480053 Wed Jan 16 15:04:00 -0800 2008 73 31 Home Cooking 0 3302471 Reading the thread on chicken stock, I'm curious as to how many of you make use of your chicken after stock. I do have problems throwing away food, and use the leftover meat (kind of devoid of flavor) for curry chicken salad (the curry helps to add flavor), chicken noodle soup (Korean style with lots of gochu garu, garlic, sesame oil, soy, scallions) and chicken a la king (with lots of veggies/no dairy) served with brown rice. Wed Jan 16 15:04:00 -0800 2008 10763 Miss Needle 1 3302526 My stock is cooked so long, the taste is cooked out of the chicken by the time it's finished. I DO eat some of it, right out of the pot, but then the chicken is strained out, along with the vegetables and herbs, and tossed. Wed Jan 16 15:18:24 -0800 2008 3302471 49600 CindyJ 1 3302547 I only use carcasses/bones with the occasional wings, so there isn't much meat at the end of the process. I have picked a few pieces off and given them to my cats, but they sniffed and walked away. Wed Jan 16 15:24:32 -0800 2008 3302471 22220 Kelli2006 1 3302557 I use backs and assorted trimmings (wing tips, etc) so I don't bother worrying about any meat left over. I used to make stock from chicken thighs that I cooked for my elderly cat, in which case I gave the cat the meat, but, sadly, the cat is with us no more. Wed Jan 16 15:26:41 -0800 2008 3302471 18353 DGresh 1 3302571 I use the carcass of a roasted chicken, so there's no waste. Wed Jan 16 15:32:07 -0800 2008 3302471 11995 pikawicca 2 3302574 I wish I could do that but DH has a great talent of picking the bones clean. Wed Jan 16 15:33:23 -0800 2008 3302571 10763 Miss Needle 3 3302681 Use the clean bones, the stock will be excellent. Wed Jan 16 16:01:53 -0800 2008 3302574 80141 ccbweb 3 3302711 A lot of the "good stuff" in stock comes from the bones and joints, so it shouldn't matter if your chicken carcass is picked clean. After roasting a whole chicken, I take whatever meat is left off the bones, then throw the bones and skin into a crockpot. If there's meat on the bones, it's because I'm too lazy to pick it clean rather than for flavor. Wed Jan 16 16:09:01 -0800 2008 3302574 42944 leanneabe 4 3302784 When I was younger I used to make chicken stock from the cheap chicken bones I would find at Chinatown butchers. However, I find that the taste is not the same as when making it with the whole chicken. I also throw in a package of chicken feet. Makes a huge difference in the product. Perhaps I'll throw in some roast chicken bones along with a whole chicken in my stock next time. Wed Jan 16 16:25:59 -0800 2008 3302711 10763 Miss Needle 5 3303054 You might make a test batch in which you pull the whole chicken out after 30 or 40 minutes of simmering (at which point the meat should be cooked through but not dried out), pull the meat off the bones and return the bones to the pot for the rest of the simmering time. I say "test batch" because you might find that you get nicely cooked chicken and stock that suits your taste or you might have a batch that doesn't have the flavor you like...but at least you'd still have nicely cooked chicken. This is what I do when I'm making stock starting with a whole chicken for some reason. Wed Jan 16 17:49:22 -0800 2008 3302784 80141 ccbweb 4 3602771 I have not tried making stock in the crockpot. I was thinking that I should first bring everything to a boil and then transfer to crockpot but that sounds messy. I'm worried that it will take crockpot a long time to get hot enough. I have the All-Clad one and there are 2 temps, high and low. What do you do? Thu Apr 17 00:13:00 -0700 2008 3302711 12520 walker 5 3602877 I put it all in in the morning and it's ready by the end of the day. I'll even put in frozen chicken carcass and/or frozen roasted wings, not defrosted. If you want it to come to temperature faster, you could add boiling water instead. Thu Apr 17 04:24:24 -0700 2008 3602771 39874 chowser 6 3604106 Should I use High or Low setting on crockpot?Thanks. Thu Apr 17 10:57:51 -0700 2008 3602877 12520 walker 7 4629410 I use low. Sun Apr 26 07:05:35 -0700 2009 3604106 11995 pikawicca 8 4629787 I do crockpot as well at times and use low setting. I use