482743 Thu Jan 24 15:58:15 -0800 2008 15 35 Beer 0 3329528 I'm thoroughly enjoying a Green Flash Imperial IPA which just came to NY on the heels of Alesmith Yule Smith, which I also found to be exceptional. In fact, I've been thinking that while I've tried many great and not so great IPAs and Double IPAs from across the U.S., it seems that every one I've tried from California has been, at worst, way above average, whether it be Alesmith, Russian River, Moylan's, Bear Republic, Stone, etc. What is it about California brewers that enables them to produce such great beers of this style? Thu Jan 24 15:58:15 -0800 2008 63942 Psychobabble 1 3329619 Practice. Thu Jan 24 16:17:35 -0800 2008 3329528 10809 Josh 1 3329684 We also grow great hops out West. Thu Jan 24 16:35:27 -0800 2008 3329528 27514 shellshock24 1 3331890 Brewers (and drinkers) that aren't afraid of hops? On the east coast most IPA's are made to be "balanced" (which means way too much malt character to me) and English/German hop varieties are commonly used along with US hops. West coast breweries (and ipa drinkers) seem to prefer (I know I do) hop forward beers utilizing mostly US hops which give them a citruisy character. Fri Jan 25 09:38:11 -0800 2008 3329528 12014 LStaff 1 3335386 An aggresive approach to hops combined with the hops from the west coast and northwest that makes them so great. Luckily, here in east coast, we have victory and dogfish to get our fill but having recently been to sandiego, the stuff they make is truly off the hook. Sat Jan 26 11:15:29 -0800 2008 3329528 101707 yankeefan 2 3335498 Glad you enjoyed your San Diego beer experience. Check out what's happening this week: http://www.sandiegobrewersguild.org/calendar.php#sdbg20 Sat Jan 26 11:53:35 -0800 2008 3335386 10809 Josh 1 3337387 As others have indicated, it is a stylistic difference and whether it is better or not is a matter of what style you prefer.. Like New World wines, the style tends to be a more aggressive, less balanced approach than traditional IPA's. Having said that, I am in the fan category Sun Jan 27 08:40:01 -0800 2008 3329528 11309 tomritza 2 3339354 Balanced is kind of a relative term, IMO. Balanced is only meaningful measured against what you're used to. If you eat a lot of spicy food, for example, your perception of a dish with balanced heat is going to be quite different than the perception of someone who never eats anything hot. Sun Jan 27 20:32:44 -0800 2008 3337387 10809 Josh 3 3340455 And a lot of people trot out the balance canard when they want to disparage a hop forward beer they dislike. Mon Jan 28 08:56:27 -0800 2008 3339354 87015 bigchow 4 3340521 "balance canard" So you don't believe a beer's flavors should be balanced? Personally, I don't think that balance in brewing or wine-making is a canard. Well-made, balanced products exist and are usually the best in their categories. Unbalanced often means (though not exclusively) one-dimensional. If that is what one is looking for, that is what one is looking for. Simply because one is not looking for that, doesn't mean that the concept that a well-made balanced beer is the apex of the brewer's art and science is a lie. Another poster gave the examples of spicy foods. Simply because one prefers foods out of balance as to the amount of spice, does not mean that a balanced presentation should be any different to them. They should recognize that they prefer their foods not balanced, but instead over spiced. Mon Jan 28 09:12:52 -0800 2008 3340455 26666 FrankJBN 5 3341060 You're missing my point completely. One person's balanced is another person's out-of-balance. There's no absolute measurement of balance, no golden ratio that can be applied. Your comment about spicy food is especially strange. Who determines what balanced spice levels in food are? Take something like Indian food. If you eat Indian food made by Indian people, for Indian people, it's typically quite spicy by Western standards. Are you going to say that Indian people prefer food that's "out of balance" because it's too hot for Western palates? Mon Jan 28 11:08:45 -0800 2008 3340521 10809 Josh 1 3341628 What I enjoy about the West Coast IPAs (opitomized by Bear Republic's Racer 5) is the biscuitiness and butteriness that melds with the hoppiness. This creates layers of texture. I'm not sure what causes this but I'd love to know. Mon Jan 28 13:08:37 -0800 2008 3329528 26180 Chinon00 2 3342170 I think balance is all in the eyes of the beholder. I assume its the type of hops that are coming from the west coast and that are used, but hell- I know they taste good and thats what matters, right? Nothing better than dry hops though, yum. Mon Jan 28 15:17:46 -0800 2008 3341628 101707 yankeefan 3 3374867 Well as they say; anyone can throw hops in a kettle. I think there are some standards for balance, most people will agree when a beer is well balanced, or not. Thu Feb 07 14:59:25 -0800 2008 3342170 163246 tofuburrito 1 3380008 California's brewers have left much of the rest of the US (not CO., though) in the dust, for some reason. I speculate that Californians were some of the first to taste modern IPAs, what with Liberty Ale, Celebration Ale, and Hop Ottin' -- and the style, thankfully, took hold. Now CA. is infested (I mean that in a good way) with great IPAs and 2IPAs; they're ubiquitous. Once one tastes a truly hoppy IPA, it's hard to turn back to the timid, diffident examples of the style that are fashionable elsewhere. A lot of the so-called East Coast IPAs just don't taste like IPAs to me. Sat Feb 09 07:37:02 -0800 2008 3329528 90936 Kenji 2 3380944 Diffidence and timidity in beer, as well as wine, food, art, etc, has its benefits, I've found (particularly for those who accept the challenge of it). Sat Feb 09 14:27:29 -0800 2008 3380008 26180 Chinon00