
Linguafood, I looked up what she called that dish online and what I found bore little to no resemblance to what she makes. But if you saw what she calls "chalupa" and had a deep appreciation for Mexican food you'd flat-out gag- underseasoned overcooked pork mixed with canned refried beans, slopped on a plate and covered with Fritos. Fritos! She's not a bad cook, actually, I think she mostly suffers from having graduated from college in 1948 with a Home Economics degree- not a lot of World Cuisine being taught in South Dakota at the time.

[KristieB]

Or unless you adore both cuisines, as do I.

[RealMenJulienne]

I must say, Al B, as another northerner I theoretically hated overcooked southern-style greens for a long time, right up until I actually tried them. These greens are freakin' awesome! I've come to the point where I'll go to a barbeque restaurant and just order a big dish of turnip greens, with cornbread to dip into the leftover broth.

This is not to detract from your opinion, but just to support the southerners in their love for long-cooked greens!

[bayoucook]

This southerner appreciates your support. They have an almost creamy taste, don't they? I've had lightly cooked ones before, but they don't touch the smoky/sweet/salty/earthy taste of over-cooked greens with hot cornbread.

[Jen76]

Hmmm. This makes me want to try them now. I always thought they looked rather...well...gross. They reminded me of the "cream of spinach" soup I was given in the hospital after surgery when I was a kid. It was rather unpleasant to say the least. But, I do love cornbread.

[RealMenJulienne]

Bayoucook, the greens I've had are indeed almost creamy in texture, but I like that the creaminess comes from the vegetable starch cooking out and not added dairy. I also really like how there is a contrast of textures in the vegetables, between the leaves and stems and whatever else is in there.

Jen, I agree that greens are not much to look at, especially next to a colorful spring vegetable saute or something, but close your eyes and give them an honest try. They have a very intense, earthy, vegetable flavor, and even though I am a lightly-cooked-fresh-vegetable-fan I still love them.

[bayoucook]

RMJ - you summed it up perfectly for me! Thanks.

[bayoucook]

RMJ - I just read your bio and we have something in common: I CANNOT bake. I can bake a cake from scratch (hate it tho') and make pretty good biscuits (southern women learn that at age 7 ha), but if it has yeast in it, forget it. Love my bread machine. Ruined refrig. yeast rolls for the 10th time for Easter. Cook's Illus. Almost No-Knead Bread hated me, quick breads are out of the question. I carefully measure wet and dry ingredients and use a thermometer for the water for the yeast. It ain't gon' happen! Poor us!

[jaredbronski]

Well, I grew up in NE and we had Yankee boiled dinner every week or two the entire time I was growing up.

I suppose that you don't know what "tonic" is either... :)

[John Manzo]

Chard and beet greens but especially kale HAVE to be cooked to death so they're not horrible woody nightmares. You can't speak of chard and spinach in the same breath and cannot prepare them the same way.

[Caitlin McGrath]

I respectfully disagree. Chard and beet greens take longer to cook than spinach, but not by much; they can certainly be done as a simple saute. And kale takes more time than either, but absolutely does not need to be "cooked to death" to be palatable. I have nothing at all against stewed greens, but that style of cooking isn't necessary to avoid "horrible woody nightmares." I hate piles of tough or woody greens, but I never do the long-cooked style at home.

[al b. darned]

>>>
You can't speak of chard and spinach in the same breath and cannot prepare them the same way.
<<<

I also disagree because I *do* prepare them the same way. I cut out the woody stems so I mostly have leaves. Maybe you have different chard, but the chard grow is about the same size and texture of spinach. The main difference is chard grows all summer and into the fall, where spinach bolts at the first heat wave.

[bayoucook]

Spinach is a lovely saute. And I have had mustard/collard/turnip greens cooked lightly, and they were horrible. Bitter and just woodsy and earthy. Those I will continue to pair with some sweet turnips and cook down, long, and slow.

[alkapal]

mustards and collards are not good when sauteed like spinach, imo. they need long cooking to be tender. but fresh mustard greens, cooked right, are sweet and tender. mmm mmm good!

[Sam Fujisaka]

Many greens are related to squid and octopus - either cook for a minute or two or cook em for hours.

[small h]

So true. And either way is fine by me. There's a recipe in Chez Panisse: Vegetables for broccoli cooked to a fare-thee-well. And it is awesome. I know broccoli is not a green, per se, but heck, not everything needs to be crunchy.

[al b. darned]

While not "regional" as in America, I don't get mushy peas. When I was in Great Britain, I was told I "had" to try the meat pie with mashed potatoes and mushy peas. The meat pie was pretty good, albeit a bit greasy, and the mash was good, the mushy peas were just wrong. I'm glad we won the war.

[Peg]

Good mushy peas (homemade) are wonderful, especially with lots of black pepper and a mound of creamy mashed potatoes. Commercial mushy peas are usually dyed lurid green and is often mint flavoured - disgusting, I agree.

[poptart]

I agree....have had both horrible mushy peas (very bland and boring) and wonderful ones. I guess like grits, they can be either one extreme or the other! :-)

[thursday]

Oh, I'm so on board for disliking mushy peas! Especially minted mushy peas. *shudder*

Though I have to put in the disclaimer that I find peas mushy and pasty to begin with, so celebrating that fact and ruining my fish and chips with them...unforgiveable!

[Lindseyup67]

Here in the U.P. of Michigan, it would have to be pasties. Unless made at home with some good steak and spices in them, IMO anywhere you buy them, they are bland and nothing to write home about........

[turqmut]

Three out of three votes from my family that pasties are inedible.

[Alicat24]

I've been in West MI for the last 15 yrs. but I grew up outside of Detroit. Pasties were a MUST have on our vacations to the U.P. (along with good smoked whitefish). I've always thought that bland was the hallmark of them (and love 'em just the same). I'm interested in what is done with them differently in a home kitchen up there to spice them up vs. what you find in the restaurants/roadside place's.

I cobbled together my own version, LOTS of rutabaga and potato, small amounts of onion and carrots boiled till tender. Browned ground beef (I've never liked the shaved/chopped beef) with a bit of garlic salt and fresh cracked pepper then all into the crust and baked. The result is less than stellar but better than nothing. I went online a few years ago to search for recipes and was surprised to find so many that had raw ingredients going into the oven. I suppose I didn't think everything would cook well enough from raw (especially the rutabaga) without burning the crust.

As time has marched, I've wanted to add more flavor but I'm torn.. There's no end to the ways I could ramp it up but then it wouldn't be the pasty I know any longer. Just adding a side of gravy doesn't do much (first time I ever even encountered it being offered was in Copper Harbor about 15 yrs. ago).

So Lindsey, any tips from a true Yooper? BTW, my hubby had never had a pasty until I introduced him 20 years ago, he wouldn't get on board and still calls them Nasties! :)

[greedygirl]

I think you're talking about what we call Cornish pasties. I love them. Traditionally they are made with skirt steak, swede (rutabaga) and a little onion which is not cooked before putting in the pastry. Delicious.

[Morganna]

Cornish pasties are one of the things I want to try when we finally get a chance to visit that part of the UK. Though the first visit, it turns out, will be in the Manchester area for our best friend's wedding.

What's a "local delicacy" or treat in the Manchester area? :) and are they over-rated? :)

[greedygirl]

Manchester is probably the right place to try an Eccles Cake, which can be delicious but are definitely not diet food.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eccles_cake

Other good things to try from that region: black pudding from Bury, Bakewell tart (from Derbyshire), Cheshire and Lancashire cheese (both crumbly white cheeses), Lancashire hotpot, potted shrimps from Morecambe Bay (strongly recommended).

[Alicat24]

As I understand the history they are indeed an offspring of Cornish pasties or meat pies. Immigrant's to the US in the 1800's who made their way to our Upper Penninsula to work in the copper mines brought the pasty with them.

If you trust Wikipedia (I'm wishy washy) later waves of Finnish immigrant's round about 1864 decided to adopt the pasty as thier own. The Finn's (if true) might explain the distinct accent/way of speaking that our Yooper's have. Very similar to the way of speaking those in Minnesota and the movie "Fargo" had but distinctly different.

Rather frustrating to not find concrete information and trust me I've searched!

[chowser]

I think of pasties as being an English thing--do I have the wrong version? I didn't care for them either--high fat meat in a pastry pocket, served cold. Something about cold congealed fat that didn't sit well.

[Peg]

They should NOT be served cold, so I think you should try them again!

[Glencora]

I was served slices of meat pie (not individual pasties) as picnic food in England. Cold, fatty meat, with a hard-cooked egg in the middle. Is that not typical? It was a bit bland, but not bad.

[Glencora]

That reminds me of Scotch eggs. I didn't "get" that at all. Though I want to add that I had lots of really wonderful food as well.

[Peg]

That's a pork pie (or I think with an egg it's a picnic pie, but I'm not certain on that). And you're right - cold congealed grease. Back when I ate meat and was a poor student I used to buy a slice of freshly made pork pie in Sheffield market - it would still be warm and juicy and delicious - that is the right time to eat them I think, not out of supermarket cellophane.

[Glencora]

I was lucky enough to stay with my friend's granny, an amazing baker. She made the pie from scratch, so I think it was a pretty good version, just not my thing. She also made scones and rock buns for tea almost every day, and for dinner, wonderful Yorkshire pudding with beef and boiled potatoes (and, unfortunately, some nasty cabbage.) What DID come in supermarket cellophane was a pink and yellow checkerboard-patterned cake with stiff, icky frosting.

[greedygirl]

Pork pie is excellent if you get a well-made one. Unfortunately there are a lot of bad pork pies around.

Scotch eggs are great hangover food and one of my guilty pleasures!

[Glencora]

Hangover food! I think I'd rather have a bacon sandwich. (see other thread)

[JungMann]

New York Italian. I still am not sure how Manhattan's Little Italy manages to stay in business.

[janetms383]

I'm with you there!

[Bob W]

As a RI native, I suppose I should love jonnycakes, but.... Maybe it's because I'm a northern Rhode Islander and jonnycakes are more of a southern RI thing. (Yes, I know you think RI is too small to have such differences, just humor me)

A few years back, I saw a bag of RI jonnycake meal (from Kenyon's Mill in beautiful Usquepaugh) at the market. I bought it and ended up throwing most of it out. We made them a couple times but the interest quickly wore off.

What do people (RI or otherwise) think of jonnycakes? One famous place to have them is Commons Lunch in Little Compton. If you're going to try them, that's where you should do it.

[thinks too much]

On the kicking RI while it's down, I don't get coffee milk. It's like watery melted coffee ice cream. At least chocolate milk has taste, but coffee milk is not much more than overly sweet milk.

But I do like clam cakes about once a summer. And even good stuffies.

[Bob W]

I'm a big coffee milk fan -- I once had the VA license plate COFE MLK. Autocrat is my syrup of choice, but they are all made by the same company now.

And check this out. One time I was driving around when I had that tag on my car when I guy pulled up along side me and yelled, "Are you from RI"? When I said sure am, he told me he was too (from Smithfield, I think) and was toting around a CASE of coffee syrup in his trunk.

