302518 Fri Aug 26 20:23:08 -0700 2005 23 29 Not About Food 0 1694468 What do think about all of the food warnings directed at pregnant women? I like to be cautious, but not overly cautious: But all of these warnings seem excessive. Bad food and alcohol built civilazation. What was good for our ancestors is not good enough for us? I am not one to jump to conspiracy theories but it seems like all of these warning are directing me and other women to "safe, clean" processed food from major companies- telling me i need their multi- vitamins enriched food products filled with fillers and preservatives. What is wrong with fresh whole foods that come from a tradition of healthy, happy living? Just a rant from a woman who is not actually pregnant but thought she was. Fri Aug 26 20:23:08 -0700 2005 0 Sarah 1 1694469 I drank wine (in moderation, of course) and ate "regular" (chowhound-ish) food with both pregnancies. My babies were the highest on the scale (forget the name of that newborn test) when they arrived. My kids rarely get sick. Fri Aug 26 21:07:19 -0700 2005 1694468 0 Funwithfood 2 1694475 Apgar is the test. I don't know why the current child bearing/young family generation has bought into the crap that they are being spoon fed by the advertising media. All of the anti-bacterial products, wipes of all sorts, the "I'm not okay with that" commercials against aspirin preying on advertising induced paranoia. Common sense is what is needed. There is also the new prohibition that is being pushed so stringently, a glass of wine is not going to hurt you or your baby. Yes, don't clean cat boxes, eat sensibly, get your exercise and when you can get to it, enjoy your pregenancy and your baby. The USA has gone really nuts with this nonsense. I am of your mother's generation. Gosh how we survived no seat belts until the 60's, drank whole milk, no bicycle helmets, no sun screen let alone being decked out in broad brimmed Tilby hats, and I have seen kids in long gloves in the sun. We were never protected from out gassing carpet, probably a bunch of us teethed on lead based paint coated window sills. We ate lots of sugary cereals and food with fat. We are here, yeah some get skin cancer, so do some younger people too, some of us get degenerative diseases some of you do too. The current crop of youngsters have more allergies and asthma and problems than we did. The children of today need their peck of dirt. Fri Aug 26 21:45:08 -0700 2005 1694469 0 Poodle Mama 3 1694477 "Gosh how we survived no seat belts until the 60's"... I am a little nuts with the baby car seat and my mother always says "you rode in the back seat of the car standing on your head and we all lived to tell about it". Fri Aug 26 22:01:51 -0700 2005 1694475 0 valerie 4 1694504 ummm...that is because you *did* live to hear about it... Sorry, but the life saving record of seat belts (and car seats) is strong and they don't deserve to be lumped in with such items as letting the baby get his bite of dirt as 'crap' from the advertising media! But don't ask me: for those of you who have little babies now, if they manage to survive to adulthood without wearing seatbelts, I predict that you will be *very* unhappy the first time they ask to borrow the family car as a teenager and you realize as they are backing out the driveway that you didn't insist they adopt the seat belt habit! Sun Aug 28 02:17:22 -0700 2005 1694477 0 susancinsf 3 1694483 couldn't agree more. Sat Aug 27 07:33:33 -0700 2005 1694475 0 mark 3 1694492 I agree that we could use more common sense and enjoy life more freely from fears. However, while I'm on your side, please don't label this as some phenomenon attributable to us -- the "the current child bearing/young family generation". Every generation has had its share of baseless paranoia and nonsense. Microwave ovens cause cancer. Diving under a school desk will somehow spare you from the effects of the atom bomb. Don't swim within 30 minutes of eating. Go outside with wet hair and you'll catch pneumonia. Feed a cold, starve a fever. You ever hear of a "snake oil salesman"? If this 32 year-old father of two had a dime for every illogical and/or contradictory piece of advice I've received from people of "my mother's generation", I would have my kids' college tuitions securely in the bank by now. Take a look at the demographic that buys tabloids. To stay on topic, the common sense approach worked twice with us very well. While I have no scientific evidence to back it up, I believe our relaxed attitude and lack of significant changes in my wife's diet/exercise patterns contributed greatly to the success and ease of our childbirth process and the health of our kids. I think everyone, including pregnant women, could greatly benefit from stepping back, taking a deep breath, and not believing everything we see and hear, no matter what generation you belong to. Sat Aug 27 16:53:54 -0700 2005 1694475 0 MSPD 1 1694476 Everything in moderation. I had a baby last October. I didn't drink during my pregnancy, but that was because I didn't drink before I was pregnant, so why start then? I went to Paris last summer when I was at 5 months. I didn't eat the cheese there, because I just figured that if, by chance, I should get sick, I didn't want to get sick in a foreign country. I ate sushi. I mean, I stayed with things like California rolls, and I didn't eat raw tuna, but I wasn't ever worried that the knife used to cut the rolls might have touched something raw. (People in Japan have been having babies for