Losing faith in cast iron cookware

[takadi]

I bought a ten inch and 12 inch cast iron pan and a bare cast iron dutch oven based on testimony of users who rave "you can't replace cast iron!" or "you can't get that nice cornbread crust anywhere else!" or "it's the most versatile cookware ever!". I'm starting to lose faith in those claims

I used to cook almost exclusively on non-stick cookware when I was inspired by Alton Brown to buy a cast iron pan to brown my steaks properly, something which was claimed never could be done properly on a non stick pan. So I figured, considering all the testimony about cast iron, if I can buy it for that purpose and replace all my other non stick cookware, it's worth adding to the collection. A year later I already encountered a number of problems.

First, claims that cast iron is nonstick hasn't been working for me. Eggs, fish, rice (risotto), etc all were ruined or had sticking problems. I have been seasoning my pan for a year with gallons of oil and fat and though the sticking problems aren't as severe as they used to be, in the end I still resort to my non stick pan

The limitations of what you can cook in cast iron is annoying. No acidic foods, no delicate soups or stews (in fear of getting off flavors from the seasoning), no pan sauces or just sauces in general. And yes I know, you get your extra iron from those stews, but if I wanted extra iron I would have taken a multivitamin pill. So far the only uses I found for my pan is frying and the occasional baking (which I found always burns the food or makes it stick, and which I already have a baking pan for). If cast iron was just a niche cookware that really only succeeds other cookware in frying, I wouldn't have bought it in the first place and would have just stuck to regular nonstick.

Cast iron is a pain to clean and even more of a pain to handle. Not only is every part of the pan hot during cooking (I can't count the times where I've burned myself, even with a pot holder), it's extremely heavy, which makes for a dangerous combination. I also can't use any detergent on it (soapy flavors might get into seasoning apparently) and I have to clean with salt, which gets very hot from the residual heat, so I always have to wait forever until it cools down. Then I have to lug the huge thing into the sink and rinse it out, and without soap it's harder to get bits out, not to mention it's so difficult to handle while cleaning. THEN I have to reseason and heat up the whole thing again. All this for just one pan.

Then there's the heat retention. Some claim this as the best part of cast iron but again I find it makes cast iron a niche cookware only really suitable for slow cooking or high heat applications. And again, I've found myself going back to nonstick anyways. The stew, soup, or braise ends up exactly the same in a regular nonstick pot, and I've found you get tastier results with steak if you brown them with butter on medium heat. So the point of having a cast iron pan has been totally thrown out the window.

Now it might be totally stupid to complain about cookware that costs barely 10-20 bucks but considering that I don't really need cast iron as much I thought I did, it's just clutter now, really heavy clutter, and that's a shame, especially since I hear so much hype about it. In the end it seems like the limitations I encountered with cast iron seemed to outweigh any limitations I had with nonstick pans (not to mention that there are studies out there that now show seasoning is more toxic than teflon).

As a final note, copper cookware of the same thickness and weight has not only similar heat capacity as cast iron, but has vastly superior conduction, making it everything cast iron can do and more, not to mention having a non-reactive surface when lined with tin or stainless steel.

As a beginner food enthusiast who was looking to explore the wonders of different cookware, replace his nonstick cookware and have the ultimate minimalist kitchen, I ended up having more junk that I don't have anywhere to store. I feel like I failed somehow. Is there a way for me to gain back my faith in this humble ancient cookware?

[grant.cook]

If you are a beginner food enthusiast, I am surprised you are talking about buying copper... thats takes a LOT of cabbage to buy, and isn't markedly better than a nice tri-ply aluminum-core stainless pan.

I also am surprised you bought a cast iron dutch oven. I've never really heard people clamor for that pot - I use one, in limited circumstances: in the woods, camping, when I am cooking with coals. You can find a reasonably priced enameled dutch oven at places like Target or Kohls - you don't have to drop Le Creuset dollars, and you still get a decent piece of cookware.

I also have read a lot of cookware literature, and for things like eggs, most seem to recommend having a handy non-stick skillet. There are purists you probably have nice seasoned cast-iron skillet that's perfectly non-stick, but I appreciate the simplicity of a non-stick skillet for a fried egg, and when I am doing skillet potatoes, I like having them stick a bit to get some flavor.

It is a bit of a niche pan, but I've found success with it - first, its hard to beat when it comes to searing.. in fact, I've never found its equal in terms of being able to totally dump massive amounts of heat energy into a steak or piece of tuna. I've also used it to make a tarte tatin and had things come out well - the conductivity means I get fewer hot spots.

Be careful in your terminology - you speak about cast iron and non-stick. I'd never brown something in a non-stick pan - I'd use stainless, where I can get more flavor and have the fond left over for a sauce. Why did you jump straight from non-stick to cast iron, ignoring stainless?

[takadi]

I got the impression that cast iron was superior to stainless because it heated up evenly and naturally acquired a nonstick coating. Plus it was cheaper than those all clad pans.

I still use my cast iron to brown meats, but that's pretty much it. I rarely do it because it makes too much smoke in the house. I find non stick makes a decent crust though if you keep it on the pan for long enough and use butter

As for buying a bare cast iron dutch oven, I really don't know what I was thinking. Perhaps I thought it had better browning properties, or perhaps I thought enamel was too fragile or couldn't handle hotter temperatures, perhaps I was being pretentiously nonconformist and took the idea of "minimalism" too far. Considering though that the dutch oven I bought was 30 bucks compared to the 200 dollars of a Le Creuset, I just went ahead and bought it. That was before I realized that you couldn't cook acidic foods in it and there were cheaper enameled dutch ovens out there.

I've actually been looking on ebay for some copper pans, and though I've always been won out by others, the pans I bid for always end up getting sold for less than 100 dollars. I don't think I would have enough money to pay full price for one though. In the end, I just want a nice thick stainless steel line saucier type pan, so maybe I'm getting carried away with copper. But it is the ideal pan I would want someday, so I'm not exactly interested in having it right away.

[grant.cook]

As a beginner, don't go crazy with pots.. you can find a nice stainless set for not a lot of money. Sure, All-Clad is great, but so are BMW's.. I drive a Ford that gets me around just fine.

I'd recommend the best first thing you can buy is a good knife, and get by with okay pots/pans. A cast iron skillet - a 12" like you bought - it is useful thing to have in a kitchen, but it serves a role (in the same way my 12" non-stick skillet does) - the centerpieces are my stainless pans and my dutch oven (I do a lot of braising). You can brown a steak in non-stick - just like a nice grilled cheese sandwich - but you don't get the "sticky" stuff - the fond, and I don't think the sear is as good. You also don't want to get non-stick stuff up to high heat - I think the teflon starts to degrade. The fond is what goes into making sauces. Sometimes "sticking" is good..

[takadi]

Yea, I've been trying to explore pan sauces, which require that sticking to form fond. It works okay in cast iron, but I find it kind of difficult to control the heat and some of the lighter sauces tend to discolor and acquire weird flavors (especially if I cooked something pungent in the pan before).

What's a good set of thick stainless steel pans I can buy that isn't so expensive like all clad?

[maxim0512]

The Farberware Classic and Millenium series are both decent sets of stainless steel cookware that aren't too expensive, especially if you find them at an outlet store.

[keith2000]

If you are not looking for a specific set and want to build your collection a pan at a time I always recomend stores like TJ Maxx. They have good quality cookware at steeply reduced prices. I agree that heavy bottomed aluminum or copper core stainless pots are extremely versitile. These are my go to pots and pans for cooking at home.

[krbtv]

Tramontina "fully clad" from Walmart.

[kchurchill5]

Well far from a beginner, but I don't waste much money on pots or pans. I am definitely against most but truly believe cooking is not the equipment but the cook. I use my big cash iron for hash, stews, my big pot for braising, ribs, oso busco coq au vin, I don't use it for eggs unless I just made bacon, I use my cast iron for fried chicken and thick cuts of meats. London broil, pork loins or tenderloin or steaks I finish in the oven.

My non sticks, inexpensive, walmart or target for the most part and they are fine for me.

Now I do have some very nice pieces, I didn't buy them gifts and I do use them but ... not because they cook any better for me.

But others will oppose that which is fine. I respect everyone opinions, I just don't and won't spend that much money on cookware. I have limited space and money so I use what I have and they work just fine. All Clad, I have one, never again. My one from target in 8 yrs and counting and still works amazing. I got some of mine from restaurant suppliers too. Also Walmart recently had a great deal on internet pieces for Lodge cast iron and 1/2 the price compared to amazon with free shipping.

Farberware, have a couple of those too, just fine.

And FYI, I don't use my cast iron for delicate fish, mine even though it is over 40 years old (my grandmothers) it sticks. I prefer my stainless or my non stick depending on what type of fish and what I am doing with it.

It is a hard choice, but best is what works well for you. Look at what you cook most and buy the pan regardless of ... this is best or don't by this ... Get a medium priced, descent pan than will work best with what you cook most often.

I roast whole chickens all the time in my 12" cast iron. I season it well, stuff some veggies and fruit lemons onions etc in the cavity and sit in on a bed of whole carrots and whole pieces of celery as a bed. Easy and cheap. It cooks great and no special pot or pan. Add a little broth and herbs at the end and perfect gravy. I cooked tons of semi boiled and smashed reds in the same cast iron, all in the oven in 30 minutes. Great simple no mixing and easy. There are lots of uses believe me.

[krbtv]

What item of All-Clad do you have? Why don't you use it anymore?

[kchurchill5]

I think it is a 3 quart stainless, I have another 6 quart enameled. Just hard to clean for me. Rather use my cheap stainless which cleans easier, NOT sure why and my cast iron for my big pot. I have 1 small Ermeril All Clad, not pad, just a small saute and 2 calphalons, Definitely wore down and now happy with the finish. But again these were gifts so I can't complain.

My large pot I don't mind but I do enjoy the cast iron better. If I had a choice, but I have both.

[mpalmer6c]

Perhaps your kitchen techniques need refining.

Burned food is not the fault of the pan, but the cook.

I never clean a pan while it is still very hot

I’ve never had fish stick to a cast iron or carbon steel pan. I use low to medium heat and the rule of 10 minutes cooking per inch thickness.

I’ve never had to reaseason a pan.

If you get burned using a pan holder, then get the glove type.

I haven’t the faintest idea how you decided that a seasoned pan will poison you. It’s not true.

If the weight bothers you, note that copper is also very heavy.

And if you like non-stick best, why not just use that?

