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Anything new or coming to Dade?

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We've heard of some leaving and others who apparently are at the begining of their end...I'm just wondering if anyone knows of anything new or on the horizon down here in the D A D E? Please advise who, when and where...if you dare!

Here's one for you all, Watch for a new Mari-Nalli Gourmet Quesadillas coming to Coco Walk...love their Cheezeburger & Rueban Quesadillas...presently serving them in the Gables.

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  1. The exquisite and innovative cooking of Michael Mina is coming to South Florida. The scheduled opening of his Bourbon Steak at Aventura's Fairmont Turnberry Isle Resort & Club this winter is noteworthy not only because Mina is one of the country's most talented chefs and restaurateurs but because it will be the first time the private resort has opened its dining rooms to the public.

    Mina is known for maintaining super-high standards at his eight successful ventures in San Francisco, Las Vegas and Atlantic City (Sea Blue, Nob Hill, Stripsteak).

    Expect premium meats and upscale takes on classic steakhouse sides (duck-fat fries, truffled macaroni and cheese, bacon-creamed spinach).

    16 Replies
    1. re: Sobe

      Oh Sobe!

      D-D-d-d-d-d-duck fat fries?!

      You had me at hello.

      p.s. to Net:

      10 things New to the 305 -

      1. Santo hires Cory Smith (X Pacific Time)
      2. Devito's opens and offers tourists a "flight" of steaks that costs more than the flight to Florida
      3. Prime Blue Grill (X Smith & Wollensky) opens on Brickell noting the lack of steak places in the area
      4. Grimpa opens in Mary Brickell Village noting the lack of steak places in the area.
      5. Indians invade South Beach opening ISHQ and Ocean Drive Fusion at the north and south ends of the drive. Intense Red Rover Game ensues.
      6. Bonefish Grill opens on Ponce - leaves fish heads wrapped in newsprint on Oceanaire's doorstep. Maitre d' learns that Luco Brazzi sleeps with the fishes.
      7. La Marea (the Tides) opens at the Tides Hotel replacing ill-fated 1220 with LA's Il Sole celeb Chef Rota. Govind Armstrong seen mooning lost diners from the Regent patio.
      8. Home Boy Michael Blum rolls in to the Newport Resort on 163rd/Collins, wonders where Sunny Isles went and starts work on a new restaurant while he searches.
      9. Rascal house is still there.
      10. Christine Lee's isn't - Reopening soon at Gulfstream

      Have a Great Weekend!

      AG

      1. re: advisor_Girl

        I know this is the opposite of coming to Dade, but did Johnny V's close?

        1. re: lax2mia

          Johnny V's did close and Chowhound removed my post about it. Not sure why!

          1. re: LesleyEats

            Yes your post was removed while I was reading it. I had to call Johnny's PR people to find out the facts.

            AG What are you implying by, "Govind Armstrong seen mooning lost diners from the Regent patio."? Are they in trouble?

            1. re: 2top

              Why do you think they removed my post on JV? I heard the news from JV's PR people firsthand! Oh well. Sad either way.

              1. re: LesleyEats

                I actually responded to your post before it was removed. They probably deleted it because you asked what was going to close next... Regardless, I'm surprised Johnny V's closed. I've been a fan since his initial stint at The Astor. His sandwich place on Alton was great too. I've had great meals at the Las Olas location.

                1. re: Sobe

                  I was just curious to know what could possibly close next because it seems like it's an epidemic of late--what, with Pacific Time, Norman's, now JV's! I loved JV at the Astor back in the day, same with JV's kitchen on Alton and up on Las Olas. Remember when he was in Delray at Sundy House, De La Tierra? It's a shame. And I am still curious to hear what closes next...:)

                  1. re: Sobe

                    The South Beach location was nothing like the old Astor or Las Olas for that matter. It was very off and his Thursday pig roast was a trainwreck. I hope he opens a sandwich place though. I miss the hoagies.

                    1. re: lax2mia

                      I agree. It didn't have the same vibe it used to.

                      1. re: LesleyEats

                        Only went once and it was a letdown. I don't understand it either. First incarnation was great (and the diner place on Alton was fantastic) and I've heard generally good things about the FTL location. Did he lose his mojo?

                2. re: 2top

                  2top>

                  No!

                  Like you, I have read the rumors on Chowhound that Evolution and Table 8 are struggling. I was only joking that new next door neighbors Govind Armstrong and Pietro Rota are rival Los Angeles "celebrity chefs." Armstrong's Table 8 started in LA and new-chef-in-town Rota is best known for his Low-key-but-High-Q Il Sole on the Sunset Strip...

                  Honestly - I hope they ALL survive the summer and keep the hounds well fed.

                  AG

            2. re: advisor_Girl

              You are hilarious!

              1. re: LesleyEats

                I also just saw an ad for a new indian restaurant coming to coral gables...the Mint Leaf....apparently it's from a London restaurant group, so sounds promising!

                1. re: LesleyEats

                  My dry cleaner is next door and she said it's a family with restaurants in London. I've looked at the website for the London Mint Leaf's and if it's the same concept the we're in for some mod Indian!

                  1. re: lax2mia

                    Awesome! It's about time!

            3. re: Sobe

              Bourbon Steak, vaunted chef-restaurateur Michael Mina's first Florida foray, debuts Tuesday at the Fairmont Turnberry Isle Resort & Club -- the first time the Aventura property has opened its doors to the dining public. Mina has eight restaurants (Sea Blue, Nob Hill, Stripsteak) in San Francisco, Las Vegas and Atlantic City.

              The steakhouse-style menu includes ''Michael's Classics'' ($22-$46) like Maine lobster pot pie. Two South Florida restaurant veterans, executive chef Andrew Rothschild (The Forge) and general manager John Riccardo (Norman's) will have day-to-day charge of the 250-seater at 19999 W. Country Club Dr.; 786-279-6600.

              I was unable to locate menu on Mina's website although he does have Bourbon Steak in Detroit.
              http://www.michaelmina.net/

              You can make reservations on opentable.com and they have a profile
              http://www.opentable.com/rest_profile...

            4. I believe texas de brazil (brazillian rodizio) is coming to SOBE. Supposedly better than porcao, which I hear has deteriorated.

              5 Replies
              1. re: tpigeon

                Yes! they are opening above Monty's. Progress is slow, though. Probably won't open until 'season'

                1. re: LesleyEats

                  Also newish -

                  If anyone is participating in the alleged cosmic specialness of 777 (July 7, 2007) which promises to be WAY luckier than next week's previously scheduled Friday the 13th (always the better day for not-so-lucky me)...

                  The Pelican Hotel on Ocean Drive is throwing a 777 Dinner Party.

                  Seven-course meal, seven wines from seven countries, and room rates from $77 if you actually drink all seven wines and want to avoid the police DUI road block at the golf course on 23/Alton driving home. It's Saturday night, 8:30 p.m. 826 Ocean Dr. (305-673-3373).

                  Has anyone eaten at the Pelican - ever?

                  AG

                  1. re: advisor_Girl

                    I've had breakfast and lunch there, but never dinner. Not bad, not fab.

                    1. re: advisor_Girl

                      AG: Not kidding about the DUI roadblocks. They are a major hassle. Getting harassed after a nice meal out with friends is a real downer, even if you don't drink. Anyone knows where the road blocks are tonight so they can be avoided?

                    2. re: LesleyEats

                      All of these places come and go, then come, and go again. It's the Johnny V syndrome.

                  2. I read that Chef Ramsey was opening a place in Miami but have been unable to confirm same.

                    5 Replies
                    1. re: Sobe

                      I also heard Gordon Ramsay was coming to Miami..maybe on the tails of Ducasse downtown?

                      1. re: LesleyEats

                        This is from way back in 2006. A little ways from Miami though.

                        http://www.gordonramsay.com/corporate...

                        1. re: LesleyEats

                          "Daniel Boulud is taking on Miami. In 2009, he will open an outpost of db Bistro Moderne, his bustling Manhattan bistro, in the $1 billion Metropolitan Miami project, which will transform the downtown area with two residential buildings, an entertainment complex and a hotel. Boulud's bistro will reside inside the Met Marquis, a new luxury hotel from Marriott."

                          2009......

                          http://www.nypost.com/seven/06072007/...

                          1. re: Sobe

                            Ah! Boulud is what I meant, not Ducasse! Thanks for clarifiying!

                            1. re: Sobe

                              Went to Boulud's place in Palm Beach (in the Brazilian Court hotel) once and it was pretty good. Menu is sort of odd, with four different sections with different "themes" (traditional, seasonal, "voyage" - which was cuisine from around the world or something, and yet another I can't recall).

                        2. Rosa Mexicano Restaurant
                          coming to 900 South Miami Avenue between SE 9th and 10th.
                          "the gold standard for upscale modern Mexican cuisine." Zagat

                          9 Replies
                          1. re: 2top

                            hope it is as good as in nyc...

                            1. re: tpigeon

                              Here's an blog entry from the New Times which talks about some of the suspicions we've had about restaurant closures (both current and possibly on their way).

                              http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptid...

                              1. re: lax2mia

                                We were just at Evolution again last weekend to eat at the bar, and the bartenders did say they had done some things to close up some parts of the space for the summer. My first time eating there was only a few weeks ago and all the restaurant seating was in a circular area that faces out onto Collins, I have no idea if this is the "real" dining room or not (it did seem small). There was also a sushi bar which they had curtained off to make the space they're using feel more "intimate." The first time we went they turned at least 2 seatings of every table and didn't appear to be slow, but the more recent visit was pretty quiet.

                                Incidentally, the sushi (which you can order from the bar menu) was very pricey and only OK. A goat cheese salad was nice but not very exciting. The "Bouley Burger" was quite good - slightly dry, but very flavorful (could there be some pork or bacon in the mix?), with a great sesame seed bun (their baker is excellent) and some homemade, just barely pickled pickles. Though the french fries were a bit limp. The drinks menu is really fantastic - I am generally not a fan of "martinis" these days, which are generally oversweet fruit bombs, but these have some great balance of booze, sweet & tart with lots of intriguing homemade ingredients.

                                If the restaurant isn't going to make it (and I hope it does, there's not much else like it in town), I sure hope the bar stays.

                                1. re: Frodnesor

                                  Guess reports of its demise have been greatly exaggerated.

                                  http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptid...

                                  1. re: lax2mia

                                    That report is pretty consistent with what we heard from the bartenders last weekend, as described above.

                                    1. re: Frodnesor

                                      Irrelevant but relevant...
                                      • The bubbly is by Chandon Saturday at David Bouley Evolution, 1669 Collins Ave., Miami Beach, which launches a monthly series of prix-fixe champagne evenings in the Etoile Lounge. Available from 8 to 10 p.m., the menu of passed hors d'oeuvres includes Bouley Burgers, gazpacho shooters, tuna tartare with avocado and saffron miso sauce sushi. Cost is $55 including tax and tip; 305-604-6090.

                                      1. re: Sobe

                                        I've got to tell you, a Bouley Burger ($15) and one of those martinis ($14, but almost like a 1.5 for 1 since you get the rest of the shaker, like it's a milkshake) is a pretty nice meal - especially if they'd improve the crispiness of their fries.

                                        1. re: Frodnesor

                                          David Bouley at South Beach is coming to town. According to Mr. Bouley, a new ownership group has taken over, and the renamed restaurant is expected to open soon. The menu will be similar to that of Upstairs at Bouley Bakery in New York, which features an eclectic menu of smaller plates from sushi offerings to burgers and Japanese-influenced fish dishes.

                                          I posted this under the Evolution thread as well. Figured it belonged here too

                            2. re: 2top

                              Soon

                              http://www.rosamexicano.info/servlet/...

                            3. More Beefsteak?
                              Word has it that, Touch, the folks who gave us Kiss Steakhouse and Lounge at 301 Lincoln Rd are planning a new steakhouse across the road at 915 Lincoln Rd.

                              2 Replies
                              1. re: 2top

                                Say it isn't so! Kiss was an excellent, if not gaudy and somewhat tacky, steakhouse! But come on already! The last thing we need on South Beach is, in no particular order: another steakhouse, sushi joint or Italian restaurant. Where's the creativity here?

                                1. re: 2top

                                  Never ate at Kiss but the bar/upstairs lounge area was a good spot for a drink

                                2. Totally agree with Netmover on Mari-Nalli Gourmet Quesadillas. I live walking distance away and the place is really good and the owner is very nice. Also, they don't use fatty oil and stuff so a lot of the quesadillas are figure friendly! Try some of their chicken quesadillas the are delish!

                                  1 Reply
                                  1. re: lorilaw

                                    Exactly lorilaw...the Quesadillas made at Mari Nalli never touch the oil, in fact they are made in a turbo oven! In addition, 'cheese' constitutes less than a third of the entire ingredient make up. I immediately cringed when the owner told me he was going to do Gourmet Quesadilla's, but these are like no other quesadillas, other than the fact that they're contained in a tortilla.

