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Regional Cooking Terminology question- "BBQ"

WHat does the term "BBQ" (I know, different folks spell it differently as well) mean to you in your region? In particular, if you were to go in your backyard and BBQ something- what would that mean? Please state your region/state. I hope to get feedback from all over, but I'm particularly interested to hear from folks in South Louisiana.
I'm from Texas. BBQ here, most of the time, means food cooked in indirect heat with a low temp. for a long time. Brisket is typically the food of choice(with ribs and sausage running close seconds), and wood is the most used heat source.
I was invited to a BBQ in Seattle once. It was burgers and dogs grilled on a gasser. It was very good, and I complimented the cook, but it was not what I expected.
Just curious...

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  1. Speaking only for North Carolina -
    Bar-b-que is a noun, never a verb. Exactly what bbq means will vary depending on where in the state you are. In NC it is always pork - pulled, shredded or chopped - with either a tomato-free vinegar and pepper sauce or a similar one with the inclusion of a small amount of tomato. BBQ is best served with fresh hush puppies, a regionally appropriate slaw (red, yellow, or white) and, if I'm feeling expansive, Brunswick stew. Oh yes, and copious amounts of sweet tea, sweet enough to send you into insulin shock.

    That thing you do out back with burgers, dogs, steaks, chicken, or whatever? That's grilling, son, never barbecuing.

    1. In NELA it can mean "To Barbecue", which means a party that revolves around grilling, or it can mean barbecued food. I do not think most people here know the difference between grilled food and barbecue. Luckily I am a chowhound....

      1 Reply
      1. In this area (New York City) it usually means food cooked on a grill over high heat, and usually gas....

        To me it means low 'n' slow over wood to render the fat and collagen and resulting in a moist, tender product.....Mmmmm, brisket....see the attached picture.

        I hear my Klose a'callin'....

        1. in the NW a barbecue definitely means anything cooked outside on a grill.. generally meat (the grill itself is commonly refered to as a barbecue).

          so for areas where bbq is a more specific term... What would you say to people if you wanted to invite them over to eat hot dogs/hamburgers you grill up in the back yard?
          "I'm having a grill party, want to come over?"... ??? or just "want to come over for some hot dogs/hamburgers?"

          4 Replies
          1. re: amopdx

            Here is Texas I would say, Ya'll come on over here- I'm doing some hotdogs and burgers." A charcoal grill would be assumed.

            1. re: Spencer

              I should have added- I live in the country. Folks up near Dallas and Houston probably would use gas and them Japanese wabachi grills and what not.

            2. re: amopdx

              Here in KC, we'd say "come on over -- we're going to grill out" or "cook out"

              1. re: amopdx

                If we're doing Q for the neighborhood we issue an invitation to a pig pickin'. That's whole hog, low and slow, with a mopping sauce. Otherwise we're just throwing some dogs on the grill.

              2. I am from the Chicago area, and to me BBQ means cooking meat at low temps over indirect heat, and smoking meats for hours.. eg. ribs, brisket, etc.

                If I am cooking brats, burgers, hot dogs, pork chops, etc on the grill I call it grilling.

                2 Replies
                1. re: swsidejim

                  Jim, I agree.

                  This has always been my definition;

                  Hot and fast cooking over direct heat= grilling

                  Low and slow over indirect heat= BBQ

                  IMVHO, BBQ is very hard to find in the upper Midwest, as everything is either grilled for marks and roasted,or it is boiled first and just finished over the flames.
                  I love grilled burgers or a brat, but real BBQ takes 10 hours and involves smoke and a large piece of meat.

                  1. re: Kelli2006


                    it is hard to find I agree, but well worth the search when you find a place that does it right.

                    Many places in Chicago as you mentioned boil the ribs, and then just throw some sauce on and throw it under a broiler., and call it BBQ ribs..

                    I must admit that was the way my mom made "bbq ribs" when I was growing up. Once I was older, and started traveling I found out what BBQ was, by traveling through the south, and texas. What an awakening.

                2. I live near Cincinnati and there is definitely a difference between grilling and BBQ. Just from people I know, BBQ usually involves ribs, but can also be chicken or brisket, often started in the oven and ALWAYS finished on a grill or in a smoker(slow cooking, smoke and open wood flame). It seems like most people consider real BBQ to involve sauce instead of rubs....I never had ribs that were seasoned with a rub until we tried Alton Brown's recipe...and I think that is because of the Montgomery Inn ribs restaurants being so popular around here. For most in the area, Montgomery Inn is the gold standard for ribs. They've obviously never tried Alton Brown's recipe......