.

[krbtv]

People have cooked acidic foods in cast iron for years! Yes you can cook acidic foods in bare cast iron. But it might pick up some of the iron flavor in your dish.

[blondelle]

The price of enameled cast iron has come down so much, that I don't understand why people still cling to their raw cast iron with it's many disadvantages. It's great for searing steaks and blackening recipes, but the enameled iron is just so much easier, cleaner, and neater. Look at the Lodge Colors line on Amazon. You can get a 3 qt. oven in a gorgeous shaded blue for $27.99, and the 3 qt, cover two handled 12" frypan type pot in matching blue for $34.99 with free shipping. They also have an enameled 12" skillet in the brown only for $24.49. That will take higher heat with no worries with acidic foods.

One the ladies mags tested it against Le Creuset and they thought it was just as good. The enamel is great quality, and you have a solid company like Lodge to stand behind it. They have rigid standards for their iron and have someone at their factory is China to make sure it's made right! Put your iron oven on Ebay or give it away to someone who's a die hard user. You will be a lot happier ;-).

[Procrastibaker]

I actually find the enamel really finicky-- it cracks easily if want to saute over high heat (Le Creuset-- had to send it back), plus it discolors.

[JoanN]

I also have 10” and 12” cast iron skillets and use them more than any other pans I own. I don’t think too many people claim that cast iron is nonstick in the same way that a nonstick pan is. Once it’s well seasoned, it sticks very little. But that’s different from nonstick, and I do keep one truly nonstick pan around for eggs and omelets, but not much else.

Once the cast iron is well seasoned (and perhaps, even though you’ve had them for a while, you’ve tried to cook too many sticky things in them too soon), you can forget the “no acidic foods” rule. Just last night I made a shellfish stew with roasted tomatoes and wine in my 12-incher and it most definitely did not have any “off” flavors. And I always make pan sauces in the skillet when I make a steak or chops. Pour in some wine, scrape up the fond, and reduce. Never any kind of problem or change in flavors.

Again, once seasoned, I find it a snap to clean. And since I’m not usually doing dishes until after dinner, the pan has already cooled by the time I get around to washing it. If it’s gunky I’ll use detergent, but often I don’t. I rarely need to use more than a scrubbie to get any remaining food bits off. And putting the pan back on the burner while I’m finishing up cleaning the rest of the kitchen has just become second nature to me. I pour in a tiny bit of (usually) peanut oil, wipe it around with a paper towel, let it sit another minute or so, and turn off the heat. I then let it sit on the stove overnight just so I don’t have to deal with it while it’s still hot.

As for hot, I have a silicone handle cover I switch back and forth between the two skillets. It stays there while in use, it’s easy to grip, and it doesn’t slip if I’m moving the pan from stovetop to oven, for instance.

And as for weight, I’m no spring chicken and am just beginning to get a touch of arthritis in my hands. I can pick it up to pour things out of it, get it into and out of lower cupboards, and easily move it from stovetop to either an upper or lower oven. Yes, it’s heavy, but it’s not that heavy. And weight evidently isn’t a major issue for you anyway if you’re considering other materials of equal weight.

If you like the results of a steak cooked in butter over medium heat, that’s fine. But short of an outdoor grill, I find I get superior results using the sear in cast iron/finish in a hot oven method and can’t imagine making steak any other way.

If you really don’t like cast iron, I’m sure you can find plenty of people who’d be happy to take it off your hands. I suspect, though, that you (1) didn’t season it thoroughly, (2) tried to cook the wrongs things in it (eggs and risotto are two good examples for which nonstick and clad stainless respectively would be preferable) before it was properly seasoned, and (3) are making more of a megillah out of cleaning it than should be necessary.

[takadi]

So are you saying that once cast iron has gotten to the point of being very well seasoned, it basically is on the same level of an enameled pan? If that's true, I'm thinking the majority of my problems is that my pans aren't seasoned enough, but I've had them for over a year. Maybe they need to age a little longer.

The weight isn't much of an issue unless the pan is hot, then it's a disaster waiting to happen. I find it especially hard when trying to pour liquids out from the already hot pot or skillet

[JoanN]

I don't have any enameled cast iron skillets, but I do have three (or is it four?) enameled cast iron dutch ovens. I'd say my seasoned cast iron is indeed at a similar level of nonstickness; maybe a teeny bit less, but then, maybe not.

It really shouldn't take a year to get your pans well seasoned. I needed to buy a new iron wok not too long ago and that didn't take much more than a month or two of no more than once-a-week cooking in it to get it pretty much where I wanted it. Try the old standby--bacon. Or make a batch of fried chicken. Or fried anything, for that matter. That should get them up to snuff in no time.

And as for pouring, I do strongly recommend one of the silicone handle covers. Just make sure you get one that fits your skillet. Some cast iron pans have wider handles than a saucepan and the skinny handle covers that are easiest to find won't fit. As I said, the handle cover gives me a good grip. I may sometimes hold the side of the pan with a regular potholder while pouring, but usually I just grip the handle with two hands and it works just fine. I do burn myself like crazy all the time, but on oven racks, not on my cast iron skillets.

[takadi]

Are the handle covers oven safe, or do you have to take them off?

I think the problem I might have with my pan is that I tend to heat it up to very very high heat when I sear my steaks, which might ruin the seasoning.

[JoanN]

They are oven safe, but if you put them in the oven, they get hot--not as hot as the handle of the skillet, but hot. The one I have (made by Le Creuset and purchased at Zabar's) is very easy to slip on and off, so I remove it before putting the pan in the oven and slip it back on to remove the pan.

[pabboy]

Never had problems preheating my cast iron on 17,000 BTUs for 10 minutes to sear a steak.

Never had problem cleaning either. I always deglaze regardless if I'm making a sauce or not. Dump out the liqui, wipe it down with some oil and use the remaining heat in the pan for seasoning.

[krbtv]

Try using Pampered chef mittens. The older beige ones work really well.

[hilltowner]

I'm with you JoanN. I have two cast iron fry pans,(12" and 10"), and two dutch ovens. One is just a wee thing, but as it turns out is perfect for just one person. I use my cast iron for almost everything I cook. The only thing I don't use cast iron for is anything that requires a saucepan or stock pot. I make pizzas in my larger fry pan in lieu of a stone. I reheat food in my smaller fry pan. I use the small dutch oven for frying. I also use the small dutch oven for braising or stewing. (I cook for one, so the size is perfect for me.) My fry pans have a permanent home on top of my stove. They are not perfectly non-stick, but I have never had a problem getting food off. Granted, I have had these pans for many years now, and there WAS the initial fussiness in seasoning, but I don't remember any huge problems. I love my cast iron. Also, I never clean it with salt. Just a good rub down in hot water, wipe, then back on the stove.

[Passadumkeg]

JoanN, with you too. All our frying pans are cast iron. What is funny is that they never stick for me, but our 23 year old hates them and foods stick for him and I can't tell him why. He doesn't like me to watch him cook. Boy, that says a lot.

[SDMike]

It's funny. Cast iron is actually how I found Chow.com. I had just bought my first cast iron skillet and was searching the web for the best seasoning method. I came upon this massive thread here on Chow. It just went on and on, and these people talked with real authority. If you search you can probably find it. Real experts in that conversation, and probably you'll see some of the people in this thread there.

Anyway, I took a lot of info from that thread and my experience with my skillet has been great. I rarely use my other pans now. I cook only for me and my 14 yr old daughter now and I'd say the cast iron gets used about 70% of the time. I always wanted a pan to go from stove top to oven and I just love it. Mine sits either on top my stove (which is why maybe I use it so much- its right in front of me) or inside my oven. I do the hot water and paper towel cleaning thing and have never tasted anything irony.

I want to thank the cast iron heads on Chow for there seasoning advice because maybe that's why my experience has been so great. Keep trying, it's really changed my perspective.

[takadi]

I guess as a beginner cook I'm having a difficult time because my experience with cast iron is that it's limited in it's uses and is mainly a niche type of cookware as opposed to an all purpose cookware. The funny thing is that most encounters with "cast iron heads" tell me that it should be the opposite and that cast iron is the most versatile cookware on the planet.

Maybe cast iron requires a little more heart and determination in order to appreciate it's true qualities. Perhaps I'm getting lured into the world of anodized aluminum and copper core and losing my soul

[SDMike]

LOL...hey, I'm a beginner too. I don't know, perhaps I got lucky, but I really think it was that original seasoning, which I got from that huge thread.

I'm sorry, as I'm no expert I can't really give you advice, except to relay my own experience. I remember the first time I cook pork chops from searing stove top to oven. My goodness, the moistness! I couldn't believe I was eating those dry things all these years.

Anyway, the one thing I've kinda learned is that you really don't have to use real high heat, just let the pan get real hot (and it will on med heat) then sear. You can adjust the heat up or down after you hear the sizzle factor. Good luck.

[SDMike]

I actually tried the cornbread thing too and that worked out great. I love cornbread and this was the best I've made by far. It's kind of amazing in that the tools used can make a difference. Who would have thunk.

[foo1024]

I use an 8" cast iron pan for a 2-egg omelette several times a week. The pan came pre-seasoned from Lodge and initially I did have some sticking problems, but not too bad. Recentlyt, while grilling a steaks on my outdoor gas grill I experimented with pan-searing because I had heard that it was superior even to grilling. I put my cast-iron pan on inside the grill, let it preheat, and cooked one of the steaks on it. Ever since then it has been much more non-stick, with eggs sliding right out of the pan onto the plate. With some bacon fat or butter it is now just as non-stick as a non-stick pan for eggs.

[mpalmer6c]

The main raves I've seen are for searing of steaks, blackened fish, etc. But I now use French-made carbon steel pans for that, since they're easier to handle. I have one non-stick pan for eggs, crepes and the like.

[waveguide33]

One problem that you might be having is the tendancy to move things around alot. If you want to sear or brown something, leave it alone. Things tend to un-stick themselves once the sear is made. Then you can usually move it easily. I also find that putting the oil into the pan after it's hot also helps.

The nice thing cast iron is that you can also use a metal spatula to scrape the bits off the bottom without fear of scratching the non-stick coating.

Occasionally I forget that I turned on the flame and aside from a bit of smoke, the dried cooking surface seems to be an improved 'non-stick' surface.

