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Best Knifes Not you whole paycheck?

nbermas May 25, 2007 01:02 PM

Any thoughts and why?

  1. d
    DukeOfSuffolk Jul 21, 2010 06:39 AM

    Best Value: Carbon Steel Chinese Cleaver (~$10 if you have a good store nearby - $30+ for a quality CCK model), Kiwi Chefs/Pairing/whatever Knives (under $10, or even under $5, each)

    these are the cheapest decent quality knifes you'll find - both kinds are often sold at asian rest supply or food stores

    next up (imo): forschner chefs knife (~$30), no-name high carbon Japanese chef's (hit or miss, but could be 30-45)

    next up: ikea VG10 knife? (never used it myself, it's like $50 iirc)

    the forschner is probably a solid choice

    1 Reply
    1. re: DukeOfSuffolk
      d
      dowlf Feb 19, 2011 05:59 PM

      I got a really nice cleaver at 888 International Market in Overland Park, KS for about $12. Takes a really nice edge and handles most of my cutting needs. I have far more expensive Japanese steel, but this gem is hard to beat.

    2. d
      davesmall Jul 20, 2010 11:23 AM

      I've accumulated a mix of kitchen knives over the years including some Henckels, Wusthof, Kyocera ceramic, and Sanelli Premana professional chef's knives. I use them all but would not recommend the Kyocera because the blade chip rather easily. They don't need sharpending but they do chip. My favorites are the green handle Sanelli Premana knives. They hold an edge remarkably well and they sharpen easily (I use a diamond coated rod and give a few frequent strokes before using a knife). I think the blade steel formulation and convex edge are what makes the Sanelli's so good. The handles are also comfortable. Here is a link showing how they are made http://www.sanelliknives.com/SNLI_Sit...

      19 Replies
      1. re: davesmall
        cowboyardee Jul 20, 2010 12:38 PM

        I'd like to see these compared against the forschner, since their description makes them seem quite similar (stamped, similar HRC, said to sharpen easily), but the forschners are cheaper. Have you tried a forschner? Aside from the non-convex edge and the less colorful handle, on paper they are quite similar.

        1. re: cowboyardee
          s
          smkit Jul 20, 2010 01:02 PM

          I have both the 10-inch Forschner Fibrox and 10-inch Sanelli and I personally prefer the Forschner. I must admit that I have not put a new edge on either of the knives, but OTB the Forschner was sharper and the blade was thinner, which meant that the Sanelli seemed to wedge more when cutting.

          With that said, I have been wanting to sharpen the Sanelli to give it a new edge and have another go at it. The handle is very comfortable -- by far the most comfortable of the low-cost professional kitchen knives I have tried. I also like the shape of the blade and the Sanelli is one of my favorites when it comes to chopping herbs.

          ...but I still side with the Forschners for overall cutting performance and price.

          1. re: smkit
            Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 01:46 PM

            ... I need to buy more knives....

            1. re: Chemicalkinetics
              s
              smkit Jul 20, 2010 06:38 PM

              Everyone needs more knives.

              1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                cowboyardee Jul 20, 2010 07:42 PM

                More knives already? How are you liking the new Tojiro gyuto? Did it not scratch the new knife itch for very long?

                1. re: cowboyardee
                  s
                  smkit Jul 20, 2010 07:53 PM

                  I lent the Tojiro to my chef friend and he loved it so much I haven't been able to get it back. He left a message on my phone saying he wanted to buy it from me.

                  Right now I am waiting for my Hiromoto AS gyuto. Should come in this week.

                  1. re: smkit
                    Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 08:14 PM

                    Sell it to your chef friend like 20%-30% off. I mean, once you have your Hiromoto AS gyuto, you probably won't need it. Except maybe use it as a backup knife for your guests.

                    :)

                    1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                      cowboyardee Jul 20, 2010 08:28 PM

                      i was trying to ask how you like your tojiro, though of course its nice to hear that smkit's friend enjoys it and even more so that he's about to experience the hiromoto AS.

                      1. re: cowboyardee
                        Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 08:54 PM

                        Hi Cowboy,

                        I answered smkit and your questions at about the same time, so you may have missed the one addressing you. It is started with:

                        :) Thank for asking, Cowboy. The Tojiro gyuto is pretty cool.....

                        It is like 3-5 post below this one.

                      2. re: Chemicalkinetics
                        s
                        smkit Jul 20, 2010 08:33 PM

                        Yep, that is probably what will happen. My Hiro is going to be so sweet. I will never let it go. Dave Martell is putting a new handle and edge on it, and I am following the process on Knifeforums. My knife is the one on the far left.

                        http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/sho...

                        After that I am going for the Ichimonji TKC. So cowboyardee, I guess my itch isn't even close to being satisfied.