                  1. I'm in S. Louisiana, but I've had cooking influence from all over, so my opinion might not be what you need.

                    I always called everything cooked outside over a flame (charcoal, wood, or gas) BBQ/barbecue/bar-b-que, etc. It didn't matter if there was sauce, what kind of meat it was, it was BBQ. Typically it would be meat at low temperatures for a long time (my daddy has the "long time" down to an art). The biggest distinction would have been smoking. Like I would never have said my daddy was bbqing a ham; he always smoked the ham, even though it was often on the same equipment as BBQ.

                    BBQ is also a noun or a verb. "We're having a BBQ." Or "Where's your BBQ?" (meaning pit or grill) "I'm going to BBQ those ribs." and so on. Of course, it's converted to an adjective by adding "ed" - "These BBQed ribs are good!"

                    In recent years, though, I've tried to distinguish between grilling and BBQing. Some people definitely think BBQ involves sauce and certain meats. If we're having other people over, we almost always say grill now for anything other than BBQ ribs. One of my best friends was very confused when she came to dinner for BBQ, and we didn't have BBQ sauce on the food. (She's from Texas, by the way.) She said, "That's grilled!"

                    So I do try to distinguish now. What I really think, though, is that barbecue is cooking anything a long while over an open flame (or coals), with or without sauce. It's also an event (having a BBQ) and can also be the equipment (I got a new gas BBQ).

                    My personal opinion is that the term grilling came into popularity by people who felt BBQ was more of a ... hokey or country kind of thing and wanted to come across as a bit more sophisticated. But still wanted the same excellent food. ;)

                    1. From one of my favorite websites:

                      "What Westerners call smoking Southerners call BBQ, and what Westerners call BBQ Southerners call grilling. Northerners don't make these distinctions because they just can't cook."


                      2 Replies
                      1. re: LordOfTheGrill

                        Being from a Mid-Atlantic state, I beg to differ with you. Some of us Yankees know the difference between grilling and BBQing. One the other hand, I also cringe when I hear people call what they do BBQing when there is no BBQ sauce involved. I think Aussies are also big offenders when say, 'Throw some shrimp on the barbie."

                        1. re: ChiliDude

                          Doesn't that just prove that the term varies depending on area/region? You choose to consider BBQ as a verb, while many choose it as a noun and is what they call the 'instrument.'

                      2. Barbeque in Mississippi is a slow cooking process at low heat for a long time. Meat
                        of choice is pork (pretty much any/all parts) but the cooking doesn't have to be on
                        a grill - oven, top-of-stove, slow cooker have all worked for me. Sauce is tomato based
                        unlike the vinegar NC sauce. Sides usually include potato salad, cole slaw, beans,
                        rolls (to stuff the meat in), something cold to drink, and lots of napkins.:

                        "What Westerners call smoking Southerners call BBQ, and what Westerners call BBQ Southerners call grilling. Northerners don't make these distinctions because they just can't cook."
                        (Love that quote by LOTG !)

                        1 Reply
                        1. re: Gourmette

                          Alas for this assertion...just got a book by one of my favorite SOUTHERN cooks, Nathalie Dupree, and her section on barbecue mentions ONLY grilling, and not a thing about slow-cooking meat!

                          Back when I was in Nashville I used to see her in person fairly often, and were I to see her again I'd ask about this...but she doesn't come to California a lot, darn it.

                        2. Texas - foremost slow and low, and I prefer brisket, but i order whatever the specialty of the area or restaurant is. I love BBQ sauce, but just not on BBQ. A thin spicy sauce can be nice though.

                          Another question - Which has more right to be called BBQ? Brisket cooked slow and low in the oven, or hamburgers on a charcal grill?

                          3 Replies
                          1. re: amkirkland

                            Trick question! Neither one...that's like asking who is more worthy to be called a Chowhound: The person who goes to McDonald's because it's fast, or the person who goes to McDonald's because they like it...?

                            1. re: ricepad

                              I would be inclined to answer the latter(on the McD's question), although you make a good point.

                              1. re: amkirkland

                                Which is more 'homemade', Betty Crocker or Duncan Hines?

