Roast Chicken - A method against the trend

[Sean Dell]

Hello Hounds,

Staying with old friends over the weekend, and on Sunday, my hostess - who is a great cook - asked would I mind if she did something simple for dinner, a roast chicken.

Since it's possibly my fav dish, I agreed heartily, and she immediately got to work and switched on the oven. It was only mid-afternoon, and I asked what time she planned to have dinner at.

'Oh the chicken will be done about 7.00, so we'll eat shortly after that'. That meant a three-hour cooking time!

I asked her what temperature she was cooking the chicken at and she told me 300F, which I scarcely believed. 'Well, I don't like it all dried out, and I like it really falling off the bone, so I like to cook it slowly'.

Of course we debated the pros and cons of high versus low temperature. I was intrigued by the idea of a slow roasted chicken, how it would taste, and whether it really wouldn't be dried out.

Here's what she did:

4lb chicken
sprinkled liberally with sea salt, and herbes de provence
No trussing, and nothing in the cavity
Covered generously with thick-cut canadian bacon on the breast

Before putting it in the oven, she put a foil tent over the breast, which she removed about half an hour before taking the chicken out.

The result was one of the most delicious, moist, and tender roast chickens I have ever eaten. It made me think a lot about the 450F oven I use for mine (which is really closer to a true 430F).

Wonder if any other Hounds use a slow roasting method?

- Sean

[gmulak]

This is a great method and I have used it myself. The only thing I do is put lots of garlic inside and squeeze a lemon on it and put garlic powder on top and put it in a Le Crucet (a very heavy metal covered pot. Put it in an oven at 290F or 300F for 3 hours, whala, the chicken is moist and the skin crispy!

[RosePearl]

Cornish game hen, chicken, 28 lb. turkey, I roast them all at 325 degrees. I've been roasting fowl since 1983, and I've never had a ruined one yet. Oh, and I usually stuff them, which gives some people the vapors, nowadays.

[koshergourmet]

There is a book that I read a review on and it is specifically for the slow roasting method, does anyone know the name of the book? I can't remember the magazine that I read it in!

[sparkareno]

Those that mention roasting at a temp of 250----is that safe?

[monkeyrotica]

So long as the internal temp reaches 180, it's safe.

[mcf]

Doesn't it also depend upon how long it takes to get to a safe temp, though? That would be my only concern; the internal temp during the hours of slow roasting.

[ZenSojourner]

It does (depend on how long it takes to get to the safe temp) but I don't know if 250F is too low or not. I'm not sure I see any advantage in taking the risk and cooking it THAT slowly, though.

[Karl S]

It's too low if the chicken is stuffed.

[ZenSojourner]

Excellent point!

[monkeyrotica]

The recipe I cited below calls for removing the stuffing from the cooked bird and cooking at a higher temp.

[Karl S]

I was talking not about aromatic vegetables, but a dense starchy stuffing - cooking a bird stuffed with such at low temps is a recipe for allowing the stuffing and interior of the bird to breed pathogens because it will take a lot longer to get that interior up over 140F and then you'd have much more risk on your hands, et cet.

My own caution would encourage the cavity of the bird to be open (and stuffed very very minimally if at all) to the circulation of sufficiently hot air to decontaminate the interior cavity in a reasonable amount of time. I am not a food hygiene fetishist, but today's poultry often carries a sufficient risk to warrant the precaution.

[ZenSojourner]

Today's poultry is pretty routinely contaminated before it ever gets to us.

I don't make roast chicken anymore (haven't for years) but when I was making it, I didn't bother stuffing it. In the first place, you can't get all that much stuffing in there, and in the second place, there's the problem with food safety we're talking about here.

I haven't made Turkey in 26 years this Thanksgiving. Yipeee! Free for another year!

[monkeyrotica]

I used to dread cooking turkey until I tried Julia Child's "Deconstructed" Turkey recipe, where you can either cut up a fresh one or buy the breast and thigh/wings separate. You just stuff the thighs and the whole spiel cooks in about 2 hours.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/...

[mcf]

I believe the OP specified that the cavity was empty.