Now, if you want a really hard-core RI specialty, how about snail salad? Unlike fried calamari, snail salad hasn't caught on nationwide. Can't imagine why. 8<D

[huaqiao]

Coffee milk is a very common drink in Asia. I'm sure that's how most people in places like Japan and Taiwan consume coffee. I'm curious how different the RI version is compared to the Asian versions.

[Bob W]

Coffee milk in RI is made by adding sweet, coffee-flavored syrup to milk. There are three main brands of coffee syrup, now all made by the same company. In order of increasing coffee flavor, they are Autocrat, Eclipse, and Coffee Time.

Supposedly coffee syrup was created by immigrants to acclimate their children to the taste of coffee. I don't know about the accuracy of that, but I did start drinking coffee milk as a youngster and moved right into coffee in high school (weak Dunkin Donuts coffee with plenty of milk and sugar). The sugar soon fell by the wayside as did most of the milk, but I never moved all the way to black coffee.

I also love Thai and Vietnamese iced coffee, btw.

[huaqiao]

I need to get a hold of some RI coffee syrup so I can conduct an informal tasting of coffee milks from around the world. :)

[Bob W]

www.autocrat.com

Coffee milk is the official state drink of RI, beating out Del's Lemonade, which was awarded a consolation prize of official summertime treat or something equally idiotic.

[Sam Fujisaka]

Common in Taiwan are large packets that contain instant coffee, powdered milk, and sugar. Just add hot water.

[al b. darned]

I miss being able to grab a pint of Garelick Farms coffee milk in the mini mart. All is not lost, tho, as I have a quart of Autocrat Syrup in the fridge.

Now if I could only get Del's lemonade....

[chowser]

Long displaced RI'er here, kind of southern RI to divide it even more, I guess, near Wickford and I never liked jonnycakes either, though I love most corn based foods. I did like coffee milk back then but what do high schoolers who don't drink coffee know. I did love Del's lemonade but not crazy about it since it's gone nationwide. I did love clam fritters, then--deep fried hunk of dough on the beach. What's not to like?

[kattyeyes]

I know--I love fried dough, too. And, think about it, when we're wearing beach attire, can you think of a less appropriate thing to eat? ;) But we were young and it tasted SO GOOD. Still does.

[Bob W]

Fried dough rocks! Doughboys in Maine, clamcakes in RI, zeppoles in NYC, funnel cakes in the Mid-Atlantic, conch fritters in Florida....

[chowser]

Why stop at dough? I've told my husband that one day I'm going to buy a huge fryer and open a stand at fairs. I won't have food but it'll be a "you buy it, we fry it" stand. People can bring whatever they've bought, we'll dip it in a special batter and deep fry it. Maybe we'll have an assortment of things that don't go bad, too--candy bars, Twinkies, etc.

[kattyeyes]

I'm in--let's do it! :)

[Andria]

Mmm... deep-fried snickers or mars bars. I wish I could get those in Montreal.

[kattyeyes]

Andria, please introduce yourself to bigfellow on his "What's for dinner tonight" thread. He's in Montreal and he posted about making deep-fried candy bars in the restaurant where he worked. Deep-fried bliss is in your future. :)
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/5960...#

[greedygirl]

Deep-fried Mars Bars and the like can be found in fish and chip shops in Scotland - although how commonly is a moot point. It's often used as an example of how unhealthy a typical Scottish diet can be. Nigella Lawson advocates the deep frying of Bounties.

[kattyeyes]

I had to look up Bounties (across pond translation: Mounds bar). That has to be killer. Mounds are one of my all-time faves!

[kubasd]

I just always wonder why they don't do a cross mounds/almond joy bar with dark chocolate, coconut, and almonds. Then It'd truly be my favorite candy.... mmm mounds..

[EWSflash]

Ooooooooooooohhhhhhh- yeah!

[alkapal]

there isn't a dark chocolate almond joy?

oops... guess not! http://www.typetive.com/candyblog/ite...

[thew]

in and out burger

[happycat]

Me, too. Just can't understand what's so great about In & Out. Sure, it's better than McDonald's, but that's damning with faint praise.

Hush puppies. Another strike against the South. Heavy, doughy grease bombs. Makes my stomach hurt to think about them.

[Davwud]

Not at all. More or less they're little chunks of corn bread.

DT

[MakingSense]

Ah! But they ARE "heavy, doughy grease bombs" when Yankees try to cook them.
Same with most Southern foods. They just don't know how.

[Passadumkeg]

There is I feel something about the cold that dulls the senses. Just looke at English and Scandinavian cuisine.

[MMRuth]

I was just about to post the contrary about English food - and, seeing your post, Scandinavian for that matter. I've been exploring British food quite a bit lately, and haven't made a thing I didn't like so far. Ditto for the "British" food I ate in London recently. And, I'm a big fan of Scandinavian food - just made a cardamom cream cake this morning when a friend said she was coming over for coffee.

[MakingSense]

I think Britain suffered an enormous loss during the years of WWII and just after. They had so little and were under such stress. So many people stopped cooking and they lost the customs and habits.
Was that at least 10 or 15 years from the late 30s until the world economy began to return to normal in the mid-50s?
If you assume that things had been hard during the Depression, that would be more than 25 years when cooking stopped because foodstuffs were hard to get or rationed.
An entire generation was raised not knowing good British food or how to cook it. That generation had nothing to pass on....

And NO - "good British food" is NOT an oxymoron!!!

[MMRuth]

Yes - they had a full 15 years of rationing. I've been reading a lot of Elizabeth David's books lately, as well as material about her. As you probably know, her early books have been credited with changing how the English approached food, and, as well, Americans such as Alice Waters, Chuck Williams, and many more. Simon Hopkinson was a big fan of hers, and she of him.

[Passadumkeg]

I lived in the Nordic countries for 10 years and visited the UK often, my comment stands for daily national cuisine.

[MMRuth]

I guess I should say - that British and Scandinavian food *can* be good, if prepared properly. That's more what I meant.

[greedygirl]

How long ago though? There's been a food revolution in the UK in the past decade, just as there has in the States. It's hard to generalise on "daily national cuisine".

[greedygirl]

Also I'd just like to point out that it's a hell of a lot colder in winter in large parts of the United States than it is in England. Ours is a temperate climate - doesn't get that hot or that cold. To compare the British and Scandinavian climates is nonsense, really. And there's absolutely no evidence that our "senses are dulled".

[Davwud]

Well being Canadian I guess I'm exempt.
I usually use a deconstructed hush puppy for breading my catfish when I do it that way. It's great. Then you make hush puppies with the left over dredge. Good stuff.

DT

[Morganna]

*cough* Sorry, but I beg to differ. I make a damn good hushpuppie and the furthest south I ever lived was Mason City, Iowa. :)

[MakingSense]

So sorry, Morganna. Speaking in generalizations. Yes, even some people who have never set foot South of the Mason Dixon can cook a great Hush Puppy and some Southerners can't do it to save their souls.
Sadly, some of the people who mock them have never had good ones.

[bayoucook]

So true MS - and we don't live on this deep southern food - it's an occasional treat at least for us - I cook all kinds of food, generally keep the fat and salt low and exercise like a demon - does anyone still perceive us in such an old-fashioned way? Before this thread, it seemed most CHs loved southern food.
Now it's a pariah. May not read this thread anymore - blood pressure.....

[Morganna]

Aww don't take it that way! This thread is hardly about a majority consensus thing. :) Just 'cos there are some folks here (really it's only a few, isn't it?) who don't like the southern food they've had, hardly makes southern food a pariah. :) Plenty of examples from other regions have been brought up. :)

[MakingSense]

The general perception of Southern food is not "old-fashioned." It's ignorant.
Check back on some of the old CH threads with responses to an OP asking for foods for a Southern-themed meal. Yikes! Shades of Daisy Mae and Bubba.
Nobody ever believes that Southern Food is elegant and sophisticated.
Even if they visit Charleston, all they want is Shrimp and Grits, which is simple fisherman's food.
Go to New Orleans and eat Jambalaya and it better be spicy. Visitors don't seem to be aware of the classic Creole specialties.
Southern restaurants don't do themselves any favors by serving dishes that cater to what tourists expect rather than honoring traditional foods.

People have NO idea. Paula Dean and the New York Times don't help a bit. They make it all seem like Dogpatch and NASCAR.

[bayoucook]

I agree. The restaurants and tourist places have a LOT to do with it. No one I know uses Paula Dean's recipes, likes Dogpatch or watches NASCAR. What upset me a little bit was people on here calling some of our regional food "disgusting" - maybe again, it's a southern thing, but I'd simply say I didn't like it, would never call it disgusting. Ya' know?

[MakingSense]

Again, it's ignorance with a shot of rudeness.
Most of those posters have never actually been to the South, except maybe for a quick vacation to New Orleans, Florida, Atlanta or wherever.
They find recipes for some so-called "soul food" or Southern "specialty" like macaroni and cheese (????), gumbo, pecan pie, fried chicken, greens, cornbread, or whatever. Then they mess with it. And maybe they're not very good cooks to begin with.
Gee, what they're eating and serving to their guests might actually BE "disgusting."
They've never tasted the real down-home versions of even those few stereotypical foods, much less the real Southern foods that we grew up with cooked by good cooks.
It would be like us making bagels out of cornbread batter and then going "yuk."

Of course, most people outside of the South, particularly in the NE and on the West Coast, lump the entire "south" together as one big homogeneous region. That would be like saying "European" food, as though there were no difference between Britain and Italy.
Anybody with a lick of sense knows that the Gulf South and the Panhandle is nothing like the Low Country, the Mountain South, the ArkLaTex, the Tidewater, Memphis and the Delta, Kentucky, etc.
But to them, it's all Red State Dogpatch and they assume license to bash away.

The worst are the Yankees who move South, should have learned better, and still continue to bash. They're changing Southern food for the worse with their short-cuts and cream cheese.
A friend who works for a big Southern newspaper keeps praying that the hurricanes and mosquitoes will make them move back North.

[Mawrter]

Wait a minute! I didn't think the Florida was really *in* the South, except in the north and inland. No?

[Cinnamon]

OK. Take a deep breath and concentrate. Southeast Florida is New England. Southwest Florida is Midwest. A blend is in the middle, where Southern starts seeping in, and the farther north you go the farther South it gets. The Keys are their own planet filled with old-time Keysians who seem a little Southern but have been there so long they're really indigenous. Pockets of fancy Florida Southern do exist around the Southwest edges, old-school gentility - sort of, in their own way - who helped settle the place.

[alkapal]

pretty good summation there, cinnamon. except -- we say that se florida is new york!

follow the interstates i-95 and i-75 migration routes!

[Sandwich_Sister]

I live in Orlando and we have a saying. "The more north in Florida you go, the more south you really are. Although you can get southern food anywhere in florida south and central florida isn't classified as "the south"

[alkapal]

clarify that to read: the southern florida east and west *coasts* aren't typically "southern" unless you're dealing with old families. inland, labelle and clewiston, e.g.: oh yeah, they're classic florida-southern.