                          2. I'm from NJ/Philadelphia area. BBQ means both - it all depends on the context clues.

                            If I invite you over to my house for a barbecue, you can expect things that are grilled.
                            If I ask if you want to go get some barbecue for dinner, you know I've got a hankering for smoked meat.

                            Basically, if "barbecue" refers to an event, it's grilling...a cookout. But if "barbecue" refers directly to the food, then it means what it's supposed to mean.

                            I once had a guy on the internet tell me that "barbecue" only means cooking outdoors and then declared that he should know - he's from Kansas City!

                            1 Reply
                            1. Growing up, I always thought that to be a BBQ, a grill had to be arranged such that the drippings from the cooking food will fall through the grill and strike something much hotter than the grill below (metal in a gas BBQ, burning charcol etc.). When the drippings hit whatever's hot below, they vaporize and the smoke gives the meat the BBQ flavor. This, and said grill had to be located outdoors.

                              So to me, growing up in So Cal, BBQ could be a verb (cooking food on this type of grill) or a noun (a BBQ being a type of grill, and BBQ being food prepared on this type of grill). We often used BBQ sauce, but plain meat, meat seasoned with Lawry's, etc. was all still BBQ if cooked on the right type of grill. Cooking over high heat or low, or slow cooking etc. didn't really factor into it, though most things prepared on a BBQ would be cooked in tens of minutes, not in hours.
                              BBQ out here (southern California) seems to be cooking something on an outdoor grill, generally gas but often charcol briquettes. As long as its cooked this way its still BBQ'd, sauce or not. I never associated it with indirect heat or slow cooking, though the indirect heat sort of makes sense - in that I always thought of a BBQ (oven, if you will) as resulting in something being cooked in such a way that as the food cookies, the drippings from the food fall and strike the source of the heat

                              1. I've lived in most of these areas and I've quietly enjoyed the regional/ cultural nuance of the word barbecue for many years. In New England, BBQ is an event or a verb, as "amopdx" indicated is the case in the NW.The term there reveals nothing about what's for dinner. It can be poulty or a hoofed animal. South of "rockycat" in South Carolina, barbecue is pork in mustard sauce, period. In Florida, barbecue is pork ribs unless indicated otherwise; brisket there is scarcer than hens teeth. In Texas, barbecue is brisket, as in most of the Mississippi River states, unless indicated otherwise.
                                None of our hounders from SoCal has weighed in; maybe because they all have those humongous stainless steel poolside cooking contraptions that are too nice to get dirty so they just go out and eat Kobi beef tartare :)

                                11 Replies
                                1. re: Veggo

                                  With regard to South Carolina 'cue, while it is almost exclusively pork (whole hog, shoulder, or occasionally ham), mustard sauce is only one of four prevalent sauces. The other three are vinegar & pepper, light tomato, and heavy tomato.

                                  1. re: Low Country Jon

                                    In S.C., all bbq restaurant also serve hash and rice. No hash and rice, not a BBQ restaurant. I consider hash as important as the bbq..

                                    1. re: byteme55

                                      ok, naive here, but what is hash? I think of corned beef hash, but otherwise am not in the know.

                                      1. re: justagthing

                                        There's not really an easy answer to that question. Traditionally, it is the stew made from all the leftover pig parts. That being said, there are wide variations in recipes, and one hash may not resemble another in the least little bit. Often, but not always, there is organ meat, usually liver, in the stew. You know this by taste, not so much by consistency, since hash is usually either ground or cooked down to the point where it's hard to identify the individual components. Sometimes hash is flavored with tomato, sometimes with mustard, sometimes you're just not sure. Sometimes it's sweet, sometimes it's smoky, sometimes it's got a bite. Sometimes it actually resembles Brunswick stew to some degree, but usually not. Hash is usually pretty darn good, but sometimes, just sometimes, you sit there wondering, what the heck am I eating?

                                      2. re: byteme55

                                        I'll bet I've never been to a place that served hash and rice. Sounds good though, as long as it's corned beef hash and not cannabis.

                                        1. re: amkirkland

                                          Hash is a meat slurry. To make the hash, cooks usually chose aromatic veggies (or not), seasonings, sharp spices, and parts of the pig parts not bbq'ed. Fatty parts and the skin are not used. The hash ingredients are combined in a large kettle and simmered for long periods of time. In many S.C. grocery stores you will find skinned whole hog heads; these are boiled for Hogs Head Hash. Along with the heads and select non-bbq-able pig parts, you then leave the standard.

