585466 Mon Jan 05 21:17:07 -0800 2009 82 31 Home Cooking 0 4299567 I'm making chicken, sausage and shrimp gumbo for a dinner party. What kind of rice shall I use to go with it? I like basmati and jasmine, I sure want the rice to be good, any ideas? Mon Jan 05 21:17:07 -0800 2009 80198 knitterbetty 1 4299575 Texas basmati is best, though jasmine is ok. Just make sure it is white rice. Only white. Mon Jan 05 21:20:57 -0800 2009 4299567 10308 Tom P 1 4299580 Uncle Ben's...That's what I use for jambalaya. Mon Jan 05 21:23:28 -0800 2009 4299567 11977 ChiliDude 1 4299611 I have to agree with chilidude, Uncle Ben's or other converted rice is what they use in NO. You might like basmati or jasmine better, but to be authentic, it has to be UB's. Mon Jan 05 21:40:27 -0800 2009 4299567 25251 hankstramm 2 4299649 I third the motion. To be authentic, it has to be long-grain rice. But there's nothing wrong with experimentaton. You could take the usual jambalaya ingredients and make a very good stir-fry. Mon Jan 05 22:01:25 -0800 2009 4299611 55316 mpalmer6c 3 4441848 Basmati is long grain white rice. It would go just fine. Sun Feb 22 13:22:16 -0800 2009 4299649 87837 RGC1982 4 4483553 i'd never use basmati. it is far too delicate to stand up to the other ingredients, even if only in a strictly physical sense. Sat Mar 07 20:04:52 -0800 2009 4441848 105717 alkapal 2 4483586 I grew up there, and "they" in New Orleans do not use converted rice, as a rule. In fact, I did not use, and was never served converted rice in anyone's home in NO during the 30+ years I lived there. Paul Prudhomme, who did a lot to popularize New Orleans cooking, recommended converted rice for gumbo and other dishes, but that doesn't make it authentic. And it doesn't make converted rice taste good. It looks like rice, but it tastes like pretty much nothing at all. Any long grain rice is fine, including basmati. Jasmine rice is a bit too glutinous for jambalaya, but it will do fine in gumbo if you don't overcook it (you want the rice kernels to be fully cooked and firm but not mushy). Long grain rices are just more forgiving in that respect. Sat Mar 07 20:24:47 -0800 2009 4299611 53530 Zeldog 3 4483926 basmati you've tried? it is a fragile rice, not *just* a long-grain rice. it is too fragile to stand up to gumbo. it'd break down to mush. Sun Mar 08 03:52:46 -0700 2009 4483586 105717 alkapal 4 4485731 I'm not sure what you mean by stand up to gumbo. The rice is never cooked in the gumbo (at least it shouldn't be). You cook it separately to the texture you desire and add to the gumbo just before serving, or let your guests add it at the table, or serve it on the side. The only way it turns to mush is if you cook it to mush in the first place. I don't know if basmati is fragile, but it doesn't turn to mush when I eat it with curry, and it doesn't turn to mush when I eat it with gumbo. Sun Mar 08 19:07:34 -0700 2009 4483926 53530 Zeldog 5 4486087 you're right. zeldog. gumbo *over* rice. (i *was* thinking of jambalaya) to me, who eats and cooks a lot of basmati, basmati is just not the flavor i think of with gumbo. anyhow, gumbo is good even without rice (which takes up tummy space). Sun Mar 08 21:26:51 -0700 2009 4485731 105717 alkapal 6 5122796 And for the record, basmati works just fine in jambalaya, too (I speak from experience). Jambalaya requires no more vigorous cooking than a biryani! Thu Oct 22 10:39:56 -0700 2009 4486087 12023 Hungry Celeste 1 4299738 If it's authentic you want, go with plain, long grain rice, cooked fully but on the dry side (so the kernels fall apart when you touch them with a fork). Using the highly aromatic breeds is not a traditional choice, since they are not widely cultivated here, but I wouldn't be totally averse if that's what you've got in the cabinet... your gumbo will overwhelm all but the most fragrant cultivars. Short and medium grain varieties should be avoided, as they tend to go mushy after a few minutes in the bowl. For the love of all that is holy, leave the parboiled stuff on the shelf; it is an abomination. (De gustibus non est disputandum). Mon Jan 05 23:18:10 -0800 2009 4299567 19502 foodmuse 2 4300273 Thanks, everyone. I agree, I would NEVER buy parboiled rice! Now I have to figure out if the Japanese rice my daughter makes in her rice cooker is a long grain rice, I thought I'd ask her to make it but I'll make uncle ben's . I hope I can make it so it is on the dry side. Any hints? Shall I borrow her rice cooker to do Uncle Ben? Thanks! Tue Jan 06 07:52:15 -0800 2009 4299738 80198 knitterbetty 3 4300327 FWIW, the Japanese rice that I make in my rice cooker is most definitely short grain rice. The whole reason I like it is because it stays sorta moist. I have made long grain rice in the rice cooker and it's much drier. By the way, I would love to see how you make the gumbo. Do you have a recipe that you'd like to share? Tue Jan 06 08:07:17 -0800 2009 4300273 10205 valerie 4 4302846 I found the recipe at epicurious.dom when I typed in gumbo. First page there's a chicken, ( boneless cutup thighs)Sausage and shrimp recipe. Uses a roux but adds tomatoes. 