                                    What else is coming to D A D E ? ? ? If anyone knows, it's a chowhound!

                                  2. I heard that Sardinia may take over another space near it's original and open up a different concept, something more casual...also opening near Sardinia in the old Madiba space is 71st street gem, Ouzo!

                                    7 Replies
                                    1. re: LesleyEats

                                      wow...Sardinia is opening another place...that's news. Please keep me posted should you hear anything else. Ouzo's opened, no? Is it as good as OPA?

                                      1. re: netmover

                                        I like Ouzo better than Opa..it's more authentic, less chain-y, less frenetic. We'll see how it does in that location, which seems to be sadly cursed..

                                        1. re: netmover

                                          And yes, stay tuned for Sardinia news...

                                          1. re: LesleyEats

                                            They are still in the design phase of the sardinia expansion. Don't expect anything until late this year, early next...

                                            Funny you say the Ouzo location is cursed. The same could be said of sardinia before they moved in. Probably a good omen :).

                                          2. re: netmover

                                            IMHO, it depends on what you order. I prefer the spitfire roasted lamb at Opa than any lamb dish at Ouzo's,although the lamb shank my fiance had at Ouzo's was very yummy ;-). However, I agree that Ouzo's is more authentic and less "chainy" (love that BTW).

                                          3. re: LesleyEats

                                            You are correct. There is also an argentinian steakhouse opening in the area as well as a 24 hour coffee shop.

                                            Ouzo is done, just waitning for permits...

                                            1. re: tpigeon

                                              I had been under the impression that the SoBe spot was going to be a second location for Ouzo. Unfortunately that appears not to be the case. The 71st Street location looks to be vacated and the realtor has "for lease" signs up. It's a loss for the Normandy area.

                                          4. Also news for South Beach...

                                            Queen Latifah is opening a fast food franchise, FatBurger, later this year. What's interesting is that this burger chain combines the concept of Burger King and Wendy's - the meat is never frozen and you, as a customer, can request for the burger to be either fried (like Wendy's) or flame-broiled (like Burger King, but, again, using meat that has never been frozen).

                                            19 Replies
                                            1. re: mialebven

                                              You're not kidding.

                                              http://www.local10.com/entertainment/...

                                              http://www.fatburger.com/home/

                                              http://www.chowhound.com/topics/326555

                                              1. re: Sobe

                                                Fatburger is sinful. It's nothing like Burger King or Wendy's. When I lived in LA it was a most guilty pleasure. The only thing that comes close is In & Out Burger, also from California.

                                                1. re: 2top

                                                  FATBURGER!!!!! I still prefer In-n-Out as I see Fatburger as In-n-Outs older, bigger, grungier cousin, but I never thought I'd see a Fatburger here. It's been so long since I've been to one that all I remember is that chopped boiled egg was a topping option.
                                                  I'd seen a sign up in a space on Washington Ave. but it was so ragged I thought they were just using it to cover up the window of an empty spot (didn't want to get my hopes up).

                                                  1. re: lax2mia

                                                    I WISH WE had an In-n-Out down here. Ok, in other opening news: Michael's Kitchen from Hollywood is opening in Sunny Isles in September. Speaking of Sunny Isles, am I the only one who thinks Il Mulino blows?

                                                    1. re: LesleyEats

                                                      Haven't eaten at Il Mulino but was by there last weekend, looked at the menu, and was just flabbergasted that any fuss is being made over this place. Looked like any other garden variety generic Italian restaurant.

                                                      1. re: Frodnesor

                                                        I tried it twice and all I got was a saucy mess. The service was condescending and if the waiter tried to push wine on us one more time, I was going to order a bottle to break over his head. In all seriousness, though, the place is always mobbed and I am puzzled, wondering, do they just not know any better?

                                                      2. re: LesleyEats

                                                        Michael's Kitchen blows.

                                                        1. re: Sobe

                                                          Really? I've never been! What's it like? I never even heard of it until recently

                                                          1. re: LesleyEats

                                                            The Weston/Pembroke crowd flock to it since it tries to be trendy but it fails on every level. Food is mediocre at best and that assumes it's not going to be served ice cold. It's cheesecake factory jr. plus the service blows.

                                                            http://www.chowhound.com/topics/134142

                                                        2. re: LesleyEats

                                                          Have you all lost your minds? Fatburger, In-n-Out, guilty pleasure? Any home ground burger -- Bittman's NY Times article -- blows all of this away. Real potatoes for the fries ... this is somehow a big deal?

                                                          1. re: taiga

                                                            Ok, by the way, hardly a culinary loss, but Senor Frog's has closed on South Beach due to what seems to be plaguing the beach----exorbitant rent.....this is a very disconcerting trend..I fear that the beach will become I4 in Orlando with every chain restaurant imaginable as the only places able to afford the rents. That said, I hear the new Outback was quite tasty on Wash Ave.

                                                            1. re: LesleyEats

                                                              No please don't even think about such a nightmare!!!! It is hard as it is...
                                                              That said, I can't believe that place lasted that long ;-)

                                                              1. re: yomyb

                                                                Remember Moe's Cantina in Senor's place? That place was great. Though it could have been the tequila. Anyway, I think it's sad what's going on on the beach with places not being able to afford their rent. The beach is turning into one great big Mall of the Americas replica...

                                                                1. re: LesleyEats

                                                                  They should bring back Stephen Talkhouse

                                                                  1. re: Sobe

                                                                    They are totally gutting the place. Talkhouse was THE BEST. that would rock. Somehow I fear it'll either be an Applebee's or a BCBG store.

                                                            2. re: taiga

                                                              Would I rather pay $1.49 for In-n-Out to make my burger fresh vs. grinding my own meat? Heck yeah. That's why it's a guilty pleasure.

                                                              1. re: lax2mia

                                                                Define the fresh burger. How many cows per burger?

                                                                1. re: taiga

                                                                  How's about not frozen burger.

                                                                  1. re: lax2mia

                                                                    One cow too many for me! Perhaps the freshness is an improvement, though of course, we're not eating "fresh" sashimi or sushi are we?

                                                  2. Por Fin Restaurant porfinrestaurant.com is opening up in the Gables. It will have the Catalonian chef Marc Vidal, who has cooked at Michelin-starred restaurants like El Bulli and in Paris, L'Arpege and Alain Ducasse. Definitely gotta keep an eye on this new high end establishment - and it most likely will offer Spanish fare.

                                                    1 Reply
                                                    1. re: mialebven

                                                      Wow - nice resume, I got the impression it was going to be another mediocre mediterranean hodgepodge based on the website which says it's going to offer "diners a unique experience by serving authentic dishes from Spain, Southern France and Italy, fused with creative touches of the 21st century."

                                                    2. Boteco, Brazilian place, just opened on NE 79th St. More here -
                                                      http://www.chowhound.com/topics/425053

                                                      1. Here's something hot off another blog. Looks like we can expect everything from Michael Mina to Fatburger.

                                                        http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptid...

                                                        1. I'm on a tear today. Here's a new wine shop/small plates place that opened next to Michy's.

                                                          http://wine69miami.com/default.aspx

                                                          5 Replies
                                                          1. re: lax2mia

                                                            Is this open? I drive that strip almost every night and didn't even notice it.

                                                            1. re: Frodnesor

                                                              It's open. Looks like a good neighborhood joint.

                                                              1. re: lax2mia

                                                                Indeed had a great big "YES WE'RE OPEN" sign in the window tonight. Will have to check it out.

                                                                1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                  Popped into Wine 69 a week or so ago. Decent (not remarkable but OK) selection of wines. Very friendly folks. Didn't eat, but took home a nice (and nicely priced) Bourdeaux. Seems there's one price to have there, another if you're just "getting take out".

                                                                  Nothing particularly exciting about the menu. Don't understand this recent trend of doing salads, cheeses and deli meats and calling it "food to pair with wine" (the online menu of the new South Beach place is very similar). Salad is generally notoriously unfriendly to wines. Why not be honest and call it "food that doesn't require an actual kitchen to prepare"?

                                                                  1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                    News Cafe used to offer Deli Meat & Cheese platters you could order by the 1/2 or 1/4 pound as I remember, they finally took it off their menu years ago due to the fact it didn't sell! Wierd to see this trend trying to make a come back...scratch that, I'm not sure it ever was a trend to begin with beyond there!

                                                                    Anybody heard anything about the old Shooters up on the Intercoastal? I hear it's going to reopen as Sol and Sombia or some such spelling?

                                                          2. Keep and eye out for Alta Cocina coming to South Miami sometime later this month. It's a husabnd and wife team from Johnson and Wales, who worked at Michy's and are now taking a stab at the entreprenuerial life.

                                                            3 Replies
                                                            1. re: netmover

                                                              Netmover - where in South Miami... and do you know who the husband and wife are? It's not Michelle Bernstein and her husband David opening a new place, is it?

                                                              1. re: jayfla

                                                                They worked at Michy's it is NOT Michy and her husband. It's right there on Sunset, dare I say downtown South Miami?

                                                                1. re: netmover

                                                                  In South Miami they'll have to compete with Don Pan and construction cranes.

                                                            2. Fatburger coming soon to sobe...what's the word on this cali chain?

                                                              3 Replies
                                                              1. re: netmover

                                                                It's In-n-out's oversized, sloppy cousin. You can get burger flame grilled or griddle grilled. There's many toppings (chopped egg used to be one).

                                                                1. re: lax2mia

                                                                  i don't think fat burger is even close to in-n-out. They are totally different in taste.

                                                                  It has been 10 years since i have had a fatburger, but i have in-n-out yearly when i go to vegas.

                                                                2. re: netmover

                                                                  Scroll up there was some discussion on this (Fat burger) last month

                                                                3. BBQ Beach Too is taking over the Roadhouse on +/-133rd and Biscayne. I just got done seraching them here and found a long lost invite to the original in South Beach by none other than AG! Sorry I missed that...I must have been on a diet for a couple weeks back then? Too bad it didn't last long! :-)

                                                                  I was told by the guy inside (they are still aways out from opening) that their Brisket and Pork are the best...and was glad to see your review concurring AG. I think it's a great idea to hook up the SOFLA CH crew! Count me in...

                                                                  1. This restaurant is supposed to open sometime this month or the next. I stumbled across this in Facebook:

                                                                    ANDU Restaurant/Bar Miami, FL.

                                                                    DESCRIPTION:
                                                                    Ran by the Craziest Chef in Miami: Chef Duly and His brother Tony. This restaurant promises to be one a of a kind dining experience in an Avante Garde atmosphere.

                                                                    CONTACT:
                                                                    Duly Viejo jpviejo@gmail.com

                                                                    ADDRESS:
                                                                    690 SW 1st Court
                                                                    Miami, 33130, FL

                                                                    2 Replies
                                                                    1. re: mialebven

                                                                      Looks like Tao (from NYC and Las Vegas) is coming to Lincoln Road, according to the press: http://stuckonthepalmetto.blogspot.co...

                                                                      1. re: mialebven

                                                                        I actually went to school with Duly, he is a funny guy. The restaurant will be in the Neovertika building on the river downtown. Hopefully the restaurant is a keeper, as he has been working to get it up and running for a long time now.

                                                                      2. ok, so we now have a Chipotle here in Dade...and yes (although it's a chain) that's a good thing...and we have more steakhouses on the way to southern sobe. What else is cooking on the 305 horizon?

                                                                        I heard about a place in the Gables today called Sazon or some derivitive thereof. Any one got the goods on that, or anything else coming soon to the Magic City?

                                                                        4 Replies
                                                                        1. re: netmover

                                                                          Only new place I know of coming into the Gables is Por Fin. I've heard there's a new Mexican place getting built out on Miracle Mile, perhaps that's what you heard of. Oh, and there's also apparently going to be another Nexxt Cafe on Miracle Mile where the Burger King used to be - I'm still trying to decide whether that qualifies as an upgrade.

                                                                          1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                            Rest assured Frod, it does not!

                                                                            Thanks for the Por Fin heads up...what's new in your neck of the woods? Although it's not new, I have heard a couple good things about Toscana. Have you been?

                                                                            1. re: netmover

                                                                              We've been to Toscana a couple times. It's enjoyable but not excellent. Can't quite put a finger on why I'm not completely sold on it. The proprietor is really warm and friendly and it's always a nice meal. Nice selection of and pretty fairly priced wines, predominantly Italian.

                                                                              A Columbian hot dog joint, La Perrada de Edgar, has opened on Collins around 69th (across from El Rey de Chivito - they ought to just install a coronar care unit on the corner!) but I haven't tried yet.

                                                                          2. re: netmover

                                                                            From a bunch of other topics:

                                                                            BLT Steak somewhere on Ocean Dr.
                                                                            Michael Mina's Bourbon Steak in Turnberry
                                                                            A is moving from the outskirts of the Design District to the beach
                                                                            I had read of a couple of places opening in the Design District, but forget names and cuisine.

