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Dovetail Walk-Out

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chadradchad Apr 18, 2008 11:59 AM

We made a reservation a week ahead for 9:15 and received a call asking if we could push it back to 9:30. We arrived at 9:30 and the host asked us to wait on the side, stating our table would be ready shortly. He then told us to move to the bar (very narrow, tiny 4 seat bar) and order a drink while the table is being set. Not ready for a drink, we stepped over to the side of the restaurant, he gave us a look. Around 15 minutes later, he told us that our table was ready. He brought us down to the basement (where there are 4 tables) and sat us in a round 8-top. The waiter came over and snidely said, "isn't it great to have room to spread out in New York City for once!" We were disgusted, who seats a small party at the biggest table in the restaurant. There was no warning of the table, or was there, "this is the only table that is ready for now..would you like to wait for another one." We then all got up and walked out of the restaurant as one person in our party spoke with the host. I heard about rude New York service, but this pushed the limit! We walked over to Eighty-One and told the host our story and were treated to AMAZING SERVICE. Not normally a ranter, but this was over the top!

  1. g
    gloriousfood Apr 22, 2008 07:38 AM

    "I heard about rude New York service, but this pushed the limit! "

    If this is "pushing the limit" for you, then you've been very fortunate in your restaurant experiences.

    2 Replies
    1. re: gloriousfood
      g
      ginsbera Apr 22, 2008 07:43 AM

      that made me chuckle a little bit, so true.

      1. re: ginsbera
        s
        Scotty100 Apr 22, 2008 02:51 PM

        This is quite funny...a 15 min wait and a bigger table...

        Was it the OP's first time dining out in manhattan?! Gimme that horrible treatment anyday...:)

    2. m
      miss_bennet Apr 21, 2008 09:43 PM

      I'm afraid I just don't understand this. You were seated at a table within fifteen minutes of your reservation in Manhattan. You had more than enough room at your table. I don't see how "isn't it great to have room to spread out in New York City for once!" can be snide in any way. I think it's more a case of the server trying to make the best of what was a bad situation.

      In fact, do you really think that a busy restaurant would deliberately seat a four-top at a table for eight? There's no way they would want those seats to go to waste. They made a decision to accomodate your party as quickly as they could, knowing they would lose four dinner receipts. The waiter tried to appease your party in the way he/she best knew. They had the courtesy to phone and ask to push back the reservation when they knew they could not uphold it instead of making you wait when you got there.

      Yes, this was an unfortunate situation, but "rude New York service" that "was over the top?" I think your expectations may be "push[ing] the limit[s] " a little.

      2 Replies
      1. re: miss_bennet
        c
        chadradchad Apr 22, 2008 04:59 AM

        This may have been a situation that you would have had to be there. I do not want to feel like I am doing a restaurant a service by paying $90 a head when I do not feel comfortable. I think many people forget to realize that you are a PAYING customer. One should not pay for services they are not satisfied with. Thus, I find it perfectly acceptable to walk if you do not fit in. If the restaurant was truly busy, they could replace that table in heartbeat.

        1. re: chadradchad
          m
          miss_bennet Apr 22, 2008 09:26 AM

          Oh, I believe quite strongly that custmoers are customers, whether they're right or wrong. I am not afraid to "let my feet do the talking" if need be. Saying what you just posted is reasonable. But the original post had a giant "does not equate" neon light flashing above it.

          I understand that internet speak leaves something to be desired. I'm glad you enjoyed your evening at another restaurant.

      2. podunkboy Apr 21, 2008 06:43 PM

        I don't think I'll ever dine at a top restaurant in a big city - I don't know how to behave when confronted with rude server behavior. I'd probably take the 8-top table, and then just work the server to death all dinner long.