[ZenSojourner]

Nevertheless, it's important to note lest someone forget and think to try this with a stuffed bird. Ounce of prevention and all that.

[monkeyrotica]

I've smoked chickens on my Weber Smokey Mountain at 225 for 3-5 hours with no adverse health effects. Just an incredibly fall apart tender chicken. The gradual temperature change breaks down the connective tissue and keeps the meat incredibly moist.

Paul Prudhomme's Atchafalaya Roast Boneless Chicken from "Seasoned America" cooks at 250 for about 3 hours. Sublime.

http://www.chefpaul.com/site.php?page...

[sbp]

Same here. Only problem is the leather skin.

[ZenSojourner]

I haven't roasted a chicken in years, but as I recall the temp was 325F and it took a couple of hours.

Of course roasting hens were smaller then so it's probably about comparable to 3 hours at 300F for a probably slightly larger bird these days.

I actually did not know anyone ever roasted chicken at such high temps! 450F seems awfully high!

[tv1530]

I will never cook a whole chicken another way after trying this method. It was thee most delicious chicken I have ever had. It falls right off the bone and the skin is still crispy. I also put some jerk rub under the skin for seasoning and then seasoned the top of the chicken with salt, pepper, garlic and put some onion and garlic in the cavity. I'm actually cooking it again as I write! Delicious!

[rememberme]

Can't comment on the chicken, but my mother remembers the best leg of lamb she ever had, very slow roasted. We had a two-stove oven, and were out. My father was instructed to turn the oven to 350 at a certain time. Of course he turned on the wrong oven, so the lamb sat in the cooler of the two ovens at about 150 or so for a few hours before we got home. She now slow-roasts lamb every time.

[kchurchill5]

Good Story! Yep, the first time I saw my mother and father in low cooking the turkey for almost 8 hours I died! It was a great turkey. I bet the lamb would be amazing.

[kchurchill5]

My ex mother and father in law did it all the time the same with turkey, like a 8 hour turkey vs 3 or 4 and 3 hour chickens. Always 300. Skin was crunchy and perfect. Great chicken and turkey. I never thought it would work but it did.

To this day I have never tried it. But ate many for Christmas dinner.

[EdwardAdams]

I like it and will try it. One problem with high temp roasting is the billows of smoke it can produce, a special problem for guests hanging in the kitchen. As far as crispy skin, I find it overrated. While it is great right off a rotisserie or high roast chicken, it has the lifespan of goodness of a fast food fry. If you let your bird rest, no more crispy skin.

[alwayscooking]

When I do a quick roast, it's at 500 using a brined, butterflied chicken with a flavored butter under the skin. Sliced potatoes underneath the chicken (chicken on top of the broiler pan - potatoes under) absorb the fat that causes the smoking - and they end up tasting great too. Takes 45-50 minutes to be done.

But I will try the slow roast!

[globalgourmand]

Heston Blumenthal did an episode of "In Search of Perfection" in which he roast the chicken at 140F for 4.5 hours. It sounds crazy, but he has 3 Michelin stars and, oh yeah, that 2005 "Best Restaurant in the World" title so... I'll trust the techniques for my first roast chicken ever. He brines it first, rinses it, blanches is quickly twice, dries it in the fridge overnight, then straight into the oven. Then he takes it out, crisps up the skin in a pan with some peanut oil, and injects it with "roast chicken flavored butter." (Butter browned w/the chicken wing tips.)

I'm going to try a modified version of this tomorrow night. As I said, this will be my first time doing a roast chicken. Its in the brine now (I added lemon) and if I had more forethought, I would have left a full 24 hours for it to dry in the fridge but instead it will get about 8. Then I intend to make a lemon/rosemary/garlic compound butter for under the skin and my oven doesn't even go down to 140 so I think I'll settle for 180.

I'll report back on this all around, first-time experience!

If you're interested in the episode, I found it on youtube.com. Its split into four parts. Search "Heston Blumenthal In Search of Perfection Roast Chicken." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41AHxT...