[ThreeGigs]

Searing 'properly' means applying intense heat long enough to char the outside of food, and *not* let the food get hot enough to cook to a depth of more than 2 millimeters. That's difficult to do because as soon as the food touches the pan, it draws the heat out, lowering the temperature of the pan below the point suitable for searing. I think you're misunderstanding what 'heat capacity' means. Heat capacity means it takes a cast iron pan longer to heat up than a copper or aluminum pan. It also means it takes longer to cool down. Much longer. Bacon on cast iron will continue to sizzle long after you turn the heat off. That means when you toss a steak onto a 500 degree cast iron skillet, the skillet will only cool down to about 350 when the steak is seared properly. Aluminum or copper will cool down to 250-300 in moments, and your steak still won't be seared enough, so you wind up keeping it in the pan longer, and overcooking the outside instead of searing it.

Cast iron isn't really suited for slow cooking *except* when you want to maintain a stable temperature environment for the food. It's good in electric ovens where the air temp can vary from 325 to 375 because the thermostat 'lags' behind the actual air temp.

For high heat, seasoned cast iron is the most non-stick surface you can have. If you're claiming you can use a Teflon pan for high heat work, you haven't been using high heat. By definition, it isn't high heat unless it'd ruin teflon and come very close to melting a tin lining.

Don't clean your cast iron right after cooking, like your post seems to imply you do. Go eat your food instead while it cools down. Then just add hot water and let it soak a few minutes if needed, before scrubbing with a plain old green scrubbie and no soap. In my opinion, the whole scrubbing with kosher salt thing is WAY overblown. Green scrubbies work great on cast iron, as they're tough on food and don't hurt the built-up seasoning.

You mentioned you went through 'gallons' of oil and fat, and also mentioned re-seasoning your pans after cleaning them. Something is wrong there too, because you should only really need to season your pans two or three times, at most. And a gallon of oil should be enough to season 300 10-inch skillets. Twice each. Fold up a paper towel, dampen it with oil (not dripping), and wipe down your cast iron. 400 degree oven for 15 minutes, turn the oven off and let it all cool down. Presto, you're seasoned. You shouldn't have to do that again, just cook in it normally, clean like I mentioned above, and wipe it with a light coat of oil before putting it back in the cabinet. It sounds like you're scrubing the carbon spots off of your pan, or not letting the oil you're using to season the pan carbonize correctly.

You sound like you're putting a lot of effort into cast iron, and *you shouldn't*. That's the beauty of it. The more you ignore your cast iron (aside from that light coat of oil before you put it away), the *better* it is. Heck, last time I made eggs and hash browns on my double griddle, I scraped it down with my spatula, wiped off the excess oil with a paper towel or two, and hung it back up. No need to even get near the sink.

Acidic foods are fine in cast iron *unless* you're boiling acidic liquids. And if I'm boiling something, I'm not using cast iron. Lemon on fish? No problem. Cast iron for risotto? No way, wrong pan. You want cast iron for things *above* boiling temperatures, so no liquids really, unless you're just deglazing. Or deep frying... cast iron is great for that as it keeps the temperature steadier. Oil is good. Starchy liquids are bad in cast iron, so no rice dishes unless you're stir-frying in your skillet.

Each type of cookware has its place. Non-stick is great for things like risotto because it cleans up easily, and eggs so your omelettes don't stick. Copper is great when you want to take the heat from a small flame and spread it out more evenly, or get better response times when you turn the heat down. Aluminum is good at that too, but not as good as copper, but aluminum is great as bakeware in the oven. Stainless takes abuse well, and lasts nearly forever unless it gets warped or dented.

If you're looking for a minimalist kitchen, you're *not* looking to always have the most appropriate piece of cookware for the job, just something that'll work. Like vice-grips. I can use 'em to pound a nail, loosen a nut, cut wire and bend metal. But a hammer, wrench, diagonal cutters and pliers will always be better tools for the tasks they're designed for.

[takadi]

"Aluminum or copper will cool down to 250-300 in moments"

Actually research shows that copper of the same thickness and weight has similar heat capacity (meaning it holds almost as much heat as cast iron, just slightly less). It just loses and gains heat alot faster. Basically copper is cast iron that can turn on the dime.

When you put a steak on copper, yes it'll lose heat but it gains back heat just as fast, making for just as much net loss of heat as cast iron

Also, I just tend to reseason my pan every time I cook. I thought I heard somewhere that you need to coat the pan in oil after use so it doesn't rust. Overkill perhaps, but I've been working on this pan for over a year, so I get paranoid

I've attempted to cook boeuf bourguignon in my bare cast iron dutch oven and found it wears away at alot of the seasoning. I'm not sure if this gets better as it ages, but I don't really want carbonized oils getting into my food. Which really gets me frustrated because I feel the only things I can cook are things that have oil in it, or else the seasoning will just strip away again. And tomato sauces are apparently out of the question.

Anyways you're right, I probably am just obsessing about trivial details, but when I hear all sorts of rules of what you can or cannot do with cast iron, it makes me just want to use something that doesn't have the issue of surface reactivity

[paulj]

The first step against rust is to keep the pan dry. In other words, do not store it when wet, or where moisture could collect.

Yes, oiling the pan after drying is a good idea. But note that the uncoated outside does not rust if stored properly.

paulj

[Whosyerkitty]

I am lucky enough to own cast iron that belonged to my grandmother and I LOVE it. Needless to say at 80+ years old it's very very well seasoned, jet black.

I use the kettle for soups and stews and I love the skillets because I can brown things on the stove and just stick them in the oven to finish (chicken breasts, pork chops). I also make meatloaf and small roasts in them so I can then just put them on the stove to make gravy. Nothing else works for pancakes and grilled cheese.

They ARE hard to wash, but I use dishwashing liquid and a nylon pad, and I have used steel wool. When I re-season them, I rub oil on them with a paper towel and put them on a low flame. I also DRY them by placing them on a low flame to prevent rusting, which my mother did and her mother did.

So I think maybe it's all in the AGING. I have read elsewhere that if you really want good iron cookware, you need to search for vintage and buy it if it's REALLY black. This could be anywhere from garage sales to craigslist to ebay to Goodwill. Very cheap.

As far as hot handles go, pick up some silicon oven mitts (or handle sleeves), they're a godsend and you'll use them for your glass and metal baking pans, too.

[ThreeGigs]

"I just tend to reseason my pan every time I cook."
*Properly* seasoning cast iron takes about 2 hours or more. I'm thinking you may not be properly seasoning, which is why:
"I've attempted to cook boeuf bourguignon in my bare cast iron dutch oven and found it wears away at alot of the seasoning."
If your seasoning is flaking off, something is wrong. You *can* season a pan too much. The thickness of seasoning, even on a decades old well seasoned pan is thinner than a sheet of paper.

"I feel the only things I can cook are things that have oil in it"
Your feeling is almost right on the money. If whatever you are cooking doesn't contain some fat, you should be adding fat or oil to the pan before adding the food. You've got to put some butter or oil on before cooking eggs, for example. Cooking things with a lot of liquid lets the grease float away, so the non-stick properties of the seasoning are negated.

"I don't really want carbonized oils getting into my food."
Why not? They're tasteless and have no adverse health effects.
*Polymerized* oils are a dfferent story. Polymerization is a precursor to carbonization, and polymerized (thick, plastic-y, sticky) oils will taste bad. Seasoning incorrectly will result in a layer of polymerized oil on your pan which can be dissolved by later cooking with hot fresh oil. Polymerized oil is only about as stiff (and durable) as plastic.

"research shows that copper of the same thickness and weight has similar heat capacity"

You're thinking of 'specific heat', which is a dimensionless number. Once you add thickness into the equation, you're talking about real capacity. And that brings up the 'of similar thickness' part of your argument. Compare an $18 "Camp Chef" cast iron skillet or a $100 LeCreuset with bottom thicknesses of over 10 millimeters, or a $29 Lodge skillet with a bottom thickness of 5.5mm, to a typical high-end copper skillet (costing upwards of $250) with a 2.5mm thick base. Your typical cast iron skillet has *two to four times* more heat capacity *in the base* (where it counts), than even the thicker high end copper skillets. Same thing with most cast iron cookware, because iron is cheap it's not a big deal to include a LOT of iron in a piece. Also since cast iron is relatively fragile, it needs to be a minimum thickness to hold up well to abuse. So I'm sticking by my guns on my temperature numbers.

"but when I hear all sorts of rules of what you can or cannot do with cast iron, it makes me just want to use something that doesn't have the issue of surface reactivity"

Buy and use whatever suits your desires, and *your* desires may lend higher weight to convenience, weight and handling, and storage space for your cookware than higher performance for a limited number of applications. I've got plenty of space for my cookware, so it makes sense for me to buy a few (quite inexpensive) pieces of cast iron for specific applications.

[takadi]

Thanks for the corrections for the cast iron and copper.

I'm not sure where I read this, but some study pointed out how the seasoning in cast iron contains more carcinogens than teflon. I'm not sure if it's an old study where the teflon in pans were cheaper, and I'm not sure if they were just talking about the fumes and smoke that came from the seasoning or polymerized oils as a opposed to carbonized. I'll try to find it if I get the chance

[ThreeGigs]

It might have been marketing spin, because there are no carcinogens in Teflon. None, zero, zilch. But... when you get teflon hot enough to break down, *then* you've got all kinds of nastiness from carcinogens to outright poisons.

[grant.cook]

Thermal capacity of copper: 0.0920 BTU/lb-°F
Copper thermal conductivity: 2660 - 2710 BTU-in/hr-ft²-°F
Thermal capacity of cast iron: 0.121 - 0.200 BTU/lb-°F
Cast iron thermal conductivity: 78.4 - 370 BTU-in/hr-ft²-°F
(Source: www.matweb.com) - using basic cast iron and wrought copper.

So yes, copper beats cast iron hands down for conductivity, and is below it in thermal capacitance.

But you seem to ignore two key points here: 1) Cast iron is A LOT heavier. a 12" All-Clad copper pan, from Amazon (All-Clad Cop-R-Chef 12-Inch Fry Pan), has a weight of 5 lbs. A similar Lodge 12" skillet is 8 lbs. There is a lot more metal there to hold heat

2) Copper may be able to "re-heat" a lot faster, but your burner may very well be the bottleneck. Burners at high on home stoves aren't meant to be able to take a heavy pan up 150 degrees "on a dime"

Searing is quick.. so in essence, you are "sucking" the cast iron pan empty of its energy to sear the steak, and then letting it reheat a tad to do the other side. The copper pan has less thermal energy and the burner can't resupply it fast enough to maintain the heat.