                                                                          3. Rumors:

                                                                            Brosia
                                                                            63 NE 39th Street
                                                                            Miami, Florida 33137
                                                                            (305) 531-8700
                                                                            www.brosiamiami.com
                                                                            the first from the newly formed hospitality division of DACRA Development. Brosia will offer Mediterranean cuisine, signature sangria as well as a 4000-square-foot courtyard with mosaic walls, white columns and 150-year-old oak trees.

                                                                            Domo Japones/Bardot
                                                                            4000 N. E. 2 nd Avenue
                                                                            Miami,FL
                                                                            a modern Japanese bistro and lounge from Amir Ben-Zion of Townhouse, Bond St. and Miss Yip's fame, opening in the Design District's historic post office this fall. The restaurant will offer sushi, sashimi and scene every night until 2 a.m.

                                                                            3 Replies
                                                                            1. re: miaedu

                                                                              nice news miaedu...that post office is looking very smart...as is Brosia. The Design District could soon become a bonafide Chowhound zone.

                                                                              Elements already has one of my all time favorite pastas, and Chef Lorena Garcia has gone relatively unnoticed here in the MIA, but her LatAm TV appearences have not. The fact that she's lunch only may very well have something to do with it?

                                                                              Micheal's certainly helped put the place on the map...and these additions coupled with some already existing joints i.e. Charcutterie, Orange, Grass, Pacha ????

                                                                              Anyone know what's up with Disctrict?

                                                                              1. re: miaedu

                                                                                Domo Japones appears close to opening.

                                                                                http://domojapones.com/

                                                                                blurb I found about the place

                                                                                Domo Japones is a casual fine dining bistro with a high energy artistic personality. This is our third and newest concept blending the refinement of Japanese cuisine in a bistro type atmosphere.

                                                                                1. re: The Chowfather AKA sobe

                                                                                  Domo Japones, is officially open for lunch and dinner. A grand opening party is Dec. 18.

                                                                              2. Something new has opened up in the space in the bottom of the office building at 70th & Biscayne (opposite side from Michy's). There used to be some nondescript place called in there whose name escapes me. New place is called, I think, Moonchine. Haven't peeked in yet.

                                                                                6 Replies
                                                                                1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                  I jujst read about that somewhere, did they in fact open?

                                                                                  1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                    Moonchine Asian Bistro
                                                                                    7100 Biscayne Blvd
                                                                                    Miami, FL 33138
                                                                                    305).759.3999

                                                                                    maybe this space is jinxed, haven't several other places failed there?

                                                                                    1. re: miaedu

                                                                                      Sure looked open to me. There have been maybe 1 or possibly 2 other attempts at this spot. A little further north in another space there was briefly a somewhat intriguing place that was doing sort of contemporary Haitian/Caribbean.

                                                                                      1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                        It is the second outpost of Indochine Bistro.

                                                                                        1. re: 2top

                                                                                          They've got quick delivery service. Nothing special, but better than Hiro's down the street which, from what the woman at the counter told me, is no longer associated with the Hiro's chain (in NMB and Sobe).

                                                                                          1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                            I would second the nothing special nod. Delivery is a nice feature, wasn't fast for us though. Chicken and shrimp soups are divine. The curry dish we had contained uncooked potatoes!

                                                                                  2. LA Boîte à Pizza : OPENING First or Second week of November
                                                                                    Franchise introduced in Europe & China and first location in USA on Miami Beach (Alton Road).

                                                                                    1 Reply
                                                                                    1. re: 2top

                                                                                      http://www.laboiteapizza.com/fr/

                                                                                    2. who is the chef for andu and when do they open. Theres also a new restaurant opening on brickell with similar concept badrutts place any info on that?

                                                                                      1. Nexxt Cafe has opened a second location in Coral Gables on Miracle Mile (the old Burger King spot). Soft opening was the past Friday, we went for lunch today, and - say what you will about the food - service and kitchen were already humming on all cylinders. We were in and out in about an hour with a pretty much full house 12:30 lunch crowd and not a single thing mis-executed.

                                                                                        The menu is the same not-even-disguised Cheesecake Factory knock-off as at the Lincoln Road location. Food quality (and obscenely large portions) are the same as well.

                                                                                        I drive by the future location of "Red Light" - new restaurant to be opened by Kris Wessel, formerly of Elia in Bal Harbour and Liason in South Beach - at the Motel Blu on Biscayne just about every day. Looks like they've been making some progress, I can see light fixtures up and banquettes installed.

                                                                                        Cannot say the same about Por Fin in Coral Gables, which seems to be in a holding pattern.

                                                                                        Drove by "Two Chefs Too" in North Miami (the original Mark's Place location on 123rd Street) this weekend, no signs of life yet.

                                                                                        1. it's been a while since we've added to this post...I know there must be somthing new cooking, or about to be cooking, down here in Dade. Let's have it!

                                                                                          Here's one I recently heard about Bourbon Street Steak House up in Aventura...

                                                                                          3 Replies
                                                                                          1. re: netmover

                                                                                            Net, that was the first response in July....

                                                                                            1. re: Sobe

                                                                                              Net -
                                                                                              I'm doing my best, I just updated a couple days ago!
                                                                                              The Bourbon Street Steak House is going to be a Michael Mina (SF, Vegas) place.

                                                                                              1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                Please forgive me, I've been out of the loop as of late and have lost a couple more brain cells since then!

                                                                                                Any one got the goods on chihuahua? Just noticed it on Washington Ave - Westside between 7-8th Streets. Could it be our sexy mexy sobe fixy ???

                                                                                                Enquiring minds wants to know....who goes first, or have you already been and found it not worthy of review here on this board (you=you all or anyone).

                                                                                                cheers!

                                                                                          2. Badrutts Place is opening soon, the Chef is Davide Piana anyone knows something on this chef or location.
                                                                                            http://www.badruttsplace.net/

                                                                                            1. The website for Brosia, the Mediterranean place in the Design District, is mostly up and running. Sample menus are there. The dinner menu looks nice and concise so hopefully they'll do a few things well vs. many poorly.

                                                                                              http://www.brosiamiami.com/pdf/dinner...

                                                                                              5 Replies
                                                                                              1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                Looks nice, though there are a few goofy pretentions - a "flight" of olives? a prosciutto "carpaccio"? Chef's got a nice resume with several years w/ Norman Van Aken and some time at Chispa as well.
                                                                                                Any info on when they're opening? In the meantime I like the "water glass" gimmick on the website.
                                                                                                http://www.brosiamiami.com/enter.html

                                                                                                1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                  Hey I hope they do great-at least they don't have to worry about the rent. But I'm not sure Mundo and Chispa are such a great resume. Although the most important thing about the chef, anyway, according to the website, is his 'charisma'. Which I'm pretty sure has nothing to do with food preparation.

                                                                                                  1. re: Miami Danny

                                                                                                    "Charisma" is a Moroccan herb rub. See, they even have it on the menu - grilled charisma prawns. Oh, wait - that's chermoula. Close, though. I've heard Design District rents ain't cheap these days either.

                                                                                                    1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                      [laughing] I thought you were going to say Prosciutto de Charisma. Rents are high, but not if you own the building.

                                                                                                  2. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                    Rumor has it there is a soft opening at Brosia this weekend.

                                                                                                2. bartolome in south beach??? anyone know anything???

                                                                                                  1 Reply
                                                                                                  1. re: netmover

                                                                                                    It is an argentinian steakhouse and it will be on 20th and purdy. That's all I know.

                                                                                                  2. What about new places in Coconut Grove... I saw Ludo's (or something like that) and I'm wondering if that's new... because I don't remember seeing it before.

                                                                                                    1. Zabor in Coral Gables just opened, the food is great. They have a very good selection of sushi and the quality is very good. They have two chefs Yozo Natsui and Gregory Khellouf.. The concept of the restaurant is a little bit from everywhere around the world.

                                                                                                      1. FYI, Phillippe is scheduled to open in early January, along with STK (both from New York).

                                                                                                        Has anyone seen/heard anything new about Por Fin?

                                                                                                        2 Replies
                                                                                                        1. re: mikek

                                                                                                          I work right across from Por Fin - it looks like they my have gotten some furniture in, but it doesn't look like anything's in place yet. The still would seem to be a few months off.

                                                                                                          1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                            Folks @ Por Fin now say January...

                                                                                                        2. Mr Chow at the W In SoBe. 09??
                                                                                                          http://www.mrchow.com/therestaurants/...

                                                                                                          1. Top Chef Howie "headband" Kleinberg opening Bulldog Barbecue North Miami Beach

                                                                                                            "If you can't snag a seat, you'll still have the opportunity to chow on Kleinberg cuisine when the 32-year-old opens his restaurant -- Bulldog Barbecue -- in North Miami within ''the next two to three months.'' Sister Amy is his partner; mom Susan -- a former VP of catering at Barton G -- will do the decor. He'll focus on the menu -- namely lots and lots of pork."

                                                                                                            http://www.miamiherald.com/358/story/...

                                                                                                            1. OK, maybe I've just been completely oblivious, but there's a Bonefish Grill toward the north end of Ponce in the Gables that I never noticed before and looks open.

                                                                                                              2 Replies
                                                                                                              1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                it just openned the week of Thanksgiving. It is not open for lunch. It opens up at 5pm. I'm hoping for a nice happy hour spot where you can stay for dinner. This past friday we went and had some drinks and then ate food at the high top tables near the bar.

                                                                                                                This restaurant is in the building i work at. The space has been empty since i started in March '05. According to my boss who is a big foodie there have been about 4 or 5 restaurants there in the past 8 years and all have failed miserably.

                                                                                                                I like Bonefish reasonably well for a middle tier chain. The fish is pretty decent and almost all of their appetizers are very tasty.

                                                                                                                1. re: sprmario

                                                                                                                  Seems like anything that far north of Gables' "nerve central" (intersection of Miracle Mile and Ponce) is going to struggle. Not as much foot traffic, not much visibility. I drive down Ponce every day to work and usually will notice something new going in, and didn't have a clue about that one until last week.

                                                                                                              2. Red Light (Kris Wessel - sp? new place in Motel Blu at 70th & Biscayne) is looking closer - appears that the bar is in and fully stocked. Can't tell what's going on in back of house but seems they're making progress.

                                                                                                                1. I spoke with the owner of Andu last night at Michael's Genuine. The official openingis scheduled for mid-January. If you live in Neovertika or Latitude (building next door) they will be doing room service until 2 am, which I think is an interesting and great idea.

                                                                                                                  1. Most of these we already know of but what the heck.

                                                                                                                    http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptid...

                                                                                                                    1. All activity has stopped at the old Pacific Time location. Anyone know anything?

                                                                                                                      2 Replies
                                                                                                                      1. re: 2top

                                                                                                                        Restaurant's been closed for some time - was something new going in?

                                                                                                                        1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                          I thought Touch took it over and they were opening *gasp* a steakhouse.

                                                                                                                      2. I'm not sure if anyone caught it, but it was in the Miami Herald today (but there's no specifics...)

                                                                                                                        There's 5 restaurants that are going to open up in the Wynwood area within 18 months - and they include a Vietnamese restaurant, noodle shop, and tea house. Maybe I should say "at the maximum 4 restaurants" since a tea house isn't a restaurant in my book unless if they're going to be serving some notable food.

                                                                                                                        54 Replies
                                                                                                                        1. re: mialebven

                                                                                                                          And in 24 months there will be, albeit a smaller article, stating that 4 of them have closed. Not trying to be cynical, just stating the obvious of Miami--location, location, location. The majority of Beach residents/tourists don't get off the island (and with the choices now available who can blame them) and most of the rest of "monied" My-ami wouldn't be caught dead in Wynwood or its vicinity.

                                                                                                                          Sure, Michelle has attracted a following but the size of her digs are comfortably small and again not too far from the causeway to the island. I've heard alot of good things about Michael's but willing to bet that within 2 years he will be doing a different place. Like to be proven wrong, but high-quality sustainable restaurants follow the money not the other way around. Again, there are always exceptions, but usually do not last too long, especially here in the 305.

                                                                                                                          We don't have a "city center" per se, not to mention any kind of worthwhile mass transit system. In fact, if gas keeps rising the way it has (all it would take is to equal what euros have been paying already or about double US) and you may find that our car-centric community may very well become more parochial than it already is.

                                                                                                                          God bless the pioneers, but to shoot buffalo with a bee-bee gun is not a winning formula. Which means, that until there is a sustainable "downtown/uptown/anytown" population base, to build an outpost too far from the supply lines (read wealth) is probably doomed. And to those who think the current condo building boom is the final piece of the puzzle, just ask your real estate friends who, if anyone, is going to populate them in the forseeable future.

                                                                                                                          Power to Michy and Michael but even their oasis' may only be a fleeting mirage.

