37093 Wed Jun 15 16:48:38 -0700 2005 20 1 San Francisco Bay Area 0 172210 This morning I'm waiting for my parents and thumbing through the new issue of Food and Wine. In the intro to Bobby Flay's recipe for a San Francisco-style seafood stew, he says that Pompeii's Grotto, Nick's Lighthouse and Tarantino's are his favorites on the wharf. Any first mouth reports on these places? Link: http://nickslighthouse.com/ Wed Jun 15 16:48:38 -0700 2005 0 Melanie Wong 1 172217 Am I the only one who thinks that Bobby Flay's visits to the Bay Area are not spent checking out restaurants on Fisherman's Wharf? Maybe I'm too cynical, but it sounds like those restaurant names were placed by a marketing company. Wed Jun 15 17:32:32 -0700 2005 172210 0 Ruth Lafler 2 172222 He had to start somewhere to come up with a mock cioppino recipe (no crab in it). Maybe a childhood memory. Or here's his recent piece about searching for sourdough at the wharf. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/03/18/sunday/main681749.shtml Maybe he had a crab cocktail along the way. (g) I could believe that about Tarantino's perhaps. But if the other two restaurants are using a marketing agency, it's not doing a very good job on getting their names out there just judging from the small number of web hits (even when I correct the spelling!). Prices for Nick's Lighthouse and Pompei's Grotto, if the web menus are up to date, are pretty low, too low for a PR budget. Bobby Flay, on the other hand, has a big publicity budget and an even bigger ego. Would his people dare put the wrong restaurant recs in his name? Link: http://www.themenupage.com/pompeigrotto.html Wed Jun 15 18:12:48 -0700 2005 172217 0 Melanie Wong 3 172232 I have a hard time trusting Bobby Flay since he made paella with putting fried chicken and prawns on a pan of minute rice. There are some things too sacred for shortcuts! Next we will hear about caasoulet with Bush's beans. Wed Jun 15 18:48:09 -0700 2005 172222 0 Jim H. 4 172259 Maybe he was following your advice. Didn't you say that paella don't need no fancy rice? (vbg) I'm not saying to trust Bobby Flay. I just found it interesting that he was quoted as recommending these restaurants that aren't the most prominent ones on the wharf, e.g., Scoma's. Let's find out if there's something to it. Wed Jun 15 19:54:01 -0700 2005 172232 0 Melanie Wong 5 172316 I'm too burnt on that Newsweek article saying the clam Chowder at Scoma's was one of the best in the country. One of the many paths I'm contemplating if I don't take off cross-country this summer is a fish crawl at fisherman's wharf. If one must diet and eat fish, why not give the wharf another try after a couple of decades. I'm tired of hearing everyone bitch about the wharf. Scoma's surprised me and I need to check out the fish. I'll put these places on my list should I go that route. No fisherman's stew though. I'm a little thru with that for a while. Gotta remember that last cioppino post though. Hope someone posts though about actual experiences. It would be nice to know what to avoid. Yeah, that's the attitude to start with. Disclaimer: Fish crawl does NOT include Pier 39. I've done Pier 39 all too recently. Except for Eagle Cafe, it's all no better than sea lion food. Thu Jun 16 04:20:56 -0700 2005 172259 0 rworange 6 172325 Hey, as someone who's been dragged pier fishing one too many times, I have to point out that those sea lions eat fresher fish than most of us. BF has screamed all too many times when he's reeled in a fish part way only to have his catch snapped up by a passing sea lion. They're smart, too. They almost always leave him his hook. If I were swiming in the Bay and saw a fish flailing about, I'd think "Hehe, easy catch" too. Meanwhile, a tip for the Wharf that's probably obvious to most: keep it simple. It's hard to incorrectly steam crab, but it's easy to botch clam chowder. And if you must go to Scoma's, bring your wallet. The lower end items on the menu are atrocious, even if they include seafood. Thu Jun 16 11:42:06 -0700 2005 172316 0 nooodles 7 172606 I took a walk along the wharf this morning, saw lots of dead but uncooked crabs waiting their turn in the cook pots. Scoma's is indeed pricey, but I think A. Sabella's even tops those levels. However, some say that A. Sabella's has the best cooks on the wharf. Fri Jun 17 23:38:03 -0700 2005 172325 0 Melanie Wong 6 172470 rworange, I think you make a lot of sense to me as a San Francisco native. However, I have just inherited a meal at Cioppino's through an auction. Do I dare go there??? On another subject, I will never forget my early Sunday morning walk along the wharf when I saw the chowder being poured out of a huge Heinz can to be warmed and sold to the tourists. I've always thought that Pompei's is the safest bet on the wharf in terms of cuisine. Thu Jun 16 23:56:09 -0700 2005 172316 0 llr 7 172473 You gotta go and report back on it so I can cross it off my list. It would be nice to have some recent Chowhound reports from these wharf restaurants. Although Cioppino has the dumbest story about the origin of that seafood stew that always starts me laughing. From their website (link below): "The origin of both the dish and the name came from the Italian fishermen ... Someone would make the rounds of the moored fishing boats, calling out for for contributions to a common, festive stew ... The cry that prompted each contribution was :Chip In!, Chip In!". But coming from an Italian throat, this American slang had to end in a vowel. And the "in" was, of course "een". So "Chip-een-o" was born." It's not nice to tease tourists like that. Link: http://www.cioppinosonthewharf.com/home.html Fri Jun 17 01:01:45 -0700 2005 172470 0 rworange 8 172609 Cioppino's didn't make that up. That story of the origin is older than I am. Walking past Cioppino's today, I noticed the menu touts it as Mario Batali's favorite. (g) Fri Jun 17 23:42:12 -0700 2005 172473 0 Melanie Wong 1 172243 I have actually been to Pompeii's Grotto a few times. Not great, but good if you stay simple (especially for the relatively low prices)--cracked crab, louie salads, and some of their seafood pastas are pretty tasty. Wed Jun 15 19:25:19 -0700 2005 172210 0 WorkinginSF 2 172258 You're a brave soul to admit you've eaten at Fisherman's Wharf! So those prices are real? Maybe I'll have to try the 'dabs. Wed Jun 15 19:51:11 -0700 2005 172243 0 Melanie Wong 3 172371 Ha ha ha! Yes, those prices are real. Thu Jun 16 15:07:15 -0700 2005 172258 0 WorkinginSF 1 172273 I hate that I am alway the contrarian, but when I am forced to eat at the wharf, I find Tarantino's much better than Scoma's and a lot cheaper. Also, it has a nice 'not been updated since the 1950s' look and smell. As for Bobby Flay, I like him even less than that lush Ina Garten. Wed Jun 15 20:37:59 -0700 2005 172210 0 george 2 172284 Oh, please don't change, george. What fun would we have if we agreed about everything?!? Scoma's prices are high. It's good to know there's a decent alternative for those unavoidable situations. Link: http://tarantinosrestaurant.com/ Wed Jun 15 21:40:38 -0700 2005 172273 0 Melanie Wong 1 172327 Several years ago I was dragging some tourists around SF and we ended up eating lunch at Tarantino's. Pretty much awful all the way around, basically everything you'd imagine from a FW tourist trap. Except the bread, I do recall the sourdough rolls and butter were enjoyable. I don't recall anyone ordering the cioppino. Thu Jun 16 12:02:26 -0700 2005 172210 0 nja 1 172638 Yesterday I had a pleasant lunch at Pompei's Grotto. My sidewalk table had an unobstructed view of Hooters and In-n-Out across the street. Menu prices are about 40% higher than on the website, even then they're still quite reasonable. No sand dabs available, so I had the petrale sole lunch. Grilled simply in a bit of butter, the two filets were cooked just right. The tartar sauce had a sweet edge to it, but I only used the lemon any way. While the green beans were frozen, they tasted better than some haricots verts served me the night