The above poster is right - every piece of cookware has its rules, it niches. Look, keep your 2 cast iron skillets, get rid of the cast iron dutch oven, but a cheap enameled dutch oven at Target for $50-60, and get some stainless pans, you'll be set.

[takadi]

I got my numbers from egullet, which are very different from yours

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?s...

According to egullet, copper and iron, per cubic centimeter, has similar heat capacity, meaning there would be enough heat left and resupplied in copper after a sear to allow it to maintain stable and hot temperatures. As three gigs stated above, the difference is that cast iron is made much thicker and has slightly more heat capacity. But if the numbers are correct, theoretically copper is the ideal material.

[grant.cook]

Frankly, lets step back here.. cooking is only in some part about right or wrong, its about making some amazing creations that bring you and your friends and family pleasure.

We debate here about the best knife, the best cutting board, and while there are differences, and some research and insight should go into a purchase, in the end, this is a lot like the basketball argumentabout Michael Jordan and his shoes.. its the hand and the mind behind it that makes cooking fun, that makes something taste amazing. A pan is minor compared to the skills, the creativity, the ingredients that go into a dish.

You are doing a lot of analysis and to be honest, is this fun? Go home and make a roux, try your hand at a loaf of no-knead bread in your dutch oven, braise a pork loin in milk, invite over some friends and sit around a table drinking chardonnay and eating something you made, and stop worrying about whether your kitchen might win some efficiency award. Heck, if you are worried about cookware, start cooking stuff "en papillote" - parchment is cheap.

If you are spending a lot of time worrying about whether cast iron is working for you, and you still are concerned after asking for everyone's input, then it isn't working for you.

[can_i_try_some]

Now that's "some fresh, clear, well-seasoned perspective."

- Ratatouille... I love that movie. Anyone? Anyone?

[takadi]

Overrated movie, but great animation

[takadi]

"You are doing a lot of analysis and to be honest, is this fun?"

Actually, yes. Last time I checked, you couldn't fry an egg on a laptop

Frankly I would love to win the most efficient kitchen award, but I apologize for any offense you might have taken by inquiring about cookware on a cookware board

[GDFLS]

I agree 100% Grant. I just posted in another thread how I gave up on cast iron, just didn't fit in with what and how I like to cook. I also agree with your previous posts about Stainless. My aluminum core with stainless cooking surface is my go to cookwear for just about everything. While I agree if you can't afford the All Clad, go with what you can buy. But I will offer this, good solid cookware is an investment. I am 38 and still use my All Clad frypan that I purchased when I was 16.

[takadi]

Just saw the thread...it's pretty much exactly the same way I feel. I feel like I'm doing something wrong, and I don't really understand why cast iron, which everyone raves about, isn't doing it for me. I'll occasionally cook a steak on it if it isn't raining outside, but I'm sticking with nonstick and stainless

[grant.cook]

Did not mean to offend, I just think often we talk so much about cooking that we forget that its the hands-on act of doing it that provides the pleasure. People ask about the best knife, and there is no absolute right answer - go chop up some stuff and see what's the best knife FOR YOU.

I think there is some mystique about cast iron - that all the high-end performance of copper or 3-ply stainless is hidden inside this cheap Lodge skillet. That by using it, we are somehow cooking more authentically, but for most, that's not the case - its easier or more efficient to use another pan. Its a useful niche pan, great for some things, not for others. For purists, I am sure you can do some amazing things.. but being a purist and being a great chef are not necessarily the same thing.

I kayak a lot, and people have beautiful old cedar boats and kayak using a "Greenland" paddle made of light wood. I kayak using a fiberglass paddle with a carbon fiber shaft. Is the "Greenland" paddle amazing when used well? yes.. Is it more authentic? yes.. but I am interested in exploring the bays and harbors of NE, not being pure, and my paddle does just fine getting me around.

[bgermain]

I agree with the pragmatics of working with the tools that work well for you, for what you are doing. What works best for you IS best for you. But I disagree about the ease & efficiency conclusions above. For me an iron frying pan is not a niche item, and it is not of interest only to purists or those seeking some sort of artisanal authenticity or contact with basic materials. For me it's an easy, efficient, useful, workhorse of a tool that I thoughtlessly pull out many times a week & that needs almost no maintenance or special handling. Perfectly true that it is also not useful or appropriate for many purposes. Also true that I am not a great chef, I just cook. If I were trained in the nuances of technique I might understand things differently. Meanwhile in my current ignorance I use my pan a lot.

[takadi]

I don't think this has anything to do with purity, just a genuine interest in high quality cookware. I find it no different than being interested in how a car works. Granted you're not gonna be the next dale earnhardt jr overnight, but even though everybody would love a sportscar, who would let down a trusty hemi? The same sentiments apply. And like cars, sometimes a person is a pick up truck guy, and sometimes he's just a four door sedan guy.

I still use my cast iron now and again, but it really hasn't found its purpose as a centerpiece in my current cooking lifestyle.

[gdaerin]

I think you've hit on exactly what makes cast iron attractive, there is a mystique about it, I admit, I think it's more authentic and "purer" and I don't really use it!

To me what makes cast iron so unique is that it's possible to find a cheap cast-iron at a garage sale all rusted and with just a little elbow grease you can have a new well seasoned pan. Sure, copper and SS last but you'd never see a copper pan going for 5 bucks at a garage sale, would you?

[Whosyerkitty]

Now that's interesting. I have a knife that I bought at a dollar store on my way to bringing food somewhere (picnic, I think) and it's now one of my favorite knives. It has a cheesy plastic handle, but it's comfortable and has stayed sharp for a few years.

[ThreeGigs]

Yes, copper would be ideal. However I've never found a copper skillet with a bottom thicker than 3mm. Give me a 7mm thick bottom and 1.5 mm thick sides and I'll gladly trade in my cast iron for copper.

Because of this thread, I was (again) looking into copper electoplating. If I could add another 3 or 4 mm of copper to the bottoms of some of my copper pieces, I'd be ecstatic.

[grant.cook]

Why don't you just go out and buy a commerical cooktop that has burners that can put out 20000-30000 BTU's per hour? Then the whole capacitance issues is moot.. you'll be able to ignite small pieces of paper at 30 feet..

[goldendawn7]

Read the Cop-R-Chef description again. That line from All Clad has a light weight ALUMINUM core, its simply a copper coating on the outside so it looks pretty. A proper copper piece from Borgeat or Falk or the better lines of Mauviel will weight almost as much, if not AS much, as a similar cast iron piece. But comparing cast iron to copper is apples and oranges, really.

[Mawrter]

Boeuf bourguignon isn't such a good choice for cast iron: wine + tomatoes = both are acidic and will reliably wear away at your seasoning. Sorry.

I took a long time myself to get into the groove of using and maintaining cast iron. I'm a fan now, but if you don't grow up using it, I agree it's a pretty big shift in the way you cook and use cookware.

[krbtv]

I don't grease mine after every use but I make sure it is dry.

[RGC1982]

You can also just put the pan on the burner on low for a few moments after drying it to evaporate any residual moisture away. You'll have to be patient and let it cool again.

BTW, this is what I do with my carbon steel wok too, which will rust in minutes.

I avoid wine sauces in my cast iron since it tends to darken the sauce, and stick to Le Creuset or Staub enameled cast iron. I mostly use my cast iron grill , and my skillets to sear or fry. I am also a proponent of soap and water. It is the only way you can really get the food gunk off and get to seasoning only. I'm not talking about using a Brillo pad here, but a green scrubber sponge with a little dishwashing liquid and a rinse. The seasoning remains behind on the pan. It could be that some of your sticking problems are due to food residue that may resemble seasoning.

[jayt90]

I clean up and season my cast iron pans and Dutch oven as simply as possible: they soak in warm water during the meal, then later get a good cleaning with hot water and a long handled brush. Never any need for detergent, but once in awhile baking soda in the soak. Then they are dried with a cloth or paper towel, and stored. During the brushing, a slight amount of residual oil will adhere to the pan, enough for re-seasoning.

I use the Dutch oven, lid on, in my ovenfor slow cooking. With the lid off, it is excellent for stove top frying, such as battered food in 1.5" oil, with a thermometer. It is easy to maintain 350 degrees because of the heat retention of the iron.

I can easily do a three egg omelet, completely non stick, in the 12" cast pan. It has to be heated to smoking, then a small amount of high smoke point oil or ghee added, and the eggs will cook in seconds, heat off, with a bit of shaking or stirring. If hot enough, there is no sticking.

I have a Le Creuset 8" enameled frypan, and it is seldom used because it sticks mercilessly. It is now my niche pan!

[ziggylu]

Late to this party myself...

We're just back from a vacation where we had a full kitchen. Knowing the cookware in the rental would stink, but not wanting to take my entire kitchen, I tossed my cast iron skillet in the car along with a knife adn a few other essentials. I hardly use my cast iron skillet at home, mostly only for cornbread. I have some copper, some All-Clad, some Le Creuset, a Scanpan for eggs....

But...the cast iron CAN do almost anything I want it to do. It's about 15 years old and well seasoned. I preheat it well for anything I want to do with it but for the most part it's very versatile. here's some things I did while we were gone:

Turkey green chile stew with cheddar dumplings
Bacon with eggs over-easy(no problem with eggs sticking at all)
Pancakes
Steaks with sauteed mushrooms
Oven roasted chicken thighs over potatoes, onions, and carrots
Tomato based pasta sauce

I wouldn't try making a delicate sauce in it. Nor do I expect it to allow fat free cooking(mmm....butter in the bottom of the pan for those pancakes!) Also, now that I'm back home I won't use it much again because I have other pans to work with but I am glad I have it. Don't give up on yours, season it well, care for it properly and over the years it will be a trusty tool when you need it.

As for copper, I've collected several pieces of 2.5mm over the last few years as I have had the opportunity to buy it at a deep discount. I love my copper cookware but I'm the first to admit it's hardly a necessity in the kitchen. It does perform very well but so does a lot of other cookware for a fraction of the cost. If your budget doesn't allow it(and copper has gone up in the last 6 weeks to about 40% over what were already high prices) and if you don't love the aesthetics of copper look save your money and look for another option.

