301926 Tue Apr 25 18:09:27 -0700 2006 54 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1686684 So my friend remembers a cheese from when she went to Wellesley. Maybe other hounds can help me out... It was an aged Gouda. She says it was aged for something like three years. The most distinctive thing she can remember about the cheese is that it was incredibly buttery and has little sugar crystals in it. She doesn't know how or why the sugar crystals form, or if they're put in there by the cheese maker. Anyone? This sounds incredibly interesting, and I'd never heard of anything like it. I took her to Cowgirl Creamery in San Francisco and all they had was a Gouda that had been aged one year. Good, but not even close according to my friend. Tue Apr 25 18:09:27 -0700 2006 0 nooodles 1 1686687 Gouda is my Mom's fav cheese. When a relative or friend comes from Holland (where Mom is from) they always bring her some aged Gouda. I love it when she shares it and your friend is right, it is very, very creamy and does have some crystals in it. I don't think it's sugar, but comes from the long aging process. I have been lucky a few times and found a very good aged Gouda at T.J. but, they don't always carry it. I would think a fine cheese shop would also carry a long aged gouda or even a local cheese maker---and maybe even your local T.J. Tue Apr 25 18:18:27 -0700 2006 1686684 0 jackie 1 1686688 not sure if they have it, but try Artisan cheese - they sell on line - They age the cheeses they purchase - so not sure about the gouda, but I have had it in Europe and agree that the crystals aren't sugar but from the aging process. Rather like a good quality parmesan that also has the crystals. Tue Apr 25 18:27:09 -0700 2006 1686684 0 tigerwoman 1 1686689 Whole Foods carries as does Trader Joes occasionally. You can also find it my local speciality foods shops. My husband is addicated. I like it but can eat more than a bite or two. Very rich. Tue Apr 25 18:29:45 -0700 2006 1686684 0 foodiex2 1 1686694 Hello noodles, you are talking about one of my favorite types of cheese. One example recently I've enjoyed, perhaps it didn't have the sugar crystallised, but it sure has a toffee character to it, flavor and texture. Great palate interplay pairing it with port. I purchased it at Farmstead cheese in Alameda in that nice marketplace on Park St.(the butcher there has a locker for dry-aging meats, if you're into that). I saw a 3 yr. old gouda--it was over $20/lb. so I passed-- just last week at a Mollie Stone's (San Mateo), so if you're near one in SF you might check them. cheers Tue Apr 25 18:46:35 -0700 2006 1686684 0 moto 1 1686695 Aged gouda is one of the finest cheeses in the world. I don't think I've ever known anyone who didn't like it. The 3-year is great, but a 5-year, which has a drier and more crumbly texture and sharper flavor, is even better (if you can find it). A similar cheese from France is mimolette - but I prefer the gouda. Aged gouda will be coated in black wax vs. the red wax that's traditional for the basic gouda. The crystals are definitely not sugar - I believe they're calcium or some calcium compound that forms as the cheese ages. Tue Apr 25 18:53:07 -0700 2006 1686684 0 FlyFish 1 1686696 Interesting- i live in Wellesley and the Wellesley Cheese Shop is one of the best there is- it has been there for as long as we have lived here (35 years) so I bet that is where she had it. Yes, aged gouda, is sooo delicious. It has a granular texture but definitely not sugar. Next time I go to the cheese shop (which is often) I will ask for details about this cheese and will post. Tue Apr 25 19:03:28 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Emilief 1 1686714 Amazon sells a 5-year old Gouda for $17/lb. Link: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000D9MYN/002-8055742-0912046?v=glance&n=3370831 Tue Apr 25 20:40:16 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Gary Soup 1 1686718 If you're in SF, you may