not just bones but a variety of chicken and I usually save the chicken add some pesto and make a great chicken sandwich. I'm sure it isn't as good but to me it is just fine. Sun Apr 26 10:05:03 -0700 2009 4629410 232829 kchurchill5 2 4632766 Same here and flavour of the brown stock is AMAZING! Mon Apr 27 11:10:07 -0700 2009 3302571 224081 BamiaWruz 1 3302600 Brillat-Savarin has this screed in his "Physiology of Taste" in which he rails against the practice, common in rural France, of eating the bouilli (the boiled meat) along wth the bouillon, saying that such meat has become completely devoid of nutrition and is now only valueless stomach-filler, and indigestible besides. I think of this every time I'm going through the chicken carcasses I've just pulled from my latest batch of broth, digging out all the cooked gizzards, the necks, and those weird organs inside the pelvic bone, and eating them...yum, yum. Now, I never make stock or broth from whole chickens, unless I'm poaching a chicken for salad or some other dish, and in that case the broth is very light and the chicken just cooked through. I think if I wanted to make a stronger broth in this case, I'd serve my poached chicken, then save the carcass, and return it to the broth along with some more vegetables and simmer that until it's extracted what it can. There are recipes for baked chicken, dating from when people had to use old hens for Sunday dinner, wherein the chicken is "boiled" (actually simmered), either stuffed or unstuffed, long enough to make a decent broth, then taken out, buttered well, and baked. The broth is used to cook dumplings or noodles, then thickened to make gravy...but that's a bit more down-homey than what you're looking for here. Chicken's cheap, and very hard to make truly inedible, so if I were you I'd experiment. Starting with the chicken covered in cold water yields the best broth at the expense of flavor in the meat; starting with a larger and more mature chicken also gives you both more meat and more flavor, so don't waste time and energy on little fryers - five pounds is a good size. I'm with you on the wasting-food problem; recipes that tell me to cut out the best bits and discard the rest, for instance, make me crazy...or at least exacerbate the problem! Wed Jan 16 15:40:06 -0800 2008 3302471 11478 Will Owen 2 3302880 Sigh -- as I only use organic chickens, making chicken broth is not what I'd call cheap, I'm afraid. One batch usually sets me back about $20. But I squeeze whatever I can out of the chicken by simmering it for at least 12 hours. Wed Jan 16 16:52:24 -0800 2008 3302600 10763 Miss Needle 3 3302900 Well, for heaven's sake, roast the chicken, eat the meat, and make stock from the remains. Wed Jan 16 16:56:59 -0800 2008 3302880 11995 pikawicca 4 3302910 As I noted above -- for me, the bones alone aren't enough for a chicken stock. While bones add depth, meat adds a lot of flavor to the stock. Wed Jan 16 16:59:45 -0800 2008 3302900 10763 Miss Needle 5 3413430 Brown the bones and the veggies in a hot oven first, that adds a lot of flavor. I only use the carcass, and my stock is always flavorful. I also leave the onion peel on the onion. And before someone else jumps all over my back and says that makes it bitter, I don't find it to be true at all. This can be a tough crowd, which is sad. Tue Feb 19 11:26:24 -0800 2008 3302910 123480 scuzzo 6 3413672 I always leave the peels on my onions in stock. As I use chicken stock for both Asian and non-Asian recipes, I wanted to keep it as neutral and light (but rich) as possible. While I agree that browning the bones and veggies first will add more depth of flavor and color, I don't think that's the type of flavor I'm going for here. But next time I'm making stock for something like chicken noodle soup, I will definitely roast first. Tue Feb 19 12:21:53 -0800 2008 3413430 10763 Miss Needle 6 3600050 i do the same scuzzo Wed Apr 16 10:07:57 -0700 2008 3413430 96253 chocabot 3 3302905 If you have your mind set on using whole chicken, I'd take it out when it's cooked, remove the meat and then add everything else back in. I wouldn't do anything with chicken meat that's been simmered for 12 hours. Wed Jan 16 16:58:11 -0800 2008 