SD restaurants gone downhill

[ginael]

I have been a big supporter of Vagabond since it opened, and it pains me to post this. For the past several months, my experience at this once-beloved restaurant has been disappointing. I've had to send back several plates due to soggy-this, not-enough-sauce-this, paltry servings of calamari, or way too bloody Filet Mignon (that was specifically ordered as Medium well). These experiences have been way too frequent. Again, I am sad to report this. It's always a pleasure to find a true gem; a consistent knock-out. When said gem goes downhill, it leaves one to wonder if this is happening to other once-trendy restaurants in the area.
Didn't one of the owners leave Vagabond for Bleu Boheme? Just wondering if anyone out there has similar experiences at a restaurant they had previously enjoyed and frequented.

[foodpeople101]

G: I must say that I appreciate your aforementioned question raised as I too have had this experience happen 1 too many times. I'll set the stage......I find a gem of a new restaurant in town with all of its accompanying accolades and attention to detail as expected to create a dinner to remember. (ahh, visions of my first meal at Vagabond are coming to mind). My second encounter is not but a few short weeks later to fulfill my insatiable craving for the same greatness. Unfortunately, this time around, the experience is just a hair less enjoyable. Maybe the bread was not as fresh, or maybe the fish was not quite as flaky. So, by my third, forth, fifth, and tenth visit I start to notice a seeming pattern.....THIS RESTAURANT IS SLOWLY GOING DOWNHILL! But, really...I keep wondering "Is it the restaurant that is slowly fading into commonality or is it that with each amazing meal I consume my frame of reference of perfection is slightly increased?"

[cstr]

You may be nearer to reality than you think. There are some places that consistently execute everything all the time, those are the places I really enjoy because of the attention to detail they display. I keep reminding myself to expect that level of service and quality of food and prep but, not get over zealous, a delicate balance. Usually if small items such as bread not being a fresh or not the same quality begin to surface, I watch for prices or quality to change. If it's a pricing issue, where the owner may have needed to adjust because of food costs, I'm OK with that. However, if quality begins to diminish, it's probably the beginning of the end.

[Alice Q]

Interesting - I have always thought Vagabond, and it's sister restaurant Bleu Boheme - to be average at best. (Philippe Beltran owns both of them.) Maybe try some of the new places that are opening up around town - or have even reportedly improved, such as the Pearl in Point Loma, Cowboy Star, Roseville, the Farmhouse Cafe, Heaven Sent desserts, Laurel or Kensington Grill?

[ginael]

My apologies for the gauche title, Salty's suggestion is much better than what I wrote. I've been to Vagabond for lunch and dinner around 10 times since New Year's Eve. My post was not intended to pit our town against others in regard to the culinary scene. I have read CH dialogue about decreased quality and service at highly-regarded restaurants. Some of these include Linkery, Alexander's, Laurel, and the list goes on. For the prices that we are shelling out, consistently poor service and food quality should not go unnoticed.

[Alice Q]

Are you implying that Linkery, Alexanders' and Laurel are dishing up consistently poor service and food quality? If so, I don't think that's quite fair. I've actually heard that Laurel has taken a turn for the better since Joe Manganelli - formerly of Chive - took over the kitchen. I have not tried it recently though. I've never heard anything very good about the food at Alexanders and have never eaten there, but it seems like they're doing pretty much what Old Venice does - serving mediocre food to people who go there because it's convenient or they like the atmosphere.

With respect to the Linkery, I have to disagree. I think their food has actually improved quite a bit over the years (though the prices have also gone up) and the new location is a huge plus. If anything it's better now than it's ever been.

[MrKrispy]

I agree with Alice about this. Unfairly perpetuating ideas that particular restaurants having gone downhill bothers me. If you base this on the occasional disgruntled poster and don't even mention if you have been there (repeatedly) seems wrong and almost mean. The obvious nod to the (arguably very unfair) recent Linkery thread is foremost in my mind.

[honkman]

But all of the restaurants you mention were not discussed because of recently decreased quality and service but different opinions about the restaurant itself often over several years. I didn't really see over the last few months an increase in number of posts about lower quality and service on CH. I feel it is even more the opposite and more people on CH see an increase in quality, for upscale and for ethnic restaurant, for SD over the last few years despite a more complicated overall economic situation

[ginael]

Chalk it up to differences in opinion and experiences. Makes the world go 'round!