                                          Hash is where the cooks talents and background really shine. Hash, like bbq, is somewhat regional. In some parts of the state, you find a less spicy, thin, stringy. meaty, watery, gray hash seasoned with aromatic veggies and possibly a very small amount of finely cubed potatoes (this style of hash can be found canned in some grocery stores as Cambridge Hash or it's thinner relative, Star Fort hash); in others you find a fine spicy reddish slurry hinting at tomato bases (tomatoes themselves, ketchup, tomato sauce or the house bbq sauce). I have seen some of the thick slurries gray, using no tomato based products (my fav); or yellow, using the mustard based bbq sauce.

                                          I have had some hash with very small amounts of finely minced corn, adding a slight sweetness. Most use no sweeteners and prefer a strong hash using vinegar or mustard to give a bite. Some use vinegars and a mild sweetener (corn or ketchup or molasses) to give both a strong initial bite with a smoothing finish.

                                          Hash is made strong.
                                          Hash is served with rice.

                                          The bland, wateriness of rice is the perfect match to temper the spicy, sharp bite of the hash.

                                          Rice (along with indigo and tea) was one of the original crops grown in S.C. and is permanently linked with hash. I suspect that when the first planter's rice was eaten, hash was there also.

                                          1. re: byteme55

                                            Interesting, I've never heard of that kind of hash

                                            1. re: byteme55

                                              That reminds me of scrapple, which is cornmeal mush flavored with pork scraps.

                                              1. re: paulj

                                                I think you might be onto something with this barbecued scrapple concept. I'll have to try that sometime :-)

                                      3. re: Veggo

                                        Don't know about SoCal (though I tend to think you are correct about the pretty stainless behemoths), but here in NoCal (San Francisco Bay Area in particular), the general impression one has of back yard BBQ is grilling on a Weber or some sort of gas contraption. The finer points of indirect heat or smoking are lost on most folks. Heck, most don't even wait for the coals to settle down to an ashen gray, instead tossing steaks on the grill over red hot coal and helplessly watching the flames engulf and char them. It's a sad state of affairs...

                                        1. re: Veggo

                                          SoCal hounder here, happy owner of medium-sized stainless steel contraption - no pool, darn the luck. It gets really dirty whether I cook on it or not (amazing how dirty the desert is, but then it doesn't get washed very often!), so I do cook on it. I do not consider this cooking to be barbecue, though I use indirect heat frequently, as I did with the big Weber kettle I had back in Nashville, if I'm cooking a roast or whole unsplit bird. One of these days I want one of those wonderful cookers with the firepit hung off one end, so I can do REAL 'cue, but for now this'll have to do.

                                        2. I am from california and I don`t care how you spell it or how you cook in wood,gas,or
                                          brickets. it all is a good Idea because you are getting to geather to have some fun
                                          and enjoy yourselves. and no matter where you come from no one places is better
                                          than the other. because everybody has there likes and dislikes about different things.
                                          and that is what I call the joy of cooking. I know that where ever I would be I would
                                          enjoy it.....

                                          1. In California, the term is rather generic. One of the above had it most correct, it's like a verb, something we do. It can be hamburger, steaks, chicken, ribs, whatever. If you get invited, and you want to know, ask. Since we have the luxary of being able to BBQ every month of the year, oh darn, we get a chance to do whatever we want. Also, no we all don't have big stainless monsters, some of us do have a good ol' fashioned Weber.

                                            1. I may be a damn yankee (born and raised in upstate New York and currently living in Los Angeles, but to me it's low and slow over wood or hardwood charcoal (usually a blend of both for me), and it's generally pork. Brisket should be saved for corned beef or pastrami, and sauce should be on the side, if at all. It's all about the rub and the mop. It can also be chicken, though that's trickier. My dad used to be the pit master for church barbecues and would make gallons of a vinegar, butter, and Bell's poultry seasoning based marinade (I think it's a Cornell University recipe) for chicken halves which would sit in the marinade in tubs packed in ice waiting to be laid out on the wire frames that would be placed over the long firepits we'd build out behind the church. He'd control the fire and conduct the crews that would take the spare wire frame, place it on top and flip the cooking frames over at minutely calculated intervals until the chicken was perfectly cooked. They'd start cooking at about noon for a 6 pm church supper. Even after my family started attending a different church, they'd still ask him back to run the barbecues. 'scuse me, now. I gotta go make up some marinade and make sure I've got enough wood to cook some chicken tomorrow.