[globalgourmand]

Okay, so reporting back: I brined (1 gal water, 1 cup kosher salt, 1/2 cup turbinado sugar, 1 lemon) for about 5 hours, then blanched twice for 30 seconds. Air dried in the fridge for about 9 hours. Compound butter under the skin (and over too) and trussed. Nothing in the cavity, but might try in the future. I played around with the temps too much to report accurately, but it ranged from 180-240F. Blame it on my insecurities cooking my first chicken-- and on my impatience! It took about 4 hours to reach 160.

I did pan brown it at the end however it made no difference texturally. It did smell great and gave a nice rustic look, but the skin was still rubbery/chewy. In the future, I might not bother to blanch (except maybe to help rinse the brine away and to help kill surface bacteria,) nor air dry in the fridge. Perhaps it might have made a difference if I didn't season with butter? I wouldn't, howeve, skip that compound butter because it added such heavenly aroma and savory flavor to the chicken. (For reference: 4 Tbs soft butter, 1 tsp sea salt, 1 tsp pepper, fine zest of two lemons, 4 cloves garlic through press, at least 3 big sprigs of fresh rosemary finely minced.) The end result was very moist and very flavorful. But, it was also pretty tedious. Perhaps I'll feel differently if I give up on crispy skin and skip the blanch and dry processes.

So, alwayscooking, you try slow next. And for me, I'll try your method-- sounds delicious! And better for my impatient ways!

[Tehama]

Hi all! Going to the movies, errands etc. this afternoon and wanted to do a slow-roast chicken.

Is the consensus from these posts that one could roast a 4 lb chicken for 3 hours at 300 or 4 hours at 250?

(I currently have the chicken prepared Zuni-style hanging out in the 'fridge - but would like to eat when I get home this evening and not wait/cook).

Any confirmation on my 'deduction' would be most appreciated!

[Tehama]

Reporting back on the slow-roasted chicken.... I had a 4 pound chicken that I cooked from 3:30 - 8:00 p.m. in a 250 oven and it turned out wonderful! The meat was falling off the bones tender and the skin is sooo crispy.

Prior to the roasting ..... 24 hours beforehand I had washed and dried the chicken and sprinkled with salt and pepper. Stuffed the cavity with a whole head of peeled garlic and a couple of bay leaves. And, separated the skin from the meat in various places and inserted sprigs of thyme and rosemary. I also dried the skin again about 12 hours into it with paper towels.

As an added bonus- when I walked in the house after the movies and errand running, etc. (and it was cool and rainy outside) the aroma that greeted me was amazing. If I could bottle that smell....

I think I will surely do this again... come home at lunch, pop the chicken in, and it will be ready for dinner with minimal fuss.

[SFLisa]

I have been making a version of Laurie Colwin's roast chicken for years. I season a 3 1/2 lb chicken with salt, pepper, and paprika; stick a halved lemon in the cavity, and roast it at 325 for 2 1/2 to 3 hours. I baste it whenever. I quarter it, and serve it over mesclun with a vinaigrette. It is absolutely my favorite easy meal.

[LynO]

I was browsing for this style of roasting one of my chickens. I was wondering if anyone knows how long I should roast a 10-12 lb chicken for. (It's a guess, but the last one I butchered was 14 lb 'on the hoof'). We used a higher heat on the last one and it was a bit tough so I wanted to try this. Thanks for any suggestions!

[GretchenS]

Made this yesterday, exactly as posted by Sean Dell (except with sliced pancetta instead of Canadian bacon), and it was outstanding! I am a crispy skin lover and considered the lack of it a worthwhile trade-off for how moist and tender the chicken was. Might try a late crisping up next time at high heat but worry a bit it would toughen the meat.

Thanks for posting this -- as you said, sometimes it really works to have something in the oven for hours while you do something else.

One note: there were TONS of juices in the pan, which threw me when I uncovered it, but still very juicy meat. Those juices will go into a batch of AAB World's Best Cabbage later this week....

[monkeyrotica]

Prudhomme has a recipe for roast chicken that's cooked at 250 for 3 hours. A spinach saute is stuffed under the breast skin and keeps it from drying out. Also, a brining would help ensure juciness. The meat is fall-apart tender and literally shreds off the bone. I've never had a problem with the skin not crisping up, but 10 minutes at 425 would solve that.