                                                                                                                          1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                            I whole heartedly and emphatically disagree about Michael's. I was there last Sunday night and it was PACKED. Not one table open inside or out. As Midtown Miami fills up, the area around the Carnival Center fills in, etc. there will be plenty a market for these restaurants. My girlfriend lives on Bayshore Dr., right near the Carnival, it takes us 5 minutes to get to Michaels. The Downtown buildings by the AAA are getting close to finished, etc. Plus, Michael's is right off the 195. If you are on the northern end of SoBe, it is a 10 minute drive there. Do not know about Michy's, but the Design District area is really growing right now. Also, Michael's is not an isolated pioneer. Brosia, the new Japanese place, Eismann from Pacific Time, etc. are all going there. I am pretty sure these professionals would not be moving there just to start a trend. The lower rent, more locals vibe, and (heaven's forbid!) less emphasis on the "scene" are what is attracting them to those parts.

                                                                                                                            1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                              Look Mikek,

                                                                                                                              I didn't say Michaels now I said in TWO years. And sure the economics of low rent, ample parking work for the owner but the location probably does not work in direct proportion for the diners. Also, the buildings that are closed to finish does not mean they are close to being filled is what I said.

                                                                                                                              I would love for Wynwood/Design area to blossom more than it already has, but at some point it needs more than a few hundred foodies driving it. No offense to fellow hounds. But it is the "non-Gourmet" who populates the majority of restaurants cause thats the way the numbers fall, sorry. Wasn't Grass welcomed with great raves no so long ago? Soyka, Kara & Y are not long for this world I think.

                                                                                                                              Believe me, I do not wish failure on anyone, even if their food or service or both don't work, I just said that in our area--location, location,location is more important than in maybe lets say NYC or SFO.

                                                                                                                              1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                enbm,

                                                                                                                                By showing examples of places you believe are going to go under you keep undermining your own argument that these places aren't going to last. The best example begin Soyka, which is going on 10 years! Dogma, the super-casual hot dog place up the street from Soyka just celebrated 5 years! Andiamo and Sushi Siam (not that I'm a fan of either) have been open for about 5 years now. I really don't understand your point of view because the facts and example you're using totally contradict your argument.

                                                                                                                                As for Grass, it closed the first time because it was pretentious and mediocre. The new incarnation is much more friendly and casual. Had it been on the Beach the same fate probably would've befallen it. Karu & Y is the most ambitious place to ever open in MIA and it'll live or die on its reputation and and allure of being near the Carnival Center (although its location is still in one of the worst aread of any fine dining establishment here).

                                                                                                                                So if your argument is location, location, location then let restaurants that cater to tourists open up on the Beach and those that cater to locals open up on the mainland. I'll be totally happy with that.

                                                                                                                                1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                  Dear lax,

                                                                                                                                  First off, love the name! I probably could've used mia2lax2sfo2mia2lax2mia. Sorry, cant get used to quakes lol.

                                                                                                                                  But dogma, please. Don't get me wrong I love hot dogs and theirs are not bad but thats not the type of eating establishment im refering to. Thats a stand or better yet a permanent in place doggie cart. Which is what they want to be but not what we are talking about at all.

                                                                                                                                  As to Soyka, have you been lately? Do you know their economics? Are they up this year from last year? from 2,3,4,5 years ago? I don't claim to know either but I'm betting that the answer is no. Now if they originally bought the land, then at some point they booked a paper bundle (unfortunately way less today than two years ago). Or maybe sold and are leasing waiting for big developer to build another condo (gasp that may be years). Who knows?

                                                                                                                                  Yes they have survived 10 years but without knowing the inside econ whose to say they will survive another 1 let alone 10? I give them credit for 10, but i'm talking about the next 10 and perhaps in their case I erred and they become the exception as my original post said not the rule. Business is based on probabilities as much as anything and all I said is that the probability for long term success is better if location is better and even more so in MIA.

                                                                                                                                  As an aside, do you keep up with LA scene at all. If so, would love to hear some of your thoughts. TC

                                                                                                                                  1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                    Ten years is a monstrous and unequivocal success in the restaurant industry regardless of whether they close tomorrow or not. Indeed surviving the first year and staying busy is a success. There are now a multitude of examples of restaurants that have done so without being in the Beach or the Gables.

                                                                                                                                    1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                      TY Frod (see his post below 1:09 pm),

                                                                                                                                      As I suspected he believes they OWN the whole block. So it seems that they are more like a land holding company than a restaurant aspiring for everyday greatness.

                                                                                                                                  2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                    *the location probably does not work in direct proportion for the diners*
                                                                                                                                    It's working for enough people to fill the place every night and we're well past the "honeymoon" period when people are just going because it's new. Indeed, I think Beach people tend to forget there's a whole city on the other side of the causeways that doesn't relish the prospect of crossing over for every nice meal. There's a concentration of higher end residential in Brickell/Morningside/Miami Shores that welcomes the prospect of having somewhere closer to go other than over the bridge to the Beach or to the Gables. As another example, Luna Cafe (around 30th & Biscayne) is a place I find perfectly mediocre but which is staying quite busy with the customers from those neighborhoods.

                                                                                                                                    *at some point it needs more than a few hundred foodies driving it*
                                                                                                                                    MGF&D has gotten national recognition in multiple publications. It is a destination restaurant for any chowish tourist coming to Miami. I think the mistake too many restaurants make is trying to snag (fleece) the tourist trade without establishing a loyal base of local customers. Tourists will come to whatever the hot spot of the moment is, and then the next time they visit, many will go to the next hot spot. If you want to stay in it long term, you've got to have repeat local customers. MGF&D gets both.

                                                                                                                                    *But it is the "non-Gourmet" who populates the majority of restaurants cause thats the way the numbers fall, sorry*
                                                                                                                                    True - but I don't think you need to be "gourmet" or a "foodie" to appreciate and enjoy good food. I know plenty of people that enjoy MGF&D who will never look at a food website, read a food magazine, etc.

                                                                                                                                    *Wasn't Grass welcomed with great raves no so long ago?*
                                                                                                                                    Not particularly. I don't know anyone who was that impressed.

                                                                                                                                    *Soyka, Kara & Y are not long for this world I think.*
                                                                                                                                    Karu & Y, yes, and deservedly so. I've never been but the universal consensus is that's it's overpriced and it sucks. Soyka? It's a big space but I think they own that whole block, got in early, and still have a pretty good steady business. I think the food is mediocre but suspect they're doing fine.

                                                                                                                                    *location, location,location is more important than in maybe lets say NYC or SFO*
                                                                                                                                    Disagree. I think the average life-span of a South Beach restaurant is short and getting shorter due to the pressures of the high rents. The success of multiple off-SoBe locations proves that if you have great food, the customers will come. And both NYC and SFO are good models of places where restaurants have succeeded and even thrived by going to "neglected" areas where the rents are cheaper. Many of the top restaurants in SF are in relatively far-flung parts of the Mission District and other "lesser" neighborhoods. NY is constantly undergoing the same sort of process. As the "prime" spots in Miami see rents continue to escalate, the same is happening here.

                                                                                                                                    1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                      Frod,

                                                                                                                                      Agreed but the far flunged places in SFO/NYC are generally alot closer in proximity to (for lack of better phrase) "money" than MIA and not to mention availability of mass transit options. Which takes away the parking issue. Imagine the Beach or Gables/Grove without dealing with parking. Now thats something to drink to.

                                                                                                                                      1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                        The Design District and Biscayne Corridor are closer to just about every part of Miami-Dade County (including the "moneyed" pockets of Coral Gables, Miami Shores, and Aventura) than South Beach is, with the exception of the 90,000 residents of Miami Beach. In fact for me in North Beach it's about equidistant.

                                                                                                                                    2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                      Sorry, I do not buy it. Their location is fine. I live in the Gables down by UM, it take me 20 min door to door to get to Michael's. It would take me 30 minutes to get to South Beach. If you think that the only people that fill restaurants are South Beach residents, then, well, you are wrong. That area is actually booming right now because of the local flare given to it. It is akin to what South Beach was 20 years ago, before it became this hotspot and party mecca.

                                                                                                                                      You say that location is an issue, but when I have gone on a Sunday night and a Wednesday night (2 nights where location would presumably matter), the restaurant was absolutely packed. While you may be right it takes more than a couple of hundred foodies to keep it afloat, it also does not take all of these buildings to be fully occupied to fill up that spot. Even if they are 1/2 filled, you are still talking about a huge influx of people into that area, who based on those buildings, have some money to eat out. You say the location works for the owner, but not the diners, yet I do not see this little theory in application. Its initial wave and hype has since died down, but the crowds populating it on all nights of the week have not.

                                                                                                                                      Karu and Y is also an awful example, since from the days its doors opened it has been met with reviews along the line of "gorgeous restaurant, awful food, small portions and astronomical tab." I do not care where you put it, that combination will lead to the failure of a spot.

                                                                                                                                      Sorry, but your argument and logic is horrendously flawed. There are many, many other areas that people who have money to spend and enjoy good food reside in other than South Beach, and many of those people (myself included) like to avoid South Beach at all costs. People from Aventura, Ft Lauderdale, etc. routinely drive down to eat dinner at much more expensive and much worse restaurants than Michael's. I fail to see why you are so set on thinking that anything off of South Beach is destined to failure. Have you even been to Michaels? It is literally 2 minutes off of the highway, well lit, and not a dangerous part of town.

                                                                                                                                      1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                        Dear Mikek,

                                                                                                                                        Where have I mentioned that "anything off of South Beach is destined to failure'? I have never said anything even closely resembling that. Instead of reading my post, you are intent on making this a SoBe is over-rated elitist over-priced area.

                                                                                                                                        Sorry, that doesn't have ANYTHING to do with my post.

                                                                                                                                        Nothing I said precludes the Gables/Grove/Brickell/Doral/etc. from success. And yes, Mikek, in case you haven't heard,SoBe can also be very successful. Why, because all my post says is that location,location,location is very important for BUSINESS success (not to be confused with 1-2 years "food" success) and lack of it makes the going much tougher than having.

                                                                                                                                        Also, for the SECOND TIME (I pointed this out to you previously in another reply to you), I refer you to my original post where I said nothing about Michaels now, but said that " willing to bet that within 2 years he will be doing a different place." AGAIN EMPHASIS ON TWO YEARS FROM NOW. Get It ?

                                                                                                                                        So sorry Mikek, at the risk of sounding cruel, it appears that it is your reading comprehension that is "horrendously flawed".

                                                                                                                                        1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                          Your implying that by not opening on South Beach, Michael's/Michy's are in fact limiting their clientele, which will lead to their closure within two years. I think that is a completely wrong analysis. They already have developed a consistent and loyal local base, and national publicity will do nothing but help that. While those buildings are still unfinished or left empty, Michael's is still packed. In two years, 5 years, etc. when those buildings are done and if they are even 50% occupied, that is a huge influx of new population looking for places to eat. So, it is crowded now. Even if those buildings do not full up, any occupancy will raise the population and customer base. So we are now dealing with your mystical 2 year figure. So, crowded now + more population close by coming + easier access for the majority of locals = a continually filled restaurant.

                                                                                                                                          You say location, location, location but you do not want to hear yourself. Michaels is 2 minutes off of the 195. It is 5 minutes from downtown, 10 minutes from south beach, 20 minutes from South Miami, 20 minutes from the Gables, 15 from the Grove and about 30 from Aventura - explain how that is not good location? If people from up north are willing to drive south to eat in sub-par restaurants, they will surely drive a shorter distance with easier parking for better food.

                                                                                                                                          And as for the two years from now, as businesses and homeowners seek to leave areas where the rent is astronomical, the design district is a very likely place for them to wind up. Similar to South Beach in the 80s, it was depressed economically, funky stores and businesses started to clean it up, restaurants move in, residents follow. So, I think your basic analysis is completely flawed, as do a couple of other people on this thread. If Michael is doing a different place in two years, it is because he needs or wants a bigger room, or like Frod said, he lends his name out as executive chef.

                                                                                                                                          I will ask again, have you actually been to Michael's? Because your blind generalization about the area and seemingly uninformed assessment of the location leads me to think otherwise.

                                                                                                                                          1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                            Well at least you seem to have partially read my post now. You got the Michaels 2 years part but are still hung-up on SoBe. I don't even mention it in my post, wow do you have hang-up there. Oh well.

                                                                                                                                            I say that Michy/Michaels have a much toughfer road to hoe than if they would have opened up in a better location. By that I mean the gables/the grove/Aventura/Brickell (oh my I remember someone having breakout success there once I wonder who?) and yes, Mikek, much to your consternation, SoBe. By the way, alot of people are equating location solely with driving distance, while that may indeed be a factor in some decision making, the "meat" of the location I refer to is economic vitality of area/ability to naturally attract tourist (and another fact of life in Miami, we ARE a tourist economy) some of you want to discount them, but remember without tourist, Miami's evolution, let alone dining scene, wouldn't be. And most importantly, ability to CONSISTENTLY attract locals. And again, not the few hundred foodies who hound out culinary news.