                        1. re: smkit
                          Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 08:52 PM

                          What is going to be the color of your handle? I cannot be sure by looking at the unfinished photo? Will it be the purple?

                          1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                            s
                            smkit Jul 20, 2010 09:00 PM

                            It will be a bluish silver and is blue curly maple.

                            Here is the actual block it came from.

                            http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/sho...

                            1. re: smkit
                              Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 09:04 PM

                              I love that color. I am not just saying to be nice. That is my favorest color of the ones you showed me in an earlier post. I like the brown one too. The only concern I have is that it is of a light color, so be careful not to stain it. When sharpening the knife, just be careful not to get the gound metal fine onto the handle. I made that mistake before. Best wishes.

                              1. re: Chemicalkinetics
                                s
                                smkit Jul 20, 2010 09:16 PM

                                Good point. I was just reading about ho wood wa handles, and some mentioned that their stone slurry stained the handles. I'm adding some oil treatment in the next couple weeks, but I will be careful with my new knife.

                    2. re: cowboyardee
                      Chemicalkinetics Jul 20, 2010 08:37 PM

                      :) Thanks for asking, Cowboy. The Tojiro gyuto is pretty cool. From published specifications and handling, it seems to be the same level of Shun classic (VG-10, 61 HRC....), except less expensive. Not 100% sure if it is VG-10, but several sources say so.

                      I tried to use it via push-cutting and rock chopping. I finally realize why rock chopping is not so great for these gyutos. It does not dull the entire edge, but it dulls the tip region fast. Well, for me anyway.

                      I have been lending my Tojiro gyuto to friends. They like it. However, I learn another thing. Most people are pretty rough to knives. I lent my Dexter Chinese Chef's knife for a week, and it came back with some minor chips. I lent my CCK knife for a week, and it came back with minor chips and rust. Now, I lent my Tojiro gyuto for a week, and it came back with scratches, minor chips and stains.

                      I don't baby my knives, but I guess that most people are rougher to knives than I do.

                      I think the Tojiro gyuto taugh me more than just the knife itself. At first, I thought Japanese gyuto can be a competitor against German chef's knives, but now considering that most people are pretty rough to their knives, I don't think Japanese knives are suitable for many people.

                  2. re: smkit
                    cowboyardee Jul 20, 2010 02:00 PM

                    IMO the thinness behind its edge is one of the best reasons to get a forschner (and probably the main reason they fared so well in tests like the Cooks Illustrated reviews compared to other European knives), so I gather that I wouldn't like the sanellis as much either. If you cut through a lot of chicken backs with your chefs knife, YMMV.

                    1. re: cowboyardee
                      s
                      smkit Jul 20, 2010 06:51 PM

                      I think that's it. The Forschner blade is thinner and also holds up reasonably well. The Sanelli steel looks of better quality, but the blade geometry isn't to my liking. I also use the Idahone ceramic steel before I use my Forschners, and that really makes them unbeatable for the price.

                  3. re: cowboyardee
                    h
                    hlsess Jul 20, 2010 01:02 PM

                    I just returned Cutco b/c they were too sharp- cut my finger so badly I needed stitches- are Henkels that sharp?

                    1. re: hlsess
                      alanbarnes Jul 20, 2010 01:16 PM

                      First, the standard microserrated Cutco aren't really that sharp. They will, however, do tremendous tissue damage because they tear, rather than slice, whatever you're cutting. Including your finger.

                      Second, there's no such thing as "too sharp." A sharp knife is a safe knife. If you lack the skills to use a it properly, you may want to acquire them by taking a class or just watching youtube videos and practicing at home. But you're far more likely to injure yourself if your knife is dull.

                      Finally, most Henkels knives are reasonably sharp out of the box. They aren't going to take as keen an edge as something made from harder steel, but they should easily shave the hair off your forearm. Your job, if you choose to buy one, is to keep it that way.

                2. Paulustrious May 22, 2009 11:46 AM

                  I would just like to thank all the chowhounders who bothered to reply to this and other threads about knives. I have finally bitten the bullet and bought some shuns. And I have to admit one of the reasons is pretty childlike. My kitchen has a large centre island round which my friends sit, laugh, eat and drink while I cook....

                  The knives looks sexy.

                  My shallowness goes deep..

                  2 Replies
                  1. re: Paulustrious
                    NYChristopher May 27, 2009 12:18 AM

                    Hey, I wanted to buy Global for the same reason, I'll admit it. Of course, after I actually had one in my hand I realized why I would hate having it. Still, they do look cool.

                    1. re: Paulustrious
                      Soop May 27, 2009 02:50 AM

                      I remember buying a skateboard once (just the deck). The only shape and size I liked was ugly. The guy in the shop said "why do you care - a few weeks, you won't be able to see what's printed anyway." I said that if I'm paying £55 for something, I at least want it to look nice.

