602266 Mon Mar 09 06:50:27 -0700 2009 34 31 Home Cooking 0 4486670 I bought some rapid rise yeast to make what I call "Easter Bread" -- a rich, eggy, stollen recipe with ground almonds and candied fruit kneaded in. I love this yeast and think it makes a much better bread product than regular yeast, but I'm curious what other people think. Mon Mar 09 06:50:27 -0700 2009 245669 rememberme 1 4487130 I love instant yeast that you can even add with the dry ingredients (I don't). I buy it in one pound bags at William Sonoma and keep it in the freezer. Most of my bread recipes use long slow rises. The Almost No Knead uses just 1/4 tsp of yeast and an almost 24 hour rise. I have a hamburger bun recipe from Julia that involves about five rises and makes the finest crumb. Mon Mar 09 09:18:35 -0700 2009 4486670 142631 dutchdot 2 4487503 Just to be sure I'm tracking, you use the regular yeast for the slow rises? (Like the NYTimes Bittman bread or the Artisian Bread in 5 minutes a day? I am constantly getting mixed up about what yeast to use. Mon Mar 09 10:53:30 -0700 2009 4487130 123744 karykat 1 4487203 heh? so it DOES make a difference! Who knew? what does the recipes usually call for? and can i use one in lieu of another? Mon Mar 09 09:37:22 -0700 2009 4486670 133265 jeniyo 1 4487300 It does what it says which is rises the dough faster but I like a slower rise for taste/texture. I use either, depending on how much time I have. Instant/rapid rise is easier to use. Mon Mar 09 10:00:10 -0700 2009 4486670 39874 chowser 1 4487644 That's interesting that you like the regular yeast for slow rise and better texture. I think I get a better texture out of the rapid rise yeast, but you know, it's been so long since I've used regular yeast, that maybe it's just because I'm a better baker. Hmmm. Mon Mar 09 11:31:07 -0700 2009 4486670 245669 rememberme 2 4487989 Generally I use rapid rise if I'm making dough to be baked the day of (often with the type the bread you're making, w/ egg, milk, etc additions) but if I have time to plan ahead, I'll start the day before and then use regular yeast. Leaving it overnight develops the flavor better but you can also use rapid rise with it, just less of it. It's not the yeast as much as the length of the rise. Mon Mar 09 12:58:16 -0700 2009 4487644 39874 chowser 3 4491536 Hmmm. Good point. This is the only bread I have time to make these days, and it does rise and bake the same day. So if I decide to make the dough the day before, which I think is actually a brilliant suggestion, should I use regular yeast? And it should rise in the fridge to preclude awful discoveries on the floor in the morning? Tue Mar 10 12:06:29 -0700 2009 4487989 245669 rememberme 4 4491666 If I make it the day before and use instant yeast, I use about 1/4 tsp and let it rise for at least half an hour room temperature (longer is fine but obviously not too long so that it finishes rising) and then put it in the refrigerator for it to finish rising. You can then wake up, bring the dough to room temp and bake and have fresh rolls or whatever you want in the morning. For regular yeast, though, I usually proof it in warm liquid first but am thinking about what todao has said below. I'll have to give that a try. Tue Mar 10 12:32:38 -0700 2009 4491536 39874 chowser 1 4491595 I still don't understand all this specialized yeast bugaboo. I'm told I have to proof active dry yeast. I don't; I simply drop it in with all the other dry ingredients at room temperature and mix as usual. Never had a problem. The rapid/quick/instant etc. yeasts do work faster but if I wanted fast I' just run out to the store and buy a loaf of whatever it was I might want to eat or serve. I do find that using active dry yeast, because it requires a bit longer to get a good rise, improves the flavor somewhat. But beyond that factor I don't usually get too picky about yeast categories in my baking. If the results are a good texture and good flavor I'm pretty satisfied. Tue Mar 10 12:18:46 -0700 2009 4486670 203621 todao 2 4491728 This all started because I feel like I get a better texture with the rapid rise yeast than I do with the regular