before at a fancier dinner house. Cooked al dente, the penne pasta on the side was tossed with butter, garlic and parsley. The requisite sourdough and butter were fine too. I liked having a cotton napkin that didn't blow away outside. Judy, my waitress, has worked here for 10 years and she took good care of me. It was a little too much food for lunch, next time I think I'd order the Petrale sandwich for $10.95 (vs. $13.95 for the lunch plate) instead. Pompei's Grotto 340 Jefferson St. San Francisco 94133 415-776-9265 Open daily for lunch and dinner Link: http://chowhound.com/chowbooks/index.html Image: http://home.earthlink.net/~melaniewong/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/pompeisgrotto.jpg Sat Jun 18 04:19:49 -0700 2005 172210 0 Melanie Wong 2 172669 Ah, the old "the green beans were canned, but they tasted fine" line. I've used that many times myself. Sometimes these posts are like reading real estate ads and you need to read between the lines. You post (along with the picture) sums up why locals don't eat at the wharf. A lot of the food isn't bad, it is just not too exciting and something you can do at home. Even I can simply cook sole, open a can of beans and buy a loaf of sourdough. And I don't have to stare at Hooters. It is simply prepared food, but not in a Chez Panisse, or even Fish., type of way. It is starting to seem that visitors are better off eating in the wharf area than Pier 39. At least the food is fresh. With the Pier 39 restuarants, even the simple fish preparations are inept and the prices are much higher. Thanks for the post. In addition to the Chownews tip of the week, there should be a Chowhound of the week note for someone who tries a place few hounds would consider venturing into. Well, if your visiting the wharf, you gotta eat and this doesn't seem like an awful choice. Link: http://chowhound.safeshopper.com/23/cat23.htm?131 Sat Jun 18 14:21:37 -0700 2005 172638 0 rworange 3 172702 Not quite. I left the beans on my plate and I didn't say they were fine. However, they were better in comparison to the ones served me the night before at the much fancier John Bentley's in Redwood City. As you can see in the picture below, these beans still had the pale, not fully cooked color. They were hard and had that rubbery twingey feel against your teeth that raw green beans do. Undersalted too. The beans at Pompei's Grotto were way better than that, but not fine. Sorry to have headed down that confusing tangent. The Petrale was cooked simply, but this was one of the very few times I've had sole in a non-Cantonese restaurant that was not overcooked. Pacific Cafe on Geary is one of the culprits that comes to mind. Once sole hits the flake stage, it's too done for me. Kudos to the kitchen for accomplishing the right texture that brings out the fish's natural sweetness and delicacy. Also for not overflouring the fish. Yes, Pompei's Grotto is a non-awful choice. This restaurant has no harbor views. I think the chance to sit outside on this sunny day was the better choice. Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/27185#112587 Image: http://photos16.flickr.com/20001769_931e187e0c.jpg?v=0 Sat Jun 18 22:44:14 -0700 2005 172669 0 Melanie Wong 4 172711 The ONE time I forget the Eagle Cafe qualifier. Thanks for the old link. Yes all Pier 39 restaurants are swill EXCEPT Eagle Cafe. Actually feeding the fish to the sea lions might be considered cruelty to animals. I hold a grudge for a long time after a bad meal. Although I haven't eaten there yet this year, I've been to Eagle Cafe a few times since that post and have always been happy. I just meant regarding fish, that it is so frustrating that these restaurants on Pier 39 (Eagle excepted) can't handle the simplest of fish preparations. It all tastes like something a chain would produce. It is also very much more expensive Good to know that Pompei's Grotto handled the fish with respect. Perhaps Mario Batali has an insight on Cioppino's after all? Sun Jun 19 00:38:19 -0700 2005 172702 0 rworange