3302880 39874 chowser 4 3302936 Yeah, maybe I should just give it up and throw out the meat. I know it has the texture of wood. That's why I use a lot of other stuff like spices to cover up the taste (or I should say lack of taste). Growing up with parents from the Korean War (and with my dad being North Korean), I was taught not to waste food. My dad still refuses to throw out food, even if it's spoiled. Wed Jan 16 17:07:51 -0800 2008 3302905 10763 Miss Needle 5 3303018 What's he do w/ the spoiled food??? Just curious. Wed Jan 16 17:37:21 -0800 2008 3302936 71241 lynnlato 6 3303440 He will eat it. And he doesn't get sick. He's pretty resilient. Wed Jan 16 19:55:35 -0800 2008 3303018 10763 Miss Needle 7 3304148 Wow... an iron stomach, as they say. I've always thought I have one too. But I don't test it's limits too much. :-) Thu Jan 17 06:37:58 -0800 2008 3303440 71241 lynnlato 4 3303060 Ah, I've just repeated chowser's advice above. It's good advice. Wed Jan 16 17:50:17 -0800 2008 3302905 80141 ccbweb 4 3303977 Agree with chowser. And it's a terrible waste of good, expensive chicken meat. For goodness' sake, take the meat off the bones when it's just cooked, then return the bones to the pot. You can then use the meat for your chicken soup or for other dishes. I use roast chicken carcasses for my stock. I freeze them, and the bones from other chicken dishes, until i have a lot, then I make stock. If I really think there's a need for meat, I'll buy a bag of wings and add them. Thu Jan 17 05:10:09 -0800 2008 3302905 14139 Kagey 5 3416077 I also use wings in my stock and, if I have no carcasses, I'll sometimes use only wings. I find that, after 1h30 simmering away, the meat on the aileron bone (the bone closest to the breast when the wing is still attached) is still soft and juicy enough to eat, add to the finished soup or make into chicken mayo sandwiches. I think it's because it's so close to the bone, and protected by thick skin and fat. Chicken wings give a lot of gelatine too, incidentally. Wed Feb 20 06:46:35 -0800 2008 3303977 10431 Gooseberry 1 3302692 Like all stocks, my chicken stock starts with roasted bones and a minimum of meat. If there is a significant amount of meat left, I do the Japanese Depression era thing--eat with a bit of soy (and hot) sauce and hot rice. Wed Jan 16 16:04:12 -0800 2008 3302471 36661 Sam Fujisaka 1 3302737 When the boulli is cool enough to handle I pick the meat off the bones and give it to Molly, my German shepherd mutt, who has been standing next to my right knee watching me hungrily as I pick. Then I throw the rest away. Wed Jan 16 16:13:50 -0800 2008 3302471 76480 ozhead 1 3302824 If I do use a fresh whole chicken, I pull the chicken breasts out and take the meat off about 20 - 30 minutes into the process, at the point where the meat is just perfectly cooked and useable for chicken salad, etc, or I will save the meat to be added back later into a finished soup. The rest of the parts (bones, skin, etc) which are most important for the flavor stay in the stock. Wed Jan 16 16:37:18 -0800 2008 3302471 150115 Mellicita 2 3303023 How long should a chicken be cooked for stock anyway? One famous author has you simmer the bird for hours. When our brother cook heard that he was horrified. He said an hour or so should do it. Our cook in another monastery simmered the chicken for a little over and hour, removed the breast and leg meat and turned that into chicken salad or baked it into chicken-stuffed bread rolls. (When she was in a hurry, she'd used Pillsbury rolls.) And Elizabeth David, in one of her books, inveighs against overcooked bones in a broth. Maybe we need a thread on the best way to make chicken broth? And, by the way, what do you do with the fat? Wed Jan 16 17:38:32 -0800 2008 3302824 53369 Father Kitchen 3 3303083 If I've been careful while making the stock, the fat will solidify at the top of the container after being refrigerated overnight and will be quite "clean." I spoon it off and put it in a container and freeze it. It's the perfect start to a roux for gravy or sauces or gumbo or what have you. I think the longest I've cooked a stock at home was about 8 hours and I didn't think it was overcooked. No meat to speak of