yeast, which seems counterintuitive. Tue Mar 10 12:45:21 -0700 2009 4491595 245669 rememberme 1 4491699 what is the difference between rapid and regular yeast in terms of the organism? Tue Mar 10 12:40:44 -0700 2009 4486670 220674 Cebca 2 4491751 i think the organism is the same. instant yeast is more porous and absorbs water faster so it gets down to business faster Tue Mar 10 12:50:45 -0700 2009 4491699 270283 silverhawk 3 4492033 So . . . how is that possible? How do they treat the yeast to make it more porous, but still alive? Tue Mar 10 14:03:11 -0700 2009 4491751 220674 Cebca 3 4493102 Sounds good but not really the reason. Instant yeast has a greater density of active yeast cells for the same weight measurement than active dry or fresh yeast. The key to natural yeast is to use the least amount possible to get the job done as the fermentation of yeast adds a flavor to the end product. Instant yeast is popular because you can use very small amounts and achieve the desired fermentation with less yeast. Tue Mar 10 20:11:04 -0700 2009 4491751 41679 Den 4 4494138 So then what is taking up the rest of the weight in regular yeast if it isn't active yeast cells? sorry to keep asking but I'm really trying to get to the bottom of this. Wed Mar 11 08:43:10 -0700 2009 4493102 220674 Cebca 5 4494187 I believe it is essentially moisture as instant and active dry yeasts are just dried yeast "cream". Wed Mar 11 08:58:05 -0700 2009 4494138 41679 Den 4 4495642 before dismissing the "water" answer check shirley corriher's book, <bake wise.> she's often right and i'd guess she's right here as well. Wed Mar 11 15:12:09 -0700 2009 4493102 270283 silverhawk 1 4492264 i'm interested to hear what people have to say about this. i've always picked up "whatever" cause i didn't know the difference. if only we have enough mouths in the house, i can bake two loafs and compare... =) are you guys referring to biga or "pre-ferment" that sits overnight for some rustic loafs? or just regular sandwich or rolls that rises in room temp then kept in the fridge on the 1st rise? second rise in room temp with forming.. i've always thought if i rest or rise the dough out too long - or if i went out and forgot, the dough would develop a off-yeasty smell. at this rate, who's making bread tonite? =) Tue Mar 10 15:11:26 -0700 2009 4486670 133265 jeniyo 2 4492384 If you're keeping the dough for a longer time, you can keep in the refrigerator so it doesn't rise too much. With the biga/sponge/etc. you leave it out of the refrigerator (but can also do it in for longer) . Essentially, the refrigerator just slows the rise and lets it develop flavor. If Father Kitchen were around, he could give the details. I'm making bread tonight--braided sandwich bread w/ salume and asiago cheese.:-) But, I didn't rise the dough overnight, just made it earlier today. Tue Mar 10 15:53:05 -0700 2009 4492264 39874 chowser 3 4493633 Pictures of the bread, please! It sounds right up my alley! Wed Mar 11 05:46:23 -0700 2009 4492384 12813 Katie Nell 4 4494034 Okay, but I'm a terrible photographer. I was careless at the bottom and the last braid came undone. Okay, it didn't work. Let me play with it more. Wed Mar 11 08:19:11 -0700 2009 4493633 39874 chowser 4 4494067 Ugh, try these instead. I think my files are too big to upload. Before baking: http://s32.photobucket.com/albums/d5/jeanwl/?action=view&current=IMGP0939.jpg after: http://s32.photobucket.com/albums/d5/jeanwl/?action=view&current=IMGP0943.jpg Wed Mar 11 08:26:22 -0700 2009 4493633 39874 chowser 5 4494639 I think it looks really good! Yum! Wed Mar 11 10:56:19 -0700 2009 4494067 12813 Katie Nell 6 4494957 ohh... can you share the recipe!? that looks like fun! Wed Mar 11 12:14:21 -0700 2009 4494639 133265 jeniyo 7 4495040 You can use your favorite dough. With that one, I used Best Recipe's sandwich bread, only using some white whole wheat and molasses for color/sugar. I can post if you want. Roll/stretch it out to a rectangle. Lay cold cuts in the center third. Cut diagonal snips (with scissors is easiest), same number on each side and just bring towards center. Brush milk, cream or egg on it and