300029 Thu Mar 24 19:34:03 -0800 2005 10 27 General Chowhounding Topics 0 1665316 Enlightening article in today's San Francisco Chronicle: Link: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/24/WIG80BRKHC1.DTL Thu Mar 24 19:34:03 -0800 2005 0 Gary Soup 1 1665318 Thanks, Gary, Interesting article. I remember hearing somewhere that "chicken shit" is considered an acceptable, if not desirable, characteristic of red Burgundies. Thu Mar 24 21:18:33 -0800 2005 1665316 0 Kirk 2 1665321 In Laura Werlin's book on cheese, "barnyardy" is considered a positive descriptor. Thu Mar 24 22:38:26 -0800 2005 1665318 0 Carb Lover 3 1665322 I love barnyardiness in a cheese -- as long as all of the animals in the barnyard are still alive. Thu Mar 24 22:54:11 -0800 2005 1665321 0 Caseophile 3 1665337 Barnyard and horseblanket aromas and flavors are also favorable in a good gueuze, kriek, or framboise. Fri Mar 25 14:01:44 -0800 2005 1665321 0 rl 2 1665323 It's heavenly when you know a wine is made from Pinot Manure. Thu Mar 24 23:15:48 -0800 2005 1665318 0 Pork Butt 1 1665332 Gary, Great article. Not being much of a wine afficianado, I was humored when introduced to Ann Noble's Wine Aroma Wheel in Sonoma not too long ago. But when it comes to wine tasting, if I know what specific characteristic I SHOULD be tasting (or shouldn't), I really start to notice distinct characteristics and learn more. Not to get long-winded, but on the same trip, my wife and I were at Pacific's Edge in Carmel. The sommelier opened the bottle for one of our courses and IMMEDIATELY stated that it was corked. We were fascinated as it was open for, literally, one second and never traveled north of his sternum level. Being wine novices, we had already expressed a desire to be guided by his expertise throughout the evening. He actually obliged us in our request for a side-by-side comparison of the corked bottle and a newly-opened, good bottle. I could tell they were vastly different, but couldn't put my finger on it. I asked what exactly caused him to know so quickly and he said the moment the cork came off, a blast of "wet cardboard" smell hit him (mentioned in the article). I lifted the glass of the corked wine and I immediately noticed! He mentioned, and I concur, that the majority of everyday wine drinkers will consume a corked bottle of wine and think it's perfectly fine, just not a good wine. I would have. In food, I know exactly what to look for and expect. I now find that the greater repertoire of wine descriptors and experiences I build, the more I'm enjoying different wines and the more knowledgeable I am becoming. To me, this was the locked door that opened, allowing me to pursue the love of wine. So now I don't laugh quite as much at the Wine Aroma Wheel. Thanks again for the article! Fri Mar 25 11:40:27 -0800 2005 1665316 0 MSPD 2 1665338 We drink a fair amount of wine and have, on occasion, run into a bottle we were sure was corked. In fact, it just happened last week. I have also had occasion to delve into the subject a bit with some wine store proprietors and tasting room people at wineries. A couple of things are interesting about the subject. One is just what you say..... that many, many people don't notice the taste at all. From a technical perspective, a wine can be 'corked' with varying levels of 'taint' measurable in it.... and some people notice it at lower levels than others. But one interesting aspect I've found is that the musty, 'wet cardboard' smell may not always be the result of true cork taint. I have personally opened bottles that gave off that distinctive smell at first, and then (within half an hour or so) the smell was gone and the wine tasted fine. I guess it's possible that what was happening was that the taint had dissipated to a level below that of my sensitivity to it..... but I have been told that there are other possibilities. The most logical one has been what was described by a winemaker as 'bottle funk'. That being a musty, wet cardboard odor, resulting from additives in the bottling process, that dissipates quickly and does not really affect the wine. As I haven't been able to get much agreement on this 'funk' thing' from wine gurus in general, I still wonder if it's true. One thing that gives it credence, though, is that I've smelled it in a bottle that was closed with a synthetic cork. Cork taint is casued by bacteria in cork, so the concept seems to hold some water. Fri Mar 25 14:14:07 -0800 2005 1665332 0 Midlife 3 1665340 Wine is funny isn't it? Wet cardboard can be a benign feature, or it can be a sign of spoilage. That distinction is probably beyond my Wine 101 knowledge. Not sure it matters, but the wine we were poured was a white. At our whim, he poured a little of the corked wine, and left it while retrieving another bottle -- same brand, wine, vintage, etc. The original glass rested for a while until the new one came (food course was served in the meantime...so maybe 5-10 minutes?) The two glasses of identical wine smelled and tasted very different. The sommelier's explanation was similar to the reference in Gary's article. Actually we received quite an education on many wine topics that night. Truly a memorable meal there. Fri Mar 25 15:15:30 -0800 2005 1665338 0 MSPD 1 1665341 When asked for an opinion about flavor notes in wine, my preferred responses is, "It tastes like, hmm, grapes." Sat Mar 26 09:41:27 -0800 2005 1665316 0 Karl S. 1 1665446 The simple, tongue-in-cheek mnemonic I was mentored with was, "White burgundy smells like garbage, red burgundy smells like shit." I prefer to associate it with the pleasant organic smell of a horse barn, and/or a mossy area after spring rain, as opposed to, say, changing a diaper. Tue Mar 29 15:40:49 -0800 2005 1665316 0 mrbarolo