in that one, all the bones/carcases of roasted birds. Wed Jan 16 17:53:23 -0800 2008 3303023 80141 ccbweb 3 3303983 Ha! There have been a million threads here about how to make a chicken stock or broth. I agree with your brother cook. I use formerly roasted carcasses and cook for about 2-3 hours on a very slow simmer. I skim the fat, usually while simmering, because I like to hang around the pot. I have once or twice saved some of it to make matzoh balls. Thu Jan 17 05:13:49 -0800 2008 3303023 14139 Kagey 3 3715702 I used to simmer for hours but have found that 1-2 hours is quite sufficient to develop good flavour. The meat still has good chicken taste and texture and gets used in the broth itself, in chicken fried rice, dumplings, chicken pot pie, mixed with mayo for chicken salad, and as a treat for the cat. The schmaltz gets skimmed and saved the next day, depending on whether or not I have an ample supply of duck fat in the fridge. Fri May 23 13:36:00 -0700 2008 3303023 42449 mrbozo 1 3303492 I also use only the bones of a picked over chicken in my stock. Maybe sometimes I will throw in a few chicken breasts during the middle of the cooking cycle if I want to make something like chicken salad or chicken pot pie. But I take those breasts out when they are done, and remove all the meat; returning the bones back to the stock. I've been using the crockpot to make my stock; so much easier and cheap! I throw away all the solids, bones, vegetables, herbs, etc, when the stock is done. There is no flavor left in them; it's all been transferred to the stock. Wed Jan 16 20:15:46 -0800 2008 3302471 95489 mschow 1 3303497 I occasionally taste the chicken while it's in the pot and when it is at the point where it is about to lose it's flavor completely--and therefore adding nothing to the stock--I will remove it and pull all the meat off and then return the carcass to the pot. The meat is perfect for soups, a la king or salads. Wed Jan 16 20:18:22 -0800 2008 3302471 158133 marentarro 1 3303505 Having tried it both ways... I think the best chicken soup is made with a whole chicken. I toss the entire thing into the pot and go from there. I usually brown it first and then add the veg & water. As for the leftovers: I pitch the vegetables, shred the meat, and use it for chicken pot pie, kreplach, to supplement the ground turkey in white chili, to add back to the soup, for chinese chicken salad (tossed w/ homeade vinaigrette first). It's not that flavorful, but it's definitely useful, and if you season it you can definitely use it. Although many people make a flavorful broth with bones, I personally feel that the meat adds the extra oomph needed and makes for a richer, more flavorful soup. I do occasionally take the meat out after 2 hours +/- and leave the bones for another hour or so. Wed Jan 16 20:22:35 -0800 2008 3302471 121685 doc_k55 1 3303646 Use the leftover meat in quiche or a chicken casserole. Wed Jan 16 21:18:44 -0800 2008 3302471 11583 ipsedixit 1 3303917 maybe i'm wierd here, but i love dipping pieces of the long simmered chicken in salt and eating it that way...definately something i'd never serve to anyone, but i do enjoy these bits in private company. Thu Jan 17 03:48:10 -0800 2008 3302471 18608 sixelagogo 2 3312914 My DH and I are on the same page with you... Sat Jan 19 18:21:24 -0800 2008 3303917 10378 RWCFoodie 1 3304025 If using chicken, I use cheap chicken--the market across the street from me sometimes does sales of dark quarters, with the backs for 39 or 49 cents a pound. I pull the fat off and save it to render chicken fat. I eat a little of the chicken and toss the rest, typically, due to the blandness. If I can get ahold of enough necks and backs, I pull of the gobs of fat and render it. Don't have to worry about the chicken, then. I don't actually use much chicken fat in cooking, but occasionally, particularly in some holiday cooking, generally when browning onions for chopped liver, I use it. A container lasts forever in the freezer and can be re-frozen, and I have made use of the fat that I would not be putting in the soup pot anyway, as the amount of fat that comes on the bones is way too much to put in soup. Thu Jan 17 05:41:26 -0800 2008 3302471 