about a billion years.) But I had major cravings for bagels and lox, and I ate it throughout. I didn't drink Diet Coke. But that was because I lost my taste for it while I was pregnant. But if I was somewhere and my husband had a Diet Coke, and I felt like having a sip, I did. One thing that I did stay away from was coffee. And that was mostly because I use a lot of Sweet & Low in my coffee and I did want to stay away from the Sweet & Low. It just felt wrong to me to use it. Bottom line, I have a healthy, happy, beautiful, unbelievable 10 month old daughter. Do whatever you feel comfortable with and don't let anyone make you crazy. And good luck. Fri Aug 26 21:57:28 -0700 2005 1694468 0 valerie 1 1694484 i'd say during pregnancy is the time you should be most especially careful of AVOIDING "'safe, clean' processed food from major companies". kids today seem to have far more health issues than those of yesteryear. my brother-in-law and his wife have several kids, and have opted to follow the latest-and-greatest media/advertising recommendations. it's gotten so bad they've caused a family feud over it. they eat nothing but processed "safe" foods, live in a sterile environment, regulate all contact/exposure with the kids, and medicate at the first sniffle. they have the sickest, weakest kids i've ever seen. i hate to think what's going to happen when the kids get into school and are exposed to germs. we require stresses in early life, that's how our bodies learn to deal with the world and build up tolerances to it. Sat Aug 27 07:55:47 -0700 2005 1694468 0 mark 2 1694496 the bay area board just had a discussion about cravings during pregnancy. If you are planning to breastfeed, your doctor may tell you to avoid certain foods [garlic comes to mind], so perhaps you should indulge in such foods while pregnant. Sat Aug 27 19:30:36 -0700 2005 1694484 0 semmel 3 1694497 If my doctor had told me to abstain from garlic when I was breastfeeding, I'd have gotten a new one. Sat Aug 27 20:01:48 -0700 2005 1694496 0 butterfly 4 1694503 ditto: I understand that the taste does get into the milk, but I figured, that is what makes the kid a potential hound, right? :-) alcohol was about the only item I made a point of avoiding while breast feeding... Sun Aug 28 02:11:07 -0700 2005 1694497 0 susancinsf 2 1694520 And the darwin award goes to... Mon Aug 29 10:46:43 -0700 2005 1694484 0 drdawn 1 1694508 working in restaurants i occassionally come across pregnant diners with all sorts of crazy restrictions that i've never even heard of. for example, i waited on a couple with whom i spent a considerable amount of time with picking apart the menu because she couldn't have anything with dairy because "it's bad for the baby". however, they didn't seem to have a problem with her sucking down two comsos and a glass of wine before their entrees even arrived. i always wonder what pregnant women in other countries do? they say no raw or rare, no unpasteurized cheese, no certain types of seafood, etc. here in the states. but what about women living in mediterranean countries? do they stay away from fish and shellfish during pregancy? do european women eliminate cheese from their diet? do kids have more or less incidence of allergies or birth defects in countries with a more lax approach to dietary restrictions? i'd be curious to know. common sense tells me that "safe" processed foods aren't good for me when i'm not pregnant, so why would they be okay for me and my baby when i am pregnant? i'm not pregnant, and i don't plan to be for at least a few years. however, i'd like to get some facts straight ahead of time because it will take me that long to mentally prepare myself for the possibility that i will need to eat my steak anything more than medium rare. Sun Aug 28 11:02:03 -0700 2005 1694468 0 rebs 2 1694511 There are very few true no-no's and even those are questionable unless you eat large quantities. They are mostly specific fish and shellfish as well as anything unpasteurized. Once pregnant your ob-gyn can give you a list. Other than that when pregnant you are best to live by "all things in moderation" and the general rules of food safety. So you should never over indulge in foods that are bad for you in general such as high sodium, high fat, highly processed snacks, meats, ready made meals and alcohol. You get the general idea. And you should practice vigilant food safety meaning to wash all fruits and veggies first, use one cutting boards for meats and another for other foods cook chicken and burgers to safe temps. Steaks and the like are fine cooked rare but again in moderation. So fear not- I ate better when pregnant since I found that I ate a much wider variety of foods and increased my veggies and healthy proteins. I ate lots of ethinic meals out, I enjoyed a glass of wine every Friday and Saturday nights (my big treat!) and ate a Dulce De leche Hagan Das bar every Sunday night. I gained 19 lbs total and ended up weighing less after the baby was born. Sun Aug 28 18:34:20 -0700 2005 1694508 0 foodiex2 1 1694510 In France, pregnant women are warned to not eat green salad (due to a bacteria that is common in lettuce grown there), but that a small amount of red wine is fine. Anyone know what that bacteria is? I can't recall. Sun Aug 28 16:26:54 -0700 2005 1694468 0 K 2 1694512 I believe it is e coli... but I don't think women are told to abstain completely, just to ensure that whatever lettuce they eat has been washed thoroughly... Which everyone does anyway, since lettuce in