                      Same is true of knives; you might as well buy nice ones.

                    2. NYChristopher Apr 24, 2009 04:21 PM

                      DISCLAIMER: I didn't read what everyone wrote, I'm just tossing in my .02

                      Without an idea of what "not your whole paycheck" represents, I will tell you that I had a minor bit of price anxiety when I purchased my Messermeister Elite 5-piece set but have come to love them. The bolster is semi-rounded, the handle isn't plastic, the weighting was ideal for me (and I was thinking of one or two other brands). I really recommend going to a store and trying some out, get 'em in your hands and feel them. One of the reasons I went AWAY from one of the other brands I was thinking of was that it just didn't feel right. And considering you may well have these the rest of your life, it's important to have tools you're comfortable with.

                      4 Replies
                      1. re: NYChristopher
                        nbermas Apr 24, 2009 05:30 PM

                        NYChrispher: When I orginally wrote the post I had a salary now it is nil to nothing so I change my post to where to get FREE anything, thanks

                        1. re: nbermas
                          NYChristopher May 3, 2009 01:04 PM

                          Free anything? Ah, you touched on a personal favorite of mine: Freecycle.

                          Go to freecycle.org, type in your city or state, e.g. Connecticut, then select the group of your choice navigate to the yahoo group and join it.

                          WARNING: the New York group I used to be in had a TON of traffic, so rather than get ALL messages or even just DIGEST messages, I posted to the site only when I had something to offer or something I wanted.

                          And my success rate was astonishingly good. I only wish I were there now (I'm now in Philadelphia and in a similar economic boat) ... I need a slow cooker.

                          1. re: NYChristopher
                            Sam Fujisaka May 3, 2009 01:36 PM

                            I just bought a big oval Crock Pot slow cooker at Target when I was in DC last time. Cost $18. To me that is pretty much free comapred to costs here. The real cost was hand carrying it back to Colombia.

                        2. re: NYChristopher
                          c
                          chuckl May 22, 2009 12:28 PM

                          I agree, I found the Messermeister's very well balanced and they feel great in my hand. I think I use the 5-inch elite santoku more than just about anything else.

                        3. g
                          gfr1111 Apr 24, 2009 02:17 PM

                          I am very impressed with the Global knives. I like the fact that they are all one piece and food doesn't get stuck where the knife blade meets the handle. They're lightweight, balanced, and stay sharp. When I bought the first one, I was concerned that the metal handle would become slippery when wet, but that hasn't happened. The stipled (or whatever you call it) handle has great adhesion. However, they may be more money than you want to spend.

                          1 Reply
                          1. re: gfr1111
                            c
                            cacruden Apr 24, 2009 04:04 PM

                            I have been very impressed with my Global-Pro knives which I have been buying every time I fly through Tokyo (they only sell them in Japan). Probably outside the price point of this original post, but when compared to the Henkle that I had - the global pro is sharper one year after last sharpening then the Henkle was just after it was sharpened. Of course you have to handle them better (i.e. clean and dry after using - do not let them sit around wet). Not sure the difference between Global and Global pro.

                          2. c
                            cutthroat49 Apr 22, 2009 08:38 AM

                            bought a 8" Henkels on sale in Macys in 1990 THis knife still sharpens well and is my go to knife. Also have a 12" Korin which is a work horse. Have several Globals which I bought after seeing Bobby Flay use them on the early days of Food TV. They are light and sharpen well and are good all around knives. If I needed or had the urge for a new knife now would try the forschner line Have read some good thing about them

                            2 Replies
                            1. re: cutthroat49
                              c
                              chuckl Apr 22, 2009 09:12 AM

                              now might be a good time to try a forschner/victorinox, as Amazon has the 8 inch chefs on special for $14. An incredible deal

                              1. re: chuckl
                                johnb Apr 22, 2009 07:24 PM

                                Unfortunately that price is from one of the third parties that use Amazon, and they make it up with a high shipping charge. That said it's still cheap, almost wholesale. Amazon seems to have that particular knife and a few others on perpetual loss leader status, but the price does fluctuate from day-to-day.

                                I'd be very interested in seeing their pricing algorthm.

                            2. p
                              pickledgarlic Jul 27, 2007 04:05 PM

                              One other thing..

                              for the love of god, handle the knife if you can.

                              I can't stand the forschner (SP?) handles. Something about them just doesn't feel good in my hand. I have big hands too and I found the Global handles lacking. The MAC fits my hand just right ($75 cdn hit the price right too).

                              If the handle sucks, for you, no matter how well the rest of the knife is it won't get used.

                              Invest in a good sharpener too, and don't store you're shiny new toy in the cutlery drawer.

