491823 Thu Feb 21 06:28:47 -0800 2008 23 31 Home Cooking 0 3419906 I am a little confused. I am new to cooking and thought cooking with olive oil was healthy. But then I read something about smoke point and olive oil not being good to cook with. What is true? When do you use olive versus canola versus vegetable oil? Thanks! Thu Feb 21 06:28:47 -0800 2008 167525 cafe 1 3420040 Different oils have different "smoke points" (which is the point at which oil starts smoking, and that's not a good thing). Olive oil has a low smoke point, which means that it starts smoking at a lower temperature than oils like canola, vegetable, and peanut oil. IIRC, peanut oil has the highest smoke point, and that's why it the best to use for deep frying or stir frying, where you want to cook fast at a very high temperature. Olive oil is great for cooking if you're just sauteeing at a lower temperature. Vegetable oil imparts some flavour to food, canola is more neutral. Different olive oils will impart different amounts of flavour. In general, the more "green" the olive oil is (more virgin), the more flavour it will impart, and the less useful it is for cooking with heat. Save extra virgin olive oil for mixing into a vinaigrette or tossing with some cooked pasta. Use more golden olive oils for cooking. If you want to do some frying at a higher temperature, use canola oil. I also use canola in my deep fat fryer because I don't want to pay the high price of peanut oil, and I don't really deep fat fry much. :) Thu Feb 21 07:13:22 -0800 2008 3419906 119275 Morganna 1 3420052 Olive oil is great for cooking and is much healthier than most other oils, though as you read, it does have a lower smoke point (the temperature at which it starts to burn) than canola. I think it's about 375F for olive oil and 475F for canola. So you wouldn't want to use olive oil for deep-frying or other high-heat cooking such as browning chicken thighs. Thu Feb 21 07:16:00 -0800 2008 3419906 29811 Buckethead 1 3420312 I use olive oil for all kinds of cooking except deep frying and stir frying. Thu Feb 21 08:35:03 -0800 2008 3419906 63569 flourgirl 1 3420329 I use olive oil almost exclusively for cooking--sauteeing, in marinades, greasing a dish. Not the extra virgin--that doesn't get heated. And not in baking yet, though I have a recipe for an olive oil cake that I am interested in trying. Thu Feb 21 08:38:28 -0800 2008 3419906 20522 gourmanda 1 3420344 Olive oil is healthier than other oils at room temperature because it is loaded with monounsaturated fat. However, when heated it quickly breaksdown into saturated fat, which not healthy at all. Also the flavor is destroyed at higher temps. As the others suggest, canola oil is good for frying. I only cook with olive oil if I am doing a low temps prep like sweating onions. For anything hotter, use a little canola oil and save the olive oil to drizzle on the food as a finishing touch so you get the flavor and the good fat. Thu Feb 21 08:41:57 -0800 2008 3419906 130031 Shane Greenwood 2 3421634 I'm pretty sure that the notion of it breaking down into saturated fat is a myth. As to flavor, absolutely a premium extra-virgin olive oil will lose its flavors w/ heat. For everyday cooking the refined and filtered product that is just called "olive oil" or "lite olive oil" doesnt'thave much flavor to lose, but is still healthy. "Virigin" oil has some flavor uncooked and is also fine for cooking. Thu Feb 21 13:22:55 -0800 2008 3420344 20522 gourmanda 3 3425698 Here's a website addressing some of the myths about olive oil: http://www.oliveoilsource.com/cooking_olive_oil.htm Fri Feb 22 16:26:42 -0800 2008 3421634 130031 Shane Greenwood 4 3425787 Olive pomace oil and virgin olive oil are both highly monounsaturated oils and therefore resistant to oxidation and hydrogenation. Studies have shown oxidation and hydrogenation occurs to a lesser degree in olive oil than in other oils. But in any case, the amount of hydrogenation is miniscule and no home cook would ever experience this problem. Fri Feb 22 16:54:31 -0800 2008 3425698 168587 JackDunkin 4 3426788 You just proved my point that olive oil does not break down into saturated fat. Thank you. Sat Feb 23 06:07:08 -0800 2008 3425698 20522 gourmanda 4 3432159 The website you posted contradicts your claims. Mon Feb 25 08:39:39 -0800 2008 3425698 43893 C. Hamster 5 3433745 Yeah, just providing a link with a little more information on the subject in the spirit of the discussion board. Not trying to provide evidence for a claim. Looks like I bought into some of the myths. Sorry if that confused you. Mon Feb 25 14:41:15 -0800 2008 3432159 130031 Shane Greenwood 2 3421899 1. Olive oil when heated does not "quickly break down into saturated fat." That's completely untrue. 