606446 Tue Mar 24 12:53:41 -0700 2009 37 8 Midwest 0 4534118 I visit central Indiana several times a year. I've been enjoying trying the finer dining restaurants in and around Indianapolis - all the more so as the finer dining scene has improved dramatically over the years. (I remember years ago, struggling to find any other place to go other than returning to the Glass Chimney!) Although I occasionally return to my favorites, I like to try new places, i.e. places I've never been before. Thus this inquiry, about where I should try during my visit next month. I will probably get to have 2-3 dinners in Indy. So far I've LOVED Oakley's Bistro (my favorite so far), and I've also really liked and enjoyed R Bistro, Elements, the Oceanaire (several times), and 14 West. (L'Explorateur too, RIP.) I'm considering several other places for my upcoming visit: Peterson's ( www.petersonsrestaurant.com ) - I will most likely go here. I'm not all that big on steaks; I'm no vegetarian, I just generally like other foods better, particularly seafood. The seafood preparations and especially the appetizers on their website menu sound spectacular! There are two other places I'm considering. I haven't seen any recent comments here about either place, so I'd welcome any opinions on them: Z’s Oyster Bar and Steakhouse ( www.zsoyster.com ) Scholars Inn / SI Lounge ( www.scholarsinn.com ) (Indy location) In case you're wondering why I chose these, rather than some other places (e.g. Meridian), it was after looking at their website menus, and noticing specific dishes that sound enticing (sweetbreads at Z's, short ribs at SI). But all opinions are welcome; if you think I would be better off choosing some other place I haven't mentioned, please recommend it! I'd also be interested in hearing about recent visits to 14 West ( www.14westindy.com ). It's been a couple years now since I went there, before they brought in Layton Roberts as executive chef, so I'm not sure whether my previously high opinion of it is still valid. And yes, at some point I'd like to return to Tallent and try it again, maybe later this year, but I'd like to concentrate on trying some of these other places first. Thanks in advance for any comments! Tue Mar 24 12:53:41 -0700 2009 55363 nsxtasy 1 4534960 You should definitely check out Euphoria in the Bugg's Temple building. The chef is formerly of Union Square Cafe in nyc, and the food is as good as Oakley's or L'Ex. Start off with the calamari or the mussels, both are stunning. Tue Mar 24 16:49:09 -0700 2009 4534118 277121 gram748 2 4535113 I see they have quite an interesting menu ( www.indycanal.com ), with global influences (e.g. a Thai soup followed by ceviche!). Thanks for the recommendation! Also, any opinions about Palomino ( www.palomino.com/menu.php?cook=1&locations=Indianapolis )? Tue Mar 24 17:44:14 -0700 2009 4534960 55363 nsxtasy 3 4542093 No one has an opinion about Z's Oyster Bar, Scholars Inn (SI Lounge), 14 West, or Palomino? Hey, where's Cookiefiend? ;) Thu Mar 26 17:33:47 -0700 2009 4535113 55363 nsxtasy 4 4545913 We are meeting up with my brother and sister-in-law (from Chicago) at Palomino tonight. We had dinner with them there a couple of years ago, and they've been raving about it ever since. They eat out a lot in Chicago, but they were still impressed. I had the best lamb shank I've ever eaten here. It's a chain, but so is Oceanaire, and I think they both do what they do extremely well. Give it a try and let us know what you think. Sat Mar 28 05:42:00 -0700 2009 4542093 11995 pikawicca 5 4550454 To follow up, dinner was very good. Lamb shanks were on the menu, as was a cassoulet, but I simply wasn't that hungry. Had the wood-roasted mushrooms to start (delicious), followed by the clam pizza. I hadn't tried their pizza before. It was very good, but not in the same league as Jeff Finch's or Daniel Orr's here in Bloomington. My brother and sister-in-law both enjoyed their roasted chicken. The only bad dish was the crab cakes -- skip this one, as it's little shreds of crab with lots of filler. Mon Mar 30 07:04:56 -0700 2009 4545913 11995 pikawicca 6 4551555 Thanks for the report - very helpful. Based on the website menu, I was trying to decide between the crab cakes and the braised boneless beef short rib, so now I know to lean towards the latter! It looks like Peterson's is a no-go for this trip, unfortunately. Z's is now part of the plan, with the possibility of another meal or two elsewhere TBD. Mon Mar 30 12:29:41 -0700 2009 4550454 55363 nsxtasy 7 4551924 You're welcome. Generally, I'd say that meat is their strongest suit. Oh, but make sure to have the mushroom soup! Mon Mar 30 13:54:08 -0700 2009 4551555 11995 pikawicca 4 4552415 Hey nsxtasy! Hummm.. I've only been to Z's Oyster Bar once - with some friends who were huge fans of the original in Louisville - and unfortunately, we were all disappointed. I didn't even write a note about it. It was only a couple of months after they opened so maybe they've