                              1. p
                                pickledgarlic Jul 27, 2007 04:02 PM

                                The Tojiro DP 240mm gyuto (japanesechefknife.com) for $50 USD is awesome.
                                I have a 8" MAC Professional ($75 CDN from the asian supply store) that I swear by.

                                A surprising heavy hitter in my kitchen is a un-named thin vegetable cleaver from (apparently) japan I got for $20 at the asian place. Carbon steel wrapped in stainless. Holds an edge like no tomorrow and gets an awful lot of use. A chef's knife is nice but if I'm doing bulk chopping I like the cleaver. The scooping action is useful and unless I'm doing really really delicate work, the end product is as good as my chefs knife.
                                I suggest this guy: http://groceryguy.blogspot.com/2007/0... as a starting point for cleavers (well more of an end point) really.

                                1. jayt90 Jul 13, 2007 06:15 AM

                                  I have a lot of Sabatier carbon steel knives, and a couple of Japanese laminates, but the knife I use most, and which feels best in my hand, is a simple Lee Valley 7" French peasant's knife, carbon steel, from Taiwan. It costs about $22.

                                  1. j
                                    JIRodriguez Jul 11, 2007 03:01 PM

                                    The best knife to buy is the knife that feels good to you and you will acctually use. If you buy a $100 knife and never use it becuase it feels wrong, it's worthless to you.

                                    That being said I have two types of knives in my kitchen that both have good bang for the buck.

                                    If you like a nice heaby feel Calphalon makes a nice line that sells under the "Simply Calphalon" name. They are forged, have a full tang in the handle, are very stout, and cost about $20-35 per blade. So you can buy them open stock one at a time to go easy on the pocket book.

                                    My second choice are the OXO Pro knives. They are precision cast and ground, so they are not as thick and stout as the forged knives, but they are generally much nicer than stamped blades. The thing I absolutely love about these knives are the grip. They have that great OXO rubber coating on the grips so you can work with them for a long time and your hands don't get as tired. Or if your hands are wet or oily you still feel like you have a good grip - I am missing my right hand pinky so having a good grip is vital for me. The OXO's run about $15-30 per blade and I think you can pick up a block set for $80-$100.

                                    Your best bet is to go into someplace that has a lot of open stock and tell them you want to see how a bunch of differant knives feel, then shop around for a good price!

                                    1 Reply
                                    1. re: JIRodriguez
                                      w
                                      Westy Jul 16, 2007 05:59 AM

                                      Could not agree more on the Calphalons. Have a short chef's knife and am really impressed. Easy to sharpen as well. Impressive for the price.

                                    2. pepper_mil Jul 9, 2007 05:37 AM

                                      Stop buying brand names and go by feel - the right weight, size, and handle shape for you is going to be a lot different, probably, from mine. I am using a 6" right now with a great blade that feels like an extension of my hand and cost less than 2$. I bought it in China, but the principle applies.

                                      1 Reply
                                      1. re: pepper_mil
                                        m
                                        Meann Jul 11, 2007 10:58 AM

                                        I agree about judging by feel ... no knife is going to suit every hand. And keep an eye open at flea markets. You can find very good old high carbon knives that look awful til you get them home and cleaned up and properly sharpened for a couple of dollars.

                                      2. b
                                        bogie Jul 8, 2007 09:50 PM

                                        Check out www. watanabeblade.com or Google to find out where you can find knives by Murray Carter. Both create Japanese-style hand-forged works of art, many of which are priced the same or less than mass-produced Wusthofs.

                                        2 Replies
                                        1. re: bogie
                                          UnConundrum Jul 9, 2007 05:23 AM

                                          If you're interested, here's a link to my Carters:

                                          http://picasaweb.google.com/unconundr...

                                          1. re: UnConundrum
                                            b
                                            bogie Jul 9, 2007 11:10 AM

                                            Those are sweet! But your Carters aren't exactly the less expensive ones I was referring to! I think that his Mueteki (sp?) line of knives under $100 is the absolute best value around.

                                            I am impatiently awaiting a new 180cm Gyotu from Watanabe...

                                        2. Richard 16 Jul 7, 2007 11:07 PM

                                          I have a variety of knives that I have accumulated over the years, some from way back in my restaurant days. I got a carbon steel Chicago cutlery chef's knife cut back from stock to give the balance I need for the Japanese cutting I learned (sliding the knife rather than chopping) and they gave it the single bevel edge. I also have a stiff fillet knife (Dexter) and vegetable knife of unknown origin both of which I picked up at -- yard sales! I have an old takobiki for slicing sushi that I got decades ago as part of a sushi making set. Cheap but very effective if I keep it sharp.

