424804 Wed Jul 25 18:32:37 -0700 2007 87 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 2783882 I went to the greenmarket in Union Sq today and picked up a bunch of stuff. I was about to hop on the subway when I decided to text my SO. As I stood there, the seller nearest me, offered his "shade from the sun" while I texted. Then I got lured into buying his beef. I must admit that I had heard the grass fed beef might taste odd to most of us not used to it. I decided to buy the beef patties, because I did not want to spend more money if the meat wasn't to our liking. So, here I made a delicious cucumber salad, a potato salad, and jalapeno butter grilled corn. I sliced the sweet onions an heirloom tomato to put on top of our grilled burgers. We sat down and took one bite each and looked at each other with faces of disgust. We hated the taste of the meat. I seriously put my burger down and said "Let's order pizza". I figured the salads and produce would hang well until tomorrow when we can make burgers with meat from our butcher. But, am I crazy? Am I missing something? We do try to eat organically and we do love adventurous food. But we just did not like the beef. I almost feel wrong for not liking it. Thoughts? Wed Jul 25 18:32:37 -0700 2007 15357 Justpaula 1 2783904 Grassfed definitely has a unique flavor, and many people are turned off by it. You are not alone. Wed Jul 25 18:42:37 -0700 2007 2783882 76025 mojoeater 1 2783906 Me too. I really wanted to like it, but I thought it was gamey and I could definitely taste that it had more flavor and less fat. We did tried it on the Big Island at Merriman's, so it was locally source. I might try it again just to be sure. Wed Jul 25 18:44:30 -0700 2007 2783882 69496 septocaine_queen 1 2784201 I think it depends on the producer and other factors. I buy ground grassfed beef from Trader Joe's and like it quite a bit. In fact, I was expecting the worst given the complaints about the flavor. I do, however, use it for kebabs, so the aleppo pepper, mint, red pepper paste, etc. are adding (and potentially masking) flavor. Wed Jul 25 20:51:01 -0700 2007 2783882 18705 emily 1 2784238 Can't say you don't have a right to your taste - but I wonder what you expected, and how you'd describe what you tasted (and what about it you disliked). I had some and remarked "gosh this actually tasted like beef, not cardboard." Wed Jul 25 21:08:25 -0700 2007 2783882 14479 wayne keyser 1 2784605 I've been purchasing grass fed ground beef from a local family farm at our farmers market for a couple of years and it has been consistently good. I tried a steak a year or so ago and wasn't impressed but I can't remember if I bought it from the farmer or WF. Anyway, I really want to like it as well and I understand it can vary from farmer to farmer and seasonally. Last weekend on impulse I decided to try again and I bought one ribeye on the bone and one strip from the same farm. I wasn't expecting a lot but they were awesome. Some of the best steak I've had in a long time - flavorful - beefier, chewy but still tender. If you care about eating pastured beef you might keep trying different sources until you find one you like. Thu Jul 26 04:44:05 -0700 2007 2783882 10222 queenie 1 2784812 I don't find it icky, but I do find it inferior to grain finished beef. I've had grass-fed filet that I paid out the nose for at at high end restaurants...L'Etoile in WI comes to mind. That rest. is consistently on the Gourmet top 50 list (assuming that means anything) and is one of those places where every component of a dish is preceded by the name of the farmer. The founder worked originally w/ Alice Waters. So I make the assumption they served the best available. The steak was very good, but not as delicious as many others I have had...Coleman and Lobels come to mind. Thu Jul 26 06:29:30 -0700 2007 2783882 10471 danna 1 2784842 It's so odd to me when people don't like the taste of grass fed beef- grass feeding is how cows are supposed to be fed- it's how beef is supposed to taste. Beef isn't meant to be fed on grain or that slop they feed them now. Thu Jul 26 06:38:53 -0700 2007 2783882 49180 jpschust 2 2784866 It's not a question of what they're supposed to eat or what they're supposed to taste like. It's what you're used to based on the grain fed diet. DT Thu Jul 26 06:44:17 -0700 2007 2784842 11291 Davwud 1 2784862 All of our beef in Colombia is fully range/grass fed. When I visit the US, beef tastes like...nothing. Thu Jul 26 06:43:43 -0700 2007 2783882 36661 Sam Fujisaka 2 2785035 Thank you. I might have had pastured/grass fed beef as a child (I'm 50 ish) but most of my life here in the US I'm sure it has been grain fed. I've always loved me a good steak but in the past 5 years or so - not so much. Grain fed beef has started to taste bland with a mushy texture to boot. And I go out of my way to buy dry aged prime beef. Although many of these have been good, they've not had the taste/texture that I remember from long ago and have been in seach of. Those fully pastured steaks I had last weekend were spot on! Thu Jul 26 07:29:41 -0700 2007 2784862 10222 queenie 2 2786693 Hey Sam. Ja, it's relatively easy to get grassfed beef - or grassfed but 'finished' on grains - here in South Africa, too. In fact, a lot of butchers are surprised if you ask! Some of the best is from Swaziland; again, that gamey, wild flavour, quite lean. Same deal with our lamb, much of which is raised in the Karoo, on indigenous shrubs. Locals buy it all - there is no international market for the meat, because the shrubs give it an almost sharp, spicy-herby flavour. Their loss, our gain. Now only if we could get our crayfish back from the exporters and tourist trap restaurants... Thu Jul 26 13:40:43 -0700 2007 2784862 10431 Gooseberry 3 2787037 And the lamb in Lesotho!! Herded by kids born on horses who later ride on locally made English style saddles! Thu Jul 26 15:10:52 -0700 2007 2786693 36661 Sam Fujisaka 3 2787527 I figured I'd just add my 0.02 here- it seems to fit: Those who find grass-fed at best inconsistent or at worst gamy are encountering a phenomenon specifically avoided by large scale grain fed cattle operations. Cattle are different from what another- variations in their diet from animal to animal and other environmental factors will result in variations in the flavor and texture of the meat. I always offer the following anecdote- I