28 raving reviews, I hope it works. Tue Jan 06 21:04:28 -0800 2009 4300327 80198 knitterbetty 4 4302877 sorry. typo. it's epicurious.com Tue Jan 06 21:17:01 -0800 2009 4300327 80198 knitterbetty 3 4300338 Why not parboiled rice? It is a very old tradition in Babladesh, and parts of India and Pakistan. Unhusked rice is parboiled, driving carp nutrients into the grain. The rice is redried and milled. It is more nutritious and has a nuttier flavor than the same long grained rice that is not parboiled. Parboiled does NOT have to be Uncle Ben's. Japanese rice is medium to short grained and slightly sticky. Tue Jan 06 08:10:04 -0800 2009 4300273 36661 Sam Fujisaka 4 4441914 Sam I've eaten a lot of rice but find parboiled has less flavor than plain white rice. Parboiled doesn't get sticky and is good in large rice dishes because it will stay nice with individual grains even if over cooked. Sun Feb 22 13:46:28 -0800 2009 4300338 89493 scubadoo97 3 4301741 Pour l'amour de Dieu, knitter, don't ruin your gumbo with Uncle Ben's. Long grain is fine, medium grain is better. Now if you REALLY want to aspire to wanna-be cajun status, put some potato salad in that gumbo bowl. Yes, potato salad, along with the rice. Tue Jan 06 14:29:02 -0800 2009 4300273 12023 Hungry Celeste 4 4302842 I'm so glad you mentioned potato salad, I've read about that. I'm confused. Do people put rice in the bowl and add the gumbo and THEN the salad? I can't imagine it. What's the sequence? Doesn't it taste odd? Try as I may, I just can conjure up the idea of all those three things together! Tue Jan 06 21:02:00 -0800 2009 4301741 80198 knitterbetty 5 4303356 Yes, we do. The trick is to not use too much rice in the first place, and then not let the potato salad get all mixed into the gumbo. Take your spoon, get a little bit of potato salad on the end, then fill the spoon with gumbo (including a bit of rice). Starchy? Maybe.... My mom also used to put whole (peeled) hard boiled eggs in the gumbo, sometimes. Wed Jan 07 06:14:09 -0800 2009 4302842 17648 rudeboy 6 4303481 Some folks like the potato salad plopped into the bowl in lieu of rice, others want the scoop of potato salad parked on the rim of the soup plate above the liquid. In whatever combination, potato salad is de rigeur as a side dish for gumbo, all over south Louisiana. Typically, it is a simple, slightly creamy potato salad, made with potatoes, chopped hardboiled eggs, mayo, and mustard. Various levels of crunchy stuff are included (pickle relish, chopped celery, chopped onions, parsley, green onions, crumbled cooked bacon, and so on). Almost always, the potato salad is made while the potatoes are still warm, resulting in a creamy, pasty salad. Wed Jan 07 07:01:19 -0800 2009 4303356 12023 Hungry Celeste 7 4303699 Ha! It's so funny to read this. Growing up in Opelousas (where we used medium-grain rice for the gumbo, btw), potato salad was always served on gumbo day in the school cafeteria, but you had to combine them on your own. In Baton Rouge (in more recent years), the school cafeteria still made gumbo from "scratch" (probably used the roux-in-a-jar, but otherwise...) but no one had ever heard of the potato salad mix. However, they did serve watermelon slices already pre-salted. Wed Jan 07 08:16:38 -0800 2009 4303481 201585 RosemaryHoney 8 4483557 >>"they did serve watermelon slices already pre-salted."<< ~~ nice touch! (i can't wait for summer watermelon!). Sat Mar 07 20:06:50 -0800 2009 4303699 105717 alkapal 5 4304016 The "potato salad in gumbo" thing is very strange to "outsiders" because you almost NEVER see it in restaurants. The problem is probably that the potato salad has to be fresh and still warm. The health department would have a hissy fit. It's not hot; it's not cold. Restaurants would be making it fresh all day long to serve it at just about room temperature or barely cooled off. If you dumped cold potato salad in your gumbo, it would cool it off too quickly. We always serve gumbo in soup "plates" with the potato salad in a serving bowl so people who want it can perch a scoop on the side - on the rim. Most of us