                                          My latest addition is a santoku knife I recieved as a present from my brother when he heard I was researching santokus. It's from Lamson in western MA. (They claim to have originated the santoku style! Pretty big claim!) He lives there and bought it at their factory store. It's German stainless. (I bring my knives to a restaurant store for sharpening -- while I wait. They say that a lot of "German" steel is produced here in St. Louis and shipped to Germany! Another claim I have not researched...) In any case, the knife is a little heavy but keeps its edge well.

                                          I heartily recommend that unless you can keep your knives bone dry and out of the humidity that whatever you get get rustless. The Chicago knife I have is not and I have to pamper it all the time,especially if I cut anything acidic. I often coat it with a little vegetable oil, and rub most of it off and in.

                                          1. thunderbug84 Jun 15, 2007 12:03 PM

                                            I like to buy knives in block sets. Check out places like Overstock.com for rediculous deals. Right now Overstock has 2 different JA Henckels block sets that are of great quality. They also have a ton of differernt Wusthof options. This is def. the way to go, especially with free shipping.

                                            1. UnConundrum Jun 10, 2007 04:36 PM

                                              All too often cheap knives are just that, cheap. If you're looking for a quality knife at reasonable prices I highly recommend www.japanesechefsknife.com The Tojiro line handled by them are very reasonably priced and they're a great company to deal with. You can find the Tojiro line here: http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/DPS...

                                              1 Reply
                                              1. re: UnConundrum
                                                alanbarnes May 29, 2009 02:00 PM

                                                I'm pretty sure Kenji dropped the Tojiro line when the prices went up. But you can still get 'em at Korin:

                                                http://korin.com/Shop/Tojiro

                                              2. c
                                                chuckl Jun 10, 2007 12:42 PM

                                                in general forged knives are much more expensive than stamped. You can go to a lot of places to see the difference. However, that doesn't necessarily mean the forged knives cut better or stay sharper longer. Stamped knives will feel lighter, and in some cases, this might be an issue. If money is an object, though, check out the range of stamped knives like forschner, dexter, etc.

                                                1. j
                                                  janeer Jun 9, 2007 06:54 PM

                                                  In America, Forschner of Chicago cutlery. Also, when I am in Europe I always bring high-carbon steel knives back from the shops there; I have a thin slicer I bought in Paris in the 70s that is still one of my favorite knives. Brought a wonderful beak parer back last year that I just love.
                                                  www.littlecomptonmornings.blogspot.com

                                                  1. w
                                                    webomen Jun 8, 2007 07:23 PM

                                                    haha...my girlfriend bought me an entire knife set (16 pcs)..with timer attached to the block set for no more then $10 at pickering flea market, and it works just fine, a little of sharping of course..but much better then what I had before..i know..the girl wants to safe her money..well..i can just say..that was a smart buy.

                                                    1. x
                                                      xena Jun 8, 2007 06:59 PM

                                                      I bought the Victorinox/Forschner 8" Chef's knife, model 40520, on Amazon for about $30. delivered. I'm very happy with it. Bought my son a much pricier Wusthof but I think I like mine at least as well. That surprised me.

                                                      1. h
                                                        Hungry Celeste Jun 7, 2007 08:33 AM

                                                        Best quality for the extremely LOW price: Rada. Often sold by clubs/schools as a fundraiser, sometimes available in retail outlets. But I've seen Wusthof & Henckels at TJ Maxx for relatively affordable prices.

                                                        1 Reply
                                                        1. re: Hungry Celeste
                                                          aphayes Jul 12, 2007 06:58 PM

                                                          I bought a brand new set of these on Ebay for about $35. They stay sharp and are really great knives. Only thing I can say bad about them is some people don't like the metal handles. Happy cutting!

                                                        2. hitachino Jun 1, 2007 07:51 AM

                                                          buy the pricier knives, whichever you prefer, at places like ross, TJ maxx, marshalls instead of at places like bed bath and beyond, department stores or fancy chef shops.

                                                          2 Replies
                                                          1. re: hitachino
                                                            b
                                                            bbc Jun 6, 2007 06:34 PM

                                                            i've been pretty happy with some brand-name knives i've bought at marshall-type stores, but you could also try going to a local asian grocery store & checking out the knives there. i bought a cleaver years ago (i think it was like $10) and i love it. they have a range though - i don't like the really large but thin kind that seems to be one piece, mine is quite solid and heavy, goes through meat so easily. they also have the asian uni-knife (rectangular, for all purpose things).

                                                            maybe you could check out the details on some of the pricey brands (i.e. what makes them so great?) and then look for similar things elsewhere.

                                                            1. re: hitachino
                                                              f
                                                              foodstorm Jun 15, 2007 01:18 PM

                                                              Really??? I have never seen "pricier" knives at those stores. Usually KA, and the cheapo International Henckels is about it. Gotta look harder next time.