[Sam Fujisaka]

Is Dogpatch a regional dish?

[bayoucook]

Haha, no Sam, it's a hillbilly cartoon. Good one.

[chowser]

Good hush puppies are addicting. I could eat a whole bowl of them but too often, it's this dense, not heavy enough of corn flavor, blob. But, I'll take good hush puppies any day.

[al b. darned]

OOOOHHHHH! Hush puppies! I got addicted to the ones they made at Fass Bros. Fish House in Norfolk in the 70's. Crispy, crunchy and not at all greasy. "All you can eat" to boot.

[happycat]

Okay, you're all probably right that most of us who bash Southern food haven't had the good stuff, correctly made, so don't know what we're talking about. Guess I'll have to do some in-depth research, fork in hand ( :

[starlady]

Old Bay seasoning.

My parents lived in Baltimore for a couple years and when ever I went to visit them and we went out, anything seafood was just coated in the stuff. We stopped going out to eat and would just bring fresh seafood home.

[Davwud]

I like Old Bay but "Coated" in it may be a bit much.

DT

[shaogo]

What is it with Old Bay Seasoning? I never thought it was very good at all.

[Bob W]

I'd never heard of it until I went off to college in Baltimore. Now I'm a big fan. I reguarly use it in my "famous" chicken salad.

Utz has been putting Old Bay on potato chips for 30 years; they call this product "The Crab" Chip. Other chippers followed suit.

[Mawrter]

I like it in moderation but my dh detests Old Bay. I suspect he may have suffered at the hands of people around here who bought it once in the 70s and trotted it out once every decade since. <gak>

[MakingSense]

French fries with vinegar, like they serve them at Thrasher's and other places on Maryland's Eastern Shore.
The vinegar tastes OK but it just makes the fries, well, wet.

[Andria]

Agreed... the aroma sucks you in, but the soggy fires... they just suck.

[jmckee]

The comedian Jim Gaffigan has this comment in one of his acts: For the English, vinegar is their ketchup. How bad is your food of you put vinegar on it to make it better?

[KevinB]

Oh, foo. I was brought up in Quebec, and even the Quebecois in the 60's preferred vinegar with their chips to ketchup. (Of course, now they prefer gravy as in poutine, but that's another thread.) I've come to appreciate both, but - especially with fish - there's nothing like a good malt vinegar on freshly made (i.e. not frozen) fries. It complements the potato taste, rather than overwhelm it as ketchup does. Of course, if I'm getting a FF meal with pre-fab fries, then I WANT ketchup on them, as the fry then becomes a flavourless mushy vehicle for ketchup transportation.

[linguafood]

I second the vinegar on fries. In Greece, I like to squeeze some lemon juice over the hand-cut fries, too. It's a good combo.

[purple goddess]

Spain was the first place I was ever served mayo AND vinegar on hot chips.

Converted for life.

[linguafood]

Hey, if we're talking bong-over food -- have you ever had "frites w/ oorlog sauce" in Amsterdam / Netherlands? Oorlog = war (wtf?), and it consists of mayo and peanut sauce side by side, and sprinkled with raw onion. It's no romantic food, but boy, does it taste awesome at 1 a.m. "-D!

And also, BTW, totally OT (well, sorta), because it took me many visits to even try this local specialty. But I did love it. At 1 a.m.

[Paulustrious]

I lived in Amsterdam for two years, and the BEST munchie food comes from the pannekoeken huizen - pancake houses. You could have just about any meal you wanted wrapped in a crepe. Start with something like sausage, ham and fried egg crepe followed by peaches, whipped cream and blackcurrant liqueur crepe.

All in the company of your best friends, all equally bong-ho.

[phoenikia]

I've had some strange looks in the U.S. when I've asked for vinegar with my fries. I'm partial to malt vinegar which seems to be hard to find outside of Canada.

Here in Toronto, in the Greek part of town, a few restaurants serve "Greek fries" -something I've never seen in Greece- fries topped with crumbled feta cheese, sprinkled with oregano and pepper, and drizzled with olive oil. When the Greek fries arrive at the table, I add little vinegar on top- but lemon juice would be a great variation;) Great end of the night food!

[Morganna]

I like malt vinegar, too. Hard to find in the US outside of chip shops purporting to be British fare.

[thew]

makes sense - just as one doesn't find lime pickle, eg, outside a place puporting to Indian fare

[ktmoomau]

Hmmm, here in Maryland vinegar is quite common with fires, vinegar and old bay seasoning actually on fresh cut boardwalk fries is kind of a Maryland thing. And in the DC.MD/VA region I find it is pretty common.

I can go to the burger place a couple blocks from my home in Northern Virginia and they have malt vinegar with the ketchup and mustard, Five Guys chain has it too I believe, or just perhaps regular vinegar, but I do think it is malt.

[Passadumkeg]

Malt vinegar is common in Maine too. either proximity to Canada or the New England - England connection?

[Morganna]

Well, I can't ever find it in restaurants in Vermont. :) Oh well. :)

[kattyeyes]

Ask for it when you come back to CT. ;) Bet it's just a request away in Mass., too. The regional boundary lines on its availability are kind of amusing.

[alkapal]

i find diners, burger places, and casual restaurants around here in dc-metro area have the malt vinegar on the table, or if you ask.

[huaqiao]

Malt vinegar on fries isn't super common here in California, but I have come across it here and there. The two places I can think of off the top of my head where I'd had it recently are Steak Escapes(the wannabe Philly cheesesteak place in mall food courts) and the Five Guys burger near me. So it looks like it's more common in the Northeast.

[chowser]

Fried fish, too--good flavor but it turns soggy.

Along the lines of french fries, chip butties and crisp butties. I don't get either of those.

[steakman55]

Well I kept trying to chime in and set folks straight all through this thread, but decided to just do one for the record.
The following are like manna from Heaven:
Whataburgers ( double meat and cheese)
Boiled peanuts
Chick Fil A sandwiches and lemonade
Sweet tea, with plenty of lime or lemon
Grits
The following are nasty:
Scrapple
Most American beer
Some of these other Yankee specialties I have never tasted, but know instinctively that they are yucky.
EOM

[MattInNJ]

BBQ Spaghetti
Cincinnati Chili

[lynnlato]

BBQ spaghetti - never had it, never will. Blech.

[John Manzo]

Currywurst. Though I gave it another chance and now like the stuff (and it's dead easy to make at home with a decent bockwurst), the first time I had it (in Berlin) I was worse than unimpressed.

[galileojunk]

I also don't get the following that In 'n Out has - eh, it's just another fast food burger. No more, no less.

Dunkin' Donuts coffee is another one - lived in Boston for years and I don't get the mass hysteria for it. It's not good coffee, people!

And Maryland's use of "Old Bay Seasoning" on EVERYTHING - it's not that Old Bay is so bad, but what's the point of making every dish and all types of seafood taste the same?

[starlady]

"And Maryland's use of "Old Bay Seasoning" on EVERYTHING - it's not that Old Bay is so bad, but what's the point of making every dish and all types of seafood taste the same?"

Yes!!!! That's exactly the issue we had! Why do potatoes and veg AND the seafood all taste the same, what's the point?

[Caroline1]

Oh yeah! Whatabirger sucks! And they (well, all of those I've tried) cut their onions with a carbon steel knife instead of stainless, and one itty bitty piece of onion removed from a hamburger and put in the bag and the bag "sealed" will stink up your car worse than seventeen skunks in the back seat! I HATE Whataburger. But when I first moved to Texas, I was told the same thing. "Little Lady, if you wanna have yourself a great hamburger from a Texas institution, you gotta go to Whataburger." How many ways can you spell "blech"?

[Bryn]

I don't know about any Canadians reading this Thread, but Tim Horton's Coffee. I hate the stuff. It's weak and the flavour is horrible. Why are there line ups out the door? (note: this may just be Alberta (Fort McMurray in particular)).

[Stephanie Wong]

Pimento cheese

[MakingSense]

That's OK. You're not a Southerner.

From The Augusta Chronicle:
"...when true Southerners are asked about pimento cheese, a smile creeps across their face as their minds and palates fill with memories of childhood. Memories of running into the house barefoot, slamming the back screen door, opening the refrigerator and filling their mouth with a scoop of the homemade spread.
It is an exceptionally emotional food for Southerners."

We understand and so would Proust.

[LaLa]

the cheese- pimento cheese, the spread -pimento cheese or pimento chees that was homemade?

[Stephanie Wong]

I believe it was homemade -- brought to a ladies get-together I attended in Memphis. Since some of the local ladies swooned over it, I don't think it was a bad batch. . . just something that disappointed since I had no emotional tie to it.

[lergnom]

Brunswick stew, with or without squirrel. (Not kidding; the traditional way is with squirrel.) Served in the Carolinas. It's not that it's terrible but that it's not good.

[Jetgirly]

Tejuino. It's a Guadalajara thing.

"Una bebida refrescante a base de maíz no fermentado y de dulce de caña del occidente de Guadalajara capital del estado de Jalisco en México. Se bebe con limón, sal y chile piquín, es de sabor agridulce y con un grado bajo de alcohol." (Wikipedia)

Imagine a sock that is totally saturated with sweat, then imagine someone wringing that sock directly into your mouth. I kid you not. That was the thought that immediately came to mind the second that sour, salty, grainy drink hit my tongue. My students pressured me for months to try it but the vendor outside the school gates looked pretty sketchy; at the end of the year I agreed to drink it but secretly poured most of it down the toilet.

[Caroline1]

Edamame. I just don't get edamame as a $4.00 (or more) starter in ANY restaurant. I don't dislike the flavor, but hey, let's face it; theyre nothing to write home about. I bought a carton of individual portions from Sam's Club, ate half of one portion, then gave the rest away.

The other thing I just don't get is chicory flavored coffee in the deep south. Now, unlike edamame, this is something I highly dislike. But then we're talking about something that is loved by people who go all ecstatic when talking about grits.... '-)

[bayoucook]

Thing with chicory coffee is to mix it half and half with hot milk. I don't anyone who drinks it black, altho' I'm sure some do. I keep chicory coffee for the weekend and for after dinner, like a sweet treat.

[MakingSense]

Oh, no, Caroline! My dark roast chicory coffee AND my grits!
I've been drinking chicory coffee since I was 3 or 4 years old!
Started off as Bayoucook suggests mixed with milk because I was a little girl but it's been black since high school.
My "house brand" is French Market City Roast, the same one that they pour at Galatoire's. I've had it shipped to me for 40 years, wherever I've lived.
Chicory is the rule in New Orleans but most of South Louisiana uses "pure" coffee.

[chef4hire]

Oh, Caroline...I ignored most of the bashing but NOT MY CHICORY COFFEE! Where did you have it? Did you use the correct hot milk to coffee ratio? Were you feverish or sick when you last tried an honest to goodness au lait??

Really, back away from the barista, pass the 'buck and come give CDM, Community or Rue a try....I promise you'll like it this time!!