eat it with both rice and potato salad. The other insider custom rarely seen in restaurants is serving beans (usually white beans) with jambalaya in some parts of the Bayous. If you don't offer the beans, you WILL get complaints. As rudeboy says, it may be "starchy" but most of Cajun food was "making do" with what you had. We weren't wealthy by a long stretch. Thank God we had great cooks who could make it taste wonderful and the traditions have endured. Wed Jan 07 09:33:10 -0800 2009 4302842 32444 MakingSense 6 4304062 FYI - I've got a work assignment in Lake Charles, and I've been to two restaurants that ask if you want the potato salad. Joy! About the rice, we grew up eating whatever. I "converted" to Uncle Ben's in my 20s when I moved away. No, I primarily use Texmati jasmine rice - I like the way the grains hold together ever so slightly while serving, then break apart in the gumbo. Their version isn't too "perfumey," but if it was, you'd never taste that behing my gumbo. Wed Jan 07 09:41:05 -0800 2009 4304016 17648 rudeboy 4 4441678 Oy vay! Sun Feb 22 12:21:12 -0800 2009 4301741 11977 ChiliDude 2 4301578 I usually have 7-8 different types of rice in my home: jasmine, basmati, arborio, carnaroli, bomba paella, long grain, wild rice (not really rice), and plain brown rice. Nonetheless, when I make New Orleans style cuisine, I use Uncle Ben or other converted rice, since that is what they use there. I'm not too pretentious to use ingredients that aren't exotic or processed when they are called for. 99% of people in NO buy their roux in a bottle, if I was there, I would too. If you want an authentic gumbo use UB. Like I said before, one might appreciate basmati in it and it might even be tastier, but if you want to do it like they do..... Tue Jan 06 13:45:23 -0800 2009 4299738 25251 hankstramm 3 4301736 There is absolutely NOTHING authentic about Uncle Ben's parboiled cardboard rice! Medium grain rules in Acadiana. Tue Jan 06 14:26:56 -0800 2009 4301578 12023 Hungry Celeste 3 4302860 Uncle Ben would have filed for bankruptcy long ago if he had been depending on the good cooks of Louisiana. Yeah, lazy ones and some restaurants might use that stuff but not the regulars. That stuff is awful. The most popular brands are Mahatma and Water-Maid and I can still hear the radio jingles in my ears after all these years. Or people just pick up bags of store brand rice. To most of us, a day without rice is a day without sunshine. In the city of New Orleans, long grain is king while medium grain is more common in Cajun country. NEVER the "perfumed" rices although we grow quite a number of them in Louisiana which even exports rice to Asia. And NO, we don't do NOT buy roux in a bottle. That is a niche product that few people purchase. Most groceries don't even carry it. Tue Jan 06 21:09:21 -0800 2009 4301578 32444 MakingSense 4 4303219 I beg to differ on the roux-in-a-jar. No less than seven different kinds of premade roux (diff brands, as well as varieties: light, dark, dry flour, powdered/instant, extra dark, "old-fashioned", etc.) are sold at my local Wal-Mart.....if they weren't selling steadily, Wallyworld would certainly drop the products. At the local Winn Dixie, four or five kinds are offered. I think that premade rouxs are pretty widely used across Acadiana, though certainly not the "rule". Wed Jan 07 04:36:41 -0800 2009 4302860 12023 Hungry Celeste 5 4303325 roux in a jar? Now I have heard it all. :-) What fun is making gumbo if you are not making a roux from scratch stirring it for 45 minutes to an hour to get it dark brown? Wed Jan 07 05:58:46 -0800 2009 4303219 26725 swsidejim 6 4303471 A long series of discussion & replies exists over at egullet on this very topic. Here's my position: beaucoup things in my native cuisine are roux-based, including lots of dishes I'd cook for an ordinary weeknight supper (such as petits pois or baby limas in a roux, routee des patates, crab stew, chicken fricassee, etc). The convenience of prepared roux means that traditional cooks can make their favorite dishes just a little faster: I'm talking about folks who aren't cooking for "fun" or as a special project, but cranking out family favorites for a hungry bunch every day of the week. Why wouldn't they use roux in a jar? An etouffee or gumbo isn't "special" to them, it is every day cooking....after 10,000 rouxs, it doesn't feel like culinary magic to some...just like work. Wed Jan 07 06:57:27 -0800 2009 4303325 12023 Hungry Celeste 7 4303513 interesting take. I never have thought of cooking as work, even when it was my job. :-) The dishes you mention are not special