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Wine preservation systems

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nose_food Mar 31, 2007 11:00 AM

What works well, what's a good value, etc.
Has anybody seen any reports scientifically comparing different products/systems (lets say vaccuum pump vs. nitrogen vs. argon). Any web links I should look at?
I found this: http:/ www.bettertastingwine.com/preserving....
What are restaurants using?
I'm leaning towards "Private Preserve" system (value for money) but have heard good things about the "ReServe" (expensive, especially if I need it for several different bottles at the same time).

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  1. Bill Hunt RE: nose_food Mar 31, 2007 02:27 PM

    I have several: 2 nitrogen (bottles of Private Reserve being one), argon and Vac-u-vins. Maybe I just have less leftover wine, but all of the non-pump units are gathering dust. For short-term storage in the 'fridge, the pump works fine. I even have one, plus a half-dozen stoppers in all of our larger suitcases, so we are never without, when traveling.

    I've never done a controlled experiment with these devices, and suppose that I should. However, as stated, it just doesn't stick around that long.

    Hunt

    4 Replies
    1. re: Bill Hunt
      carswell RE: Bill Hunt Mar 31, 2007 04:34 PM

      [Meant this as a reply to the OP. Sorry.]

      Well, friends and I have done a semi-controlled side-by-side test and inert gas came out the winner. The test featured four young mid-priced wines: two whites (a Burgundy and an Alsatian Riesling) and two reds (a Burgundy and a M├ędoc). A third of each bottle was transferred to a half bottle and sealed with a Vacu-Vin type system; another third to a 250-ml screwcapped bottle and gassed with Private Preserve; and the remaining third was left in the original bottle and recorked. (Unfortunately, we didn't test freezing.) The wines were tasted blind two days later. In every case, the majority preferred the gassed wine.

      Based on that test, personal experience (I used Vacu-Vin for years before trying Private Preserve) and anecdotal evidence from people in the food and wine service business, I've concluded that vacuum pump systems are only slightly better than just recorking the bottle. The pumps remove aromatics; they don't create anywhere near a perfect vacuum, so oxidation continues, only at a slightly slower rate; and they aren't airtight (the next day you can pump out almost as much air as you did the day before), so their benefit, such as it is, lasts only a few hours.

      1. re: Bill Hunt
        b
        brandygirl RE: Bill Hunt Mar 18, 2008 12:10 PM

        re: "short-term storage in the 'fridge," does that include reds? I've always kept leftover reds on the counter, thinking that the refrigerator would ruin them. Should I put the leftover reds in the 'fridge?

        1. re: brandygirl
          monkuboy RE: brandygirl Mar 18, 2008 02:35 PM

          They will keep longer in the fridge. Just make sure to take them out in enough time to let them warm up. I keep my leftovers in the fridge and there seems to be no deterioration by letting them chill like that.

          1. re: monkuboy
            b
            brandygirl RE: monkuboy Mar 18, 2008 08:47 PM

            Good to know. Thanks!

      2. monkuboy RE: nose_food Mar 31, 2007 04:00 PM

        Like Bill Hunt, I haven't conducted controlled tests either but I've used both the Vacu-Vin and Private Preserve and haven't really noticed any difference. The Vacu-Vin keeps the wine tasting fresh for at least 5 days (I haven't tried it longer than that) and it I find it easier than the Private Preserve. I was initially hesitant to use either one, but they seem to work fine as long as you don't wait too many days.

        1. Husky RE: nose_food Mar 31, 2007 04:04 PM

          if my wife and i are going to have one glass each with dinner, i simply transfer the remaining half bottle into an empty 375ml bottle, cork it and put it in the fridge (reds and whites)...chances are we will consume the balance within 48 hours and i've never had a wine "turn" using this method.

          1. Midlife RE: nose_food Mar 31, 2007 04:45 PM

            All I can add to the already on-target responses is that every one of the professional preservation systems on the market (these are mostly designed for wine bars and similar use) are inert gas systems. Argon is supposed to be the best choice for systems that allow you to choose. The two consumer versions (Private Preserve and Wine Life) use combinations of Nitrogen, Argon and CO2). In my experience, most wineries that use anything use one of those two.

            Here's a link to am Italian company that makes very high end systems for restaurants, bars, etc.. What I read says they use Nitrogen, but I believe their systems will use Argon as well. They claim no degredation after 20 days (but these systems are high-tech, totally enclosed units where the wine is never exposed to air after the bottle is set into the unit. http://www.enomatic.com/ I priced their 8-bottle, 2-temp unit @$12,000. The same unit with the card system was $20K. Not something for home use, but the message is, I think, in the gas.

            1. n
              nose_food RE: nose_food Apr 1, 2007 09:49 AM

              I just found this: http://www.avalonwine.com/Keeping-win...