[jfood]

Although this is very interesting and i am glad everyone who tried it loves the results, I view roast chicken as a quick meal to get the best product to the table in the quickest time. Three hours for chicken. OMG. I just love my 40-minute 425 degree spread chicken. Crispy outside, moist inside and the family loves it. I just can;t see three hour boyds.

[Sean Dell]

Which is exactly why I posted this in the first place! Until I ate this chicken, I prefer the quickie method. But there are times when letting a chicken hang out in the oven for a couple of hours, while other things are going on, seems just perfect...

Goes to prove that there's never just one right way of doing something.

- Sean

[jfood]

Absolutely SD, and when there is only one way we all agree on, then Chowdom because boring, big business will figure out a way to flash freeze it and the beauty of food choices die.

Keep those choices coming.

[maillard]

Funny, I was just going to post about how much I love slow-roasted chicken legs. I made this last weekend with chicken that I prepped like the Zuni chicken (thyme under the skin, liberally salted, left to dry for a day). Then I roasted for a couple hours somewhere around 300. I like how effortless it is and also how flexible it is. The chicken can just hang out in the oven until whatever I'm serving it with is ready. I had mostly crispy skin and most importantly, the meat just fell off the bone. The underside of the chicken gets kind of fried in chicken fat and is really fantastic.

I hadn't considered this a possibility for a whole chicken, since it seems like the breast meat would dry out. But if others have had success doing this, I may have to try it!

[Karl S]

This method is fantastic for the obvious but woefully underappreciated star of the supermarket poultry case: turkey thighs.

[maillard]

Woah, I don't know if I've ever seen turkey thighs. I will have to keep an eye out for them.

[Da_Cook]

Slow roasting chicken is safe and tasty.
For crispy skin, take a lesson from the Chinese. Dry it 1st. Let the chicken spend 24 hours uncovered in your fridge, then cook it.
If you brine, do it 2 days ahead, pat it dry and, again, let the chicken dry for 24 hours. uncovered in the fridge. Especially good ( and quicker) if you have a commercial type fridge that uses a fan to circulate the cold air.

[FoodFuser]

And a small 1.5 volt fan in a home fridge helps dry it, too. Got mine for 2 bucks at K mart. Here's an example:

http://www.centurynovelty.com/detail_...

[scott123]

Low temp roasting (250 deg. or less) gets into potential food safety issues. I like to start my chicken higher to get the exterior/some of the interior out of the bacterial 'zone' as quickly as possible, then I dial down the heat for the rest of the time.

It's tough. Lower temps tend to produce very succulent results, but you don't want to go too low. The last chicken I did I went with 275 for 1 hr. then 225 for the rest of the time. I'll probably tweak these temps a bit in the future, but I'll probably stay in that general range of temperature.

The skin doesn't crisp up, but the meat is unbelievably good. If I have time, I crisp the skin on it's own or I use the skin in stock.

[LindaWhit]

"Low temp roasting (250 deg. or less) gets into potential food safety issues"

Well, I haven't died yet. :-) I also prefer the older crockpots that cooked at a lower temperature than the new ones do.

[doctor_mama]

Just curious--if the chicken ends up cooked at 170 degrees or so, what is the hazard? Is it the length of time it takes to get there?

[Karl S]

It's the length of time it lingers between 40-140F. You need to have a longer time over 140F to kill off what might have grown in the lingering. Salmonella is killed just over 160F.

[Mill City Modern]

Well, according to the newest FDA food handling regulations, the total (cumulative) time food can be in the 40°-140°F zone is four hours. So I think with cooking at 300° for 3 hours, or even 250° for 4 hours, you'd be in the clear by a long shot.

[Nettie]

Paula Wolfert's _Slow Mediterranean Kitchen_ talks quite a bit about cooking for long periods at low temperatures, but I don't know if she has a recipe for roasted chicken. Generally, she says that you need to blast it with high heat first to get rid of surface bacteria, then reduce the heat for slow roasting. From memory, the temperatures used are more like 20-30 minutes at 425, and then reduce heat to 200 or less.