                                                            2. flourgirl May 25, 2007 04:50 PM

                                                              I have a 10" Forschner chef's knife and a Dexter-Russell bread knife. Love 'em both and didn't break the bank.

                                                              9 Replies
                                                              1. re: flourgirl
                                                                k
                                                                Kelli2006 Jun 11, 2007 02:39 PM

                                                                Flourgirl, I utilize Forschner knives in my professional knife kit, except for a few dexter Russell. I prefer the D-R bread and slicing knives over Forschner, but that is a very personal decision. There are too many people who equate forged(expensive) with quality. Forschner is standard in professional kitchens, and there is a lessons to be learned.

                                                                My daughter gave me a Kitchen Aid Santuko for X-mas, and I am amazed by this knife. She paid approx $25.00 and it performs as well as many knives costing 2-3 times as much. Its very sharp, takes a steeling easily and the silicone grip handle makes it very comfortable in a wet environment. I liked it so much I bought her a 3 piece set for her college apartment next year. The only downside to this knife is that it is made in China.

                                                                IMVHO, there are too many people who post here who feel that all their cooking problems can be solved with the purchased another piece of equipment. Technique and experience are far more than important that top of the line equipment, and the sign of a real professional are those who can prepare a great meal with less than optimal ingredients and tools.
                                                                A lady who I apprenticed under beat it into me psyche that a real craftsman never blames their tools for a less than optimal performance.

                                                                1. re: Kelli2006
                                                                  Sam Fujisaka Jun 15, 2007 12:28 PM

                                                                  I agree with K2006: I have the same KA Santuko, which I got for $20 at Target. Besides that I mostly use my 35 year old six-inch Sabatier chefs and a newer gotton on sale five inch Sabatier that I use to fillet fish. I went through a stage of more money than experience and bought a couple of really nice but pricey K. Dicks. Never use them. I find the lighter Sabatiers to be much faster than the German knives.

                                                                2. re: flourgirl
                                                                  coney with everything Jul 16, 2007 07:42 AM

                                                                  Cook's Illustrated always seems to love the Forschner/Victorinox knives, but where can you buy them (retail, not online)? I've looked at BBB and a couple of other stores but no luck. I want to see and hold a knife before I buy it.

                                                                  I would say to knife shoppers to stay away from the "sabatier" knife deals on Amazon. I have a 30 yr old Sabatier that I love so I fell for the "closeout, regular retail $300, sale today 29.95 Imported Sabatier....." knives they featured on their home page. What a waste of money. They don't sharpen at all, and the knife block they came in looks like it was never sanded down. Sure, the knives are imported...from CHINA, not France.

                                                                  1. re: coney with everything
                                                                    k
                                                                    Kelli2006 Jul 16, 2007 08:38 AM

                                                                    Coney w/ everything. Forschner knives are standard in the food service industry and I have always found the best prices are at a restaurant supply shop. If a particular shop doesn't have them I am sure that they can direct you to a store that does. I love the Forschner paring knives, and they are a absolute bargain at $6.00 each. I buy a 1/2 doz even 2 years, as they are constantly stolen from my kit.

                                                                    Knife merchant or cutlery.com have great prices online.

                                                                    1. re: Kelli2006
                                                                      coney with everything Jul 20, 2007 07:16 AM

                                                                      Thanks, Kelli, I never though to look at a restaurant supply place.

                                                                      1. re: Kelli2006
                                                                        b
                                                                        bogie Jul 20, 2007 11:04 AM

                                                                        Prices can be even better at the bookstore of your local culinary arts college!

                                                                      2. re: coney with everything
                                                                        breadandcoffee May 25, 2009 12:51 PM

                                                                        Victorinox - I bought mine at Winners which I think is equivalent to Target in the US.

                                                                        1. re: breadandcoffee
                                                                          jayt90 May 25, 2009 06:45 PM

                                                                          Winners=Target? Haven't heard that one, but I know Target is looking for a Canadian entry.

                                                                          1. re: breadandcoffee
                                                                            c
                                                                            chuckl May 25, 2009 07:16 PM

                                                                            probably the best knife on a budget

                                                                      3. Chuckles the Clone May 25, 2007 04:02 PM

                                                                        Dexter-Russell's. Neither lower in quality nor higher in price than the
                                                                        acclaimed Forschner/Victorinox, plus you can get em in *camouflage* !
                                                                        http://www.dexter-russell.com/product...

                                                                        4 Replies
                                                                        1. re: Chuckles the Clone
                                                                          w
                                                                          Westy Jun 12, 2007 08:12 AM

                                                                          I could not agree more. I love my Dexter. It holds a great edge and has a great balance to it. i have the white handled model (you see them in rstaurant kitchens). Not flashy, lacks the style of muh nicer knives, but I would heartily recommend them.
                                                                          I also checked out the Dexter "Connoisseur" line. They have forged blades and really nice wood handles.
                                                                          Incidentally, the Dexter cleavers and Asian veggie knives set a standard for quality. I have both and they are great.