2. The flavor is not "destroyed" at higher temperatures. Higher temperatures do compromise the taste of the oil but the degree to which that happens is a function of both the temperature and how long the oil is heated for. You certainly retain much of the taste of a good extra virgin olive oil using it for a quick sautee. Thu Feb 21 14:27:10 -0800 2008 3420344 43893 C. Hamster 1 3420354 Here is a list of different smoke points for different oils: http://www.cookingforengineers.com/article/50/Smoke-Points-of-Various-Fats I use EVOO when I want the flavor but if not, extra light is cheaper and is fine for regular use (greasing pans, cooking at higher heats, in a rich stew where you won't taste it, etc.). Thu Feb 21 08:44:50 -0800 2008 3419906 39874 chowser 2 3421906 That is a great website. I was going to post that chart which I have used for a few years. Thu Feb 21 14:29:02 -0800 2008 3420354 41679 Den 1 3420479 I use extra virgin olive oil for almost everything. I use peanut oil for stir frying and pan frying. Very rarely use canola if I want a neutral taste. Mario Batali insists that the smoke point of olive oil is high enough to allow it to be used for even deep frying, which he claims to do. Also olive oil and canola oil are vegetable oils. All oils made from vegetable matter are. Usually what is labeled as "vegetable oil" is safflower oil or a mix. Thu Feb 21 09:08:24 -0800 2008 3419906 43893 C. Hamster 2 3421537 Most labels on vegetable oil that I have seen (Wesson, Crisco, the 5 gallon bottle at the Chinese grocer) have been soybean oil. In fact, years ago I had an Asian recipe for crab cakes that called for soy oil. So, down to the Asian grocer I go. Search and search, can't find it, have customers helping me look, no one can find the elusive soy oil. I asked an employee who points down the aisle to the bottom shelf, "soy oil" he insists. I pick it up and the label says "vegetable oil" and I look all over for the ingredient list. Finally I find it. . .written in black ink on a navy blue label: Ingredients: soybean oil. THAT was frustrating! Thu Feb 21 13:06:55 -0800 2008 3420479 20522 gourmanda 1 3420792 Olive oil is great for cooking. Light olive oil is good up to 450F or so, so it's suitable for all applications. Extra-virgin oil (especially unfiltered) will start to smoke at lower temperatures (325-400F, depending on purity), but it's still good for everything but stir-fries and deep frying. The real issue is the cost / benefit analysis--extra virgin oil ranges from a little bit pricey to extremely expensive; it makes sense to use cheaper stuff when the flavor of the oil isn't a major factor in the finished dish. As far as the smoke point goes, it's easy to tell when you've overheated your oil--you'll see wisps of smoke start to rise from the pan. Personally, I use light olive oil (in the big metal can) as my primary cooking oil, a moderately-priced extra-virgin oil for cooking things like sauces where more olive flavor is wanted, and a bottle of full-flavored unfiltered extra-virgin oil for drizzling, dipping, etc. I also use quite a bit of canola oil (when a neutral flavor is important), and keep grapeseed oil around for very high-temperature applications like stir-fries. Just remember, when it comes to cooking, there are two rules: (1) Don't sweat the small stuff, and (2) everything that doesn't cause injury to person or property is small stuff. Keep a fire extinguisher handy, handle your knives safely and don't let raw poultry come into contact with your salad greens. Beyond that, experiment. Anybody who hasn't had to order a pizza after ruining dinner isn't cooking hard enough. Thu Feb 21 10:20:57 -0800 2008 3419906 58743 alanbarnes 2 3420914 "Anybody who hasn't had to order a pizza after ruining dinner isn't cooking hard enough." Your whole post is great, (I do the same thing with using various kinds/grades of olive oil for different purposes) but the last line is just priceless advice. I remember being very disheartened many years ago whenever I had an outright failure in the kitchen. I finally came to understand that anyone who is interested in expanding their cooking horizons will inevitabley have that occassional total failure. (Not to mention the more frequent times when I try something and although it comes out OK, it may not be something I'd care to make again.) Thu Feb 21 10:48:35 -0800 2008 3420792 63569 flourgirl 1 3421841 Obviously this is all about personal preference .I grew up on recipes with Crisco (veg shortening) or animal lard, butter and the generic "vegetable oil". After years of trying the latest new oil/fats, I tend to rely on 3 for most applications. Unsalted Butter, Extra Virgin Olive Oil and Canola Oil. Now I always stock: A medium priced brand of of extra virgin olive oil, good plain unsalted butter and a bottle of Canola oil. Olive oil tastes great and is one of the better fats. Canola is also seen as one of the healthier oils. Butter is added for taste. Of the three - Canola, EVOO and Butter, Canola can