[Skyking333]

I have been using cast iron sucessfully for over 30 years. There are just a few simple steps to follow. 1) make sure you have properly seasoned the pan. I usually just clean it carefully, put it in a 325 degree oven, and wipe several times with oil. You may need to do this more than once 2) when I use the pan, I always clean it while it is still hot. If you take out your food, take the pan to the sink, get HOT water coming out of the faucet, and clean the pan. I have a wooden type scrubber (looks like it is small sticks of bamboo tied together into a stiff brush) that is used to clean a wok. 3) return the pan to the stove and place it on the hot burner (which is not on), wipe the pan clean, and then pour in a teaspoon of oil and whip the pan to constantly renew the seasoning.

This is quick, simple and really works well. It just requires that you handle the pan when it is hot.

Also, when you place the hot pan under the hot water, be careful that you are holding the pan from the side and that your hand is not over the pan. When the hot water hits the hot pan, it generates a lot of steam, and steam is hotter than boiling water. Always hold the pan by the handle and to one side when placing it under the water.

One more note, it is not necessary to place the pan under the hot water immediately after removing the food, but it should be done before the pan cools. (within 5 minutes).

When the pan is hot, and the water is hot, the food comes off immediately.

When you let the pan cool, the food adheres to the finish, and scubbing removes the seasoning.

And when cooking, always remember to get the pan hot first, then add the oil just before adding the food. Remember the chinese saying "Hot wok, cold oil, food won't stick". This is saying, don't add the oil and let the oil get hot before adding the food.

[justjoe]

"I have a wooden type scrubber (looks like it is small sticks of bamboo tied together into a stiff brush) that is used to clean a wok."

I was just going to make this same tip! Buy 'em at the Asian market, they're cheap. You might also see some other old fashioned wok cleaners there that work well on cast iron, but this one is my favorite. I very rarely use any soap on my ci, and I never even heard of cleaning cast iron with salt. And cast iron tip #2: to make eggs nonstick, the secret is getting the eggs to room temp., and the quickest way to do that is just to put them in warm water for a couple of minutes.

[justjoe]

Here's another good trick for cleaning cast iron pans - an old credit card. Use it to scrape off the gunk first, if it's all gunked up, and then you can switch to a Chinese wok cleaning bristle brush. That way keeps the brush from getting all gunked up. After each use I either wipe the pan with an oily rag (like coconut oil), or give it a little schpritz with an a cooking oil spray can.

[Y.T.]

i used to like Teflon non-stick cookware and then some time ago i decided to try cast iron.however i didn't pick up the non-seasoned dutch oven, but instead i chose the enameled Chantal one - i alrdy had some Chantal stoneware, i like it, and it was so much cheaper than LC and Staub, and it was on sale, so i decided to give it a try :) it was a winner, now I'm upgrading to all-cast iron cookware, I'm trying to get the right skillets now...

i think the key is to heat it properly, with or w/o the oil, and for the love of kittens DONT u ever use olive oil, 'cos it burns... but cheapo canola oil is the way to go. i do deglase in 95,5% of cases and i cant say the stuff sticks to the surface - just leave it alone for some time, it'll be fine, don't move your steak too soon. i can be wrong tho - when I'm browning things and my fire alarm dosn't go off i feel like I'm doing smth wrong, so mb i tend to overbrown, if there's such thing :)
I've tried some stainless skillets, mostly for steaks and meat, but i think i'm getting better results with cast iron.

[Mawrter]

Agreed about no olive oil. I don't use canola oil for a bunch of reasons, personally, but I'm glad to hear it works for you.

I think the preferred way to go to avoid stickiness is some kind of saturated fat. That means lard, food-grade cocoa butter or Crisco. Crisco is favored by those who don't mind about TFAs (trans-fatty acids). Lard is traditional and very effective (that's what I've used) but obviously no good for vegetarians. Cocoa butter is natural, saturated, animal-free, and supposedly does not make everything you eat taste like you're eating a coconut.

HTH.

[razkolnikov]

"Crisco is favored by those who don't mind about TFAs (trans-fatty acids)"

Is that an issue when you use Crisco to season the pan, or in other words, does the end-product (the hard black layer of seasoning) really retain any of the seasoning fat's characteristics? I guess what I'm asking is: would a pan seasoned with Crisco release TFAs into the food, or does the high-heat seasoning process convert the fat into a neutral state (carbon?) that's different from where it started (so TFA or animal fat/lard wouldn't be an issue)? I'm genuinely unsure about this; have been wondering for a while.

[Mawrter]

Hey Raz, I don't know enough to give you a real answer, but I speculate that it depends. :-)

My seat-of-pants answer: Probably some minute degree of TFA gets into the food, and that probably isn't enough for most people to get too fussed about. I If I had an old cast iron skillet that had been seasoned with Crisco, I wouldn't get rid of it. But I also wouldn't season a new one with it since I know there are the other options.

[jaykayen]

This shouldn't be an issue, as Crisco has been reformulated to not have any trans fat.

[Mawrter]

From the Crisco website, the ingredients of the shortening:

****************************
SOYBEAN OIL, FULLY HYDROGENATED COTTONSEED OIL, PARTIALLY HYDROGENATED COTTONSEED AND SOYBEAN OILS, MONO- AND DIGLYCERIDES, TBHQ AND CITRIC ACID (ANTIOXIDANTS).
******************************

Trust me, there are plenty of people out there who don't want to ingest that cocktail of industrial oils, whether it's a TFA or not.

See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crisco

[geppetto]

Crisco may have been reformulated, but it still contains trans fats. Look past the Nutrition Info and examine the Ingredients. You will see Partially Hydrogenated Cotton Seed and Soybean Oils listed. They are the trans fats.

The FDA allows companies to say they have Zero or No Trans Fats if they have less than 0.5g of trans fats per serving. The serving size for Crisco is 1 Tablespoon, or 12 grams. 4% of that tablespoon can be trans fats and it is still OK to tell you it doesn't have any in the nutrition information. I heard the FDA is also looking out for us when it comes to melamine too! We're so fortunate to have them on our side.

On the topic - I'm still learning how to use my cast iron frying pan outdoors on the grill for searing scallops and cooking fish. I started using grape seed oil as it has a higher smoke point. (not that I can get the pan as hot as I would like...) For cleanup, I let the pan cool and use a spongie thing with the green back to clean the pan with a very,very small mount of detergent and hot water. Then dry by hand and apply a thin coat of vegetable oil with a paper towel.

[elmbow]

Who here remembers the butter scare of the 70's??? Well, I was raised on dairy products and KNEW right from the get go that whoever these "scaremonger" pundits were, they were completely wrong about butter and I didn't need "Popular Science" to back me up. Fast forward through about 17 similar scares in the last few decades and I'm about at my wits end with folks. The latest is TFA's. Well how do you square TFA's with MTC's? And who'd of thunk that today's cutting edge exercise nutritionists are touting the benefits of palm and coconut fats, eh? Bottom line is this: Even assuming that TFA's are somehow detrimental to your well being, (and I doubt they are.) then the amount of TFA's you're going to be ingesting from using lard or shortening to season cast iron cookware is beyond (BEYOND) miniscule!.
Now, a few words about cast iron: I'm pushing 65 years and have spent a good part of my life living in wall tents in the Rocky Mountains and guess what that means? Yup, I'm a dutch oven nut. I own at least 20 of them. I will flat out unequivocally state that you should never use oil to season a dutch oven. Heresy? Bear with me, please. Try seasoning an oven with oil and then putting it away for the winter. Come springtime you'll find that it has gone rancid and you'll need to re-season the oven. Now, season an oven with lard or shortening and put it away for the winter, voile, no rancid smell after sitting in the garage for 4 months. I don't claim to understand the chemistry, nor do i care. I ONLY use shortening to season any cast iron cookware. Try it, and for heaven's sake quit worrying about the amount of TFA's in the shortening. As for cleaning, others have hit it in previous posts, forgert the salt, never use any type of soap or detergent, get the hottest water your tap will provide into the pan as soon after cooking as possible, except WAIT long enough so that the pan DOESN'T send off clouds of steam. The pan is too hot and you risk cracking the iron. Let it sit a few minutes with water, then use one of the plastic scrubby things, (I use the brand name orangy yellow one.) Scrub it out good, wipe it down insidew and out with a paper towel, its own heat will continue to drive the rest of the moisture out and it won't rust, put it on the stove and using another paper towel, give it a once ovber with a very light coat of shortening and you are good to go. I use cast iron pans and griddles exclusively for high heat searing of meats, vegis, etc. Needless to say, sourjacks and cast iron were made for each other. Cast iron can be made reasonably non stick in a pretty short time, but the shiny black patina that has come to be the trademark of cast iron cookware will only come after many years of constant use. But then, so long as it doesn't get broken, your great grand kids should still be using them a century from now.

[toodie jane]

You a packer? ...ever think of posting some good campfire cast iron recipes? We used to have an outfit who'd set up a series of dutch ovens and serve weekend breakfasts at a highway interchange (out int he country) till the health dep't shut them down. sheesh.

[mr. rowshan]

Good cast iron pans work, the problem is all the new cast iron cookware that's coming out is formed from low quality ore.

Compare the smoothness of the cast iron in this blog to that of your cast iron. I think you'll see a huge difference. http://blackirondude.blogspot.com/200...

Enamel coated pans are great, but they are much more delicate that really good pure cast iron.

[rockfish42]

It's not the ore so much as the manufacturing process. New pieces are sand cast and then "polished" with steel balls being shot at them. This results in a roughish surface in comparison to the older pieces which were machined after the casting. I have several 1920-30's Griswold pieces and several newer Lodge pieces. I prefer the older smoother skillets for eggs everything else is about equal, though CI had an article about heavier skillets giving a better sear.

[Steady Habits]

Just want to second your thoughts. I've got a Lodge skillet that's about 5 years old; a Lodge griddle that I bought maybe...25 years ago, and a newly acquired, but not new, Wagner skillet that I rescued from my late FIL's basement. Word is he obtained that one in Australia during WWII. That thing is as smooth as the ice on a pond, despite having been left in a humid cellar on the shore for decades, and so is my 25 y.o. griddle. The newer skillet has required a LOT of seasoning to be practical. That's fine, since I often season the pans between uses (great way to make the kitchen cozy on a cold winter's day), but the newer pan is just now becoming bearable to use, rather than simply a pain in the neck. I love that Wagner pan, though. I personally have absolutely *no*use for non-stick--can't stand the stuff--but I don't need it with my two older CI pans.

I always wash mine in soapy water, though (and, of course, rinse it very well and dry it immediately). I talked to a chef once who told me that the health department would shut him down if he didn't use soap, and that was good enough for me. I've never noticed any residue in taste or texture. But of course these pans are well seasoned by now.