in my house, but weekly menu items. In the past month I have made pork and sausage jambalaya, shrimp creole, crawfish etouffe, and a gumbo. All on the weeekends when I have time to get the proper ingredients, and time to invest in the cooking process. I will always prefer something I make at home vs something in a jar. Especailly something as important in cajun/creole cooking as the roux. different strokes I guess. Wed Jan 07 07:17:07 -0800 2009 4303471 26725 swsidejim 7 4303572 Well, when you have a baby, get home at 5:30, and want something with a dark roux by 8, a jar is the way to go. Here in Austin, there's no decent ones available. I used to stock up on a particular brand that I got from Pt Arthur, but I can't remember the name. For that particular jar, I couldn't tell that much of a difference from my own prepared roux. Several of the brands are ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE, though! Wed Jan 07 07:34:47 -0800 2009 4303471 17648 rudeboy 8 4303605 gotcha' beat.. toddler at home(terrible 2's), leave the house @ 6:00 a.m., and dont get home until 6:00 p.m. on work nights :-) I go to the local cajun spot(a good ol' boy from Louisiana runs it, and makes weekly trips down to Louisiana for product) for dinner on those nights if I need a cajun fix. Otherwise its leftovers from the weekend. No way I'm cooking dinner until 8:00 p.m. on a work night. Wed Jan 07 07:44:46 -0800 2009 4303572 26725 swsidejim 8 5139318 I think it was called "Savoie." Wed Oct 28 21:14:06 -0700 2009 4303572 17648 rudeboy 5 4304068 That is SOOO funny, Celeste. Only in Louisiana would there be THAT many varieties of roux! The last few times I was in grocery stores in NOLA and on the North Shore, even in Sam's Club, there were a few pitiful small bottles of the stuff and we mocked their high prices. They wouldn't last me a week! I don't blame anybody for buying it. Some people have a hard time with roux and that phone always rings at just the wrong time! I guess I never paid much attention because I've been making my own Magic Roux Powder for so many years that I haven't given it a thought. I rarely begin a roux from scratch. Why bother? I toast up 5 pounds of flour at a time to a nice pecan color and finish it up in hot oil (of my choosing for whatever I'm making) in minutes. It even works to thicken stews and gumbos with a fraction of the fat. Nice for diet time. A low-fat roux? Wed Jan 07 09:43:19 -0800 2009 4303219 32444 MakingSense 2 5131041 I agree. I've spent a great deal of time there and my in-laws all use regular long grain rice. My MIL cooked it like pasta and drained it. It cannot be a mushy rice. My husband and I love jasmine rice and we use that with gumbo too. I've never used converted rice or seen it used by my people here or in NOLA - it's a big city, I'm sure lots of people use it there. Mon Oct 26 05:42:38 -0700 2009 4299738 253735 bayoucook 3 5131076 LSU has decided to get into the jasmine rice market and they have come up with something called Jazzman rice which, I am told, is grown around Lafayette (well, of course..where else?) I am partial to Doguet brand medium grain myself although you can't find it east of Lafayette(it is a Cajun family that went to Texas to grow the stuff). they also have a good bottled roux. Mon Oct 26 06:09:25 -0700 2009 5131041 107060 hazelhurst 4 5131104 I'll look into that. Every time we go to New Orleans we go to the local grocer - can't think of the name - Russo's? They have several of them around the city. I stock up there, and at Whole Foods. I do so wish we could get a Whole Foods or a Trader Joe's or some super-nice grocery here on the MS coast - maybe eventually.... Mon Oct 26 06:27:28 -0700 2009 5131076 253735 bayoucook 5 5132699 No, I think it starts with a "D". Where is my brain!? Mon Oct 26 15:03:56 -0700 2009 5131104 253735 bayoucook 1 4299796 Emirl's recommendation is "medium grain enriched rice" for true cajun authenticity. It's hard to find and there is a difference in taste over long grain, it's got a nuttier flavor and it's got a bit more crunch to it. I use "Cajun Country" produced by Falcon Rice Mill, Inc. in Crowley, Louisiana, 70526. Tue Jan 06 00:41:46 -0800 2009 4299567 215379 Grillncook 2 4301732 For once, I'm in complete agreement with Emeril. The hardcore cajun traditionalist's choice is medium-grain, cooked so that it will hold the shape of a scoop, yet still break apart into individual grains. Lazy restaurants (in and outside of Louisiana) use converted rice because it is easy. It is also terrible....the cardboard-y individual grains float apart in your gumbo, with no exterior