[Caroline1]

The ONLY time I had it was when my first husband was a student in air traffic control school at Keesler AFB in Biloxi, Mississippi. I had just left California for the first time, unless you count an hour in Yuma to get married. We were poor as church mice, had no car, and my husband did the grocery shopping from my list on his way to or from school. I wrote "coffee." He bought "coffee." Neither of us had any idea how different "food" was in the South. I tried to bake yeast bread using self rising flour (don't DO that!!!), and I believe I was still using my classic electric chrome gorgeous percolator that made horrible coffee all on its own (but was very decorative), so you can imagine what it did with chicory coffee! And I do drink my coffee black. So the percolator got a good internal scrubbing and I gave the coffee away. It was a bitter experience, if you'll pardon the pun.

[chef4hire]

OK...I'm gonna give you a pass...please try again the next time you're in NOLA

I promise to pay for the cup if you don't like it!

[Caroline1]

You're on! But don't hold your breath waiting for me to show up in NOLA! '-)

[Mawrter]

I love chicory coffee. I wish the New Orleans restaurant in Philadelphia hadn't closed. I'm sure it wasn't authentic to you locals, but it was the closest I've ever been. I really regret never having been to NOLA pre-Katrina. <sigh>

[thinks too much]

Anyone notice that one man's trash is another man's treasure? Almost every problematical food (with the exception of Scrapple which I like ok) is immediately defended passionately, with a poster saying "You haven't had a REAL version of it... if you had, you'd totally get it!" Isn't that the point of this thread: wanting to try a specific food and being underwhelmed by the reality of it?

Thanks, pimento ladies, by the way, for framing their opinions with Proust, and understanding that an outsider just might not get it.

[edwinasam]

Krispy Kreme doughnuts.

[kattyeyes]

HA HA HA! You should have seen when they came to CT and everyone was abuzz about them. Our Berlin Turnpike location was so overwhelmed, people were lined up DOWN THE PIKE just to get them. Now it's a CitiBank. :)

[MakingSense]

Oh, but you already had Dunkin Donuts which had a claim on everyone's hearts. They had grown up with them and they were old friends. And DD's coffee is good.
Krispy Kreme was just the new kid on the block and everyone was taken in by the publicity blitz.
Down in KK territory, the reverse was true. We didn't see what the deal was on DD.
Another "emotional" food.

The DD shop in our neighborhood however killed the Starbucks. They're right across the street from each other at a major bus/subway transfer point and Starbucks can't beat them on variety or price point. And DD has those terrific takeaway jugs of coffee for meetings and events. We all love them.
But I still slam on the brakes for HOT Krispy Kremes down on Highway 1. The best.

[alwayscooking]

I don't get DD coffee - it's awful (I grew up in the NW) and the donuts and other things they call food are even worse. When I have coffee (which is infrequently), I want it to taste deep, rich and strong. DD's is just off in aroma, strength, and flavor. I guess you have to grow up with it . . .

[MakingSense]

You probably just started a fight with half of New England - or at least CT.
You may be right about DD coffee and most of the foods we've discussed in this thread. You "have to grow up with it."

DD coffee isn't as good as what I grew up with in New Orleans, but it beats the hell out of Charbucks. We were very happy to have DD as an alternative to Charbucks for mass market coffee and at least their donuts are fresh . It's not bad for when I don't have time to hit one of my favorite coffee houses.

[alwayscooking]

Everyone to their corners! Living in Boston, I've had this fight before - and live to tell of it.

My chain preference was Seattle's Best but that went away in Boston. Now I rely on making my own.

[MakingSense]

Yep, you grew up in the NW and craved the familiar. Maybe the folks in Boston didn't take to Seattle's Best because they wanted what was familiar to them.
Lots of products don't make it when they try to expand geographically.

Krispy Kreme had problems with the expansion model. They opened too many new stores too quickly and the financial burden took them down. They're doing fine now since they've pulled back.

We're watching Starbucks suffer now. They're closing stores right and left but small independent coffee shops are prospering in most communities if they had good business models.
Sometimes it's the product, sometimes it's the business plan....

Most people like the coffee they've been used to their whole lives - unless they're new coffee drinkers. You're not one of those. Neither am I. So we make our own to stay happy.

[alwayscooking]

It's ironic but I didn't discover Seattle's Best until I moved to Boston - then they closed.

[Andria]

May I add a Timmy's (Tim Horton's) double double to the fist-fight? Travel abroad with almost any Canadian and the nothing we miss most... your morning Timmy's coffee. We're the ones who sit in the sun too long and hallucinate a Tim Horton stand on the beach. Designer coffee houses are fine, but Timmy's is just good-ole comfort coffee.

[al b. darned]

I don't know if DD coffee changed or my taste did, but I used to like DD coffee. Now I think it's pretty lame...but it's nowhere near as nasty as MD's "premium blend" coffee!

[Caroline1]

The primary difference between Kirspy Kreme and Dunkin' Donuts is that DD makes GREAT crullers and KK's are disgusting. I don't think I've ever had KK coffee, but when I have a long way to drive, a cup of DD is good for the road.

[thew]

i didnt grow up with KK, but i was sure sad when they closed up shop here in NYC

[shaogo]

The Krispy Kreme on the Berlin Turnpike in Connecticut was indeed teeming with people when they first opened. It was a public relations coup.

The reason they're not there any longer is because when they came into town, they agreed to certain zoning requirements. Apparently their use of the place as a manufacturing facility, with trucks pulling up in all hours of the evening, was in violation of their arrangement with the town. They were shut down and moved elsewhere.

[thew]

there was a whola sale closing of krispy kreme's across the northeast

i think they expanded too fast

[Avalondaughter]

...or maybe their donuts just weren't all that.

I understand that the hot doughnuts were a great gimmick and that's what made them special, but if you can't eat your hot doughnut right away, then you're stuck with a pretty ordinary blog of dough.

I'm a sucker for Boston Cream ones. DD has it all over KK in that respect. KK doesn't taste as good and it's smaller than DD. If they're non-original-glazed doughnuts are like this, no wonder people aren't into them up north.

[kattyeyes]

Right there with you on Boston Cream (or Creme as they say in the land of DD). ;) I honestly eat them so infrequently at this point, but still crave them...and DD is so pervasive around here, they're always calling me from the road with their little exit signs that say, "SEE YOU TOMORROW." Thank god for willpower, I guess. I do like some of the mom & pop doughnut shops even better, but lucky for my waistline, they are nowhere near my house.

And, yes, back to Making Sense, I think DD coffee is an emotional/growing-up-with-it thing, or as Andria nicely put it, "comfort coffee." I drink mine light with two sugars and have joked for years it's a hot coffee shake. But I'm a big fan of the hot coffee shake. Even better with hazelnut. The smell just sucks me right in (well, and to the haters, maybe the smell just sucks). I always want one as soon as I get a whiff of one, though.

Got a DD coffee the other day and noticed a t-shirt in the display case, "FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS DRINK STARBUCKS" with the DD logo, of course. HA HA HA! America runs on Dunkin', don'tcha know?!

On the other hand, I love an Illy or LaVazza espresso and don't even need sugar in them, go figure.

[thew]

for me KK excelled in the fluffiness of the doughnuts - now i grew up on DD, but theirs is a much denser doughnut.

[beachmouse]

To me, KK doesn't even hold up as well as similar donuts from the Publix bakery case. They're so insanely sweet that I can't aste anything other than sugar.

[LaLa]

Thats the problem KK SHOULD NEVER BE BOUGHT IN A GROCERY STORE...they should only be bought at a KK THAT BAKES tjhem on site and they must go in the back and get them off the line....that is the only way to enjoy KK.

[kubasd]

OMG i drove past it that day and was amazed at the amount of people lined up outside! I drove past and went to dunkie

[LPhila]

Know it's probably that I haven't learned to appreciate but... Ireland, black pudding, for breakfast. Can't take anything with that flavor, that early...

[RealMenJulienne]

Chicagoans, please understand that I say this as a longtime admirer of your fair city, but I can't understand what the deal is with the Italian beef sandwich. This is a sandwich I really WANT to love. First, it's from Chicago, so big plus for me. Second, it has giardiniera on it, perhaps America's finest condiment. Third, it is sold from questionable-looking shacks all over the city, which provides an irreplaceable ambiance when eating one. The problem is the sandwich itself is only OK at best.

I have eaten beefs at 4 locations - Johnnie's, Portillo's, Poochie's, and some generic Streeterville deli - so I don't think I am being unfair. Some were not bad, others were nasty, but in all cases I was still eating wet bread and overcooked beef. I also think the Italian beef fails my litmus test for a sandwich: portability. If you can't eat it one-handed while driving, or while striding down the street, without getting gravy all over your hands, then the sandwich has lost its raison d'etre.

Now, is the Italian beef entirely without merit? Of course not. Sometimes a big pile of meat and giardiniera served on a dissolving bun just hits the spot. But is it an iconic sandwich which deserves to be ranked alongside the cheesesteak or the Italian sub? Sadly I must say no.

[TampaAurora]

You can eat a cheese steak while driving? And stay clean?

[RealMenJulienne]

TampaAurora, it's not easy but it can be done. The trick is in turning your wrist to make gravity work for you!

[TampaAurora]

My dad was a cabbie in Philly. I thought he was the only one able to do that.

[bolivar13]

Well, your number one problem there is requiring a sandwich to be portable. Have you ever had a pastrami at Katz's in NYC. Good luck porting that and sandwiches probably don't get much better.
I personally however love the italian beef. I live in RI now and it's one of my most missed foods. I'm amused that you're wanting to rank it along the cheesesteak because I've always thought the cheesesteak was a decent sandwich but missing the soggy wonderfulness of the italian beef.
I guess that to me, the dissolving bun is half the point of the sandwich.

[RealMenJulienne]

Hi Bolivar, I have had pastrami in NY but not at Katz's, and I would say that a huge mound of meat between two scraps of rye, however tasty, is not a good sandwich. Maybe I am being unreasonably dogmatic but to me a sandwich must be able to be eaten cleanly, with one or two hands, on the move. I think the italian beef would be much improved if they were made with a crustier bun, with the juice spooned into the middle rather than all over the outside.

[BobB]

I have the same problem with NYC deli sandwiches. Why do they have to put this softball-sized mound of meat in the middle of the bread, leaving the edges bare? Take a second more to spread the meat out evenly and the sandwich would be easier to handle and easier to eat. It's a pet peeve of mine. Fortunately I only have to deal with it on the one or two occasions a year that I'm in NYC eating deli.

[alwayscooking]

Perhaps the pleasure of a real NYC deli sandwich (ala Katz's) is pulling out and savoring some of the meat in advance of attacking the monster. Or saving some for dessert . . .

[bolivar13]

Ah, that's just a philosophical difference then, I guess :)

[Sam Fujisaka]

Yak butter tea in the Himalayas, pulque in Mexico, Marmite and Vegemite in their respective places of origin, an' salted peanuts in yer Pe'si or C'cola in y'all know where!

[Sal Vanilla]

Yeah - I do not get Whattaburger either. Or those little mini square burgers - who's name slips my mind.

I do not get Rocky Mountain Oysters.