                                                                                                                                            Mikek, I haven't been to Michaels but I have been to Wynwood and the Design district. You see, the point is not the quality of restaurant which I'll assume based on others here is above average (not daniel above average I bet or for that matter Masa or French Laundry or even Nobu) it is the quality of the surrounding area and its economic vitality that I do not necessarily see as viable. Simple, you understand?

                                                                                                                                            I wonder how long you have actually lived in Miami? Have you ever explored the area surrounding Michaels? Have you ever driven the 79th street at night? How often? Next time you are at Michaels I invite you and your date to take a mile stroll and see what you feel like, encounter. While I may not have been to Michaels, you, I'm afraid have no clue as to what Wynwood et al is like.

                                                                                                                                            Oh yeah, if you want to defend Michaels as a restaurant go to the appropriate thread. Last I heard he hasn't opened a new restaurant and says here he isn't scheduled to do so for another couple of years LOL.

                                                                                                                                            1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                              I have actually lived in South Florida my entire life, as did my dad. I know the areas you speak of quite well. Would I take my date for a stroll in the design district? Not so much. However, that is not to say that in the next wave of redevelopment things will stay that way. I guess our split lies in the fact that I place less of an emphasis on the surrounding area and its walk-ability in favor of a central location. The fact that all of these chefs are flocking to the Design District, to me, is indicative of the area's viability and growth potential. I do not think that chefs such as Michael Schwartz, John Eismann, the owners of Brosia, etc. would want to spend the money and time on a venture they think will flop within two years.

                                                                                                                                              As to the post below, if I could put Michael's anywhere as an investor, it would likely go somewhere near Mary Brickell Village. I think that neighborhood is the type that would immediately adopt a restaurant of MGFD's style, as the vibe there is similar (vibe only) to a Rosa Mexicano (though perhaps RM is more "party centric").

                                                                                                                                              1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                Hallelujah Mikek!

                                                                                                                                                W finally agree on something. You are right, Mary Brickell would be a perfect spot for a sustainable high-end eatery. Interesting, that when it comes to putting down your dollars, you choose Brickell (like I would) over Wynwood et al.

                                                                                                                                                1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                  I couldn't disagree more on this. Mary Brickell was already an absolute abomination to get in and out of when there was nothing other than Oceanaire and PF Chang's. It is destined for, and is getting, chain restaurants - the afore-mentioned, and now Rosa Mexicano. Not the place to try to put a smaller chef-driven restaurant. Look at how Duo tried and failed in Brickell area. Or Mosaico.

                                                                                                                                                  1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                    No, that is the ideal location not taking cost into account. I do not know what the rent would be and how that would impact Michael's ability to offer food at the prices he does.

                                                                                                                                                    1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                      If I didn't have to take cost into account my ideal place to live would be Journey's End!

                                                                                                                                                      Even if prices were equal, I still wouldn't want to be in that area - it has never supported a decent restaurant but lines up for generic chains.

                                                                                                                                                      1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                        Aw come on. That La Broche place in Brickell deserved to close. What with PF Changs getting ready to open.

                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                          I think there is a market for it though. A place that is great food but conducive to a happy hour vibe (which is what I think Michael's would be like if it were in that area). could do very well. I mean, people spend to go to Novecento and Perricone's, why not spend the same amount for good food? Same applies for Oceannaire.

                                                                                                                                                  2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                    *but are still hung-up on SoBe. I don't even mention it in my post*

                                                                                                                                                    Actually, you did:
                                                                                                                                                    "The majority of Beach residents/tourists don't get off the island (and with the choices now available who can blame them)"

                                                                                                                                                    As for "better locations" ("gables/the grove/Aventura/Brickell") - the Grove has never supported a decent restaurant; Brickell and SoBe have probably seen more restaurant closures than just about any part of the city; Gables rents are extremely high; and I think Aventura may be too old-fogeyish to support a more cutting-edge place like MGFD or Michy's.

                                                                                                                                                    What you're disregarding in your comments is the role of rent cost in the economic viability of a restaurant. Operating in a "prime" location like SoBe or the Gables has a signficant cost and puts huge pressures on the bottom line.

                                                                                                                                                    1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                      Dear Frod,

                                                                                                                                                      I beg to differ, where does Beach = Sobe only? Also, in the way Mikek and lax had refered to my post they claimed that I said/inferred only Sobe can support high-end successful restaurants (paraphrasing). And obviously, the quoted reference from my post does not in any way exclude other areas.

                                                                                                                                                      What you don't consider Christine's "decent", ok, only kidding I swear LOL. But even though the food is not worth the price, the party ambience is admirable. You have forgotten about Balena On Grove Isle, also do you remember the restaurant at the Grand Bay? I forget the name off hand, but they did quite well for multiple years if I am not mistaken. While I haven't been, the Ritz also seems to garner "decent" reviews.More so than SoBe (who have built-in tourist) the Grove needs to attrract a greater percentage of locals. Unforunately, parking there has always been a problem. And btw, there are worse meals than a cold brew and burger at scotty's.

                                                                                                                                                      As to brickell, I AGREE (wonderful feeling :) ) with Mikek and feel that Mary Brickell will attract something again, "decent".

                                                                                                                                                      If high rents were the deciding factro, than a mahjority of our 5 star establishments here in SoFla, as well as, in any comparable city (NYC, SFO, LA, Boston, DC, Chicago, etc ) would not be open for business. Las Vegas is an exception since their "rent" is cheap but the competition to keep those gambelers in your hotel may be even greater pressure than high rents. Also, don't you think that that pressure/competition forces the chefs to continue to push the envelope? As opposed to resting on past laurels? This competitive enviroment is generally what leads to innovation, IMHO.

                                                                                                                                                      1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                        *I beg to differ, where does Beach = Sobe only*

                                                                                                                                                        Fair 'nuff. But I don't think you're suggesting that 71st & Collins is your idea of a "prime" location. Or that South Beach is any more accessible from there than the Biscayne Corridor (it ain't).

                                                                                                                                                        I assume you're referring to Christabelle's Quarter? Haven't been and not very tempted. I actually had Alex Patout's cooking in NO and it wasn't remotely the best meal I had there, I can only imagine how much more dumbed down it must be here. Now I understand he's gone.

                                                                                                                                                        Baleen? Grove Isle is a sort of unique location - and I don't think it's ever terribly busy either. RItz Carlton? Hotel restaurant, I don't know anyone who's ever gone that wasn't staying at the hotel.

                                                                                                                                                        *If high rents were the deciding factro, than a mahjority of our 5 star establishments here in SoFla, as well as, in any comparable city (NYC, SFO, LA, Boston, DC, Chicago, etc ) would not be open for business.*

                                                                                                                                                        I don't see how that's either here or there. Yes, some restaurants can and will succeed in those locations. Many will fail. The question is, is it economically viable to have a restaurant somewhere other than in the middle of the prime "tourist" or "moneyed" zip codes? I think the answer is yes, that this has been demonstrated time and again in many of the cities you've mentioned, and is gratefully starting to happen here in Miami.

                                                                                                                                                        *Also, don't you think that that pressure/competition forces the chefs to continue to push the envelope? As opposed to resting on past laurels? This competitive enviroment is generally what leads to innovation, IMHO.*

                                                                                                                                                        No, not at all. In fact I think it encourages: (1) conservatism; and (2) price gouging. Conservatism because, once something works, it's perceived as too risky to mess with the formula. And price gouging because of the pressures of making the rent.

                                                                                                                                                        I think this is a big reason why restaurants in the prime touristy locations become stagnant and lose their appeal to locals. A couple good examples: Nemo (Michael Schwartz's first place) and Pacific Time. Nemo was an excellent restaurant, but I stopped going after a certain time because the menu basically hadn't changed in years. Same is true of Pacific Time (though I always liked Nemo better). That's OK for the tourist who's here for the first time, or maybe comes once a year (and wants to see the same exact things every time they visit) - but it sucks for a local who may be coming once a month.

                                                                                                                                                        By comparison, every time I go to Michy's or Michael's there is something that has changed on the menu. Another of my favorite places, Timo up in Sunny Isles, also regularly changes their menu. I think when you don't have to obsess over making the nut of your astronomical rent every month, and aren't trying to cater exclusively to the tourist trade, you can take some chances and experiment a little more.

                                                                                                                                                        And you definitely see the price gouging too, especially in the wine lists. Another example: Talula is one of my favorite local restaurants and one of the few "great" places to eat on South Beach as far as I'm concerned. Their food prices remain in line for a high end place, but in the past 2 years their wine list has gotten just ridiculous. There's basically no bottle to be had under $40, and the few that are priced at that point are $10-$12 retail bottles. The markups are 3-4x retail and it just pains me.

                                                                                                                                              2. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                "gorgeous restaurant, awful food, small portions and astronomical tab."

                                                                                                                                                $25 Million to build doesn't help either...

                                                                                                                                          2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                            If they're closed it'll be because they're not good, not because people won't drive there. Michael's and Michy's are both packed every night despite being in out-of-the-way locations. Michy's has been open more than a year, Michael's is nearing it too, and both show no signs of slowing.

                                                                                                                                            I suspect the only reason either of them will be moving will be because (1) they need bigger space; or (2) rent increases at their current locations squeeze them somewhere else (probably more likely for Michael's in the Design District than for Michy's). I would be surprised if either of them go back to the beach other than to create a menu or lend their name as "exec chef".

                                                                                                                                            I'm not sure how you could consider Michy's to be easily accessible. Other than for someone like me (I live in North Beach and so have just a short hop across 79th St. Causeway) it is a royal pain in the ass for anyone in South Beach, between the trek across the causeway and then the battle through the morass of Biscayne Blvd. construction. Yet it doesn't appear to have affected business at all.

                                                                                                                                            I also don't think gas prices have any affect on the moneyed customers going to higher end restaurants. If you're willing to drop $50+ a head on dinner, you're not going to fret about paying $3.50 a gallon. Nor do I think anyone is betting on all those empty condos being their customer base.

                                                                                                                                            Indeed, I think you're much more likely to see (and have seen) failures in high-rent South Beach (can you say Evolution, for instance) because with the high rents, the margin for error is so slim. As you say, Miami doesn't have a "city center". This means that unless you're actually in South Beach (and the population of residents in South Beach is actually pretty miniscule), you're going to be driving to dinner. What you lose by being off South Beach is perhaps some of the tourist trade, but 90% of the residents are driving to your restaurant anyway and a good number of tourists will drive or taxi to a "destination" restaurant.

                                                                                                                                            This isn't to say that everything that opens up in Wynwood or the Design District is going to succeed. The restaurant business is a tough one and most places fail. But if it's good, I think Michy's and MGFD have proved that the locals will come, and come back as repeat customers, and a good number of the tourists will come too.

                                                                                                                                            1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                              Also, what you spend on the gas money driving to the Design District or Michy's, you more than save on the relative value of the food. I went to Michael's last week with another couple, we got 1 snack, 3 of the small dishes, 3 or so medium dishes, a side, 1 dessert and 2 glasses of wine each and it was only about 90 per couple. On South Beach, the 4 glasses of wine per couple alone would be that much.

                                                                                                                                              1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                Ty Frod,

                                                                                                                                                As usual (at least from what I've read so far from you), your post supplies intelligent and well thought out ideas. However, I would like to point out a few thoughts where by my own failing to write precisely enough may have lead you to miscontrue my thinking.

                                                                                                                                                First I'm not saying $3.50/gall more like $6-7. And your right, the real monied crowd probably wouldn't be bothered by this, but the rest of us which makes up (i'm guessing here) 60% of the other diners would. Instead of going twice a month maybe only once, instead of driving to Wynwood maybe stay in the Gables, etc..

                                                                                                                                                Which brings me to my second point, the Gables is quickly becoming a center for living, eating, and playing. A number of condos already up and more to come with easy access to many fine dining establishments. Yes, perhaps they don't stand up to the quality of the beach yet, but they have attracted new investments and will continue to do so, even if Norman couldn't stay (by the way, I believe that to be an entirely personal decision as opposed to a business one).

                                                                                                                                                So not only those living in SoBe can walk to eat/play, those in the Gables do it ,as well as, those in the Grove, I would mention Brickell too but they like to show off their cars too much (only kidding). The Dadeland area is also building up its condo mass and soon that will become more of a walkable dining community. However, Dadeland/Downtown corridor/Design District are all building out for the future (5-20 years, maybe longer if real estate economy doesn't bounce back sooner or worse yet, our area does not improve in attracting higher paying jobs).

                                                                                                                                                This is all true becuase modern urban design dictates the centralization of services. Nobody likes to spend multiple hours commuting with or without gas going through the roof and then having to jump back into a car to drive somewhere to eat/play. But if you do have to, I'm certain that the closer you are to the place the more you will frequent it. Again the crux of location, location, location.

