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Jewish Deli-Triangle Area ??

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I recently moved to Raleigh from Cleveland, Ohio and I am seeking a good jewish deli serving all the comforts of home. Looking for corned beef, chopped liver, potato latkes, matzo ball soup...

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  1. Sorry, Hallie. It doesn't exist. Period. Several of us have hashed out this sad topic in the past. When I moved here three years ago I had the same cravings. You have to book a JetBlue flight to NYC. Sigh.

    3 Replies
    1. re: klmonline

      I still can't believe we don't have a decent deli in Raleigh, especially given the number of NY transplants who have moved here. I would LOVE a bowl of matzo ball soup on a rainy day like today!

      1. re: Suzy Q

        Hallie;; now is the time to plan a trip to Myrtle Beach, as there is Jerusalem Restaurant there and it sounds great. Glatt Kosher too!
        They have Gus' pickles at Weaver St. and make chopped liver on Jewish Holidays at Whole Foods, veg & liver. I had it on Hannukah. But most Jewish people here eat healthily...I make Sephardic food for the holidays. So I think that's the problem;-)

        1. re: Rory

          I think I have seen Gus' pickles at Whole Foods.

          BUT...my favorite pickles are the ones sold at the Carrboro Farmer's Market. AWESOME. Try the Russian pickles. My favorite pickles ever. not sure they are kosher, but dang...they are tasty.

    2. Wonder why Horowitz's closed?

      2 Replies
      1. re: cackalackie

        Not sure but many of us still mourn its passing. I still have cravings for their overstuffed rare roast beef on rye...

        1. re: kgb1001001

          I don't know, we stopped going there after my wife returned her blintz for being moldy

      2. I was told not long ago that there is a Kosher/ethnically Jewish shop in the Hope valley area of Durham (in a shopping center), and I believe its still running, but I cant say for sure if its a deli, or simply a shop with various and sundry cultural or religious items...

        1 Reply
        1. re: TSQ75

          Here's the mini-report I wrote up on that place shortly after it opened. I haven't been back, so I don't knwo if they have expanded or added anything. But it was a small specialty grocery store only... No dining.
          http://www.chowhound.com/topics/32608...

          By the way, for convenience of reference, here are the other threads I know of on this general topic:
          http://www.chowhound.com/topics/341539
          http://www.chowhound.com/topics/326084
          http://www.chowhound.com/topics/379773

        2. I recently posted about DaVinci deli in North Raleigh. They carry the same meat Neil Horowitz used to serve at his dear departed deli. It comes from New York and I've tried pastrami and corned beef and they're as good as I can get. In the same shopping center, there's a Fresh Market and their New York seeded rye is the real deal. So the best I can do for you is recommend you do it yourself, at least until there's a real Jewish deli here and I don't have to call in favors just to get a jar of Hebrew National mustard.

          1 Reply
          1. re: yahooer

            Thank You Yahooer, as a fellow N Raleigh transplant I have been sorely disappointed. I think you may have saved me.

          2. Serious success... Finally!

            There is a relatively new deli in the north of Raleigh serving meats and cheesecake imported straight from the Carnegie Deli in NYC! It is called "From NY With Love" and is located a bit off Falls of the Neuse just north of 540. The place is a family-owned business and is not a chain.

            They feature the usual suspects, including properly steamed pastrami and corned beef - just warm enough. The Jewish rye was soft and tasty and the deli mustard was the right kind. Unlike the Carnegie Deli, you don't have to pay the giant prices and get the giant sandwiches. They offer three filling sizes at different prices.

            My SO had a chopped liver sandwich (one of the vanishingly few places around here where you can get one). The liver was a bit firm and cakey... It could use more schmaltz (fat) to moisten and sweeten it. Other than that, the flavor was fine.

            The display case held several of the traditional Carnegie cheesecakes and pies, including their famous 5th Avenue Pie. We didn't partake tonight. The menu also advertises home made chicken soup with matzoh balls and optional noodles, so you can come down on whichever side of the debate that you favor.

            They do various omelettes for breakfast (served all day), but no matzoh brei or blintzes. Oh well... You can't have everything. The cooler is stocked with Dr. Browns for quenching your thirst appropriately.

            It's a small place, maybe 8 tables done in a formica diner style. The owner said they do a pretty good catering business to local companies.