[alwayscooking]

RMO - eaten in huge batches with eggs by the guys that do the Spring castration. Makes you wonder what they're compensating for or if they're just happy it's not them.

[Bryn]

We call 'em Prairie Oysters in these dem parts.

[bayoucook]

Krystal burgers? White Castle?

[fern]

I love a White Castle kids meal now and then. Crinkle fries, those oniony, mushy-bunned burger squares sound horrid but taste pretty darn good.

When we were young it made good late-night drunk food. Now I like it for a cheap and salty lunch once in a while. Might be one of those things you had to grow up with, they do sound disgusting when described.

[Wahooty]

That's because they ARE disgusting. But that doesn't mean you don't crave them wildly, especially when inebriated. Even in altered states, however, I sink my teeth into them and go, "man this is awful...but I NEED more..."

I think they are so addictive because of the secret ingredients - crack and just a smidge of self-loathing.

[fern]

Wahooty, you made me laugh out loud. All so true. I want a sack of sliders!

[Wahooty]

I don't know about Krystal, but White Castle's slogan is "What you crave." Unfortunately, it is SO TRUE. Nobody I know thinks they are good food, but the cravings are absolutely real. In the interest of full disclosure, I do have a childhood association - my grandparents would occasionally take us out for them when we were visiting, and as a wee one I thought they were awesome because it was a burger that was my size. No recollection of the actual flavor, aside from the fact that it was not the reason I got excited about them. Size DOES matter, or at least did to me when I was 7. Cut to 15 years later and a Friday after Thanksgiving in Chicago, when one member of our party was late getting home after a LONG night of bar-hopping because he made his cab driver go through the drive-thru for a suitcase. Nothing has ever been more satisfying/disgusting. Apparently the heroin to the cocaine that is the slider is their chicken and/or fish sandwiches. Thankfully, I went to slider rehab before I graduated to those.

Seriously, just the thought of them makes me shudder/yearn.

[fern]

Well, I am sorry you mentioned the chicken and fish sandwiches. I'd probably have made it through without trying either, now it's another bad plan I can't commit to avoiding. The only thing saving me now is that we have lost our employment in this house and are not spending ANY money on fast food. Hmmm, just found the silver lining in that situation. ;)

I don't love fast food but White Castle and Culver's Butter Burger w/everything (no cheese) & fries will always be a treat for me.

Grandma & Grandpa, a late-night suitcase full of sliders. The stuff good memories are made of.

[KevinB]

Used to live in Windsor, Ontario, and worked in Detroit. Once a month or so, I'd pick up a sack of sliders for the ride home.

They never made it over the bridge.

[pacheeseguy]

Here in Lancaster County, where I was born and raised, I just don't see the appeal of these 3 local favorites
Souse - pickled, jellied Pig's feet, tongue and other parts
Cup cheese - vile smelly snot, described as cheese
Turkey Hill Iced Tea - sweet flavored water, a big seller year round all along the east coast

[chef4hire]

even turkey hill ice cream is gross- I know ppl love it but to me it tastes like sweet whipped air

[pacheeseguy]

that's exactly what it is - whipped air
There are many better choices available, but they do have a well know name here
in the area.

[Mawrter]

Yuck, yuck and yuck - ITA.

[Ruth Lafler]

I've been looking at this header for days and nothing came to mind, then another thread reminded me: Whoopie pies. In fact, I've been to Lancaster County a couple of times and I don't get what's so wonderful about Amish baked goods. Too sweet, too bland, not very good quality ingredients, etc.

Others I agree with from this thread:
In n Out Burgers
Cincinnati "Chili"

[thinks too much]

Good call on the whoopie pies! Sweetened whipped shortening for filling does not make a tasty treat in my book.

[ktmoomau]

I love Amish baked goods, but I grew up with them as I had an amish nanny. What I find funny is that you say not very good ingredients. Perhaps not the ones you had, but anything my nanny made had fresh from the barn milk, hand churned butter, fruits from the garden, foraged or somewhere you could go pick your own fruit, real lard (which is actually better for you I think than margarine or shortening) so everything was fresh and very tasty.

I however do not like anything from those "Amish" markets... the only acceptable things other than my nanny's are by the side of the road bake stands, small amish community bakeries or the harvest sale they have at home every year.

I think a well made whoopie pie is really good for how light the cake is, a lot like a devil's food cake crossed with a cake doughnut in a good way. But I generally think everything is a matter of personal taste and it is what I grew up with. A fancy restaurant here in DC with a famous pastry chef tried to make "whoppie pies" they had marshmallow cream and were abysmal. Amish recipes vary so much by region and family you do have a distinct preference. For example I don't like chunky snitz pies, the snitz has to be almost as fine as apple butter for me to like it.

[Ruth Lafler]

I think, perhaps, that these days only baked goods made for home consumption are made with the ingredients you describe. The baked goods they make to sell are pretty awful -- basically just sugar and shortening. And yet, people make a big deal about it. I did, however, have some excellent Amish pickles last time I was in Philly.

[ktmoomau]

Most of those "Amish" markets are really Mennonite markets anyway... maybe some crafty Amish, but all in all probably more Mennonite. Not that it makes a huge heck of a lot of difference.

Yeah I only get things from very local Amish bakeries. There is one near my parent's home that two sisters run called Sugar and Spice that is great. But again you are probably right any "big" operation is probably awful. I think the joy of Amish food is the fact that it isn't supposed to be a "big" operation, it is supposed to be close to the earth, and any large for profit operation would get away from that. Not that the Amish don't try to be profitable or business-like, which they do. But I think the real joy of amish cooking is the fresh ingredients.

But those I don't really consider those huge places that advertise all the Amish gook de gook to be genuine. That is like thinking a McDonald's hamburger is what a hamburger is...

Real Amish baked goods are heavenly. They have some doughnuts which I think are like a better version of a Krispy Kreme that I could dream about. If you get one hot and fresh its like a pillow of heaven.

[travelmad478]

I make it a point every July to go to a Mennonite auction in Intercourse, PA specifically to get those doughnuts. They are revelatory. I posted about it on the PA board years ago. It should be a CH pilgrimage (it is one for me!)

[ktmoomau]

Yes, it should be! Sugar and Spice sells them but you have to time it to get there right when they are done.

They sell them at the Harvest Sale in Western Maryland every fall, early October and they are hot and right there... I buy other stuff there, but come for the doughnuts.

Fiance doesn't believe me yet, he has only had one a day old that I brought them and they are ok then, but not the heavenous joy they are fresh...

Oh travelmad... now I want to go home and get doughnuts. I am getting married in a couple weekends, maybe I can request someone bring me doughnuts down from home when they come. It can be lunch.

[kattyeyes]

They sound fab. But do they still sell the "Intercourse is for lovers" t-shirts? We went when I was 12 or 13 and I bought one, but my mom never let me wear it out of the house. ;)

[travelmad478]

> But do they stll sell the "Intercourse is for lovers" t-shirts?

Not at a Mennonite auction they don't ;-)

This year's dates are July 17-18. The event is held at the corner of New Holland Rd. and Rte. 340. Be there, or miss the most wonderful doughnut on this earth!!! They come straight out of a vat of boiling oil right into your hand. OMG is it incredible.

[Passadumkeg]

Yes, and one can drive through Intercourse and wind up in Paradise! But dont' detour into Blue Ball(s).
Historical factoid: Joshua Chamberlain and the Maine 20th brought back Whoopie Pies to Maine after the Battle of Gettysberg. Maine now considers them her own. Some are wicked good, but give me shoo fly pie or brown bread w/ apple butter.

[Agent 510]

I have a new nominee for this thread: St. Louis-style pizza. For anyone who hasn't had the misfortune to try it, it features a crispy thin crust, a weird processed cheese blend called Provel, and (at least at the place I tried, Imo's) a lot of grease. Blargh.

Another more controversial pizza nomination: Chicago deep-dish pizza. I realize it's almost un-American not to love this stuff, but I realized the only place I've had really good-tasting deep dish is Lou Malnati's in Chicago. The others I've tried (including Geno's and Giordano's in Chicago), I think I only liked because I was hungry, drunk, and/or drunkenly hungry - and they were downright nasty once they got all cold and congealed.

[travelmad478]

Chicago pizza is an abomination. There have already been dissertations written on the subject of "proper" pizza on CH, but let me just chime in to say that you are so right. It is like dough with tomato sauce on top. Yech.

[Agent 510]

Putting aside the "proper pizza" side of the discussion (which you're right, has been covered ad infinitum on here already), I think deep dish pizza CAN taste good with the right ingredients and preparation. There's nothing inherently wrong with it, it's just really "big" pizza.

I just think a lot of places don't bother, because even if it sucks, it'll appeal to gluttons and people who are just fascinated by the concept. There's a place called Zachary's where I live, which I think is just OK, but has had lines out the door for years because people are just so enthralled with the naughty indulgence of deep-dish pizza, here in the Bay Area where you have an overabundance of healthy places, noodle shops, and vegan outposts.

[Caitlin McGrath]

Actually, I think Zachary's has lines out the door because people actually really like it, gut bomb that it is. Whether one believes those people have good taste or know good food depends on one's opinion of Zachary's, but I, for one, don't believe it's ben so popular for almost 30 years simply because people are "enthralled with the naughty indulgence of deep-dish pizza." There's plenty of indulgence available in the Bay Area along with vegan, raw, and health-oriented places; Zachary's is one flavor.

[thursday]

It's not just for gluttons! I adore deep dish pizza! Zachary's is awesome, but I like Gino's East and Giordano's just as well. I don't think there's any better kind of pizza -

[DCLindsey]

Funny, the first thing I thought of was St. Louis style pizza -- its absolutely disgusting.

[Boccone Dolce]

I forgot about Provel until I read this!!!
What did I have it on......... I can't remember. But when I read it I could hear them saying it and I remember going 'Do you mean Provolone?' and the guy getting all snitty 'I said Provel- it's Provel. I know what Provolone is.' Gaaaaaaa where was I- Kansas City? St. Louis?

[Just One Bite]

I don't get Lobster Rolls. I love lobster and I just can't imagine why anyone would want to pay that kind of money to ruin that delicious meat with mayonaisse and put it on a hot dog bun! I want it hot and grilled or boiled, with lemon & melted butter.

I also don't get In-N-Out Burgers. The best thing about them is that they put so much lettuce that they are crispy & fresh. The fries are always soggy, and when I've asked for them well done, they were burnt!

On the other hand...I LOVE Chick-Fil-A and wish they had them in Los Angeles.

Also don't get Key Lime pie. It always tastes like soap to me.

[BobB]

There are actually two types of lobster rolls here in New England - cold ones, which are the ones you describe, and hot ones, in which the warm lobster chunks are mixed with melted butter and served on a toasted bun. I prefer the latter, sounds like you might too.

[Morganna]

Yah, I just had one of the hot ones last night. MMMMMMMmmmm

[Just One Bite]

That DOES sound good!