brought 4 ranched venison tenderloins to a party. Each one tasted drastically different from the next running the gamut from mild and almost beefy, through lamb all the way to very, very gamy. Thu Jul 26 17:29:37 -0700 2007 2786693 39914 lunchbox 2 2791974 Couldn't agree more. We beefeaters in the US have had our tastebuds programmed to accept grain-fed juiced-up beef as real beef - not! The first time I tried grass-fed was a strange sense to me as I didn't get was I was expecting. But once I accepted the flavor as REAL beef and better for me, I can truly say that it's a great protein. Having just recently returned from Malaysia and Singapore, I can say that the beef there tastes and feels different as well. I can't be certain how much is commercially raised like in the US, but I know I ate grass-fed while on the island of Langkawi. The steers and kerbau (Malay for water buffalo) graze in many of the yards and adjacent open fields on the lush island and are utilized for milk, draft, fertilizer, hides, and of course meat. Beef rendang is believed to have evolved in order to "tenderize" and preserve the relatively tougher meat of the grass-fed water buffalos. As I am sure Sam the Man knows, it's better in almost every way for everyone as well. It's better for the steer, farmers, the environment, and consumers themselves. In fact, grass-fed beef is lower in overall fat, much higher in unsaturated fat, and actually contains Omega-3 fatty acids - once thought to be only available for the most part in seafood. Yes, ounce for ounce, beef is more intensive on resources than say chicken, but if you're opting to eat beef, grass-fed is the way to go. Keep it simple... Sat Jul 28 12:30:45 -0700 2007 2784862 64003 bulavinaka 2 3588006 AHHA!! An old post of Sam's - but one that I guess has answered an old question in the Harters household. We've been regularly visiting America since 1980 and have often commented about how bland the beef usually is, in comparision to what we get in the UK. We thought it might have been something to do with the hanging/ageing process. Never occured to me it was something as fundamental that your cattle don't graze on grass. We do have some feed mixes which supplement silage or hay in the winter. Sat Apr 12 15:26:22 -0700 2008 2784862 154102 Harters 2 5086614 Missed this one! Yup after living abroad for so many years, 'Merican beef tastes like greasy cardboard, chicken like a doctor's office smells and pork bland. Maybe this is why we eat so much lamb! Wed Oct 07 15:13:01 -0700 2009 2784862 93538 Passadumkeg 1 2784906 I'd think it depends on the producer. Until recently, the last time I had grass-fed beef was years ago at the home of a friend to raised cattle. I didn't like it; it was gamey, But just last night I had a grass-fed ribeye (from the Tallgrass company) that had great flavor, certainly better than any grain-fed steak I've ever bought from a supermarket. Thu Jul 26 06:54:12 -0700 2007 2783882 55316 mpalmer6c 1 2785072 I find the same thing with grass fed bought from the Farmer's Market in GAP and some of the grass fed from the Park Slope Coop. The meat is tough and has a lot of gristle. Saying that, I will ay it depends on the farm you buy it from. To me the best rib eye out there is by Hardwick's. It's 100% grass, has a nice fat content, it's buttery and has very little gristle. As for ground beef, I will always grind it myself, this way I know what to expect. Thu Jul 26 07:38:36 -0700 2007 2783882 15393 bigmackdaddy 1 2785327 personally i love grass fed beef. however, when i've served it, about half of the people aren' t fans.... Thu Jul 26 08:44:56 -0700 2007 2783882 60025 winedubar 1 2785710 Don't feel wrong...if you have not had it before, it will take getting used to. Along Sam F's lines, I am from Guatemala and while I lived there as a teenager, all we ate was grass fed beef (because that is how its done down there). My father has a dairy farm and those cows are out in the pasture all the time and depending on what grasses they are eating that is the subtle flavor that comes thru the milk...it is also heavily influenced by the season as well (rainy vs. dry). So it is same with grass fed beef, they are what they eat :D. You may have to shop around until you find the the one ranch whose grass fed taste you like. I would not give up just yet. Thu Jul 26 10:27:04 -0700 2007 2783882 105586 Cat Chow 1 2786514 It's unfortunate that we have become culturally conditioned to prefer the taste of beef raised in a manner that is not only worse for the cows but is also worse for the environment and our own health. Thu Jul 26 13:00:35 -0700 2007 2783882 75002 Megiac 2 2789920 The same thing has been happening here in Canada vis-a-vis salmon. Sustainable, yes. Tasty? No! Our tastes have indeed been modified by mass production. Fri Jul 27 13:33:54 -0700 2007 2786514 42449 mrbozo 1 2786740 I like grass-fed beef, but not as beef jerky for some strange reason. Thu Jul 26 13:56:00 -0700 2007 2783882 11583 ipsedixit 1 2787091 Since I'm used to grain-fed beef, grass-fed beef is too gamey for me. Thu Jul 26 15:23:39 -0700 2007 2783882 24711 dty 1 2787167 was it the taste, or the texture, or both? I ask because grass-fed has less fat content & burgers can get tough when subjected to normal (grain-fed) beef cooking treatment. also, since the patties were ready-made, you don't know what cuts went into them. some cuts definitely have a more game-y/liver-y taste. I recommend that you try again...but go with a good cut - try a thick-cut (1.5-2 in.) new york steak. Split one between you and SO & you will be spending less than $20. Some websites (including grass-fed beef suppliers!) recommend cooking grass-fed beef more delicately (lower heat; less time). I think this misleads. The best way is to season with salt & pepper, brush with olive oil & grill over a *high* heat fire to sear both sides nicely dark brown & grill-marked. Then move off direct heat & let the steak roast until the thickest interior is 120 degrees. (I like to throw some wood chips over on the charcoal side for this part). Let rest for 5 minutes or so after you remove from the heat. Interior should rise another few degrees or so & be fairly rare. ...so...quick direct heat for exterior crusty flavor & then slow, even heat to finish. If you like your steak medium or above, then skip the whole thing. -E Thu Jul 26 15:41:34 -0700 2007 2783882 22193 