[takadi]

Will the new "rougher" pans eventually smooth down over time? I don't get why lodge would roughen the surface up with a steel ball treatment...if it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? I don't know why they would go through the extra process - lower quality ore makes more sense

[rockfish42]

The surface isn't further roughened up by this treatment, the balls are meant to knock off any excess sand that isn't removed earlier. If you watch Good Eats the episode Fry Hard II : The Chicken shows the whole process.

[maymayrays]

I agree with this, completely... my experience with cast iron was the same as Takadi's, until my mother in law sent me a set of gorgeous vintage skillets from an estate auction in Connecticut. Those pans are as slick as any non stick I have ever used, in fact I just (accidentally) cooked an egg without using ANY oil or butter in my 12" skillet this morning and didn't even notice until I saw that the texture of the egg itself was a little off. But it didn't stick even a little bit. I have tried new, pre-seasoned and raw pans (Lodge brand) and had nothing but headaches. In fact, my new pre-seasoned double-sided griddle is sitting on my kitchen table waiting to have rust scoured off of it so I can use the darn thing. And, trust me, I seasoned it using bacon, kobe beef hamburger, and fatty salmon. Food has always stuck to it, and I feel like it always will. And now I get to deal with the rust on it. Yey. If I were you, I would get rid of the new pieces and get over to a thrift store, garage sale, or antique store and find a nice, slick, old school machined piece that will make you realize you aren't crazy -- and that good, tight cast iron is a fabulous tool in the kitchen. You'll be so glad you did.
P.S. I don't ever use soap on my vintage pieces, though mostly out of laziness. I also don't ever hesitate to cook whatever I want in them -- tomatoes, wine reductions, lemon-caper sauce -- because the old cast iron is so completely superior to what is being made today.

[takadi]

Man I haven't visited this thread in a while. I must say I'm still experimenting with my pan, but I've heard rumors for quite a while that Lodge or any other company for that matter doesn't make their cast iron products as well as they used to, which explains alot of testimony from people who claim their vintage products are extremely nonstick and slick but their recent lodge pans aren't.

I've owned my pan for too long to get rid of it, but I might consider going out to some sale and purchasing a vintage piece, if I can find one at least.

By the way, I wonder why vintage cast iron is so much better than "new" cast iron? I always thought all cast iron was equal

[vday]

Gotta agree about the vintage pans - I have several that are vintage from 2 grandmothers and those babies are SLICK on the bottom . . . I think they were originally machined very smooth to begin with, and then with the years of use I see a big difference from a newer pan I have which has some rougher texture to the cooking surface of the pan. I just got on this thread and it reminds me I have a huge, but a little rusty, cast iron pan out in my garage. I think it is an older one and now need to get out there and check it out to see about getting it back in action.

[Passadumkeg]

My wife was just commenting yesterday about how smooth one of our cast iron fry pans is and asked where we got it from and I replied "from up in the attic". Very smooth and relatively light. My 30 year old Norwegian Hoyang (with a mahogony handle) pan is very heavy, but very smooth. A big old Lodge, that I inherited from one of my sons, is big, heavy, and rough, but still cooks well.

I just got back from a 3 day sea kayak camping trip and cooked for 11 poeple using only cast iron cook ware; bean hole beans, chili, bacon, eggs, pancakes (strawberry ployes), tortillas, the whole 10 meters (world version of 9 yards).
In addition, my wife suffers from less PMS when I cook only on cast iron.

[toodie jane]

"my wife suffers from less PMS when I cook only on cast iron"

*chuckle* because YOU'RE doing the cooking, silly! (keep on spoiling her)

[acesandeights]

I have to say, I've owned very expensive non-stick, stainless, and cast iron. I now use two cast iron pans. They sit on the stove all day, every day. They are both Lodge pre-seasoned pans; however, they are not truly seasoned until you use them regularly and frequently. My All Clad is in a drawer and my Circulon is gone. I can't get rid of the All Clad because my wife would kill me (just because of the cost). After spending a great deal of time using cast iron (also using cast iron dutch ovens over fire/coals), including my cast iron pans, cast iron dutch ovens and a new enameled Creuset, the best advice I can give is start with lower heat. It seems to me most (and I mean A LOT) of the cooking difficulties people have is too high of heat. I love cooking, and eating, but the biggest thing I've learned cooking with cast iron is to slow down. Cooking slower, with lower heat makes for a much better product, and the cast iron lends itself to lower heat (it conducts it so well that heating the pan over high heat defeats the purpose, you'll burn your food, or get it to stick because you'll get the pan smoking and it won't cool down quick enough). My cast iron pans and dutch ovens are truly non-stick at this point, and cooking requires a spray of non-stick cooking spray and sometimes nothing at all (I cooked a fried egg yesterday with no oil at all, after a batch of pancakes, with NO sticking). I've watched other cooks use too high of heat and too much oil only to find their food did not turn out the way they wanted. Slow and low, cast iron does the work for you.

I'm sorry you've had issues, but try again, at no higher than medium heat (even frying) and use it everyday for a week, with a spray of Pam before and after you cook (wipe it out with a paper towel after cooking) and after that time I bet things will start to come together for you. You don't need much oil to season it, use a vegetable oil, not animal based at first.

[chuckl]

I'd agree that cast iron works best for "low and slow" cooking not because it conducts heat well (it doesn't; that's why it takes so long to heat up compared to say copper) but because it retains heat (it also takes a long time to cool off). If all you do is low and slow cooking, that's great, but if you saute, not so much. While a properly seasoned cast iron pan has wonderful non-stick properties, to which i can attest, sometimes the point is precisely to have some food matter stick during high heat (it's called fond), for making sauces when you deglaze with wine or stock. If you're content with only one style of cooking, good for you, but some people like fast and hot as well as low and slow -- it all depends on what you're cooking and how. Extolling the virtues of one doesn't require diminishing the qualities of the other.

[acesandeights]

I've been reading some older cook books and have found them, when they state time, to be much longer cooking for sauteing, browning and other things. I've found if I saute more slowly I get better results. As a matter of fact, sauteing onions for example takes approximately 30 minutes. I had been burning things in cast iron that now I don't (i.e., caramelized onions). I'm not sure what you meant about "extolling the virtues of one doesn't require diminishing the qualities of the other", as I don't think I was doing that. But, to the original poster, or anyone else having difficulties with cast iron, I would suggest not giving up, and *possibly* trying slower cooking with lower temps.

I realize some people like fast and hot, or slow and low, but it doesn't mean they have to be limited in one style of cooking, as I'm not sure of anything cast iron doesn't do well (maybe boil water quickly). Cast iron works well for both (slow or fast); however, again, if a person is having trouble as the OP states, instead of losing faith, possibly trying a different style will bring the results sought. Also, there are different brands, with different qualities. Not all cast iron, as all copper, aluminum, or stainless pans are equal.

[powillie]

I have, probably, a dozen cast iron skillets, 6" through 15". I also have a 12"x4" chicken fryer and a dutch oven. I use the 15" all the time, great for breakfast. I use the 6" for toasting spices, onions and garlic. The others, as needed.

Do not be intimidated by cast iron, you do not need to baby it. If something is stuck to it, hold it under running water and use a metal scratch pad to clean it. If it is really stuck on, heat it up good and hot, pour in a small amount of water, and use a metal spatula to scrape it off.

To season cast iron, please remember that you are not trying to create a coating but to treat the metal. Begin by heating the skillet on your hottest burner to smoking hot, the hotter the better. This will expand the metal and open the pores of the iron. While the skillet is smoking hot, pour in a couple of tablespoons of canola oil, I would not use an animal based fat since it can turn rancid. Use tongs and a wadded-up paper towel to distribute the oil over the cooking surface, then over the handle and outside of the skillet. Allow this to cool to room temperature. Repeat this until you are satisfied with the cooking surface. If you get a buildup, hold the skillet under hot running water and use a metal scratch pad to clean it, use soap in necessary. Remember to bring your skillet up to cooking temp before adding oil and food. You can use your cast-iron to sear a steak at high heat on the stovetop then pop it into the oven to to bring it to a delicious medium-rare. Or make a pan pizza baked at 500 degrees with the cheese and toppings of you choice. This should allow you to get started with your castiron cooking. Should your skillets begin to look a little gray, just heat it up and re-season it.

[MikeB3542]

Don't confuse low or medium burner settings with low temperatures! Given a bit of time, an empty cast iron pan will get pretty darn hot under modest burner settings. Unless you are doing a sear, keep the temps around medium and you will be much happier with the results. (I will turner the burner to high just as I put in food like veggies to keep the pan temp from dropping too low -- as the pan recovers, I will dial the burner back).

[gdaerin]

would this apply to veggie omelets? You would do this when adding vegetables to an omelet?

[Luvfriedokra]

Intersting thread- I love cast iron but I also grew up using it and mine are passed down so I haven't encounterd any of the problems I've been reading about. But it's definitely not for everyone-I would think long and hard before purchasing new cookery. Don't get caught up in raves and hype, (I know it's hard if you're kitchen-obsessed like I am because everything on CH sounds so cool) figure out what works for you and what will fit into your lifestyle.

[gdaerin]

I don't think anyone is going to argue that copper is superior to cast iron! I've experienced all the same frustrations with cast irons as well.

I've burned myself as well a few times and I just find it very hard to wash a pan without soap! There is something very satisfying about getting a pot squeaky clean in hot sudsy water.

[razkolnikov]

I don't get this aversion against a bit of soap for cleaning cast iron.

The way I see it is, did you ever try to clean an oven with a bit of dishwashing soap? There's a reason you need extremely high heat or noxious lye(!)-based cleaners to clean the grease that's burned into an oven -- it doesn't simply release when it contacts soap. Cast iron seasoning is similar: it's fat that's polymerized into the surface at around the same temperature as grease gets baked onto the oven walls. No quick contact with soap will get that stuff of.

I don't soak mine in sudsy water, but I use the same soapy nylon scrub I use for most dishes. Never had any problems.

[EscapeVelocity]

Same here razkolnikov.

And Cast Iron is the Shizzle. Anybody losing faith in it needs to go to coffession and do some Hail Mary's and Our Father's.