be able to find a local store that sells superaged gouda from Winchester Cheese Co. This is a So Cal artisan that makes farmhouse goudas in the traditional Dutch style. They sell cheeses of varying age & sharpness, as well as flavored goudas. I like the superaged, cumin, and herbed garlic flavors. Link: http://www.winchestercheese.com/ Tue Apr 25 21:38:09 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Professor Salt 1 1686720 I just bought an English Cheddar from TJ and I noticed said crystals in that as well..I was curious as to what they were, I am sure they are same thing..I hope! Tue Apr 25 21:52:03 -0700 2006 1686684 0 King of Northern Blvd. 1 1686727 I think the crystals are actually salt. Any decent cheese store should carry an aged Gouda (and no, I don't consider Cowgirl to be a decent cheese store). It's often sold under different names(different producers?): Boerenkaas and Saenkanter are two. As moto mentioned, I satisfy my Saenkanter cravings at Farmstead Cheeses in the Alameda Marketplace. Link: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/02/06/WI139511.DTL&type=wine Tue Apr 25 23:36:36 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Ruth Lafler 2 4815144 An expert told me it was salt. I love this cheese and get it as often as I can. Our local cheese shop keeps it, it's the owner's wife's favorite. AND a friend just brought me back a huge hunk from Amsterdam! Mon Jun 29 10:31:17 -0700 2009 1686727 253735 bayoucook 1 1686734 Alot of aged cheeses have crystals or some people call it a gritty texture. It is one of two things - calcium lactate (cheddar) or tyrosine (parmesan, gouda). Those are just a few examples. Anyway some gouda's get a butterscotch flavor as they age which is why your friend thought it was sugar. Cheeseboard has some good aged cheddars. Of course you can taste there in addition to telling them you are looking for a butterscotch flavor. Others have given you some good brands to look for. Here's a good link that talks about tyrosine. It ends by saying ... "There's one last good thing about those crunchy crystals. Tyrosine is a building block for serveral important brain chemicals--epinephrine, norepinephrine, serotonin and dopamine, all of which work to regulate mood. Deficiencies in tyrosine have been associated with depression [That's why the Italians are always so damned happy, eh? That and the wine.]" Link: http://www.myspeakerscorner.com/forum/spawn.php?fn=2&mid=553552 Wed Apr 26 02:05:13 -0700 2006 1686684 0 rworange 2 4814041 I'm writing this so some folks don't go out and buy tyrosine thinking it will make them happier, better or smarter. Too little tyrosine is rare because it's in so many common foods: chicken, turkey, fish, peanuts, almonds, avocados, bananas, milk, cheese, yogurt, cottage cheese, soy, lima beans, pumpkin seeds, and sesame seeds. Too much tyrosine, though, in the form of tyramines, is quite common, causing severe headaches and migraines, and a hypertensive response similar to histamines. Tyramines are found in some of our most flavorful foods -- anything aged or cured, for example -- and their effect is cumulative. Each person, also, has an individual threshold for tyramines. A little aged gouda might be fine for you, but combine that with a few glasses of red wine, salumi, and eggplant and the amount of tyramine may be too much for your body. Migraine sufferers learn to avoid foods with tyramines, but those foods can cause a bad headache in anyone. There's been quite a bit written about tyramines on Chowhound. What causes the rare deficiency in tyrosine is an inability to synthesize phenylalanine. Tyrosine is an enzyme that helps to release neurotransmitters, and also helps in creating thyroid hormones. But more is definitely not better, in spite of what those folks say who are trying to sell you tyrosine supplements. Sun Jun 28 21:27:56 -0700 2009 1686734 18222 maria lorraine 3 4818661 Yes! Yes! Yes! From someone who has recently started watching