evans 1 2787393 I also grew up eating grass fed beef. To me, the US beef is like pink cottonwool. Bland and mushy. I also like goat and mutton. It tastes like meat! Thu Jul 26 16:47:56 -0700 2007 2783882 71215 mlgb 1 2787563 We buy all of our beef from a local farm that pastures their animals from birth to slaughter. The taste is the differece between budweiser (grain fed) and a wonderful microbrew (grass fed). I really enjoy the way the flavor is different depending on the time of year, etc. To me, these differences are akin to a wine's terroir. Grain fed beef is quite literally a factory product. If that is your bag, fine. I, personally, am not keen on it. Thu Jul 26 17:44:36 -0700 2007 2783882 40062 lisa13 1 2787694 I have bought grass fed beef hamburger at the grocery store. It was a little gamey, more like farm raised buffalo. It also had a distinctively more beefy taste. The farmer we bought a 1/4 cow from mostly grass feeds, he was going to finish the cow the week before it was sent to the meat locker on grains. He changed his mind at the last minute, said the cow didn't need additional fattening up. So what we ended up with was basically grass fed and it is awesome stuff. It tastes more beefy but not gamey. The steaks practically fall apart, but some of the traditionally tougher cuts are tougher than grain fed grocery store equivalents. Thu Jul 26 18:26:27 -0700 2007 2783882 61071 blackpointyboots 1 2789233 I'm curious--how does the flavor of grass fed beef compare to buffalo meat? We eat buffalo all the time and like it quite well. To me, it has a sweeter, more mineral flavor that I wouldn't describe as gamey, though it's certainly more flavorful than grain fed beef. Do they compare? Fri Jul 27 10:25:15 -0700 2007 2783882 24126 amyzan 2 2793492 the buffalo I have had is indeed "mineraly" - it has a flavor somewhere in the direction of liver, but in a good way. To me it is different than pastured beef, but I have a hard time coming up with what, exactly, the difference is. The beef can be more in the gamey direction (though it does not have to be), and it does not have that mineral quality. Sun Jul 29 09:07:21 -0700 2007 2789233 40062 lisa13 1 2790200 i'd say, yeah you're crazy-- but that would be rude. also i think maybe something else is going on. i think that the op got pressured by the seller into buying something she wasn't sure she'd dig, then she may not have prepared it correctly, it's hard to tell from the post. it's also unclear whether the "beefy, meaty" taste was too strong or whether it was too lean & it got overcooked. she just says "we hated the taste of the meat" and doesn't say what she was tasting. just as milk from pastured cows can taste different at different times of the year and due to different regions/types of pasture, grass-fed beef can vary due to what the animal ate. if the farmer is serious about the taste of his animals' meat, s/he will take care of the pastures and the types of grasses that grow there. assuming it was a "pressure sale"-- maybe the guy is unscrupulous or sloppy. maybe he's selling you patties because they're from old, tough animals-- milkers, maybe? or maybe the meat was overcooked & that's why it didn't taste good. ask a friend who enjoys grass-fed beef where they prefer to buy their beef (butcher, store, farm. . .) & share a meal with them. maybe you like grass-fed beef, just not those burgers from that farmer/producer. give it a second shot before panning all grass-fed beef. to me, grass fed is wonderful! Fri Jul 27 14:53:03 -0700 2007 2783882 46030 soupkitten 1 2791065 I've had grass fed beef that is amazing, and grass fed beef that is awful. Like any artisinal product, quality varies from producer to producer. Would you judge all goat cheese by one mediocre gouda? Fri Jul 27 21:44:45 -0700 2007 2783882 10793 Morton the Mousse 2 2791096 uhh that is what cows were meant to eat... come to Northern California to taste some of the most succulent grass fed beef ever. As others have said- the product varies from farm to farm. Better than commercial feed lot beef that is uniformly tasteless. Fri Jul 27 22:03:51 -0700 2007 2791065 55542 drmimi 3 3884238 Where do you get your beef from? Fellow nor'cal folks want to know. Sat Jul 19 18:45:45 -0700 2008 2791096 91425 virtualguthrie 1 2791137 Today I wanted to buy some good beef to feed my family (6 at home tonight). Knowing this could get expensive, I went to my local Wild Oats, in search of some grassfed. Incredibly, their grassfed filet mignon was $17.99 per pound compared to $24.99 for regular. I bought 2lbs., and proceeded to grill it, and accompanied it with old school baked potatoes, a salad made from arugula, basil, and napa cabbage, and a bottle of "Heart of Darkness" 2004. It was delicious. And my grocery bill was less than what one person would cost at a steakhouse. My family has no problem with grassfed meat. That's what I buy whenever given the choice. It just tastes better to me. Fri Jul 27 22:35:17 -0700 2007 2783882 68466 vickib 1 2791319 I'm thinking that maybe something was wrong in the packaging. I bought some grass fed steaks from an organic farm that wrapped the steaks in butcher paper and then froze. The steaks were freezer burned and tasted awful. I recently bought some at my farmers market that were shrink vac-packed and were wonderful. Sat Jul 28 05:30:04 -0700 2007 2783882 11256 LikestoEatout 2 2791747 It's very possible. Grass fed beef is often ruined due to improper aging, butchering, storage, and/or freezing techniques. It's a cottage industry, and some producers are still perfecting their methods. Sat Jul 28 10:17:59 -0700 2007 2791319 10793 Morton the Mousse 1 2791796 What's the difference between grass-fed beef and Kobe Beef from Japan? What do they feed the Japanese Cows that makes their meat so expensive? Sat Jul 28 10:40:17 -0700 2007 2783882 113098 DrBehavior 2 2792059 Bigmackdaddy is indeed the daddy mack! I've made a few posts about this before- to those who have heard this, I apologize... Waygu literally translates as "Beef of Japan" There is very little inherently better about waygu vs. angus vs. hereford PER SE... the difference comes from the fattening process that has been given the name from the Japanese prefecture where it was perfected- Kobe. Waygu cattle from Japan (who are frequently raised in countries with more pasturage, notably Australia and the US) are raised for the first 16-18 weeks much as any other meat cattle are raised- grazing on grass in open pasture, but whereas most "American" steers are then shipped off to crowded feedlots for a few weeks of carbo-loading of grain (mostly corn), the "Kobe" cattle are transported to smaller elite pastures where grains (mostly rice) are offered in addition to their grazing, they are frequently groomed, and are supplied beer and Sake lees in the summer to increase their appetite- all of this for another 130-150 days. Basically, Kobe is Beef Foie Gras- it is pampered and overfed- but no one could possibly call their treatment inhumane- the Philosophy behind the process is that happy cows make happy beef. Now back to some of the facts behind the philosophy: the beef is expensive because: 1) grazing is more expensive than feed (ranch labor). 