settled down... I haven't been to SI since it re-opened after it's cosmetic remodel. We felt it was a good place for cocktails and appetizers but not so much for dinner. If I were going to be in that area, I'd stick with R Bistro or Elements. Unfortunately I haven't been to 14 West in quite awhile and so can't comment. In that area of downtown, I like Oceanaire (as you do) and I also like Palomino. Yes, they're both chains, but they do a good job - nice appetizers too. Palomino has a more casual feel, which isn't a bad thing. We do have reservations at Euphoria next week end - I'll report back on that. I have high hopes after hearing good comments from the Burgundy Society's dinner. Sorry for the delay! Mon Mar 30 16:39:06 -0700 2009 4542093 90565 Cookiefiend 5 4552702 Thanks for the feedback! Someone correct me if I'm wrong about this. From reading various websites, it appears that there used to be a restaurant at Buggs Temple, called Tavern at the Temple, but that restaurant closed at the end of September. They somehow kept the chef involved (the one who was with Danny Meyer, as gram indicated above) while they developed and then opened Euphoria, also in the temple (but possibly in a different space, upstairs?). It sounds like Euphoria not only may be in a different space, but it's not described as a simple name change, so I'm guessing it's a different menu etc? But with the same chef as Tavern at the Temple? I never went to the Tavern at the Temple, but I noticed it described in last year's Indy Monthly "best restaurants" article. (I'm just wondering to what extent I should consider their description still relevant to Euphoria.) Mon Mar 30 18:11:33 -0700 2009 4552415 55363 nsxtasy 6 4553762 I just read that they finally got new signage - downstairs is Creation Cafe and upstairs is Euphoria. The chef is Brad Gates... There's a local blog, FeedmeDrinkme, with the menu from the Burgundy Society's dinner, she wrote: "A creamy foie gras and fig terrine, a light crab/fennel/endive starter, beautiful Bearnaise with a parchment steamed turbot, a luscious oxtail risotto, and my favorite sweeetbreads -- and then came the cheeses and desserts. " Sounds pretty fabulous! Tue Mar 31 07:03:25 -0700 2009 4552702 90565 Cookiefiend 1 4545749 We like Dunaway's. The food is great and the rooms are really cool. We had a terrible experience at Scholar's Inn but it was just one of those nights. Went to Palomino years ago. Don't think it was anything spectacular, but not bad. www.dunaways.com This is my first post on Chowhound. Very exciting! Sat Mar 28 00:25:40 -0700 2009 4534118 273768 Henry Carroll 1 4545773 If you just want a great cheeseburger and a beer, Workingman's Friend at 234 N. Belmont is a friendly dive. It's always written up in the alternative weeklies. Sat Mar 28 01:01:12 -0700 2009 4534118 273768 Henry Carroll 2 4547816 Jesus. Workingman's is just steak and shake with more authentic decor. To top it off, it's in a neighborhood you don't want to be in after dark. Sat Mar 28 23:21:42 -0700 2009 4545773 275616 Chalkie 3 4552304 I've had several great cheeseburgers and beers at workingman's friend. Go before sundown if you're afraid of the dark. Mon Mar 30 15:58:28 -0700 2009 4547816 273768 Henry Carroll 1 4594147 Thanks again to all for the advice. I've posted a report about my three dinners in Indy, at Z's Oyster Bar, Palomino, and the Oceanaire, in the topic at http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/348586 Tue Apr 14 07:41:48 -0700 2009 4534118 55363 nsxtasy 1 4671449 I have never been able to manage a quorum to visit Z's, I am curious as well. I do think SI or Scholors Inn is very pretty, but very average on food. Never had anything to enjoy there. R Bistro is the place to go in that area. 14 West was very pompous steakhouse wannabe. I did not enjoy it at all. Food was large portioned, and minimal flavored. Oceanaire is always good, and Palomino is as well, I like it for lunch. The Buggs Temple area is one to watch. I have not tried the first attempts, but I hope Euphoria has a chance. Side note, for the north east side on 82nd street between Dean and Allisonville the Taiwan Tearoom is great. They have buba tea, and a dozen apps that are well crafted with first class ingredients. Let's keep this one going. Sun May 10 15:58:37 -0700 2009 4534118 157386 edelase 2 4741554 I'm new to the board, but actively interested in the Indy dining scene. We dined at Euphoria only once and were very disappointed. English pea soup that was gritty! A lovely skate wing paired w/ pasta marinara -- what was he thinking! Scholors Inn is fine for cocktails and appetizers - skip dinner. R Bistro continues to be strong and is locally owned. Oceanaire good food, large portions. Only been to Z's once with a group of ladies and most left disappointed. Will try again w/ husband and may have a different opinion. Terrible disappoint that Elements closed - keep hoping for a miracle to happen on that site. Thu Jun 04 06:41:51 -0700 2009 