starchiness to hold the "juice". And don't even get me started on using converted rice in jambalaya! Plain long-grain is fine, too, but you want to cook it slightly on the starchy side. You're not aiming for grain separation here. I grew up on Mahatma and Water-Maid, two widely distributed long and medium grain brands. If you can get your hands on LA-grown medium grain, it's a great choice. Tue Jan 06 14:25:38 -0800 2009 4299796 12023 Hungry Celeste 3 4302874 Oh my goodness, am I supposed to cook it so it's a bit sticky? I thought my goal was to have grain separation. Never having been to NO, I am completely gumbo ignorant. Help! What exactly do you mean about holding the shape of a scoop? Do you mean when you scoop it , it does't fall off the spoon? Thanks~ Tue Jan 06 21:15:44 -0800 2009 4301732 80198 knitterbetty 3 4337112 I cure & smoke my own tasso ham and make my own andouille; nevertheless, I use Paul Prudhome's Louisana Kitchen cookbook, and he recommends converted rice. Lazy, he might be, but I'm not the type to make changes to things that work well. I've noticed here where I live in SF, people will be against anything commercial. Hey, you might not like Uncle Ben's, but everything PP has recommended to me in his cookbooks works just fine. I'm just wondering, is that what he means when he says converted? Is there some ,"have to know the secret Acadian handshake" rice out there. BTW, I've had so many people praise my (PP's with my ham) jambalaya . Definitely better than anything I've tried on the West Coast --actually many have told me better than they had in NO as well. Sun Jan 18 14:31:48 -0800 2009 4301732 25251 hankstramm 4 4341140 Converted rice is parboiled; it cooks (for the second time, when you prepare it)into distinctive, separate grains. There's nothing "wrong" with it; it is very forgiving, almost impossible to overcook into mush, and resists breakage. On the other hand, to those of us raised on medium grain or soft-cooked long grain, it is hard & cardboardy. When used in a dish like jambalaya, the individual grains are separate & loose....not the preferred texture for many home cooks in Acadiana. Competition jambalaya cooks (the folks who cook outdoors in 5 to 45 gallon cast iron pots) & restaurants often use converted rice for jambayala: as I said earlier, it is more forgiving. As a broad generalization, jambalaya isn't really restaurant food....it's solid home cooking. It is quite hard to find a decent jambalaya in any NOLA restaurant! Tue Jan 20 06:56:20 -0800 2009 4337112 12023 Hungry Celeste 5 4341824 Thanks for the info--I'm actually going to reheat some of mine from Sunday for lunch. Tue Jan 20 11:25:19 -0800 2009 4341140 25251 hankstramm 4 4483609 Hankstramm, I think folks are praising your tasso and andouille. Sat Mar 07 20:38:51 -0800 2009 4337112 53530 Zeldog 3 5121243 I use medium grain rice but the stuff I use is Japanese (the brand is Kokuho Rose). And it works very well in Gumbos and Etouffes. Just don't use too much of it. Also, the hardcore cajuns will lash me for this, but I make my roux in the oven. (ducks to avoid rocks and other flying debris) It is next to impossible to mess up (provided you know your oven well and know the times required for each different type of roux for the amount you are cooking). It's the only way I can make a brick red roux without burning it (I'd have black bits if I tried to make a red in an iron skillet). The japanese rice is a little tacky but individual grains still separate when you serve and eat it. Wed Oct 21 17:53:55 -0700 2009 4301732 83050 Cremon 4 5121831 Why not Buy American? The US is a major rice grower and exporter. Japan is the US's largest market for both medium and short grain milled rice, predominantly from California. We grow high quality rice that is exported world wide, only limited because our production costs are higher than in our main competitor countries - Thailand, Vietnam, and China. Rice was one of the first crops grown in the Colonies, as early as the late 1600s in the Carolinas and Georgia. It was the basis of the early economy. Make your roux in the oven. No problem. Did you know that if you make a big batch that you can store it in a jar in the fridge and it keeps a very long time? Always ready when you are! Wed Oct 21 22:09:29 -0700 2009 5121243 32444 MakingSense 5 5123526 Kokuho Rose is grown in California. It is called Japanese medium grain rice because the Japonica breeds originated in Japan. And contrary to what you said, Not only is Japan NOT the largest market for US rice, it's not a market for rice at all. Japan does not import or (until