[taos]

Why is that the manufacturers of cast iron say not to use soap?

http://www.localburgerandfries.com/hours

Your analogy to the oven is also wrong. Are you comparing cleaning the oven with removing the seasoning from a cast iron pan or are you comparing cleaning the oven with removing cooking grease from a seasoned cast iron pan? No one said that soap, scrubbing and high heat was not necessary to remove seasoning from a cast iron pan. But that's not the goal of every day cleaning.

[razkolnikov]

Wrong link.

re: analogy - neither. What I'm saying is that the cast iron seasoning is similar in chemical structure/process as the fat baked into an oven that's so hard to remove (I'm not 100% on the chemistry here, but it makes intuitive sense, given how CI is seasoned). If you can't get the oven clean with a bit of soap, a bit of soap also won't hurt the CI seasoning.

[taos]

Sorry. I was posting in another thread earlier. Here's the correct link:

http://www.lodgemfg.com/use-care-help...

[fermented]

I just discovered this website and this thread--this is great! First, I'd like to say that I have been cooking with cast iron for over 30 years. I have a Griswold dutch oven and a Wagner skillet. I use them constantly and never have any problems--I think of them as being Stradivarius-like--they just keep getting better with age. These babies are old--and were old when I bought them. They could be 50-70 years old. I got both at the Goodwill.

I loved the specific disscussion about cast iron versus copper. Just a question to throw into this argument. Are you talking about shiny bright copper (which a lot of people prefer for the aesthetics), or are you talking about blackened copper? The latter I have read is better. And I keep my vintage Revere Ware that way, although I rarely use. I can make anything in my CI dutch oven, and for other things I have some (also vintage) Rena Ware. I have a Norwegian CI waffle maker and some other things, a CI cornbread pan.

Got a question: Has anyone ever heard of an Ohsawa pot? I discovered this on a macrobiotic website when I was researching a better way to make rice. This is a "pot-within-pot" technique, using your pressure cooker. It is supposed to be like rice used to be made, in ceramic pots or cast iron. Slowly, I assume. Anyway, I bring this up here because I have a "science project" coming up. I have a special small cast iron pot that will fit into the pressure cooker and I am going to try that and see what happens. I don't want to spend that kind of money on those "Ohsawa" pots. I figure the worse thing that could happen would be 1-2 hour rice. !! Anybody have any experience with this?

PS--I vote on the side of no detergent on cast iron EVER EVER EVER. I think we have just become too germ-phobic. I have been fermenting my own pickles, kim chi, and saurkraut as per the Wild Fermentation surge. There are good bacteria out there, ya' know.

PSS--Two superior things about cast iron. 1. Camping, over a fire. 2. Solar oven, you know, for those possible looming days when the grid goes down just a wee bit.

[razkolnikov]

They're taking the safe route: better to say not to use soap at all if it keeps someone from putting the pan into a dishwasher or soaking it overnight. But as far as a quick rinse with some soap (followed by drying and applying a thin layer of fat/oil/shortening to the hot pan) goes, I just don't see (chemically) how it can do anything to a good seasoning layer.

But I guess it comes down to doing what works best for the individual. I find that a bit of soap that's quickly rinsed off does nothing to the seasoning; others feel more comfortable without soap. If it keeps cooking well, it's all good.

[rockfish42]

The no soap dictum is because homemade soap previously made with lye and whatever fat might be around is a lot more caustic if not made properly. I agree that a little bit of soap once in a while won't hurt a properly seasoned pan, the issue arises however that new pans seasoned at a low temperature don't have fully polymerized fat which can in fact be removed with soap and mild scrubbing.

[EscapeVelocity]

Cast iron loves to be treated badly.

[taos]

Actually I think it's the other way around. in the century or two between homemade soap with lye and today's extra strength-super duper grease cutting concoctions, there was good old fashioned soap. Like the kind our mothers or grandmothers (depending on our age) grew up washing dishes with. You probably can't strip a seasoned cast iron pan with this. But the advent of new grease-cutting concoctions has made the no soap instructions necessary.

And, no, cast iron does not love to be treated badly (see below). Ask anyone who has put a piece in the dishwasher, put it away wet, allowed it to rust, put a piece of hot cast iron under cold water. Like every piece of cookware, it has its pros and cons and asks to be treated with appropriate care.

[Whosyerkitty]

I always use soap. I dry on the stove. I think the Lodge people don't use their own products. And I have beat the garbage out of mine and it still loves me.

[EscapeVelocity]

Same here Whosyerkitty. I soak em overnight in the sink, put water in them directly off the stove hot, put it away wet, scrubbed it with soap, with nary a peep of rust and a great seasoning going strong.

Sometimes I leave it outside for days to feed the dogs.

LOL!

[Whosyerkitty]

Excellent! Extra iron for the dog!

[phantomdoc]

This post has been very informative. Last night i did a version of chicken franchaise in my 12" cast iron. The trick of using medium heat worked like a charm. Cooking in EVOO nothing stuck to the pan. Also cooked the extra egg batter and is released easily. Thanks for the advice.

[krbtv]

It takes many many many years to have good seasoned cast iron. The good thing about cast iron is that it will be around 100 year from now - your non-stick cookware will not last that long. There are also health concerns with non stick.

If you are new to cooking and want something good but not too expensive then try Tramontina 8 piece cookware set. It is fully clad (aluminum all the way up the sides). It can be purchased at Walmart for about $150. Make sure you get the set that is "fully clad", and not disk bottom. They also make a 12 inch fry pan and a 12 inch jumbo cooker.

You might like enameled cast iron better than raw cast iron but a good enameled version like Le Creuset is expensive.

Yes copper cooks better than cast iron but cost 15 to 20 times more. If you must have copper then look at Falk at www.copperpans.com .

[Politeness]

kbrtv: "It takes many many many years to have good seasoned cast iron."

Have you tried Annabelle's (acmorris's) technique, set out in minute detail here: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/4338...

In that same thread, a couple of posts lower, she says, "You can't duplicate years of use, BUT you also don't have to wait ten years either. Bottom line, you can wait 10 years like you have done for a piece that is 'beginning to get a very nice surface' or you can season it and have a rock hard non-stick surface which requires very little if any oil. The benefit of doing so is that the peice is protected and durable. Waiting 10 years for a finish to develop is also allowing 10 years of the elements to work on the metal."

And she attached photos to prove it!

[chuckl]

I agree, Politeness, if you follow the proper procedure, you can season cast iron very very well in weeks, not years.

[Bethcooks]

I read all the posts with great interest because I love cast iron and have never had any of the problems described. Maybe the secret is growing up with cooks who just used it everyday and I just do the things they did without thought. My mother would once in a great while put her cast iron in a fire in the fireplace and then season it again. I don't know why she did that? I have also read that you can do that with the new preseasoned cast iron. About acid foods - I recently read an article [where?] they made the point that we are getting less iron in our diets because less cooking is done in cast iron. I use mine all the time for acid foods. It does turn tomatoes brown but in a stew, etc dish I don't really mind. One question: Has anyone used peanut oil to season or wipe down their pans after use? It has a very high smoking point and I thought it might be better???

[Politeness]

Bethcooks: "One question: Has anyone used peanut oil to season or wipe down their pans after use? It has a very high smoking point and I thought it might be better???"

We had the very same thought, and tried to follow through on it, with our unseasonable Lodge cast iron skillet. The problem was that we had failed to follow the thought through to the logical conclusion. A high smoke point means that the oil is not carbonizing, because when an oil carbonizes it produces smoke. But seasoning IS carbonizing oil onto the surface. Peanut oil WILL work to season a cast iron pan, but you have to use higher temperatures to get it above its smoke point. We have had better success seasoning cast iron with bacon grease and virgin (Mitoku brand) sesame oil, neither of which has a very high smoke point.

(And, as I mentioned in another thread, I suspect a component of your lack of problems is that you have cast iron that was machined fairly smooth when it was originally fabricated; in recent years, Lodge brand cast iron, which is the most readily available cast iron to purchase new in the United States, has not been machined, and comes with a surface that is difficult if not impossible to season properly. Also, see vday's May 25, 2009, comment above.)

[Bethcooks]

Thanks - I had obviously not thought this through to its logical conclusion. I agree with you that the older cast iron was much smoother. Not only am I using my mother's cast iron, I am beginning to sound like her as in, "They just don't make things the way they use to do!"

[sueatmo]

I was turned on to old cast iron through reading Chowhound. I have begun collecting some skillets. I too do not find the finish on my old skillets to be non stick the way modern non-stick finishes are. I do find that I have to be conscientious about keeping the insides scrubbed and oiled, but don't find this onerous. I don't fry in them, because I don't fry any more. I do bake in them with excellent results, I brown meat in them and I like two of them going at once as griddles for pancakes. The Griswolds are really nice pans with well-designed spouts and nice balance. I have bought an older no name skillet which is almost as good. Try a frittata using an iron skillet!

But I use stainless for everything else because it dishwashes so well. Mine have copper disks in the bottoms. And I use one or two non stick skillets for eggs and sauteing aromatics. Each material has its own uses.

[kchurchill5]

Today I went to my Dads (in town) and a neighbor was throwing lots of cookware out. I went by as I drove out the complex and saw cast iron on the ground. I looked. It was lodge. Beautiful. A 2 qt I believe maybe 3 and a small 6" small pot and a 10" skillet. Well I went up to the door and asked if I could take them ... she said sure. Excellent condition, in fact, not used enough. I will be glad to use them. What a find!! I have a large 6 qt I think, I do have a 14" I think, maybe 12, and a small skillet 6 or 8 and another 1 qt pot. So these will be a great addition.

[Passadumkeg]

I go to yard sales looking for cheap La Cruset.
All I own for fry pans are cast iron. Full stop.

[Popcorn76]

I have a large cast iron skillet that I love, but don't use often... Even though I don't use it often, it is one of my favorite pieces of cookware.

This piece was a hand-me-down... It's at least 30 years old. So obviously it's had decades to season, and the patina build-up has contributed to its "natural" non-stick properties and rustic look.

While it seems that my pan is naturally non-stick now, I must say that when it comes to eggs, you have to be careful. Eggs MUST we warmed up to room temperature before plopping them in the skillet. If you take the eggs out of the fridge and immediately break the shell and put the eggs in a hot skillet, they will ALWAYS stick and it can get quite messy. So always let your eggs warm-up to room temperature and make sure the skillet is preheated on medium heat. Also make sure there is a little oil or butter in the pan, too.