[Passadumkeg]

For many Downeast Mainers a lobster roll is cheap food, just like a hot dog or any other sandwich. I regularly trade my ham sandwiches for my students' lobster rolls and we are both happy. They're tired of lobster and I of ham.
I wouldn't even consider eating a Chick-Fil-A! Nasty chain junque.
Best we each stay at home.

[Agent 510]

I think part of the reason people go bonkers over In-n-Out is because of the crappiness of the competition (McD's, Burger King, Carl's Jr., Jack-in-the-Box). It doesn't compare to a good restaurant burger, but it's miles ahead of those guys' offerings.

[ginael]

Agreed, Agent, agreed. Here in San Diego, we have several options for delicious hamburgers; Hoodad's, Rocky's, Neighborhood, Burger Lounge (albeit a chain), et al.

It's almost as if the allure of In 'n Out is enough for people to insist on eating there.

[Passadumkeg]

I visit my bro every year in Vegas ans after al the bruhaha am always tempted to try I 'n Out, but so much food, so little time. I even by -passed Blake's Lottabuger w/ green chile in New Mexico last week.

[DanaB]

While I also love lobster in its pure form, I can't think of much better than a good lobster roll, with chunks of lobster mixed with the right amount of mayo on a roll grilled in butter. Yum, yum, yum!

I also like tuna salad and shrimp salad, and I love dipping my chilled cracked crab in a dip of mayo mixed with dijon mustard. I think mayo goes great with many kinds of seafood, especially shellfish. Maybe it's a mayo thing? If you are not a fan of mayo, I could see how you might not like a lobster roll. But to me, it's a perfect combination :-)

[huaqiao]

There are a few Chick-Fil-A's in the LA area. I go to the one at the Del Amo Fashion Center in Torrance quite often. And I always pass the one in Irvine when I go visit my parents.

And there's really not much to get about In-N-Out. It's a good inexpensive burger using fresh ingredients.

[alkapal]

i'll get you a good recipe for key lime pie -- my brother-in-law (a native floridian from a long-time floridian family) has perfected his pie using his own key limes. it is definitely not "soapy," but uses a pastry crust (authentic) and key lime juice and sweetened condensed milk. maybe an egg. the ratio of juice to the milk is critical.

you can get the key limes at trader joe's, if you have one nearby. persian lime juice will make you a lime pie, but it won't give you the same flavor as the key lime.

[kchurchill5]

Key Lime is great. I make it a lot for friends. Yes It is very basic, but I like cracker crumb, but either or, the filling is the same. I don't like just a dollop of fresh whipped cream with a little lime zest vs the norm. But both ways are great.

[kchurchill5]

I agree and not. Love lobster rolls, but I prefer if I had my choice to have lobster plain but still a great sandwich, but way way over priced. I make them for 1/3 the cost, same taste.

Chick-Fil-A I won't even eat that when desperate ... I do eat fast food on the go, but wouldn't even set food in the place. I have had it 4-5 times and it was just horrible.

Key lime, if made right, it is great! But imitation key lime is terrible.

[himbeer]

Louisiana breaded soft shell crab.

[bolivar13]

Wow... You're out of your mind. Those are amazing.

[Passadumkeg]

Ditto, just had some last week in Lafayette. Superb. Flatlanders just don't know goooood seafood.

[Morganna]

I've never had the chance to have soft shelled crabs. Do you eat them whole? Shell and all? Guts and all?

[bayoucook]

The bad stuff has been cleaned out before it's cooked, then yes, you eat the whole thing and wish you could eat more!

[Morganna]

I'd give it a go. :)

[MakingSense]

Huh? Those are on St. Peter's menu in Heaven.
You musta had a really bad experience. That is food as good as it gets.

[mpjmph]

I like them, but I can understand why some wouldn't. Even if you like the taste or texture, the appearance can be a little freaky for the unfamiliar.

[bayoucook]

I can understand that, I've seen it here when someone orders their first soft-shell crab. Also have overheard those unfamiliar with crawfish tell their young that they're just baby lobsters!

[Glencora]

himbeer, I've had it only once and didn't like it, either. Seemed to me as though someone had forgotten to remove the shell. We seem to be in the minority, though. Anyhow, it was years ago, in Williamsburg VA, a place not known for it's cuisine. I'd be willing to try again.

[bayoucook]

Glencora - they have to be harvested at exactly the right time. When you have one on your plate, you should barely notice there's a shell - it should be just a little crispier and a tad chewier than the rest of the crab. And the tentacles and claws are so, so delicious, the crabmeat in the center just delectable!

[Passadumkeg]

Amen, sister!

[MattInNJ]

Communion wafers, their consistency is terrible, they are bland, and you only get one!

[Passadumkeg]

Funny, I grew up on soft shell crab sandwiches in NJ and still crave them when I return summers; maybe one of my favorite seafoods.

[EWSflash]

But don't you just love the way they stick to the roof of your mouth? ;-)

[The Shepherd]

One word Quohog. Thought I died, was up all night wishing I knew where to find a drug store or a gun. Rhode Island can keep them.

[The Shepherd]

I believe it is spelled Quahog. Still deadly!

[applehome]

You got ahold of a bad one - them's the risks of eating raw shellfish. A Quahog is just a bigger/older cherrystone which is a bigger/older littleneck. Hey - nobody said finding great food was always easy. How many foragers had to die before we figured out which mushrooms to eat?

[Passadumkeg]

Quohogs on the half shell were maybe the first "chowish" food I learned to eat as a kid. We used to get them by the bushel and shuck them around the campfire. Still love 'em. I got sick on a oyster in Mobile a couple of weeks ago (Scargod slid it onto my plate when I went ot the restroom.), but that hasn't stoped me from eating them. Either has overindulgence in Black Label, but that's another story.

[EWSflash]

I have to ask- Carling's or Johnny Walker? ;-)

[Passadumkeg]

EWSMabel, Black Label Scotch. I do, however have a 50 year old bottle of Carling's down in the cellar.

[taos]

Soft shell crabs. Had them at the Maryland shore a few years ago and found there wasn't much edible there. Was surprised since lobster is my favorite food on the planet. I was at a very popular place with a line out the door so I don't think it was the establishment.

Also lutefisk, which I had at the Syttende Mai festival in Stoughton Wisconsin a while back. Kind of unpleasant.

[sebetti]

don't worry taos, very few people actually LIKE lutefisk. It exists on many tables simply for tradition's sake.

[Passadumkeg]

I actually like lutefisk, associate it w/ the Xmases I spent in Norway and miss it.
And.........soft shell crab sandwiches are my favorite sandwiches (grew up on them).
I just like too many foods.
I live on the coast of Maine and enjoy lobster, but just don't get these hordes of tourists sitting by a noisy highway to pay an exorbitant price for for a bottom feeding bug.

[Bob W]

I'm a litle confused about how there's not much edible in soft-shell crabs. The whole thing is edible. There should be nothing left on your plate.

[taos]

Ah, sorry. Not soft shell. They were just regular Chesepeake Bay crabs, Blue I guess they're called. Definitely hard shelled. We used hammers. After all the pounding, nothing there. As I said, I love lobster so I'm used to working for my food, but did not understand this.

[ktmoomau]

Well real people from the area don't use hammers and pound all the meat into smitherines. Too bad no one showed you how to really eat one. Not as much meat as a lobster of course, but a fair amount.

[Passadumkeg]

Sweet meat too. Caught them as a kid too. Taos, try a real crab cake next time, less work, lots of flavor.

[Bob W]

Yeppers, blue crabs have really sweet meat. Bobby Flay did a crabcake throwdown that bizarrely was with a guy up in Boothbay Harbor (Hahbah), ME, who made crabcakes with local peekytoe crabs fished right out of the harbor.

Now, I am sure those are nice enough crabs, but sorry, there is no finer crab than the blue crab. Bobby brought some blue crabs up to Maine, made his crabcakes, and won the throwdown (which he rarely does), despite the local guy using crabs that were fished out of the harbor that same morning.

Bobby should do a crabcake throwdown with someone from Baltimore, so both contestants are using blue crabs. That would be a fair fight.

[lifespan]

Yes, it's an acquired skill. I married into a Mid-Atlantic family that's crazy for blue crab - they introduced me to the ritual and skill of eating them. Quite a treat, although I'm still working on the skill part... Must be done while consuming beer. Best when undertaken at a big table, covered with newspaper, on the screened porch of beach house. Wear old clothes and flops...

[Passadumkeg]

We use a pareing knife and prefer white wine. My favorite childhood bar The Sayreville Bar, had all you can eat blue crab special up until 2 years ago when it suddenly shut.

[Wahooty]

Yes, a bushel of blue crabs isn't dinner, it's an evening's entertainment. Beer is required, as is an outdoor venue if you can swing it. And copious amounts of slaw or whatever side dishes of choice to keep you sustained in between morsels of critter. Man, I miss the Chesapeake sometimes...

[Passadumkeg]

I'll acquiese to beer as well. I get free rock crabs, but they just ain't as sweet.

[Wahooty]

The problem with wine is that there's just something incongruous about handling actual glassware with hands coated in crab detritus. A beer bottle covered in wayward seasonings and bits of shell is more easily disposed of and you're not mussing up something you're going to have to clean later. It goes right along with the newspaper on the table. I save the wine for the crabcakes we make the next night with the meat from the crabs cracked after we're all full....

[alkapal]

i'm with you taos, crabs are too much trouble. give me alaskan king crab legs or crab imperial! ;-)).

[lifespan]

The most disappointing regional food I've tasted:

There is a traditional French Acadian food in Nova Scotia that is still available in many small villages on the Acadian coast, called Rapie Pie. Rapie Pie is a type of meat pie topped with grated potato from which all the starch has been squeezed.

I read a great deal about Rapie Pie prior to a bicycle trip I took to Nova Scotia in 1993. With great anticipation, I looked forward to tasting it.

First bite was a bit of a shocker, because it was not appetizing. So, I dug in - I thought perhaps it's an acquired taste. But, it did nothing for me. It was bland and, generally speaking, nothing to write home about.

I sampled another from a different preparer in a different village. Uggh. I thought, "What's all the fuss about? I've had better food in England."

p.s. I don't want to offend English readers with this stereotype... we know the English are capable of preparing some really fine food. But, we also know the old joke about English food - and perhaps experienced it first-hand in bygone days.

[taos]

I think there is a difference between regional favorites and plain old regional food that is simply unique to a particular area.

As a native New Englander I might put lobster rolls in the latter category. When I was growing up, it was in the category of junk food, or close to it. All it is is bits of lobster meat mixed with cheap mayonaisse and served on a junky white bread hot dog roll. I don't recall people traveling from out of town to eat them. I've never heard of hot lobster rolls either. Must be a new invention.

[lifespan]

You missed one of the great pleasures of being a New Englander then. What you described is something like lobster salad on a poor quality bun. The lobster roll that people rave about is nothing short of AMAZING. Here's a link to an establishment in Connecticut that serves one of the best examples of said lobster roll: http://ljfishtale.com/
Now, take a gander at its beauty: http://comradechufood.blogspot.com/20...
I would drive perhaps 150 miles to eat such a delicacy. Fortunately, I have only to drive 30 miles...