            They also opened a smaller counter operation in the Cary Town Center food court. It has a more limited menu and little appeal for the kids looking for cheap pizza and Asian steam tray food. Pity.

            The web site (still under construction) is http://www.fromnywithlove.com and the map page only points to the Cary shopping mall location. But the menu shows the full offerings at the "real" location.

            The address is 10511 Shadowlawn Dr., Suite 119. That's in a shopping center. When you enter off Shadowlawn, drive all the way around the traffic circle to the strip of businesses on the far left. That will make sense when you get there.

            I have a lot of trips still to come so I can check out the corned beef, matzoh ball soup, and other offerings. But just having Carnegie pastrami available locally is a major victory.

            Here's the location map on MapQuest: http://tinyurl.com/5y87uu

            Enjoy!

            -----
            From NY With Love
            10511 Shadowlawn Dr, Raleigh, NC 27614

            34 Replies
            1. re: klmonline

              Kimonline; youu made my new year:) also I appreciate your discussing the mustard etc it's so important. Now, are the pickles good? nice and sour.
              weirdly I had success with 'Rolands' made in India, tasted just like a 1/4 sour dill (got it at Big Lots)

              1. re: Rory

                Sadly, their pickles were not too my liking. Not crispy enough and full sour, rather than half-sour. I've tried Ba-Tampte brand jarred half sours and wasn't impressed. But my local Fresh Market (the one in Cary) carries K&Z brand half sours, and they are fantastic. Crispy with just the right seasoning. Like any good deli pickle, they don't last long in the fridge once opened, so eat them fast while they're still crispy. The bare-bones K&Z website is http://www.kzpickles.com if you want to see what their jars look like so you can spot them easier in the store.

                Happy New Year!

              2. re: klmonline

                I'm not doubting your experience and since I haven't made it over yet I can't offer an opinion on the food, but I find the menu a little scary, for lack of a better word. For starters, there's the name. So far from what I've seen in the last 20 years or so, any food establishment in the Triangle that uses the words "New York" or "Brooklyn" in their name wouldn't last half a day in the City. That being said, does the restaurant offer plain meat sandwiches or just the multi-ingredient combos I saw on their MoneySavers menu? Good meat should stand on it's own, without a lot of embellishment, and although I will put cheese on a meat sandwich, the idea of putting anything dairy on a pastrami sandwich just doesn't sit right with me.

                Do they have knishes? And most importantly, do they know that it's a capital crime to microwave them (many NY delis commit that offense, sad to say)?

                I understand the demands of the market, but I still feel a little uncomfortable with a "NY-style" deli that offers bacon, cheese on meat sandwiches, and ice cream. I'm sure I'll try it in the intermediate future, but for the next few weeks the matzah ball soup, brisket, and chopped liver will be homemade - in my home.

                1. re: rockycat

                  Hey, don't get me wrong... This isn't a New York deli! It is a Raleigh deli attempting to bring at least some of the items to the hardcore faithful that we want while attempting to survive in a completely different cultural setting. For most people in this area, "deli" means a place where you can get a sandwich with lettuce, tomato, and cheese on some slices of Boar's Head prepackaged meat. So I think their approach is probably sound from a pragmatic business perspective. Their menu as stands would not last half a day in the City. But no proper New York Jewish deli would last long here, I fear (more the pity).

                  I'll tell you that my pastrami sandwich was properly done. Just a bunch of thinly sliced meat piled on rye with some mustard. No embellishments.

                  As I said, they are definitely not a kosher restaurant, so they will mix dairy and meat with wild abandon for the people who insist on cheese to complete a sandwich.

                  I don't believe they have knishes. And if you are comparing any Raleigh commercial food establishment to your own home cooking of good Jewish standards, you are fooling yourself. This is as close as we've got in the area for the times when you DON'T want to do the cooking yourself. If you want to invite me over for homemade soup, brisket, and chopped liver I won't have to debate about whether I should go out to the deli instead! :)

                  1. re: klmonline

                    While a proper deli would be wonderful, I'll be ecstatic if they can deliver on good rye and good corned beef and pastrami!

                    It is getting to be a challenge finding a decent knish in NYC, let alone trying to find one outside of it!

                    Thanks for finding and reporting. The map looks like it is tucked away and wasn't the easiest place to stumble upon...I'm hoping to get up that way soon and try it!

