Tex chowdawg heads west for China Village, Chinese bacon and Eyetalian hawg jowl (long)
Howdy!
Ill be in the East Bay this weekend to visit my son at UC to help him celebrate his 21st bday...well hit Chez Panisse to do that properly (!?!), but will devote most other meal slots to Asian (for sentimental reasons, well claim a couple of stools at the lunch counter of Henrys Hunan...its quite a floor show and its free, and the food isnt terrible). As a former El Cerritovian and EB mag editor, I have a pretty good idea of where to go, but would like a few pointers. Ive surfed the 18,000 or so postings on the board dating back to Spring 2000 to do some catch up.
1) Well hit China Village for sure, at least a couple of times. In fact, I have already called Mr. Yao to set up our Thurs. dinner (which will be a shameful miniature copy of yalls Feldman Fest, but for only four folks). Have read all the CV posts and examined the photos with a magnifying glass and am getting revved up for some good chow there. But, are there any other ideas that have not made it onto the board? I only saw one mention of the Sichuan classic twice-cooked pork which is served up real nice at NYCs Grand Sichuan International, but there you must emphasize that you want the Chinese version made with fatty belly pork, otherwise you get an insipid dish of who-knows-what. I gather you must do the same at CV, but any other comments on this dish? Any other menu tips not posted? Seems like Ive read much about 5-6 dishes, and then little about a few others, and then nothing else...just my observation. With 100 items on the good menu, itd be interesting to see a broader spectrum of comments...
2) Saw a thread about fatty bacon with preserved mustard greens or with taro from several months (a year?) back. I remember a very modest place on 8th in Oakland (cant remember the name, but its on what I remember as the main block of activity on the street, I imagine Webster is one of the cross streets) that served a claypot dish with this bacon, dried bean curd skin and some sort of greens. I thought it was quite good. Any other thoughts on finding a really good dose of a dish like this. Saw a mention of the Gold Medal, but there must be others...maybe Ill just go back to the place Ive had it before several times. When I get back, Ill report on the experience and put a name to the face...
3) My doc would kill me (or at least my own root causes for his recommendations might), but I am tempted to search for a local, retail source for Niman Ranch guanciale. Their website lists a couple of places that offer a full range of their products, but I am a bit leery of that statement. I read a post here that suggested that Berkeley Bowl has reduced their NR offerings, and they are one of the supposed NR complete sources. Maybe the meat market on College under Oliveto? Cafe Rouge on 4th Street? Anyone have a lead on that?
4) We used to like Viks, but I always felt the food was fairly one-dimensional...cheap, but sometimes you get what you pay for. Yes, its always fun to wait in line for a long time to order, then fight like a buzzard to find a place to sit--both always enhance any dining experience--but maybe the food itself does not live up to the level of these character-enhancing pleasures? I am thinking the Udupi Palace on University might offer slightly more nuanced food with a wider variety of choices...we can always get it to go, then sit out front on the sidewalk. Any updates on Viks vs. Udupi? Other, better S. Indian in E. Bay? My son is a fish-eating vegetarian, and loves dosai, etc.
5) I will probably help him augment his kitchen battery. Any place perhaps cheaper than Sur la Table to pick up decent sheet pans and so on?
6) Hell probably know where to go, but what about morning cappuccino? I used to be a Peets fan, but imagine there are better places...South Berkeley, N. Oakland?
7) Was there ever a consensus on custard tarts in Oakland? The name Ruby King pops out as one recommended place...others?
Thanks
mq
(Ill file a report upon my return...if the plane can get off the ground at Oakland International.)
Mike Quinn
Sep 21, 2004 10:22AM
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I'm just going to quickly comment on the Indian question. I think Udupi Palace is a great choice for Indian food you may not find easily in Texas. Then, if for any reason you're still not satisfied, you can go across the street (well, across the street and down a block toward downtown Berkeley) to the Chaat Cafe for chaat.
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They actually are directly across the street from each other.
I second that recommendation, but want to add that you probably don't want to eat on the street in front of Udupi. I don't know about you, but I think bus fumes and dirty sidewalk aren't good condiments for any type of food. Eat inside or take your food over to the Ohlone Greenway/belt on Hearst. Plenty of nice benches there.
Have fun, y'all! (I only spent a year-and-a-half in Texas - am I qualified to use "y'all" in a sentence?)
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Ah, thanks for the clarification. I was sitting here trying to picture the vicinity and all I could be sure of was Kragen and the Valero station!
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PegS said:
"I think Udupi Palace is a great choice for Indian food you may not find easily in Texas."
Actually, there is some great S. Indian in Austin and much more in Houston. The high-tech biz has attracted a very discerning clientle which happily supports these places, so we all benefit. We ain't all dumb nat'l guard-skippin' hillbillies over here...(g)....
And thanks for the rec. I think if we do go the chaat route, we will still suffer through the old Vik's routine to rekindle those old memories of the previously mentioned standing in line, eating on the sidewalk, etc...
And since we will make it to Udupi Palace, we will enjoy the luxury of a table...i WAS kidding about getting it to go and eating it on the sidewalk...which, of course, was a reference to the Vik's experience. Take out makes my skin crawl, generally speaking.