When it comes to rice, here is what I do and it works like a charm and provides non-stick cooking. Warm up the skillet to medium-high heat, add in a tblsp of oil or butter... Add in the rice (say one cup jasmine rice), stir the rice in the oil or butter, and saute over medium high heat until some of the rice begins to brown (most of the rice will not develop color at all), usually about 4-5 minues. Add in 1 2/3 cup of water, let boil, and then turn heat down to a very LOW simmer heat, and cover with foil & let simmer for about 20-25 mins. Do NOT peek!!! I usually turn the heat off at 20 mins, and let the rice continue to sit covered for about 5-10 more minute.

Now, the water content in rice is important when it comes to sticking. Many recipes recommend cooking rice at a 2:1 ration, meaning 2 cups of water for every 1 cup of rice. When I have followed those recipes, I learned that the rice always develops a crust at the bottom and seems to stick to the skillet. And the rice was always too "mushy" as it was high in water content. It took me a while of trial and error to perfect my rice recipe, and it works well cast iron skillets, and the rice even is not as sticky as it would be if you followed the instructions on the packaging. This rice cooking technique also works using any cookware over the stove top, and you can also substitute the rice with beef or chicken broth for added flavor.

My last recommendation is to always keep your pan seasoned. What I do is this... After I cook, I wash the pan (no soap of course). Then I dry it with a paper towel, and place the dry pan back on the stove. I turn the heat up to medium high, scoop out some vegetable shortening and rub it all in the interior of the pan... Just enough to lightly coat the interior. Once the pan starts to get really hot, I take the pan off the heat just before it gets smoky. I let it sit to cool down.... And voila - the pan is seasoned! Periodically I also rub shortening on the whole pan (inside and out) and place in a hot oven at 375 for 30 mins, when I feel that the exterior needs to be seasoned again. After the 30 mins, turn the heat off and continue to keep pan in the oven until it becomes completely cool again.

Hope these techniques help you!

[krbtv]

Thanks for the tip about eggs being at room temperature!

[Politeness]

Popcorn76: "I must say that when it comes to eggs, you have to be careful. Eggs MUST we warmed up to room temperature before plopping them in the skillet. If you take the eggs out of the fridge and immediately break the shell and put the eggs in a hot skillet, they will ALWAYS stick and it can get quite messy. So always let your eggs warm-up to room temperature and make sure the skillet is preheated on medium heat."

P76, your experience is your experience, and I do not doubt it; but it differs completely from ours. Four or five mornings per week we fry eggs for breakfast on a cast iron skillet, and we take the eggs straight from the refrigerator to the skillet. (We do always preheat the skillet before frying eggs.) The fried eggs never stick, ever.

[mateo21]

I agree, Politeness. I do eggs in a small CI skillet 4-5 times a week and they come straight out of the fridge and into the pan -- they slide (yes, they really do!) right out of the pan :)

[Mr Taster]

Wow, I have never had that experience with my Lodge frying pan. The eggs stick every time. Does the cooking surface of your pan actually have a slick, nonstick feel to it? Mine has a tacky, sticky feeling.

Mr Taster

[Passadumkeg]

It should be very slick. Sounds like you need to scrub w/ soap and hot water to get the sticky off, then re-season the pan in the oven.

[Beckyleach]

Re-season at a hot enough temperature to EXCEED the smoke point of whichever oil you are using, as well. You *must* burn off the oil and turn it to carbon in order to avoid the tacky-sticky oil finish.

[Passadumkeg]

You betcha!

[Politeness]

Holy thread revival, Batman! The surface of our skillet is slick as a greased frog. Nothing tacky in our kitchen. [grin}

[epabella]

i don't believe in a pot or pan of all trades but cast iron comes close. some might say it's travesty but for fast and high heat to sear meat, i get better results from a visions cookware pyrex type skillet. it transfers heat much faster than any cast iron i have. you have to watch closely when searing with it though and it also lets go of the heat so much faster too.

[sm1nts2escape]

It sounds to me like you have learned to cook on light weight non-stick and you are not use to cooking on a heavy metal.I wouldn't diss cast like that being that you only just started using it.I have been using cast since I started cooking and will tell you that a nice #8 skillet will cook just about anything.I have no fear of cooking with heavy tomatoe sauces or baking anything.If you are burning while baking then it's the oven or temp your cooking at and not the cast!I use it as a skillet,a baking dish and a dutch oven.Proper seasoning wil let you cook anything.After I use my iron I ussually just clean it with a sharp metal spatula then wipe everything out with a paper towel then put some butter in it and heat it up on med till the butter melts and burns out all the water then wipe it down with a paper towel again.If I cook with a heavy tomatoe sauce or cook rice then I will sometimes wash with a mild soap and wipe with a rough sponge and rinse with hot water then oil it.Basically you should oil your pan after every use.You only get pitting from cooking with highly acidic foods if you burn them in the pan witch would be setting of fire alarms or leaving the acidic food in there for storage.I think cast is the best and would like to try cast enamelware for a dutch oven and casserole.Good luck anyways!

[Ambimom]

Cast iron is indestructible, amazing, and non-stick, but the bad news is that it does require a learning curve. The good news is that while learning, the cast iron won't be destroyed.

It should be cleaned of food residue after use. (lots of tools, lots of methods. Pick the one that works best for you. I use either a plastic scraper or wire brush)

Pre-heat pan on low heat before cooking. Depending on pan, can take up to 5 minutes which can seem like an eternity when you are hungry.

A few drops of oil is always a good thing but unless you are actually frying, the less oil the better.

Eggs should be cooked on low heat.

A properly seasoned pan (used for several months at least) can cook tomato sauce and even be rinsed in soapy water....just rinse in plain water and wipe dry immediately to remove any residue.

Don't give up on cast iron.

[chuckl]

good advice, Ambimom. I've had some success cleaning cast iron with kosher salt, just sprinkling a small amount in the dirty pan and cleaning it with a scrubbie. Seems to work pretty well without diminishing the seasoning.

[meowzebub]

I'm wondering why you have to scrub your pans. If you're cooking on low to medium flame (and once cast iron is up to temperature, that is what you should be using) AND allowing the food to caramelize, there is no sticking. In fact, if the food is properly browned in any kind of pan, there is going to be minimal or no sticking.
NOTE: Every time you scrub cast iron, you remove the seasoning. Ditto for using soap (does not leave a soapy taste unless you're not rinsing well).
It's ironic that people buy non-stick cookware because the coating actually prevents proper caramelization (to get it up to temperature, you need to heat the pan to the point where the coating deteriorates and gives off toxic fumes), so, 90% of the time, you need to spray or oil the pan to prevent sticking. Crazy.

If you're done with cast iron and want to try stainless, remember to heat the pan, THEN lay the meat in the bare pan, or add a thin layer of oil for veg/other foods. For meat/poultry/fish, let it brown whereupon it will release from the pan.
For the veg/other, pay attention to your food; it will tell you through sight or sound whether it needs stirring, et c.

I suggest you're ranting against an item you haven't been using properly. Perhaps you might try the tips and suggestions in these replies before you condemn your purchases. But buying a whole "wardrobe" of cast iron without any experience, and now, considering a very expensive new copper "wardrobe", leads me to believe you're more likely to keep jumping from one quick fix to another.

[Mr Taster]

I never heat my clad frying pan without oil.... the oil tells you when the pan is the right temperature. Sometimes the pan is ready when the oil shimmers, and sometimes when it just begins to smoke. Depends on the oil and what you're cooking. If you add cold oil to a hot pan, it's a guessing game.

Mr Taster

[elmbow]

New here and still trying to figure out how the posts work. I will challenge anyone who uses dutch ovens to use any processed oil to season their oven, put it away in storage for 4-5 months and then take a whiff in the springtime when you pop the top, It will be rancid. A previous poster commented that animal fats will go rancid. 'Tis the other way around. Oils turn rancid over time in cast iron. Now do the same thing with shortening or lard, Not rancid after long term storage. I don't understand the chemistry, My uncle was a founder of IDOS and I learned this from him 35 years ago. Don't believe me? Try it for yourself and see. Yes, cast iron cookware can be reasonably seasoned in a very short time and the process continues to build over time. But anyone who declares that the shiny, black, smooth as teflon patina that cast iron is known for will develop in anything less than years of continuous use has never seen such a pan. I have a 14" oven inherited from my mother, it is at least 60 years old and so shiny black you can see to shave in it. I have ovens that have been in constant use for 20 years and are (still) only approaching the patina of that older one. Use soap and detergents at your peril! The non stick qualities of an old black iron skillet are far superior to any any non stick coating. Sourjacks, hashbrowns, meats, doesn't matter.

[Beckyleach]

You said: But anyone who declares that the shiny, black, smooth as teflon patina that cast iron is known for will develop in anything less than years of continuous use has never seen such a pan"

Hmmm...I have a #8 large block logo Griswold skillet that I STRIPPED down to the bare metal with lye, and re-seasoned only once (but at very high temps, wiping occasionally) and the surface is like black glass. I did this in March of this year.

(and that's just one example....I've seasoned about 20 other skillets since then, and many are just as nice. A lot depends on the age and finish of the cast iron in the first place; older skillets and cast iron were machine polished by hand before leaving the factory.)

[elmbow]

I'm curious, how long did you soak in the lye solution? I've always used high heat to burn out old build up. The old smoother pans and ovens will certainly patina up faster than the new rough stuff, but .....it still takes a long time to get the patina I'm talking about.

[Beckyleach]

When the solution was new (early this summer) I could get really thick crud (so thick it obscured the Griswold logo on the bottom, for instance) off in just a few days. Lately, I've been having to leave things in for up to a week...the cooler temps (my set up is in an unheated shed) slow down the action of the lye, as well.

Some people have told me that they've forgotten to fish out their cast iron before winter and found things the next spring that still were just fine. As long as the pieces are completely submerged, they don't rust. And apparently lye does NOT corrode cast iron at all. Woe to she who puts in aluminum or many other metals, though...or enamel!

[Beckyleach]

Oh! Forgot to add: I always leave the iron in long enough so that every bit of the burnt on carbon and whatever washes off in the sink with just a little scrubbing. I end up with bare iron that has to be oiled immediately, if I'm not seasoning it right away, so that it doesn't rust.

[powillie]

If your castiron smells bad after a 4-5 month storage, it wasn.t clean when you put it away.

[Chemicalkinetics]

Just want to say something "smart ass". In my experience, cast iron and carbon steel are incredible cookware material. So for the last 2400 years+, we did not really improve our cooking material? Sure, we refine them, but there is not dramatic improvement.