[Ewilensky]

Alice,

Vagabond was never good, merely mediocre. But it was an incredibly convenient spot to walk to, or grab a light meal at the bar while taking a walk around the neighborhood. But those last few visits have led me to believe it is not even suited for that (I'm finding myself more content to grab a pint and a manchengo/chard grilled cheese sandwhich at Hamilton's).

The Farmhouse Cafe is an excellent suggestion and I just recently returned to KG and it has done a complete 180.

But to the OP -- If you've eaten at the same place 10 times in 6 months, perhaps it is time to try something new -- Searocket just opened up in the new Linkery spot, maybe give them a try.

[Alice Q]

I read about that grilled cheese sand. on Marie's blog (Diary of an Amateur Foodie) and really want to try it. Vagabond would be ok if they lived up to the promise of their decor and their prices - but they don't and neither does Bleu Boheme, imho. Just had a bite at the FH Cafe on Friday, and the flatbread was delicious. Too bad KG had to wait until we left the neighborhood to improve! :-)

[geekyfoodie]

It's a great accompaniment to a post-work drink. Hamilton's cafe is doing above-average pub food, so you should definitely check it out. We were pretty happy with our meal there.

http://culinarynerd.blogspot.com/2008...

Per your previous post, Heaven Sent Desserts is a prime example of an establishment that started strong, plummeted downhill (trust me, I went enough times in a short period to see it happen), then started slowly rebuilding. My recent visit was more than decent.

[ginael]

Ewilensky, I did not mean to imply that I have only eaten at Vagabond, that is silly. I make it a point to try a new restaurant every month. Have heard great things about Farmhouse, thanks for the suggestion.

[pickypicky]

I sympathise with you, G. I never had a good meal at Vagabond, but I know how you feel about losing a neighborhood bistro. I live in Clairemont-- and we would gladly DRIVE to any place that offered simple, well-prepared, consistent , reasonable food and a thoughtful wine list. But I think I read that bistros in Paris were shutting their doors,because they can't make ends meet. So maybe, the difference is that in some cities, restaurants close rather than serve poorly, and in others, restaurants cut corner after corner ( hiring less than experienced line cooks, who after all, are the blokes and chicks cooking your steak. They could give a damn how well done the order is.) Maybe a thread on Consistency might be nice. . . I don't expect dazzlement every time I eat out, but sometimes fewer surprises would be nice.

[Ewilensky]

I must say that my last 2 visits to Vagabond have been rather bad. Cold food, out of balance taste profiles (the calamari one night was pure sugar and sending it back came back as pure chili pepper). A plate of mussels with only 4 opened mussels and a server who insisted the closed ones were fine to eat. Bad service (granted my last visit the bartender was waiting tables and working the bar and he did try his best). We've put them on the "one my try"list. A shame. I can walk to Vagabond and have been a fan since they opened.

However this topic is not titled properly as it is a generally broad statement that I think is untrue.

Now is a very exciting time for San Diego restaurants and one only needs to read a few of these topics to see that.

[DiningDiva]

Picky, I have to take exception to the characterization that line cooks don't give a damn about how well an order is done. While that may be true in some cases, where's the expediter, the restaruant manager, the owner, or an excutive chef (if there is one). Line jockeys generally do what they're told or shown. If they aren't trained, or just given a short, rudimentary demonstration of what their job entails, and no direction as to the quality standards they are expected to achieve then what they produce isn't going to be very good. Line cooks are an indispensible part of any kitchen, but they generally shouldn't shoulder most of the blame for poor product, the bulk of the blame lies further up the food chain in a management that accepts and condones substandard performance.

Sorry, but I just think it's unfair to single out line cooks as the problem. The problems described by gineal reflect far more than line cooks. The chef/manager/owner all need to take a good hard look at the operation and figure out what they want it to be and focus on it.

[pickypicky]

I was misunderstood. I didn't mean that the line cook doesn't care. (Mon dieu! They're the people who feed me!) I meant that a line cook's feelings are not hurt if you order your steak well done. That was in response to the above post that considered ordering a steak less than rare an insult to the chef. A good line cook delivers, just as a good chef does. And yes, I do believe that when restaurants cut costs, they often cut the quality of who they hire.