117292 Shayna Madel 1 3304103 It's really a waste of food to use chicken for stock, as opposed to bones. Roasted bones are your best alternative, or bone a chicken using the carcass and wings for the stock and save the breast meat, legs and thighs for other uses. There is a great poached chinese chicken technique that I used to use when I had a fresh chicken: Boil water in a large pot, place the entire chicken in the pot, bring the pot back to a boil for 15 minutes. Shut the heat off and leave the chicken covered in the pot for an hour.Take the chicken out and you can put the meat aside, (best to let this cool), then use the bones and other ingredients to make stock. Thu Jan 17 06:20:55 -0800 2008 3302471 16841 Felixnot 2 3306113 maybe i'm wrong, but i'm assuming that ms. needle was refering to those bits and pieces of chix meat that hang around the carcass and can only be removed once the carcass has been simmered for a long long time. Thu Jan 17 14:42:14 -0800 2008 3304103 18608 sixelagogo 3 3306209 No. I guess I'm in the minority here. I'm talking about an entire whole chicken. I know it costs a lot, but the broth I get out of the whole chicken/chicken feet is so aromatic and rich. I could just drink it the way it is with no adornment, maybe with a few sprinkles of salt. And this is why I hate using canned/frozen/boxed broth. I only do it in emergencies. I think the next time I make stock I'll try a couple of new things. I'll try taking out some of the chicken meat after about an hour. I've already saved the carcass from my roast chicken I cooked on Tuesday night. I'll add that to my stock to make up for taking out the chicken early. Felixnot, I've done that Chinese poaching chicken thing to make Hainese chicken rice. Love the silky smooth texture of the chicken meat that results from the process. I've used the broth to make the rice. Perhaps I'll try adding my old roast chicken carcass to that as well. Thanks! Thu Jan 17 15:13:12 -0800 2008 3306113 10763 Miss Needle 4 3306251 Around here, if I am lucky, as I said above, I can sometimes get chicken really cheap, in fact cheaper than necks and becks and backs only. I just don't have much use for the boiled chicken after a day or two, so I do prefer to use necks and backs from a waste standpoint. I accumulate the wing tips and the backs from when I buy dark quarters with the backs or whole chickens in between my soup cooking and I add them to the pot, either way. It's quite interesting to read this thread and also the one going on about the matzoh balls and an earlier one about chicken livers and see how differently people make things that I used to assume everyone made pretty much the same way. I am going to think about the chicken feet thing--maybe I will try it, depending on the price. Thu Jan 17 15:26:33 -0800 2008 3306209 117292 Shayna Madel 4 3312249 Miss Needle, may I please interject a note of thanks for your description of that Chinese poaching method, which I'd either not heard of or forgotten. Yesterday afternoon I brought a gallon or so of water to the boil and put a 6 lb. chicken into it with some salt, and proceeded as you described. If you are anywhere near Southern California, you may have felt a small earth tremor last evening. That was me falling off my diet... Thank you! I did, by the way, debone and skin the meat, and put those things, the wingtips and the pope's nose back into six cups of the broth, and simmer that for about two hours more. Gonna be lovely soup. Sat Jan 19 13:28:17 -0800 2008 3306209 11478 Will Owen 5 3312333 Felixnot deserves the thanks, not me. Yeah, chicken prepared that way is absolutely delicious. I've got to do it sometime again. Sat Jan 19 14:08:10 -0800 2008 3312249 10763 Miss Needle 1 3306314 1. you can partially break down your whole chicken before making stock-- remove the breasts, either boneless/skinless, or perhaps as supremes (skin-on, incl. the first bone of the wing), and save them for a nice dinner, & use the rest of the carcass for stock, supplementing w some extra wings & backs, feet etc if you want. ime the stock does not suffer significantly from the lack of breast meat, and it is the most expensive, and most versatile part of the chicken. 