                                              1. In Texas, if you knew nothing about the host, what would you expect if invited to a backyard BBQ? Would you expect a smoker with brisket that been cooking since the night before? Take out BBQ from some restaurant? a hot grill and hamburger patties?

                                                Sure there are good true BBQ restaurants in Texas (we even have some in the PNW), but is the BBQ tradition so strong that people don't confuse the terms when talking about backyard cooking? Are there differences depending on the part of Texas? south east coast? big city, Rio Grande, San Antonio, old German neighborhoods, out west?


                                                6 Replies
                                                1. re: paulj

                                                  In the city anywhere, if invited to a BBQ I would hope for long cooked smoked meat, but expect burgers and brats.

                                                  1. re: paulj

                                                    To answer your first question, I wouldn't know what to expect if I didn't know the host. Perhaps it's because there has been such an influx of people from other parts of the country to Houston in the last 35 years, but I find the notion that everyone in an area uses the term bbq to mean the same thing fallacious. If I were going to a restaurant, I'd need to check it out in advance, if possible, but I wouldn't expect any place in this part of the country to serve grilled hamburgers or even smoked hamburgers and call them bbq. But I know native Texans who cook chicken on a grill in the back yard, mopping it with a sauce, and call it bbq and I know people who cook ribs and brisket in an oven with sauce and call it bbq, even a crockpot (shudder).

                                                    As for the rest of the questions, yes, there are big differences in different parts of Texas, although the lines are blurred. Robb Walsh in Legends of Texas BBQ delineated 4 styles: cowboy (cooked over direct heat), Central TX meat market (smoked, indirect heat; coarse ground sausages in natural casings made on premises are usually a speciality), East TX/Southern Black/Urban Black (often finished wrapped in foil, even in the oven; tenderness of the meat and 'messy' piles of meat are signatures more than smokiness, along with fine ground all beef sausages in synthetic casings and soul food sides), and Hispanic/S. TX (barbacoa, not really relevant anymore). He also traces the historical derivations of the styles. The Central Texas smoked meats style is the most celebrated, going back to German immigrant butchers who brought Old World smoking to Texas; sausages are a prime meat. In some small town bbq joints, the sausage is sometimes the only thing worth ordering.

                                                    Cooper's in Llano and Mason is the most famous example of the cowboy style; the owner there has said of C TX smoked meats that it's not bbq! I've never been but I undersand Cooper's cooks over mesquite coals, not a mesquite fire.

                                                    Some C TX meat market style places eschew sauce at all; some eschew sides and eating utensils, serving orders on butcher paper. Rubs are usually very simple.

                                                    Woods differ too, although the local variety of oak is the most common. In C Tx it's post oak. In SE and E TX pecan is sometimes used. Mesquite is more common in the west, and so on.

                                                    One difference in big cities is the impact of smoke pollution restrictions which has forced many city joints to use gas-fired ovens to which logs are added for smoke. The whole process can set up and left to do its thing, eliminating the need for a pit man. The results can be remarkably consistent and good but not exceptional. Places in Houston that have to do this are Goode Co. and Luling City Market, a copy cat of the famous City Market in Luling, TX.

                                                    But 2 of the best joints in Houston are Black owned - Williams and Thelma's - but don't use the Southern/East Texas Black methods. Williams is closest to the C Tx style while the sometimes irascible Thelma proclaims what she serves is not Texas food, it's Louisianan!

                                                    Hey, I'm getting tired of typing. Buy the book (or look up Robb Walsh's website where there is an article on bbq if I remember which explains a lot of this better than I have).

                                                    1. re: oltheimmer

                                                      good post, but why do you call barbacoa irrelevant? it may not be something in the lamb/goat familyas often, but I think the traditions behind and inspired by barbacoa are pretty significant still.

                                                      1. re: amkirkland

                                                        I believe the most traditional barbacoa is a form of pit steaming, slow cooking but with more moisture than the southern dry smoking. It may have more in common with Hawaiian luau or a NE clam bake, though the flavors are different. The name though must come from the same roots as BBQ.