              But what about inexpensive systems (private preserve) vs the pricey ones that completely contain/seal the bottle.

              1 Reply
              1. re: nose_food
                Midlife RE: nose_food Apr 1, 2007 12:44 PM

                The only 'pricey' one I know of that isn't major $Ks is the Pek system that runs around $200 and is also a refrigeration unit which, IMHO, is overkill. As to the effectiveness ...I'm sure it works better than Private Preserve or VacuVin, but a big downside is that it only holds a single bottle. My vote would go to Private Preserve/Wine Life and your home fridge. My experience is that gas is more reliable than air removal... YMMV.

                If you have a large number of bottles to preserve at a single time, and the $200 doesn't bother you, here's what I did....... Go to a compressed gas supplier (usually in the yellow pages under gas or oxygen equipment) and see if they can set you up with a small tank, gauge, regulator and hose w/\trigger nozzle. Have them fill the tank with nitrogen or argon. This is really geared toward a wine bar or restaurant use, but it's a pretty cool deal to have if you do a lot of tasting and entertaining and have a lot of leftovers. At $10 per can of Private Preserve, it will pay for itself @ around 20 cans of PP. Those cans say they give 120 'uses' but I find they run out of pressure at around 40 uses or so. I've had a tank of argon, that cost $17 to fill, preserve 500 bottles and it's still 75% full.

              2. ambrose RE: nose_food Apr 1, 2007 02:35 PM

                Here's a link to a previous discussion about this issue...

                http://www.chow.com/stories/10152

                In it, you will see reference to a study that Consumer Reports published in the December 2006 issue of their magazine. They tested four different wines using several wine-preservation systems that claim to eliminate, or at least minimize oxidation. Their conclusion? Recork the bottle and stick it in the fridge.

                http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/fo...

                1 Reply
                1. re: ambrose
                  Midlife RE: ambrose Apr 1, 2007 03:25 PM

                  I have no real interest in defending or recommending anything here. If someone can't taste a difference in wine stored for several days with just a cork and refrigeration, then that is the answer for them. People have vastly different sensitivities to aromas and flavors; the same person will even even have differences in their perception of these things at different times. It's the same issue as what you should pay for the wine itself ..... if you can't taste the difference, don't pay any more than the price at which you're happy with the wine.

                2. p
                  paulnewport RE: nose_food Mar 16, 2008 10:02 PM

                  The best systems seem to use gas. Take a look at WineStation from Napa Technology. I believe they are coming out with a home version this year.
                  www.napatechnology.com

                  2 Replies
                  1. re: paulnewport
                    Walla2WineWoman RE: paulnewport Mar 16, 2008 10:20 PM

                    I use the KISS version - keep it simple stupid. The very most I will use a vacu-vin, but otherwise if you have to keep the wine a few extra days transfer the wine into an empty plastic water bottle. Squeeze the air out of it, screw the cap back on and toss it in the fridge. It's the easiest way to keep wine without it oxidizing.

                    1. re: Walla2WineWoman
                      monkuboy RE: Walla2WineWoman Mar 17, 2008 09:07 PM

                      I use a similar method - I bought a 4-pack of syrah splits (187.5 ml bottles = 1/4 of a normal bottle). I use those bottles to apportion a bottle of wine into 4 servings, one glass per night. So far it works just fine and it only cost $3.00 for the 4 pack. You'd probably pay more than that just to buy the empty bottles! WallaWalla Wine Woman's solution is more flexible (no pun intended) but mine looks better, haha..

                  2. d
                    duck833 RE: nose_food Mar 18, 2008 05:31 PM

                    I do a little planning. If I am only going to have one or two glasses I open a younger Oregon Pinot Noir. These are typically tight and need some time or air. Usually I will enjoy my one generous glass and cork the bottle, I leave it on the counter. On day two I do the same, and I usually notice that the wine got better with a day open. Day three I finish off the bottle and the wine is actually better than it was on day one or two.

                    1. Vinquire RE: nose_food Mar 31, 2008 09:56 AM

                      Personally, I find a combination of Vacuvin, a smaller bottle/container, and the fridge to be the best. I once had a half open bottle that I opened the night before a trip, and it was still fresh as a daisy when I came home by:
                      1. Transfer the leftovers to a smaller bottle so there is less air contact (half bottles work great for this)
                      2. Vacuvin the heck out of that bottle
                      3. Stick it in the fridge. There is something about the chill that delays the oxidation process

                      I haven't had much luck with the gas, but I have a feeling that's me not squirting long enough. Other winos I know swear by it, but I find it to be expensive if you use it regularly, where the Vacuvin solution is buy once, and keep forever (or until the rubber stoppers crack from too much washing).

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