[Bob W]

Hot lobster rolls seem to be a Connecticut-only thing. I grew up in RI and spent many summers in Maine and never heard of them either.

McDonalds in Maine sometimes have lobster rolls, so on the low end they certainly be characterized as junk food -- but still, that is pretty good junk food!

[Passadumkeg]

Yes, Mickey Dee Lobber Rolls, just $3.95. You want fries w/ that? Super size it?

[BobB]

Not hot, but warm lobster rolls (lobster meat mixed with melted butter, served on a toasted roll) are quite common here in Mass, especially in better restaurants. There's a discussion on the subject a couple of hundred posts upstream here.

[taos]

Sorry, I beg to differ on the "fairly common" and "better restaurants" part.

I've lived, and eaten at restaurants, Massachusetts for over four decades and all you're describing is a regular old lobster roll but heated up and put on the same Wonder Bread roll that's been toasted instead of served raw. I haven't seen it at too many "better restaurants." It's certainly not common at them.

They also have clam rolls. Basically the same deal, but substitute fried clams for pieces of lobster. They're not commonly served at better restaurants either.

[lifespan]

It seems one must define a term such as "better restaurant," and BobB does not explain what is meant. However, to base our discussion in fact, I offer the following example (hoping that BobB will do the same):
In Connecticut, it is not uncommon to find lobster roll on the menu of an upscale establishment ( e.g., Max Fish in Glastonbury; see website: www.maxrestaurantgroup.com/fish ). I suppose, there is a difference between "upscale restaurant" and "fine dining restaurant," although I am not prepared to explain what it is for this thread.

As for the lobster roll itself, the argument between taos and BobB strikes me as unnecessary. It seems logical...and I am guessing here...that the upscale, and very delicious, lobster roll that is raved about is an interpretation of the cheapo lobster roll, which apparently has existed for decades and decades and decades. There is nothing unusual in America with this culinary practice; that is, finding an old regional favorite (the cheapo lobster roll) and taking it uptown, so to speak. The best of American culinary creativity is to use readily-available, regional ingredients and create a dish with a twist. Right? Having said that, I will report that the very delicioius version of lobster roll, the one raved about at this site, has existed for at least several decades...

So gentlemen, why all the testiness?

[taos]

Last I checked Glastonbury, CT was not in Massachusetts and Bob claimed that the hot lobster roll was common at better restaurants in Massachusetts, which really is not true, no matter how you slice it.

I haven't been to Max Fish, but I have been to Max Amore several times -- same type of place, except not specifically seafood. Never saw lobster rolls on the menu. If Max Fish is of the same class as Max Amore, I'd call it a "better" or upscale restaurant.

I just checked Wikipedia and learned that the specific kind of hot lobster roll seems to be found only in Connecticut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lobster_...), so I think what Bob really meant to say was this:

The hot lobster roll is found is a preparation found almost exclusively in Connecticut and is found even in some upscale seafood restaurants.

That's a big difference from saying it's commonly (not just sometimes) found in upscale restaurants (not just upscale seafood restaurants) in Massachusetts (which is not Connecticut, again).

Looking forward to a trip to Max Fish to try it!

[BobB]

I wasn't trying to make an argument out of this, but since you insist on calling me a liar --

First of all, I started off my first post in this subthread by saying NOT hot, but WARM lobster rolls (i.e., specifically not the CT kind) are common in MA, especially in better restaurants. The "better SEAFOOD restaurant" part of that I assumed was understood since we're talking about lobster. I then proceeded to give several examples of places - all in MA - that serve them, most of which are higher-end restaurants.

Whether I should have used the word common - OK, maybe that was an overstatement. I've seen them enough that they seem common to me. But regardless of ubiquity, they undeniably ARE found in MA, and ARE found more in higher-end establishments than cheap fish joints, which to tend more to cold lobster/mayo presentations. QED.

[lifespan]

Max Fish version is only so-so example of said lobster-roll. Max Fish was mentioned as an example of an upscale restaurant in CT that serves lobster roll. (Again, it's only so-so.) If you're actually interested in understanding and learning (rather than simply offering bombastic comments to compensate for your lack of expertise)...try Lenny & Joe's (A Fish Tale) as mentioned earlier in thread for the best lobster roll imaginable. Furthermore, I mentioned Max Fish hoping that big BobB would follow suit and offer an example of a Mass. restaurant serving non-mayo, warm lobster roll. (If big BobB is correct, why doesn’t he offer evidence?) And by the way, concerning other areas within New England (outside of CT): In May (2009) I ordered and ate a non-mayo, warm lobster roll in an upscale restaurant in Maine (near Bowdoin College). The lobster roll was of the type we are accustomed to at Lenny & Joe's in CT...
A bit of advice for taos, who claims expertise about lobster rolls and New England: he may want to investigate the topic prior to commenting so strongly....

[BobB]

I listed several, yesterday, in the post that is currently directly below this one.

[Paulustrious]

You are historically correct.

[BobB]

No, a regular lobster roll has mayo, a warm one (at least the kind I'm referring to) does not. Neptune Oyster is famous for them, Great Bay did them from time to time as specials. Clink does a somewhat more elaborate one. Those are (or in the case of Great Bay, were) all "better" restaurants. Bubala's in P'town does them. I don't know who else off the top of my head but those can't be the only places.

[Sandwich_Sister]

I love this thread!

I agree with a few of the answers and others I do not. I do agree that some of this does have to do with how you are raised. I was raised in central florida by a father who is from Cleveland and mother who was raised in the south. So while I do like a lot of southern food I don't like it all.

Here are the things I agree with.
* In N Out and whataburger - It's over rated. It's a fast food burger, it may be one of the better fast food burger but it's still just that and I've had better at non chain fast food burger joints.

* Boiled Peanuts - way too gushy soggy mushy gross in my mouth feeling. Funny story though, when I worked at an armory and sword shop one was the armorers, who had a southern draw, asked me if I had every had boiled nuts. I thought he said Bull nuts and he told me how tasty they were and how he was going to bring them in the next day. Even though I don't like boiled peanuts I'm glad I was wrong about the possibilty of having to taste bull nuts.

* Just a comment on Philly Cheese Steaks - Here is one that I think depends on how you were raised, although I've never had one in Philly I like my cheese steaks with provolone and I'm not sure I'd be a fan of the cheese wiz although I would try one.

Things I didn't see mentioned that I just don't get.

* Cream of Wheat. I've really only seen northerners eat it. Just not my thing

* English Breakfast Tea with Milk

* Natto - I've had this twice and its hard to get over the "stinky feet" smell of the fermented soy beans but I hear it is very good for digestion

* Bagel with Lox - I love Salmon but its not something I want to eat early in the morning

* Subway's Chicken Teriyaki Sub - Well all of subway's subs lol. Anyone who thinks buying a foot long for 5 bucks from subway is more filling than a great fresh cut meat deli sub at 6/7 inches for 6 bucks is brainwashed by marketing. It's just that Chicken Teriyaki just doesn't belong on a sub roll, that is an abomination.

* Tamarind Candy - I've had some from India and I couldn't stand it, the other candy I had there tasted like soap and potpouri. Bleck

* Chicken and Waffles - the two just don't go together to me. It seems so juxtaposed

My husband is not a chowhound member but he travels a lot and had to add a few.

* He said in Venice he had lasagna and it had boiled egg in it, he said it was ok but not what he would call Lasgna meaning it's not how grandma made it. This seems to be the whole thing about how you were raised as to how you like things regionally.

* He detested Haggis

* Hawaiian Pizza - but that is because he hates pineapple and doesn't think fruit belongs on a pizza, I however love Hawaiian Pizza and always make it at home when he isn't around.

I always try things more than once if I had a bad experience with them because maybe next time I'll have a good experience, or my taste has changed, or maybe I'll find out I just don't really care for it.

[Paulustrious]

SS, I can recommend bull nuts. Shelling them is a bit of an art.

[BobB]

Art? Heck no, ball busting is a natural talent for some people. I've known a few... ;-)

[ktmoomau]

Another vote for the Philly cheesesteak- I have had them in Philly and other places, wit whiz, wit provolone, plain or with peppers and I just don't get it. I would rather have a steak or prime rib sandwich.

[lrohner]

When I first moved to Miami, I was dying to taste authentic Cuban cuisine. Boy, I just didn't get it. Especially when I saw Cuban Sandwiches and Dulce de Leche shakes on MacD's menu!

But I did absolutely fall in love with Venezuelan food and the Brazilian churrascarias they had there.

[BrooksNYC]

The appeal of pralines is totally lost on this New Orleanian. They're just too sweet. Cloyingly sweet. Rot-every-tooth-in-your-head sweet.

[Bob W]

Hear, hear! I love N'awlins, but pralines to me are frankly gross. Why not just open a bag of sugar and pour it into your piehole?

[roro1831]

I'm with you there Brooks, too sweet for this New Orleans boy and I must confess that I don't care for pecans either.

[iluvtennis]

Awwww, man...i love those things! I wish i didn't have such a sweet tooth, and i do admit that i've felt a little sick after consuming too many pralines, but i still end up wanting a praline from time to time. One time a cashier scolded me when i purchased some, asking me if i had any idea how many calories were in them. It was embarrassing.

[alkapal]

>>>>>One time a cashier scolded me when i purchased some, asking me if i had any idea how many calories were in them. It was embarrassing.<<<<<

you're too nice, iluvtennis. embarrassment wouldn't have been my reaction. http://www.thebraincode.com/BFFL/imag...

[thew]

seriously.

i believe STFU is the proper response

[DishDelish]

How awful!

[DishDelish]

I don't get the obsession with Crispy Creme Donuts. I heard about them for years before finally trying them and they aren't worth the calorie splurge in my opinion. I had very high expectations too. I have had much better donuts from some private family businesses.

[Davwud]

Did you have the "Original Cream" right off the line??

DT

[DishDelish]

I will admit, it was probably a few hours old.

[Davwud]

Do yourself a favour and the next time you drive by and the "Hot Now" sign is on, get one right off the conveyor belt. You may not like it but at least it'll be the best you can get it.
Other than at that time, the "Original Cream" aren't all that special and the rest of their donut line isn't particularly good.

DT

[Wahooty]

Yes, that's the part that always gets lost in translation. I find that the source of the Krispy Kreme mystique can be traced to one of two things, depending on the person:

1) The "Hot Doughnuts Now" sign. When you see it lit, not only do you get a glazed doughnut still hot from the fryer, but it is also often free. I would often get late-night mass e-mails in college from people, reporting that they had just driven past and the sign was lit. Insert mass procrastination expedition here.

2) Church/school/community fundraising. Krispy Kreme has always been a top choice for easy fundraising in certain areas. Growing up, there would often be groups selling Krispy Kremes after Mass at church, and occasionally my mom would give in to our whining and pick up a box. This was pretty much the only way we ever got doughnuts, so there is a fond childhood association. And as is evident from this thread, childhood associations are important to what makes something a regional favorite. I didn't even know about the "Hot Doughnuts Now" signs until college, because my hometown didn't have an actual store - as a kid, I didn't even know that Krispy Kreme made more than one kind of doughnut, or that they ever came in quantities other than multiples of 12. :)

But yeah, if they're not plain glazed, and fresh out of the fryer, there is really nothing at all special about them. But even mediocre foodstuffs are infinitely better when freshly made.