2. you can alternately remove the breasts from the stock after 25 mins or so depending on size of the chicken, this meat should be nicely poached for a salad, return rest of carcass to stock 3. it won't win any prizes, but you can remove any other large chunks of chicken stock meat after 40 mins-1 hour, shred, & fry with a bit of chorizo or bacon, & some aromatics & spices, and use this in mole or other well-flavored sauced comfort food preparation, stuffed inside a burrito, in a spicy potpie, in a stew with lots of parsnips and mushrooms. . . to avoid disappointment the meat should not be the primary or central component or flavor of the dish, it's mostly flavorless, but if you kinda think of the meat in the same way as tofu, dependent on the flavor of the sauce rather than possessing any flavor of its own, you can come up with something passable. i use organic chickens in stock too. it bugs me no end to waste expensive meat. i get extra backs and parts for stock from the farmer when i buy the chickens, "cannibalize" the carcasses for the cuts i desire, & try to use everything. still working on it. Thu Jan 17 15:54:15 -0800 2008 3302471 46030 soupkitten 1 3306517 I almost always boil a whole chicken for stock, because I find the flavor of the stock richer and more concentrated than just bones, roasted or not. The meat from the whole chicken is pretty bland when it's cooked up, though. I do also like to dip a little in salt and put it on a saltine for a small snack, but the rest I usually chop up and mix with my dog's food along with the carrots from the pot as well, and a little stock. They like it. Of course, they eat sticks and gumballs off the sweet gum tree, so I don't think we're talking about terribly refined palates here. Thu Jan 17 17:22:09 -0800 2008 3302471 49971 Andiereid 2 3306572 I was going to say the dog thing, but I didn't want anyone to pick on me. We had to give our family dog boiled chicken and rice when we were trying to figure out if she had a food allergy...Alas, I don't have a dog anymore. Thu Jan 17 17:43:55 -0800 2008 3306517 117292 Shayna Madel 1 3312970 I use the soup chicken to make chicken pot pies, chicken enchiladas, chicken salad or chicken croquettes. Sat Jan 19 18:49:55 -0800 2008 3302471 11776 dmjuli 1 3412692 Well, I wanted to thank all of you for your input. It was time to make chicken stock again and I reevaluated my technique. I threw an organic chicken and organic chicken feet in water with onion, celery and carrots, slow poached it for two hours, removed only the chicken meat and simmered the bones and the feet for 24 hours. While it isn't as good as simmering the whole chicken for that time, it was a pretty good compromise. The meat still has some flavor and am eating a couple of pieces in a Chinese-style noodle soup as I'm typing this. I couldn't add any old chicken carcasses as I don't make chicken broth all the time (a batch will last me for months). My carcasses got such nasty freezer burn. Perhaps I should buy a vacuum sealer in the future. Tue Feb 19 08:51:06 -0800 2008 3302471 10763 Miss Needle 1 3412784 I was making stock the other day for the umpteenth time and, for no particular reason, I decided to check out what Judy Rodgers has to say about it. She recommends using a whole chicken, with head and feet, and removing the breast meat (but not the skin) for another use. I was headed to Chinatown anyway, so the head and feet part was no problem. I'd always used a whole chicken without head and feet before, but never again. This was the best batch of stock I've ever made--and, I had two skinless, boneless chicken breasts to cook as I pleased. She also says that if you have a "dressed" chicken (no head/feet) you can "make up the balance" with wings "which deliver bright flavor and viscosity" but says not to supplement using backs. She doesn't explain why, but I assume backs don't "deliver" what wings do. Tue Feb 19 09:13:42 -0800 2008 3302471 11407 JoanN 1 3413582 I make stock with chicken wings, sometimes roasted, sometimes not, and I simmer for an hour, maybe 2 at the most. I use the meat off the bones in chicken enchiladas with a strong sauce. I also like to add sauteed onion and mushroom to the filling. I have an old chicken