2) the labor intensive handling of the animals 3) transporting the animals 4) the length of time the animals are alive is nearly twice as long as conventional cattle- that means more food, more labor, etc 5) waygu cattle and crossbreeds between waygu and angus (all of the beef we eat in the US called "Kobe" is actually cross-bred) has a different saturated fat/unsaturated fat/hdl/ldl ratio than hereford or angus, it is, in fact, better for you, despite the quantity of fat per serving. All of these characteristics raise the price of Kobe-style beef high above that of conventional beef- but as vickib said above- rising petroleum costs impacts industries dependent upon it faster than those that do not- grassfed may be more expensive now, but won't fluctuate as much and may eventually be a better buy across the board- which is the goal of all sustainable agriculture business! to tie this whole thing back to the original post, the Kobe fattening process is just that: an artificial process meant to standardize the final product- Kobe-style beef should be fairly consistent from steak to steak. Entirely grass-fed animals will naturally have more variations because of the minor variation in diet and exercise from animal to animal. Damn, I'm a wordy bastard! Sat Jul 28 13:24:26 -0700 2007 2791823 39914 lunchbox 3 2792072 But I'm not done yet... sorry. At the top of my post I said something about waygu, angus, and hereford being relatively similar- that's really a simplification, but one of the chief differences comes not from the beginning of the steer's life, but from the end: The American palette (that which has not been rendered bland) appreciates the flavor of aged beef. Hereford and Angus are usually hung 4-11 days, butchered, then wet aged as much as 20 days before it hits your plate. Further dry aging is a desirable thing. For the most part waygu- whether it goes through the Kobe process or not- is aged very little (often 4-7 days at the most). Aging allows enzymatic reactions which break down some of the proteins in the meat and allow significant amounts of water to evaporate from the meat- if you just spent the better part of a year making a cow perfect, you want it served as is! Sat Jul 28 13:32:44 -0700 2007 2792059 39914 lunchbox 4 2792196 I really appreciate the trouble you've taken in giving me a much needed and very complete lesson in the various distinctions that exist. Despite the fact that I spent much of my early years on a farm, my knowledge was limited to pigs. Thanks again. Sat Jul 28 14:33:42 -0700 2007 2792072 113098 DrBehavior 1 2792420 No...I would not say I was pressured, as I was already interested in a way. Although, my interest was not enough to actually make me buy it until they purveyor offered me his shade from the hot NYC sun while I was texting. I went for the beef patties, because they were cheap and did not want to spend and arm and a leg on my first foray into grass fed beef. Do you think if I bought a whole cut, like a rib eye, it would be "easier" to accept? The taste was very, welly, grassy, my BF said "like hay", and also kinda metallic. And it had an interesting smell. We understand that cows are meant to eat grass and I totally acknowledge that my taste buds have been treated to grain fed beef for 32 years, for good or bad, but as much as I would like to train my palette to accept grass fed, this experience has gotten me running from it. Fortunately, I bought free range farm chicken at the Greenmarket in Sunnyside today and I know that is something we already like better than the supymarket kind. Sat Jul 28 16:43:10 -0700 2007 2783882 15357 Justpaula 2 2792458 I would take the opportunity to try it again, perhaps in a restaurant where it might be properly prepared. If you like it, you can purchase the same cut and try to make it at home. If after a few tries grassfed still doesn't appeal, don't sweat it. You don't have to force yourself to eat anything you don't like. Sat Jul 28 17:01:40 -0700 2007 2792420 76025 mojoeater 2 2792461 you definitely have to cook it in a different way from traditional grain finished beef. here are some tips: http://sustainabletable.org/features/articles/grassfedbeef/ Sat Jul 28 17:03:49 -0700 2007 2792420 61861 ebbatten 1 2794917 Yeah, maybe it was the producer. I recently bought some New Zealand grassfed ground beef from Citarella, made a hamburger at home, and it was the best hamburger I've ever had in my life by miles. A friend at work tried it and she loved it too. It was truly superior. Certainly not gamey or tough in any way. More like melt in your mouth and so fresh. Of course, we're not doing the environment any favors flying things in from New Zealand but it was so delicious I will have to get it again. Sun Jul 29 20:17:48 -0700 2007 2783882 43257 KateC. 