[Procrastibaker]

The blog Chocolate and Zucchini recently had a post on slow-cooked chicken if you're interested. I was going to try it, but haven't yet. Usually, I make an herb butter with some lemon and stuff it under the skin, put a lemon and herbs in the cavity and roast for about 1-1.5 hrs at 450. I like to turn the chicken on its breast at about 1/2 hr in-- I think this is part of the Zuni method, but I didn't know that when I started. Then I flip it back over near the end.

[thejulia]

Laurie Colwin, ex 'Gourmet' writer and author of 'Home Cooking' and 'More Home Cooking' also recommends the low slow method. This is completely different than the Zuni Roast Chicken method I've used which blasts with high heat. Here's a link to a page that claims to have Colwin's method (can't verify if that's true because I don't have the book with me). I'm fascinated to see what would happen without bacon draped over the top.

http://www.labellecuisine.com/archive...

[MzMaggie]

I bake mine for about 4 hours at 250 deg. I cut up a lemon, peel some garlic cloves and cut a few sprigs of rosemary and thyme and stuff it all in the cavity. Comes out perfect every time!

[macca]

That's how my mom always roassted chickens- really good, but I LOVE crispy skin. I suppose you could always crank up the heat, and remove the bacon at the very end. hmm...... sounds like a good experiment for a cold, fall Sunday afternoon while the football games are on!

[Biggie]

I mix room-temp butter with chopped bacon, thyme, and shallot. I then massage that between the skin and breast, and also all over the whole outside of the bird. I season it with smoked salt and peper. I roast it at 300 for 2.5-3 hours or so, and it comes out great. I'll usually roast it on top of sliced potatoes, carrots, and onions. If I'm in the mood, I'll toss an orange and/or a lemon cut into pieces into the cavity.

[amoncada]

You can accomplish the same result by roasting for 75 minutes at 375 degrees with the breast side down method. First roast the bird breast side down for 45 minutes with 1 1/2 cups of chicken broth and long way thick sliced potatoes on the bottom of the pan. Agreed, do not add 4 teaspoons of salt...1 tablespoon is plenty especially when cooking with salted chicken broth. For best results, use low sodium chicken broth. Then turn bird over for remaining 30 minutes. This method creates crispy skin and fall off the bone tender chicken in only 75 minutes total cooking time.

[Norm Man]

Your method sounds interesting.

When you are roasting the chicken breast side down, is the breast submerged under the chicken broth or is the chicken on a rack sitting above the chicken broth?

[amoncada]

I don't use a rack. The potatoes will elevate the chicken above or on top of the liquid. Brush some olive oil on the potatoes as well to prevent them from sticking to the bottom of the roasting pan. Try it without the rack first. A good quality roasting pan will make a difference as well. I use the ALLCLAD stainless roasting pan.
Occasionally I add chopped fennel or chopped onion in the pan...very tasty.

[cheryl_h]

I've done smoked chicken and turkey this way, at temperatures of around 200 F. The problem with the long, slow cooking is the skin which goes from being soft to kinda rubbery to tough as leather. Now I smoke at 200 F for about 20 minutes for chicken, an hour or two for largish turkeys, and finish in the oven at about 350 - 400 F which crisps the skin and doesn't make it tough. I always brine beforehand.

[Chas]

Hey Cheryl - How long do you brine say a 3 or 4 lb chicken? And also how much salt to water?

[cheryl_h]

For a whole chicken I'd brine for perhaps 4 hours or so. Cooks Illustrated usually recommends a couple of hours. I think you can take this up to overnight but I usually start in the morning so I can airdry the chicken overnight in the fridge. I use the Lone Star rub from Raichlen's book on Sauces, Marinades and rubs before smoking. First paint the chicken lightly with olive oil OR warmed molasses, pour the rub over. I posted the rub recipe on CH earlier, you can probably find it using the Search feature.

I use a saturated brine solution of 1 cup kosher salt to 1 gallon water. Test by floating an egg. If it floats, you have enough salt. I also add half as much brown sugar (or regular sugar plus molasses) as salt, and some spices and herbs for flavoring - peppercorns, bay, juniper, some Italian herbs.