in my freezer I am planning to make stock out of, and will try some of the techniques here. Tue Feb 19 12:01:23 -0800 2008 3302471 86106 cocktailhour 1 3413775 Make a ramen noodle lunch adding the chicken meat and something green to the ramen noodles. Tue Feb 19 12:44:47 -0800 2008 3302471 57867 Gin and It 1 3413843 Guess I am lucky. I can usually find whole butcher chicken on sale for cheap. I like to cut up my own chicken. The breasts and thighs go in the packages we use for roasting, baking, etc. The backs, wings, legs and other trimmings go into a large container I keep in the freezer for making chicken soup. Many years ago I used chicken feet too, now they are impossible to find in central Ohio. I find that the "cheap" cuts of the chicken actually make much better soup. Growing up as the child of Holocaust survivors, we never threw food away either. But then, my mother doesn't live close enough to look in my trash can when I dispose of the long simmered and tasteless chicken. Tue Feb 19 12:59:50 -0800 2008 3302471 15139 Diane in Bexley 1 3413846 You could always use the bones and spent meat in a sort of "secondary" stock. You won't be able to use the second stock as a primary stock, but you can use it as the base of a new stock featuring fresh bones, vegetables, and aromatics. Many French cookbooks allude to this process. I believe it's listed in Keller's books as remouillage. R. Jason Coulston Tue Feb 19 13:00:02 -0800 2008 3302471 166350 Jason_Coulston 2 4629370 Ranhofer in _The Epicurean_ describes the remouillage, made by covering the remains of stock with water and simmering for another three hours, as a liquid not as rich as stock but richer than water as a liquid that can be used whenever you need to add a meaty flavored liquid to something. If one had large stockpots with spigots (so it would be easy to add more water after draining the stock) and not-quite-modern refrigeration as they did in Delmonico's in the 19th century, it seems like a very sensible thing to do, particularly in a restaurant where they've got stockpots going all the time. It's an idea I like, but I'm not sure I could justify the fridge space to keep remouillage on hand at home. As to the original question, I make chicken stock with raw chicken bones, backs, necks, gizzards, and carcasses, strain it, and then poach a whole chicken in the stock, which I'll use for chicken salad, soup, pot pie, or something along those lines. Then I strain, chill, take off the fat and render and strain the fat (which is the best for sauteeing onions), clarify the stock with egg whites, and then usually reduce it to consomme, so it doesn't take too much freezer space. Sun Apr 26 06:27:19 -0700 2009 3413846 198087 David A. Goldfarb 2 4629735 Out of curiosity, I checked the _French Laundry Cookbook_, and what Keller does is add the remouillage back to the original stock to increase the yield and reduces the whole mixture to about a quarter its original volume. That sounds like a viable idea at home. I'll try it next batch. Sun Apr 26 09:39:17 -0700 2009 3413846 198087 David A. Goldfarb 1 3599660 What is going on here- don't waste another meal. After you make the chicken soup take the onion, celery, carrots, etc. and chicken, season, put in roasting pan and roast till brown. Some of the bones are so soft you can eat them-just make sure to drain everything so you don't have any liquid in the roasting pan. and in that way you have an extra meal. Make a salad and oven potatoes. Enjoy! Wed Apr 16 08:26:46 -0700 2008 3302471 174387 ydelle 1 3599888 chicken salad works Wed Apr 16 09:30:54 -0700 2008 3302471 135229 thew 1 3599949 Whenever I spatchcock a chicken, I remove the backbone and the wing tips and put them in the freezer. I also save the gizzards, etc, and any excess fat. Then when I make stock using a carcass, I have some meat to add to it. You get a really rich flavor from the fat of the chicken, as well as the meat. Wed Apr 16 09:44:00 -0700 2008 3302471 80937 danhole 1 3602705 My dogs love me. Wed Apr 16 23:02:38 -0700 2008 3302471 24417 Food Tyrant 1 3607212 I give a bit to my 3 cats and toss the rest Fri Apr 18 09:31:02 -0700 2008 3302471 180068 Smileelisa 1 3714021 I made my weekly chicken soup