1 2805850 Grass-fed beef tastes like... beef. It's just more intense. Also, grass-fed beef (or any animal) is rich in omega-3 fatty acids, which is an essential nutrient. Grain-fed beef has more omega-6 fatty acids. The ratio of omega3:omega6 is critical for metabolism. In other words, omega 6 intake reduces out the benefits of omega-3 intake. Ratios that favor omega-3 will reduce inflammation, blood clotting, and tumor growth; ratios heavy in omega-6 promote these health hazards. Also, omega-3 is critical for brain metabolism, while omega-6 has been linked to depression. The typical (grain-fed) American diet is heavy in omega-6, and this is probably a major factor behind our many health issues. Wed Aug 01 21:44:49 -0700 2007 2783882 72598 jeffypop 2 2805866 I love grass-fed bison & grass-fed beef. My husband & I had the best grass-fed NY steaks about a month ago we bought at the farmer's market in Paso Robles. It didn't seem gamey at all to me, just really flavorful (I love game meats, especially elk). Wed Aug 01 21:53:27 -0700 2007 2805850 64009 LANative 1 2805980 I haved read all the above because I am trying to learn more about the topic of Graas-finished vs. Corn-finished beef. The web page below is to some good info on topic. As for your question, IMO, No, not crazy! You are just another victim of the American Cattle farmer lobby. In the beginning the Native Americans hunted grass-fed buffalo on the Great plains. That all changed with the creation of Indian Reservations for the Natives and the Scorched Earth policy for the Prairies, which burned the grass and starved the buffalo. Other buffalo herds were shot so their hides could be used to make belts to turn the wheels of the industrial revolution. Now comes the Cattle farmers to feed the nation with Natural grass-fed beef (a domesticated animal) on the "open" prairies. The problem with this plan was that seasonal changes and weather problems have a bad impact on profits -- Yikes. Moreover, corn-fed beef finished in "industrial feedlots" grow faster, bigger, have more savory fat and concerns about mass illness of the heard, caused by such close proximity of cattle in those feedlots, are addressed by mixing antibiotics into the feed - Yummy! Overtime, our Manifest Destiny was to gradually learn to like “Midwest Corn-fed beef.” Recently, however, Americans (from the Mountains, to the Prairies, to the Oceans -- white with foam) have begun to question what they have been taught to eat and the result is a more educatied consumer wanting to eat better foods -- even gress-fed buffalo. "White with Foam"? Yes! Use Sea salt and pepper on your gress-fed beef at least one hour before cooking slowly over low heat and it is something to sing about. As for the flavor issue, it might be that what is learned first is learned best. Thus, maybe it is simply hard to adapt to the flavor of grass-finished beef, and/or maybe it is the quality of the grass that the particular beef eats which is determined by those same problems of seasonal changes and poor weather that brought about our learning to eat domesticated animals finished on corn mixed with antibiotics. Anyone for a chezborger? The Web page below is a good article by Cathy Thomas, Food editor The Orange County Register http://www.ocregister.com/life/steak-grassfed-vs-1712975-grainfed Wed Aug 01 23:39:05 -0700 2007 2783882 90917 JeetJet 2 2806201 Raising grass-fed beef is tricky - pasture quality, genetics, harvest age, etc. all play a part. The BEST grassfed beef I have ever had comes from Tallgrass Beef in Kansas. I eat as locally as I can, but have yet to find a local product that holds a candle here. I know the Tallgrass Beef is served at Harry Caray's in Chicago (among other places) and we have loved it. I have served it to grain-fed beef eaters to rave reviews. If you want to try grassfed for health reasons and have a grain-fed palate, try Tallgrass. Thu Aug 02 05:49:50 -0700 2007 2805980 80577 lmariaschneider 3 2807175 Two years ago we ate at a few different places in Chicago every night looking for the best ribeye in town (Yes, it was hard work). On our last night in town we all agreed to return to Harry Caray's because we all liked the meat there more than any other place we had a ribeye. We thought it was the aging (very tender) but what you say now explains the superior flavor. Also, I have never found a better ribeye.Thanks for the tip. Now I will contact Tallgrass and ask if they sell to a steakhouse in L.A. Web page for Tallgrass http://tallgrassbeef.com/ Thu Aug 02 10:15:26 -0700 2007 2806201 90917 JeetJet 4 3130021 Lets discuss why grassfed beef tastes different... if we can even argue that it does. There is a body of scientific research that says most Americans can't tell the difference, even though there is a clear difference in fatty acid composition between grain fed and grass fed cattle. Personally, I have worked in feedlots, and worked on some heritage breed pasture based farms in central NY, and I think I would rather risk my digestive tract on the grass fed cattle. To be fair, however, feedlots serve a purpose, they provide a consistent cookie-cutter product to a population who is content eating fast food hamburgers every day. Grass fed beef requires some talent to properly cook and flavor, and while it does have some more readily oxidized fatty acids, it is consistently leaner and contains a healthier fatty acid mix. I encourage people from all walks of life to really give grass fed beef a try; it is different than what most people are used to in this country, however, it is a healthier solution that provides a natural solution to many of the problems that feedlots have created. There will be little e-coli 0157-H7 in grass fed beef, as these cattle have an unsuitable rumen environment for this bug. Also, when your butcher tells you grass will kill cows, tell him to climb in his hobart grinder feet first. I had a client tell me this once, and couldn't quite believe my ears. Cattle are rumenants, and much like termites, they house microbes in their stomachs which allow them to convert cellulose into energy... there is a long pathway we will skip here, however. Cattle evolved this way, and we have tried to inefficiently feed them corn to get them fatter faster, regardless of cost, so that people will have a beef product they feel is consistently moist and has the same flavor (or fatty acid profile). So, I encourage you to go out and be daring, grass fed beef out of australia is very cheap and easy to come by... if you eat alot of beef, contact a local wholesaler who is probably importing from a company like Dunedin Beef... and order right from them. Go out there and eat grass fed! Thu Nov 15 23:59:52 -0800 2007 2807175 127836 JerseyMidwest 1 3131771 I've never been able to detect any difference in taste, but I've only tried the patties. It seems to cook faster and shrink more. Maybe not scientific, but I like the idea that this is what the cows would eat naturally if they were to roam free and not domesticated. Fri Nov 16 12:43:25 -0800 2007 2783882 46671 notmartha 1 3582446 I LOVE grass fed beef from Whole Foods supermarket. It’s SO much better than regular beef! If there’s