very recently) export rice. All rice grown in Japan has been consumed there until very recently. And thank you for the tip on storing roux in the fridge. I was not aware you could do that! I worry that larger amounts will require more time in the oven though. But it's worth playing with. I guess as long as there's no water in the roux, it should be ok in the fridge right? Thu Oct 22 14:31:27 -0700 2009 5121831 83050 Cremon 6 5124454 Japan is a major market for US rice. #1 or #2 in 2003 and 2004. http://westernfarmpress.com/news/040610-rice-Cuba/ Top 10 US Rice export destinations. http://www.plantsciences.ucdavis.edu/ucceRice/STATS/2001_export_destinations.htm They started importing US rice in 1993, and by 2008, Japan was given permission by the WTO to re-export rice from the stockpiles of imported rice that they had accumulated when Vietnam, China, and Thailand stopped exporting due to poor harvests. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601080&sid=aaIwiqTBArLk Thu Oct 22 22:34:27 -0700 2009 5123526 32444 MakingSense 7 5126143 Anything they import from us either gets warehouse or re-exported. Their tariffs are so high, American rice would be five times the price of domestic rice. It is impossible to sell foreign rice to end consumers in Japan for that reason. When I was there 2 years ago, I could not find US rice anywhere and when I asked, I learned about the prefecture subsidy of local rice growers and the crippling tariffs any foreign exporters would have to pay. So those exports you show there are probably re-exported unless those are specialty rices like forbidden rice or American wild rice (grown and harvested by native americans). Because you cannot buy American grown white rice in Japan - I know - I've tried. And regarding Japanese exports - they warehouse over a million tons of rice there in case of a disaster. Recently they exported a lot of their stockpiles to the Phillippines when that country appealed to them after their own harvests were poor in 2008 (they shipped them 200,000 tons). It is possible IF they imported white rice from us - that it was in that stockpile and exported. But their people do not have the option to consume US grown rice. Fri Oct 23 14:42:30 -0700 2009 5124454 83050 Cremon 4 5122041 a korean-american friend uses kokuho rose to make sushi rolls. i thought it is a bit sticky for gumbo. i like a drier medium-grain for gumbo myself. making sense, do you have a brand to recommend, please? Thu Oct 22 04:19:28 -0700 2009 5121243 105717 alkapal 5 5123554 Kokohu Rose will be sticky if you use it for sushi because of the addition of sugar and vinegar. It's a medium grain rice so the kernels will stick together more than they would in a long grain. I love medium grain rice but if you prefer a drier rice, I would go with Carolina long grain (Mahatma brand rice is Carolina long grain - an Indica rice cultivar brought to the United States from Madagascar in 1694 and popular in the south ever since). It's drier and less sticky than medium grains and might be more to your liking, Alkapal. Thu Oct 22 14:43:18 -0700 2009 5122041 83050 Cremon 6 5124653 """Kokohu Rose will be sticky if you use it for sushi because of the addition of sugar and vinegar.""" ~~~~ cremon, since i don't know you but you are a fellow southerner, i'm gonna let that one slide...... let's just say, i know that some rices are inherently sticky. i think sam identified the chemical reason: low amylose. but i'll bet *EVERYONE* on chowhound (except sam, who probably wrote it) will learn from this article on rice: http://www.sagevfoods.com/MainPages/Rice101/Varieties.htm for example, about calrose (california medium grain rice variety) rice: "Medium grain rice is shorter and wider than long grain rice. The kernels are two to three times longer than its width. The amylose content of California medium grain rice is about 18 percent, and so the rice tends to be a little on the softer side and is sticky. The kernels cling together." Fri Oct 23 04:27:59 -0700 2009 5123554 105717 alkapal 7 5126154 Oh I agree with you that the medium grains will be stickier. But they are made stickier still by the process of making sushi rice. And yes, most medium grains have almost no Amylose. But long grain rices will be less sticky as I said. I don't know of any medium grain rices that aren't sticky at all. Bomba rice (used for paella) is LESS sticky than Kokuho Rose, Nishiki, or Botan but it is still stickier than any long grain rice. Fri Oct 23 14:48:42 -0700 2009 5124653 83050 Cremon 7 5131015 By the way - I used Kokuho Rose last night to make a risotto with some native