                    If they have rugelach (a big "if "I know) as good as Russ & Daughter - I'll probably have to name my first born after the owner!

                    1. re: meatn3

                      Meatn3, Weaver St makes incredible rugalach. The best I've ever had.!
                      Russ & Daughter- now I'm nostalgic. But barely so. The new 2nd Ave Deli is bad, so I'm more than happy to find this in Raleigh. Thanks again kimonline for the link to good pickles. It's vital;-)

                      Now as for brisket. Cliff's Meat Market has organic brisket so of course it will be best at our house, served with gedempt potatoes and tomatoes and sauerkraut;-)
                      Thanks for the new year wishes and Happy New Year to other hounds!

                      1. re: Rory

                        Thanks for the tip. I'm still getting to know this area and have only visited the Hillsborough location. I didn't notice it there, but I wasn't really searching either...

                        I'm not familiar with Cliff's - another food field trip to do!

                        L'Shana Tova!

                        Now you have me thinking of honey cake! I haven't had that in years...

                        1. re: meatn3

                          Okay, so it's OT, but I never realized how many of us are landsmen. Given our underrepresentation in the general local population and our overrepresentation on this board, I wonder what that says about us as a group.

                          1. re: rockycat

                            that we're naturally smart to live in this area;-) warm weather, fab food.

                            Weaver St should also make honey cake. Just ask. Also they bake superb challah, round holiday ones. And carry kosher wine for the holidays
                            Cliff's Meat Market is in Carrboro
                            http://www.cliffsmeat.qpg.com/
                            L'shana Tova:) chowhounds

                            1. re: rockycat

                              That we gravitate towards written word even with our obsessions?

                              :-D

                              It does have me thinking that a real deli could have a chance - especially if the location had a strong lunch crowd, such as RTP.
                              It could become a huge regional draw too. Real deli is always at the top of my list when traveling.

                              1. re: rockycat

                                I'm still puzzled by the fact that you think you're underrepresented in the local population. Rarely a day goes by that I don't meet an import, and I can't tell you the last time I met a native.

                                1. re: Suzy Q

                                  Me thinks they were referring to the local Jewish Population not northerners/New Yorkers

                                  1. re: quazi

                                    Could be. I don't notice a lack of Jewish folks here, though, either. That's one of the biggest reasons it's always perplexed me that we don't have a good Jewish deli in town.

                                    1. re: Suzy Q

                                      when I first moved here, people heard my obviously-Jewish surname and kept asking me if I was "from New York."

                                      it took me a while to figure out what that meant. There aren't *that* many Jews here.

                                      1. re: tamalesfordinner

                                        Nah, there are plenty of Jewish people here.....Suzyq I think the lack of deli is due to the fact we don't eat like that any more..it's just way too unhealthful. My parents only see
                                        meat in our house for the New Year and Passover....so they're not rushing out
                                        to eat pastrami once a week like in the past.

                                        1. re: Rory

                                          A number a years back the Spouse and I were discussing how to help the owner of the now-defunct kosher Eshel market stay in business. Given the lack of a NY-style (read "Jewish") deli in the area, we thought he might expand to the space next door with a small sit-down food service area. He was already selling most of what he would need to stock the deli and the rest was easily available. The idea was quickly nixed since, for this person to do it, the deli would have to be truly kosher and we all agreed that by the end of the first week he'd be ready to shoot the next person who walked out because he couldn't get cheese on his roast beef sandwich.

                                          Granted, running a kosher and a kosher-style deli are two completely different animals, as it were. There just aren't that many delis anywhere anymore. If you check the Kosher board you'll find posters there assiduously searching for real deli in Brooklyn, of all places. It's just become another in the assortment of ethnic eateries. We all have many more choices than we did 20 or 30 years ago. It would just be a shame to see this style of fine fressing lost to the ages.

                                          I believe it was Neil Simon who wrote that he didn't realize he'd had permanent heartburn his entire life until he was drafted into the Army. There's nothing like some good ol', down home haimishe cooking.

                                          Shanah tovah, y'all.