a Whole Foods near you, go try theirs, it’s wonderful! My whole family agrees, it’s all we buy now. Thu Apr 10 15:43:06 -0700 2008 2783882 182515 Aggie M. 1 3582753 We buy our grass-fed beef on the hoof then have it dressed, aged, and butchered to our liking. Our preference is for very young beef; a nine month old steer being perfect for our taste. I do wish more people had the opportunity to taste this younger beef. It's tender, succulent, flavorful, and quite digestible. The fat is still creamy from mother's milk, and lightly yellow from the grass; and the cuts are about 1/4 to 1/3 smaller than those of older beef. Thu Apr 10 18:12:25 -0700 2008 2783882 172760 fromagina 2 3589671 Oh, I'm so jealous. My sister just got us a cow share which we'll receive in June. I can't wait...I also noticed that my local TJ's didn't have grass fed ground beef yesterday. It looks like they also redesigned some of the packaging. They had cryovac organic, which doesn't mean grass fed. I hope they will still have the grass fed... Sun Apr 13 10:12:10 -0700 2008 3582753 15457 peppatty 3 3887463 If it's organic, it's almost certainly grass fed. Grain-fed cattle need a constant dosing with antibiotics to counter-act the havoc wrought on their digestive system by corn. The use of antibiotics would render the beef non-organic. Mon Jul 21 08:19:00 -0700 2008 3589671 11995 pikawicca 4 4092153 Not necessarily, organic dairy cattle never see the pasture, they're given " organic remedies" to ease the pain. Wed Oct 08 19:19:10 -0700 2008 3887463 231444 mcnow 1 3587422 I've been buying only grass fed beef, mostl from Australia and NZ for a few years now, for health reasons and for taste and texture and because grain finishing negates the health benefits. Rarely, I've gotten a piece of meat with an unusual flavor I don't love, but usually it's very buttery, with the good mineral flavor that good beef should have. What it tastes like is very influenced by what's growing in that particular pasture at the time of grazing, so there's huge variety in the flavors of grass fed beef depending upon where they've been range fed. I like Oze beef from Australia and the NZ beef Trader Joe's carries. I also much prefer lamb from those countries. I really hate Niman ranch And Coleman beef, bad texture and flavors, IME. Sat Apr 12 10:52:06 -0700 2008 2783882 133381 mcf 1 3880612 There's a good chance that if you bought grass-fed ground beef, and it tasted bad, then some of the fatty acids oxidized. This would have given it a rancid flavor. Read the post from JerseyMidwest. I think this might have been the problem, try some grass-fed steak that seems more fresh next time. Fri Jul 18 09:40:00 -0700 2008 2783882 138683 NO SLICE 1 3881118 I can definitely understand your dislike for grass-fed beef. It has a sort of Earthy, dirt-taste to it that you don't find with other beef. But I do think it's taste you can adjust to if you prioritize the movement. I interviewd Bill Kurtis, a former CBS anchor who owns a ranch of grass-fed cows, and he swears by it. Fri Jul 18 11:59:50 -0700 2008 2783882 112406 Chew on That 1 3884084 Adam Perry Lang, famous BBQ chef,openly admits to viewing grain-fed beef as being better. The main difference being that grain-fed beef is much more fatty than grass. Grain-fed cows are the main reason why our beef is generally considered the best in the world, no matter what all-natural, organic pundants might say. Sat Jul 19 16:59:56 -0700 2008 2783882 146339 phan1 2 3884533 Your beef is considered the best on the world? Whose beef? By whom? Sat Jul 19 21:55:29 -0700 2008 3884084 189364 rachelfc 3 3884589 By reputation. The same reason why France has the reputation of having the best wine in the world. And it's a reputation that has been earned, not given. Sat Jul 19 22:36:13 -0700 2008 3884533 146339 phan1 4 3884656 I see. I'm presuming you are in the US and believe it is reputed to have the best beef in the world? I had just never heard of this reputation, even when I lived there, so was a little confused. No offence intended. Sat Jul 19 23:31:28 -0700 2008 3884589 189364 rachelfc 4 4091117 so if u.s. beef is so great, why is it banned in europe, japan, korea, etc? you can't pay a lot of visitors to the u.s. to eat beef here, it's considered dirty and unsafe-- a reputation that has been earned, not given. Wed Oct 08 12:31:09 -0700 2008 3884589 46030 soupkitten 2 3887272 Millions of Argentines would disagree with that statement. Mon Jul 21 07:13:47 -0700 2008 3884084 19646 laguera 3 3887470 Many Americans who have traveled abroad (of which I'm one) would disagree, as well. Mon Jul 21 08:21:01 -0700 2008 3887272 11995 pikawicca 4 3933297 Not sure about the reputation of US beef. Even the lunch buffets in Argentina serve beef in an entirely different league than US beef. Not only that, much of the world is terrified to consume US beef because of the atrocious food safety regulations here. Tue Aug 05 19:08:42 -0700 2008 3887470 10691 JeremyEG 2 3887430 What nonsense! US beef is most certainly not held in high esteem here (France) nor I suppose in most of the world. It's inexpensive and highly available. Argentine beef is often held in high esteem, as is Norman beef; both of these are places where cattle graze. Mon Jul 21 08:06:12 -0700 2008 3884084 177724 tmso 2 4091219 US has a reputation for the best beef in the world? Not by a long shot. If anything the opposite is true. It may have a good reputation among the American cattle industry, but that's about it. It barely even tastes like beef, and between the "factory" cows' unnatural diet and the drugs they are fed, it's a bad choice on many levels. But hey...what do I know? People buy it, and like it. Unfortunately, many people here in the US have been conditioned to be suspect of anything that has real flavor. Thankfully, we do have a choice. Just read labels carefully: a lot of "grass fed" beef is not 100 percent grass fed...it is often finished on a feed lot like conventional American "factory" beef. Wed Oct 08 13:03:43 -0700 2008 3884084 116047 The Professor 1 3886180 This seems to be a YMMV issue, As a kid I ate at the stockyards at Grand Jct. Colo and the beef there was range fed, back east I spent 10 years working for a residential school that raised its own beef, all grass fed. It is going to be different from feedlot beef and it is a function of what you are used to. Sun Jul 20 17:50:17 -0700 