4671449 438365 winesnobs 3 4742150 Hello winesnobs! This sound familar? "The pea soup was not very much of a pea soup. I was thinking 'Spring menu, fresh peas - a bright, light and fresh tasting soup - yum!', and boy was I wrong. The soup was grainy and a pale green color with almost no pea flavor, but the real problem was the 'salmon pastrami' that was layered over the entire bowl of soup. The salmon did not go well with the soup, it was hard to eat (large strips of cured fish draped over a liquid) and frankly - it didn't taste good. Maybe if the salmon had been chopped and added as a small garnish it would have worked. " I think your pea soup is the same pea soup I had... ;-) I'll have to give them another chance! Thu Jun 04 09:32:56 -0700 2009 4741554 90565 Cookiefiend 4 4748103 I think in Indy the main issue seems to be LOCATION with certain places. Euphoria has a talented chef in an unbelievable space, yet the restaurant may suffer from inconsistency because of the location: a bit of a destination that many people won't be willing to head to during certain hours--mainly evening. The space is beautiful and it just needs downtown to grow up with residential density, especially around the canal. At the right time, however, this is a place where you may find the best deal. The bartender serves up some (from what i've had) of the best cocktails in town. Siam Square in Fountain Square is fairly new and has very decent and consistent, fresh Thai. Although it's in an isolated and industrial setting, I will say WORKINGMAN's FRIEND has the best cheeseburger and onion rings in INDY! I think the setting and short drive from downtown add to the experience, personally. But some people are just looking for THEMED AMBIENCE over FOOD QUALITY...so be it. Still enjoy Goose the Market and had some really good frites and mussels at Brugge---try the mussels with their sig. black beer, bacon, walnuts and cheddar. Chatham Tap for Fish & Chips and Ale! Sat Jun 06 09:25:43 -0700 2009 4742150 24358 napolean 1 4749535 May I ask what entices you about SI?? Does their cocktail menu look less pretentious than their 'food'? Never been but just from what I've heard from others in the past.......there is a reason they write WATERMELLON CROUTONS on the menu. What's that all about? Do you read this menu to be one that focuses on food? I read it to be ALL OVER THE PLACE and can't really decide what it wants to be. I agree with Cookiefriend: "Just go for the marked down drinks." It doesn't take a great chef to make crappy product sound good on a menu...and then hoping it's edible enough to eat or have somebody pay over 20 for an entree. It takes a great chef to keep things simple with great ingredients. What's up with these over-the-top menus: they're too big. Do you think Indianapolis restaurants have Thomas Keller staffs back there cooking the food?!? Z's Oyste Bar is in Castleton: ENOUGH SAID. Proves Indy has a long way before the public is educated enough to be critical about food quality. Sat Jun 06 22:58:17 -0700 2009 4534118 24358 napolean 2 4763234 Hmmmm. No replies. I must be writing to a bunch of SI followers...or restaurant owners in general. Interesting. Thu Jun 11 09:15:35 -0700 2009 4749535 24358 napolean 3 4764193 Nah, I think everyone basically universally agrees that SI's food and concept is weak (both in Bloomington and in Indy). In both places there are many other options for better food at a better price point. It is possible to do great food in Indianapolis, and even somewhat modern food, but SI has never really achieved this. Frankly I doubt they're long for this world. Just my take on things. Thu Jun 11 13:26:05 -0700 2009 4763234 285673 chetatkinsdiet 3 4764489 napolean - I thought you were writing to nsxtasy... so I didn't respond. Plus I had already said that I'd only go to SI for appetizers and drinks - I'd try a drink with a watermelon crouton ;-) I am curious about this though: "Z's Oyste Bar is in Castleton: ENOUGH SAID" I haven't been back since the first debacle, even our friends who were huge fans of the original in Louisville haven't been back. But I did think that perhaps they needed to work out any "just getting started here" blues, and that I may give them another chance - one bad experience isn't enough to turn me totally away (usually - there are exceptions) and nstasy enjoyed it - I respect her opinion. Z's is, however in an awful location. Nothing has succeeded there. chetakinsdiet - I think you're correct - even with the remodel they may not last long. It is possible to do great food in Indianapolis... I miss L'Explorateur. Thu Jun 11 14:50:11 -0700 2009 4763234 90565 Cookiefiend 4 4764559 A watermelon crouton is a cube of watermelon, perhaps heated, but I doubt it. Take a close look at SI's drink list, but in Indianapolis and in Bloomington- it's clearly just written up by the distributors to sell high margin product. That said, for all my criticisms about SI, and I've got plenty, I wish they'd focus on what they