                      2. re: rockycat

                        I went by this evening. I'm in complete agreement with klmonline's take on the sandwich. I had tender, well flavored corned beef, the mustard had a nice kick, the rye very fresh and lightly seeded. I ordered the small (3 sizes) and it was a respectable amount of meat, plenty for me for $4.69. They did have knishes, two varieties IIRC. They had rugelach!!!! It was very good. There was more filling than Russ & Dtr, but lacked the crunchy sugar on the exterior. The pastry and the flavor was close, very close, to my "bubbe" benchmark! More importantly, I don't have to drive for 8 hours! I will be making the drive here again...

                        They had a number of traditional dishes in a refrigerator case for purchase - stuffed cabbage, latkes, pickled herring, a whitefish salad, quite a bit more too. Borscht (hot and cold) was listed on a sign. Now you aren't going to walk in and immediately hear, smell and see "deli". Just not enough patrons to create that experience - now. But if they do well and build up a customer base, who knows? I suspect they are offering other things to stay economically viable. As far as offering cheese, this is not an area with enough of a Kosher background to be able to take a stance on it without loosing customers. That there is only, what, 1 or 2 certified Kosher restaurants in the entire state speaks volumes. Sabra Kosher in Durham is revamping to on-line sales only - just not enough of a demand regionally at this point..If allowing dairy with meat will keep their doors open, I sure as heck can't fault them!

                        I spoke to the female half of the couple. They have only been open a few months and seem to be pouring their heart and soul into getting this going. It seems there has been some lack of appreciation from folks who think deli = lunch meat from Piggly Wiggly...which was a little perplexing and disheartening to her.

                        They are a bit off the beaten track, at the back of this shopping center - so most of their market might not stumble upon them easily. With the economy as it is, I have a lot of respect for someone willing to take that gamble right now!

                        My feeling is this: Get out there soon and try it. If you like it, thank them and tell every one you know. This is the closest I've seen in the area (and anywhere I've lived for the last 15 years) and I am really happy to have them!

                        1. re: meatn3

                          we waited so long to try From NY With Love (no reason to go to Raleigh, usually) that both locations seem to be closed. The website is now generic and the phone numbers don't work. Dang.

                          1. re: tamalesfordinner

                            Oh no! I was there perhaps two months ago. It was very quiet, but it was also around 3:30...

                            My heart goes out to them - I think in a better economy they may have made it.

                            1. re: meatn3

                              I'm terribly sorry to hear it but, unfortunately, not surprised. I'm sure the economy has a lot to do with it, but I also know they were steadily being forced to dumb down their menu to make it more "white bread." I mean that literally. In the beginning they made their own rye bread and it was proper heavy rye. The customers complained too much, according to the owner, and he had to start using plastic packaged squishy rye. In the end I suppose he could satisfy no one.

                              The owners were from my old 'hood in Brooklyn and I understand their Russian home-cooking was pretty good. I wonder if there's a niche for that?

                              1. re: rockycat

                                The apparent lack of good places serving things like deli items and pizza on par with what northern transplants are accustomed to back home is consistently surprising to me. Surely we have as many or more northern transplants in NC as we do Mexicans- yet good Mexican food abounds. Any ideas on why this is the case?

                                1. re: Naco

                                  good mexican food abounds?????

                                  Uhm, no. (but I am biased as I used to live in Phoenix. ) More than willing to be proven wrong - offer up suggestions.

                                  The best I have found is in Durham which was good, but I would love to have a good baja place.

                                  1. re: Naco

                                    Expanding a bit, the quality of NC Mexican wasn't really what I was getting at, so that was a bit of poor phrasing on my part(although I do think that we do well in terms of quality). The dichotomy that I see is between the NY-style delis which don't seem to be economically viable without drastically deviating from what is on offer in the northeast- this despite the large population of northeastern transplants.

                                    Contrast with the taqueria, which aims to fill a similar niche(providing a taste of home to transplants). They're everywhere in North Carolina, so they are obviously economically viable, and most of them have a majority Latino clientele, so they are not achieving this by changing the food for North Carolina natives.

                                    1. re: Naco

                                      Also, please note that the Mexican food here will not be the Sonoran-style one is more likely to find in the American Southwest. Most of the authentic Mexican food in this area is Jalisco-style as that is where a good number of the local Mexican population originates. It's going to be different but no less authentic.