[honkman]

So you have a few bad experiences with one restaurant and that is reason enough to open a new discussion with the title "SD restaurants gone downhill" ? I read somewhere that there are more than 8000 restaurants in San Diego. Don't you think you should base your judgement on a few more restaurants ? Or why don't you just revive the famous "SD restaurants are bad" topic.

[ginael]

If you re-read my post, you will find that over the past several months I have had poor experiences at this restaurant. I love SD dining options, therefore have no need to open a post for "SD restaurants are bad". If you don't agree with my findings, so be it. My question to everyone else is, have you also had the unfortunate experience of your once-cherished go-to restaurant decreasing in quality?

[honkman]

It's not if I agree with you or not but I don't understand why you use such a judgemental title instead of just writing "Vagabond gone downhill" -sounds pretty much what "The Sun" would do. And my reference to "SD restaurants are bad" was because on this board about two years ago we had the same discussion started from somebody who had a few bad experiences at a restaurant and he started a discussion with the judgemenal title "SD restaurants are bad". This was for weeks/months one of the most disputed/heated discussion I have ever seen on this board.

[ginael]

You are right, the title was not the best choice of words. Again, this is not based on a "few bad experiences". I think you are mistaking my issue with the disparate "SD restaurants are bad".

[SaltyRaisins]

I understand what you have experienced, ginael. It was a relief to have an above average bistro to patronize in a part of town that is otherwise a gastronomic Cherynobyl. From the dry and vapid sausages at the Linkery (certainly a restaurant whose namesake is "linked" to a particular item should be able to hit sausages "spot on," as they say) to the amateurish concoctions up at Alexander's (otherwise a pleasant enough place if you're into pleasureboat upholstery), the Vagabond presented a welcoming, if perhaps a bit stagey, alternative. Experiences like yours just should not happen. Ever. There is no excuse for an incorrectly cooked steak (culinary school 101 and certainly not rocket science), and I hope the waitstaff did not contradict your opinion. Humans are generally forgiving, and I would be happy to return to a place that fixed a mistake. It doesn't require disappointment in many restaurants for your misfortune to be very real- on the contrary, observing a place that has been consistent and a comfort take a nose dive is a real tragedy. Of the 8000 restaurants that "honkman" presents (although I'm guessing the number is arbitrary and likely much lower when you remove candy vendors and such), I'd put the number of good places in town around thirty. Not bad for a city, but certainly not in a proportion to the population. The Napa valley, for example, has this many places in the city limits of Napa itself.
Addendum: Perhaps the title of the thread is a bit sweeping. Maybe "Has Vagabond gone downhill?" would be better. An interesting discussion would be: what happens to a restaurant that has a management in transition. Or would this be further rehashing of a tired topic, honkman?

[honkman]

Don't you think thirty good places in SD is way too low ? I think there are many more in SD. Your example with Napa shows some of the problems - everybody associates good restaurants with Napa Valley but not with SD. I am pretty sure that if some of the good restaurants in Napa would be in SD they would get much less enthusiastic reviews just because most people associate SD with average restaurants.

[SaltyRaisins]

Of course my estimate is entirely subjective when you consider what factors churn in the mind and are filed into the "good" category, but on many visits to Napa all my expectations of the reality versus the hype were thwarted. Believe you me, I don't feel SD needs justification on the culinary front and would root for this town's particular delicacies. There's simply a higher percentage of good fine dining up there.

[royaljester]

I'll agree that Bay Area has some great standards, and it's a tough comparison because they're #2 in America after New York for food overall. So I'm not going to compare San Diego on a national level and say we're a food destination.

But San Diego does have some real gems when we're talking about our choices. My current favorites are Kaito sushi and Yumeya - and the former is one of the best sushi bars in the US bar none. And have you tried Tsuruhashi? Yakitori at that value cannot be found - I take my Bay Area friends there.

[Steve Green]

SaltyRaisins said: "From the dry and vapid sausages at the Linkery (certainly a restaurant whose namesake is "linked" to a particular item should be able to hit sausages "spot on," as they say)"

Means nothing. There's a place called "Chili Great Chili" in Pacific Grove that serves, hands down, the WORST chili I've ever had -- or as my GF put it, chili made by someone who had never seen real chili, let alone tasted it.

[Ed Dibble]

That's funny about Chili Great Chili - and very true. How does it stay in business?