tyramines in food because of complicated migraine syndrome! Tue Jun 30 12:18:06 -0700 2009 4814041 14341 OCEllen 1 1686745 I recently bought an aged Gouda from DiBruno Brothers in Philly, I think its ten years old but don't know the name under which they sell it. Incredibly concentrated, intense flavor, and yes it has crystals. A younger version. There is another aged gouda I like that is about 5 years old called Rembrandt. Wed Apr 26 09:17:17 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Ellen 2 4813020 In 2009 the Whole Foods chain in LA carries the line of goudas that Rembrandt is part of. My favorite is Vincent, yes. Sun Jun 28 11:43:00 -0700 2009 1686745 287825 Weetje 1 1686764 I, too, love this stuff & am always on a quests to find more. My Trader Joe's used to carry it, but, alas, no more. They carry another 6 month "aged" from WI, but it's not the same. If anyone spots some of the good stuff in Orange County, Ca, PLEASE let me know! I tried Cowgirl Creamery's & it was just nasty & very expensive. Tried the something Frog cheese shop in Orange & that wasn't the same either. Has anyone tried Amazon's or know of any mail order that's the real stuff - buttery & crystally & caramelly & wonderful & not the faux? Wed Apr 26 12:59:53 -0700 2006 1686684 0 torta basilica 2 1686784 Try iGourmet.com - looks like the Beemster X.O. is the one you want. Link: http://www.igourmet.com/shoppe/search.asp?country=Holland Wed Apr 26 17:15:56 -0700 2006 1686764 0 Linda W. 3 1686889 Under the guise of necessary Chowhound research, I have ordered a pound of this & will report back. I tried to order Ewephoria (love that name!), but could not find where they shipped. Thu Apr 27 19:30:42 -0700 2006 1686784 0 torta basilica 4 1686918 Call the 800 number listed on the Cheese Shop's website (see my post) to order Ewephoria. They can easily ship it to you. Fri Apr 28 13:33:57 -0700 2006 1686889 0 Lauren J. 3 4814531 Yep, I've had this from iGourmet and it sounds exactly as described above. Wait... or maybe it was their regular aged beemster, not their super-aged. Hmm. (Any post about igourmet prompts me to yell from the rafters about the Dorothea they have available. O.M.G. Fantastic. Mon Jun 29 07:06:12 -0700 2009 1686784 20991 shanagain 1 1686767 Try Ewephoria! It's a wonderful, full-flavored extra-aged gouda made from Dutch sheep's milk and is aged about 1 1/2 years. It has those amino/mineral crystals that add even more tang. I get mine from The Cheese Shop in Carmel, and they also ship their cheeses. You might be able to find it at one of your better local cheese shops, as well. Enjoy... Link: http://www.cheeseshopcarmel.com/cheese/cheese.htm Wed Apr 26 13:12:26 -0700 2006 1686684 0 Lauren J. 1 1686862 I'm surprised Cowgirl didn't have one, although they do tend to focus more on American cheeses. Try the 24th Street Cheese shop, either of the Pasta Shops in Berkeley, Cheeseboard, or Oakville Grocer. I've seen multi-year Gouda at each place. -Nick Thu Apr 27 13:34:40 -0700 2006 1686684 0 nja 2 1686888 Please see my post below. They have it, but... it's not the crystally delicious stuff we all are searching for. Thu Apr 27 19:28:32 -0700 2006 1686862 0 torta basilica 1 1805260 There's no "sugar" crystals in aged Gouda. The crystals you see are lactic proteins and are a by product of aging. True aged Parm Reggiano is entirely those crystals. Sun Aug 13 17:38:54 -0700 2006 1686684 25435 jeffyd 2 1808392 The crystals still might be considered "sugar" if you consider the various forms of sugar...glucose, fructose, sucrose, lactose. Or maybe I just have my chemistry all wrong. Tue Aug 15 02:47:55 -0700 2006 1805260 13515 Just Larry 3 4814007 The crystals are usually calcium lactate, and less frequently tyrosine. http://books.google.com/books?id=mnh6aoI8iF8C&pg=PA589&lpg=PA589&dq=cheese+crystals+tyrosine+or+lactate%3F&source=bl&ots=EUOpl4Eqvj&sig=FiHH_udOg2-InY7tTrUijzqUqvc&hl=en&ei=uT9ISqndOo6mMeKdxa8C&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6 