Because I don't like to waste either the brine or my time, I do several chickens at a time. Three fit into the smoker without crowding. It's nice to have a fully smoked chicken in the freezer when you need BBQ in a hurry.

[Chas]

Cheryl Thanks again. I have given the smoker a week or so off. I'll follow the directions you've given. The last time you warned of the skin being rubbery, I was using the homemade smoker and man you were right!!! I could have made shoes with the skin. I could hardly even cut it with a sharp knife! But the meat was itself very moist and tasty. Finishing in the oven will be what I do. Thanks for the brine ingredients as well.

[Sean Dell]

All very interesting. And in answer to Carb Lover's question earlier, no, the skin wasn't crisp, because it had been covered with Bacon which was, however, deliciously crisp, the fat having been rendered completely by the long, slow cooking time.

- Sean

[LindaWhit]

Yes, I have - for even longer (5 hours) at a lower temp (250°). It's called "Roast Sticky Chicken" - very much like a rotisserie chicken from the supermarket - and has been bandied about on AOL cooking message boards for a long time. Here's a sample recipe:

http://allrecipes.com/recipe/roast-st...

The only thing I would HIGHLY recommend is cutting WAY back on the salt amount - 4 tsp. makes the chicken completely inedible. 1 tsp. or less would work in the rub mixture. I also cook it to an internal temp slightly lower.

[JaneRI]

A friend swears by this recipe which calls for 3 tbs of salt....

Salt-Rubbed Roast Chicken with Lemon & Thyme Recipe #51888
From Tom Douglas of the Dahlia Lounge in Seattle. I admit it - when I first saw the amount of salt in this recipes I thought, "WHAT?" but Chef Douglas is incredible so I decided to trust him and try this recipe just like he said to. What can I say - it's just delicious. My favorite way to roast a chicken now. You will be converted, too, once you try it. Great with mashed potatoes.
by P4
4 servings
1⁄2 day 8 hours prep
3 tablespoons kosher salt
1 1/2 teaspoons fresh ground black pepper
2 tablespoons chopped freesh thyme, stems reserved to stuff into the cavity
3 1/2 lbs chickens, excess fat trimmed,rinsed inside and out and patted dry with paper towels
1 lemon, quartered
4 cloves garlic
3 tablespoons unsalted butter, melted

Mix the salt, pepper and thyme.
Lay the chicken on a rack in a roasting pan and rub the mixture all over the skin on both sides.
Refrigerate uncovered overnight or for at least 8 hours.
Oven to 400 degrees F.
Put the lemon quarters, garlic and thyme stems inside the cavity of the chicken.
Brush the chicken with some of the melted butter.
Roast, basting every 20 minutes or so (first with melted butter, then with any fat and juices accumulating in the pan).
The chicken should be done in about an hour, but make sure by testing the thigh for a temperature of 170 degrees F.
Let the chicken rest for at least 10 minutes before carving.

[jessicheese]

I've been making the Sticky Chicken recipe (with variations but always with the time/temp method) for years and it is off the hook. The only roast chicken that i've had that's better is the one that comes from our smoker. Similar method yielding the similar results- crispy skin and juicy, fall-off-the-bone chicken.
I also want to mention that the gravy from the sticky chicken is absolutely fabulous.

[TongoRad]

I've done it with turkeys before (on a v-shaped roasting rack)and gotten great results- juicy with crispy skin. I'll have to try it with a chicken next time, though I usually spatchcock those.

[slacker]

For the turkey, what temp and how long (per pound)? Do you also put some fat on the breast and tent?

[TongoRad]

I've only done it the last couple of times so I don't have it down to an exact science yet but I'm pretty sure I used 20 min. per pound at 300F as a guideline- but really let the thermometer be the determining factor. I take it out at 170F in the thigh, but you could probably go to 175F with good results if that seems too low to you. I have a spare fridge so I can let the bird sit uncovered for a day to dry out, and coat it with canola oil (as well as some s&p) before roasting. So far I haven't seen the need to either tent or raise the temp at the end to crisp it up (a big bird will be in the oven for a long enough time, I guess.)

[Carb Lover]

Fascinating...so did it really take 3 hours? And very important--how crispy was the skin? Thanks for bringing this up.