                                      1. re: rockycat

                                        I don't often find that Mexican restaurants here specialize in the cuisine of a particular region of Mexico, despite the names often suggesting it. If you go to Fonda y Birrieria Jalisco, they have things like cochinito pibil on the menu, which is from Yucatan. I see siete mares as a weekend special all the time. One of my local places is owned by people from Nayarit, and they have baja style tacos on the menu(which they call Nayarit style).

                                        So I'd say that you often see these little flourishes that are nods to the owner's home state/region/etc., but generally the menus tend to be more pan-Mexican in an attempt to satisfy a wider range of tastes, to say nothing of the availability of ingredients. I talked to the owner of El Sabor de Oaxaca(which *was* a focused regional restaurant) for a while, and he talked about how the difficulty of acquiring certain ingredients meant that he could only offer three different moles out of the traditional seven that Oaxaca is known for.

                                  2. re: rockycat

                                    I worked in a bar/restaurant years ago (with no pretentions of being kosher) that served a grilled pastrami and cheese on rye. One guy came in and asked that the swiss be changed to blue cheese. We all gagged at the thought, but darned if he didn't scarf it down.

                                2. re: tamalesfordinner

                                  The Raleigh location of From NY with Love is still open. Don't know about Cary, but I look into the Raleigh store yesterday. I ilove their tongue sandwich! It's like heaven on toasted rye.

                                  1. re: Tom from Raleigh

                                    Have they gone back to the home baked rye or are they still using the store plasticbag stuff.

                                    1. re: Tom from Raleigh

                                      I've been to their N. Raleigh store twice and they were empty and incredibly slow. Have they stopped selling cheesecake as the last time I was there I didn't see any. I have to admit that for the price for the middle selection (for the amount of meat) I was very disappointed. One there wasn't much meat up there and second the sandwich was flattened. For the money and the taste, I think Neal's Deli in Carrboro is better. I like New York With Love and with them longevity, but if their mediume sandwich is barely filled I would hate to think of what the first option is like.

                                      1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                        Burgeoningfoodie-

                                        Why all the hate for a small business that's just trying to put out a decent sandwich?
                                        I never tried the cheesecake, nor did I look. I've never had their medium fill, only their first option sandwich and each time I was quite happy.

                                        Neal's Deli in Carrboro or Sandwhich in CH might be better than To NY with Love, but they're certainly not in North Raleigh. We need To NY With Love in North Raleigh. There are too many Paneras already.

                                        1. re: Tom from Raleigh

                                          Tom, I don't think it's fair to characterize an opinion that differs from yours as "hate". I'm all for wanting to see local businesses survive, too, but that doesn't mean everyone has to patronize them if they just don't care for the atmosphere/service/product/whatever. And in these financial times, if people don't feel like they're getting a good value for their money, they're not likely to return, period.

                                          1. re: Suzy Q

                                            I don't think it tastes bad and I've not tried their counter items (knishes and stuff in the case). I wish all places well unless they burn me or have absolutely no respect for the clients or their own conditions. I'm just saying the two times I've been there my expectations weren't met in comparison with other places of similar offerings. I do agree with Tom that Raleigh (and maybe N. Raleigh more than other areas) needs something like this and not another robotic/thinktank sandwich place like Panera or Bear Rock. Comparing restaurants is like comparing coffee shops.. you've got your Starbucks and Dunkin and then you've got the local establishments which people are going to argue about too.

                                            1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                              I do not hate them, but I am a bit disappointed that they started out with a great rye bread and then stopped providing it because a few customers wanted fake rye bread.

                                        2. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                          I was there today. I always get the small sandwich ($4 and change) and it has a reasonable amount of meat. Not stingy, not massive - just right imo.

                                          The prepared food items were fewer. Looked like the cheesecake is still there - but I glanced that way from a distance.

                                          Has anyone tried their breakfast? IIRC, years ago the Stage Deli had an omelette made with the scraps left from slicing the deli meats. There was a little of everything in it and it was soooo good! I'm hoping NY with love has a contender...

                              2. Getting back to the Jewish deli that's still a dream, I was surprised to find Hebrew National corned beef, pastrami and some other cold cuts at A Southern Season. Does that mean they might have deli sandwiches at the restaurant there someday? I can only hope. Meanwhile, I was glad to bring some home, warm it up, put it on some good seeded rye from Fresh Market, slather with Hebrew National mustard and finish up with a big smile on my face.