                                                                          1. re: Westy
                                                                            m
                                                                            MakingSense Jun 12, 2007 08:57 AM

                                                                            Flashy? Style? You're not doing a photo shoot. Just because something is more expensive doesn't mean that it's necessarily "nicer." I got over kitchen tool envy loooong ago. There's almost a certain counter-chic to having the inexpensive knives that are used in restaurant kitchens and butcher shops. How many people spend $200 on a knife and botch a simple dice, can't do a decent julienne to save their lives?
                                                                            Your hands, skills and the care you give your knives are the ultimate tools. Money is never a substitute for technique.

                                                                            1. re: MakingSense
                                                                              w
                                                                              Westy Jun 12, 2007 09:46 AM

                                                                              Understood, but I see a lot of posters in other threads who like the Globals, higher-end Sabatiers, etc. I want my kitchen gear to be easy to use and last a long time.

                                                                              1. re: Westy
                                                                                m
                                                                                MakingSense Jun 12, 2007 10:33 AM

                                                                                See jfood's testimonial above to his 1978 Forschner. Good stuff is found at every price point. Some people love their expensive new toys and others revel in a fabulous bargain. I have beloved gear that I paid too much for with a song in my heart and cheap stuff that I dearly love for which I make no excuses. Some of my things are inherited from grandmothers and bought at estate sales. Some things that cost a lot didn't last or never really gave me the pleasure I expected.
                                                                                Price is not always a guarantee of performance.

                                                                        2. jfood May 25, 2007 03:03 PM

                                                                          jfood has a 10" forschner from 1978 that is still a great knife. last time jfood went shopping for a 7-8" decided to buy whatever felt the best, no price barriers. Jfood bought a 8" forschner. Price is $30-50. Great knife, great price. could not justify triple digits for a knife when the Forschner has been good to jfood.

                                                                          10 Replies
                                                                          1. re: jfood
                                                                            w
                                                                            will47 Jun 8, 2007 06:31 PM

                                                                            Why does jfood talk in third person about jfood?

                                                                            You'll see a lot of recs for the Forschners, both here and elsewhere. I finally got one (a 10" stamped chef's knife w/ wood handle) to see how I liked a 10" blade, and I think it's a great knife for the price. It doesn't have the heft of some other knives, but it works great, and the factory edge is pretty sharp. I find myself reaching for it recently, even though I have a bunch of "nicer" and more expensive knives.

                                                                            Also, the Mundial forged stuff is a great value.. you can get a forged 8" chef knife for ~ $20-25.

                                                                            1. re: will47
                                                                              ttriche Jun 9, 2007 07:29 PM

                                                                              Second the Mundial rec. My Mundial wood-handled forged 8" chef's knife from college is still going strong. A mighty blade for ~$30 (and it's a '2100', which Amazon seems to still sell for the same $30 or so last I checked). I was under the impression that Mundial was started by some Henckels employees who realized that steel (and steelworking) was a lot cheaper in Brazil for the same quality of product... may be apocryphal, but I have to say, our Henckels Pro S wedding-present cleaver has an uncanny resemblance in heft and steel to the Mundial chef's knife that I got in college.

                                                                              F. Dick and Forschner are particularly well entrenched in all of the old-school butcher shops I've ever patronized. My father picked up a scimitar-style Forschner from Canali's Meats in DC and loves it. (I hated to break the news that the Market was gutted by fire recently, but they'll be back... just some more battle scars for that magnificent building)

                                                                              So anyways, forged or not, wood or plastic, you can get a bomber chef's knife that will hold up to many, many sharpenings for not a lot of money. You just have to look outside of the usual high-ticket Wusthof and Henckels offerings. (Kershaw used to make good ones, don't know whether they still do since Shun gave them a license to print money)

                                                                              1. re: ttriche
                                                                                m
                                                                                MakingSense Jun 10, 2007 02:17 PM

                                                                                The Canales Brothers are already back! You didn't think a three-alarm fire that destroyed a major market was going to keep them down, did you? They're selling their fine meats, fresh pastas and sauces at the outdoor market Fri - Sat until the temporary market is open next month and then it's back to normal, sort of.

                                                                                1. re: ttriche
                                                                                  randallhank Mar 20, 2009 01:04 AM

                                                                                  Belated, but I third the Mundial rec. In addition to my Wusthof and Globals, my main workhorse knives are Mundial forged. I have 5100 in black and a few in white. I also have the most beautiful carving set and bread knife from the old 2100 ironwood series. I also have a Olivier Anquier carving set and 10 inch chef knife. I think I have a problem. Anyway, my Mundials hold their blade as good or better than the Wusthof's. Mundial DID, btw, make knives for Henckels once upon a time.