                                                                                                                                                As you very correctly stated, the restaurant business is a tough one (statistically I think it is the toughest) and for some one to last 5 years plus waiting, hoping, for an area to build critical mass is a hard nut to swallow.
                                                                                                                                                The people building in Wynwood are rolling the dice that they can survive the length of time required to attract "surrounding partners", if not, they will fail. Not because they weren't good enough, au contraire, but becuase they weren't close enough.

                                                                                                                                                Lastly, I think Michy's which as you know is not IN Wynwood has a better chance of surviving than Michael's. The causeway does make it more accessible to the beach and Biscayne Blvd/US 1 will always be a main thoroughfare in Dade.

                                                                                                                                                In the end, I was just trying to say that in the 305, location is more important for success than in other places. But even there: Joel, Daniel, Wolfgang, etc.always seem to choose the finer parts of town.

                                                                                                                                                TY again Frod for your postings, I sincerely enjoy reading what you have to say!.

                                                                                                                                                1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                  EnbM - Thank you too, it' s interesting to have something to discuss here other than "I'm going to be in South Beach for the weekend where should I go?" Some further thoughts ->

                                                                                                                                                  *First I'm not saying $3.50/gall more like $6-7. And your right, the real monied crowd probably wouldn't be bothered by this, but the rest of us which makes up (i'm guessing here) 60% of the other diners would.*

                                                                                                                                                  If gas prices go to $6-7/gallon there are a lot less people driving over the causeway to the Beach and a lot less tourists flying here too. The effects will be across the board. Once again, remember that the population of Miami is overwhelmingly NOT in Miami Beach. Miami Beach has about 90,000 residents out of a total of about 2.4 million in Miami-Dade. Most of them are closer to Wynwood / Design District / Biscayne Corridor than they are to South Beach.

                                                                                                                                                  *the Gables is quickly becoming a center for living, eating, and playing*

                                                                                                                                                  The Gables has actually been an eating destination for a couple decades at least. Giralda Avenue has long been known as "restaurant row". While a number of the places have changed hands over the years, there's always been a concentration of fine dining in the Gables. You are right that there has been an influx of condo construction in the Gables' "business district" and it may become one of the few "walkable" communities in South Florida. Though I don't know that the occupancy rates on the Gables condos are any better than anywhere else. Plus, Gables rents are also already sky high and not very inviting for non-chain restaurants.

                                                                                                                                                  *even if Norman couldn't stay (by the way, I believe that to be an entirely personal decision as opposed to a business one)*

                                                                                                                                                  Actually I think this was very much an economic decision. He had a tiny, antiquated kitchen at Norman's, did not have the space or resources to do any sort of catering to supplement income, and didn't want to put the capital into that space that it needed. I think you'll see him reopen a place in Miami within the next few years, likely tied to a hotel. He's pretty much said as much himself.

                                                                                                                                                  *However, Dadeland/Downtown corridor/Design District are all building out for the future (5-20 years, maybe longer if real estate economy doesn't bounce back sooner or worse yet, our area does not improve in attracting higher paying jobs).*

                                                                                                                                                  The condo market is unpredictable, but one of the things I've been seeing is that the single-family residential in areas all along the Biscayne Corridor is getting rehabilitated. There are little places like Kingdom, a bar up around the 60s and Biscayne, that are populated every night. I don't think they need to wait for Midtown Miami to have a steady customer base. I think between Morningside, Bay Heights, the Upper Eastside, and then Brickell and Miami Shores on the more far-flung outer reaches, plus North Beach, there's a community shaping up along here and I actually think it's developing some traction. Soyka's success over the past 10 years, and the rest of the places in that 55th Street space, show that there's a population to be served in this neighborhood (even if you don't have great food).

                                                                                                                                                  *Lastly, I think Michy's which as you know is not IN Wynwood has a better chance of surviving than Michael's. The causeway does make it more accessible to the beach and Biscayne Blvd/US 1 will always be a main thoroughfare in Dade. *

                                                                                                                                                  Michael's location is literally 2 blocks off of Biscayne Blvd. and 2 blocks away from the 195 exit (and only 6 blocks from I-95). How could you possible ask for better access from either beach or mainland? By comparison, Michy's is in the boonies.

                                                                                                                                                  BTW, I believe Wynwood is actually the area to the south side of the 195 overpass; Michael's is on the north side in the Design District.

                                                                                                                                                  *I was just trying to say that in the 305, location is more important for success than in other places*

                                                                                                                                                  I actually think there have been a number of good examples which have disproven this premise - or at least proven that good (and even some mediocre) restaurants can thrive in places other than the Beach or the Gables. I sure hope so - if the only options are South Beach and the Gables, we're going to soon be seeing nothing but steakhouses and chain restaurants.

                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                    Frod,

                                                                                                                                                    I stand corrected cause I did lump Design/Wynwood together.

                                                                                                                                                    As to Michy's versus Michael's, the areas are different (imagine me sticking up for the 79th st area lol). One is at least traffic busy at night (although not all of it Michy worthy I grant you) the other feels like what it is, an industrial/warehouse type area (almost Doral though not quite as new or residentially occupied). And I guess I am partial to nice spanish jewish woman chefs as oppossed to nice anglo jewish man chefs LOL.

                                                                                                                                                    As to the Gables, again my writing failed me. While it has been a destination for many years, it was primarily a driving destination, now with the build-up of condos it has become much more of a walking one. Is it all there yet, of course not, but well on its way to transforming. Also should mention that much the same is starting to happen in South Miami as well, although I would say they are a few years behind gables.

                                                                                                                                                    Last but not least, your point about Soyka/Biscayne corrider makes me delve deeper into my thoughts (btw TY Frod cause thats the point of all this internet chatter right) Anyways, in my original post, I was directing my opinion as to whether high-end foodie restaurants could survive as a long term winning business entity in Wynwood et al cause of their location or better yet lack thereof. But you're right, if a a fast food place can generally survive as a prospering entity in most any locale/demographics Then a mediocre restaurant can probably survive where there have been no other options. I would say that was the case with Soyka for many years of its existence. Now, there is more real competition at the upper end and I'm surmising that they will suffer for it.
                                                                                                                                                    The real question is how many establishments can the area handle and at what levels of menu cost?

                                                                                                                                                    So I postulate (me and Aristotle you know :)) that an area in closer proximity to mainstream wealth will feed more chefs and higher menu prices than one that is not. And that from this convergence of establishments, a "restaurant row" or like confluence will be created which feeds on itself and creates a dining destination (read SoBe/SoHo/SoMa just to keep it easy).

                                                                                                                                                    In the outpost that is Wynwood et al a few dining destinations will fail to do so cause they are competing against equally competent chefs who are more conviniently located, not to mention in a wider range of cuisines.

                                                                                                                                                    So gathering crititcal mass is the key and it obviously becomes a question of the chicken and the egg. How apropos for a foodie site ! Do you build it and they will come more/ or do they come and you build more?

                                                                                                                                                    Having seen the SoMa and SoBe scenes develop/evolve first hand I can state the following:

                                                                                                                                                    1. It helps to have a touristy city-Check
                                                                                                                                                    2. It helps to have artists types in the area-Check
                                                                                                                                                    3. The artists help bring in the avante-garde monied types who like to set style-Check
                                                                                                                                                    4. A few top chefs stick their neck out looking for cheaper rents so they can create the best for less (at least it starts that way lol)-Check
                                                                                                                                                    5. Leading or cutting edge educated liberal types (yes thats most of us hounds I like to think anyways) start to talk up the destination and venture to
                                                                                                                                                    6. The aforementioned tourists frequent and hopefully wax eloquently on their experience-Check
                                                                                                                                                    7. More follow the leader types set-up shop in area - Partial Check (ongoing right now remember the 5 prospective openings that started this whole mess, life was so simple before the Wynwood et al thread)
                                                                                                                                                    8. Key POINT If enough synergy/good karma/luck/wind blowing in right direction/talent/and did I mention luck come together AND you start to CONSISTENTLY attract the local wallets WHO ARE NOT food/artists/leaders/Paris Hilton AND you DELIVER comparable product for cost in a COVINIENT manner the area may go to step 9.-No Check here since the few we currently have cannot be equated to a confluence of cuisines and the jury is out on whether Mr/Mrs Baker from Coral Gables have ventured out there, again, CONSISTENTLY..
                                                                                                                                                    9. Big fat banker types start to commission economic viability studies of areas potential gross mark up (inside term, only kidding, all they wanna know is how much they can take for how little, thats what an MBA from Wharton teaches you)-No Check since they are still too busy running from condo conversion fiasco throughout area
                                                                                                                                                    10. Big fat banker types cant seem to get easy reservations in area and recommission more economic viability studies to reaffirm that area is booming and money is being left on the table.- No Check (see 9)
                                                                                                                                                    11. Big fat banker types create pools of investment funds(really just a long name for your hard earned money) to invest in the area (read that a Hilton and W are planned and Cheesecake Factory/Houstons et al plan to build next to the just opened TGIF.
                                                                                                                                                    12. Our own Mr/Mrs Baker from Coral Gables decide that the area is a great place to take Aunt Sally when she visits from Iowa and the cutting edge avante garde types who started the "find" so long ago move on to Savanah or retire to drink real mojitos in the bahamas.

                                                                                                                                                    Obviously, alot of what I've written is tongue in cheek, but the underlying fundamental is there: In order to build up something you have to attract outside money and that only comes if the PROBABILITY of BUSINESS SUCCESS and the RETURN on CAPITAL can be JUSTIFIED. I'm not sold that Wynwood et al has all the attributes for long-term business viability given the surrounding area and the competition from throughout dade. Sure its hot right now, but, long term will it fizzle or sizzle.

                                                                                                                                                    1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                      So you are saying right now they are at step 7.5 for both Michy's and Michael's, as the Wynwood is opening near Michy's and Brosia, Dojo, Eismann's new spot near Michael's. Based on what I have seen eating at Michael's aside from me, it is definitely expanding beyond the foodie community. Last time there, there was a birthday table for 10 of loud young professionals and the table behind us were just getting hammered and put down about 3 bottles of wine between 4 people.

                                                                                                                                                      1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                        Again thats a start but only that. I'll grant you, better that than the empty tables that were Grass. As they say only time will tell.

                                                                                                                                                        But let me ask you Mikek, all things as to food quality and service being equal ( in reality may not be if areas are different especially when it comes to service which is usually based on label pool of surrounding area at some level) and Michael asked you to partner in restaurant, where would you vote for? And if you better not say design district cause I'm sure he'll welcome your money open handed LOL.

                                                                                                                                                        By the way, hope you don't take things too personally, I realize that you have passion for your convictions and that is a good hound trait. TC

                                                                                                                                                        1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                          Just one more further thought ->

                                                                                                                                                          *But let me ask you Mikek, all things as to food quality and service being equal ( in reality may not be if areas are different especially when it comes to service which is usually based on label pool of surrounding area at some level) and Michael asked you to partner in restaurant, where would you vote for? And if you better not say design district cause I'm sure he'll welcome your money open handed LOL.*

                                                                                                                                                          It's an interesting question to ask, because Michael Schwartz in fact HAS had several restaurants in South Beach before he opened MGF&D. It's not like he was forced to open up in the Design District - he (and his investors) CHOSE to do so. There are no doubt some very sound reasons for that decision.

                                                                                                                                                          I don't think you can possibly answer the question you ask without having the data to compare the expenses of a location in the Beach or the Gables vs. the Design District. But I have little doubt that there were folks with bankrolls and spreadsheets asking those very questions.

                                                                                                                                                          Some trailblazers have had huge success by taking chances on "transitional" neighborhoods. Mark Soyka is a great example - when he first opened News Cafe in the late 80's there was virtually nothing else on Ocean Drive. Same was true of Lincoln Road when he opened Van Dyke in the early 90's. Same was true of Biscayne Blvd. when he opened Soyka's in the late 90's.

                                                                                                                                                          Now Soyka has succeeded partly because he's been savvy enough to buy property before the rest of the market catches on and catches up, but that still doesn't mean that it's a "land holding company". If the restaurant weren't successful the property would have been sold for development at some point over the past few years' real estate boom.

                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                            I am also fairly certain that he in fact, intentionally moved to a place that will attract less tourists. A couple of meals ago he came to the table and spoke with my girlfriend, her mother and I, and part of the motivation behind this is to make it a place where he can cook what he wants, without the "scene" backing it. The problem is when you go to a South Beach or Downtown, and attempt to pander to the tourist aspects, your shelf life is much shorter. In pricing himself in the market the way he did, and making it a more casual vibe, it will attract repeat customers to the restaurant. With other restaurants opening in the area at this pace, I would not be surprised to see a night life develop around it. In fact, I think a place like a jazz club or wine bar would do very well in that area playing the post-dinner destination role that eatn mentioned.