                                It's a start.

                                6 Replies
                                1. re: yahooer

                                  If you ask the sandwich counter next to the deli case (nicely), they'll make a sandwich for you using things from the case, even if it isn't on the limited menu they offer.

                                  1. re: brokegradstudent

                                    well it isnt meat, but my New Yorker dad is so fed up that he can't get a decent kosher dill pickle that he is going to try to make his own. I'll report back on the results, but I am optimistic! If they turn out to be the real thing, I'll bring a crock to the Carrboro Farmers' Market and share with my fellow hounds.

                                    1. re: Rory

                                      That would be awesome!

                                      1. re: Rory

                                        A lot of the NYers I know prefer half sours to kosher dill and I've finally found a place to buy them.

                                        1. re: Rory

                                          In N. Raleigh on Falls of Neuse, Da Vinci's in the Falls Village Shopping Ctr (center where Fresh Market USED to be) will sell you NY Pickles that are pretty good and good deli mustard as well. They bring tongue and corned beef in from the Bronx. Pastrami, too, but it's not my favorite. Mostly though, they are an Italian deli and sell fresh pasta and sauces

                                          1. re: TerryG

                                            thanks for the enthusiasm! we like a sour pickle, but I'm sure while the pickles ferment some will be half-sours, have all the ingrediants and pickling jars etc.., my dad is just going to pick up some fresh dill today (got to put in our own dill plants) so I'll report back:)

                                    2. a "New York Deli" will probably *never* survive in the Triangle, and the fault is probably more that of the people who yearn for it than the people who have never experienced one.

                                      Because it's not the *food* that the people who whine for one really miss, it's the Experience. The other people in line, the voices of the folks behind the counter, the day to day rhythm of the culture of the place. They miss the culture, the comfort, the daily experience of being wrapped in swaddling that is reliable and safe and warm and well known.

                                      You could take Katz's and move it across from the capital building in Raleigh, and people would complain that it wasn't really exactly what they meant when they said they wanted the right deli here.

                                      Until people are willing to embrace the concept of a good "Triangle Deli", it will be necessary to load up the SUV and drive to Manhattan and buy what you want while you stay a few days and lug a few cases back this way. Of course this is the primary attraction of Manhattan anyway -- to visit a few days -- otherwise all the "transplants" would live there instead of here.

                                      22 Replies
                                      1. re: fussycouple

                                        I'm not from NY - I'm from Michigan. I'd like a Michigan deli!

                                        1. re: tamalesfordinner

                                          Aren't you the one who reported that NY with Love was closed? Their web page is still up and according to the person that answered the phone, they are open until seven tonight. Posting crap about places being closed when it isn't true will cost them business and maybe cause them to close. Sorry for the vent.

                                          1. re: blewgo

                                            I was at the Cary Town Center mall today and the food court location for From NY With Love was closed down. Boards ripped off the wall and no sign of life. That may possibly be part of the reason why they changed their website (which is back up with an entirely new design after showing only a holding page and no content for a while... I checked it when that previous post came up and confirmed it).

                                            1. re: blewgo

                                              Perhaps we should take this as a reminder to get out & support the independents that we don't get to very often. I'm so happy that this was a mistaken report - we'll make a visit this week!

                                              klmonline, I can't find anything other than the holding page on line...

                                              1. re: meatn3

                                                Are you using this address: http://fromnywithlovedeli.com/

                                                If so, try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page. It might be fetching your local copy.

                                                1. re: klmonline

                                                  That works! Thank you.

                                            2. re: tamalesfordinner

                                              Would you settle for Katzingers? :-p Though it isn't Michigan.

                                            3. re: fussycouple

                                              Fussy, I know what experience you are talking about. Though i think people here would settle for a Carnegie moreso than a Katz's. I mean they want the huge sandwiches and the health salad and the variety of pickles. I don't know if they mean they want to stand in line and pull a number from the ticket machine. I can't see people waiting in line for their food... just think about the impatience of people who are sitting and waiting for their food. Also, at least the last time I was in 3rd Ave. Deli in NY, you had better know what you want when you go in and get your number because they don't have time to waste. Yeah the rhythm down South is always different. Also, I'm not sure that one would survive (at least like the kind you are mentioning) in N. Raleigh where things are spread out. It may actually do better in a downtown setting, but then again our downtowns aren't crammed with people. I think a NY Deli would do good in a sports venue where the people are constantly walking around and lots of knoshing goes on anyways. The variety may not be able to be as wide, but I think the opportunity is better.