[bayoucook]

Whew! This is getting long. Since it's persistent, maybe we should start a part II ?

[fern]

I like that idea. It's been fun to read this, I'm learning so much more about these regional foods, but it is getting awfully long!

I still don't get St Louis toasted ravioli.

[Passadumkeg]

Yes, long, but the trouble is, I like EVERYTHING that is local, no matter the locale.

[cycloneillini]

When I posted this thread I never imagined it would get this many replies. It's been fascinating to read about everyone else's version of my Whataburger!

[Passadumkeg]

Go west young man, go west! And try a Blake's Lottaburger w/ double green chile in New Mexico. What a burger!!!!

[bobcows]

Love Whataburger. This is the first year in the last six that I did not go to Austin in March and I miss my Whataburger fix. I did try Cincinnati chili a couple weeks ago and I loved that too. People should accept the fact that there are different types of "chili". Also a Sonic recently opened in the Grand Rapids area and we had to check it out. They actually had lines waiting to get in, like a bank, driving through a maze and waiting until someone left so we could park and order our Sonic burgers. This was a month or so after they had opened. That was a bit surreal.

[roro1831]

That has happened with the two Sonics that opened up in this area lately. I just don't get it.

On a similar note, Pancho's reopened a location back in my hometown and they had lines out the door for the first two to three months. I ate my share of Pancho's in college but I knew then the food wasn't good.

[thursday]

I'm keeping the thread going with:

Okra. And I'm Southern. But ew.

Poi. I really, really wanted to like poi. It made me feel so open to regional cuisines to try it more than once when we went to Hawai'i. But I just couldn't get on board. Ahi poke on the other hand...mmmmm....

[Passadumkeg]

How about chopped liver on rice?

[BobB]

That sounds good. Where is it a local specialty?

[Passadumkeg]

The south. Scargod was chowing down on it in N Carolina, while I was nursing a bad oyster(?).

[alkapal]

chopped liver on rice is not familiar to this southerner. my mom would make fried (sautéed) calf's liver and onions, but i've not seen nor heard of chopped liver on rice. since it's on rice, is it from south carolina or new orleans? oops, i see scar had it in north carolina. i'd bet that is soul food.

[Passadumkeg]

Scar wolfed it down in N Carolina along w/ Q, fried okra and an gallon of iced tea. Where is he?

[alkapal]

i'll bet it was fried chicken livers and not calf's liver, right?

~~~~~
yeah, where's scar?

ps, that's an odd menu to recover from a bad oyster, unless he was depending on the tea to clean his system! ;-)).

[Passadumkeg]

I had the bad oyster and watched him feast while I nursed a curative pulled pork sandwich and my own gallon of sweet tea.

[alkapal]

now i read more clearly! pulled pork and sweet tea is probably even a cure for dysentary! or the plague --- if ONLY they'd known!

[Naco]

That sounds like perloo or hash, which are South Carolina mainstays. I suppose you might find some around the Wilmington area. Where were you?

[alkapal]

the way i recall "purloo," it was a thick meat stew, with rice (tho' in my personal experience not as rice-y as a jambalaya), and that's how relatives from florida's upper gulf coastal areas made it.

i like to see the regional variations in basic rice and meat dishes (and their spelling, too). i looked up some recipes, and see that in the carolinas it is like dirty rice: http://www.foodandwine.com/recipes/dirty-turkey-rice-purloo

i see the food and wine folks also call it a "rice hash."
but they may be conflating the two dishes, huh, naco? sounds like with hash, it's served over rice, and with purloo, the rice is incorporated.
i found another "perlow" -- with seafood (in this case, shrimp). http://www.household-management.com/cookbook/Perlow.html
off-hand -- from a cursory look -- i wonder how this differs from jambalaya (other than using bacon instead of a sausage, and no celery).... this looks like it could be a low country dish, too.

maybe the jambalaya is specific to NOLA area (cajun & creole country) http://www.jfolse.com/recipes/meats/p... , and that the term "purloo" is what is used everywhere else to describe the meat & rice combination dish? naco, making sense, bayoucook and others, please weigh in.

[Naco]

Perloo is very similar to jambalaya- this is more along the lines of a difference in terminology than substance.

[Passadumkeg]

Naco, it was South Carolina, in Florence, here's our post:

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/620370

[Naco]

Ah, so I had it pegged. I went back and forth between SC and NC a lot as a kid, and the rice dishes always stuck out at me. You don't really see that kind of thing in most of NC.

[alkapal]

the liver dish that scargod had is identified by low country jon as "liver hash," as naco said. http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/6203...

[small h]

Poi tastes like soap. I love how it looks, though. My first trip to Hawaii, I ate it every day, in an unsuccessful attempt to learn to like it. Fail.

[DishDelish]

You really have to grow up eating it as a baby I think. I understand what u mean though, I so want to like it for the sake of my children and hubby. He will be bringing a bunch home for the baby and kids on Saturday.

[small h]

My first day on Kauai, I ordered a bowl of poi in a diner and ate it with a spoon (the server thought I was nuts, and after the first bite, so did I). I know that it's really a condiment, and I definitely gave it a shot, on everything from eggs to lomi lomi salmon. No dice.

[DishDelish]

No, no it isn't a condiment. Maybe that is how they try to get the tourists to eat it? I always heard they added sugar for the tourists at luaus though. It is supposed to be eaten with just a little water added. Older Hawaiians like to leave it out a few days until it is really sour (yuck). My husband (a native Hawaiian) has taught me how to eat it ... I just don't like it. It really does make the perfect baby food though. My kids eat huge bowl fulls and I just try to act like it is wonderful around them because I want my kids to be adventurous around food. I had to hold my head far away from the poi whenever I prepared it for my daughter when I was pregnant this last time, it stinks!

[im_nomad]

fried clams, when I moved to the maritimes. Everyone I met would ask me if i'd had clams yet, so I finally tried them that summer, full belly on first bite, and I had no idea what it was. Not pleasant. And yes, I gave them another chance or two later on, snagging one from others platters and such.

That aside, I don't get the hype about the taste which ranged between bland and a somewhat "liver" taste. FWIW I get the same taste from oysters. Steamed clams smell horrible to me, and i've never gotten the urge to taste them.

[almond3xtract]

RAISING CANE'S in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.

TASTELESS, SOGGY, BLAND, GREASY ALL AT THE SAME TIME. The Cane's Sauce everyone raves about is mayo, ketchup and black pepper. And it's EXPENSIVE!! For three chicken strips, soggy freezer fries, a greasy piece of toast, nasty/mushy cole slaw and a drink (sold separately) you're out $10.

[cycloneillini]

I couldn't agree more Almond. They have started opening them in the Houston area (in areas where there might be a concentration of well to do LSU alums), and I just don't get it. I mean it's OK, but it's just chicken strips. What's the big deal? To me Tyson's strips out of the freezer aren't that much different, and I can always concoct some kind of sauce that's just as good as theirs.

[roro1831]

I have to agree with the Raisin Cane's as well, it wasn't open when I was at LSU, but I have been back since and it's good for tailgating if you aren't set up to do your own cooking. But as far as being really good, it just isn't, in fact it gets bashed on the chains board.

[iluvtennis]

They opened one up in my hometown of west monroe, and i thought maybe the appeal was a large array of dipping sauces to choose from. Well, they only have one sauce, and it's not that good, lol. Every time i go home, though, the drive-thru line is hopping. I don't get it.

[QSheba]

I don't know if this is a "regional favorite"...but In the upstate NY area (Rochester, NY where I went to college) the "Nick Tahou's Garbage Plate" was a Rochester favorite/must try. A meat (burger, hot dog, etc). topped with any combination of home fries, macaroni salad, baked beans, or french fries topped topped with spicy mustard, chopped onions, and hot sauce....

The Pittsburgh Primanti's Sandwich with fries and coleslaw. The fries aren't that good, the coleslaw was just vinegar cabbage, and they use low quality meats/cold cuts. In theory it could be good, but the quality was just subpar and I think it's popularity comes from the drunk Pitt students that wax nostalgic about it.....

[BamiaWruz]

Canada - Poutine

[TexSquared]

Canada: Tim Horton's. The coffee is like crack cocaine in these parts. I've tried it, I don't get it. And the rest of their stuff (donuts, sandwiches, cookies, etc) are crap. Yet Canadians seem to be brainwashed to join the long drive-thru lineups at these places, like well programmed robots. Gotta wonder what the secret ingredient is....

Canada again: Bloody Caesar cocktail. Mott's Clamato is gross enough. Adding vodka and Worcestershire sauce doesn't improve it any.

Buffalo: Duff's chicken wings. Certain reviewers call them the best. They are, if you like drinking vinegar straight. I still prefer the original at the Anchor Bar.

[Davwud]

Uncle Timmies has gone steadily the way of the franchise. They used to bake their donuts in house. Now not all do. They used to be big and good. Now their small and cheap.
The coffee is fine. You may not like it but the thing about it is, it's got very little personality. So people like it. It's right down the middle of the road. Pandering to the largest market.
I personally don't get it either. It's a license to print money up here. You could put a TH 200 miles from nowhere and there'd be a line up out the door.

Caesars are good if made well. If not, terrible.

DT

[John Manzo]

I live in Calgary, where the Caesar was invented, and though it's sacrilege, I have to agree with you. Can't stand Caesars, but then I can't stand bloody marys either.

Tim's is disgusting. Everything about them is disgusting. The coffee is weak swill that people drink in gallons to make up for its watered-down lack of flavour, caffeine or taste of any kind. Their donuts are sickening. I wish to God that Dunkin' would open outside of Quebec in this country- KK gave us some choice but with only one or two locations per city, even before they moved out, we were still mostly stuck with Tim's everywhere. They litter every corner here and I understand it's even worse in places like Toronto.

[TexSquared]

Yeah, it's definitely 100X worse in Ontario. If a Tim's opens across the street from any competing donut chain, that other shop is closed in 6 months. And if you've never been here, how's this for monopoly -- there is a Tim's at EVERY EXIT on the Queen Elizabeth Way which is the freeway between Buffalo and Toronto. I don't think even Waffle House can brag about that much market penetration on southern U.S. interstates!

Near my house, there are two major intersections on which a Tim's sits on two of the corners, so that they can get both the morning AND the evening rush hour. And no matter when you drive by, always at least 5 cars in the drive-thru. Even at 2am. Freeways and city streets littered wih those damn brown cups, and triple the trash when they're doing the stupid "roll up the rim" contest.

Going by what Davwud says, Tim's is to coffee what Bud is to beer. Not great, but the masses like it.... When KK came to Canada, some avoided them because theyr'e (ooooh, evil) American owned. Conveniently forgetting that at the time Tim's was 100% owned by WENDY'S.

[Sam Fujisaka]

The bandeja Paisa