        1. b
          BKAL Apr 21, 2008 07:42 AM

          I went with wife a month or so ago. Had made reservation weeks in advance via opentable. We arrived and they too brought us downstairs. It was a two-top table at least, but the other than that the cavernous room was set for 2 very large parties. Was completely ridiculous! We were wedged in between these 2 tables set for 8 or 10 each.
          Whne we asked to be moved and they did - to a nice table upstairs. Meal was good, etc. But was a little put off that they even tried to seat us down there! They should reserve crappy places like that to walk-ins.

          2 Replies
          1. re: BKAL
            Cheflambo Apr 21, 2008 01:18 PM

            OMG ... I cannot believe all the whining here. You complied with their request to move the reservation 15 whole minutes and were rewarded with twice the amount of space you usually get in a NYC restaurant. You had to wait a few minutes in a safe spot, but you decided to put yourself in the way (for the above noted holding-my-breath reason, Im guessing). Not ready to drink? Order a soda or fizzy water -- which would probably be compt anyway. Then you decide to walk out rather than negotiate for another, better table? If I were this resto's MOD, and the server assigned to that table, I'd be glad to see you go.

            1. re: BKAL
              m
              marcia Apr 21, 2008 05:37 PM

              I completely agree, Walk-ins definitely shouldn't be treated as well as those with reservations because, as we all know, their s&*& doesn't stink.

            2. jfood Apr 20, 2008 06:22 AM

              There are a million stories in the naked city.

              The resto did a bad job on this reso from the beginning and when the snowball started downhill, well you know the ending. But this is not a catastrophic or worst story winner. Just a series a bad decisions and try-fors on the part of the resto and the MOD.

              When the call came to move the reso to 930, the antennae should have gone up. That is in the same vein as "the people at your table have just received the check." Usually a bad sign. And while you were sitting at the bar the resto thought that they had it under control. Once you "stepped over to the side of the restaurant" the dominoes started falling. MOD thought let's get this party a table and he gave you what he had. Seeing a standard 60" round table (jfood assumes from the 5 foot statement) you could have said that this was not acceptable. Then the waiter doubled-down with his stupid/cute (depending on your point of view ) comment, hence the last domino fell. And jfood thinks you did the correct thing in leaving. You would not have enjoyed the meal no matter what at that point.

              So jfood thinks the resto did a number of unfortunate things, but when their hand was forced by your leaving the bar the MOD went into hyper-try-for. You could have just said "No" upon seeing the 8-top. Jfood is not blaming you AT ALL, just stating what he thinks how people react. Jfood would be interested what was said between the MOD and your colleague on the way out.

              Was it "over the top"? can't really get there. Was this a very inexperienced MOD who tried to see if he could think out of the box? Probably, but unfortunately in your, and jfood's, opinion he failed miserably.

              Give the restaurant a call and explain what happened and see what they say. You never know. they may have been put in a bad situation by other diners that night and unfortunately you took the brunt.

              1. hotoynoodle Apr 19, 2008 09:57 AM

                the phone call asking to nudge your reservation was unusual, but my impression is that the restaurant was overbooked and trying to juggle parties. it also prevented what could have been a 30-minute wait. you waited only 15 minutes to sit, which isn't outrageous in my book. table-turns don't always run like a swiss watch.

                i also don't understand why the restaurant should apologize for seating you at a large table. when pressed, i will put 4's on 8-tops and never once has anybody complained. it certainly seems preferable to being squished on a table too small. would it have been impossible for you to say, "gee, we'd prefer something more intimate. how long would the wait be for a smaller table?"

                it never ceases to amaze me what people perceive as personal affronts.

                10 Replies
                1. re: hotoynoodle
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                  chadradchad Apr 19, 2008 11:18 AM

                  There was indeed shouting between me and the other parties. I would say there was a good 5 foot distance between two diners. They made it feel like it was a privilege to be in their restaurant. I have been to many fine dining establishments and have never heard this tone being used. It made me not want to return to Dovetail.

                  NB: The reservation was for four.