                                                                                                                                                      2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                        Restaurants to open in the far flung areas of Miami in the last 2 years:
                                                                                                                                                        Michael's Genuine - Esquire top 20 new restaurant
                                                                                                                                                        Michy's - Gourmet Magazine top 50 restaurant, So Fla Zagat guide best food winner.
                                                                                                                                                        Karu & Y - dine among Chilulys

                                                                                                                                                        Restaurants to open in the Gables in the last two years:
                                                                                                                                                        Tarpon Bend - formulaic seafood chain
                                                                                                                                                        City Cellars - formulaic grill chain
                                                                                                                                                        Flemmings - formulaic steakhouse chain
                                                                                                                                                        CPK - formulaic pizza chain
                                                                                                                                                        Benihana - formulaic teppenyaki chain
                                                                                                                                                        Chili's - coming soon!

                                                                                                                                                        You'r right eatn, the restaurants go where the money is. Just not the good ones!

                                                                                                                                                        BTW, haven't been to LA for about a year so I'm out of the loop a bit. Last time I was there Pizzeria Mozza had just opened and I'm still remembering their pizza and zucchini blossoms!

                                                                                                                                                        1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                                          Let's expand this. Restaurant CLOSINGS in the Gables / SoBe / Brickell last 2 years (stars by those which I don't believe lasted more than 2 years) ->

                                                                                                                                                          Norman's
                                                                                                                                                          Brana*
                                                                                                                                                          Max's Grille*
                                                                                                                                                          Chispa
                                                                                                                                                          Evolution*
                                                                                                                                                          Johnny V*
                                                                                                                                                          Cafeteria
                                                                                                                                                          Pacific Time
                                                                                                                                                          Madiba*
                                                                                                                                                          Afterglow*
                                                                                                                                                          Duo*
                                                                                                                                                          Mosaico*

                                                                                                                                                          So is being in the "moneyed" locations the key to success or an invitation to failure?

                                                                                                                                                          1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                            And Brana was way ahead of its time. It had the same theme as Michael's (local focus ingredients) but the Gables didn't nurture and accept it. But Bonefish Grill is thriving.

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                                              I'm not sure that Brana's was ahead of its time. It opened around the same time as Michy's and not much before Michael's. I think it had a few strikes against it -

                                                                                                                                                              - though in the Gables, it was on a somewhat desolate untrafficked street, in one of those "cursed" locations that have seen a series of restaurants come and go over the years

                                                                                                                                                              - it was a little too stilted and formal, particularly if compared to Michy's and Michael's which seem to have found success with a more casual vibe. I don't think this is what SoFl diners are looking for, either locals or tourists. While we like good food, we don't particularly like it in a stuffy environment.

                                                                                                                                                              - the food was inventive, but the menu was pretty limited and a lot of people felt like many items sounded a lot better than they actually tasted. Though I still fondly recall an outrageous pork belly dish w/ peanuts and pedro ximenez sherry "jelly".

                                                                                                                                                              I'm not sure the place would have made it without a number of changes, regardless of where it was located. Too bad.

                                                                                                                                                          2. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                                            TY Lax for the info,

                                                                                                                                                            Just shows on my step plan that the gables is further along than Wynwood et al :). But seriously, you have missed a few places that have opened and to use Frod's term, are "decent".

                                                                                                                                                          3. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                            *As to Michy's versus Michael's, the areas are different (imagine me sticking up for the 79th st area lol). One is at least traffic busy at night (although not all of it Michy worthy I grant you) the other feels like what it is, an industrial/warehouse type area (almost Doral though not quite as new or residentially occupied).*

                                                                                                                                                            I actually think Design District may prove to be more viable than Biscayne Corridor. It's smaller scale, there are storefronts, there's actually the potential for it to be a place you can walk around if some retail / bars / more restaurants start filling in. Biscayne Corridor is long and stretched out, trafficky, broken up by several motels, and not exactly conducive to walking (street-walking doesn't count, though that seems to be much less prevalent than it was a few years ago).

                                                                                                                                                            I do think Wynwood is further behind the curve than either of these, but (as noted in another post) there is a growing number of businesses operating here that needs to be served - it may not (and probably will not) be by high-end gourmet destination places, but if the rents are right a neighborhood place can thrive.

                                                                                                                                                            *Then a mediocre restaurant can probably survive where there have been no other options. I would say that was the case with Soyka for many years of its existence. Now, there is more real competition at the upper end and I'm surmising that they will suffer for it. The real question is how many establishments can the area handle and at what levels of menu cost/*

                                                                                                                                                            I actually think the area has the capacity and population to support a number of restaurants of varying types. I don't think Soyka's has really been affected much if at all by the influx of new places - Luna Cafe, Canela Cafe, Michael's, Michy's. I drive by all of the places on Biscayne Blvd. every day - Soyka's parking lot is perenially full, Michy's is always packed, Luna and Canela are always active, and I'm talking about every day of the week. Even when Soyka was the only game in town, most people weren't eating there 5 times in a row - they'd go elsewhere. The fact that they're going down the block instead of across town shouldn't really matter.

                                                                                                                                                            I think the success of MGF&D and Michy's in their present locations shows that there is a population here that will seek out good food. But the options available to that population are still quite limited, particularly if you compare to other communities. I think there is "pent-up demand" for good quality restaurants and that you don't need to be in a location that gets "foot traffic" (SoBe, Gables) to succeed.

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                              As usual, very good points Frod.

                                                                                                                                                          4. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                            Interesting you mention Norman coming back to Miami in a hotel. He owns the restaurant at the Ritz in Orlando, and with Evolution closing, that would seem like such a natural fit fot both parties, seeing as they already have an established and seemingly successful partnership.

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                              Wynwood. We all know what the facts are, and I won't stretch them:

                                                                                                                                                              1) it's a gentrifying area, whether we like it or not, despite the need for street landscaping and infrastructural improvement
                                                                                                                                                              2) it's a hip spot in the art world - often mentioned around the globe. Otherwise Art Basel wouldn't be supporting the idea of having events in Wynwood.
                                                                                                                                                              3) condos are coming up near, but not in Wynwood (except for 1-3 random mid-rise buildings, and some others in Midtown Miami).

                                                                                                                                                              now for the negs:
                                                                                                                                                              1) it looks depressed, gritty, and ghetto.
                                                                                                                                                              2) it has a lot of poor people living in its proximity more so than the wealthier group.
                                                                                                                                                              3) there's no high-end restaurants in Wynwood, but in the Design District - however, people still eat in Wynwood - Lost & Found Saloon, Choice Cafe (Korean), Enriqueta's (Cuban), Clive's (Jamaican), and other small joints (I remember seeing: Peruvian, Cuban, Honduran, Puerto Rican).

                                                                                                                                                              That being said, think also about what I said - of the 5 restaurants coming up, only three has been confirmed. Vietnamese, noodle shop, and a tea house. Seriously, do you think they sound like high-end establishments? I don't think those are the type of restaurants meant to attract the SoBe crowd. It's mainly for the locals to enjoy, and it probably will serve the lower to mid-income bracket - but the point of the news was that there'll be more dining establishments in Wynwood.

                                                                                                                                                              And that'll stay - there are people coming to live in and near Wynwood, and that's that.

                                                                                                                                                              I also happen to think Michael's in the Design District caters to the mid-income bracket, and that he'll stay for more than two years. I can't speak of the other new restaurants.

                                                                                                                                                              1. re: mialebven

                                                                                                                                                                Well said - not everything needs to make every food magazine's Top 10 list in order to succeed and have customers. There are now a number of businesses operating in the Wynwood area and there is an expanding customer base to be served.

                                                                                                                                                                1. re: mialebven

                                                                                                                                                                  I agree with Frod, well said. But the original post had nothing to do with pedestrian restaurants (I don't use this term derogatorily , I , and am sure most of us, frequent them more than any high-end places). It was about where high-end places (don't have to be top ten either) succeed.

                                                                                                                                                                2. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                                  Here's Norman himself laying a similar hint:

                                                                                                                                                                  http://blogs.menupages.com/southflori...

                                                                                                                                                          5. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                            Are you kidding me? Do you really believe that if something isn't accessible to Beach residents it won't make it? I have friends that are Beach-centric, but you're among the most callous Beach-centric people I've seen. If restaurants go where the money is then guess what, Michael's and Michy's have made it easier for the Brickell, Morningside and Miami Shores crowd to get excellent food without crossing the causeway.

                                                                                                                                                            And as for monied Miami hanging out in Wynwood, have you been there for a Second Saturday art walk? Yeah, I thought not.

                                                                                                                                                            1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                                              This is an important point. Whatever reluctance there is for Beach residents to leave the Beach is probably equalled by the reluctance of Miami's other residents - Brickell, Grove, Morningside, Shores, and points north - to cross the causeway to the Beach and deal with the traffic, the parking, the valets, etc. And the population of those other areas (even if you just focus on the higher income brackets) probably vastly exceeds that of the beach.

                                                                                                                                                              1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                Really comical when you look at the success of new restaurants that have ventured elsewhere versus the closing of Evolution, Pacific Time, etc. You beach residents can enjoy the big new opening of the year, DeVito's, and pay ungodly amounts for mediocre (at best) food.

                                                                                                                                                                1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                                  It seems that Maison d'Azur at the Angler's Hotel stole the thunder from DeVito's. Let's have a pool on when DeVito's closes.

                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: 2top

                                                                                                                                                                    I forgot about Maison. I actually have a fantastic dinner set up there for Dec 30th with a set 3 course menu, open bar, private cabana, etc. for my friends coming in town for NYE. Should be great!

                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: mikek

                                                                                                                                                                      Good call. Curious to hear about the menu either here or in the Maison thread.

                                                                                                                                                                2. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                  Yup, fact of the matter is there are not many locals on the beach.

                                                                                                                                                              2. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                                We will follow our chefs where ever they go!
                                                                                                                                                                Viva low rents and ample parking!
                                                                                                                                                                Jonathan where are you?

                                                                                                                                                            2. Zabor Closed, They had some problem with investors. Domo Japones opened in Design District food is good but a little expensive.

                                                                                                                                                              2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                              1. re: augusto

                                                                                                                                                                Wow... did they break the record in having the shortest number of days of being open? That was fast!

                                                                                                                                                                1. re: augusto

                                                                                                                                                                  Also, I thought Domo Japones was touted as a casual dining establishment, but then what's all the reports coming in about it being expensive?

                                                                                                                                                                2. I'm not sure if this was mentioned, but South Beach is getting another New York steakhouse - STK - which seems to be popular among women as it has also lighter fares and fish entrees.

                                                                                                                                                                  1. wow! wtf happened to my post? I have been reading for a half hour now and am only 1/2 way finished!

                                                                                                                                                                    this post is not about new dining destinations, it's about new dining establishments.

                                                                                                                                                                    In honor of the hijack, I have this to say. Nemo was in no man's land when it first opened. Many landmark restaurants were originally in the poor part of town only to wind up in the midst of the glam later. I remember when the Strand opened over on Washington Ave and the only viable street on the beach at the time was considered to be Ocean Drive. Oh how the times have cheanged! I remember when Dougie Rodriguez took a chance on a Rd named Lincoln. You could've rolled a bowling ball down that street and not hit anyone back then.

                                                                                                                                                                    The Double D is quickly gaining momentum and should become the next city center-ish. It certainly posesses the commercial space, art and walkability a true dining destination requires to thrive. It has all the right ingredients, including destination. I live on South Beach and have no problem crossing over. It's right at the end of the Julia Tuttle and 5 minutes from 395. Way easier than getting up to MIchy's. I think once the contruction is completed that whole area will open up. Should Power Studios reopen there and the other 3 or 4 restaurants about to oppen do well, the Double D will become the next city center draw. It very well may happen. Hey you and your girl do not want to go strolling to far in the Grove either. It's basically two blocks, kind of like the DD.

                                                                                                                                                                    As for $, East of Biscayne Blvd is flush with cash and they have little desire to cross over to the land of congestion. I myself am reluctant to cross over due to worries of long waits to return and DUI checkpoints. If it's to run over and grab a bite, no worries, if it's a night out on the town...then I may elect to stay East.

                                                                                                                                                                    Karu & Y cannot be spoken of in the same bredth as MIchy's and Micheal's. What were they thinking? Horrendous location, just an outright toss of the dice IMHO. Do people actually go there? If they do, and they are still open-don't ask me how-the Double D and the Upper Eastside will be a walk in the park comparitively speaking. Ain't no Opera House gonna save that place...wow!

                                                                                                                                                                    Now, anyone got anything new?

                                                                                                                                                                    6 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                      In honor of this thread returning to its originally scheduled programming:

                                                                                                                                                                      - Cross-referencing mention of "Dolores But You Can Call Me Lolita" in the old Firehouse 4 location on Brickell ->
                                                                                                                                                                      http://www.chowhound.com/topics/46890...

                                                                                                                                                                      - Not exactly new but I've finally remembered the name after 3 visits, Taberna Giralda on Giralda Ave. in the Gables between Ponce and Salzedo. Nice little real Spanish tapas place. Great bacalaitos, several octopus dishes.