sprinkle your favorite spices (I used oregano w/ salume and asiago cheese). Bake at 350 for about 25-30 minutes until it reaches 190 degrees. I love it for picnics, skiing, etc. and it's dinner tonight since we don't get home until close to 9pm. What I love is that you can be creative with stuffing. Hard boiled eggs, tuna, some greens and drizzle w/ olive oil and vinegar for a nicoise twist. Oven dried tomatoes and mozzarella, some parmesan. Provolone and salami. Sometimes I plan ahead and sometimes I just use whatever is in the house but it always turns out well. Wed Mar 11 12:31:30 -0700 2009 4494957 39874 chowser 1 4492281 This is always an interesting topic. The thing that I've always been confused on is rapid rise vs. instant. The only kinds that I can find in the regular grocery store are active dry and rapid rise, but King Arthur says that instant is not the same as rapid rise (it seems like most of their recipes use instant). I ended up ordering something that specifically said "instant" yeast from KA, which is probably what they want, but I'm still confused! (I do like the stuff I ordered though!) Tue Mar 10 15:17:15 -0700 2009 4486670 12813 Katie Nell 2 4492388 This is interesting. I'd like to know about it, too. I've always treated instant, rapid rise and bread machine yeast as the same thing. Tue Mar 10 15:53:43 -0700 2009 4492281 39874 chowser 2 4782331 Without realizing it, I bought the "Fleischmann's RapidRise Highly Active Yeast". On the back it reads "How to Use RapidRise (Instant) Yeast in Traditional Recipes". There is no difference between Rapid Rise and Instant. Apparently with the instant you mix it in with the dry ingredients and then add your liquids. I've never used Rapid Rise before and plan to prepare it as I've always done in heated liquid (120-130F). I would feel more comfortable knowing the yeast is good before wasting ingredients and time. I assume I won't need to let it rise as long as if I had used regular yeast. Wed Jun 17 14:42:48 -0700 2009 4492281 275312 vera_ewashington 1 4492494 According to my Fleischmann's cookbook "rapid-rise is a highly active strain of yeast that makes bread doughs rise 50% faster than regular yeast. Its particle size is finer and for 50% faster rising, it should be added to dry ingredients before hydration (Quick mix method)" Does this help? I'm an instant guy, myself... adam Tue Mar 10 16:28:21 -0700 2009 4486670 154787 adamshoe 2 4492752 What I have is Fleischmann's "Rapid Rise Highly Active Yeast", which doesn't say anything about how to use it. This is what I've been using since it came out years ago. What I don't know is whether I'd get a different or just slower result with regular yeast. But my life is too crowded right now to do a test. Tue Mar 10 17:58:20 -0700 2009 4492494 245669 rememberme 3 4492834 Same results, but a slower rise time w/ traditional yeast. You can still do a fridge-rise w/ rapid yeast (or even freeze it...). Cold doesn't hurt yeast; heat does. adam Tue Mar 10 18:27:49 -0700 2009 4492752 154787 adamshoe 2 4494143 ah, that helps me! Wed Mar 11 08:44:55 -0700 2009 4492494 220674 Cebca 1 4782820 I usually find myself with active dry in the fridge and a recipe that calls for instant, or vice versa so this conversion chart has come in very handy. http://gaaarp.wordpress.com/2009/05/18/yeast-equivalents/ Wed Jun 17 17:43:07 -0700 2009 4486670 95577 yamalam 1 4782874 Instant and Rapid Rise yeasts are expensive, more expensive in my neighborhood than good old Active Dry Yeast. I buy ADY in two pound bags, freeze most of it in small baggies and reserve about half a pound or so in the refrigerator. I thaw out one small baggie at a time as I need it. It takes a little more ADY to get the same results as the Instant/Rapid variety (about 1 1/3 times ADY to a specified amount of the other stuff, but it is just as potent and there is no difference in flavor. ADY actually contributed to better overall flavor of the bread because it ferments more slowly than the o the stuff, allowing the flavor to develop in the bread as it rests. Quick rise = less overall flavor. Wed Jun 17 18:10:25 -0700 2009 4486670 203621 todao