The aged gouda I like is called Old Amsterdam. It's nutty, buttery, with lots of those lactate crystals. It has a slight caramel flavor; and I'm guessing the milk is slightly caramelized before it's made into cheese. Old Amsterdam is at Trader Joe's, but there are other more expensive ones. Sun Jun 28 20:58:09 -0700 2009 1808392 18222 maria lorraine 2 4817404 MMMM I really enjoy it when I get a chunk of Reggiano full of those little bursts of flavor and texture. Tue Jun 30 06:04:05 -0700 2009 1805260 253154 Fritter 1 1809832 I eat a lot of dry, aged cheeses and see those crystals often. I take them as an indication that I have a cheese I'm going to like. Current favorite: Piave. Tue Aug 15 19:01:56 -0700 2006 1686684 13192 chocolatetartguy 2 1812235 If you like Piave, there's an artisan cheese that is available is ome places called Lateria Sant'Andrea. It's got more depth of flavor than Piave (even the Extravecchio) and is made by a small caseria (Piave is made by a large industrial maker). Wed Aug 16 18:06:00 -0700 2006 1809832 25435 jeffyd 3 1812323 I'm in Berkeley. Where might I find Lateria Sant'Andrea? I struck out at my beloved Cheeseboard. Thanks for the tip. Wed Aug 16 18:30:01 -0700 2006 1812235 13192 chocolatetartguy 4 1812431 Hmmm ... it's going to be hard to say this without it looking like a plug, but since he mentioned it, I assume jeffyd carries it at his cheese shop: Farmstead Cheeses and Wines in Alameda. Wed Aug 16 19:06:48 -0700 2006 1812323 10159 Ruth Lafler 5 1812594 You might recall that I don't mind such posts as long as they come with full disclosure. jeffyd didn't plug anything but the cheese, so no disclosure necessary. I had two reasons to go to Alameda this weekend and now I have three. Wonder if he has some Philly-style sharp provolone? Wed Aug 16 19:57:43 -0700 2006 1812431 13192 chocolatetartguy 5 1812687 reply to chocolatetartguy .... Don't know about that specific type of provolone, but he has a great selection, especially considering it's a small store. When I was in there yesterday the selection of soft/washed rind cheeses was really tempting. Wed Aug 16 20:20:45 -0700 2006 1812431 10159 Ruth Lafler 5 1824066 Despite a change in plans, I still found myself in Alameda Saturday and closer to the source to boot. I bought some Lateria Sant'Andrea and snacked on it Sat night. It was very good with a slight raw milk taste. I think I still like Piave best, but certainly wasn't sorry I tried Lateria Sant'Andrea. In fact, it was my most productive stop in Alameda that day. I also found out that there the Piave I've been buying at the Cheeseboard is a bit more aged than the one I sampled there there. I hear you bought some too. What did you think? Tue Aug 22 03:04:52 -0700 2006 1812431 13192 chocolatetartguy 1 1812376 Try Rainbow Grocery at 1745 Folsom St in San Francisco. They have a 5 year old gouda that's cumbly, carmelly, and delicious. Sometimes they're sold out so you might call ahead and see if they'll tell you if it's in stock (415) 863-0620. Wed Aug 16 18:46:31 -0700 2006 1686684 26257 managerharry 1 1813664 OK, I had to just post and say - after reading this chain, I bought some aged Gouda from Whole Foods. MAN, it was so good! Thanks for the tips in buying them! Thu Aug 17 02:53:17 -0700 2006 1686684 10835 virtualfrolic 2 1813890 Another convert! It's great travelling cheese, btw. You can keep it at room temp almost indefinitely, so it's great to throw in your bag for a plane trip or when you're going to be out all day. Thu Aug 17 05:16:52 -0700 2006 1813664 10159 Ruth Lafler 1 1814494 your sister probably had Old Amsterdam which is wrapped in a black casing. Thu Aug 17 15:29:53 -0700 2006 1686684 25921 uman 2 1835772 I just found some 3 yr. Old Amsterdam at our local cheese shop. It was much better than the usual supermarket Gouda (or maybe I was just impressed by the price per pound!). Sun Aug 27 03:31:15 -0700 2006 1814494 11791 DonShirer 1 1814500 as far as the