2008 2783882 206826 Old Fat Sailor 1 3890405 I've recently been buying grass fed beef at our local farmers' market (NY) and while I like the taste, it's been really challenging grilling it. The burgers are easy to get to medium rare, but yesterday I grilled strip steaks for less than 3 minutes on each side (last time 4 on each was too much), and they still came out past medium rare. I was so frustrated... I guess I'll try again with 2 minutes on each side. Any tips? Tue Jul 22 05:44:51 -0700 2008 2783882 28696 i_eat_a_lot_of_ice_cream 2 3890666 Check out this link from ebbatten's post above (from about a year ago): http://sustainabletable.org/features/... Tue Jul 22 07:24:12 -0700 2008 3890405 58123 wasny 2 4091128 "the farmer and the grill" by shannon hayes is a great book on grilling techniques for all types of grassfed meats. Wed Oct 08 12:34:04 -0700 2008 3890405 46030 soupkitten 1 3890585 It all goes back to you are what you eat. I don't think I've ever had 'exclusively' grass fed beef being born and raised here in the U.S. That and the fact that Ive never sought it out. A few cases in point with regard to the 'you are what you eat' statement. Many years ago not long after I furloughed out from the Air Force I moved up to up in Napa from So Cal. Lesuire time included fishing various lakes throughout Northern Ca, one of them being Lake Berryessa near Napa itself. Catfish were one of the more easily caught fish in the lake. The first time me and my friend brought home a mess of them my friends wife, who was from Thailand, fried them up in a pan for dinner. One bite and I wasn't too impressed with the muddy/mossey taste of the flesh of the fish. Even further back in time, when I was a young teen-ager and we were visiting my grandparents who were living in San Jose at the time and while dining out in what was at that time a 'fine dining' restaurant' I saw a 'frog legs' dinner on the menu and decided to be adventerous and ordered them because of all the talk that they tasted like 'chicken'. Well nothing could've been further from the truth. Tasted like pond water. Fast forward to more current times and now that most all the catfish you see on any menu in any restuarant in the country are farm raised and fed a diet of some kind of pellets and live in shallow waters of man made ponds. I decided to give catfish on the menu at a local Red Lobster a try. Well, there was no comparison in taste to those muddy creatures from the depths of Lake Berryessa. It was in a word dilectable. I now never hesitate to order it in any seafood restaurant that may have it on their menu or to buy it in the market and fix it myself. As far as frog legs goes, although I haven't had them since, I imagine if they are now 'farm raised' and fed a diet that is not the same as they would feed on in the wild, that they too would taste quite differently. And so it is I would imagine with the domesticated 'bovine' of the animal world. Should they be dining exclusively on the grasses of the the natural habitat of their wild ancestors the taste of the flesh is going to be different and not the same as if they had been grain fed. So if you've been raised all your life eating grain fed beef and are accustomed to its flavor and taste, then experiencing exclusively grass fed is going to be somewhat of a shock to your tastebuds and one that you might not enjoy...at first or may never come to like it period. So you may not be missing anything at all and I would not feel wrong, for not liking it. Of course there may be seasoning and or cooking techniques that could help with the flavor issue you experienced with the grass fed beef. Maybe an internet search engine could help you find information on how to prepare this type of beef. In fact here is the link to one just such web sight from a google search of 'preparing grass fed beef', 'Tips for Cooking Grass Fed Beef ' and the link to the many hits from that search. http://www.americangrassfedbeef.com/tips-for-cooking-grass-fed.asp http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=preparing+grass+fed+beef Tue Jul 22 06:56:46 -0700 2008 2783882 141261 crt 2 3933312 The grass fed vs. grain fed issue has to be discussed in the context of sustainability and health or it doesn't make any sense. It's not as simple as "I like oranges, so why should I change to apples? To each his own." Grain fed beef is a major contributor to the energy crisis and grass fed is not. Everyone needs to find his/her own balance but people generally seek out sustainable food for bigger reasons than taste. Also, grass fed beef can be cooked very well. It took me a few tries but I finally made a rare burger with very good fixins (homeade mayo, brioche, local pickles). Delicious and sustainable. JeremyEG Tue Aug 05 19:14:03 -0700 2008 3890585 10691 JeremyEG 1 4089217 the beauty of grass fed beef (well i should say ONE OF the ) is that you dont have to slather it in sauces and spices. it is so good and flavorful just the way it is. cows were meant to eat grass, not corn. With grain fed beef - you're getting antibiotics along with that taste. Really - it's just b/c you are used to it ... someone from argentina, just like the person who posted to this reply from colombia - they eat beef fed on grass - always - and when they eat grain fed beef here - it tastes bad. This is one of the couple of reasons Americans are SO FAT, and other countries - dont suffer from the obesity we see here. EVERYTHING is processed here! corn is genetically modified then given to cows. YOU SHOULD read OMNIVOURS DILEMA - very good book - easy read too... Tue Oct 07 17:10:33 -0700 2008 2783882 160898 feebee45 2 4090617 I agree that grass-fed beef, when aged properly, is superior to corn-fed, but I will say that not all Argentines think our beef tastes bad. I am married to an Argentine, and we have family and friends come to visit all the time. Almost all the Argentines (and various other South Americans) I have cooked for remark on how delicious the beef is. I am not going to get into the politics of it, but a lot of people, not just Americans, like the taste of corn-fed beef. Wed Oct 08 09:40:42 -0700 2008 4089217 19646 laguera 1 4090653 Ohmagawd, thank u so much for posting this. I had a similiar experience and my husband and I were so perplexed. Was it us? Was it something we did/didn't do? I feel better, after reading other responses. We purchased a couple