                  1. re: chadradchad
                    hotoynoodle Apr 19, 2008 01:34 PM

                    so you were seated at a 20-foot table? wow.

                    ;)

                    1. re: hotoynoodle
                      BobB Apr 23, 2008 09:08 AM

                      Could have been circumferential distance. 20 ft circumference = <6.5 ft diameter.

                  2. re: hotoynoodle
                    MMRuth Apr 19, 2008 01:42 PM

                    I have to say, while I don't take it as a personal affront, I really do dislike being seated at a table that is far too large for the party. It often takes away from the ability to converse in a normal, unforced fashion, and does completely change the dynamic, IMHO. Actually, the more I think about it, the more strongly I recall how unpleasant it can be. I'll try to pinpoint more why ... but, as a diner, I, at this point in my life, unless I was really terribly keen to try the food at a place, would refuse the table. And, I'm generally not at all a picky restaurant diner.

                    1. re: MMRuth
                      hotoynoodle Apr 19, 2008 01:56 PM

                      and as a paying guest, you have every right to refuse a table, provided you are willing to cool your heels and wait for another. the op was seated within an acceptable amount of time relative to the reservation, and because they didn't like the table, walked. not much of an opportunity for dovetail to make any sort of gesture.

                      recently, we had a very busy night booked. reservations were all counted and the floor plan mapped. tables set with menus, wine lists and appropriate number of settings. between 5:45 and 6:15, i had 4 empty tables for walk-ins. an older couple walked in. i showed them to a nice 4-top. they wanted a booth, but i had reserved requests for the few booths. i showed them to another 4-top, explaining how busy we were, and i'm giving them a very nice table. the man very loudly called me a b***h, right in the middle of the dining room. they stormed off, saying they would never return. honestly, i'm fine that. what a jackass, ok?

                      other seated diners were shocked by the man's behavior and praised my composure.

                      in my estimate i had done the best i could to accommodate that couple. in their mind, i was unreasonable. two sides to every story, i guess, huh?

                      1. re: hotoynoodle
                        MMRuth Apr 19, 2008 04:01 PM

                        That does sound like a nasty customer! And I really was just commenting on my view generally of being seated at a table being intended for a much larger group than my party, rather than referring to what the OP did etc.

                        If I have a reservation for four, and "fulfill" my side of the bargain by showing up on time, confirming the reservation if needed etc., being shown to a table that seats 8 really would not, from my perspective, be the restaurant fulfilling its end of the bargain, and I think a restaurant should realize that. I know that yes, they are giving a table that can seat 4 people, but it would honestly affect my enjoyment of the evening for the reasons I stated above.

                        In my home, I adjust the table size depending on the size of the party and the ambiance I want to create, and the table size does contribute to the ambiance. It would surprise me if restauranteurs didn't realize that as well. Of course, I do understand that sometimes restaurants get squeezed for space etc., but I would certainly expect an apology or a "we're terribly sorry, but the only table we have is for a larger party, do you mind?" if seated at a table for 8 with a party for four. One thing I see a lot in New York is tables for 4 (square) that can be converted to larger tables by putting larger rounds on top to accomodate larger parties.

                        Edit - I wrote this quickly and it's not meant to sound confrontational etc. - just thought it might be useful for you, since you're in the business, to know that there are some customers who really don't like it when this happens - I'm actually amazed that you've never had anyone say anything about it.

                        1. re: MMRuth
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                          Le Den Apr 19, 2008 05:28 PM

                          To the OP: When the host asked you to wait at the bar you chose to wait somewhere else, probably in a traffic lane which inconvenienced other diners (no one asks guests to wait where they will be in the way, but guests often choose those spots specifically to be a problem and get seated quicker--sort of like threatening to hold your breath until you pass out). This spells difficult customer and they seated you asap at the first table available and away from the majority of guests because they expected trouble. You fullfilled their expectations.

                          And once seated, why not move your chairs closer together?