take the most amount of heat for frying. Thu Feb 21 14:09:54 -0800 2008 3419906 136893 Springhaze2 2 3426512 Don't have time to expound on oils, but I did want to add my two cents on an oil that has not been mentioned yet on this thread - sesame oil (not the toasted kind, which is meant for adding at the last moment like extra virgin oil). Sesame oil has a relatively high smoke point, and unlike canola oil, adds a very delightful taste to foods. I almost always use it in my stir frys. Although rapeseed oil also has a high smoke point, I don't care for its taste nearly as much. Avocado oil, I believe, also has the highest smoke temp point, but is also very expensive. High oleic safflower oil has been made with seeds specifically made for a higher monounsaturated content, and can be heated up to a high temperature. (I think the brand that makes this is Spectrum.) Don't forget about coconut oil. Lots of myths about its unhealthiness. Do some research on the oil and you will read about its benefits (i.e. why have southeast asians been using this oil for years in their cooking but didn't experience clogged arteries supposedly bound to happen according to the experts in the US some years ago?) Ayurveda views sesame oil, coconut oil, and ghee as healthy oils to use. In moderation of course, and according to one's body type so as to maintain the balance. And don't forget about the need to account for cold/expeller pressed oils vs. refined oils. Some cold/expeller pressed oils are much better than refined, in certain uses, whereas the refined is better in other uses. I like to look at this topic in terms of the effect it has had on the peoples who have used these oils in history. I also look for certain brands of oils. When I go to a place like Whole Foods, I trust that they carry only the better brands. I'm sure most health food stores also do the same. Trader Joe's has their own line of oils. Someone told me that their extra virgin olive oil is good. I've heard that some brands sold at traditional supermarkets use a process for making oil where the oil is heated to a very high temperature resulting in an unhealthy product. I'd spend an extra buck or two to get a better oil. I believe that one reason for heart disease and clogged arteries is due to not only eating too many fried foods, but using cheap oils that result in free radicals making havoc in our bodies. (To be on the safe side, for insurance, why not take at least 4 fish capsules or 1 tablespoon of fish oil, too?!!!) Fri Feb 22 22:41:09 -0800 2008 3421841 11936 FelafelBoy 1 3434120 I only use three kinds of oil for cooking, and that includes frying. 1. Peanut oil. High smoke point, flavorless, great for all types of food and especially good for stir frying. 2. Olive oil. Lower smoke point than peanut oil. Adds flavor, therefore not appropriate for all dishes. Don't waste extra virgin olive oil for frying. Just use "olive oil." 3. Drawn butter. (aka ghee, clarified butter) Lower smoke point than peanut oil, much higher smoke point than non-clarified butter. Long shelf life. Adds buttery flavor. I especially like it for steaks, seafood and vegetables. Oh, and I do use sesame oil for flavor but not for frying. Mon Feb 25 16:18:09 -0800 2008 3419906 112096 Caroline1 2 3435076 Caroline1 - you may be using products of a very different nature than I have used. Flavorless oils in my world consist of canola oil, safflower oil. Oils with flavor definitely include peanut oil, which is why I tend to NOT use that oil for stir frying. Its flavor is too bold for the taste I want from the stir fry. Sesame oil for me, imparts some flavor but less so than peanut oil. You say you add seame oil for flavor but not for frying. I assume you are referring to TOASTED sesame oil which is very different from refined sesame oil which can be used for medium high temperature frying and imparts a very pleasant flavor to the dish. Toasted sesame oil should not be used as a frying oil but rather as a flavoring. Mon Feb 25 22:10:18 -0800 2008 3434120 11936 FelafelBoy 3 3435094 I concluded many years ago that people's ability to taste is not the same in all of us. Whenever the family went to a Mexican restaurant and was served the standard chips and salsa, if my husband and daughter said it was mild, it would be too hot for my son or me to eat. The opposite was also true. That seems to be the case with your taste buds and mine. I find canola oil to have a very strong and unpleasant flavor, with saflower oil only a little less unpalateable. For me, peanut oil is tasteless. I do know I'm not the only one who complains of the taste of canola oil. I bought a small bottle recently to see if the filtering processes and flavor have improved. They have not and the bottle went directly into the oil recycling jug. And yes. Toasted sesame oil for seasoning. Mon Feb 25 22:28:04 -0800 2008 3435076 112096 Caroline1