                                                                                  1. re: ttriche
                                                                                    e
                                                                                    EdwardAdams Apr 22, 2009 08:28 AM

                                                                                    I wil cast my vote for Mundial as well. Well designed and executed and made from
                                                                                    German steel worked in Brazil. The price is outstanding. After using them for a number of years, I bought my daughter a three piece set, chef, serrated, parer for $80. She says they are the only ones she uses now.

                                                                                    1. re: EdwardAdams
                                                                                      nbermas Apr 22, 2009 10:21 AM

                                                                                      Where do you buy Mundial?

                                                                                      1. re: nbermas
                                                                                        e
                                                                                        EdwardAdams Apr 23, 2009 06:12 AM

                                                                                        I got mine here.

                                                                                        http://www.cutleryandmore.com/mundial...

                                                                                        1. re: nbermas
                                                                                          randallhank Jan 5, 2010 06:45 PM

                                                                                          The Mundial Store or ebay.

                                                                                  2. re: jfood
                                                                                    bkhuna May 29, 2009 02:35 PM

                                                                                    Forschner is a good recommendation for inexpensive yet good knives. It's a great knife to start off with because of the quality you get for the price. Many folks stay with them and never feel the need to pay more.

                                                                                    1. re: jfood
                                                                                      i
                                                                                      Info Adso Nov 8, 2009 09:56 PM

                                                                                      Ever seen "The Jimmy" Episode of Seinfeld? I thought you had Cutco knives, jfood? That might not help your credibility in the knife department. Though that doesn't change the fact that you are correct - Forschner knives offer a tremendous value.

                                                                                    2. steinpilz May 25, 2007 02:30 PM

                                                                                      I have Wusthoff, Global, and Shun, knives. I more recently got the Asian ones. I got the Wusthoff in the 80s (they obviously last, thought one broke from my pounding too many garlic cloves and I lost two in moving, hopefully someone in Pittsburgh is doing some great cooking now - I love my Wusthoff cleaver but rarely use my 6' 'sandwich knife'). I'd say that I like the Asain knives because they seem lighter and more 'alive' - perhaps this is a deliberate marketing strategy for people like me. I have no complaints about the 5" Global, I use it for most everything now, I had a brief problem with the 8" Shun rusting on a 'stainless steel' rack in my sink but I learned from my mistake. The Shun is very sharp and attractive, I only use it for special occasions. I'd like to get some of those neat Japanese vegetable knives, I wouldn't buy a 'set' from any manufacturer at this point.

                                                                                      4 Replies
                                                                                      1. re: steinpilz
                                                                                        n
                                                                                        Noice May 25, 2007 02:43 PM

                                                                                        Steinpilz:

                                                                                        Just curious (or nervous, really): how exactly did your knife break from smashing garlic cloves? Thanks for helping my knife avoid the same fate.

                                                                                        Noice

                                                                                        1. re: Noice
                                                                                          steinpilz May 25, 2007 04:31 PM

                                                                                          I would use my small Wustoff to crush garlic, gentle smash with the garlic under the blade. One day the blade broke off about 3 inches away from the handle during some not too extreme chore (prying apart frozen chicken I think). I was quite surprised but after thinking I thought it must be a repetited stress related fracture - after many years of mostly gentle garlic crushing the steel had weakened. My solution is to now use my newly made 3 inch Wustoff for all my garlic crushing, as well as all manner of utility-knife tasks. Thanks for asking.

                                                                                          1. re: steinpilz
                                                                                            Zeldog May 28, 2007 06:45 PM

                                                                                            Doesn't your Wusthoff have a lifetime warranty? If their policy is the same as Henkels, you can get a new one (full size) for the cost of shipping the old one to them just to make sure it's theirs. No questions asked and no receipt required.

                                                                                            1. re: Zeldog
                                                                                              steinpilz May 31, 2007 09:46 AM

                                                                                              When I bought the Global 5" as a replacement the lady in the store mentioned this to me about the Wustoff, I looked at their website and either decided that it didn't apply or I just decided to keep my old-shorter knife for sentimental reasons.

                                                                                      2. a
                                                                                        adventuresinbaking May 25, 2007 01:11 PM

                                                                                        I have the Victorianox chef's knife. It costs about 25 dollars and is a great knife. I've used more expensive knives that I have liked less.

                                                                                        Actually, I haven't met a Victorianox knife that I haven't liked. I own about three and they all work well and cost considerably less than other professional knives.

                                                                                        1. n
                                                                                          Nikiforos May 25, 2007 01:04 PM

                                                                                          Cheap high carbon ones--they sharpen easily.

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