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Sin and Redemption (McCaul St., Toronto)

Food Tourist Sep 13, 2008 08:23 AM

Stuck at home today due to a mysterious bout of food poisoning and making a wish list of where I would eat if I could...

Couldn't help but notice that the aptly-named Sin and Redemption gastropub has opened across from Redemptorist-run St. Patrick's Church. My young priest friends in the rectory are genuinely thrilled, though their older parishioners are a little perturbed. Seems like a great venue for a future Theology on Tap or after-Church indulgence!

Has anyone overindulged in their bistro offerings or 32 beers on tap? Any idea of price range for main courses?

  1. Food Tourist Oct 1, 2008 05:58 PM

    Although the beer list is pretty impressive, so far the food is a sin. Avoid the braised beef flatbread pizza and the frites. Eat dinner before you go!

    13 Replies
    1. re: Food Tourist
      pinstripeprincess Oct 1, 2008 07:12 PM

      i heard they have delirium available, but what else is impressive about the list? is most of it available on tap or by the bottle?

      1. re: pinstripeprincess
        l
        lister Oct 2, 2008 07:35 AM

        They do have Delirium available on tap. There are a couple of other good Belgian beers there too on tap. Everything else is in the mediocre range. The place is better than most sports bars, dives and frankly most bars in Toronto but isn't as good as the better beer places in town. The tap list is quite long.

        We had the meat, cheese, veggie and crackers platter. Meh.

        1. re: lister
          HarryLloyd Oct 2, 2008 11:26 AM

          lister,

          which "couple" of other ones were good? what were the "mediocre" ones?


          Chow!
          HL.

          1. re: HarryLloyd
            l
            lister Oct 2, 2008 01:14 PM

            http://sinandredemption.com/menu_beer...

            That's the list. Opinions are plenty on what are good, mediocre and bad beers...

            1. re: lister
              pinstripeprincess Oct 3, 2008 08:13 AM

              i'd actually consider that a pretty promising list on the belgian front. now the question is how much are they charging? i'm finding that many of the beer bars in toronto are just charging far too much and raising their prices regularly. why pay $30 for a rogue when i can get it in buffalo for like $8!

              1. re: pinstripeprincess
                HarryLloyd Oct 3, 2008 08:46 AM

                16oz domestics 5.50 (one for 4.50)
                16oz imports 6.50
                10oz-12oz premiums 4.50-5.50

                not bad if you ask me.


                Chow!
                HL.

                1. re: HarryLloyd
                  pinstripeprincess Oct 3, 2008 10:59 AM

                  sounds pretty damn reasonable. can't stand paying min $8-9 a pint at beerbistro anymore.

                  1. re: HarryLloyd
                    Food Tourist Oct 3, 2008 03:54 PM

                    And they were willing to pour me a half-pint, which was even cheaper.

                  2. re: pinstripeprincess
                    b
                    befuggled Oct 5, 2008 11:02 AM

                    The Belgians look decent. DT is a classic, and I have a soft spot in my heart for Leffe and Affligem. It's good that they have a kriek, although Belle-Vue wouldn't be my first choice. The Koningshoeven (the Dutch Trappist beer) is supposed to be good, although I've never had it. I'm not all that excited about a lot of the other beers, though.

                    If the food isn't good, though, I'm not going to be spending a lot of time there. My wife doesn't drink any more, and I've been cutting back.

                  3. re: lister
                    gregclow Oct 3, 2008 08:48 PM

                    The lack of even one Ontario microbrew on that list is disappointing. (No, I don't consider Brick to be a microbrewery.) As is the lack of even one Ontario VQA wine on their wine list.

                    1. re: gregclow
                      pinstripeprincess Oct 5, 2008 10:41 AM

                      true enough... after having difficulty not stumbling into a place that didn't serve a single delicious microbrew in philadelphia it's sad that they wouldn't promote local here considering they are also in a location where there isn't much good beer competition.

                      speaking of which... i don't know what is what, but no half pints in philly either! love that it's a no brainer here and they'll gladly let me get my small glasses in toronto bars.

                    2. re: lister
                      atomeyes Oct 5, 2008 03:36 PM

                      we're in Ontario. that's a very impressive import list.
                      not sure why they have Bud and Keith's on tap, but hey, i guess they need something to wash the tables with after people eat :)

                    3. re: HarryLloyd
                      Food Tourist Oct 2, 2008 06:59 PM

                      The night I was there they had a quadruple-fermented (10% alcohol) on tap. However, maybe because I was too exhausted to think, I ordered the Fuller's London Porter instead but didn't enjoy it.

                      Did I mention the "beer braised short rib flatbread" comes with horseradish on the side which does nothing to improve the taste?

              2. JonasBrand Oct 2, 2008 08:08 PM

                I don't know about the food... but this place is an eyesore!

                2 Replies
                1. re: JonasBrand
                  Food Tourist Oct 3, 2008 03:53 PM

                  Eyesore how?

