444258 Mon Sep 24 10:43:02 -0700 2007 19 34 Wine 0 2970714 I'm preparing a three course dinner, but am unsure what to serve with the main course. I've got a beautiful late harvest riesling to go with dessert and an aged Kabinett to go with the appetizer. The main course is a sousvide steak that will be finished with a smoked salt and black pepper crust. It's served with a mushroom ketchup and a blue cheese infused butter. I'm torn, the mushrooms make me think pinot, but it probably can't stand up to the rest of the flavors. The black pepper and smoked salt make me feel like a syrah or zinfandel might be the better bet. Normally I'd go with a cabernet when I serve steak, but I think it might get over powered. I'm leaning towards a Southern Rhone blend, but I also could be moved towards a newer Spanish or Tuscan blend as well. Any ideas? Mon Sep 24 10:43:02 -0700 2007 86802 vanillagorilla 1 2970736 Flavorwise your on the right track with Pinot. I'd go with a big one from Oregon (IMO most of them are pretty syrah like these days anyway); something along the the lines of Bergstrom Arcus Vineyard should do nicely. Mon Sep 24 10:48:22 -0700 2007 2970714 97345 Vinny Barbaresco 2 2970845 While I'd disagree that most Oregon PN's are Syrah-like these days, Bergstrom is a good example of that style. I'm not sure if they still do an Arcus, but their deLancelloti Vineyard would also make a good match, with a lot of spice and smoke (My TN for the 2004: "Very rich and extracted for a pinot, with a nose that opens up with some ripe berry, minerals, spice box and smoke, followed with more dark berries, a hint of orange peel, and a chewy texture."). Penner Ash also makes Oregon PN in a big style that would probably work. Mon Sep 24 11:13:02 -0700 2007 2970736 35525 Frodnesor 1 2970875 Pepper and mushrooms make me think of an earthy Rhône with a high percentage of Grenache, or an old-vines Navarra Garnacha. Mon Sep 24 11:19:40 -0700 2007 2970714 11369 Robert Lauriston 2 2970967 Wouldn't a Rhone with high Mourvedre often be earthier? Mon Sep 24 11:38:09 -0700 2007 2970875 26666 FrankJBN 3 2971048 Grenache / Garnacha is often peppery. Earthiness would come from some other grape in the blend and the terroir. Mon Sep 24 11:53:52 -0700 2007 2970967 11369 Robert Lauriston 1 2970992 IMO the more important taste notes to match are: 1) Very juicy steak. Sous-Vide tends to produce extra juiciness, a good thing. 2) The Blue Cheese essence 3) To a lesser extent the ketchup/mushrooms condiment. First off, IMO pinot noir is not big enough for this dish. It wouldn't clash greatly, but perhaps just come off a bit insipid, IMO. My first choice for the "juicy steak" by itself is probably nebbiolo, although alot of rich reds will also work (cabernet, syrah, zinfandel, merlot). But first choice nebbiolo here. As for mushrooms... nebbiolo and cabernet are great connections here. As for "blue cheese" essence, this swings more towards zinfandel, tempranillo, and syrah, and this is probably the wild card of the dish. If serving a gorgonzola-based butter, go with tempranillo or syrah. If roquefort then serve zinfandel. Bottom line: At the end of the day I would probably select Nebbiolo or zinfandel for the main course, and de-emphasize (not eliminate), the tomato in the ketchup. Make if more like "tomato-slathered black peppercorn mushroom garnish", as opposed to a rich ketchup. Mon Sep 24 11:43:31 -0700 2007 2970714 42549 Chicago Mike 2 2971063 Mushroom ketchup doesn't include tomatoes. Mon Sep 24 11:56:49 -0700 2007 2970992 11369 Robert Lauriston 2 2971175 As Robert stated the mushroom ketchup has not tomato. It's basically 2 kilos of mushrooms with all of their juice extracted, combined with wine, vinegar, a touch of sugar and then cooked down to a ketchup consistency. The blue cheese is more of a Stilton. Mon Sep 24 12:26:03 -0700 2007 2970992 86802 vanillagorilla 3 2971739 If a cow's milk Stilton, then you're leaning more towards syrah or especially tempranillo as a wine match as they are both particularly nice rich reds with a cow's milk blue cheese.... On the other hand, the intensity of the mushroom extraction really favors Nebbiolo here.... cabernet sauvignon 2nd choice. So, given the clarity on the cheese I'd favor either