                                              1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                I think you might be on to something - I'd sure try a deli concession at a Hurricanes game, for instance. Even a kosher one, if it meant giving up my beloved cheese in exchange for a really good pickle. :)

                                                1. re: romansperson

                                                  Well I mean think about it. Every place you go to around here has the same thing. Now BBQ I can understand that is like our state dish (be it east or west). Now whether it is a kosher deli or not I don't care if the product tastes the same. I don't know that you'd have to give up cheese (unless you keep strictly kosher and you want a meat dish). But just something different, the only thing is probably that the cost of a stall and the items to keep it going (esp. at RBC) would be super high and also those places in the RBC have restaurants outside of the arena to promote the game. But a sports venue in general would be great place to at least get a foot hold somewhere.

                                                  You can go to Las Vegas of all places and still eat food from teh Carnegie (or is it Stage) Deli. Some places up north even have pickle bars with at least 3 different types of pickles (sours, half sours, dills).

                                                  That I would expect transplants to congregate in a sports venue too.

                                                  1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                    I can speak at least for Washington DC and say they are sorely lacking in a really good deli. Constant problem there. There are some *great* sandwich places (Breadline comes immediately to mind) but nothing like the NY deli experience. so maybe this is just something that doesn't translate easily.

                                                    1. re: LulusMom

                                                      Even in New York the NY deli experience is coming to an end. Many of the old line Kosher delis are no more. And, many of the ones that are still open have had the quality slipping for years. This does not include ones like the Carnegie deli that in part survive from the tourist trade, but the small neighborhood ones in Brooklyn, Queens and even Manhattan.

                                                      1. re: chazzer

                                                        I don't think Carnegie is a kosher deli, but NY style for sure. Didn't DC have an outpost of the Carnegie or Stage deli? The last deli I went to before 3rd Avenue was in Edison NJ. It was/is called Harold's and is in a hotel. You wanna talk about huge portions.. just do a search on it and check out the images.

                                                        1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                          You do mean the 2nd Avenue Deli (which is now located near 3rd Ave.), don't you?

                                                          1. re: rockycat

                                                            Yes I meant 2nd Ave which relocated to 3rd and 33rd (I do believe). There was a branch of a well known NY Deli in DC a long while back, but I don't remember which one.. and I think it was in the Dupont Circle area..

                                                            1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                              I lived in the Dupont Circle area for a loooong time, and don't remember at all what you're talking about (then again, I drank in the Dupont Circle area for a long time, so the problem may well be with my memory).

                                                              1. re: LulusMom

                                                                Well I did say I THINK which means I'm not totally sure other than I know that there was an outpost at some point somewhere in the DC area... I'm almost sure of it (just to add confidence :-) )

                                                                I did a little bit of digging. The Carnegie Deli branch in the DC area was located in Tyson's Corner

                                                                1. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                                  Makes sense (at least for me not remembering) - I had no car, never made it out of the city. But in terms of where they'd place it, makes no sense at all. It's a fairly upscale, WASPy place to put a deli. The downtown of DC would love a place like that.

                                                                  1. re: LulusMom

                                                                    Maybe it's only a matter of time or a petition. Could see plenty of politicians making work of a place like that.

                                                          2. re: burgeoningfoodie

                                                            DC has tried a few times to have NY style delis and they have always failed. And failed quickly and miserably.

                                                            1. re: LulusMom

                                                              The truth is that no one eats like that on a regular basis, I mean all the fat and sodium consumed in a deli meal. It is a once in a while treat, and delis can not survive on the once in a while crowd.

                                                              1. re: chazzer

                                                                Actually the fat and sodium are consumed all the time via fast food. It's the fact that the same can be had waiting for actual sandwich, knish, etc but no one wants to spend the time much anymore. It is also the fact that the reputation of such deli's (the monstrous sandwich) which is a small part of their menu precedes them. I'm not saying the normal sandwich doesn't have plenty of meat, but I mean the 15-22 buck gonzo sandwiches.

                                              2. For those who enjoy Deli's in general...

                                                http://www.savethedeli.com/