crystals go, I always thought they were calcium deposits. Thu Aug 17 15:31:17 -0700 2006 1686684 25921 uman 1 1814808 Now that I have the aged gouda, what are the best ways to eat it, fully utilizing it's great flavor (other than eating it alone or with crackers). It seems like you're all gouda experts - so I figured you'd know off the bat! (I'm not much of a cheese person! You truly converted me, as previously, I would have never bought cheese like this!) Thu Aug 17 17:07:36 -0700 2006 1686684 10835 virtualfrolic 2 1815454 Well, as I said, if you want to maximize its flavor you should keep it at room temp -- I just leave it loosely wrapped in paper on the counter, but in a warmer climate probably on a pantry shelf would be best. The moisture content is so low it will keep for weeks like that, although in warm weather it may weep a little fat and start looking shiny. I've mostly just eaten it plain, but it makes a great substitute for grated parmesan. Thu Aug 17 20:34:46 -0700 2006 1814808 10159 Ruth Lafler 2 1834597 Melt it into a cream sauce for cauliflower. Sat Aug 26 08:15:58 -0700 2006 1814808 25310 Chuckles the Clone 1 1835854 crystals are not sugar--they are protein. Sun Aug 27 04:57:16 -0700 2006 1686684 11935 westsidegal 1 3491107 The crystals that form in aged gouda are actually protein crystals. You will some times find them also in aged Grana style cheeses. The three year Gouda was probably called Saenkanter, but there are other brands. I don't know, but assume some of the butterscotch flavor in these aged cheeses comes from the milk being heated higher than it is in the make process of other cheeses. I suspect that what happens is you set up an incipient carmelization of the milk sugars, that is completed by the enzymatic activity of the cheese as it ages. Thu Mar 13 20:12:04 -0700 2008 1686684 151736 Steve Schaefer 1 4814078 I'm not a cheese expert but the best gouda I've ever had was definitely buttery... what you mentioned sounds on the right track. I've had some that was downright buttery from Whole Foods even... I am no cheese expert and don't recall the name except that it was an extremely long one. I would expect others can steer you toward even more buttery cheeses. Sun Jun 28 21:49:22 -0700 2009 1686684 40486 Cinnamon 1 4814745 My favourite Gouda is Thunder Oak Extra old Gouda from Thunder Bay, Ontario. For you Americans thats way up in North Western Ontario, Canada. It gets pretty cold there in the winter, but our igloos keep us sheltered til summer comes in August! Mon Jun 29 08:22:23 -0700 2009 1686684 259720 haggisdragon 2 4817412 Sounds great, checked website, they will apparently not ship to the US and A, Canada only. Damn. (I know exactly where Thunder Bay is, originally being from London, Ont., myself.) Tue Jun 30 06:07:09 -0700 2009 4814745 13709 buttertart 3 4818447 Yeah! They're pretty small. Its hard to get the old stuff even in T-Bay! Tue Jun 30 11:22:42 -0700 2009 4817412 259720 haggisdragon 1 4820805 Does anyone else find it poetic that, like its subject, this thread was cracked open and tasted after three years of aging? ;-) Wed Jul 01 07:34:31 -0700 2009 1686684 14386 BobB 2 4820871 No. Wed Jul 01 07:50:44 -0700 2009 4820805 40486 Cinnamon 2 4859755 Poetic and lovely indeed BobB. . . Since I'm a relative newcomer to the CH boards, it allows me to read some interesting comments about my favorite cheese Tue Jul 14 22:39:50 -0700 2009 4820805 293998 vday 1 4826839 This is so funny to me learning about the crystals in my aged goudas. As I mentioned, I only found it about a year ago and became an instant fan. I never really shared with my hubby how much I was paying for...oops. Anyway, I have to laugh I find the crystals to be just wonderful and what I thought is that the cheese was turning so I hurry up and eat it. Doh, never could understand why every single hunk had them. Thank you fellow chowhounds for my continued education! Fri Jul 03 06:10:20 -0700 2009 1686684 50431 chef chicklet