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Don't know when you were last there, but Vik's has remodeled and expanded.
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Heh, I stand corrected. ;-)
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Suggest you check out the Crate and Barrel Outlet across the street from Surly Table.
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Re kitchenware: A few blocks from Oakland's chinatown is Cash & Carry on Oak around 3rd St. They sell kitchen supplies and more. There's also a restaurant supply place around 9th/Jackson - not at all sure of the address. Have a great weekend!
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In SF, try economy fixtures. Tons of great restaurant supply items that work fine in a home kitchen.
Link: http://www.abcvaluline.com/m_erf.htm
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I had a bad experience at Economy over the weekend. I wanted to buy glasses (100 to 200 worth) but found that their glasses on display don't have prices on them. I asked a salesperson for help or a price list, but he said I'd have to bring the glasses up to the sales desk that I was interested in. So I picked out a couple of flutes and walked up. Before scanning he commented that one was very expensive but the other was more reasonable. If you can tell just by looking at them, why don't you just get off your ass and walk 15 feet over to the display and point some out for me? Anyway, he scanned them and was correct about the relative cost. So I asked if he could point out some others that were in the same price category (about $24/dozen). He again refused and said I'd have to bring up any and all that I was interested in. Most of the non-glassware stuff--the whole warehouse full of it--did have price tags. So if you're shopping for other stuff this attitude probably wouldn't be an issue. But I was so annoyed that I left without buying anything. I now see the difference between "Open to the Public" and "Public Welcome."
As an alternative, I suggest City Discount on Polk Street in San Francisco. It's a much smaller place, but their focus is on selling inexpensive kitchen supplies (might be liquidation sales, I'm not sure) to the public. Very friendly staff and competitive prices, much cheaper than Williams Sonoma, Sur La Table, Macy's, etc. Not a whole lot of glass or tableware, but otherwise they've got all the essential cooking tools.
City Discount
1542 Polk (between Sacramento and California), 771-4649
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If you want to stay in the East Bay there's also East Bay Restaurant Supply down on the Oakland Embarcadero.
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Regarding #6...
If I'm going to sit down and have a cup of cap for breakfast, I like to do so in bustling places with lots of people-watching. For that I liked going to International Cafe (top of Bancroft), Cafe Strada (Bancroft and College), Roma Cafe (College and Ashby), Royal Coffee (College and Claremont), and Peaberry's (in the Rockridge Market Hall on College). I've had good coffee at all, and I've also had not so good. So much depends on the barista. What you need is to have Krys/Stanley Stephan walk that strip and tell you who's doing it well these days. ;)
Either Peet's has been roasting heavier than they used to, or my tastes are changing. Because while they aren't going nearly as far as Starbucks (i.e., burning), I'm finding that I like their coffee less and less these days. Maybe somebody can tell us where Blue Bottle coffee is regularly brewed; I've had their stuff at the Ferry Building and it's fantastic.
http://www.bluebottlecoffee.net
-Nick
Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/...
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Some other good cappuccinos to be had in S. Berkeley/N. Oakland are at Hudson Bay Cafe on College at Hudson and Nomad Cafe on Shattuck at 65th. Both have free wi-fi, too, if that's a concern. They have totally different ambiences - Hudson Bay Cafe is a cozy and slightly old-fashioned cafe and Nomad is a mod hipster hangout.
I agree, Mike, we had great South Indian regularly at Madras Pavilion in Austin when we lived there. But there's definitely more chaat here than there was in Austin. Not sure about other Texas cities.
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I have had it at Shanghai (Webster between 9th and 10th) and Tin's Tea House (Webster at 7th). I had the Shanghai version several times and the Tin's version once. I liked Tin's better; thick cut uncured pork belly including skin, if I'm not mistaken, cooked in a savory gravy to tenderness, served atop the reconstituted mustard greens and some lettuce. Don't recall bean curd sheets at either place, but could have missed it. The Shanghai version is thinner with more of a "red-cooked" sauce, but still nice. I think I prefer Tin's.
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The to-go order I got at Shanghai was a bone-in hunk-o-pork, gravy-juice in a styro container. Very Large!
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That sounds like the pork joint, not the pork belly, which wouldn't have a bone.
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Ooops, you're totally right. Got all addled and rattled thinking about pork parts!
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I realize Tex is asking about twice cooked pork but I would add that the pork joint at Shanghai is exemplary - and a good value also. China Village's Hot & Spicy Pork Shoulder is OK - not one of their stronger dishes. I have had the twice cooked pork at China Village - on a lunch special - had a bit of heat - interesting version with long slices of thinly cut pork belly that were cooked until pretty crispy - with leeks, if I remember correctly. I thought it was pretty good but a whole plate of it was a bit much for me - pretty rich dish - probably better for sharing.
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I only ordered this once, off the "Chinese" menu, but it was indeed made with the Hunan smoked pork, and sauteed with leeks. It was pretty good if I recall, but it was a long time ago. I don't know if you ordered a version of the "American" menu if you would get something different.
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Haven't had the twice cooked pork at China Village. If you're jonesing for a fresh bacon dish, don't miss the cold appetizer.
Link: http://www.chowhound.com/topics/show/22632#84339
Image: http://www.chowhound.com/misc/mel/chi...
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