Tempranillo or Nebbiolo with this steak.... but honestly alot of rich reds will work here and I'd prefer a great Cabernet, Syrah or zinfandel to an "average" rioja or barolo in this situation, but all else equal rioja or barolo would be first choices. Mon Sep 24 14:39:48 -0700 2007 2971175 42549 Chicago Mike 4 2972516 Stilton is always cow's milk. The amount in a compound butter's going to be just a grace note compared with pepper and smoke. I don't think Barolo would hold its own very well against that dish. Mon Sep 24 18:29:03 -0700 2007 2971739 11369 Robert Lauriston 5 2973014 Well keep in mind the dish isn't stilton butter... the dish is a very well prepared juicy steak with heavy mushroom essence, for both of which nebbiolo is a fabulous match. Mon Sep 24 22:00:37 -0700 2007 2972516 42549 Chicago Mike 6 2974575 If the dish in question were a juicy steak with mushroom essence, Barolo might pair very nicely. Tue Sep 25 11:09:14 -0700 2007 2973014 11369 Robert Lauriston 2 2971796 "First off, IMO pinot noir is not big enough for this dish. It wouldn't clash greatly, but perhaps just come off a bit insipid, IMO." Define your concept of "bigger"; to me it means more fruit, more extract and more alcohol. American Pinots are far bigger wines than most Nebbiolo based wines, especially an astringent Barolo. Mon Sep 24 14:53:12 -0700 2007 2970992 97345 Vinny Barbaresco 3 2971833 I would agree that there are some quite earthy california pinots that might match this steak quite well... on the other hand there are some very elegant Carneros pinots for example that IMO wouldn't match as well... At the end of the day, IMO, Pinot Noir is just "dicier" as a match for this dish, but I don't see it as a sharp contrast either. In full disclosure, the Pinot would probably also match the mushrooms quite nicely.... So, yes, to my palate if you can find a particularly earthy Pinot Noir then that could be quite a sensational match... but it's just not as predictable IMO as any of the matches I listed. Mon Sep 24 15:05:17 -0700 2007 2971796 42549 Chicago Mike 1 2971475 Reading the description and letting my mind and palette play, I kept coming up with Syrah, but a Northern Rhône, say a Côte-Rôtie, or Hermitage. René Rostaing does a great La Landonne and Paul Jaboulet-Ainé has La Chapelle. Both should go nicely. Note: these are but two producers out of many. What fits within your budget, and is available in your area should dictate. Hunt Mon Sep 24 13:37:42 -0700 2007 2970714 11329 Bill Hunt 1 2972110 Priorat... or New World styled CA Cab. Mon Sep 24 16:31:58 -0700 2007 2970714 50041 whiner 1 2972174 Don't become overly obsessed with the flavours of the blue cheese, mushrooms and smoked salt. While I've not seen your recipe, it's a pretty safe bet they're accents to the primary flavour, i.e. beef. What's more, while blue cheese on its own usually spells trouble for red wine, here it's not only a supporting player but is also blunted by the butter. An old French resto recipe I make from time to time is pan-fried fillet steaks served with blanched and sautéed cucumber and sauced with a white wine, shallot, Roquefort and cream sauce. The chef's recommended wine pairing -- and the best of the various wines I've tried with the dish -- is a St-Émilion, and I've got to wonder whether one of those or a similarly styled Merlot from elsewhere wouldn't do the trick here. Failing that, I'd look to a Syrah from the northern Rhône (one of the less foursquare Cornas, say) or New Wolrd (Edmunds St. John, anyone?), which would certainly know how to read the smoke signals. Mon Sep 24 16:47:42 -0700 2007 2970714 10520 carswell 2 2973021 Just my opinion that matching the peripheral flavors is what separates a good wine match from a phenomenal one. To have earthy mushroom essence wafting up your nostrils and blue cheese on your palate and not take it into consideration could be a big oversight.... As the poster is preparing it, this dish is anything but "plain steak". Mon Sep 24 22:05:56 -0700 2007 2972174 42549 Chicago Mike 3 2974592 The dish is complex, but mushroom ketchup and mushroom essence have very different aromas, and there's crusted pepper and smoked salt in there as well. Tue Sep 25 11:12:51 -0700 2007 2973021 11369 Robert Lauriston