do really well- the Bakehouse. Really solid bread, which is saying a lot. Thu Jun 11 15:17:59 -0700 2009 4764489 285673 chetatkinsdiet 5 4764595 whoops! I hope the watermelon crouton in my imaginary drink isn't heated... that was a bit of a joke that evidently didn't fly - my apologies! Again though - the bread at The Bakehouse is great - you are correct! Thu Jun 11 15:32:35 -0700 2009 4764559 90565 Cookiefiend 5 4764612 I disagree about the bread. It used to be the best bread around (damning with faint praise, here), but that was when they baked it at night and sold it the next day. After that, it went on sale at half price. Now they sell days-old bread, dry and flavorless, as do all of the local supermarkets. I'm in Bloomington and the last two sandwiches I've had at the eastside location have been inedible, due to stale bread. And the challah roll that they serve their weird cinnamon-y "barbecue" on was hard as a brick when I had the misfortune to try it. God, Bloomington needs a great artisinal bakery. We could certainly support one. Thu Jun 11 15:39:25 -0700 2009 4764559 11995 pikawicca 6 4764640 It's no surprise that places like Tallent bake their own bread rather than outsource it. Thu Jun 11 15:49:12 -0700 2009 4764612 285673 chetatkinsdiet 6 4764656 Yah, SI bread is decent when fresh. But I totally agree with pikawicca about what one day does to that bread. Too chewy and bland. The watermelon croutons? It just dumbs down the system as a whole. It's saying, "You are going to pay a lot of money for this generic (ridiculous) creation and I don't care how it tastes." When this area gets an artisinal bakery---which will probably happen in Bloomington before Indy---then that's good sign for the dining scene in Indianapolis. I can't wait when it happens! Thu Jun 11 15:52:46 -0700 2009 4764612 24358 napolean 7 4764688 What about Rene's in Broad Ripple? He makes his bread... The last time I had bread at The Bakehouse (granted that was in December, the one on College), I had breakfast and I enjoyed it. Thu Jun 11 16:04:36 -0700 2009 4764656 90565 Cookiefiend 7 4765021 I'm wondering where it will be, I think Bloomington is probably ripe for a really solid bakery. There are a couple of places that could use a run for their money in Bloomington- bakehouse and big red liquors come to mind. Thu Jun 11 17:59:07 -0700 2009 4764656 285673 chetatkinsdiet 8 4765160 Sahara Mart is giving Big Red a serious run on the wine front. They have lots of interesting choices that BR doesn't carry, including a huge selection of organics. Thu Jun 11 18:49:11 -0700 2009 4765021 11995 pikawicca 9 4765203 We're getting pretty far off topic, but what the heck I led us there. Sahara Mart has a lot of off vintage wines- good wines, but not really great wines. Big Red really has that market cornered in Bloomington. I've yet to taste an organic wine really worth its salt- the problem is that you can't add sulfites and label the wine organic, even though sulfites are a naturally ocurring substance. You simply can't age wine without sulfites. Thu Jun 11 19:04:45 -0700 2009 4765160 285673 chetatkinsdiet 10 4765238 I'm not sure that the market for "really great wine" is huge in Bloomington. There is some demand, but most of us make do with good, drinkable wines most of the time. That said, I went to a potluck last month where a couple was responsible for bringing a wine to go with my lamb dish. The Margaux they brought was a superb match, and a shockingly generous contribution. Thu Jun 11 19:17:31 -0700 2009 4765203 11995 pikawicca 11 4765638 I think Bloomington certainly has that market, otherwise I don't think you'd see the volume that the reserve room both in a Kroger of all places and in Big Red. There's certainly a market for really good 30 dollar bottles. There's also a market for a staff who really knows wine and is customer service oriented. Thu Jun 11 23:53:17 -0700 2009 4765238 285673 chetatkinsdiet 12 4766103 Good bread, good wine.......we may as well talk about CHEESE while we're at it! Who has the best cheese selection in Indy and Bloomington? I wish Capriole Farms was featured in more stores (beyond the farmer's markets). That's an up-and-coming market, I believe. I love the variety GOOSE has...and the 'tour' is one of the best deals in the city (maybe THE BEST). Fri Jun 12 06:58:03 -0700 2009 4765638 24358 napolean 13 4766151 Frasier's in Fishers has a very nice selection of cheese. The Cheese Shop in the Fashion Mall has a decent selection - used to be much better. Euphoria has a very nice cheese plate/selection. I hope that's (cheese) a trend that sticks around. Fri Jun 12 07:10:08 -0700 2009 4766103 90565 Cookiefiend 13 4766594 Goose wins it for cheese for sure. In Bloomington it's Bloomingfoods, which ain't saying much. In bloomington it's usually a better idea to hit the farmer's markets to get your cheese, though living down here I tend to order my cheese online quite a bit. Fri Jun 12 09:08:19 -0700 2009 4766103 285673 chetatkinsdiet