of ribeyes from a grass-fed beef farmer at our farmer's market. We've had his flank steaks before and liked them, but we had marinated them. I didn't do anything to the ribeyes other than oil, s&p and cooked them 3 mins each side in a cast iron skillet and then an additional 2 mins. in a hot oven to med. rare. The beef had a strange gamey flavor (for lack of a better description) and it was so tough that we couldn't finish our steaks. Now, mind you, we are adventurous eaters and not typically turned off by something out of the ordinary. I suppose it was not what we were expecting and so we were surprised by the flavor. Does the beef tend to be tougher too? Wed Oct 08 09:57:34 -0700 2008 2783882 71241 lynnlato 2 4090687 Grass-fed beef is definitely leaner. So that's why you probably think it's tougher. When you cook it, you really shouldn't cook it as long as grain-fed beef. At home, I eat grass-fed beef -- ground beef, short ribs, brisket, chuck, flank, etc. However, when I go to a steakhouse (about once a year), I prefer grain-fed. To me, a grass-fed steak is just not the same. And, yes, I've had grass-fed steaks before. Wed Oct 08 10:13:30 -0700 2008 4090653 10763 Miss Needle 3 4090961 Well, thanks for the information. I cooked it how I would a grain-fed beef steak. Now I know. I guess it's back to the market to give it another try! I do think the flavor is simply a matter of getting used to. It's like tasting lamb for the first time and expecting it to taste like beef. I loved the flank steak and was pleasantly surprised by the more prominent beef flavor. Wed Oct 08 11:37:15 -0700 2008 4090687 71241 lynnlato 4 4091192 To hades with what i call milk cow beef. I was raised on it when we could afford beef at all. Sure you can "get used" to free range /grass fed beef, but why? You could get used to cow corn instead of sweet corn too, but why? If you want to live like a third world peasant or a monk , buy a hair shirt. Please, no one tell me about the delights of free range chicken either. Again, i was raised on them, shooting them in the head and then chopping off the head so they could bleed out and then scalding and plucking and they were in the end, fit only for the pressure cooker and none too good even then. We are becoming a nation of food snobs, having CONVINCED ourselves that this stuff must be good because it is ghastly expensive and the in crowd extols it's virtues. Like it? fine, eat it. If i have to learn to like it i'll pass thanks. dick Wed Oct 08 12:56:08 -0700 2008 4090961 148516 mr jig 5 4091348 I think you misuderstood me. I don't want to learn to like something simply because it is hip or now or whatever. If, however, it is a better product because it is environmentally and animal friendly, well then I'll consider it. I had one steak that I didn't enjoy from a farmer who had sold me several flank steaks that I loved. I wasn't sure if I got a bad cut or what. As for free range chicken - I much prefer it over my local supermarket stuff. Less fat to trim and more flavorful. Even if it tasted the same, I would likely chose it because I think there's something to be said for the chicken that has had a better quality of life than those crammed on top of one another in a commercial poultry farm. But that's just me. Each to their own. Wed Oct 08 13:46:42 -0700 2008 4091192 71241 lynnlato 1 5086438 I'll agree that what you had was probably oxidized beef. I've had rancid/oxidized corn-fed meat before -- I don't think the bad taste had to do with it's provenance. We eat almost exclusively grass-fed beef and buffalo, and I prefer it so much to grain-fed beef that on the rare occasion I go to a steakhouse and order a corn-fed steak, I am immediately struck by how flavorless and "not-beefy" it is (I have given up filets forever. Just 'cause something is tender doesn't make it delicious. Flabby, bland, overpriced. Boo.) We just served grass-fed buffalo strips at a party, and they were the tenderest, most flavorful (and with only moderate marbling) steaks we had ever had. Our guests remarked on how delicious they were and didn't realize they were Buffalo until we told them. Re: Mr. Jig's (furious!) post, I don't think this is food snobbery. I think trying to eat in a way that respects the environment, and also your family's health (who wants to eat meat from an animal that spent it's last days standing knee-deep in feces, eating ground up bits of other animals and being pumped full of drugs to keep multiple infections at bay? Yuck!). Most other developed countries pasture their cows (I just spent three weeks in France and didn't see one feedlot -- drive a couple of hours in California and it's nothing but manure and miserable cows as far as the eye can see) and it's better for the animals, better for the environment, and better for you. Give it one more try. Whole Foods is a very reliable place to get certified, sustainable, grass-fed meats. Don't write it off just yet! Wed Oct 07 14:15:39 -0700 2009 2783882 1114603 Francoise 2 5087543 Great post! I've served ground buffalo ti guests as well and mt guests have remarked that it's the best burger they've ever eaten. In addition to Whole Foods, I would also suggest your local farmer's market. Some people have specific tastes in red meat (more fat, less fat, mild, etc). Go ahead and ask the beef or bison farmer at your market which cut might be best for you. I find most farmers more than willing to work with their customers. Don't expect that at McDonald's! Enjoy. JeremyEG Wed Oct 07 23:06:05 -0700 2009 5086438 10691 JeremyEG 2 5091217 We also buy and eat only grass fed beef, and it's for health, environmental and humane reasons all. To lower cost, I plan to buy a chest freezer and begin ordering from a farmer and buying half an animal cut to our specifications. Flavors are much better, though varied depending upon what animals have grazed on, and meat is tender, but not in the same way as highly marbled grain/corn fed beef. Fri Oct 09 10:13:41 -0700 2009 5086438 133381 mcf 1 5093235 Once you had grass fed beef in Argentina you will not eat anything else. Cows cannot digest corn and would never eat it if they had a choice. But corn is cheap, government subsidized fodder, so the cows get it together with medication which helps with the digestion. I do not want these drugs in my food even if they are considered safe. Sat Oct 10 08:27:05 -0700 2009 2783882 291326 apple11