France isn't as spic and span as American lettuce and comes from the market with dirt, grit and often little interlopers. Here in Spain, women are not told to avoid much--with the exception of mayonnaise and eggs that aren't thoroughly cooked, particularly in the summer--due to salmonella. In my experience, doctors here are much less alarmist and less prone to overreacting--probably due to the fact that they don't live in fear of being sued for malpractice, if something freakish or rare occurs. Also--from a cultural standpoint--there is a generalized sense that life is a risky proposition and there are never any guarantees... That said, despite the fact that this is a much less economically advantaged country, the infant mortality rate here is lower than it is in the US and the life expectancy is longer. Sun Aug 28 20:00:01 -0700 2005 1694510 0 butterfly 1 1694518 I have a wonderful 6 month old daughter. During my pregnancy I ate pretty much everything my taste buds would let me eat. (I hated the taste of chicken of any kind for a while). I used common sense and stayed away from foods like raw sushi, shellfish, and un-pasturized cheese and dairy products. I could handle a little bacteria in my stomach, but is that really good for my fetus? Due to a high blood pressure problem during the latter part of my pregnancy, I had to watch my salt intake. I ate lots of fruit, vegetables and beef. I also have had friends that used their pregnancy to eat all of the junk food they could fit into their mouths and gained a lot a weight that they never took off. Mon Aug 29 02:23:55 -0700 2005 1694468 0 Karen 1 1694527 You wrote: "safe, clean" processed food from major companies" Which makes me think: You have your mind made up already. Heed the warnings! Mon Aug 29 12:10:09 -0700 2005 1694468 0 MidtownCoog 1 1694528 Yes, excessive and sometimes not that well explained. I just found the Canadian recommendations and aside from avoiding raw meat, seafood and dairy, they state that "soft cheeses and pates" may be sources of listeria. I'm left with little idea why (I need to understand to believe) or which cheeses qualify as "soft". Feta? Nothing about cold cuts which I've seen banned on some American sources. I have been avoiding raw foods (including tastes of dough/batter made with raw eggs), minimizing my mercury fish exposure, and not eating mussels (this is totally irrational based on hearing too many "ate a bad mussel, was so sick" stories). I have been eating some soft pasteurized cheeses. I figure my immune system is not what it should be, and I personally feel pretty motivated by the desire not to have a premature baby. I haven't been drinking at all, it just hasn't been that tempting, especially after reading that the baby can't process the alcohol as well - so the effects are magnified. I do think this is a personal choice and that the current zero-tolerance recommendation in North America is motivated more by fear than actual evidence. I am affected by social pressure as well on this one. Mon Aug 29 12:24:35 -0700 2005 1694468 0 julesrules 2 1694548 Here is a link to US Food and Drug Administration on listeria. It recommends pregnant women eat soft cheeses made with pasteurized milk only. But it also says cases of listeria have been linked to pasteurized milk. I'm not sure where feta fits into all this. I say know and trust the people who grow/produce/process your food and you will likely be fine. I also say pregnancy is not the time to throw caution to the wind. Link: http://www.foodsafety.gov/~dms/lmr2qa.html Mon Aug 29 15:48:53 -0700 2005 1694528 0 Junie D 3 1694553 Thank you for the link it was quite informative. Down at the bottom they do mention that feta made from pasteurized milk is okay, most of the soft-cheese cases have been from non-pasteurized sources. Mon Aug 29 16:58:03 -0700 2005 1694548 0 julesrules 1 1694543 Ha ...Bad food and alcohol built civilization LOL I think you should stick with what you feel comfortable with. The same healthy diet of balanced whole foods is good for you and your baby, with some precautions which have to do with BACTERIA....and those should be taken to heart. For example no raw honey for you and for the baby for the first year. Many foods contain natural bacterias that a baby's system is just not ready for, maybe most could handle it, erring on the safe side seems wise. I am not suggesting you need to keep your child in a bubble...going to that extreme never gives the immune system a chance to develop...which creates a bigger problem in the long run. And of course..civilizations were built by women having 5 to 10 or more children over their lifetime, and losing a couple could be expected, if not losing your own life in labor. Mon Aug 29 14:53:18 -0700 2005 1694468 0 ciaolette 1 1694560 Just to add my two, four, six...cents...my bf is a perinatologist (high risk pregnancy specialist) and when I asked this question of him he said that he only discourages mothers from eating Mexican cheeses, he felt brie was fine as was feta etc. He also discourages alcohol usage because saying to a mother that they can have one or "moderation" could give an alcoholic license to drink and they cannot stop at one. As for anything else, mercury restrictions was the only other thing he is cautious about. As for myself, I had four healthy, very high risk pregnancies and I admit I continued to consume 1 cup of coffee a day and a diet coke and all of my sons are fine (at least physically!!!). Mon Aug 29 19:10:30 -0700 2005 1694468 0 4chowpups