                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                        Dear Net,

                                                                                                                                                                        Sorry if you felt "hijacked", but as Frod did say in a previous post:
                                                                                                                                                                        "EnbM - Thank you too, it' s interesting to have something to discuss here other than "I'm going to be in South Beach for the weekend where should I go?""
                                                                                                                                                                        And yeah as the last word on new dining destinations (which did start out asking the viability of those soon to open restaurants you refer to btw) please don't even try to compare lincoln/washington to wynwood/dd and stroll in the grove you may mean in one direction not all around like wynwood et al.

                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                                          1st off, The Double D ain't Wynwood!

                                                                                                                                                                          2nd off, South Beach was every bit as bad as Wynwood in the 80's, probably worse! I used to hear gun shots out my window once a week.

                                                                                                                                                                          3rd off, you go west in the Grove and you may never return to life as you know it.

                                                                                                                                                                          As for Wynwood, I do not know of any restaurants there...other than my old standby Enriquetas, which closes at 4pm, but is and has been packed for 10+ years.

                                                                                                                                                                          Here are 3 good reasons to go to these fringe areas to eat: I ilke to call it the rule of the P P P...

                                                                                                                                                                          1. Parking
                                                                                                                                                                          2. Price
                                                                                                                                                                          3. People who aren't afraid to venture into uncharted waters for good chow.

                                                                                                                                                                          Just like the pioneers and their patrons back in the day on sobe, these areas are prime for the same type of resurgence. Of the two, UES or the DD, I think the Double D is the better dining destination because it is very concentrated. UES covers 20 + blocks and we all know the the Double B (Biscayne Blvd) is and has been one of the seediest streets in the 305 and is not very prone to walking.

                                                                                                                                                                          Look at the Meatpacking District in NYC! A true shithole for years and now the pride of the city. ENB, this is how hoods get gentrified, join the party babe!

                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                            Net -

                                                                                                                                                                            I think a lot of people either forget or weren't here to remember just how desolate South Beach, and then Lincoln Road, were 20 years ago. I remember walking Ocean Drive back then and I am not exaggerating when I say that virtually every hotel was either empty or an old folks home.

                                                                                                                                                                            A couple of pioneers started fixing up some of the flagship properties (I remember the Carlisle and the Cardozo being among the first), and when News Cafe first moved in it was basically the only game in town. Gradually a few more places started filling in (do you remember the Strand on Washington?), and lo and behold, in about 5 years South Beach had become a destination.

                                                                                                                                                                            Before then, basically the only place where there were good upscale restaurants was Coral Gables.

                                                                                                                                                                            Same thing happened on Lincoln Road, which also was basically abandoned 15-20 years ago. First there was Doug Rodriguez with Wet Paint Cafe, then - lo and behold, Mark Soyka again - Van Dyke, Jonathan Eisman with Pacific Time. Again, there was not an awful lot else going on there before these folks came in. Look now.

                                                                                                                                                                            I don't think Wynwood will ever be a dining destination - too spread out, not enough of a "neighborhood", still too much industrial stuff interpersed among the newer galleries, but I do think it has the capacity to support multiple neighborhood eateries. I do think the Design District has the capacity to be a destination, and to some degree the Biscayne Corridor too. Biscayne Blvd. has vastly improved in the past 2-3 years by the way. People actually eat outside! (at least when there's not construction).

                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                              And wasn't it in an area immediately outside of the commercialized Grove that a man was shot when asking for directions? ENBM, I think you've got extreme tunnel vision and short term memory when it comes to the neighborhoods you're extolling.

                                                                                                                                                                              Regardless, I believe we've hijacked this board enough, don't you think? Should we get back to looking at the new places opening up? Michael Mina is coming for goodness sake! Lobster pot pie and duck fat fries!!!!!

                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: lax2mia

                                                                                                                                                                                OK, when you mention duck fat, it's time to pack it in and go chow!

                                                                                                                                                                                But please don't say that Wynwood et al (including DD) has/ or ever will have the natural attributes that lincoln/washington had. They would have to build a top ten (USA wide mind you) convention center next door, a couple of thousand rooms of more than your holiday inns and motels/ and oh yeah an ocean to boot.

                                                                                                                                                                                Time will tell, and as I said in a previous post in what feels like another lifetime by now: "Believe me, I do not wish failure on anyone, even if their food or service or both don't work, I just said that in our area--location, location,location is more important than in maybe lets say NYC or SFO."

                                                                                                                                                                                We shall see in say 2-5 years, but until then, lets enjoy whatever good chow comes our way and hopefully not get shot while doing it :)!

                                                                                                                                                                      2. Alta Cocina in South Miami must be open, as it's reviewed (unfavorably) today in New Times ->
                                                                                                                                                                        http://www.miaminewtimes.com/2007-12-...

                                                                                                                                                                        6 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                        1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                          What a harsh review....

                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: yomyb

                                                                                                                                                                            And then some. Wow, give them a bit of a break as they iron out opening month(s) jitters at least. Plus anyone who is disappointed cause there's no A1/W sauce for their steaks, I would definitely take anything they review with a grain of salt.

                                                                                                                                                                          2. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                            ouch! LK is a solid food critic. This is not good news for Alta Cocina. The inherent problem with chefs are that they don't necessarily "get" the whole front of the house thing. It is crucial to the success of any joint. They are sorely lacking the basics in both the front and the back of the house according to this critique.

                                                                                                                                                                            You all know how I insist upon giving places sufficient time to work out their kinks, however this place has been up and running for at least 2-3 months now. Some of these issues are from restaurant 101 and are a real red flag. I do not think A1 sauce is necessarily one of them, and have in fact lost a little respect for LK (the writer) for having brought it up, but the fact remains, every restaurant that serves steak should have a couple bottles around as people do ask for it even in the finest of dining establishments. And Worchestshire, come on! Doesn't every kitchen have some on hand? No one greeting, no one saying goodbye and thank you? These critics don't one and done places. They usually go a few times prior to printing their critiques. This place just fell off my wish list...sorry!

                                                                                                                                                                            Now here's one that may not last the two years ENBM gave MIchael's and Michy's! Which btw, I beleive will both be around for a long time to come unless they have crappy leases...in which case maybe Wynwood will become the next dining center here in the MIA?

                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                              My Dearest Net (a term of endearment you know :),

                                                                                                                                                                              I never said Michy's wouldn't last, and for that matter, I just said that Michael would be doing a different restaurant in 2 years, but that was yesterday's news I thought ?

                                                                                                                                                                              Anyways, you are right on about "inherent problem with chefs are that they don't necessarily "get" the whole front of the house thing". Business is more than just cooking its also greeting, serving, booking and perhaps the trickiest, managing/estimating perishable ordering. Unfortunately, with a review like this, they may not get a chance to learn on the job, a luxury granted few nowadays.

                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: eatnbmerry

                                                                                                                                                                                Sorry if I misquoted you. This thread mushroomed and I may have meshed some of the mushroom cloud together.

                                                                                                                                                                                You make, and have made, some very good points. Your point about it being a luxury to learn on the job is very valid.

                                                                                                                                                                                I thought some of the dishes the critic described sounded interesting. Unfortunately, the execution was shakey. The gnoccis with gorgonzola and rabo or osso bucco sounded devine. As did the Trinidadian cuisine. I have been by there and it has seemed empty. Does anyone down yonder in South Miami know if it does a brisk business at night? That's a nice city center actually. How's that mall on the mall graveyard doing? Is it happening? Anything new going on in or around there?

                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                                  Is meshing mushroom clouds better than the old school style of making tea from them? LOL

                                                                                                                                                                                  Haven't driven by at night lately to be honest. Yes, the rabo does sound yummy. May have to give these young-ens a try! Boost their confidence! Give em an at-a-boy for pushing/pursuing their passion! After this review they must need it. Maybe Michy will drop by and help out too.

                                                                                                                                                                          3. Jan. 4: Jeffrey Chodorow's Kobe Club right next to China Grill, Kobe Club will be an exclusive spot of just 45 seats inside and 20 cozy cabana-ish booths outside

                                                                                                                                                                            This is the place (in NYC) that received the infamous 0 star review from Frank Bruni in NY Times forcing Chodorow to take a out a full page ad in NY Times.

                                                                                                                                                                            Let's hope we get a better version

                                                                                                                                                                            http://events.nytimes.com/2007/02/07/...

                                                                                                                                                                            rebuttal letter http://www.chinagrillmgt.com/pdf/Resp...

                                                                                                                                                                            2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: The Chowfather AKA sobe

                                                                                                                                                                              Either version, it doesn't sound like I'll be able to afford eating there and sending my kid to college :).

                                                                                                                                                                              1. re: The Chowfather AKA sobe

                                                                                                                                                                                Goodness knows we need more overpriced steakhouses.

                                                                                                                                                                              2. All - a modest proposal that we carry over the original subject of this post (new restaurant openings) to a new thread, as this one is getting awfully unwieldy.

                                                                                                                                                                                To make matters even worse, SOME people saw fit to carry on an extended discussion of the viability of certain So. Fl. dining destinations within this thread, adding even further clutter (yes, I am indeed a primary culprit).

                                                                                                                                                                                Someone already started a new thread for new openings in 2008 which is at present mercifully short - indeed the OP didn't even post a message!

                                                                                                                                                                                http://www.chowhound.com/topics/469320

                                                                                                                                                                                I suggest we get an early jump on things and start posting info on new openings, etc. there instead of here, so as not to have to load the 200+ posts each time.

                                                                                                                                                                                2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                                  Agree. Hopefully, people will start new threads as they start opening.

                                                                                                                                                                                  1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                                    I feel your pain Frod! Which is exactly why I recently created this post. http://www.chowhound.com/topics/465611 I thought they nixed it, seems it was moved. If ever I could ask you and all other hounds to get behind a post it's this one: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/465611 It's about the slow load times you mentioned.

                                                                                                                                                                                    On the new front, News Cafe Lounge coming soon to 55th St Station.

                                                                                                                                                                                  2. Fratelli Lyon is poised to open in the Design District soon. Some of you may remember the earlier Lincoln Road pioneers over at Lyon Freres (sic) where sushi samba now stands. It was an awesome French style market cum cafe. I miss it dearly to this day. Anyway, it seems the surviving brother is taking over at a place called Driade on ne 2nd ave and 41st. Should be another nice addition to what is quickly becoming a dining destination.

                                                                                                                                                                                    BTW, I just ate at Elements which I always enjoy a couple blocks south. Lunch only...but who knows whether they'll open for dinners should things snowball over there.

                                                                                                                                                                                    2 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                    1. re: netmover

                                                                                                                                                                                      Driade is the italian furnishings company in the Design District that opened this past summer. Is Fratelli Lyon a restaurant component?

                                                                                                                                                                                      1. re: miaedu

                                                                                                                                                                                        Exactly! They will be serving out of the front of the Driade furnishings company. This area is on the cuspe of becoming chowhound central smack dab in the middle of mid-town-ish. The double D strikes again with your new info below...thanks!

                                                                                                                                                                                    2. according to the Herald's celebrity gossip columnist Masaharu Morimoto is looking in the Design District for a space.

                                                                                                                                                                                      http://www.miamiherald.com/358/story/...

                                                                                                                                                                                      1. TRE downtown Miami brought to you by the owners of La Loggia.

                                                                                                                                                                                        1. Something called MaiTardi Risto Bar is looking for staff in the old Brosia location.

                                                                                                                                                                                          3 Replies
                                                                                                                                                                                          1. re: 2top

                                                                                                                                                                                            That name sounds MaiTarded.

                                                                                                                                                                                            1. re: Frodnesor

                                                                                                                                                                                              Haha, the name does sound retarded... and to think I was thinking about how tarde or late it would open since it seems Miami restaurants have a habit of opening past their announced opening dates.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Botequim Carioca the Brazilian restaurant opened in Park West neighborhood of Downtown - the first resto open for lunch and dinner in that area. That would explain why it always seem packed.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Across the street from NE 9th Street, in another condo building, there's a sign up saying that Ziggy's Greek Pizzeria is coming soon. Anyone know anything about that?

                                                                                                                                                                                            2. re: 2top

                                                                                                                                                                                              It actually means never late or on time or some such translation. Just learned today it's Graspa Group from Tiramesu, Spris, Segafredo (Lincoln), Van Dyke, etc.

                                                                                                                                                                                              They just put a pizza oven in I see.

                                                                                                                                                                                              More Italian on the way to the double D.

                                                                                                                                                                                            3. "Prelude by Barton G" will offer fine dining in the Carlin Banquet Room before and after our performances at the Arsht Center. The restaurant, designed and operated by Barton G. Weiss, will have three sittings on performance nights and two sittings before our Sunday matinees. The prix-fixe dinners and post-performance suppers are $39 and include three courses. The brunch/lunch menu is $23 and includes two courses. Additional food and beverages will be available on an a-la-carte basis. The prices are exclusive of tax and gratuity.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Seating in the Carlin Banquet Room will be limited - about 100 guests at a time - and tickets are expected to sell out in advance.