today and just found this thread. I realize it's a bit old. After many experiments with my greatest critics (husband and three boys), I have found that wings are great, with some drumsticks, lots of chicken bones and some extra necks thrown in. Dark meat seems to give more flavor and dry out less. I know using feet would be best, but I just can't do it. My Rabbi's wife gave me the best advice - bones, bones, bones! I also use a bit of tumeric - I read it somewhere and like the results. It doesn't flavor much, though gives nice color. I switched from using onions with the peel on to using tumeric. I use onions, carrots (okay, I cheat and use baby carrots, they are sweeter), and celery leaves only, not the stalks. Parsley and dill get added later in the simmering - preferably fresh, unless it's too hard to get. Our farm market doesn't always have dill, and I can't get myself to buy it in plastic packages for outrageous prices. I simmer for a long time; sometimes overnight if I start making the soup late. When straining, I find if I have the time, straining three times makes for better soup. I make big batches to freeze, so I get it over with at once. The extra chicken we end up with gets fought over, it still has plenty of flavor! We make chicken salad, or best of all, freeze it in zip-locks in portions just right for making chicken risotto. This is a favorite in our house. My sixteen year old makes it in the rice maker. Perhaps not authentic, but yummy. As for matzoh balls, we are a divided family. The kids like klunkers and my husband and I like them light! Mine always come out light, can't make a klunker for anything. Be well... Fri May 23 03:14:19 -0700 2008 3302471 191500 samsaulavi 1 3714046 You can do the Catalan grandmother trick which is to make croquettes or canelonis. This is the classic thing you eat on the day following Christmas lunch. Christmas lunch is Escudella (like Bollito Misto--big cauldron of broth made with all sorts of animal parts, including chicken, and vegetables). The day following is St. Estaban--or as I refer to it, St. STEVE day--you have caneloni and croquettes which uses the leftover pieces of meat. For croquette, you take the meat, mix with flour, water and egg/milk, form small balls, coat with flour and pan fry. If you add yeast to the mixture, you can make bunuelos, which is lighter. You can add onions, a bit of sauteed bacon to add flavor as well. Caneloni is the Catalan version of Lasagna...it is dosed with bechamel sauce. Again, you can introduce more vegetables and bacon to add more flavor. Fri May 23 03:57:27 -0700 2008 3302471 23630 mielimato 1 4629447 Flash! My new chicken stock method requiring much less cooking time. I've been buying pairs of birds that come with the visceras, necks, and feet (!) for roasting. After roasting, I de-bone the drumsticks and wings as cleanly as possible and save in the freezer. The day I get a new pair of birds, I toss the gizzards, livers, hearts, necks, feet, and roasted bones from the last pair and some salt, pepper, a garlic clove, and a small onion into a pot with just enough water to cover and simmer. I take out and eat the gizzards, liver, and hearts with my daughter after 15 - 20 minutes and let the rest simmer for only 20 minutes more, skimming any foam and clarifying as needed. The feet provide plenty of gelatin. The roasted bones provide flavor. The quick & concentrated stock is not quite as good as looooong simmered - but saves energy and thereby reduces greenhouse gas - and is very good for 95% of my applications. And no meat is wasted in the process. Sun Apr 26 07:26:56 -0700 2009 3302471 36661 Sam Fujisaka 2 4629734 I would love to get a "whole" chicken with the feet still attached. I saw that in one of my non-American cookbooks and thought that would be so cool! I will just have to live with buying chicken feet from the Asian market. I use a crockpot for stock. Fairly low energy I believe and the stock can simmer on the counter while I'm sleeping or at work. Sun Apr 26 09:38:35 -0700 2009 4629447 173425 Jen76 3 4629774 Or sleeping at work. Sun Apr 26 09:56:20 -0700 2009 4629734 36661 Sam Fujisaka 4 4630768 Haha...never! ;) Sun Apr 26 17:37:23 -0700 2009 4629774 173425 Jen76