American wild rice (the type harvested by native Americans in Minnesota) and it was fantastic. I know Arborio medium grain is preferred for this but supposedly arborio is a Japonica cultivar. Mon Oct 26 05:17:15 -0700 2009 5124653 83050 Cremon 5 5123626 We've used Kokuho Rose (along with Koda Brothers and even CalRose) for sushi since the 1950s. The stickiness of such Japonicas comes from the low amylose content. Thu Oct 22 15:12:32 -0700 2009 5122041 36661 Sam Fujisaka 6 5124662 sam, from something on another thread http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/618635#5124383 , could you tell me if some medium grain rices used in an american chinese restaurant can be "rougher" than other medium grain rice? is it less (or not at all) "polished"? Fri Oct 23 04:38:12 -0700 2009 5123626 105717 alkapal 7 5124678 chownut was just expressing the Chinese preference for separation of grains when cooked and served. All commercial polished rices are polished essentially to the same degree. Fri Oct 23 04:54:30 -0700 2009 5124662 36661 Sam Fujisaka 8 5124684 well, not being a rice expert, i just know that the rice in question (a hong kong, cantonese place) is different from the rice at a nearby szechuan place. it appears drier and spikier, somehow. i need to make some photos, and invent a rice-o-meter! Fri Oct 23 04:58:47 -0700 2009 5124678 105717 alkapal 2 4302858 I;m going to look for that. Maybe whole foods here in NJ. I was uneasy about their andouille sausage, it came from applegate farms, I wonder if some sausage vendors are better than others. Anyone know? I love the idea of a crunchy, nutty, rice,maybe it's not authentic NO but as long as it's yummy I shall be so happy. Ha!, maybe I should go with basmati if I can't find the medium grain. Decisions, Decisions! Tue Jan 06 21:09:08 -0800 2009 4299796 80198 knitterbetty 3 4303224 The quality of your smoked meat is a principal factor in the quality of your cajun cooking. I won't frown at your Applegate Farms stuff, as it is the essence of gumbo to use whatever you have on hand. But for a treat, you should get your hands on the real thing some time. Try mail-ordering from the Best Stop in Scott, LA or Wayne Jacobs in Laplace, LA Wed Jan 07 04:40:07 -0800 2009 4302858 12023 Hungry Celeste 3 4304161 You should be able to find medium grain rice. Most people never look for it. An acceptable alternative is brown rice, rather than the fragrant rices. Years ago, my father had me cook gumbo for him and some of his older relatives and just about time for them to arrive we realized we were out of white rice. All we had was brown. I thought he would have a fit but he told me to use it anyway. The brown rice was a big hit. Surprisingly, they all marveled that it was like the rice that they had grown up with in the country - in the 20s and 30s - before rice was as finely milled as it is today. Daddy came to prefer the brown rice in his gumbo and even liked it for dirty rice. I sometimes make jambalaya with it too. Just NO Uncle Ben's Celeste is right about that stuff tasting like cardboard. Wed Jan 07 09:58:39 -0800 2009 4302858 32444 MakingSense 1 4300292 I usually use long grain white enriched (Uncle Bens) but this past weekend I bought medium grain white enriched (store brand). They are certainly different, and I can't tell you which I like better. The Long Grain is "dryer" whereas the Medium Grain is stickier and held together in the middle of the bowl. Tue Jan 06 07:57:43 -0800 2009 4299567 253108 wineos 1 4300307 I use medium or long grain white rice. I wouldnt consider any other variety. Tue Jan 06 08:02:37 -0800 2009 4299567 26725 swsidejim 1 4301762 Not authentic, but as I was reaching for my usual bag of brown basmati rice at Trader Joe's, I noticed brown jasmine and decided to try it. I am very pleased - it doesn't clump and doesn't have as pronounced a "this is good for you, get over it" taste. Tue Jan 06 14:34:24 -0800 2009 4299567 159317 greygarious 1 4302194 I always use whatever happens to be on sale at the grocery store. I buy the biggest bag they sell, which usually is long or medium grain, and always enriched (I lost a major battle with DH over that one, I was trying to save a few bucks, and he said we can ALWAYS afford to eat healthy) anyway, sorry for the ramble, but any American grown rice should be perfect. :) I learned to make gumbo in Louisiana from a local, and she always bought the cheapest rice. Tue Jan 06 16:47:39 -0800 2009 4299567 120180 tzurriz 1 4303371 Louisiana popcorn rice is great. Wed Jan 07 06:18:47 -0800 2009 4299567 11259 Becca Porter 1 4304119 Mahatma long grain - free boiled like pasta and yes, you want it a bit overcooked to pull out the sarchiness which holds the liquor (liquids). Recently, I had made a rice dish for a sick neighbor and she later commented that she had never had such "moist" rice. In the past, she's always used Uncle Ben's. She's now a Mahatma convert. Off topic somewhat, Camillia beans (red and others) are the only bean that I've found which will produce a wonderful creamy liquor and bean texture. But I don't think they're sold in stores outside LA and southern MS and maybe SE TX?. I have my parents either ship them to me or bring several bags when they come to visit. There's an incredible difference between Camillia and what's available on local grocery store shelves. Wed Jan 07 09:51:28 -0800 2009 4299567 216999 CocoaNut 2 4442594 Am in total agreement about Camellia beans. They're heads and shoulders above other kidney beans if you're making red beans 'n' rice. I've been Googling online sources. Can't vouch for this place, but the prices seem reasonable: http://www.thecajunconnection.com/otherspices.html Sun Feb 22 18:23:10 -0800 2009 4304119 79862 SBrooksB 1 4341259 What a great thread. I've always used what I had in the house. Not brown though. I've tried brown in my "Healthy version" of jambalaya but with little success. It's not that easy to cook. I don't keep UB or Minute Rice in the house. Most often, it's Basmati DT Tue Jan 20 07:33:11 -0800 2009 4299567 11291 Davwud 2 4441698 Basmati, but whatever white rice, preferably just regular, not fast cooking or minute, but I have used all. I'm not a purist, just a realist and sometimes have to roll with what you have. Don't have time for anything else :) But to admire those. Sun Feb 22 12:25:48 -0800 2009 4341259 232829 kchurchill5 3 4441840 Gumbo, jambalaya and other foods from that part of the US are about using what's available. So to be pure to the recipe, you use the rice you have available. Like I can't get Matahari rice (or whatever long grained rice is most widely used there) up here so I use what I have. DT Sun Feb 22 13:16:45 -0800 2009 4441698 11291 Davwud 4 4442169 I totally agree, use what you have or that is available. I love basmati, but hey, I have used them all. Sun Feb 22 15:21:38 -0800 2009 4441840 232829 kchurchill5 1 5131040 the originan madagascar rice that was originally grown in the rice plantations of south carolina and environs might likely be the original rice for gumbo. it's now only grown on one plantation there but can be ordered. it's a fragrant rice similar to basmati. http://www.carolinaplantationrice.com/ Mon Oct 26 05:42:27 -0700 2009 4299567 1101903 lil magill 2 5131235 Traditional Malagasy rices - of which there are many - are not fragrant. The rices came with the people from what is now Indonesia. What is fun is that the languages in the Central Highlands have a lot of cognates with Bahasa Indonesia. Mon Oct 26 07:20:24 -0700 2009 5131040 36661 Sam Fujisaka 3 5131256 The rice plantations in south carolina grew rice from Madagascar -- Africa. The story goes that a ship came into port damaged from a hurricane and the captain paid for repairs by selling the cargo of rice. African slaves knew how to grow it by flooding the fields.... Now it's all grown in Arkansas, so I understand. The plantation rice I've had is very good! Mon Oct 26 07:27:52 -0700 2009 5131235 1101903 lil magill 4 5132371 It was relatively rare to ship unmilled rice (to then use for seed) as a main cargo. Such rice spoiled, rotted, and was eaten by weevils. Plus shipping weight and volume was so much greater than milled. seed was shipped in relatively small quantities and with considerable care. I think that the International Rice Research Institute (where i used to work) has done some molecular marker testing to determine some of the origins of Carolina rice. My ex colleafge (at both IRRI and here at the Internaitonal Center for tropical Agriculture) did a lot of tracing of the Carolina rices - a lot of speculation included. Mon Oct 26 13:03:49 -0700 2009 5131256 36661 Sam Fujisaka 2 5132461 Carolina Gold Rice is grown on several plantations, some of them organic. The rice is named in Slow Food's Ark of Taste as a Heritage Food. More information about the history of Carolina Gold: http://www.slowfoodusa.org/index.php/programs/ark_product_detail/carolina_gold_rice/ Great stuff, although pretty expensive. There are lots of other less expensive rices grown in the Carolinas, Louisiana, Texas, Arkansas, and Hawaii, although California probably grows the most by volume in the US. Mon Oct 26 13:33:28 -0700 2009 5131040 32444 MakingSense