                  It's brand new, very chi-chi, romantic atmosphere, and has very comfortable seating. Interesting/eclectic decor includes church collection baskets, pictures of nuns, and moose-themed overhead lighting.

                  1. re: JonasBrand
                    j
                    jayseeca Oct 5, 2008 03:49 PM

                    I would agree the place is pretty... ugly, and the food is just as bad. You know you're in trouble when the 'belgian frites' are comparable to Burger King, and the ketchup even tastes off.
                    The decor seems a little outdated, and not a fan of the painted stone signage and font.

                    Beer selection and prices are pretty good though.

                  2. c
                    cheeser Oct 3, 2008 04:49 PM

                    We went for a work lunch with about 16 people today. For these pub lunches we usually go to the Village Idiot because of proximity. We don't like the Idiot because it is usually overcrowded, the food is just regular, and the service is not super. We were looking forward to something different. Overall, the atmosphere was great. The decor was nice, and it felt very open, so good for conversation. The food was not superb but I would say that it was decent. I had the grilled salmon on a bagette with fries. The salmon was a little dry but the fries were good. For the cost, the portions were very adequate. The menu offerings were not hugely inventive, and I would expect more from a 'gastropub'. The 32 beers on tap were initially impressive. But many of them were just regular. I do like that they have a bit more variety with some Belgian beers at very decent prices. So as a neighborhood option, I'd say it was pretty good.

                    1 Reply
                    1. re: cheeser
                      m
                      Mila Oct 6, 2008 07:24 AM

                      FYI, the owner is the same as the Village Idiot. We dropped into both places on Friday night. I enjoyed the selection on tap at S & R but prefer the beaten up pub atmosphere of the Idiot. The staff at both locations were fantastic, knowledgeable and happy to provide tasters of anything on tap.

                    2. a
                      arugula Jan 31, 2009 02:14 PM

                      It's really cozy, but the service and food are really spotty. I had some delicious frites there, and I brought a few friends back to try them. It was hard to believe it was the same kitchen. The second time I had them the frites were were soggy and undercooked.

                      The waiters were almost comical. They would take one persons order at a time and charge away, ignoring the other diners in our party. One of them was so clumsy he whacked my friend in the head with a tray and didn't notice.

                      The beer list is small, but the waiters were knowledgeable and I ended up trying three different ones, all of which were delicious. There was a pear beer that ordered on a lark. Absolutely lovely. Too bad about the food, the service and the music. I like the room and the beer.

                      1. e
                        emmalee Dec 31, 2009 05:23 AM

                        Appalling service - from the owner. Beyond appalling.

                        I've been going to this place ever since it opened, on a relatively regular basis. Last night my friend and I were treated so despicably that I will never, ever return.

                        The person who approached us was the owner of the place (same owner as The Village Idiot Pub - which will also be subject to my boycott). He was incredibly rude and confrontational from the very start, and for no reason.

                        My friend and I sat ourselves at a table in the very back corner. A table that was pretty much an afterthought - mismatched chairs, just a plain wooden table different from all of the others and crammed in the corner with some extra chairs/benches. We sat ourselves because no one came to seat us - and in previous visits, I have sat myself in that pub.

                        TWO HOURS later, after having consumed a couple of beers and some food, the owner approaches us and tells us that we have to move. He says that we sat ourselves and we shouldn't have and we should be sitting at another table.

                        I told the owner that we had been sitting here for two hours, were served by many of his staff, and not one told us that we should not be sitting there. He then told us that he was not going to serve us further if we didn't move (again, providing no reason for us to move) - all the while with a very smug and jerky smile on his face. We had just ordered more food and beer before he approached, so I told him that we weren't going to pay for that. He told us then that he would call the police on us if we didn't pay and told us to leave.

                        Our wonderfully kind waitress sorted out our bill and we tipped her well.

                        Piece of advice to you, owner of Village Idiot and Sin and Redemption: never before in my many visits have I seen you in either place and those visits were quite enjoyable. Perhaps you should remain a "silent partner" and not try to micro-manage your establishments.

                        2 Replies
                        1. re: emmalee
                          p
                          paper_bag_princess Dec 31, 2009 08:26 AM

                          I work in the area and due to an utter lack of decent pubs and bars in the area we often end up at Sin and Redemption.

                          I have always found the service here to be beyond horrible. We often arrive in a group of 5 or 6 and although the place is usually fairly empty they act as if they are doing you a favour by seating you.

                          The aforementioned owner hovers around tables and I find him to be creepy and rude. We too have often been asked to move tables and have been told we can't sit in certain areas.

                          Not sure where the attitude is coming from, the place isn't that great and neither is the food.

                          1. re: paper_bag_princess
                            g
                            Gary Dec 31, 2009 10:02 AM

                            Haha, I was thinking that this sounded like the crap service I've received at the Village Idiot before, and was amused to find out it is the same owner. All makes sense now. So much attitude for so little justification. I'll spend my money at one of the other 9,234 pubs in Toronto.

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