                                                        1. re: paulj

                                                          Actually, it comes from Argentina, Brazil, and Uruguay. And I think they were first!

                                                        2. re: amkirkland

                                                          It was Walsh -- not me! Cow's head cooked in an oven? No smoke involved? (or lengua cooked in a crock pot?) Typically served at a taqueria, not a barbecue joint.

                                                          Here's a link to the article on Walsh's website (doesn't mention barbacoa); this was incorporated into the book http://www.robbwalsh.com/03writings/a...

                                                    2. Here in Virginia, grilling in the backyard is called a 'cookout.' BBQ is a product which can be the result of a cookout, but rarely is. For the most part, BBQ refers to pulled/sliced meat (pork, beef. poultry) with sauce and pork ribs that you get at a good down-home restaurant. Some folks have BBQ for their events, so you hire someone to cook the pig on a spit, etc. I live in an especially chow-friendly town, but there is no really good true southern BBQ available at a restaurant. There are plenty of places that call themselves BBQ, but the sauces are pretty generic and the meat isn't cooked long enough. So we rely on friends to occasionally have quality BBQ events, or stick to BBQ when we travel further south.

                                                      1. How do regions vary by how much sugar is in their sauces? Most "BBQ sauce" I've seen in restaurants and grocery stores is way too sweet. Even the SC/GA mustard sauces get loaded with sugar, I guess to make them more like "honey mustard".

                                                        1 Reply
                                                        1. re: aynrandgirl

                                                          You might enjoy the vinegar & pepper sauce prevalent in eastern NC and SC. There's rarely ever any sweetner added at all. As the name implies, it's pretty much just vinegar and red pepper, often with a small amount of secret ingredient or proprietary spice blend. Western NC, or Lexington-style, sauce adds tomato, usually in the form of ketchup, but still tends to be less sweet and less thick than anything you'll find in most supermarkets.

                                                        2. In St Louis, BBQ is usually grilling, specifically Pork Steaks (Sliced Boston Butt) grilled and soaked in Maull's BBQ sauce.

                                                          To me, BBQ is low and slow - and its almost time for the competition season to start!!!

                                                          1. I am so with you!! I'm from Texas and my family lives in Southern Louisiana. I grew up thinking BBQ was slow cooked meats. Now I live in Los Angeles and I've had to adapt. BBQ here means lighting a gas grill, and quickly cooking meats, fish, and veggies. In my book, that's GRILLING! Which is also wonderful, but NOT BBQ. I have a smoker and every year on my birthday I slow cook ribs, tri tip, and chicken. Everybody digs it, especially the southern transplants. I always send out invites that say "we are having a little Texas Bbq", and we always have a full house. I also light the grill, and make veggies and fish for the non meat eaters.

                                                            So, if you ask me, and lots of bbq people like me, bbq is slow and low. And smoked. Grilling is a chicken breast on grill, or a fllet mignon. Very different things, in my book. Most big cities DO have bbq joints with transplanted southerners. I hope you find one! Or do it yourself! A good book to start with is Smoke and Spice, by the Jamison's.

                                                            Another thing: bbq sauce is really different in different parts of the country. I still make mine from scratch, or buy Stubbs at the market. I don't like the sugary stuff so mutch. Being a Texas gal, I like the vinegary kind.

                                                            And....do you miss crawfish boils? Every Christmas my parents and their friends have one and I live for it! And then we shell the leftovers for etoufee and gumbo.

                                                            Good luck!!!

                                                            2 Replies
                                                            1. re: dutcher

                                                              BTW...crawfish restaurants have been popping up all over recently in SoCal.

                                                              1. re: dutcher

                                                                Hey Dutcher,
                                                                I'm not a transplant- I still live in Texas, Southeast on the coast.
                                                                I do crawfish boils at home frequently in the summer. Also do an annual boil at a friends home in Austin wherein my friend invites all his Austin friends. It's a great time. I also have an offset stick burner bbq pit that I use to bbq brisket, pork butt, and sausage- served with pintos, coleslaw, tater salad, and Mrs. Baird's loaf bread. For sauce I use a Best Maid cheapo sauce and add caramelized onions and chipoltle powder.
                                                                Sounds like you are staying near to your roots there in SoCal- good for you. I spent some extended time in Seattle- had no idea that I was so addicted to my local food until then.