                          In all my years in the restaurant industry, I have never had guests complain about a table being too large. Too small, yes...but never too large.

                          1. re: Le Den
                            j
                            jp62 Apr 19, 2008 07:52 PM

                            I agree with Chad. 4 people at and 8 top is wack! I would have demanded to be seated at the very narrow 4 seat bar!!

                            1. re: jp62
                              c
                              chadradchad Apr 19, 2008 09:12 PM

                              There wasn't a bit of room at the bar! It was a four top! We were on the side away...

                            2. re: Le Den
                              MMRuth Apr 20, 2008 04:18 AM

                              My issue with this is that, while it's fine at a long rectangular table, where you can seat two people across from two people and just ignore the rest of the empty table, at a round table, even moving the chairs closer to one another, you still end up with the awkward situation where it is difficult for the two people sitting at either end to, respectively, converse with one another, or for that matter, the person two people down from them. It is interesting to me that those in the industry have never had complaints about this.

                    2. e
                      eyesofahost Apr 18, 2008 10:26 PM

                      From the view of a Host:

                      You never mentioned how many people your reservation was for, it makes a difference if you were like a party of 5 on a round 6-8top or a party of 4 on a round 6-8top as opposed to a square table. Most NYC restaurants don't have tables sized for 5-6 people and then tables sized for 7-8 people. The round tables in NYC restaurants are all the same size for parties of 5-8 people.

                      1 Reply
                      1. re: eyesofahost
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                        LIHCREVCO Apr 19, 2008 09:00 AM

                        a lot of restaurants use big tables in an extra room to support walkins or accidental overbook resy's. This sounds like your resy might have accidentally taken or they had trouble turning tables throughout the evening. Also eyesofahost is correct they don't really make big enough or small enough tables to handle 5-6 people, so this may have been the size of your table no matter where you were sat.

                      2. b
                        beachmouse Apr 18, 2008 04:47 PM

                        Call me a claustrophobic hayseed, but I actually find it kind of nice when the table ends up being bigger than the party. As long as you don't feel like you have to shout to get heard at the other end of the table, I'd rather to feel like I was free to spread out a little at the table without infringing on others' space.

                        1. a
                          andymadrid Apr 18, 2008 01:27 PM

                          I hate it when you have a reservation, you arrive on time, and then you are rewarded by being shown the bar in order to pay for expensive drinks you never asked for in the first place. If I wanted to go to a bar, then I wouldn't be at your restaurant because I would be at a bar.

                          1 Reply
                          1. re: andymadrid
                            Miss Needle Apr 18, 2008 04:01 PM

                            Many restaurants comp drinks for the diners in situations like these. Don't know if the OP had that happen to him though.

                          2. g
                            ginsbera Apr 18, 2008 12:27 PM

                            maybe its just me, but that doesnt sound terrible, especially not walk-out worthy. I guess it's one of the you had to be there situations.

                            3 Replies
                            1. re: ginsbera
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                              chadradchad Apr 18, 2008 12:42 PM

                              Yeah, I am not normally a walk-out type of guy. But we just sensed this rude tone and we weren't ready to spend money at a place that made us feel uncomfortable.

                              1. re: chadradchad
                                m
                                MomoMed Apr 18, 2008 01:25 PM

                                In what world is that NOT walk out worthy?

                                Just to clarify, you made a reservation and the restaurant actually called you to push back the reservation?

                                1. re: MomoMed
                                  g
                                  ginsbera Apr 18, 2008 02:07 PM

                                  the whole calling to push back the reservation is not a good thing, but at least they called. It could have been found out upon arrival. My whole thing was, the poor seating at a very large table didn't seem walk out worthy, but then again I wasn't there and can't get the tone of voice from the servers through an internet posting....at the same time, we pay for a service and expect a certain level when prices are high, as they are at Dovetail. With that said, they should have handled the situation better and the manager should have done something to remedy the problem.

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